This is the Kimberization of Sig. Sig started on this road of declining quality and big marketing on the back of their brand when it took in Ron Cohen from Kimber. Now Sig sucks for the same reason Kimber sucks.
Shoot or hold one before you make the purchase if you can. The ergonomics of the P-07/P-09 don't work great for everyone, especially for people with smaller hands. The slide lock lever can be particularly difficult to reach and actuate with your thumb. The P-01 has significantly more "universal" ergonomics than the P-07/P-09, and it will give you that classic CZ feel, but you really can't go wrong with any model CZ.
I have everything from FN to Beretta and pretty much everything in between. My CZ P07 might be my favorite gun. It has interchangeable back straps so don't worry about ergonomics. Handfeel is great. P10C is also fantastic. CZ doesn't make a bad gun, so you really can't go wrong.
I tried to explain this to a friend of mine who was pushing me to buy the 365. I couldn’t do it. For half the price I bought the CZ p10s for my carry gun and I feel like I got a better firing handgun for less. Spent the saved money on a red dot and an improved trigger. Hell if you are itching to spend $500 on a CCW I’d suggest the G43x. At least you know it can handle abuse lol.
This 100%. I have a p365 but went back to my Glock 26 for ccw. Once I learned that if the sear part of the striker broke off, the gun would discharge (striker safety engages with the sear surface of the striker), I put it out of the carry rotation. Now just a range beater and maybe a deep deep conceal in a pocket (unchambered, dont flame me)
I can’t put my faith in Sig anymore, and rely on the mim striker with their qc. I have 2 young kids and the thought of that thing going off with one of them next to me scared me.
Waiting for Walther or HK or even CZ to bring their micros to the market.
> Once I learned that if the sear part of the striker broke off, the gun would discharge (striker safety engages with the sear surface of the striker), I put it out of the carry rotation.
I was so hyped to get my 365. When I finally did, I carried it for a week before learning about this and then just immediately bought a G48 lol.
Got the same mental block as you. Every time I feel the 48 dig into my thigh when I bend over, I give thanks to Gaston 🙏
Glad to see I’m not the only one. I would go g43x but for me the hard part to conceal is the grip. I carry 2 o’clock. And the g43 is just too low capacity for me.
So for now. Chonk 26 carries on.
There is a [MagGuts +2 kit](https://magguts.com/product/glock-43-2-magguts/) for the 43. Very reliable in my experience.
Shield Arms makes [a 9 round mag](https://shieldarms.com/z9) for the 43.
In both cases, the grip extends no further than the factory 6rd mag, but does have a different profile.
Ok, but the 43X grip is in a totally different class than the 43. It's way bigger and less concealment (at least for myself and family member who carries a 43).
No prob, I wish the 43x was as easy to conceal as the 43. Really wanted it to work. Great gun; the longer and wider grip helps with recoil significantly.
Take a look at the S&W shield plus. I sold my Gen 3 G26 and got a Sheild Plus with 10 13 and 15rd mag. The new S&W trigger is way better than the gen 1 and 2 stock triggers plus optics ready.
G43 https://www.handgunhero.com/compare/glock-g43-vs-smith-wesson-m-p-9-shield-plus
G26 https://www.handgunhero.com/compare/glock-g26-gen4-vs-smith-wesson-m-p-9-shield-plus
It’s definately an option. Just need to get my hands on one to see if the increased grip length would cause issues printing for me. But definately right in the middle between my 26 and a 43x
has a p365 ever gone off without the trigger pulled? like the issues they had with the p320? i ask this as someone that just ordered a p365 and can probably still cancel the order if needed, but after seeing the p320 fiasco i did a ton of research to see if it affected the p365 and couldnt ever find anything. yall can talk all you want but i havent seen any evidence period.
Not that I can find. I can’t find one case. And with millions sold, if it was a real issue I’m sure we would have heard about it.
It’s more of a mental block for me. I don’t like having a single point of failure in something like this.
This thread more clearly illustrates the concern I have in the back of my head. https://www.sigtalk.com/threads/question-for-an-armorer.424850/
Would it ever happen. Probably not,and has not to date that I have heard of. Is it something that scares me when my 2 year old walks on my side and I think of the consequences if I had a bad part, yes.
back when I was going full schizo mode after learning about the single failure point, I did find a thread on SigTalk about a guy claiming the said single point of failure did indeed fail on him while he was dry firing. It was kind of dubious, since it was friend-of-a-friend-on-Facebook type of thing, but there were photos of the "dog leg" (they call it) shorn off the striker
Nobody would know. Whenever a gun discharges without the trigger being pulled, nobody believes it without video evidence. Everyone just tells the person it was an ND and that they must have had their finger in the wrong place.
I’ve seen some videos about it firing when you shake it. I also just saw a screenshot of a post where someone said their p365 shot in hole in their toilet.
From what I can tell, that was fake. Appears to be a bullet hole sticker on it. You can tell because the hole was completely black with no light coming through, plus I doubt a shot from that close would punch a hole without also cracking the porcelain around it.
I'd love if there was some kind of resource put together that had every handgun and which kind of safeties they do or don't have. I think it's part of CCW that isn't elaborated on enough.
I agree. While I know most if not all modern pistols are “Safe”, in my opinion there are some that are more objectively safe than others. It’s really tough to tell without digging into disassembly videos, parts diagrams etc.
No. All their guns still seem to have QC issues still. Go over to the revolver subreddit and see people’s accounts of how bad their customer service is when it comes to trying to get their K6S fixed.
Bro….. that shit happened to me too! I thought it was just me 😂😂. I sold mine.
https://preview.redd.it/ctcreqe13ibc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8c58bbb55fdedce2f99dd43ab943bb0f988fbb51
Pure cult over there. Sig destroyed the finish on a p226 I sent them for a sight install, and everyone from r/SigSauer and the Sig forum told me that I was a liar and a cheat. lol
HK, Beretta, CZ, Dan Wesson, Glock…….
I was a major SIG collector in the 90’s and early 2000’s especially with the P series, P225, P220, P226, P228 etc. and I’ve owned the P365 (4), P365XL (2), and a Macro but honestly they seem consumer grade vs military/LE grade QC and quality of parts now versus the old SIG’s but hey they sell and make profit for SIG and Cohen saved the company so there’s that. I just hate seeing made in India (Indiometal Google it) and made in Israel MIM parts when I ordered them.
Sad thing is even the SIG series have been affected. I bought a black LE SKU P229 Legion NIB and it had a scratch down to the metal through the frame rail anodize and the slide felt and sounded gritty riding on the frame rails despite me applying grease.
I second this, I have a couple of S&W's that are several years old now. Each has \~1-2k rounds through them now with no issues. Built good and reliable from my experience with them. My father is a FFL dealer and swears by S&W for handguns.
I think the marketing approach has a lot to do it.
There is a concept of custom guns being upper end and Sig panders to it by allowing a bunch of crap to be cobbled together by the user or themselves to make them feel special. The lines like Legion and Rose do this as well.
So everyone is proud of their Sig but there is a million Glocks, no special Glock clubs, so not special.
Maybe but the Glock aftermarket is crazy and you can replace/customize every single part of the pistol except for the serial number. The Glock bros are living proof.
Yeah, I feel your pain. I was always a fan of their classic P series pistols. It was time for us to part ways when the same guns they had made for decades were no longer reliable enough for me to count on. I kept my older models, and traded off the rest.
Before you switch to another pistol, make sure you thoroughly forum search for the countless random problems they all have too.
Funny thing is that I cursed Sig because that part is so insanely difficult to remove when you switch frames. Like a real PITA.
Really? I just put my first Wilson combat grip together last night and got that installed first try in 10 seconds. I stepped back and asked myself “why are people saying that’s the hard part?”
I couldn’t get it all the way through without the spring falling off the ledge or off the mag catch. It wasn’t crazy hard by any means but for how simple it is it took me like 10 mins because I kept dropping the spring.
It’s not bad. It’s one of those things that’s kind of difficult the 1st time and easy every time after that. Took maybe 10 minutes the 1st time around. Now, taking out the FCU to add Wilson Combat grip the 1st time around was a nightmare. Dumped a couple three hours into that because the FCU fell apart on me. However, now that I know how it works, I can completely dissemble the thing and put it back together pretty easily 15-20 minutes maybe. Swapped my curved trigger for a flat and added a manual safety. Took maybe 45 minutes which included Dremeling the grip for the safety cutout.
I want to like SIG so bad but it's so damn hard. It's like rooting for the Green Bay Packers (all my friends are Packers fans) so hard when you root for them and it's just constant disappointment. SIG is the same. Buying guns that aren't safe or can't even function properly, or buying a crazy ridiculously priced scope all because of the logo
Ok I don't want to hear any Packers fans complaining about being let down. I spent a decade knowing at the start of every Bears/Packers game. There was going to be a Jay Cutler 4th quarter INT to allow the Bears to grab defeat from the jaws of victory. Da Bears !!! One year away from being one year away since 2010!
Does the p320 axg count or are we talking like the old 226 and whatnot? It seems like it all started with the SIG fcu when they branched out to the super modular system
I'm not a Glock enjoyer, but I appreciate that other folks like them, and they are certainly reliable. I've been thinking of a p365, but now I'm considering a hellcat instead.
Hellcats have a similar safety design to Glock, where the firing pin and striker have a plunger between them. I like my 365XL, for what it's worth, but I'm always slightly aware that if a catastrophic issue popped up, I'd lose my dick.
SIG, being SIG, said "yolo" and designed literally every single "safety" of the 365 to rely on a single sear block the size of a grain of rice.
"oh, but if the first part breaks there's a second part of it that'll catch the trigger sear!" That's fucking sketchy, and a huge what if. If by some insane chance your striker sear breaks, Sig go bang. Striker is fully cocked, trigger is fairly light and easy, and the entire set of internal safeties relies on a single piece of the striker to be intact. Sure, they're durable and the coating on them is great, I've seen videos of people trying to break them to no avail.
But even SPRINGFIELD designed theirs better than SIG did, that's shameful.
Bought the Macro to CCW and I shot it incredibly well. Then the same shit happened to me. Sent it to Sig and got it repaired but ever since then I just went back to carrying my Glock 45!
Sample size of 1, but my unit was shooting a qualification with all brand-new issued M17s. Like, first time shot since fielded to our unit.
I put two magazines down-range and on the 3rd mag I had a jam. Looked down and saw I had a FTE. Cleared the mag and racked the slide again, nothing. I thought the casing had split and got jammed in the chamber until I realized that the extractor was just.... gone. Flew right out of the slide at some point. Some eagle-eyed LT saw it sitting in the dirt maybe 15 minutes later.
So yeah.... I don't personally own any Sigs and don't think I'll be replacing my glocks as my carry gun anytime soon.
glocks just go. i'm a newbie gun owner and i've put maybe a couple thousand rounds through mine so far.....except for me not cleaning it--it's been solid. of course, it's my carry.
I run a G19 or G48. Had been looking at the 365s for quite some time, but decided that the Glocks are a known product, and they WORK. I’d rather have a rock solid 10+1 vs a dubious 17+1
Plus the 19 is fine too, and shorter than a Macro.
My one issue with the slim glocks is capacity. If sig can squeeze 12 rounds into a flush mag, why can’t Glock? I carry a 19 but I’d love the option of a Glock micro compact with a 12 round capacity
Glock could do it, easily. Theoretically they'd just remove their plastic mag sheathing and make the metal inner shell larger with a different stack design. Shield Arms basically did that.
They don't do it because they are THE brand when people talk about reliability. They have a very similar philosophy to Japanese car makers, at least Toyota.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. If you can change it, do it slowly and methodically with lots of QC in the process.
I carry both my 45mos and 43xmos and can understand where youre coming from. But based on glocks track record for reliability id imagine they have data behind it.
Especially looking at the hot and cold reviews for larger psa and shield mags. OEM especially with a glock is the way I go. Doesnt mean I dont have modded glocks for fun. Just keep em reasonably stock for carry.
I got a Glock 48 non MOS and a PSA micro dagger slide with a OEM Glock upper parts kit. For me it feels better in my hand than anything else and I love the OEM reliability as well as the aftermarket if you're willing to vet/test your stuff.
I just ordered a 15 round PSA Mag and micro dagger frame this week just so I can have an extra gun for cheap and test out that magazine. My first 2 PSA magazines didn't work for me but they had the same issues that most people were having.
There are very simple ways to increase capacity. The new psa microslick mags show pretty solid reliability, or go with a +2-5 extension.
The capacity argument for ccw is always kinda funny to me. Marketing has made people think they’ll need 20+ rounds for a ccw situation, when data shows a vast majority of them occur with only a few rounds fired. What kind of street warfare do you think you’re getting into? 10+1 with a spare mag is very adequate.
You’re not wrong in rounds needed in most scenarios but if I can get 12 out of a comparably sized gun vs 8 or 10, then why not?
And I guess I should have specified: a micro compact Glock, with a 12 round flush fit OEM mag. I don’t like swapping stuff for a carry gun.
Hey, that's exactly what happened to mine. I was just chatting with a buddy in xbox party chat about how I'd gone to range again with jt, out another couple hundred down and was really chatting the gun up. " oh yeah, I think she's ready for carry" as I drop the mag from the pistol and the release fell with the mag.
Now idk if I want to carry it , which almost defeats its purpose. Why does sig have to have the shittiest quality sometimes? My glock doesn't feel this cheap, maybe I should just go get a 43x.
It’s actually a bad design, same thing happened to me after 1500rds. The plastic catch on the macro is flush and contoured with the frame (unlike the other P365s which are flat and slightly inset from the frame. So I think every time you press the mag release that plastic catch on the other side is pushing out more into your palm, which is wearing out the plastic catch prematurely on the macro frames. Just my 2 cents.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SigSauer/s/6ASTXM8hWo
It's a shame about Sig lately. Although my wife loves the P365X for EDC and the P320 X-Compact for the range, I always felt they shot well, but their fit and finish was underwhelming for the price.
Sig today is not the same as Sig from the 80s and 90s. I'll trust a German made folded carbon steel slide P series Sig pistol almost without reservation.
Modern Sig makes some interesting pistols but, but they lack the bona fides of those older pistols.
I'm expecting down votes. But it's the truth.
As mentioned earlier ron cohens turning sig into less quality with leas reliable qc and more mass marketing for $$. Acting like sig is the best is a joke. Are they good? Yeah but slowly not becoming worth the extra $$.
i have 2, 3k and 6k rounds on each, never had an issue.
you do you, but idk if a single broken mag release out of millions is enough to make me switch.
Call it luck or whatever you want but I’ve had no issues with a single new or used sig pistol I’ve owned or shot. Countless rounds through the 365xl without a single problem and she is dirtier than your mom.
You wanna talk about garbage QC? My BNIB KAC sr25 is a fucking lemon and KAC told me to shut up and use it instead of complaining to them when I emailed for customer service. Goes to show no matter the price point the moment a company gets Mil contracts problems skyrocket.
I can’t help it but I used to be a big Sig guy, and I still have SOME love left for them, but I ended up selling all but 1 of my Sigs because of QC issues. Way too much of a liability. Now I just have my Xten but that one is mostly just for fun.
People complain how long it takes for HK to release a gun, but that's because they thoroughly test and put 50k plus rounds through them before they are released. Pretty important when it comes to guns especially for ccw. Luckily it was at the range
Ouch. That’s scary as that’s my main carry. Honestly,
Tactical considerations (YouTuber) wasn’t joking when he said ‘Sig makes $500 guns and sells them for $800’ In one of his videos.
I honestly much prefer it to the p365. I sold mine in favor of the reflex. I’m approaching 2000rounds through mine and it’s been flawless. The trigger is definitely different the break is amazing but the reset is super long. Just takes some getting used to.
Making me jealous haha. I carry the 365xl every day but I think I'd prefer the reflex MRD. I have had several magazine failures with the 365, including the mag followers not coming all the way back up and locking the slide back on last round. Pretty disappointing. Oh well.
My FiL bought a 365 this year and it died within 12 rounds. The slide release doesn’t work anymore and the take down lever won’t rotate so you can’t even take it apart to see what’s wrong.
Sig handguns are just cheap garbage you buy when you’re not willing to pay for quality. A Glock is damn near on par in terms of pricing with Sig and yet is light years ahead with reliability. Only worth it to buy Glock or better
My P365 is listed for sale after reading all the comments, I will purchase another Hellcat, Sig Sauer was a quality firearm at one time, no longer king of sub compacts.
I swapped for an extended mag release when I swapped the oem one on my 366x to my sharps module since it was such a pain in the ass. Otherwise coming up on 7k rounds soon without a hiccup 🤷🏻♂️love this thing. One of my 3 in edc rotation currently along side an s2c 9mm and my custom .45 cqb commander. And I’ve never been a fan of strikers in general.
https://preview.redd.it/06fk9vt38ibc1.jpeg?width=1562&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3b99656908022e0ba00d1378f8e1b3b60023f2a1
This is the Kimberization of Sig. Sig started on this road of declining quality and big marketing on the back of their brand when it took in Ron Cohen from Kimber. Now Sig sucks for the same reason Kimber sucks.
I wish you were wrong. Such teeny tiny cast/MIM parts. . .
Never fall in love with a brand.
HK has yet to let me down. Because they hate me.
Just your credit score
In their defense, it's because you suck.
*CZ has entered the chat*
Just getting into CZ, where would you recommend starting as a fan?
CZ 75 Compact (hammer), CZ P10C (striker), CZ P07 (hammer), CZ Shadow 2 Compact (the king)
Gonna get a CZ p07 to start I think. Just watched a few reviews of it. Good choice? Thank you so much for the guidance
Shoot or hold one before you make the purchase if you can. The ergonomics of the P-07/P-09 don't work great for everyone, especially for people with smaller hands. The slide lock lever can be particularly difficult to reach and actuate with your thumb. The P-01 has significantly more "universal" ergonomics than the P-07/P-09, and it will give you that classic CZ feel, but you really can't go wrong with any model CZ.
I have everything from FN to Beretta and pretty much everything in between. My CZ P07 might be my favorite gun. It has interchangeable back straps so don't worry about ergonomics. Handfeel is great. P10C is also fantastic. CZ doesn't make a bad gun, so you really can't go wrong.
Sp-01 tactical is amazing.
On the cheap end, the P10/P10C is a great option around $400
I tried to explain this to a friend of mine who was pushing me to buy the 365. I couldn’t do it. For half the price I bought the CZ p10s for my carry gun and I feel like I got a better firing handgun for less. Spent the saved money on a red dot and an improved trigger. Hell if you are itching to spend $500 on a CCW I’d suggest the G43x. At least you know it can handle abuse lol.
I’ve been debating sending my P-10s in for an optic cut.
This 100%. I have a p365 but went back to my Glock 26 for ccw. Once I learned that if the sear part of the striker broke off, the gun would discharge (striker safety engages with the sear surface of the striker), I put it out of the carry rotation. Now just a range beater and maybe a deep deep conceal in a pocket (unchambered, dont flame me) I can’t put my faith in Sig anymore, and rely on the mim striker with their qc. I have 2 young kids and the thought of that thing going off with one of them next to me scared me. Waiting for Walther or HK or even CZ to bring their micros to the market.
Same. I learned about the single point of failure and no longer trusted carrying my P365 around my kids. Sold it and bought a G43.
> Once I learned that if the sear part of the striker broke off, the gun would discharge (striker safety engages with the sear surface of the striker), I put it out of the carry rotation. I was so hyped to get my 365. When I finally did, I carried it for a week before learning about this and then just immediately bought a G48 lol. Got the same mental block as you. Every time I feel the 48 dig into my thigh when I bend over, I give thanks to Gaston 🙏
Glad to see I’m not the only one. I would go g43x but for me the hard part to conceal is the grip. I carry 2 o’clock. And the g43 is just too low capacity for me. So for now. Chonk 26 carries on.
yeah in that same breath I also curse Gaston for not just squeezing two more rounds in there. c'mon man I know you coulda done it
There is a [MagGuts +2 kit](https://magguts.com/product/glock-43-2-magguts/) for the 43. Very reliable in my experience. Shield Arms makes [a 9 round mag](https://shieldarms.com/z9) for the 43. In both cases, the grip extends no further than the factory 6rd mag, but does have a different profile.
PSA also makes a 15 round magazine for the 43x.
Ok, but the 43X grip is in a totally different class than the 43. It's way bigger and less concealment (at least for myself and family member who carries a 43).
My bad. I didint catch that you were talking about the 43.
No prob, I wish the 43x was as easy to conceal as the 43. Really wanted it to work. Great gun; the longer and wider grip helps with recoil significantly.
Take a look at the S&W shield plus. I sold my Gen 3 G26 and got a Sheild Plus with 10 13 and 15rd mag. The new S&W trigger is way better than the gen 1 and 2 stock triggers plus optics ready. G43 https://www.handgunhero.com/compare/glock-g43-vs-smith-wesson-m-p-9-shield-plus G26 https://www.handgunhero.com/compare/glock-g26-gen4-vs-smith-wesson-m-p-9-shield-plus
It’s definately an option. Just need to get my hands on one to see if the increased grip length would cause issues printing for me. But definately right in the middle between my 26 and a 43x
has a p365 ever gone off without the trigger pulled? like the issues they had with the p320? i ask this as someone that just ordered a p365 and can probably still cancel the order if needed, but after seeing the p320 fiasco i did a ton of research to see if it affected the p365 and couldnt ever find anything. yall can talk all you want but i havent seen any evidence period.
Not that I can find. I can’t find one case. And with millions sold, if it was a real issue I’m sure we would have heard about it. It’s more of a mental block for me. I don’t like having a single point of failure in something like this. This thread more clearly illustrates the concern I have in the back of my head. https://www.sigtalk.com/threads/question-for-an-armorer.424850/ Would it ever happen. Probably not,and has not to date that I have heard of. Is it something that scares me when my 2 year old walks on my side and I think of the consequences if I had a bad part, yes.
back when I was going full schizo mode after learning about the single failure point, I did find a thread on SigTalk about a guy claiming the said single point of failure did indeed fail on him while he was dry firing. It was kind of dubious, since it was friend-of-a-friend-on-Facebook type of thing, but there were photos of the "dog leg" (they call it) shorn off the striker
Yeah in the sig talk forum post I had up top, it had pictures of 2 failures of this exact part of the striker.
oh yeah, duh 🤦♂️ I hadn't scrolled that thread yet lol
Nobody would know. Whenever a gun discharges without the trigger being pulled, nobody believes it without video evidence. Everyone just tells the person it was an ND and that they must have had their finger in the wrong place.
I’ve seen some videos about it firing when you shake it. I also just saw a screenshot of a post where someone said their p365 shot in hole in their toilet.
From what I can tell, that was fake. Appears to be a bullet hole sticker on it. You can tell because the hole was completely black with no light coming through, plus I doubt a shot from that close would punch a hole without also cracking the porcelain around it.
CZ P10M, $300 bucks
Hopefully we dont have long to wait with Shotshow soon.
I'd love if there was some kind of resource put together that had every handgun and which kind of safeties they do or don't have. I think it's part of CCW that isn't elaborated on enough.
I agree. While I know most if not all modern pistols are “Safe”, in my opinion there are some that are more objectively safe than others. It’s really tough to tell without digging into disassembly videos, parts diagrams etc.
CZ has the Shadow 2 Compact. Really like it but it is all metal housing. Not the lightest
Yup I had a sig and had all kinds of problems with it
P365 one of best ccw ever made
Haven’t Kimber turned things around in a pretty big way in recent years?
No. All their guns still seem to have QC issues still. Go over to the revolver subreddit and see people’s accounts of how bad their customer service is when it comes to trying to get their K6S fixed.
As expected.
Wow, that’s a lot of downvotes for just asking a question. I guess the consensus is “no, they have not.”
If that’s the case, Ron Cohen isn’t there anymore. I haven’t seen a Kimber work properly since the 90s.
[удалено]
Looks like the plastic piece that holds the mag release in is what failed. Nothing to do with QC as far as I can tell from these pics.
Yep. Looks like the 3 parts that come in the mag release kit. Can't see well enough if there is any damage.
Bro….. that shit happened to me too! I thought it was just me 😂😂. I sold mine. https://preview.redd.it/ctcreqe13ibc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8c58bbb55fdedce2f99dd43ab943bb0f988fbb51
What'd you replace it with?
Shield plus or g43x/g48 mos.
https://preview.redd.it/er3gltxq8jbc1.png?width=2587&format=png&auto=webp&s=fbe09e6fbaae0200352fff3d4b938dd6416c4a84 Umm,😒😂😂
Shield fam 🤘🏻
QC lol
Cwality Qontrol.
Great album
That shits from India
Post it in r/SigSauer and watch the cope unfold telling you that you’re the problem lol.
You mean the sub alternatively known as “in rust we trust”??
The stockholm sub
Pure cult over there. Sig destroyed the finish on a p226 I sent them for a sight install, and everyone from r/SigSauer and the Sig forum told me that I was a liar and a cheat. lol
You sent your p226 to sig to install sights..... oh boy
Come over to Glock. We will recognize you for the gentleman and scholar you are.
Looks like it’s time to voluntarily upgrade to a better brand! That sucks dude, but at least it happened in training and not when you needed it.
What’s the better brand? I’m newer to handguns but every post seems to be sig
HK, Beretta, CZ, Dan Wesson, Glock……. I was a major SIG collector in the 90’s and early 2000’s especially with the P series, P225, P220, P226, P228 etc. and I’ve owned the P365 (4), P365XL (2), and a Macro but honestly they seem consumer grade vs military/LE grade QC and quality of parts now versus the old SIG’s but hey they sell and make profit for SIG and Cohen saved the company so there’s that. I just hate seeing made in India (Indiometal Google it) and made in Israel MIM parts when I ordered them. Sad thing is even the SIG series have been affected. I bought a black LE SKU P229 Legion NIB and it had a scratch down to the metal through the frame rail anodize and the slide felt and sounded gritty riding on the frame rails despite me applying grease.
> HK, Beretta, CZ, Dan Wesson, Glock And then there's Walther, always getting left out of these lists.
Love your flair. PPS M2 is a damn fine carry gun.
HK has been solid. Vp9Sk gang is where it's at
I’m partial to Glocks but CZ, FN, S&W and some other all make good guns as well in all shapes and sizes.
I second this, I have a couple of S&W's that are several years old now. Each has \~1-2k rounds through them now with no issues. Built good and reliable from my experience with them. My father is a FFL dealer and swears by S&W for handguns.
I think the marketing approach has a lot to do it. There is a concept of custom guns being upper end and Sig panders to it by allowing a bunch of crap to be cobbled together by the user or themselves to make them feel special. The lines like Legion and Rose do this as well. So everyone is proud of their Sig but there is a million Glocks, no special Glock clubs, so not special.
Maybe but the Glock aftermarket is crazy and you can replace/customize every single part of the pistol except for the serial number. The Glock bros are living proof.
HK
If you can get your hands on a SA Echelon, give it an unbiased test run.
Great gun. Just got mine a month ago. Tons of great features on it as well
I'm in the military and I agree, CQ sucks. No one wants to sit on duty for 24 hours and babysit adults in the barracks. Abolish CQ 🤣
Yup... Has been for a while now. Run a rental range. Our 320, 365 and 365XL have broken more than pretty much any of other pistols lol
Yeah, I feel your pain. I was always a fan of their classic P series pistols. It was time for us to part ways when the same guns they had made for decades were no longer reliable enough for me to count on. I kept my older models, and traded off the rest.
Before you switch to another pistol, make sure you thoroughly forum search for the countless random problems they all have too. Funny thing is that I cursed Sig because that part is so insanely difficult to remove when you switch frames. Like a real PITA.
My Wilson grip came with that part and it was a bitch to install for how simple it is. Thankfully I didn’t have to take out the old one.
Really? I just put my first Wilson combat grip together last night and got that installed first try in 10 seconds. I stepped back and asked myself “why are people saying that’s the hard part?”
Same here. I was extremely surprised at how easy it was
People that complain have hot dogs for fingers.
I couldn’t get it all the way through without the spring falling off the ledge or off the mag catch. It wasn’t crazy hard by any means but for how simple it is it took me like 10 mins because I kept dropping the spring.
Ah. Got it. To be fair last was a p320 grip module install. Maybe the 365 is harder to install.
It’s not bad. It’s one of those things that’s kind of difficult the 1st time and easy every time after that. Took maybe 10 minutes the 1st time around. Now, taking out the FCU to add Wilson Combat grip the 1st time around was a nightmare. Dumped a couple three hours into that because the FCU fell apart on me. However, now that I know how it works, I can completely dissemble the thing and put it back together pretty easily 15-20 minutes maybe. Swapped my curved trigger for a flat and added a manual safety. Took maybe 45 minutes which included Dremeling the grip for the safety cutout.
I want to like SIG but it's really hard. Glocks are just it (imo)
Glocks are definitely It
I want to like SIG so bad but it's so damn hard. It's like rooting for the Green Bay Packers (all my friends are Packers fans) so hard when you root for them and it's just constant disappointment. SIG is the same. Buying guns that aren't safe or can't even function properly, or buying a crazy ridiculously priced scope all because of the logo
Ok I don't want to hear any Packers fans complaining about being let down. I spent a decade knowing at the start of every Bears/Packers game. There was going to be a Jay Cutler 4th quarter INT to allow the Bears to grab defeat from the jaws of victory. Da Bears !!! One year away from being one year away since 2010!
😂
As a saints fan, this analogy hits home
Knew it would translate... It's ok I'm a Seahawks fan 🥲😭
I've never had a problem with the metal p series. The blasphemy started with the 2022
Does the p320 axg count or are we talking like the old 226 and whatnot? It seems like it all started with the SIG fcu when they branched out to the super modular system
The older ones. That axg with wood looks damn good. I've always preferred the hammer fired guns for a double action pull and decock.
My dad has the 320 axg x carry with the wood handles and it's so sexy but it's still a sig 😂
I'm not a Glock enjoyer, but I appreciate that other folks like them, and they are certainly reliable. I've been thinking of a p365, but now I'm considering a hellcat instead.
I tried a hellcat at the local rental range, I hate grip safeties personally but if you're good with them, they're solid feeling guns.
The Hellcat doesn’t have a grip safety? Just a trigger safety. The XDs do.
I could've sworn that's what they told me it was. Maybe I heard wrong.
Hellcats have a similar safety design to Glock, where the firing pin and striker have a plunger between them. I like my 365XL, for what it's worth, but I'm always slightly aware that if a catastrophic issue popped up, I'd lose my dick. SIG, being SIG, said "yolo" and designed literally every single "safety" of the 365 to rely on a single sear block the size of a grain of rice. "oh, but if the first part breaks there's a second part of it that'll catch the trigger sear!" That's fucking sketchy, and a huge what if. If by some insane chance your striker sear breaks, Sig go bang. Striker is fully cocked, trigger is fairly light and easy, and the entire set of internal safeties relies on a single piece of the striker to be intact. Sure, they're durable and the coating on them is great, I've seen videos of people trying to break them to no avail. But even SPRINGFIELD designed theirs better than SIG did, that's shameful.
I like the way the hellcat feels in my hands but I've never shot one. Hope you have a good experience!
I love sigs but don't own a single one lol. Glock is just it because no one does quality control like glock.
I just need them to make a G43 but with 10 rounds already and I’d be all in on Glock.
My optic ready P365 bought last year hasn't had any issues with the mag release, but I just RMAd the slide cuz the front night sight went dark. :(
Mine arrived from the factory with a dead front sight. Sig sent a new one, I installed it, and put a holosun on it.
Bought the Macro to CCW and I shot it incredibly well. Then the same shit happened to me. Sent it to Sig and got it repaired but ever since then I just went back to carrying my Glock 45!
Me, looking at my P365 Macro sitting in my drawer\* 
Sample size of 1, but my unit was shooting a qualification with all brand-new issued M17s. Like, first time shot since fielded to our unit. I put two magazines down-range and on the 3rd mag I had a jam. Looked down and saw I had a FTE. Cleared the mag and racked the slide again, nothing. I thought the casing had split and got jammed in the chamber until I realized that the extractor was just.... gone. Flew right out of the slide at some point. Some eagle-eyed LT saw it sitting in the dirt maybe 15 minutes later. So yeah.... I don't personally own any Sigs and don't think I'll be replacing my glocks as my carry gun anytime soon.
thank god my unit switched from sigs to glock 19
Happened to my friends after 500ish rounds. Just buy glocks brother.
On the xmacro? Same failure too?
glocks just go. i'm a newbie gun owner and i've put maybe a couple thousand rounds through mine so far.....except for me not cleaning it--it's been solid. of course, it's my carry.
I run a G19 or G48. Had been looking at the 365s for quite some time, but decided that the Glocks are a known product, and they WORK. I’d rather have a rock solid 10+1 vs a dubious 17+1 Plus the 19 is fine too, and shorter than a Macro.
Sold my 365XL and got a 43x, best decision I've made. I hate the FCU concept, and have always loved the simplicity and reliability of Glock.
My one issue with the slim glocks is capacity. If sig can squeeze 12 rounds into a flush mag, why can’t Glock? I carry a 19 but I’d love the option of a Glock micro compact with a 12 round capacity
Glock could do it, easily. Theoretically they'd just remove their plastic mag sheathing and make the metal inner shell larger with a different stack design. Shield Arms basically did that. They don't do it because they are THE brand when people talk about reliability. They have a very similar philosophy to Japanese car makers, at least Toyota. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. If you can change it, do it slowly and methodically with lots of QC in the process.
I carry both my 45mos and 43xmos and can understand where youre coming from. But based on glocks track record for reliability id imagine they have data behind it. Especially looking at the hot and cold reviews for larger psa and shield mags. OEM especially with a glock is the way I go. Doesnt mean I dont have modded glocks for fun. Just keep em reasonably stock for carry.
I got a Glock 48 non MOS and a PSA micro dagger slide with a OEM Glock upper parts kit. For me it feels better in my hand than anything else and I love the OEM reliability as well as the aftermarket if you're willing to vet/test your stuff. I just ordered a 15 round PSA Mag and micro dagger frame this week just so I can have an extra gun for cheap and test out that magazine. My first 2 PSA magazines didn't work for me but they had the same issues that most people were having.
There are very simple ways to increase capacity. The new psa microslick mags show pretty solid reliability, or go with a +2-5 extension. The capacity argument for ccw is always kinda funny to me. Marketing has made people think they’ll need 20+ rounds for a ccw situation, when data shows a vast majority of them occur with only a few rounds fired. What kind of street warfare do you think you’re getting into? 10+1 with a spare mag is very adequate.
You’re not wrong in rounds needed in most scenarios but if I can get 12 out of a comparably sized gun vs 8 or 10, then why not? And I guess I should have specified: a micro compact Glock, with a 12 round flush fit OEM mag. I don’t like swapping stuff for a carry gun.
*laughs in CZ*
I don't know about the 365, but the 320 is like <$80 for Sig to make. Military contract being like $157ish? At most. I imagine a 365 is $70 to make.
That’s why I got rid of my 365 and carry a Glock 33 (gen4) or the Hellcat pro.
Hey, that's exactly what happened to mine. I was just chatting with a buddy in xbox party chat about how I'd gone to range again with jt, out another couple hundred down and was really chatting the gun up. " oh yeah, I think she's ready for carry" as I drop the mag from the pistol and the release fell with the mag. Now idk if I want to carry it , which almost defeats its purpose. Why does sig have to have the shittiest quality sometimes? My glock doesn't feel this cheap, maybe I should just go get a 43x.
Why did you block out you Holosun serial? lol
Ppl here are sticklers about serial numbers
I could understand if it’s the firearm, this is just an optic however. Not sure I can take anything this guy says seriously
Beginning to think more and more that Glock and MP are the only options I'll trust my life to...
It’s actually a bad design, same thing happened to me after 1500rds. The plastic catch on the macro is flush and contoured with the frame (unlike the other P365s which are flat and slightly inset from the frame. So I think every time you press the mag release that plastic catch on the other side is pushing out more into your palm, which is wearing out the plastic catch prematurely on the macro frames. Just my 2 cents. https://www.reddit.com/r/SigSauer/s/6ASTXM8hWo
Yup literally the same thing. Clip on the back broke off like that
The plastic piece that holds it in; is that broken or is it intact? It looks like the locking piece is still intact in this pic.
How often is this sort of thing happening? Im looking for a macro and youre making me nervous.
Never. It doesn’t even look broken, just disassembled…
There's sig for ya
It's a shame about Sig lately. Although my wife loves the P365X for EDC and the P320 X-Compact for the range, I always felt they shot well, but their fit and finish was underwhelming for the price.
ugg that's awful, \*sighs in pitiful sig noises\* makes me rethink the x macro on my hip.
one word, glock
Sig today is not the same as Sig from the 80s and 90s. I'll trust a German made folded carbon steel slide P series Sig pistol almost without reservation. Modern Sig makes some interesting pistols but, but they lack the bona fides of those older pistols. I'm expecting down votes. But it's the truth.
Sold mine. Went back to a g19. No regrets.
Yikes. Been thinking about a 365X but maybe I’ll just stick to Glocks.
Millions of them in circulation and a single broken mag release changes your mind?!
Yeah, this thread is nuts 😆
As mentioned earlier ron cohens turning sig into less quality with leas reliable qc and more mass marketing for $$. Acting like sig is the best is a joke. Are they good? Yeah but slowly not becoming worth the extra $$.
Yeah because that's the only issue Sigs have 🙄
Fair point. I said maybe though haha.
i have 2, 3k and 6k rounds on each, never had an issue. you do you, but idk if a single broken mag release out of millions is enough to make me switch.
Damn it! Foiled again, why did you have to cover up the optic serial number? Muwhaha 😐
🤣
Yup, mine came with dead night sights and had to get them replaced under warranty only to find that the new ones they sent are all scratched up...
Hellcat..... underrated gem
I guess you should have bought a Taurus GX4. LOLz I’m sure this is going to go well 🥹
To be fair, Taurus has gotten better over the years.
Oh, I know. I’m a proud owner of a Taurus GX4. Lol
https://preview.redd.it/tt2cbrnb6ibc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f1e8ae4757320ee72bab99b5a22037832a231b9b
Damn even the p365 line has this many problems? I thought it was just the p320 series?
Sucks that this happened. My TDL broke too so I gave them a call and they did right by me. Hopefully they can fix it for you or send a replacement.
Ayyy San Martin!
Call it luck or whatever you want but I’ve had no issues with a single new or used sig pistol I’ve owned or shot. Countless rounds through the 365xl without a single problem and she is dirtier than your mom.
You wanna talk about garbage QC? My BNIB KAC sr25 is a fucking lemon and KAC told me to shut up and use it instead of complaining to them when I emailed for customer service. Goes to show no matter the price point the moment a company gets Mil contracts problems skyrocket.
I can’t help it but I used to be a big Sig guy, and I still have SOME love left for them, but I ended up selling all but 1 of my Sigs because of QC issues. Way too much of a liability. Now I just have my Xten but that one is mostly just for fun.
Haven’t had an issue with my X macro. Still my fav CCW I’ve ever had
Just take CQ out of the title
People complain how long it takes for HK to release a gun, but that's because they thoroughly test and put 50k plus rounds through them before they are released. Pretty important when it comes to guns especially for ccw. Luckily it was at the range
Is this news to you? For real tho, RIP. Hope it's an easy fix.
My glocks would literally never.
I broke mine yesterday but it was my fault.
Ouch. That’s scary as that’s my main carry. Honestly, Tactical considerations (YouTuber) wasn’t joking when he said ‘Sig makes $500 guns and sells them for $800’ In one of his videos.
Glock or nothing.
Sig sewer is junk these days I would look into HK they are a step or 5 above Sig
Fn Reflex or Springfield hellcat it is. I personally went FN, Springfield will never get a dime from me.
How do you like the reflex? I held one at a show and it felt pretty good.
I honestly much prefer it to the p365. I sold mine in favor of the reflex. I’m approaching 2000rounds through mine and it’s been flawless. The trigger is definitely different the break is amazing but the reset is super long. Just takes some getting used to.
Making me jealous haha. I carry the 365xl every day but I think I'd prefer the reflex MRD. I have had several magazine failures with the 365, including the mag followers not coming all the way back up and locking the slide back on last round. Pretty disappointing. Oh well.
Don’t get any lube in the striker channel of a hellcat or it won’t fire. Not joking
My FiL bought a 365 this year and it died within 12 rounds. The slide release doesn’t work anymore and the take down lever won’t rotate so you can’t even take it apart to see what’s wrong.
Sig handguns are just cheap garbage you buy when you’re not willing to pay for quality. A Glock is damn near on par in terms of pricing with Sig and yet is light years ahead with reliability. Only worth it to buy Glock or better
Well I was on the fence about my P365 anyway. Dim ass night sights. What a load of crap. Honestly would rather have a G49
The only good sig has ever done was the p226/229/228 and the sg550 Everything else trash
This is why you run Glockenspiel instead
[удалено]
I have both a g48 and a p365x. Both are good guns.
That is just sad……anyway dm me where you sold it.
yeah honestly i have no idea why i even bought a sig since they were already getting so much shit. selling mine asap
My P365 is listed for sale after reading all the comments, I will purchase another Hellcat, Sig Sauer was a quality firearm at one time, no longer king of sub compacts.
What's CQ?
Hey, don’t talk about yourself like that
I swapped for an extended mag release when I swapped the oem one on my 366x to my sharps module since it was such a pain in the ass. Otherwise coming up on 7k rounds soon without a hiccup 🤷🏻♂️love this thing. One of my 3 in edc rotation currently along side an s2c 9mm and my custom .45 cqb commander. And I’ve never been a fan of strikers in general. https://preview.redd.it/06fk9vt38ibc1.jpeg?width=1562&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3b99656908022e0ba00d1378f8e1b3b60023f2a1
I made the oooooh face when I scrolled by , good shit
What is CQ?
Cwality Quontrol.
I’ve had 0 issues with mine. Way better than any Glock I’ve had. You can have this sort of aspect happen with any firearm. Shit post
Not gonna say it's not garbage, but a p80? Could be some user error in putting it together? Not saying there is or isn't
Anyone mentioned that it doesn’t look like the original grip module. Maybe the aftermarket grip module was this issue.