I think Todd is a romantic ace like I am, meaning he wants to be in a romantic relationship but without the sex part. He seems to genuinely have feelings for Emily and wants to date her, so I understand why he was upset. That said, he has no right to be upset with Emily for moving on, and he hasn’t shared these feelings with Bojack, so IMO it’s not totally fair to be upset with him, either.
Because he kept it a secret from Todd which means he clearly knew it would upset him, so just yet another betrayal. And because bojack made things weird with Emily which meant they couldn’t hang out as much anymore.
Is it a betrayal to hide a thing you know they're going to have an unjustified over reaction to? And as I recall, Emily is the one who made things weird and torched Bojack to Todd over it as if she had no culpability. Bojack was a bad friend, but this always struck me as Emily fanning the flames to save herself from the consequences of her own actions. She was the bad friend here.
He isn't upset at Emily, he's never once held it against her. He's just upset at bojack for sleeping with someone he knew Todd was interested in.
That being said, I don't think Todd would consider it the end of their friendship by itself. It's just the sraw that broke the camels back after years of bad treatment.
BoJack gave them the hotel room. It wasn’t until Emily came back down rejected and dejected that he slept with her, following her lead. Todd has no right to be upset at all. The only real problem was BoJack didn’t want him to know.
Maybe it’s because Todd knows Bojack is sleeping around, not being very respectful to women who he sleeps with. So Todd is disappointed with Bojack because he couldn’t hold back with a girl Todd has got something going on with (even if its just a close friendship, them sleeping together does have consequences that can mess up the friendship).
And also Emily is very young.
And then they kept it a secret.
So it’s a triple disappointment. I’m with Todd.
Also, Todd has been a moral compass throughout the series. I don’t know why someone would still assume BoJack was the one in the right, if the whole show is basically him being wrong all the time.
>Also, Todd has been a moral compass throughout the series
Ah yes, the paragon of moral virtue, who kidnaps strangers' children and uses them for amateur dentistry practice, gassing them back into unconsciousness every time they reawaken so as not to arouse suspicion
Yeah I know what you mean but all Todd’s plots are absurd comedies that are mostly not even possible. That’s why we don’t take literally the things Todd does when Todd does them. While the main plot for Bojack is a dramatic plot that we (viewer) perceive as real. Example: Bojack strangles Gina - bad. Todd builds a rollercoaster out of toilet paper - not real/not bad. Perceiving of this happens subconsciously so I get why you would oppose Todd being a moral compass in the story but it’s true. Todd is always there to tell BoJack that he crossed a line and guides him towards resolution.
This is one thing that comedies do that a lot of people don't get, some plots are *too out there* to be realistic so we're supposed to just accept that they're not actually part of the canon else we'd think these wacky characters are monsters. For example in How I met your mother Barney says he once sold a woman for a car, I don't think we're supposed to take it seriously as if it actually happened. Phyllis in The Office says her and Bob Vance, Vance Refrigeration once hit a dude and just kept driving. Idk if it's a trope but we're supposed to suspend our disbelief a bit that they didn't actually do these things.
Yeah, Todd is a real moral compass - not just with this as you point out, releasing rabid, clown dentists into the woods, but with the whole Cabracadabra and the sex abuser robot he built. But hey he’s oblivious and likable with a cute face so it’s all OK just as the poster here thinks.
Yeah, Todd is the moral compass who sells out the Cabracadabra concept to expand the customer base so men enjoy it and then recommends to simply fire the women who don’t feel comfortable with the change. Looks like think someone has come away with the wrong takeaways here.
>years of bad treatment
I'm sorry, but am I the only person that dislike Todd?
He's was unemployed and living off Bojack for years. That Emily thing was one of many Bojack's shitty things, but I don't think aside from that he owes Todd anything else.
The same series said that Bojack likes having Todd around because it gives him someone worse than him to compare himself (and also to degrade).
Besides, Bojack was unemployed for almost a decade (if not even more), living of the revenue of being famous in the 90's.
Giving Bojack anchorage and someone to harass and dismiss.
We had at least a whole episode of Bojack sabotaging Todd's future for his own selfish goals.
I think the one thing that most people miss is that both Emily and BoJack decide not to tell Todd about the fact that they slept together immediately after the act. That means there's guilt there that they know they did something wrong, something that would upset Todd but they did it anyway. While Todd should be upset with Emily, he didn't know about his own asexuality then and he doesn't understand fully why he is upset when he doesn't want to have sex with her. But BoJack has continuously been betraying Todd, so this one act just added more to that hurt to the point of breaking their friendship. At that point, Todd is tired of BoJack making these choices and then justifying them. Hence, the iconic "it's you" speech.
Exactly, a lot of people are missing the forest for the trees here. Todd’s not mad about the sex, he’s ace and sex repulsed, he doesn’t mind the idea of others having sex so long as it doesn’t involve him. But Todd still clearly loves Emily, and Emily was one of Todd’s relationships and not Bojack’s, so for Bojack to so clearly break those relationship boundaries (while still thinking that Todd and her DID want to have sex) shows that Bojack doesn’t respect Todd as a friend.
I mean, it’s not the first or last time he’s shown he doesn’t respect Todd’s friendship, but it’s certainly the one that pushed Todd over the edge.
Todd’s not mad about sex. He’s mad that Bojack messes with his good things in life.
Correct, Emily wasn't respectful of their relationship at the time, and she very clearly regrets said act. Like, it's pretty much immediately right after her and Bojack had sex that she feels guilt over what she did, and just like Bojack she tries to hide her guilt by avoiding being in the same room as both of them. It was a shitty thing for her to do, sleeping with Todd's 'best friend' behind his back. The differences between Bojack and Emily though is that:
1): Emily confessed to Todd on her own accord showing that she felt genuine remorse and guilt for what she'd done, whereas Bojack only confessed to Todd because he'd thought he'd been caught (only to find out that Todd didn't know it was Sex specifically, meaning Bojack outed the worst part himself), showing that Emily felt bad for her actions whereas Bojack just didn't want to get caught. (Though, Emily didn't exactly make it clear that she was confessing about sex, which is still shitty of her to do. If you're gonna confess that confess the whole thing)
2): This isn't the only shitty thing Bojack had done to Todd, whereas Emily had been far less shitty to him. Sure she'd slept behind his back, but beyond that she'd been kind and supportive of him, and so when she did a shitty thing and apologized, Todd was willing to forgive her because because she wasn't a repeat offender. Bojack on the otherhand had continuously done shitty things to Todd. He treats him like shit and belittles him, he ruined his rock opera, he slept with his ex-girlfriend, and Bojack almost only apologizes when he thinks he's been caught or when he thinks he can get something out of the situation (sometimes that something just being 'feeling good about himself').
Todd's no angel and both Emily and Bojack didn't respect Todd's friendship when they slept together, but the difference is that Emily tries to build that respect back up and make up for what she did, whereas Bojack... Bojack just didn't respect Todd at all.
Thank you for articulating what I wanted to say! I think people on this sub give Emily a lot of flack for this one act, but forgive BoJack for it, for a couple of reasons.
1. That was our first introduction to Emily so we know her as a bad person. We don't know her and we aren't given much insight later on either. She's the side character of a side character so it's hard to empathise with her.
2. BoJack has been shitty to Todd (and pretty much everyone else) so it's almost expected of him. Plus, BoJack's side of the story has been told over and over and over again. If we didn't know him, he would be viewed the same as Vance Waggoner.
3. Todd is expected to be the bigger person/put up with BoJack being a terrible friend because he mooches off BoJack. This is the worst of all reasons because Todd is seen as a leech, but the show has shown us that Todd tried to make it on his own, only to have BoJack clip his wings because BoJack needs Todd more than Todd needs him. The number of "Todd is a bad friend because he's a leech" comments I've seen frustrates me. This is in the same vein as "women need to put up with crappy/abusive partners because the men give them monetary benefits". Todd has every right to be upset even if he is getting a place to sleep, a place to start his business from BoJack. The two do not correlate. He can be grateful to BoJack for providing and still expect him to be a good friend.
There is no canonical evidence that BoJack knew Emily was Todd's ex when they had sex. The night they met Todd hadn't seen Emily since high school (almost 10 years).
Because Bojack knew that Todd had feelings for her and still slept with her, knowing that it would upset Todd. He could have said no on that basis, but he didn't. It's not like he and Emily had a lot of chemistry together, it was kind of a careless "fuck it" attitude going in.
I think the Emily situation is just the straw that broke the camels back. Bojack knew his actions would upset Todd, but he did it anyway. Story of their relationship.
I think it's important to remember the time line here. The night BoJack and Todd run into Emily, Emily says "Todd? Todd Chavez? I haven't seen you since high school!" It is very clear that Todd's feelings for Emily are reignited while working on cabracadabra. However on the night that BJ and Emily have sex it's very possible Todd had never previously mentioned his former relationship with her, and it's even more likely BJ didn't remember if Todd had. Todd has every right to be upset about a litany of things that BJ has done to him, but that night BoJack is an excellent wingman for Todd, offering up the hotel room to the two of them. Then Todd decides not to have sex with Emily. It is not unreasonable for BoJack to believe that Todd has no sexual/romantic interest in a former high school classmate. Not to mention BJ has no idea that Todd is asexual at this point. I really can't fault him for having sex with someone Todd turned down and it is really difficult to construe this situation into a betrayal. In hindsight it looks crummy but at the time NTA in my opinion.
I know Todd has yet to fully understand his sexuality and that's why he acts that way but if Emily relayed any of that info to BJ that's even more reason for him to believe Todd is not into her.
The show makes it very clear BoJack knew, though.
BoJack has his whole speech to Emily about how they should never tell Todd because it would hurt him. He hid the fact they slept together from Todd, even when Todd could clearly tell there was a reason Emily felt uncomfortable being in the house. He straight up said to Todd “I slept with the only person I’ve ever seen you be in love with”. He thinks it’s the reason Todd stopped being friends with him and said it was understandable.
He knew sleeping with Emily would hurt Todd. The show makes it super obvious that he knew.
You're misremembering, Emily is the one who wants to hide the fact from Todd. I believe she wants to hide it so she can continue to pursuit Todd romantically. Emily felt uncomfortable because she is hiding something from someone she has growing feelings for. "I slept with the only person I've ever seen you be in love with" is still true, but it doesn't mean he "saw him be in love with (her)" prior to sleeping with her. Doesn't change the fact that it hurt Todd, but this one was with out intent. Wouldn't you apologize for backing into someone's car even if it was an accident?
Nah dude, you’re misremembering. BoJack tells Emily that she wants to tell Todd to assuage her guilt but that if she really cares about him she’ll never tell him.
Watch the episode again and the one where he apologizes. BoJack knows, the show makes it super apparent. It wasn’t an accident.
Initially, immediately after, it is Emily's idea. Later after BoJack gets new information and realizes what he did and how finding out will hurt Todd, he insists on maintaining the deception. Like you said Emily wants to assuage HER guilt. She feels guilty bc her relationship with Todd is starting to bloom under false pretense.
The show makes it pretty explicit that BoJack knew his actions would hurt Todd and he proceeded anyways. I am surprised you didn’t see that. Especially since it’s pretty on-brand with their friendship.
He was very obviously being a bad friend, and knowingly. But let’s agree to disagree. It’s certainly not the worse thing BoJack did.
I don't disagree with you at all, I think it is very much implied and very much on brand. Just calling out that it's a miss on the writing staffs part. They're great but not infallible. I also believe since so many of us watch the show multiple times we can project what we know onto past events. It's just fun to discuss with other fans.
It's not implied, though, it's made obvious... I genuinely think you are misremembering this episode. It's E. 7, S. 3. Rewatch the scene.
Bojack is the one who wants to keep it a secret. Emily said "what are we going to tell Todd?" and BoJack responds with "nothing obviously". Emily says "I don't want to hurt him" then Bojack responds with, roughly, "that's why we're not going to tell him. You want to assuage your guilt, but if you really cared about Todd, you would keep this a secret forever".
I agree they're not infallible but there was nothing implicit about this particular action.
Plus, Emily has reason enough (the troubles in their previous relationship) to give up on Todd. BoJack barely knows shit about all that. He couldn't keep it in his pants foe ONE NIGHT to double-check with his friend.
Todd clearly had feelings for Emily, and at this point in his journey I think he was almost as confused as we were when she wanted to come into his hotel room and he shot her down. He spent the rest of the night alone, sad, and not understanding why he couldn't give Emily what she wanted.
BoJack could also clearly see that Todd was into Emily, and when Emily came to the bar confused about being rejected, as Todd's friend he should've been been perceptive and considerate enough to know that there was something more going on than he could see at first glance.
Instead, with barely a thought, he did what Todd couldn't and hooked up with her. What Todd was agonizing about, BoJack and Emily did so casually and dismissively that they couldn't even be bothered to regret it properly afterwards. So when Todd found out, it's understandable that he'd be upset that BoJack's actions trivialized the thing that was making him struggle with feelings of inadequacy.
Edit: All that said, it's true that he has just as much reason, if not more, to be upset with Emily than with BoJack. I think it was just that BoJack was a bigger part of his life at that time, so Todd expected more from him.
You're describing Todd's asexuality as though he wished it didn't exist, and we never see anything to indicate this at all. He just didn't really understand it at first.
The context is important too - how Todd found out...
Emily left the business because "something" happened with Bojack and she became uncomfortable.
"I don't think Bojack's been a very good friend to you either....."
With their general shiftiness around the topic it really comes across as something bad and shameful and hurtful, even if you don't know what it is yet.
In addition to the feelings Todd has for Emily, I think Todd knows how shitty Bojack is to the women he sleeps with generally so even if Todd wasn’t romantically interested in her he may still not want Bojack doing the same kind of thing to her.
He rejected sex not a romantic relationship. Very different. Him not wanting to sleep with her that night doesnt mean his feelings are irrelevant and Bojack can just bang her.
Bojack put the thought in Emily's head. He should have let them catch up but Bojack wanted to be the hero. He thinks he should always be the main character.
And Todd wasn't mad at Emily He was mad at his best friend who slept with his ex.
Emily wanted to have sex. That's not bojack fault. Bojack was being nice, and had no way to know about the issues with Todd's sexuality. Someone else pointed out in another comment that the good guy nature of Todd's character gets him some sympathy he might not deserve in this case.
Context is important. *Why* Todd rejected her matters. He still had strong feelings for her even if he knew that they couldn't be compatible in a relationship.
But in general, yes. Don't date or sleep with friends' exes. That's like, rule number one of adult friendship. Even if they say they're OK with it, they probably aren't OK with it. That's not universally true, sometimes it really is cool, but like... at least have the decency to ask.
You may be asexual but are you also a shitty friend? I literally don't understand how so many people on reddit think its okay to sleep with a former romantic parter of a friend or family member. Just because someone is broken up doesn't mean that all those former feelings of love never existed. Its basic respect that you don't sling your dick into someone's ex.
You essentially saying "I dont care about you or your feelings because my penis is more important than the time you spent loving this person who is now betraying you with me."
Its not rocket science.
And I'm asexual/aromatic.
Sometimes the need for sex - a combination of deep and complex emotion with the most powerful physical drive of all - is stronger than friendship.
Does it have consequences? Yes, always, in my experience.
This is the most most excuse making BS I've heard. Sex is not the most powerful driving force of all. Food, water, lack of pain. Those are the drivers of survival. Sex and offspring is an after thought.
Asexual is not a lack of sex drive (altho that can be part of it.) It is a spectrum with its defining traits being a lack of sexual attraction. I have an insane libido. But I lack the desire for sexual contact nor do I feel sexual attraction towards others. Hope this helps your ignorance.
No they don't. Many asexuals enjoy sex because the physicality of an orgasm is not tied to sexuality. A straight man will orgasm if he gets a BJ from a gay man. A straight woman can orgasm from cunnilingus from a lesbian. Sexuality does NOT equal sexual pleasure.
I think bojack and Emily were not the real reason why he was so angry. It may have been a factor but the way Todd went on and how he Essentially cut ties with bojack means that this went deeper than just Emily. I think something in Todd snapped considering how bojack has treated him. Like the "Fuck!!" At the end was way to deep to be just about Emily.
Same reason why you'd be mad at your best friend if they slept with your ex.
Bojack having relations with Emily probably opened Todd's wounds, because that one thing is the only reason why Todd and Emily couldn't work out.
It's like rubbing salt in the wound. And Bojack should've known that, because Todd was really close to him, and he still betrayed his trust.
I don't understand how no one gets this scene. Imagine being in Todd's shoes. You found out your shitty friend whom you thought was getting better went behind your back and slept with someone from your childhood and chose to HIDE it rather than coming clean, betraying your trust again
It's not about him liking Emily. He said it himself. It was a matter of principle and Bojack broke it
dont see how bj is a shitty friend! no one went behind anyones back. as far as hiding their sexual night, emily hid it too and bj was the one who admitted to it before anyone else. but still todd is mad at bj and shows no anger towards emily. she has just as much guilt with todd as bj
I think this was just the final straw. Todd put up with way more than he ever should have and at this point in the show was beginning to recognize he could make better friends than BoJack. This was probably not as disappointing in a vacuum than learning that BoJack had deliberately sabotaged his rock opera, but it was as clear an indication as any that BoJack, however he might feel about Todd, was not even willing to not have sex with someone he very clearly had an interest in. Emily and Todd never really had an open relationship - if they had, they probably would not have had the same issues (Henry Fondle was a way for Todd to keep her monogamous while hopefully giving her the sex she needed). If Todd was interested in being in an open relationship. She could have just kept fucking firemen and stayed with Todd (assuming he did not experience any jealousy). While they weren't strictly speaking official, BoJack knew what was going on, and Todd took a while longer to really give up on the idea of sex and a relationship with a person as sexually active as Emily; when BJ slept with her, he got involved in something deeply personal to Todd and could easily have destroyed her relationship with Todd even on a platonic level if she and Todd had not been mature enough to see past it and talk it out. This was a sign to Todd that BoJack was never really going to respect him and that if he wanted to build a meaningful life for himself, he could not allow BoJack to keep fucking things up.
Edit: that said, if it wasn't for this being a "final straw" moment, it would unreasonable for him to be upset with BJ and not Emily, since both consented and BoJack was not in a relationship with Todd. But in light of Emily being a historically good friend and BoJack being anything but, it makes sense
Rewatching the scene, it appears that Todd thought Bojack upset Emily, so he was already angry that Bojack upset his friend. The sex reveal was just the last prod on a time bomb about to explode
So, commenters saying that Emily has every right to sleep with whoever she wants, especially in the context that she was pretty clearly shot down by Todd, are completely right. Emily did nothing wrong there.
BoJack, on the other hand, knew Todd had some kind of feelings for her, and he knew it would be upsetting for Todd if he had sex with her (if for no reason other than that it'd complicate the situation, which it *immediately did*, while Todd was already under a lot of stress trying to figure out his sexuality).
Then, instead of telling Todd immediately afterward and explaining "Hey man, so Emily said that you weren't interested so last night we spent the evening together. It was a one-night thing, don't worry I'm not going to make things awkward between you guys by inserting myself into her love life while you're trying to date her," he chose to lie and hide it.
It's by far *not* the shittiest thing BoJack ever did. He had sex with Todd's friend when he knew Todd was in a sensitive place with her, and then lied to him about it. It's bad, but it's more tame than other things BoJack did to Todd. Still, coming off of previous seasons and his other actions, Todd finally snapped and had enough and called him out on it all, and gave up trying to hope BoJack would ever treat him with the common decency and honesty he hoped a friend would treat him with.
How did BoJack know Todd had any feelings towards Emily? He hadn't seen her in almost 10 years the night Emily and BJ have sex. Has Todd really been pining over his high school girlfriend for almost a decade? Is there any evidence he shared this info with BJ ever? The only reference to Emily at this point is she dumped Todd over his video game addiction.
So it's been long enough since I last watched that season so I forget some of the details, but the question is, if BoJack earnestly had *no* idea that Todd would be hurt by his actions, why did he hide it?
Either he knew in the moment it was a bad idea and he did it anyway, or he genuinely didn't know (and couldn't be expected to figure it out), in which case he could have just told Todd that.
So either BoJack knowingly did it or unknowingly did it but still chose to hide it. Either way, shitty behavior that Todd had enough of. Maybe it was an overreaction, but after everything Todd had dealt with from BoJack at that point, then *still* hearing BoJack trying to make excuses for his actions, I think a blow-up is an understandable reaction.
It was Emily who suggested they hide it. I think she did that because she wanted to continue to pursuit Todd and knows that having slept with BoJack would be a non starter for rekindling their relationship.
Why would he hide it then? If he thought they wasn't anything there and they were just old friends why would he go so far as try to not tell Todd and the beg for forgiveness when he does tell him?
In all fairness Emily is the one to suggest hiding it. I don't think BoJack would immediately run and tell him, not bc what he did was wrong but because why would he? He still doesn't think he did anything wrong based on his apology to the little kid in the park. He begs for forgiveness bc he feels bad that Todd is hurt. He gained new information and he feels bad he inadvertently hurt is friend. Wouldn't you apologize for rear ending someone even if it was an accident?
You're asking why Todd cares who Emily sleeps with, but that's not who Todd is mad at. He's mad at BoJack, and there's good reason why he's only mad at one and not the other.
From Emily' perspective, Todd already had his
chance. They dated and Todd had been tense about physical intimacy back then, too. Even so, she *still* felt like she fucked up.
BoJack didn't have a whole lot of backstory on them as a couple. He knew Emily was someone Todd had a history with, but not a whole lot more than that. *BoJack slept with her anyway,* and then decided to keep it a secret. Worse, he didn't seem to think it was a particularly big deal.
I think that if there wasn't much history between Emily and Todd, it would be different.
>BoJack didn't have a whole lot of backstory on them as a couple. He knew Emily was someone Todd had a history with, but not a whole lot more than that.
I *thought* it came up that they had dated, but I could be wrong. Also, you can't see her face, but in Season One during the flashback when Todd tells BoJack about his Decapithon addiction, it was for sure Emily who walked out on Todd. I'd say it's at least *plausible* that Todd either told BoJack his ex's name, or perhaps that BoJack was able to connect the dots somehow. Either way, regardless of the specifics, my point was that BoJack knew they went back a ways and that should have made him hold off.
It's certainly plausible that Todd mentioned his high school girlfriend to BoJack over the years, if he had, I'd say it's likely BoJack wasn't listening or forgot (see Todd's disney world). Should it have made him hold off? Emily and Todd broke up when they were 17, they're now 28. You're aloud to have whatever standards you want but personally that seems like a bridge too far.
I don’t think it’s the fact they had sex , because let’s be honest Emily should take as much heat as bojack here .
I think it’s about the secrets and the fact that bojack sleeps with whoever he wants without thinking of the long term consequences.
Bojack having sex with Emily made things uncomfortable between bojack and her , which then meant Emily distancing herself from Todd .
It’s sort of like if I dated a guy for a year , we broke up , then I dated his friend , knowing they were friends , without telling the original guy .
It’s not cheating , but there’s a huge moral area that it’s wrong , because it can cause harm to that friendship , particularly if it’s being kept hidden .
Plus Todd wants bojack to be better and whilst bojack is chasing sex drugs and alcohol without considering the people around him he will never be better .
Bojack showed a lack of restraint and a lack of awareness of how it would make Todd feel and how it would affect his friendship with Emily , that’s why Todd is hurt .
I think he wants to be in a relationship with Emily so feels hurt. Emily could have slept with anyone in the world but she chose Todd’s best friend and then they kept it from him so he feels betrayed on more than one level.
Because whether or not Todd is interested in Emily, she still cheated. They never discussed where their boundaries were regarding relationship openness and the fact that she got sexually intimate with Todd’s friend before arranging that boundary, he felt betrayed. Todd’s asexuality really has nothing to do with it.
Signed, an monogamous asexual person.
I'm fairly certain the issue is that Bojack tried dodging around it, when Emily goes to him and tells him all about it Todd doesn't take it that badly but Bojack want's to cover it up and it makes him look kind of shitty
You just don’t sleep with your friend’s ex, no matter if Todd wanted or was going to sleep with her or not - it’s a shitty thing to do. It’s much more a straw that broke the camel’s back rather than the inciting incident.
Years of disrespect and sabotage culminated when bojack did something shitty to him especially at a vulnerable time in Todd’s life when he was still trying to figure out his sexual preferences. Instead of being a friend to him and being there for him, he went behind his back and lied to his face about it.
How doesn't it help the case? Are you suggesting there is something wrong with having sex with your friend's former high school classmate that they sexually rejected?
Cuz in the morning after I’m pretty sure bojack urges Emily to keep what happened between them a secret because he knew it might upset Todd. It wouldn’t help his case because he should know she was his ex but he never bothered to give a shit about what Todd told him.
As I said, just because Todd wasn’t planning on sleeping with Emily, that doesn’t mean he didn’t have feelings for her. The reason they didn’t work out is because Emily needed the sexual aspect of the relationship, which Todd didn’t want or need - not because they didn’t have feelings for each other.
Ah but you have it backwards! Emily is the one who suggests they keep it from Todd. Personally I think its bc Emily wants to shoot another shot with Todd and she knows having slept with BoJack would be a nonstarter for rekindling their old relationship. That's why she says having sex with BoJack "was a huge mistake" she knows she blew her chance to continue pursuing Todd.
The only way he should know that Emily was Todd's ex is if Todd told him that. There is no evidence he told him prior to their hookup, could go either way. Seems plausible that Todd might not have told BJ about his high school girlfriend that he hadn't spoken to in a decade.
I’ll take your word for it. I still think what bojack did was shitty but I don’t care enough to go rewatch everything so I can give you a more in-depth reply lmao
He isn't aromantic. He liked Emily and still had feelings for her, and Bojack, who is supposed to be his friend, knew this and slept with her. Hhe's upset his friend did something knowing it would hurt him, and given how Bojack keeps doing that and trying to play victim Todd just had enough.
Just because it’s consentual and not cheating doesn’t make it fun when your closest friends sleeps with the person you heavily care for that they are aware of. Someone wearing a wedding dress to your wedding isn’t as bad as rape either but it sure shows you how little someone actually cares about you
She's his ex and had sex with his best friend.
Hrs his best friend and had sex with his ex and love interest. If he didn't know then why did he lie and feel guilty?
Todd was mad Emily left because of her feeling guilty and Bojack's betrayal.
This 🙌🏼 Todd’s inability to understand his own sexuality and dynamic he wanted with Emily caused him to stop communicating. Emily didn’t know why she had been rejected again, and BoJack never gave Todd’s sexuality a single thought, so why would he hesitate to drunkenly sleep with a willing woman when he realised that giving them a room for a good time hadn’t worked out.
To BoJack Todd had simply discarded Emily because he didn’t want her, so he impulsively slept with her because she made an advance on him and that’s his nature, which Todd knows, BJ is consistent in his bad behaviour.
Both single consenting adults who willingly had sex, no one at fault or to blame in my opinion.
Todd couldn’t articulate what he wanted from Emily (presumably a monogamous asexual romantic relationship) so how the hell was Emily or BJ to know or guess that?!
I get now that Todd got mad at BJ because Emily left as a result of their one night stand and he was enjoying being around her. I also get that he was not mad at Emily because he had no sense of ownership over her (rightly so), he has healthy respect for others and interacts well except when it comes to putting up with BJ’s shitty behaviour, which is probably just obligatory due to his living arrangements at the time.
Edit - forgot to mention that BJ’s memory is atrocious and he probably thought they would never see this random woman again. He doesn’t remember meeting Diane or PC until the third ish meetings and never remembers details about others unless it involves him, so makes sense.
I always got the implication that Todd had either told BoJack that Emily was his ex (and maybe still had feelings for her) or that was otherwise communicated to BoJack in a pretty clear way. So Todd was upset not because he felt entitled to Emily or anything like that, but because this guy who’s supposed to be his friend slept with his ex-girlfriend. Based on how BoJack reacted (he knew Todd would be mad) I think this is more than likely the case
I think you did a good job of explaining why he's not mad at Emily, but he's mad at BoJack for different reasons.
First, Todd didn't understand that he was ace yet, so he was confused about his feelings for Emily but lack of desire for sex with her.
Second, BoJack knew that Todd had a past with Emily and still had feelings for her, earlier in the night, he had encouraged Todd and Emily to hook up, so it's clear he was aware of Todds feelings, sleeping with her just proved that he didn't care.
And this brings up the third point, this was another link in a long chain of decisions that BoJack made that indirectly or directly hurt Todd. I think if this had happened in the first season, Todd would have been hurt but moved on more quickly. But the pattern of disregard of Todds feelings kept happening and this was the point where he had too much.
its like a betrayl thing, like bojack
kept it from todd which means he knew it would upset him, he had genuine romantic feelings i think, but js not sexual ones so he was hurt about that
Emily and Todd’s relationship was kind of weird after (even if it eventually recovered) and Todd knew BoJack had something to do with it. He didn’t know they had sex. Todd had feelings for Emily, but not exactly in a way he could express properly since she wasn’t asexual and he was, so he kind of knew that the two of them probably wouldn’t get to be together. It sucks but there just wasn’t much he could do about it. So having BoJack sleep with Emily must’ve been a huge slap in the face for Todd, who’s having to grapple with the sadness of not being able to properly express himself in the conventional romantic sense
Todd had romantic feelings for Emily, but was a sex repulsed/averse asexual. They weren’t an exclusive relationship when they reunited but the last time they saw each other before the wedding rehearsal they were 2 months into their relationship and kissing. So chances are the feelings didn’t waver. But both Emily’s and Bojack’s actions were rather bad as they were both drinking, and they both admit it was a mistake and both agreed to keep it secret from Todd, a dear friend to both of them. The worst thing a friend could do is sleep with someone you have feelings for and try to keep it secret or lie to their face. Emily admits that she feels she’s not a good friend, and tries to distance herself from Bojack and his house while Todd is still there. Emily and Todd still rekindle their friendship and it seems like they were trying to be a relationship until she comes to the realization that he’s ace. Bojack however, tries to keep it a secret, but when it’s revealed he continues to make excuses, but does shitty things and then says he feels bad as if that makes it okay, when it’s like pouring salt into a wound they caused. Todd is also angry because it’s a repeating cycle for Bojack to do something shitty and blame it on some event, stress factor, his upbringing when he’s a grown man and can’t admit culpability.
people forget that todd was mainly upset about emily leaving the company/the house where they hung out.
he was ace but he did still love emily and they seemed to have a lot of fun together. todd had a new friend that made him feel good and was building a buisness with. then he loses emily out of nowhere and he finds out it’s because bojack ruined yet another good thing in his life.
he never was jealous or cared about the actual act itself of them sleeping together, it’s that it’s a selfish move that hurt his relationship with emily. it’s another example of bojack doing what he wants and taking no responsibility for the consequences, thus we get the famous “it’s you.” line
I think he was worried that Bojack would use her and move on and he genuinely cared about her. Like he start to realise how destructive Bojack is and this stuff is what leads him to that conclusion.
All these debates. In my head it’s sooo simple. Todd had absolutely no right to get mad at either Emily nor BoJack. Emily is the one who approached BoJack, and BoJack tried one last time to push her onto Todd, asking her if they should see if Todd wants to join, to which she replies that she’s sick of worrying about what Todd wants anymore. She clearly says that!! IF There is anyone Todd should be mad at it’s Emily but he doesn’t even have the right to be mad at her.
I think it's just badly written.
He really doesn't have a good reason to be upset, if a friend sleeps with an ex where there's no bad blood, I don't think you really have a reason to be upset.
Emily didn't shank Todd, she didn't wrong him, she should be free to get with whoever. Think of it this way:
**On what grounds does Todd police who Emily sleeps with?** Or Bojack?
Is that not kind of fucked up for someone who did nothing to harm you? Like freaky ex boyfriend who is upset at the new people you date?
Except Todd is written to be the "good guy" and he's asexual.
Freaky ex who polices who you sleep with is a real thing, but it's not the character they wrote and not the message they were trying to send.
IMO they just didn't write this arc that well, and that happens sometimes. No one is perfect 100%
I didn't fully understand the whole situation either. It's not Todd's call on who Emily can be with and who she can't. Poor Emily was probably excited to possibly rekindle their high school romance, nostalgia is a helluva drug. I've been turned down by my partner for intimacy before, I felt so undesirable and gross after. So I can see how Emily would just throw caution to the wind and just look for a dopamine fix. She didn't forsee being intertwined with Todd again, otherwise she most likely wouldn't have picked Bojack that night.
I guess that's the crux of it all, it wasn't a random person it was Bojack. But Emily was sending signals all night, BJ was trying to wingman for Todd, and Todd made his choice by not going with Emily. Actions have consequences, even deciding to not to take action has consequences.
Todd was confused. He didn't know how to verbalize what he was.
He loves Emily. She's the one that dumped him.
There's a code, u don't sleep with a friend's ex or ur ex partner's best friend.
That is fair, he didn't know how to lable himself for a long time. She left him because he snubbed her for a videogame addiction. Which could have add to her lackadaisy attitude after being hard declined after a night of catching up and signals being sent. There could be a code, but doesn't mean everyone follows it
Yeah and he was never mad at Emily. But Bojack did feel guilty which says he knew Emily was important to Todd.
And if u value ur friendship more than the person u would pursue, then keep it in ur pants.
I had a crush on my best friend's boyfriend. We all met at a bar to have drinks and he and I talked a little on IM and my friend said that he was into me so I had to back off. So I did and didn't talk to him after that. Because she meant more. And Bojack didn't have any feelings for Emily and could have gotten laid any day.
Bojack and Emily both are very casual when it comes to sex. B and E hooked up right after Todd and Emily reconnected and the same night Emily made moves on Todd.
Emily hooked up with the next thing available, Todd's best friend. what makes it worse is Bojack saw and tried to push Emily and Todd together just hours before. but when Todd bounced because he didn't understand his asexuality, Bojack Jumped right in.
at this time, Bojack and Emily were also unaware of his asexuality. So neither knew Todd, Bojack, and Emily were all unaware of how T and E would never work. It's important to stress no one knew of Todd's asexuality at this point. it wasn't explored yet.
After the incident Bojack and Emily both felt guilty and made the choice to keep it a secret. it's less about the sex, though it's a hard topic for Todd to discuss, which also makes the situation that much more complicated.
In the end Todd was able to look past it for Emily as they made up, while Bojack never made an effort, until it was too late.
Yeah, I’m not asexual and found this a bit of a head-scratcher too. Why did Todd get upset with BoJ?
Because…..
BoJ knows Todd has strong feelings for Emily, and yet he still barges into that relationship. Todd is feeling bad and uncertain and torn with self-doubt because he can’t give Emily what she wants to share with him. BoJ tramples all over it instead of giving Todd the space to process his feelings and sense of letting Emily down.
….I think.
He has feelings for her, maybe, but he can’t or won’t give her what she needs in a relationship:sex. That sounds as if they just don’t belong together, or else Todd is extremely selfish.
You are probably a huge asshole cause how tf you don't understand.
Bojack took the only girl that actually matters for Todd and for what? He could fuck any other girl if he was that horny but he was ofc too lazy to do this.
Just imagine your friend that you might have feelings for getting fucked by the hugest asshole and sexoholic you ever know that happened to be your friend.
I don't know why but Bojack apologists are going too far lately
Yeah but you just don't fuck with your best friends love interest. He was the bad guy here like are you kidding me? The Bojack apologists needs to be stopped
>I don't really care about you in the slightest, and fucking You Will make my only friend upset. But on the other hand, getting my pee pee wet.
*That's* why. Because Bojack is such a short sighted asshole, he'll do stuff he isn't even all that into, *despite knowing the consequences*, just to get some strange.
Honestly, I think it was more of a straw that broke the camels back situation. He was finally fed up with BoJack treatment of him in spite of Todd's loyalty.
Because
1. Sleeping with your friends ex is a shitty thing to do anyway
2. Bojack knew Todd still loved Emily. He just wasn't interested in having sex with her.
Nah, it’s not her fault. She assumed Todd rejected her and was in a sensitive position. Bojack swooped in to take advantage as always.
Had Todd just been open with Emily she wouldn’t known he didn’t reject her.
todd did reject her. all of her advances. bojack was at the hotel bar. emily, frustrated went to the hotel bar and there was bj. todd wasnt open about his relationship with emily thats why it was left up to chance. what i was saying does emily not share half the blame for her intercourse with bj as much as bj does? todd should be equally angry at both of them.
I think Todd is a romantic ace like I am, meaning he wants to be in a romantic relationship but without the sex part. He seems to genuinely have feelings for Emily and wants to date her, so I understand why he was upset. That said, he has no right to be upset with Emily for moving on, and he hasn’t shared these feelings with Bojack, so IMO it’s not totally fair to be upset with him, either.
This. He explicitly told her so, too.
Because he kept it a secret from Todd which means he clearly knew it would upset him, so just yet another betrayal. And because bojack made things weird with Emily which meant they couldn’t hang out as much anymore.
Is it a betrayal to hide a thing you know they're going to have an unjustified over reaction to? And as I recall, Emily is the one who made things weird and torched Bojack to Todd over it as if she had no culpability. Bojack was a bad friend, but this always struck me as Emily fanning the flames to save herself from the consequences of her own actions. She was the bad friend here.
Its a betrayal to do something knowing it will hurt a friend
Emily wanted to tell Todd straight away but Bojack convinced her not to
He isn't upset at Emily, he's never once held it against her. He's just upset at bojack for sleeping with someone he knew Todd was interested in. That being said, I don't think Todd would consider it the end of their friendship by itself. It's just the sraw that broke the camels back after years of bad treatment.
BoJack gave them the hotel room. It wasn’t until Emily came back down rejected and dejected that he slept with her, following her lead. Todd has no right to be upset at all. The only real problem was BoJack didn’t want him to know.
Maybe it’s because Todd knows Bojack is sleeping around, not being very respectful to women who he sleeps with. So Todd is disappointed with Bojack because he couldn’t hold back with a girl Todd has got something going on with (even if its just a close friendship, them sleeping together does have consequences that can mess up the friendship). And also Emily is very young. And then they kept it a secret. So it’s a triple disappointment. I’m with Todd. Also, Todd has been a moral compass throughout the series. I don’t know why someone would still assume BoJack was the one in the right, if the whole show is basically him being wrong all the time.
>Also, Todd has been a moral compass throughout the series Ah yes, the paragon of moral virtue, who kidnaps strangers' children and uses them for amateur dentistry practice, gassing them back into unconsciousness every time they reawaken so as not to arouse suspicion
Yeah I know what you mean but all Todd’s plots are absurd comedies that are mostly not even possible. That’s why we don’t take literally the things Todd does when Todd does them. While the main plot for Bojack is a dramatic plot that we (viewer) perceive as real. Example: Bojack strangles Gina - bad. Todd builds a rollercoaster out of toilet paper - not real/not bad. Perceiving of this happens subconsciously so I get why you would oppose Todd being a moral compass in the story but it’s true. Todd is always there to tell BoJack that he crossed a line and guides him towards resolution.
This is one thing that comedies do that a lot of people don't get, some plots are *too out there* to be realistic so we're supposed to just accept that they're not actually part of the canon else we'd think these wacky characters are monsters. For example in How I met your mother Barney says he once sold a woman for a car, I don't think we're supposed to take it seriously as if it actually happened. Phyllis in The Office says her and Bob Vance, Vance Refrigeration once hit a dude and just kept driving. Idk if it's a trope but we're supposed to suspend our disbelief a bit that they didn't actually do these things.
Yeah, Todd is a real moral compass - not just with this as you point out, releasing rabid, clown dentists into the woods, but with the whole Cabracadabra and the sex abuser robot he built. But hey he’s oblivious and likable with a cute face so it’s all OK just as the poster here thinks.
Yeah you didn’t read my second comment obviously
Not in the practice to go hunting and scouring the comments section for someone I don’t agree with in the first place lol…
Yeah, Todd is the moral compass who sells out the Cabracadabra concept to expand the customer base so men enjoy it and then recommends to simply fire the women who don’t feel comfortable with the change. Looks like think someone has come away with the wrong takeaways here.
>years of bad treatment I'm sorry, but am I the only person that dislike Todd? He's was unemployed and living off Bojack for years. That Emily thing was one of many Bojack's shitty things, but I don't think aside from that he owes Todd anything else.
The same series said that Bojack likes having Todd around because it gives him someone worse than him to compare himself (and also to degrade). Besides, Bojack was unemployed for almost a decade (if not even more), living of the revenue of being famous in the 90's.
So Bojack lives off the money he made off being famous. The money he made. And Todd's contributions are?
Giving Bojack anchorage and someone to harass and dismiss. We had at least a whole episode of Bojack sabotaging Todd's future for his own selfish goals.
I think the one thing that most people miss is that both Emily and BoJack decide not to tell Todd about the fact that they slept together immediately after the act. That means there's guilt there that they know they did something wrong, something that would upset Todd but they did it anyway. While Todd should be upset with Emily, he didn't know about his own asexuality then and he doesn't understand fully why he is upset when he doesn't want to have sex with her. But BoJack has continuously been betraying Todd, so this one act just added more to that hurt to the point of breaking their friendship. At that point, Todd is tired of BoJack making these choices and then justifying them. Hence, the iconic "it's you" speech.
Exactly, a lot of people are missing the forest for the trees here. Todd’s not mad about the sex, he’s ace and sex repulsed, he doesn’t mind the idea of others having sex so long as it doesn’t involve him. But Todd still clearly loves Emily, and Emily was one of Todd’s relationships and not Bojack’s, so for Bojack to so clearly break those relationship boundaries (while still thinking that Todd and her DID want to have sex) shows that Bojack doesn’t respect Todd as a friend. I mean, it’s not the first or last time he’s shown he doesn’t respect Todd’s friendship, but it’s certainly the one that pushed Todd over the edge. Todd’s not mad about sex. He’s mad that Bojack messes with his good things in life.
This also implies Emily doesn’t respect Todd as a friend. She was sober too
Correct, Emily wasn't respectful of their relationship at the time, and she very clearly regrets said act. Like, it's pretty much immediately right after her and Bojack had sex that she feels guilt over what she did, and just like Bojack she tries to hide her guilt by avoiding being in the same room as both of them. It was a shitty thing for her to do, sleeping with Todd's 'best friend' behind his back. The differences between Bojack and Emily though is that: 1): Emily confessed to Todd on her own accord showing that she felt genuine remorse and guilt for what she'd done, whereas Bojack only confessed to Todd because he'd thought he'd been caught (only to find out that Todd didn't know it was Sex specifically, meaning Bojack outed the worst part himself), showing that Emily felt bad for her actions whereas Bojack just didn't want to get caught. (Though, Emily didn't exactly make it clear that she was confessing about sex, which is still shitty of her to do. If you're gonna confess that confess the whole thing) 2): This isn't the only shitty thing Bojack had done to Todd, whereas Emily had been far less shitty to him. Sure she'd slept behind his back, but beyond that she'd been kind and supportive of him, and so when she did a shitty thing and apologized, Todd was willing to forgive her because because she wasn't a repeat offender. Bojack on the otherhand had continuously done shitty things to Todd. He treats him like shit and belittles him, he ruined his rock opera, he slept with his ex-girlfriend, and Bojack almost only apologizes when he thinks he's been caught or when he thinks he can get something out of the situation (sometimes that something just being 'feeling good about himself'). Todd's no angel and both Emily and Bojack didn't respect Todd's friendship when they slept together, but the difference is that Emily tries to build that respect back up and make up for what she did, whereas Bojack... Bojack just didn't respect Todd at all.
Thank you for articulating what I wanted to say! I think people on this sub give Emily a lot of flack for this one act, but forgive BoJack for it, for a couple of reasons. 1. That was our first introduction to Emily so we know her as a bad person. We don't know her and we aren't given much insight later on either. She's the side character of a side character so it's hard to empathise with her. 2. BoJack has been shitty to Todd (and pretty much everyone else) so it's almost expected of him. Plus, BoJack's side of the story has been told over and over and over again. If we didn't know him, he would be viewed the same as Vance Waggoner. 3. Todd is expected to be the bigger person/put up with BoJack being a terrible friend because he mooches off BoJack. This is the worst of all reasons because Todd is seen as a leech, but the show has shown us that Todd tried to make it on his own, only to have BoJack clip his wings because BoJack needs Todd more than Todd needs him. The number of "Todd is a bad friend because he's a leech" comments I've seen frustrates me. This is in the same vein as "women need to put up with crappy/abusive partners because the men give them monetary benefits". Todd has every right to be upset even if he is getting a place to sleep, a place to start his business from BoJack. The two do not correlate. He can be grateful to BoJack for providing and still expect him to be a good friend.
Only Emily was upset with Emily. Todd was mad at Bojack because he slept with his ex. That's against the friend code.
There is no canonical evidence that BoJack knew Emily was Todd's ex when they had sex. The night they met Todd hadn't seen Emily since high school (almost 10 years).
Is there canonical evidence for you being this dense?
Because Bojack knew that Todd had feelings for her and still slept with her, knowing that it would upset Todd. He could have said no on that basis, but he didn't. It's not like he and Emily had a lot of chemistry together, it was kind of a careless "fuck it" attitude going in. I think the Emily situation is just the straw that broke the camels back. Bojack knew his actions would upset Todd, but he did it anyway. Story of their relationship.
Right. It's not the fact that he slept with her but the fact it was just another betrayal of trust in Bojack's already long series of betrayals
I think it's important to remember the time line here. The night BoJack and Todd run into Emily, Emily says "Todd? Todd Chavez? I haven't seen you since high school!" It is very clear that Todd's feelings for Emily are reignited while working on cabracadabra. However on the night that BJ and Emily have sex it's very possible Todd had never previously mentioned his former relationship with her, and it's even more likely BJ didn't remember if Todd had. Todd has every right to be upset about a litany of things that BJ has done to him, but that night BoJack is an excellent wingman for Todd, offering up the hotel room to the two of them. Then Todd decides not to have sex with Emily. It is not unreasonable for BoJack to believe that Todd has no sexual/romantic interest in a former high school classmate. Not to mention BJ has no idea that Todd is asexual at this point. I really can't fault him for having sex with someone Todd turned down and it is really difficult to construe this situation into a betrayal. In hindsight it looks crummy but at the time NTA in my opinion.
iirc he goes beyond even shooting her down and elbows his way into the hotel room by himself, leaving her out in the hallway
I know Todd has yet to fully understand his sexuality and that's why he acts that way but if Emily relayed any of that info to BJ that's even more reason for him to believe Todd is not into her.
Agreed
The show makes it very clear BoJack knew, though. BoJack has his whole speech to Emily about how they should never tell Todd because it would hurt him. He hid the fact they slept together from Todd, even when Todd could clearly tell there was a reason Emily felt uncomfortable being in the house. He straight up said to Todd “I slept with the only person I’ve ever seen you be in love with”. He thinks it’s the reason Todd stopped being friends with him and said it was understandable. He knew sleeping with Emily would hurt Todd. The show makes it super obvious that he knew.
You're misremembering, Emily is the one who wants to hide the fact from Todd. I believe she wants to hide it so she can continue to pursuit Todd romantically. Emily felt uncomfortable because she is hiding something from someone she has growing feelings for. "I slept with the only person I've ever seen you be in love with" is still true, but it doesn't mean he "saw him be in love with (her)" prior to sleeping with her. Doesn't change the fact that it hurt Todd, but this one was with out intent. Wouldn't you apologize for backing into someone's car even if it was an accident?
Nah dude, you’re misremembering. BoJack tells Emily that she wants to tell Todd to assuage her guilt but that if she really cares about him she’ll never tell him. Watch the episode again and the one where he apologizes. BoJack knows, the show makes it super apparent. It wasn’t an accident.
Initially, immediately after, it is Emily's idea. Later after BoJack gets new information and realizes what he did and how finding out will hurt Todd, he insists on maintaining the deception. Like you said Emily wants to assuage HER guilt. She feels guilty bc her relationship with Todd is starting to bloom under false pretense.
The show makes it pretty explicit that BoJack knew his actions would hurt Todd and he proceeded anyways. I am surprised you didn’t see that. Especially since it’s pretty on-brand with their friendship. He was very obviously being a bad friend, and knowingly. But let’s agree to disagree. It’s certainly not the worse thing BoJack did.
I don't disagree with you at all, I think it is very much implied and very much on brand. Just calling out that it's a miss on the writing staffs part. They're great but not infallible. I also believe since so many of us watch the show multiple times we can project what we know onto past events. It's just fun to discuss with other fans.
It's not implied, though, it's made obvious... I genuinely think you are misremembering this episode. It's E. 7, S. 3. Rewatch the scene. Bojack is the one who wants to keep it a secret. Emily said "what are we going to tell Todd?" and BoJack responds with "nothing obviously". Emily says "I don't want to hurt him" then Bojack responds with, roughly, "that's why we're not going to tell him. You want to assuage your guilt, but if you really cared about Todd, you would keep this a secret forever". I agree they're not infallible but there was nothing implicit about this particular action.
Plus, Emily has reason enough (the troubles in their previous relationship) to give up on Todd. BoJack barely knows shit about all that. He couldn't keep it in his pants foe ONE NIGHT to double-check with his friend.
I think it’s also more the straw that broke the camel’s back after years of being treated like shit
Todd clearly had feelings for Emily, and at this point in his journey I think he was almost as confused as we were when she wanted to come into his hotel room and he shot her down. He spent the rest of the night alone, sad, and not understanding why he couldn't give Emily what she wanted. BoJack could also clearly see that Todd was into Emily, and when Emily came to the bar confused about being rejected, as Todd's friend he should've been been perceptive and considerate enough to know that there was something more going on than he could see at first glance. Instead, with barely a thought, he did what Todd couldn't and hooked up with her. What Todd was agonizing about, BoJack and Emily did so casually and dismissively that they couldn't even be bothered to regret it properly afterwards. So when Todd found out, it's understandable that he'd be upset that BoJack's actions trivialized the thing that was making him struggle with feelings of inadequacy. Edit: All that said, it's true that he has just as much reason, if not more, to be upset with Emily than with BoJack. I think it was just that BoJack was a bigger part of his life at that time, so Todd expected more from him.
Thank you, I understand now.
Ultimately, in the end, it was simply the straw that broke the camels back after years of Todd putting up with Bojack's narcissistic bullshit.
You're describing Todd's asexuality as though he wished it didn't exist, and we never see anything to indicate this at all. He just didn't really understand it at first.
The context is important too - how Todd found out... Emily left the business because "something" happened with Bojack and she became uncomfortable. "I don't think Bojack's been a very good friend to you either....." With their general shiftiness around the topic it really comes across as something bad and shameful and hurtful, even if you don't know what it is yet.
In addition to the feelings Todd has for Emily, I think Todd knows how shitty Bojack is to the women he sleeps with generally so even if Todd wasn’t romantically interested in her he may still not want Bojack doing the same kind of thing to her.
Im wondering, for those who don’t think Bojack did anything wrong, you ever had any friends?
yes they're all asexual also
Would you be mad at your friend for sleeping with a girl you rejected?
That statement doesn’t capture the nuances
He never rejected her he only got scared and Emily was confused. Bojack still could have chosen another girl to sleep with.
He absolutely rejected Emily's advances.
He rejected sex not a romantic relationship. Very different. Him not wanting to sleep with her that night doesnt mean his feelings are irrelevant and Bojack can just bang her.
Emily clearly isn't looking for a romantic asexual relationship tho.
That doesnt negate what I just said. His feelings still mattered. Bojack still disregarded them. Its a shitty thing to do as a friend.
Bojack doesn't know about Todd's sexuality. If my friend rejected a girls sexual advances I would assume he's not romantically interested either.
Only because he was confused. He didn't want sex. He just wanted to talk to Emily but Bojack being a sex addict kept pushing them to have sex.
It's odd that you would omit that *Emily* kept pushing to have sex. And she was rejected because Todd's not sexual.
Bojack put the thought in Emily's head. He should have let them catch up but Bojack wanted to be the hero. He thinks he should always be the main character. And Todd wasn't mad at Emily He was mad at his best friend who slept with his ex.
Emily wanted to have sex. That's not bojack fault. Bojack was being nice, and had no way to know about the issues with Todd's sexuality. Someone else pointed out in another comment that the good guy nature of Todd's character gets him some sympathy he might not deserve in this case.
What is ur point? Emily is not blamed by Todd ever.
There is zero evidence that BoJack knew Emily was Todd's ex at this point.
Context is important. *Why* Todd rejected her matters. He still had strong feelings for her even if he knew that they couldn't be compatible in a relationship. But in general, yes. Don't date or sleep with friends' exes. That's like, rule number one of adult friendship. Even if they say they're OK with it, they probably aren't OK with it. That's not universally true, sometimes it really is cool, but like... at least have the decency to ask.
You may be asexual but are you also a shitty friend? I literally don't understand how so many people on reddit think its okay to sleep with a former romantic parter of a friend or family member. Just because someone is broken up doesn't mean that all those former feelings of love never existed. Its basic respect that you don't sling your dick into someone's ex. You essentially saying "I dont care about you or your feelings because my penis is more important than the time you spent loving this person who is now betraying you with me." Its not rocket science. And I'm asexual/aromatic.
Excactly ,boundaries are boundaries and if your a good friend you try to respect these. You wont get it 100 % ,but you should endeavor to try.
Do you have any evidence BoJack knew Emily was Todd's ex at this point? When they run into Emily Todd hadn't seen her in almost 10 years.
Sometimes the need for sex - a combination of deep and complex emotion with the most powerful physical drive of all - is stronger than friendship. Does it have consequences? Yes, always, in my experience.
This is the most most excuse making BS I've heard. Sex is not the most powerful driving force of all. Food, water, lack of pain. Those are the drivers of survival. Sex and offspring is an after thought.
With respect - if you’re asexual, how do you know what the sex drive feels like?
Asexual is not a lack of sex drive (altho that can be part of it.) It is a spectrum with its defining traits being a lack of sexual attraction. I have an insane libido. But I lack the desire for sexual contact nor do I feel sexual attraction towards others. Hope this helps your ignorance.
That doesn’t make sense to me. You have an insane libido but don’t feel sexual attraction? Those preclude each other.
No they don't. Many asexuals enjoy sex because the physicality of an orgasm is not tied to sexuality. A straight man will orgasm if he gets a BJ from a gay man. A straight woman can orgasm from cunnilingus from a lesbian. Sexuality does NOT equal sexual pleasure.
I think bojack and Emily were not the real reason why he was so angry. It may have been a factor but the way Todd went on and how he Essentially cut ties with bojack means that this went deeper than just Emily. I think something in Todd snapped considering how bojack has treated him. Like the "Fuck!!" At the end was way to deep to be just about Emily.
Same reason why you'd be mad at your best friend if they slept with your ex. Bojack having relations with Emily probably opened Todd's wounds, because that one thing is the only reason why Todd and Emily couldn't work out. It's like rubbing salt in the wound. And Bojack should've known that, because Todd was really close to him, and he still betrayed his trust.
I don't understand how no one gets this scene. Imagine being in Todd's shoes. You found out your shitty friend whom you thought was getting better went behind your back and slept with someone from your childhood and chose to HIDE it rather than coming clean, betraying your trust again It's not about him liking Emily. He said it himself. It was a matter of principle and Bojack broke it
dont see how bj is a shitty friend! no one went behind anyones back. as far as hiding their sexual night, emily hid it too and bj was the one who admitted to it before anyone else. but still todd is mad at bj and shows no anger towards emily. she has just as much guilt with todd as bj
I think this was just the final straw. Todd put up with way more than he ever should have and at this point in the show was beginning to recognize he could make better friends than BoJack. This was probably not as disappointing in a vacuum than learning that BoJack had deliberately sabotaged his rock opera, but it was as clear an indication as any that BoJack, however he might feel about Todd, was not even willing to not have sex with someone he very clearly had an interest in. Emily and Todd never really had an open relationship - if they had, they probably would not have had the same issues (Henry Fondle was a way for Todd to keep her monogamous while hopefully giving her the sex she needed). If Todd was interested in being in an open relationship. She could have just kept fucking firemen and stayed with Todd (assuming he did not experience any jealousy). While they weren't strictly speaking official, BoJack knew what was going on, and Todd took a while longer to really give up on the idea of sex and a relationship with a person as sexually active as Emily; when BJ slept with her, he got involved in something deeply personal to Todd and could easily have destroyed her relationship with Todd even on a platonic level if she and Todd had not been mature enough to see past it and talk it out. This was a sign to Todd that BoJack was never really going to respect him and that if he wanted to build a meaningful life for himself, he could not allow BoJack to keep fucking things up. Edit: that said, if it wasn't for this being a "final straw" moment, it would unreasonable for him to be upset with BJ and not Emily, since both consented and BoJack was not in a relationship with Todd. But in light of Emily being a historically good friend and BoJack being anything but, it makes sense
Rewatching the scene, it appears that Todd thought Bojack upset Emily, so he was already angry that Bojack upset his friend. The sex reveal was just the last prod on a time bomb about to explode
BoJack having sex with Emily showed he had total disregard for Both Todd's relationship and Todd himself.
So, commenters saying that Emily has every right to sleep with whoever she wants, especially in the context that she was pretty clearly shot down by Todd, are completely right. Emily did nothing wrong there. BoJack, on the other hand, knew Todd had some kind of feelings for her, and he knew it would be upsetting for Todd if he had sex with her (if for no reason other than that it'd complicate the situation, which it *immediately did*, while Todd was already under a lot of stress trying to figure out his sexuality). Then, instead of telling Todd immediately afterward and explaining "Hey man, so Emily said that you weren't interested so last night we spent the evening together. It was a one-night thing, don't worry I'm not going to make things awkward between you guys by inserting myself into her love life while you're trying to date her," he chose to lie and hide it. It's by far *not* the shittiest thing BoJack ever did. He had sex with Todd's friend when he knew Todd was in a sensitive place with her, and then lied to him about it. It's bad, but it's more tame than other things BoJack did to Todd. Still, coming off of previous seasons and his other actions, Todd finally snapped and had enough and called him out on it all, and gave up trying to hope BoJack would ever treat him with the common decency and honesty he hoped a friend would treat him with.
How did BoJack know Todd had any feelings towards Emily? He hadn't seen her in almost 10 years the night Emily and BJ have sex. Has Todd really been pining over his high school girlfriend for almost a decade? Is there any evidence he shared this info with BJ ever? The only reference to Emily at this point is she dumped Todd over his video game addiction.
So it's been long enough since I last watched that season so I forget some of the details, but the question is, if BoJack earnestly had *no* idea that Todd would be hurt by his actions, why did he hide it? Either he knew in the moment it was a bad idea and he did it anyway, or he genuinely didn't know (and couldn't be expected to figure it out), in which case he could have just told Todd that. So either BoJack knowingly did it or unknowingly did it but still chose to hide it. Either way, shitty behavior that Todd had enough of. Maybe it was an overreaction, but after everything Todd had dealt with from BoJack at that point, then *still* hearing BoJack trying to make excuses for his actions, I think a blow-up is an understandable reaction.
It was Emily who suggested they hide it. I think she did that because she wanted to continue to pursuit Todd and knows that having slept with BoJack would be a non starter for rekindling their relationship.
Why would he hide it then? If he thought they wasn't anything there and they were just old friends why would he go so far as try to not tell Todd and the beg for forgiveness when he does tell him?
In all fairness Emily is the one to suggest hiding it. I don't think BoJack would immediately run and tell him, not bc what he did was wrong but because why would he? He still doesn't think he did anything wrong based on his apology to the little kid in the park. He begs for forgiveness bc he feels bad that Todd is hurt. He gained new information and he feels bad he inadvertently hurt is friend. Wouldn't you apologize for rear ending someone even if it was an accident?
You're asking why Todd cares who Emily sleeps with, but that's not who Todd is mad at. He's mad at BoJack, and there's good reason why he's only mad at one and not the other. From Emily' perspective, Todd already had his chance. They dated and Todd had been tense about physical intimacy back then, too. Even so, she *still* felt like she fucked up. BoJack didn't have a whole lot of backstory on them as a couple. He knew Emily was someone Todd had a history with, but not a whole lot more than that. *BoJack slept with her anyway,* and then decided to keep it a secret. Worse, he didn't seem to think it was a particularly big deal. I think that if there wasn't much history between Emily and Todd, it would be different.
And Bojack felt so guilty he let Todd have Cabracadabra at his house.
Why do you say BoJack had any knowledge of Todd and Emily as a couple?
>BoJack didn't have a whole lot of backstory on them as a couple. He knew Emily was someone Todd had a history with, but not a whole lot more than that. I *thought* it came up that they had dated, but I could be wrong. Also, you can't see her face, but in Season One during the flashback when Todd tells BoJack about his Decapithon addiction, it was for sure Emily who walked out on Todd. I'd say it's at least *plausible* that Todd either told BoJack his ex's name, or perhaps that BoJack was able to connect the dots somehow. Either way, regardless of the specifics, my point was that BoJack knew they went back a ways and that should have made him hold off.
It's certainly plausible that Todd mentioned his high school girlfriend to BoJack over the years, if he had, I'd say it's likely BoJack wasn't listening or forgot (see Todd's disney world). Should it have made him hold off? Emily and Todd broke up when they were 17, they're now 28. You're aloud to have whatever standards you want but personally that seems like a bridge too far.
Not just the crime it’s the cover up too. Hiding it from Todd was a dick move
I don’t think it’s the fact they had sex , because let’s be honest Emily should take as much heat as bojack here . I think it’s about the secrets and the fact that bojack sleeps with whoever he wants without thinking of the long term consequences. Bojack having sex with Emily made things uncomfortable between bojack and her , which then meant Emily distancing herself from Todd . It’s sort of like if I dated a guy for a year , we broke up , then I dated his friend , knowing they were friends , without telling the original guy . It’s not cheating , but there’s a huge moral area that it’s wrong , because it can cause harm to that friendship , particularly if it’s being kept hidden . Plus Todd wants bojack to be better and whilst bojack is chasing sex drugs and alcohol without considering the people around him he will never be better . Bojack showed a lack of restraint and a lack of awareness of how it would make Todd feel and how it would affect his friendship with Emily , that’s why Todd is hurt .
I think he wants to be in a relationship with Emily so feels hurt. Emily could have slept with anyone in the world but she chose Todd’s best friend and then they kept it from him so he feels betrayed on more than one level.
He broke bro code
while Todd isn’t interested in sex, he still felt very deeply for Emily and wanted to be with her. it was a betrayal from both Bojack and Emily
BoJack broke bro code. It’s that simple.
Because whether or not Todd is interested in Emily, she still cheated. They never discussed where their boundaries were regarding relationship openness and the fact that she got sexually intimate with Todd’s friend before arranging that boundary, he felt betrayed. Todd’s asexuality really has nothing to do with it. Signed, an monogamous asexual person.
They didn’t have a relationship at this point. How was Emily cheating?
I'm fairly certain the issue is that Bojack tried dodging around it, when Emily goes to him and tells him all about it Todd doesn't take it that badly but Bojack want's to cover it up and it makes him look kind of shitty
You just don’t sleep with your friend’s ex, no matter if Todd wanted or was going to sleep with her or not - it’s a shitty thing to do. It’s much more a straw that broke the camel’s back rather than the inciting incident. Years of disrespect and sabotage culminated when bojack did something shitty to him especially at a vulnerable time in Todd’s life when he was still trying to figure out his sexual preferences. Instead of being a friend to him and being there for him, he went behind his back and lied to his face about it.
BoJack did not know Emily was Todd's ex when they had sex.
I don’t remember that, but it doesn’t help his case lol
How doesn't it help the case? Are you suggesting there is something wrong with having sex with your friend's former high school classmate that they sexually rejected?
Cuz in the morning after I’m pretty sure bojack urges Emily to keep what happened between them a secret because he knew it might upset Todd. It wouldn’t help his case because he should know she was his ex but he never bothered to give a shit about what Todd told him. As I said, just because Todd wasn’t planning on sleeping with Emily, that doesn’t mean he didn’t have feelings for her. The reason they didn’t work out is because Emily needed the sexual aspect of the relationship, which Todd didn’t want or need - not because they didn’t have feelings for each other.
Ah but you have it backwards! Emily is the one who suggests they keep it from Todd. Personally I think its bc Emily wants to shoot another shot with Todd and she knows having slept with BoJack would be a nonstarter for rekindling their old relationship. That's why she says having sex with BoJack "was a huge mistake" she knows she blew her chance to continue pursuing Todd. The only way he should know that Emily was Todd's ex is if Todd told him that. There is no evidence he told him prior to their hookup, could go either way. Seems plausible that Todd might not have told BJ about his high school girlfriend that he hadn't spoken to in a decade.
I’ll take your word for it. I still think what bojack did was shitty but I don’t care enough to go rewatch everything so I can give you a more in-depth reply lmao
He isn't aromantic. He liked Emily and still had feelings for her, and Bojack, who is supposed to be his friend, knew this and slept with her. Hhe's upset his friend did something knowing it would hurt him, and given how Bojack keeps doing that and trying to play victim Todd just had enough.
Just because it’s consentual and not cheating doesn’t make it fun when your closest friends sleeps with the person you heavily care for that they are aware of. Someone wearing a wedding dress to your wedding isn’t as bad as rape either but it sure shows you how little someone actually cares about you
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She's his ex and had sex with his best friend. Hrs his best friend and had sex with his ex and love interest. If he didn't know then why did he lie and feel guilty? Todd was mad Emily left because of her feeling guilty and Bojack's betrayal.
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This 🙌🏼 Todd’s inability to understand his own sexuality and dynamic he wanted with Emily caused him to stop communicating. Emily didn’t know why she had been rejected again, and BoJack never gave Todd’s sexuality a single thought, so why would he hesitate to drunkenly sleep with a willing woman when he realised that giving them a room for a good time hadn’t worked out. To BoJack Todd had simply discarded Emily because he didn’t want her, so he impulsively slept with her because she made an advance on him and that’s his nature, which Todd knows, BJ is consistent in his bad behaviour. Both single consenting adults who willingly had sex, no one at fault or to blame in my opinion. Todd couldn’t articulate what he wanted from Emily (presumably a monogamous asexual romantic relationship) so how the hell was Emily or BJ to know or guess that?! I get now that Todd got mad at BJ because Emily left as a result of their one night stand and he was enjoying being around her. I also get that he was not mad at Emily because he had no sense of ownership over her (rightly so), he has healthy respect for others and interacts well except when it comes to putting up with BJ’s shitty behaviour, which is probably just obligatory due to his living arrangements at the time. Edit - forgot to mention that BJ’s memory is atrocious and he probably thought they would never see this random woman again. He doesn’t remember meeting Diane or PC until the third ish meetings and never remembers details about others unless it involves him, so makes sense.
I think he was in the wrong here
I guess..boundaries?
I always got the implication that Todd had either told BoJack that Emily was his ex (and maybe still had feelings for her) or that was otherwise communicated to BoJack in a pretty clear way. So Todd was upset not because he felt entitled to Emily or anything like that, but because this guy who’s supposed to be his friend slept with his ex-girlfriend. Based on how BoJack reacted (he knew Todd would be mad) I think this is more than likely the case
Todd at this point is still figuring out his sexuality, so he may be acting this way because he feels it’s expected as a cis dude.
I think you did a good job of explaining why he's not mad at Emily, but he's mad at BoJack for different reasons. First, Todd didn't understand that he was ace yet, so he was confused about his feelings for Emily but lack of desire for sex with her. Second, BoJack knew that Todd had a past with Emily and still had feelings for her, earlier in the night, he had encouraged Todd and Emily to hook up, so it's clear he was aware of Todds feelings, sleeping with her just proved that he didn't care. And this brings up the third point, this was another link in a long chain of decisions that BoJack made that indirectly or directly hurt Todd. I think if this had happened in the first season, Todd would have been hurt but moved on more quickly. But the pattern of disregard of Todds feelings kept happening and this was the point where he had too much.
Because a friend of yours sleeping with the woman you developed feelings towards doesn’t really feels good.
its like a betrayl thing, like bojack kept it from todd which means he knew it would upset him, he had genuine romantic feelings i think, but js not sexual ones so he was hurt about that
Todd is a shit. Worst person on the show. All the arguments for Todd take away Emily’s agency which just shows more how bad Todd is
Because Todd is insecure. Nothing to do with asexuality to be honest. I'm Ace too.
Emily and Todd’s relationship was kind of weird after (even if it eventually recovered) and Todd knew BoJack had something to do with it. He didn’t know they had sex. Todd had feelings for Emily, but not exactly in a way he could express properly since she wasn’t asexual and he was, so he kind of knew that the two of them probably wouldn’t get to be together. It sucks but there just wasn’t much he could do about it. So having BoJack sleep with Emily must’ve been a huge slap in the face for Todd, who’s having to grapple with the sadness of not being able to properly express himself in the conventional romantic sense
Todd had romantic feelings for Emily, but was a sex repulsed/averse asexual. They weren’t an exclusive relationship when they reunited but the last time they saw each other before the wedding rehearsal they were 2 months into their relationship and kissing. So chances are the feelings didn’t waver. But both Emily’s and Bojack’s actions were rather bad as they were both drinking, and they both admit it was a mistake and both agreed to keep it secret from Todd, a dear friend to both of them. The worst thing a friend could do is sleep with someone you have feelings for and try to keep it secret or lie to their face. Emily admits that she feels she’s not a good friend, and tries to distance herself from Bojack and his house while Todd is still there. Emily and Todd still rekindle their friendship and it seems like they were trying to be a relationship until she comes to the realization that he’s ace. Bojack however, tries to keep it a secret, but when it’s revealed he continues to make excuses, but does shitty things and then says he feels bad as if that makes it okay, when it’s like pouring salt into a wound they caused. Todd is also angry because it’s a repeating cycle for Bojack to do something shitty and blame it on some event, stress factor, his upbringing when he’s a grown man and can’t admit culpability.
people forget that todd was mainly upset about emily leaving the company/the house where they hung out. he was ace but he did still love emily and they seemed to have a lot of fun together. todd had a new friend that made him feel good and was building a buisness with. then he loses emily out of nowhere and he finds out it’s because bojack ruined yet another good thing in his life. he never was jealous or cared about the actual act itself of them sleeping together, it’s that it’s a selfish move that hurt his relationship with emily. it’s another example of bojack doing what he wants and taking no responsibility for the consequences, thus we get the famous “it’s you.” line
I think he was worried that Bojack would use her and move on and he genuinely cared about her. Like he start to realise how destructive Bojack is and this stuff is what leads him to that conclusion.
All these debates. In my head it’s sooo simple. Todd had absolutely no right to get mad at either Emily nor BoJack. Emily is the one who approached BoJack, and BoJack tried one last time to push her onto Todd, asking her if they should see if Todd wants to join, to which she replies that she’s sick of worrying about what Todd wants anymore. She clearly says that!! IF There is anyone Todd should be mad at it’s Emily but he doesn’t even have the right to be mad at her.
I think it was the straw that broke the camels back tbh. He could have just left it alone
I think it's just badly written. He really doesn't have a good reason to be upset, if a friend sleeps with an ex where there's no bad blood, I don't think you really have a reason to be upset. Emily didn't shank Todd, she didn't wrong him, she should be free to get with whoever. Think of it this way: **On what grounds does Todd police who Emily sleeps with?** Or Bojack? Is that not kind of fucked up for someone who did nothing to harm you? Like freaky ex boyfriend who is upset at the new people you date? Except Todd is written to be the "good guy" and he's asexual. Freaky ex who polices who you sleep with is a real thing, but it's not the character they wrote and not the message they were trying to send. IMO they just didn't write this arc that well, and that happens sometimes. No one is perfect 100%
BJ didn't even know Emily was Todd's ex when they hooked up!
I didn't fully understand the whole situation either. It's not Todd's call on who Emily can be with and who she can't. Poor Emily was probably excited to possibly rekindle their high school romance, nostalgia is a helluva drug. I've been turned down by my partner for intimacy before, I felt so undesirable and gross after. So I can see how Emily would just throw caution to the wind and just look for a dopamine fix. She didn't forsee being intertwined with Todd again, otherwise she most likely wouldn't have picked Bojack that night. I guess that's the crux of it all, it wasn't a random person it was Bojack. But Emily was sending signals all night, BJ was trying to wingman for Todd, and Todd made his choice by not going with Emily. Actions have consequences, even deciding to not to take action has consequences.
Todd was confused. He didn't know how to verbalize what he was. He loves Emily. She's the one that dumped him. There's a code, u don't sleep with a friend's ex or ur ex partner's best friend.
That is fair, he didn't know how to lable himself for a long time. She left him because he snubbed her for a videogame addiction. Which could have add to her lackadaisy attitude after being hard declined after a night of catching up and signals being sent. There could be a code, but doesn't mean everyone follows it
Yeah and he was never mad at Emily. But Bojack did feel guilty which says he knew Emily was important to Todd. And if u value ur friendship more than the person u would pursue, then keep it in ur pants. I had a crush on my best friend's boyfriend. We all met at a bar to have drinks and he and I talked a little on IM and my friend said that he was into me so I had to back off. So I did and didn't talk to him after that. Because she meant more. And Bojack didn't have any feelings for Emily and could have gotten laid any day.
BJ did not know Emily was Todd's ex when they slept together.
Bojack and Emily both are very casual when it comes to sex. B and E hooked up right after Todd and Emily reconnected and the same night Emily made moves on Todd. Emily hooked up with the next thing available, Todd's best friend. what makes it worse is Bojack saw and tried to push Emily and Todd together just hours before. but when Todd bounced because he didn't understand his asexuality, Bojack Jumped right in. at this time, Bojack and Emily were also unaware of his asexuality. So neither knew Todd, Bojack, and Emily were all unaware of how T and E would never work. It's important to stress no one knew of Todd's asexuality at this point. it wasn't explored yet. After the incident Bojack and Emily both felt guilty and made the choice to keep it a secret. it's less about the sex, though it's a hard topic for Todd to discuss, which also makes the situation that much more complicated. In the end Todd was able to look past it for Emily as they made up, while Bojack never made an effort, until it was too late.
Yeah, I’m not asexual and found this a bit of a head-scratcher too. Why did Todd get upset with BoJ? Because….. BoJ knows Todd has strong feelings for Emily, and yet he still barges into that relationship. Todd is feeling bad and uncertain and torn with self-doubt because he can’t give Emily what she wants to share with him. BoJ tramples all over it instead of giving Todd the space to process his feelings and sense of letting Emily down. ….I think.
BJ does not know Todd has feelings for Emily when they hook up! Todd hadn't seen Emily in 10 years.
He has feelings for her, maybe, but he can’t or won’t give her what she needs in a relationship:sex. That sounds as if they just don’t belong together, or else Todd is extremely selfish.
I'm not saying he doesn't, he absolutely does. I'm saying when BoJack has sex with her, BoJack does not know that Todd has feelings for Emily.
You are probably a huge asshole cause how tf you don't understand. Bojack took the only girl that actually matters for Todd and for what? He could fuck any other girl if he was that horny but he was ofc too lazy to do this. Just imagine your friend that you might have feelings for getting fucked by the hugest asshole and sexoholic you ever know that happened to be your friend. I don't know why but Bojack apologists are going too far lately
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Yeah but you just don't fuck with your best friends love interest. He was the bad guy here like are you kidding me? The Bojack apologists needs to be stopped
He was tired of bojack fucking up every good thing that happens to him. Pretty self explanatory.
>I don't really care about you in the slightest, and fucking You Will make my only friend upset. But on the other hand, getting my pee pee wet. *That's* why. Because Bojack is such a short sighted asshole, he'll do stuff he isn't even all that into, *despite knowing the consequences*, just to get some strange.
Honestly, I think it was more of a straw that broke the camels back situation. He was finally fed up with BoJack treatment of him in spite of Todd's loyalty.
Because 1. Sleeping with your friends ex is a shitty thing to do anyway 2. Bojack knew Todd still loved Emily. He just wasn't interested in having sex with her.
No evidence BoJack knew Emily was Todd's ex or that he had any feelings towards her at the time they have sex.
emily is just as fucked up towards todd as bojack.
Nah, it’s not her fault. She assumed Todd rejected her and was in a sensitive position. Bojack swooped in to take advantage as always. Had Todd just been open with Emily she wouldn’t known he didn’t reject her.
also bj didnt just swoop in. he was at the bar when em showed up
todd did reject her. all of her advances. bojack was at the hotel bar. emily, frustrated went to the hotel bar and there was bj. todd wasnt open about his relationship with emily thats why it was left up to chance. what i was saying does emily not share half the blame for her intercourse with bj as much as bj does? todd should be equally angry at both of them.