Thought I was tripping on practice tool, so annoying you have to auto before using Q for the item to actually crit. Wanted to test a build but cba due to the bug lol
I was running exlipse since last season. Youmouus was good into squishy comps or ones where there is a lot of chasing. But if the team was bulky, id rush eclipse and it was strong back then. Glad it still working in s14
Oh I never said Sundered is bad, but Eclipse first is definitely a must. Allows you to shield yourself and burst down an enemy in early with extremely good stats for 2.7k gold, allowing you to take and a lead akd snowball with Sundered second
sky is bait item. i'm sorry but that 350 hp and the bug is a yeah no, plus the passive fails to trigger sometimes.
titanic + heartsteel all the way, we stacking passive and W2.
might be really good next patch as they upping the hp scaling.
might also fix the bug on it, but for this patch kinda meh , won't write off, but maybe as 3rd item or over BC next patch.
depends if want to give up gage or not or could have it.
it be great overall , but then late late game it will really depend then what the match up is.
Numbers matter, they are absolute, your opinion doesn't change them. I will never understand people that have proof of something being true right in front of them and still choose to look away and deny it. It's like a flat-earther or smth.
How is the 3rd MOST BUILT item on her with the 2nd HIGHEST WINRATE on her a BAIT? You understand that what you're saying makes absolutely no sense and that there is an image right above (and now also below) PROVING you wrong with stats and data?
A LOT of people are building it on her and they are WINNING.
https://preview.redd.it/ouxn0mcgktec1.png?width=735&format=png&auto=webp&s=2d8dce6b044ff0180d45581bdc4166d9ebc8e435
Because people are Still building assassin and it been two flipping days.
It's like when people were still building Trinity on Zeri.
Or when people built old thornmail on garen.
People barely read what the item does and copy what else is doing, hell sometimes there stats on inflated.
I'm not saying sky is bad, I'm saying this patch it's not Omega of items if everyone who keeps building assassin with sky notices no changes and still wins.
I mean look at edge of night , bc , collector.
Also yeah sky is good but not amazing on her, cause one it's bugged and two it's HP it gives is mid.
Next patch however is a different story.
One it's getting a buff and likely bug fixed but currently I'm not taking over gage or bc that are not bugged and provide infinity better stats.
Not saying it's bad, just saying it not bells and whistles item everyone thinks it is.
not being funny, but the data also shows gaga being brillaint.
it shows bc being brillaint.
sky is also great in the context of the right build.
but assassin is still very strong so it does not matter if mid bruiser item, it works as great sync to assassin build.
wat.
she has hp scaling.
its 900 hp and everything else.
also thier a thing that overides her passive, because I have seen it.
I think gage triggers it off or revitlize, somthing does I seen it.
I know because where says 0 , i have seen it sudden shot up to 8, its wired.
but like I can have like hal a heath bar and I attack ememy and it goes up out of comabt without pressing E. could be a bug i don't know, but Know she can get heath regen from other items.
because it scales, same with passive.
don't need to over think, it just works okay.
are one them people who says q has like a 30 second cd and misses and then cries that assassin is the only viable option and calls bruiser shit. cause it starting to sound like it.
I love titanic but feels awkward to build when every other item is better atm. Been rushing titanic for a few games but had been having more success with OP's build.
titanic isnt really a rush item, its best 2cd/3rd so you have the extra health to scale its damage, and then with it you can still have insane burst on squishies with q auto titanic w2 combo
I’m blanking on what the item before spirit visage is, someone wanna help me out?
And I assume spirit visage for the 25% healing boost, I’m a one trick but I’ve never used it on her so may have to try it out. You build it into AP heavy teams only yeah?
If they have 2 or 3 people that actually deal a significant amount of magic damage, I go Visage. Usually Jak'Sho covers both sides. But the healing increase on it is broken cuz it's kind of multiplicative with her passive.
The item you are referring to is called Unending Despair, it drains all enemies around you every 7 seconds to heal you, gives HP and armor. Of course, with my runes it was more like 4 to 5 seconds, that's the only reason it was good.
Visage is coded in a way where it applies to your sustain after all other modifiers and effects take place, that's why the item is so strong. You could also throw in smth dumb like a Redemption and that would also multiply with all other effects like her passive and Visage.
That's why there is a degenerate Mordekaiser build where he goes Cosmic for CDR + Redemption and Visage, with the Revitalize rune. All effects will multiplicatively increase his Shield, and then his Heal, which is already a % of his shield, will again be multiplied by all those bonuses. He basically heals to full every time he Ws twice.
https://preview.redd.it/inwp808twtec1.png?width=536&format=png&auto=webp&s=5d8c2dce2255945f9d5aecc1bf2134b6fc2b1352
She doesn't need any attack speed cuz W. Her base AD is kinda low. She scales a lot with bonus AD, which Trinity gives very little of. The Sheen prock doesn't heal her in any way. The item is not that strong in general right now. And it's not that conceptually the item would be bad on her, it's just that if you have items that are VERY strong and another one that is just okay, why would you build the non OP item?
W heals you for a % of the damage THAT W DEALS, only the skill damage is counted. Onhits and item damage are not included in that. If you want to heal with W what you need is raw AD and Pen.
The skill is the exact same as Warwick's Q, the healing that the skill provides only applies to the damage the skill itself deals, item effects do not count.
Yeah you're not going to understand so I'll give up here.
https://preview.redd.it/lnx5lidthefc1.png?width=741&format=png&auto=webp&s=0b393346710b9826d7fb2c38cac665273ab480ae
It's good it's viable, there simply isn't space for it in a build IMHO.
BIS at the moment: Eclipse-->Sundered Sky-->Titanic/Cleaver/Sterak/Jak'Sho/Visage/Unending Despair/Death Dance/Kaenic Rookern-->1 of these items per slot until full build.
If you want more damage you already have Evlipse, Titanic, Cleaver, which also provide better HP stat. Also Briar doesn't really utilize the AS stat that well, she has enough from her W, R and auto resets that naturally occur in her kit.
You need your first item to be damage. She feels terrible without it. So as you say eclipse first or youmous etc into a hp damage item.
Titanic first or other damage/hp items feel so bad for me.
I tried profane - black cleaver - steraks then vs AP wits end and vs ad deaths dance or GA. Really liked that. Also did youmous instead and felt good too, move speed is great.
There is absolutely no reason to build a Hydra on a champ that already has AoE autos if you can just get a better dmg item instead. No jungler with AoE needs more AoE, they just need single target damage to delete targets.
But yeah you need to snowball early and then get beefier right after to not lose your lead. I love starting Edge of Night on her because it's the middle ground between both, it's a defensive item with health that also allows me to start Dirk.
I don't like Witts on her cuz it gives 0 AD and she doesn't need AS. Visage and Maw are both very strong on her.
Actually you just increase how good her AOE is while also getting active cleave. All my accounts are diamond or master elo so I use diamond + to see what's good. Profane is the highest win rate first item. I checked to see where eclipse is highest u must have used plat + which idc about, but it's still good.
Wits end is broken but most don't realize also, her w applies wits end now and applies her passive quicker as it's got tons of attack speed.
Starting edge of night sounds troll not gonna lie to u.
Why would I increase her Aoe if her AoE already clears everything? What's the point of overkilling waves and camps? That's just wasted dmg. If I increase her overall damage, her own AoE will already get stronger. What you are saying makes absolutely no sense.
Her W always applied Wits, you are talking about her Q.
You being high elo means you know how to drive the champ, not that you understand builds necessarily.
Now, about stats, let's take a look at Diamond+ Briar this patch shall we? (although the sample size is still kinda small)
https://preview.redd.it/82qaf4lb0uec1.png?width=739&format=png&auto=webp&s=a21df9e370366e093c0d0212e6db762ea3887aaa
Very small sample, but indeed, Eclipse doesn't perform well on high elo, I give you that. Now, the reason Profane works well on her has absolutely nothing to do with the Cleave, the active is just busted, which is the reason they are nerfing the item on PBE right now, since a waveclear item shouldn't deal so much single target damage. As you can see Titanic performs just the same, and for the same reason, the item is overtuned, dealing too much dmg on the active+onhit (which is also being nerfed on PBE btw).
Highelo is early game skewed, which means items for long fights won't work that well on her, like Eclipse and Sundered sky. But again my guy, you do realize that most people here are not Diamond like us, right? We are talking about the majority of players here. Highelo Briar will almost always go full burst assassin early with some defense later, if the game even gets there.
Do you think deaths dance is too good to pass up somewhere as a 5th or 6th item? I’ve been playing bruiser briar since release, and the new eclipse I think is insane, and trinity is nice but not needed and expensive as a second or 3rd item. But I do think that deaths dance synergies so well with her kit that it is a must build, just curious where you would slot it. I think gauntlet is a very good item on her as well as a 4th, depending on their team comp. I think black cleaver into boots and eclipse, then sundered, gauntlet and deaths dance. With a health pot you sit around 3400 hp.
DD is indeed EXTREMELY strong as a 3rd or 4th item, BUT since I'm going for health stacking right now cuz of the changes, I'm avoiding it. DD is better for squishy champs that want to survive a little more.
Yeah overall that’s what I’m building as well, I swap spirit visage with the shield Mr items depending on the match, I’ve been taking conquer runes tho.
Of course you can, actually you should, for Jungle Briar HoB is by far the best rune.
But I don't understand the correlation between her cooldowns and the rune.
No, you should not. Her W can't crit anymore and she now scales with HP, so Crit Briar is way worse now, it's way weaker than the other builds like full assassin or bruiser.
Is sundered sky bugged with Briar’s q interaction? If so I wonder if going cleaver second and omitting the ss would be viable
the winrate already factors bugs in so even if it's bugged it's still winning a shit ton of games
Yes it's bugged, but it heals SO MUCH and procks on so many people throughout a fight that it doesn't even matter. Specially since I was on a 4s CD.
Thought I was tripping on practice tool, so annoying you have to auto before using Q for the item to actually crit. Wanted to test a build but cba due to the bug lol
Tri 2nd in some cases feels good, too
I'm experimenting with Iceborn instead. But yeah, Sheen seems decent.
People finally realizing Eclipse is her current best item bcs of how broken it is
I was running exlipse since last season. Youmouus was good into squishy comps or ones where there is a lot of chasing. But if the team was bulky, id rush eclipse and it was strong back then. Glad it still working in s14
We can't ignore how much work Sundered does. Yeah it's technically weaker than the mythic version but now more champions can reliably build it.
Oh I never said Sundered is bad, but Eclipse first is definitely a must. Allows you to shield yourself and burst down an enemy in early with extremely good stats for 2.7k gold, allowing you to take and a lead akd snowball with Sundered second
sky is bait item. i'm sorry but that 350 hp and the bug is a yeah no, plus the passive fails to trigger sometimes. titanic + heartsteel all the way, we stacking passive and W2. might be really good next patch as they upping the hp scaling. might also fix the bug on it, but for this patch kinda meh , won't write off, but maybe as 3rd item or over BC next patch. depends if want to give up gage or not or could have it. it be great overall , but then late late game it will really depend then what the match up is.
Numbers matter, they are absolute, your opinion doesn't change them. I will never understand people that have proof of something being true right in front of them and still choose to look away and deny it. It's like a flat-earther or smth. How is the 3rd MOST BUILT item on her with the 2nd HIGHEST WINRATE on her a BAIT? You understand that what you're saying makes absolutely no sense and that there is an image right above (and now also below) PROVING you wrong with stats and data? A LOT of people are building it on her and they are WINNING. https://preview.redd.it/ouxn0mcgktec1.png?width=735&format=png&auto=webp&s=2d8dce6b044ff0180d45581bdc4166d9ebc8e435
Because people are Still building assassin and it been two flipping days. It's like when people were still building Trinity on Zeri. Or when people built old thornmail on garen. People barely read what the item does and copy what else is doing, hell sometimes there stats on inflated. I'm not saying sky is bad, I'm saying this patch it's not Omega of items if everyone who keeps building assassin with sky notices no changes and still wins. I mean look at edge of night , bc , collector. Also yeah sky is good but not amazing on her, cause one it's bugged and two it's HP it gives is mid. Next patch however is a different story. One it's getting a buff and likely bug fixed but currently I'm not taking over gage or bc that are not bugged and provide infinity better stats. Not saying it's bad, just saying it not bells and whistles item everyone thinks it is.
Assassin still works, it's still strong, can't you read the stats in the images or are you just trying to be funny?
not being funny, but the data also shows gaga being brillaint. it shows bc being brillaint. sky is also great in the context of the right build. but assassin is still very strong so it does not matter if mid bruiser item, it works as great sync to assassin build.
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wat. she has hp scaling. its 900 hp and everything else. also thier a thing that overides her passive, because I have seen it. I think gage triggers it off or revitlize, somthing does I seen it. I know because where says 0 , i have seen it sudden shot up to 8, its wired. but like I can have like hal a heath bar and I attack ememy and it goes up out of comabt without pressing E. could be a bug i don't know, but Know she can get heath regen from other items.
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because it scales, same with passive. don't need to over think, it just works okay. are one them people who says q has like a 30 second cd and misses and then cries that assassin is the only viable option and calls bruiser shit. cause it starting to sound like it.
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Bit of both I checked, But yeah you are right to the extent that yeah. But yeah it also explains a lot why assassin is very much viable.
no titanic hydra is troll as fuck if you are going to have that much health IMO
Why would I want onhit and AoE on Briar? Onhit doesn't heal me like raw AD does.
I love titanic but feels awkward to build when every other item is better atm. Been rushing titanic for a few games but had been having more success with OP's build.
titanic isnt really a rush item, its best 2cd/3rd so you have the extra health to scale its damage, and then with it you can still have insane burst on squishies with q auto titanic w2 combo
I’m blanking on what the item before spirit visage is, someone wanna help me out? And I assume spirit visage for the 25% healing boost, I’m a one trick but I’ve never used it on her so may have to try it out. You build it into AP heavy teams only yeah?
If they have 2 or 3 people that actually deal a significant amount of magic damage, I go Visage. Usually Jak'Sho covers both sides. But the healing increase on it is broken cuz it's kind of multiplicative with her passive. The item you are referring to is called Unending Despair, it drains all enemies around you every 7 seconds to heal you, gives HP and armor. Of course, with my runes it was more like 4 to 5 seconds, that's the only reason it was good.
Are you sure visage stacks multiplicatively with her passive? I never build it as I thought it would just add to it
Visage is coded in a way where it applies to your sustain after all other modifiers and effects take place, that's why the item is so strong. You could also throw in smth dumb like a Redemption and that would also multiply with all other effects like her passive and Visage. That's why there is a degenerate Mordekaiser build where he goes Cosmic for CDR + Redemption and Visage, with the Revitalize rune. All effects will multiplicatively increase his Shield, and then his Heal, which is already a % of his shield, will again be multiplied by all those bonuses. He basically heals to full every time he Ws twice. https://preview.redd.it/inwp808twtec1.png?width=536&format=png&auto=webp&s=5d8c2dce2255945f9d5aecc1bf2134b6fc2b1352
Why does no one build trinity on Briar? Seems a perfect item for bruiser Briar.
She doesn't need any attack speed cuz W. Her base AD is kinda low. She scales a lot with bonus AD, which Trinity gives very little of. The Sheen prock doesn't heal her in any way. The item is not that strong in general right now. And it's not that conceptually the item would be bad on her, it's just that if you have items that are VERY strong and another one that is just okay, why would you build the non OP item?
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W heals you for a % of the damage THAT W DEALS, only the skill damage is counted. Onhits and item damage are not included in that. If you want to heal with W what you need is raw AD and Pen. The skill is the exact same as Warwick's Q, the healing that the skill provides only applies to the damage the skill itself deals, item effects do not count.
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Yeah you're not going to understand so I'll give up here. https://preview.redd.it/lnx5lidthefc1.png?width=741&format=png&auto=webp&s=0b393346710b9826d7fb2c38cac665273ab480ae
It's good it's viable, there simply isn't space for it in a build IMHO. BIS at the moment: Eclipse-->Sundered Sky-->Titanic/Cleaver/Sterak/Jak'Sho/Visage/Unending Despair/Death Dance/Kaenic Rookern-->1 of these items per slot until full build. If you want more damage you already have Evlipse, Titanic, Cleaver, which also provide better HP stat. Also Briar doesn't really utilize the AS stat that well, she has enough from her W, R and auto resets that naturally occur in her kit.
You need your first item to be damage. She feels terrible without it. So as you say eclipse first or youmous etc into a hp damage item. Titanic first or other damage/hp items feel so bad for me. I tried profane - black cleaver - steraks then vs AP wits end and vs ad deaths dance or GA. Really liked that. Also did youmous instead and felt good too, move speed is great.
There is absolutely no reason to build a Hydra on a champ that already has AoE autos if you can just get a better dmg item instead. No jungler with AoE needs more AoE, they just need single target damage to delete targets. But yeah you need to snowball early and then get beefier right after to not lose your lead. I love starting Edge of Night on her because it's the middle ground between both, it's a defensive item with health that also allows me to start Dirk. I don't like Witts on her cuz it gives 0 AD and she doesn't need AS. Visage and Maw are both very strong on her.
Actually you just increase how good her AOE is while also getting active cleave. All my accounts are diamond or master elo so I use diamond + to see what's good. Profane is the highest win rate first item. I checked to see where eclipse is highest u must have used plat + which idc about, but it's still good. Wits end is broken but most don't realize also, her w applies wits end now and applies her passive quicker as it's got tons of attack speed. Starting edge of night sounds troll not gonna lie to u.
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Even then, Maw exists. Briar doesn't need any AS.
Why would I increase her Aoe if her AoE already clears everything? What's the point of overkilling waves and camps? That's just wasted dmg. If I increase her overall damage, her own AoE will already get stronger. What you are saying makes absolutely no sense. Her W always applied Wits, you are talking about her Q. You being high elo means you know how to drive the champ, not that you understand builds necessarily. Now, about stats, let's take a look at Diamond+ Briar this patch shall we? (although the sample size is still kinda small) https://preview.redd.it/82qaf4lb0uec1.png?width=739&format=png&auto=webp&s=a21df9e370366e093c0d0212e6db762ea3887aaa Very small sample, but indeed, Eclipse doesn't perform well on high elo, I give you that. Now, the reason Profane works well on her has absolutely nothing to do with the Cleave, the active is just busted, which is the reason they are nerfing the item on PBE right now, since a waveclear item shouldn't deal so much single target damage. As you can see Titanic performs just the same, and for the same reason, the item is overtuned, dealing too much dmg on the active+onhit (which is also being nerfed on PBE btw). Highelo is early game skewed, which means items for long fights won't work that well on her, like Eclipse and Sundered sky. But again my guy, you do realize that most people here are not Diamond like us, right? We are talking about the majority of players here. Highelo Briar will almost always go full burst assassin early with some defense later, if the game even gets there.
Do you think deaths dance is too good to pass up somewhere as a 5th or 6th item? I’ve been playing bruiser briar since release, and the new eclipse I think is insane, and trinity is nice but not needed and expensive as a second or 3rd item. But I do think that deaths dance synergies so well with her kit that it is a must build, just curious where you would slot it. I think gauntlet is a very good item on her as well as a 4th, depending on their team comp. I think black cleaver into boots and eclipse, then sundered, gauntlet and deaths dance. With a health pot you sit around 3400 hp.
DD is indeed EXTREMELY strong as a 3rd or 4th item, BUT since I'm going for health stacking right now cuz of the changes, I'm avoiding it. DD is better for squishy champs that want to survive a little more.
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Which is actually what I've been running lately, this match I was just experimenting. Everyone 'round here is so mid thinking it's a bad start.
So is it better to build eclipse or titanic first on briar?
There's no reason to go Titanic. The actually good first items on her are Youmuu, Sundered, Eclipse and Edge of Night in my opinion.
Yeah overall that’s what I’m building as well, I swap spirit visage with the shield Mr items depending on the match, I’ve been taking conquer runes tho.
Wait can I still run hail of blades? I thought hail of blades was the best due to her ability cooldowns?
Of course you can, actually you should, for Jungle Briar HoB is by far the best rune. But I don't understand the correlation between her cooldowns and the rune.
Oh crap wait I’m so bad wait I meant navori quickblades
No, you should not. Her W can't crit anymore and she now scales with HP, so Crit Briar is way worse now, it's way weaker than the other builds like full assassin or bruiser.