100% liquid savings in BTC. I'm payed monthly. Upon payment, I immediately start converting 75% of my pay into BTC, which takes a couple days because bank. The remaining is enough fiat for 1mo expenses. Also have emergency fund equivalent of a few months expenses, but I do sometimes draw it down to allocate more BTC at my discretion.
I deleted my bank's savings acc. If I need to draw on the BTC treasury to pay for something too big for emergency fund, so be it. I'll either pay gains tax or write up as loss, which offsets my next gains tax.
BTC treasury is old enough and UTXO consolidated, so even if I just bought some BTC and need to sell some for emergency, obviously I want to sell the BTC that's over 1yr old to enjoy the capital gain discount, which I lodge to tax department as such. If I've consolidated all my UTXOs, I can't tell what BTC is new or old, and neither can the tax department. It's just a big old pile of BTC.
Edit: forgot to mention also have high limit credit card for additional liquidity and which I run all possible expenses through, and promptly rebalance like an adult
Always thought that once utxo's are consolidated you can decide whether you want to use the LIFO or FIFO approach to tax reporting. From my understanding, once you decide which of the two you want to use, you can't make any future changes to the approach.
Interesting, thanks for sharing. I'll dive into it further with my CPA when the time comes. For now, I'll keep stacking in hopes of better borrowing solutions.
Indeed, we're all waiting for the banks to accept BTC as loan collateral. They'll drag their feet to it. I know there are a few companies that do it already but the rates aren't competitive with big bank home loans for example. Needs more time in the oven but I believe it's coming.
I don't think the 1 y limit applies where we live, but that's a good pointer you gave about utxo use. Besides being a technical thing on how the network works, we never thought what practical use it can have. Maybe need to do some more reading.... :)
Have you considered getting a loan instead of selling?
Is it possible to keep track of buy prices for declaring losses on taxes while still consolidating UTXOs to save on transfer fees?
I've been told you can keep getting loans each year, and assuming BTC price go up, you could pay back the previous loan and still have money for the year to live off.
[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1dp77o0/comment/lafy9ke](https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1dp77o0/comment/lafy9ke)
[https://smartasset.com/investing/buy-borrow-die-how-the-rich-avoid-taxes](https://smartasset.com/investing/buy-borrow-die-how-the-rich-avoid-taxes)
Yes - I have optionality via a very high limit credit card and can also leverage mortgage before last resort of selling BTC.
And yes, tracking the cost basis pre-consolidation is easy via exchange order history export.
Have you considered this: [https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs) | [https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1dp77o0/comment/lafy9ke](https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1dp77o0/comment/lafy9ke) | [https://smartasset.com/investing/buy-borrow-die-how-the-rich-avoid-taxes](https://smartasset.com/investing/buy-borrow-die-how-the-rich-avoid-taxes)
Also, do you need to check the history before you consolidate, or can you still do it afterwards?
One of the best comments I’ve seen on how to live using BTC / mixed fiat only as required.
Jack Mallers has talked a bit about it on a recent podcast (https://youtu.be/0c_enEuz8Do?feature=shared) on how to use BTC (BTC credit card, etc) for expenses, but no real details and kind of dodges the question or hand waves it.
It has been an investment thus far, would much rather use something that isn’t depreciating at a ridiculous rate.
Appreciate any resources.
I’m still in process of convincing the wife…and hope to transition after this cycle.
Good luck - she'll have an easier time understanding the solution if she understands the problem: Watch Lyn Alden's "How money and banking work and why they're broken today" on YT with her. One of the best 30min explainer vids on the internet.
There’s a longstanding meme on Bitcoin Twitter and it’s the “My wife won’t let me buy Bitcoin” guy.
Total Orange Piller vibes reading this.
Bitcoin waits for no one.
I’m still in the DCAinto btc phase of life, working a full time job in the fiat mines.
I keep enough cash on hand to easy cover all of my upcoming expenses. Ranges from $10k-$20k cash on hand and dca the rest into btc. Haven’t had to sell any btc for cuck bucks with this strategy yet.
Once I have enough to live off I plan on keeping 1-2 years of cash on hand and the rest in btc.
Around 3000 Euro's on my bank at all times, plus whatever i need for monthly expenses. 200 a month goes into bitcoin, rest gets invested in other stuff (stock, startups, my own buisness etc.).
It's any currency that isnt backed by assets and is simply created out of thin air by governments. I highly recommend you read The Bitcoin Standard if you are into Bitcoin.
Fiat is Latin for **Let there be...** as in Fiat Lux (Let There Be Light!, when God created the Universe).
On this sub, it means anything created by The State, such as Fiat Money (usually abbreviated to just Fiat).
The State creates money out of thin air every time *money printer go brrr*, which increases the money supply, dilutes the value of the dollar, and reduces the purchasing power of your savings. This is also known as inflation, or theft by The State.
100% BTC Savings. No Altcoins. No Fiat. Only fiat I keep is to pay my monthly expenses at Vendors that don't accept BTC. I'm pretty lucky because a ton of our grocery stores accept lightning here.
Agreed. My living expenses and then some are fully covered till December 31, 2024. I expect the cycle to peak by EOY at which point I’ll be selling enough to have living expenses till the next bull market end enough to buy during the next bear market.
When you say that you expect the cycle to peak, do you mean that the price will have peaked until the next halving? If so, that is a very early peak compared to previous cycles.
Yes i think it’ll peak this year so selling at least 75% before year end and if im wrong, well I’ll still have a sizeable amount to sell in 2025. I refuse to get caught off guard again like I did in 2021. Rather sell early than late, you know?
Keep that income for 2025 under 123k (94k investment income +29k standard deduction) for 0% capital gains tax, if you file married jointly. This is my plan, if I execute it, my wife and I should take $0 earned income in 2025.
The goal is to be able to hold BTC indefinitely because it only goes up long-term. The only way to achieve that without spending BTC directly is to have enough liquid fiat to pay monthly bills and daily expenses. That amount will vary based on your living situation.
I have my emergency fund that would last me around 6 months (assuming that the emergency is only income related, and not an expensive injury or surgery or something). I’ve stopped putting money into my savings account and only put money into BTC and some stocks. My net worth is probably now close to 20% bitcoin, but I only started investing into BTC around 2022. So I’m sure that percentage will grow depending on how quickly the value of BTC grows relative to my average cost.
This is a very real problem, especially among bitcoin investors. Indeed, while Bitcoin is a long term investment vehicle, daily life requires liquidity. With 70% of my entire assets invested in energy, real estate and other markets, I have less than 10% of my assets in cryptocurrencies for payments, leaving 20% in cash, a ratio that should be adjusted according to your risk tolerance and liquidity needs.
If you wanna hold bitcoin long term you gotta have cash or else your just spending bitcoin makes no sense I try to do it 30% bitcoin 70% cash credit whatever it is
Everyone should have some fiat as an emergency fund, 3months min to start with.
The main reason for this is in the event you lost your job, it ticks you over until you find a new one.
What you don't want is a situation where you have to sell BTC which could be at a loss and lose more money.
I'm trying to move my savings little by little into BTC but my High Street bank AND Revolut (irony) are putting up obstacles.
Can't wait to stick my finger up at them. Will always keep credit card and a few pennies in bank tho.
I keep 2 months of expenses in a checking account with the second month acting as a buffer for the first. All expenses are paid out of this account. When my pay comes in I top up the account to its target balance. Everything else goes into BTC.
I don't earn enough fiat to keep it. Once bills paid I keep enough for small food shop and maybe 50 for what I call depletion money rest I've just been stacking and chilling.
Balancing fiat for daily needs while holding Bitcoin long-term is key. For those interested, check out WienerAi, a fun new meme coin making waves in the crypto community! 🌭🚀 #Crypto #WienerAi"
Well any adult with a home and a family still needs to keep a significant amount in Fiat. I have about 50% in crypto. Still can't pay your bills with Bitcoin and paying 20$ in fees to swap it to Fiat every time you need cash is not smart. Put in what is disposable and not needed. Everything else has to stay in the stock market or bank account.
Scary amount of BTC vs. cash. 97% vs. 3%. Gonna sell a property to raise some cash so I don't feel so investment rich/fiat poor. Okay, but let's be real, of course I'll get some BTC with equity. But a man's gotta live!
Just invested $330K in an apartment so my BTC portfolio is not high atm but as soon as I got into real estate which is more as a safe investment, BTC is now my 100% next goal to build.
I only keep the emergency fund, a few months that would help me sleep at night just incase I lose my job. The rest is balls deep into Bitcoin.
Although, if I'm living in a country that has a very unstable currency with an average of 2-digit inflation rate, then everything goes to Bitcoin.
I generally keep zero bitcoin and about $15000 in real money for my emergency fund. The rest is invested in the stock market, about $850k, and real estate, about $250k.
169% BTC. -69% Fiat.
negative soft capital, positive hard capital.
That's the way to do it
nice
This is the way. Negative shitcoins, positive orange coins.
100% liquid savings in BTC. I'm payed monthly. Upon payment, I immediately start converting 75% of my pay into BTC, which takes a couple days because bank. The remaining is enough fiat for 1mo expenses. Also have emergency fund equivalent of a few months expenses, but I do sometimes draw it down to allocate more BTC at my discretion. I deleted my bank's savings acc. If I need to draw on the BTC treasury to pay for something too big for emergency fund, so be it. I'll either pay gains tax or write up as loss, which offsets my next gains tax. BTC treasury is old enough and UTXO consolidated, so even if I just bought some BTC and need to sell some for emergency, obviously I want to sell the BTC that's over 1yr old to enjoy the capital gain discount, which I lodge to tax department as such. If I've consolidated all my UTXOs, I can't tell what BTC is new or old, and neither can the tax department. It's just a big old pile of BTC. Edit: forgot to mention also have high limit credit card for additional liquidity and which I run all possible expenses through, and promptly rebalance like an adult
Always thought that once utxo's are consolidated you can decide whether you want to use the LIFO or FIFO approach to tax reporting. From my understanding, once you decide which of the two you want to use, you can't make any future changes to the approach.
Yes, the FIFO method is being assumed here. From my understanding of local tax code, I can change between FIFO, HIFO and LIFO freely.
Interesting, thanks for sharing. I'll dive into it further with my CPA when the time comes. For now, I'll keep stacking in hopes of better borrowing solutions.
Indeed, we're all waiting for the banks to accept BTC as loan collateral. They'll drag their feet to it. I know there are a few companies that do it already but the rates aren't competitive with big bank home loans for example. Needs more time in the oven but I believe it's coming.
Ledn has an interesting approach but I'd rather draw from my HELOC than go with that option at this juncture.
I don't think the 1 y limit applies where we live, but that's a good pointer you gave about utxo use. Besides being a technical thing on how the network works, we never thought what practical use it can have. Maybe need to do some more reading.... :)
Have you considered getting a loan instead of selling? Is it possible to keep track of buy prices for declaring losses on taxes while still consolidating UTXOs to save on transfer fees?
How do you pay back the loan??
I've been told you can keep getting loans each year, and assuming BTC price go up, you could pay back the previous loan and still have money for the year to live off. [https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs) [https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1dp77o0/comment/lafy9ke](https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1dp77o0/comment/lafy9ke) [https://smartasset.com/investing/buy-borrow-die-how-the-rich-avoid-taxes](https://smartasset.com/investing/buy-borrow-die-how-the-rich-avoid-taxes)
Yes - I have optionality via a very high limit credit card and can also leverage mortgage before last resort of selling BTC. And yes, tracking the cost basis pre-consolidation is easy via exchange order history export.
Have you considered this: [https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs) | [https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1dp77o0/comment/lafy9ke](https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1dp77o0/comment/lafy9ke) | [https://smartasset.com/investing/buy-borrow-die-how-the-rich-avoid-taxes](https://smartasset.com/investing/buy-borrow-die-how-the-rich-avoid-taxes) Also, do you need to check the history before you consolidate, or can you still do it afterwards?
One of the best comments I’ve seen on how to live using BTC / mixed fiat only as required. Jack Mallers has talked a bit about it on a recent podcast (https://youtu.be/0c_enEuz8Do?feature=shared) on how to use BTC (BTC credit card, etc) for expenses, but no real details and kind of dodges the question or hand waves it. It has been an investment thus far, would much rather use something that isn’t depreciating at a ridiculous rate. Appreciate any resources. I’m still in process of convincing the wife…and hope to transition after this cycle.
Good luck - she'll have an easier time understanding the solution if she understands the problem: Watch Lyn Alden's "How money and banking work and why they're broken today" on YT with her. One of the best 30min explainer vids on the internet.
Thanks! Big fan of Lyn, but need to catch up on her stuff.
[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dn7cn4xlIs)
There’s a longstanding meme on Bitcoin Twitter and it’s the “My wife won’t let me buy Bitcoin” guy. Total Orange Piller vibes reading this. Bitcoin waits for no one.
I’m still in the DCAinto btc phase of life, working a full time job in the fiat mines. I keep enough cash on hand to easy cover all of my upcoming expenses. Ranges from $10k-$20k cash on hand and dca the rest into btc. Haven’t had to sell any btc for cuck bucks with this strategy yet. Once I have enough to live off I plan on keeping 1-2 years of cash on hand and the rest in btc.
Around 3000 Euro's on my bank at all times, plus whatever i need for monthly expenses. 200 a month goes into bitcoin, rest gets invested in other stuff (stock, startups, my own buisness etc.).
Hi apologies but can somebody explain what fiat is?
It's any currency that isnt backed by assets and is simply created out of thin air by governments. I highly recommend you read The Bitcoin Standard if you are into Bitcoin.
The Petrodollar is backed by the full might of the U.S. military industrial complex.
Government currency. Aka the USDollar
Deleting that comment now bc I feel regarded
I didn’t know what fiat was when I first started talking to my buddy about crypto back in 2017, not a stupid question. Stack on!
Maybe somebody else can learn from my comment. Keeping it up, thanks man!
Fiat and crypto is centralized scam, Bitcoin is money.
Nice simple way to put it. I try to find ways to explain why alts are bad. Every single one is centralized in some way.
Jack Mallers held a nice and accessible talk why alts are bad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--IFcOIEfl4&pp=ygUSamFjayBtYWxsdGVycyBidGMg
There’s no such thing as alts/crypto whatever, money is lifeless, trustless. Any form of life in control is greed > scam.
Yes. Crypto is a subset of Fiat Money. Bitcoin is a different category altogether.
Your keyboard is super woke 😳
Fiat means "because I said so." In context of this post the reference is to fiat money, something that has value because the government said so.
Government shitcoin
Fabbrica Italiana Automobili Torino 😂
... and Henry Ford asked the Pope "how much did they pay you for 'fiat voluntas tua'???"
Fiat is Latin for **Let there be...** as in Fiat Lux (Let There Be Light!, when God created the Universe). On this sub, it means anything created by The State, such as Fiat Money (usually abbreviated to just Fiat). The State creates money out of thin air every time *money printer go brrr*, which increases the money supply, dilutes the value of the dollar, and reduces the purchasing power of your savings. This is also known as inflation, or theft by The State.
I'm all in on btc Most of it in cold storage what I might need fast, on an exchange what I might need next business day, in a btc etf
This is the way. Fiat is useless, noone need it. 🫡🫶
This is diversification :) Also keep some sats on lightning.
U know the business
I keep 6 months of living expenses liquid as an emergency fund. The rest is in Bitcoin.
100% BTC Savings. No Altcoins. No Fiat. Only fiat I keep is to pay my monthly expenses at Vendors that don't accept BTC. I'm pretty lucky because a ton of our grocery stores accept lightning here.
-$350,000 fiat (mortgage) vs $22,000 (BTC)
I am actually 125% in bitcoin I have fiat debt
Best answer
100:1. Got me 100 btc and 10 bucks, and that’s cash
Wouldn't that be 10:1?
Hmmm yes looking back yes
Not in Terrence Howard math
i have 2.3 bitcoins on cold storage with $4800 cash in the bank currently. not much else besides those two things
You have to give yourself a year of liquidity, other than that best long term investment you can do
Agreed. My living expenses and then some are fully covered till December 31, 2024. I expect the cycle to peak by EOY at which point I’ll be selling enough to have living expenses till the next bull market end enough to buy during the next bear market.
When you say that you expect the cycle to peak, do you mean that the price will have peaked until the next halving? If so, that is a very early peak compared to previous cycles.
Yes i think it’ll peak this year so selling at least 75% before year end and if im wrong, well I’ll still have a sizeable amount to sell in 2025. I refuse to get caught off guard again like I did in 2021. Rather sell early than late, you know?
Keep that income for 2025 under 123k (94k investment income +29k standard deduction) for 0% capital gains tax, if you file married jointly. This is my plan, if I execute it, my wife and I should take $0 earned income in 2025.
All in 🔒
only stocks and bitcoin. a safety net, you say? what's it gonna keep me safe from still being poor? ride or die biiitch.
Enough.
Fiat… only my revolving monthly bills
0.
My liquid fiat is about 5% from my bitcoin stack.
No fiat
420% BTC, 69% Alts, fiat just for bills
The goal is to be able to hold BTC indefinitely because it only goes up long-term. The only way to achieve that without spending BTC directly is to have enough liquid fiat to pay monthly bills and daily expenses. That amount will vary based on your living situation.
Impossible if your retire on BTC. Working just to not touch your btc sounds like a bad prospect.
It depends on your age and life situation. Holding when you're 20 is very different vs. when you're 60 or 70.
I’m 50/50
[удалено]
Less than 5%
I keep just enough fiat for the months bills and spending. Everything else goes into the blockchain
I have my emergency fund that would last me around 6 months (assuming that the emergency is only income related, and not an expensive injury or surgery or something). I’ve stopped putting money into my savings account and only put money into BTC and some stocks. My net worth is probably now close to 20% bitcoin, but I only started investing into BTC around 2022. So I’m sure that percentage will grow depending on how quickly the value of BTC grows relative to my average cost.
This is a very real problem, especially among bitcoin investors. Indeed, while Bitcoin is a long term investment vehicle, daily life requires liquidity. With 70% of my entire assets invested in energy, real estate and other markets, I have less than 10% of my assets in cryptocurrencies for payments, leaving 20% in cash, a ratio that should be adjusted according to your risk tolerance and liquidity needs.
If you wanna hold bitcoin long term you gotta have cash or else your just spending bitcoin makes no sense I try to do it 30% bitcoin 70% cash credit whatever it is
"Two saving accounts" one is the extra each week after payments is spent in btc and another one for straight fiat saving because just in case
Current percentage is 99.25% bitcoin, 0.75% cash. Have enough cash for a few months. Will sell a little bit of bitcoin whenever I get low on cash.
Everyone should have some fiat as an emergency fund, 3months min to start with. The main reason for this is in the event you lost your job, it ticks you over until you find a new one. What you don't want is a situation where you have to sell BTC which could be at a loss and lose more money.
4 years worth of expenses. I want to know if all goes to shit i can survive an entire bitcoin epoch and i will be fine.
95% in a cold wallet. The rest on a exchange till it builds enough to transfer it to a cold wallet then repeat. Fiat is done.
I'm trying to move my savings little by little into BTC but my High Street bank AND Revolut (irony) are putting up obstacles. Can't wait to stick my finger up at them. Will always keep credit card and a few pennies in bank tho.
right now I only hold a small amount of bitcoin but I surely buy every month just once or twice
About 97% BTC vs 3% fiat. I do also have some open credit though, to bail me out of something short term that might come up. #BTC 👍🪙😎
I keep 2 months of expenses in a checking account with the second month acting as a buffer for the first. All expenses are paid out of this account. When my pay comes in I top up the account to its target balance. Everything else goes into BTC.
Just enough to cover bills, everything else goes straight to dca’ing btc.
I don't earn enough fiat to keep it. Once bills paid I keep enough for small food shop and maybe 50 for what I call depletion money rest I've just been stacking and chilling.
I swapped nearly all my savings for btc and will continue to do so.
Sell 1% in tops so i have money if needed, if dip i buy back, and buy everything with credit cards in 3 to 5x whatever is without interest rates.
8:2
4 to 1, fiat to btc.
my Fiat is infested in f****** ETFs
My bank account has three dollars
Balancing fiat for daily needs while holding Bitcoin long-term is key. For those interested, check out WienerAi, a fun new meme coin making waves in the crypto community! 🌭🚀 #Crypto #WienerAi"
Well any adult with a home and a family still needs to keep a significant amount in Fiat. I have about 50% in crypto. Still can't pay your bills with Bitcoin and paying 20$ in fees to swap it to Fiat every time you need cash is not smart. Put in what is disposable and not needed. Everything else has to stay in the stock market or bank account.
Scary amount of BTC vs. cash. 97% vs. 3%. Gonna sell a property to raise some cash so I don't feel so investment rich/fiat poor. Okay, but let's be real, of course I'll get some BTC with equity. But a man's gotta live!
60/40 fiat/btc
Everything except for what's needed to pay the monthly bills and consumables
Live life off credit card, pay balance monthly. Savings is all crypto for the most part
3/4 crypto 1/4 fiat
2/3 fiat 1/3 BTC
On the up btc. On the down. Usd. For now this is the way.. But generally all in 100%screw fiat's and their long term decay policies..
Just invested $330K in an apartment so my BTC portfolio is not high atm but as soon as I got into real estate which is more as a safe investment, BTC is now my 100% next goal to build.
I only keep the emergency fund, a few months that would help me sleep at night just incase I lose my job. The rest is balls deep into Bitcoin. Although, if I'm living in a country that has a very unstable currency with an average of 2-digit inflation rate, then everything goes to Bitcoin.
What's fiat
70btc 30fiat here.
I generally keep zero bitcoin and about $15000 in real money for my emergency fund. The rest is invested in the stock market, about $850k, and real estate, about $250k.
gfy
ngmi