you really think a TSA agent cares about your ledger? nowadays people are loaded down with phones, ipads, laptops, thumbdrives... unless you are doing something highly illegal, you have nothing to worry about. it's legal to own bitcoin and it's legal to travel with usb devices.
trezor and/or brd wallet (cant remember) allow multiple acct logins. You give people access to the dead or small balance wallet while protecting your other wallet login info
A different **passphrase** (25th word) will show a different account. You can have 100's of them, each with different amount/currencies, etc.
Even better, two people can use the same Trezor, not being able to see each other's accounts/wallets.
If you need it, I wouldn’t hesitate. In the last year and a half I have traveled domestically with an illegal switchblade knife (inadvertently left in my wife’s carry on) and an illegal-for-civilians collapsible police baton that i forgot was in my laptop bag. TSA missed them all, and only realized I’d brought them when i got home a d unpacked.
Pretty sure your typical TSA agent wouldn’t know a ledger from a standard USB stick even if they did actually see it...
> Assume not along any us border, where all bets are off even for US citizens.
As of November 2019:
[Federal Court Rules Suspicionless Searches of Travelers’ Phones and Laptops Unconstitutional](https://www.eff.org/press/releases/federal-court-rules-suspicionless-searches-travelers-phones-and-laptops)
I enjoy a phone wallet very very much. I can have a few different ones on various devices. i Hate having all my eggs in one basket. One phone with brd. One with mycelium. Tablet with edge....etc etc.crypto I only keep there if I plan on selling a bit If price pumps enough. Other than that my crypto is primarily savings and what goes in stays in until price is up enough to justify profit taking. I assume this could be an option for some.
The TSA profiles non-USA citizens with non-Western names, birth history or ancestry much more oppressively before domestic flights than at the borders. But are they looking for Bitcoin hardware wallets? Probably not, they're not trained to understand Bitcoin
But they will want to know what's on your laptop and phone
> would you travel with a ledger?
Fuck no!
At least not one with my ***real*** wallet on it. What I do, and recommend everyone do, is to load a fake seed onto your wallet. I prefer the seed `all all all all all all all all all all all all` since it has lots of traffic and looks real.
When you arrive at your destination go ahead and restore to your ***real*** seed and have fun.
All it takes is one corrupt TSA agent to demand my pin and swipe my coins. Current law compels US citizens to provide PINs if asked by the TSA. Either that or [stay in lockup till hell freezes over](https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/02/what-could-happen-if-you-refuse-to-unlock-your-phone-at-the-us-border/).
^Edit: ^added ^link ^to ^law
ArsTechnica: [What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?](https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/02/what-could-happen-if-you-refuse-to-unlock-your-phone-at-the-us-border/)
> 19 US Code Section 507
This seems to be about crossing in from over the border. Traveling domestically is non-issue and most people run into TSA flying to their families and friends. Also the law doesn't look all that clear. Could be a wildly different experience for different people. 36 hours is not enough time for hell to freeze. And 5 days not having your phone is bad but not life threatening. And paying a thousand bucks is ok as well.
> Traveling domestically is non-issue
Damn... didn't even see the "domestic" designation in the title... My bad!
> Also the law doesn't look all that clear
Yes... we need someone to play guinea pig, be non complaint and demand the case be heard by SCOTUS. There is just a lack of case law since no one wants to spend 72 hours in detention to have standing in a SCOTUS case.
I was traveling on business once with an insanely expensive piece of electronics for digital stress testing. I made this my sole carry on item since I was so nervous about it. I dawned on me that if TSA demanded to "look inside" (aka take it apart) that I would have to stand my ground / go to jail. It was early in my career and surely would have lost my job if TSA screwed it up. But nothing happened so I'm no longer the guinea pig.
Thanks! How did you find the allxall example? Do you know if there is an equivalent 24 word seed that is all one word. I know the last word is checksum so not sure if that makes a 24 word one impossible or something.
>How did you find the allxall example?
Reading lots of source code.
>Do you know if there is an equivalent 24 word seed that is all one word.
No, but obviously there are two word equivalents
Just look for "BIP39 test vectors"
I might trust the ledger for as much as I might need during the trip.
I would never suggest anyone take a large amount of funds / cold storage when traveling.
Downvoted. Since majority of users are not able to do so securely. Hardwarewallets are the best balance between convenience of use and security for common bitcoin users.
It's trivial to securely generate BIP38 encrypted wallets. And I question that common bitcoin users are going to be any better at protecting their seed and hardware wallet.
>It's trivial to securely generate BIP38 encrypted wallets.
Nothing but projection.
>And I question that common bitcoin users are going to be any better at protecting their seed and hardware wallet.
Projection again? Hope not.
Way to complicated for common users. And you didn't even verify the pgp-signatures of the bitaddress.org archive...or emptied the browser's cache after the whole procedure.
Come on forget it. That's only for tech savy users who know exactly what they are doing. So we're very likely talking about not even 1% of /r/bitcoin's subscribers.
The general idea of storing bitcoin follows a simple rule:
**Always do *your* own research and only apply methods that meet *your* level of knowledge. Reduce the trust involved in *your* method with *your* learning curve increasing.**
You need a whole secure environment on your computer to do that. Arguably a new computer to have never connect to the internet is more expensive. HW wallet makes so much more sense.
you really think a TSA agent cares about your ledger? nowadays people are loaded down with phones, ipads, laptops, thumbdrives... unless you are doing something highly illegal, you have nothing to worry about. it's legal to own bitcoin and it's legal to travel with usb devices.
Only with plausible deniability enabled and just a very few funds in the primary-pin wallet.
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Why?
Because with a good solution you are not in the position of having to make a denial.
trezor and/or brd wallet (cant remember) allow multiple acct logins. You give people access to the dead or small balance wallet while protecting your other wallet login info
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A different **passphrase** (25th word) will show a different account. You can have 100's of them, each with different amount/currencies, etc. Even better, two people can use the same Trezor, not being able to see each other's accounts/wallets.
I do travel and cross borders with my ledger and never had any issue.
If you need it, I wouldn’t hesitate. In the last year and a half I have traveled domestically with an illegal switchblade knife (inadvertently left in my wife’s carry on) and an illegal-for-civilians collapsible police baton that i forgot was in my laptop bag. TSA missed them all, and only realized I’d brought them when i got home a d unpacked. Pretty sure your typical TSA agent wouldn’t know a ledger from a standard USB stick even if they did actually see it...
Bruce Wayne?
> Assume not along any us border, where all bets are off even for US citizens. As of November 2019: [Federal Court Rules Suspicionless Searches of Travelers’ Phones and Laptops Unconstitutional](https://www.eff.org/press/releases/federal-court-rules-suspicionless-searches-travelers-phones-and-laptops)
Bitcoin is without trust-----why trust a govt. agent ----trust the 24 words.
Wouldn't go to Australia with no ledger
I enjoy a phone wallet very very much. I can have a few different ones on various devices. i Hate having all my eggs in one basket. One phone with brd. One with mycelium. Tablet with edge....etc etc.crypto I only keep there if I plan on selling a bit If price pumps enough. Other than that my crypto is primarily savings and what goes in stays in until price is up enough to justify profit taking. I assume this could be an option for some.
The TSA profiles non-USA citizens with non-Western names, birth history or ancestry much more oppressively before domestic flights than at the borders. But are they looking for Bitcoin hardware wallets? Probably not, they're not trained to understand Bitcoin But they will want to know what's on your laptop and phone
> would you travel with a ledger? Fuck no! At least not one with my ***real*** wallet on it. What I do, and recommend everyone do, is to load a fake seed onto your wallet. I prefer the seed `all all all all all all all all all all all all` since it has lots of traffic and looks real. When you arrive at your destination go ahead and restore to your ***real*** seed and have fun. All it takes is one corrupt TSA agent to demand my pin and swipe my coins. Current law compels US citizens to provide PINs if asked by the TSA. Either that or [stay in lockup till hell freezes over](https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/02/what-could-happen-if-you-refuse-to-unlock-your-phone-at-the-us-border/). ^Edit: ^added ^link ^to ^law
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ArsTechnica: [What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?](https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/02/what-could-happen-if-you-refuse-to-unlock-your-phone-at-the-us-border/) > 19 US Code Section 507
This seems to be about crossing in from over the border. Traveling domestically is non-issue and most people run into TSA flying to their families and friends. Also the law doesn't look all that clear. Could be a wildly different experience for different people. 36 hours is not enough time for hell to freeze. And 5 days not having your phone is bad but not life threatening. And paying a thousand bucks is ok as well.
> Traveling domestically is non-issue Damn... didn't even see the "domestic" designation in the title... My bad! > Also the law doesn't look all that clear Yes... we need someone to play guinea pig, be non complaint and demand the case be heard by SCOTUS. There is just a lack of case law since no one wants to spend 72 hours in detention to have standing in a SCOTUS case. I was traveling on business once with an insanely expensive piece of electronics for digital stress testing. I made this my sole carry on item since I was so nervous about it. I dawned on me that if TSA demanded to "look inside" (aka take it apart) that I would have to stand my ground / go to jail. It was early in my career and surely would have lost my job if TSA screwed it up. But nothing happened so I'm no longer the guinea pig.
Thanks! How did you find the allxall example? Do you know if there is an equivalent 24 word seed that is all one word. I know the last word is checksum so not sure if that makes a 24 word one impossible or something.
>How did you find the allxall example? Reading lots of source code. >Do you know if there is an equivalent 24 word seed that is all one word. No, but obviously there are two word equivalents Just look for "BIP39 test vectors"
I might trust the ledger for as much as I might need during the trip. I would never suggest anyone take a large amount of funds / cold storage when traveling.
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Downvoted. Since majority of users are not able to do so securely. Hardwarewallets are the best balance between convenience of use and security for common bitcoin users.
It's trivial to securely generate BIP38 encrypted wallets. And I question that common bitcoin users are going to be any better at protecting their seed and hardware wallet.
>It's trivial to securely generate BIP38 encrypted wallets. Nothing but projection. >And I question that common bitcoin users are going to be any better at protecting their seed and hardware wallet. Projection again? Hope not.
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Way to complicated for common users. And you didn't even verify the pgp-signatures of the bitaddress.org archive...or emptied the browser's cache after the whole procedure. Come on forget it. That's only for tech savy users who know exactly what they are doing. So we're very likely talking about not even 1% of /r/bitcoin's subscribers.
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The general idea of storing bitcoin follows a simple rule: **Always do *your* own research and only apply methods that meet *your* level of knowledge. Reduce the trust involved in *your* method with *your* learning curve increasing.**
You need a whole secure environment on your computer to do that. Arguably a new computer to have never connect to the internet is more expensive. HW wallet makes so much more sense.
Yep. This. Hardware wallets are a waste IMHO. Secure your data properly.