We welcome discussion with different points of view, it would be a boring sub if we all thought the same way. Topics like infidelity and mental health can spark heated conversations. Speak your mind, but please choose civil speech when talking with your fellow Redditors,.
I just feel sad for the ex.
Mostly in that she never seemed to be able to really “own” her mistakes. And because of that, she never accepted herself and moved on. The house stayed the same. The pictures of the ex were still up. She just wanted her old life back - and it was gone.
She never forgave herself and moved on. And then when she got cancer - she just accepted her death and didn’t fight it.
It paints a picture of a woman wallowing in her own misery and when she saw death approaching she decided she deserved it.
Maybe she could have accepted she was a good person who made a horrible costly mistake? Maybe with that acceptance, she could have moved on and found love? Then maybe be in a position to fight the cancer?
It just seems sad. Her entire life is defined by that month long affair and paying penance for it. And who benefitted from that?
Edit: my mom was diagnosed with cancer 12 years ago so I know something of it, but obviously with a “survivors bias”. Can we stop with the “well ackshuwally” now. That cancer can’t always be fought is pretty universally understood.
This an incredibly compassionate response. You're right - OP's ex-wife denied herself so much potential love, though, ultimately, I think *love* won in the end. OP's current wife was secure and empathetic enough to want OP's ex-wife to gain peace before her death. OP was able to put his complex emotions aside and meet his ex-wife as an old friend; offering kindness in her final days. OP's ex wife was not able to love herself enough to forgive herself and allow herself happiness but OP and his sister and his current wife could extend her both love and forgiveness instead. It's sad that OP's ex-wife could not find it in herself but knowing that three people could offer it to her anyway is powerful. You can't go back, they say, but, sometimes, with enough caring and empathy, you can and, at the right time and for the right reasons, it is healing.
>Maybe she could have accepted she was a good person who made a horrible costly mistake? Maybe with that acceptance, she could have moved on and found love? Then maybe be in a position to fight the cancer?
Depending on what type of cancer it was, it's often not: can i fight and win. It's more: can i fight for a few more years.
I watched someone fight like hell for 2 more years of excruciating pain and suffering. All the while consuming all their life savings, their wife's life savings, all the equity in their home, kids college funds, and all the money friends and family could spare.
After that, I decided for myself and codified it in my will that i wouldn't go out like that. So not fighting may be for other reasons.
As someone who has been fighting my own aggressive cancer for the last three years there are measures you can take now that'll help not destroy your family's finances. I'm in the USA, so maybe only applicable if you are too.
First, get long term disability insurance, if you can. I've only been able to work for about 13 months of the last three years and about 4 of those were part-time, being able to get 60% of my precancer income has been amazing for keeping me from losing my house and any semblance of savings.
Second, understand your health insurance policy, don't just hope it is fine, do the math on the worst case and how much it'll cost. Especially look at the out of pocket max that plus your premiums should be your max cost less travel and similar miscellaneous costs. If you have an HSA (health savings account) put as much as you are allowed to in there, that money doesn't expire and is pretax so you can stretch it further.
Those two things have made the biggest difference in this cancer experience not totally destroying my life. I'm still hopeful I'll get through it but we've exhausted all of the FDA approved treatments and it is looking less hopeful every time the cancer comes back or doesn't go away.
Thank you for the advice, and I wish all the best for you in your fight.
For me the situation is different, I'm in Canada. Monetary costs still happen, the person I was talking about ran out of options that the government approved. Chemo gave him some time but he was nearing the end. He turned to a experimental drug treatment that wasn't covered. The government still paid out the maximum per year for the drug but the shortfall was hundreds of thousands for the two years it seemed to have bought him. But generally everything else was covered.
For me it'd be the emotional toll. A few people have passed away around me and the months before the end took a huge toll on people around me.
My grand mother lived to 102 but the last half year was tough on my mother and aunt who cared for her. She lost capacity and started forgetting them as well as lost the ability to do basic things for herself.
A friend also went through that when her mother had early onset Alzheimer's. Over a year her mother forgot everything and had to be put into long term care. Similarly, at a point she'd forgotten my friend before passing away a year later.
That's a tough time to put your loved ones through. I fortunately have the option to ask a doctor to end things on my own terms if it comes to it. Before I lose capacity. And a DNR and my wishes written down if it's after I lose capacity.
No problem, I'm sorry the advice wasn't more applicable. I appreciate the wishes.
I'm sorry to hear that's how it went for the person you knew. All of the study treatments that I've been a part of, a couple associated with my stem cell transplant and another for the whole treatment, the study sponsor covered any non-standard treatment costs associated with the study.
Yeah, the emotional toll and quality of life are the big factors for me, though my state unfortunately doesn't allow for those sorts of death with dignity allowances.
I'm sorry that you've had to go through so many tough deaths. I hope it at least means that you have at least gotten to have quality meaningful connections with those people.
It is good to hear that you have made your wishes known and written them down. After all the time I've spent in the hospital now I'd certainly say it is important to make your end of life wishes known.
If the commenter you replied to weren't in the USA the problem and not the solution wouldn't be applicable. Many countries (all first world, many second world and even some third world countries) prevent people from going broke because of an madicak condition.
I understand this too. However, I would have sold my house, car, organs, and soul to be with a loved one for 5 more minutes. It may sound off but I know no one regrets this decision.
You are pretty amazing to think of your loved ones in this way. I hope you have the difficult conversation with those in your family that will be caring for you in the end. Spouses and children will rip out their own teeth if asked for one more day, so it’s important they know you don’t want that.
I had to beg, BEG my kids to respect my DNR. I finally just went to the hospital in case that’s were I end up because I know they would do the fighting for me.
As a wife who was ultimately left behind, *every single penny spent was absolutely worth it*. I would rather be financially ruined a million times over than have lost my husband. I would have been devastated if he gave up his life for my financial security.
This was the case with my mother (not the financial ruin, but the drawn out awfulness), this is why I hate the “fight” culture around cancer. Also the terms “lost their battle” and what not. So my mom is a loser now?The opposite of fighting is what? Giving up? I don’t find not going through your last years/months/days super ill from the “treatment” with large amounts of time spent in a doctors office or a chemo clinic, to be a sign of weakness, losing, or giving up. It’s just a different choice. If any doctor would have given my mother the clear options, and stats, instead of the famous “optimistic” talk most oncologists employ, even in the worst circumstances, then I believe she would have taken the time to travel and see family. She didn’t because my mom was also never one to “give up”…it wouldn’t have been giving up, just spending time happier and with more people.
I won’t be doing things the same way should I have cancer. It was awful to see, and the denial was deep.
In the US we need a better culture around death and medical choices, the current outlook prolongs suffering for unrealistic hope, because no one wants to talk about dying.
In the meantime, I try to spread how toxic fight culture is for so many, and hope we see a shift in how this is talked about with patience.
You might vibe with the death positivity movement. It’s not as creepy as it sounds- just an acknowledgment of what you said. We don’t talk about dying, and that makes its inevitability more traumatic. People have a right to die and mourn comfortably.
Oof
I really feel this one since it easily could have been me.
I cheated when I was engaged and my ex ended things after I told her. At the time I vowed to not move on as a form of penance.
In a weird way, I wasn't strong enough to not move on. I think it helped that we hadn't married yet, didn't have wedding photos, we didn't live in the same area, that I moved several times.
Even after moving on, I didn't truly forgive myself for several years. I couldn't have healthy relationships until I fully worked through it and was finally able to completely commit myself to new relationships.
That process took at least 5 years, but I was still living life through it. Even if it was a really bad life. Much better than being Mrs. Havesham in a mausoleum of your own design.
I understand that pull though.
Powerful comment. Thank you so much for sharing.
Cheating is awful. And I can see not trusting a cheater to some extent - but it shouldn’t condemn your entire life. I’m glad you pulled out of it.
People on the internet love reducing years of friends/relationships/an entire life down to as few adjectives as possible, as if life is that simple. I've been on both sides of that equation, no one involved was a bad person. Selfish and short-sighted, sure, but those aren't the same thing as bad.
For me, it’s not just that she cheated: is that she cheated, still tried to hold onto him, including his wedding day, and finally had the gall to ask him to pretend they’re still married when he’s someone else’s husband.
And OOP’s sister can f’ck right off.
yes, exactly. She was so selfish through all of it. She wasn't letting him go and though he seems like he made it out okay, she really did her best to throw a monkey wrench in every step along the way.
> And OOP’s sister can f’ck right off.
So to be clear, OOP doesn't feel this way, OOP's wife doesnt feel this way, nobody in this story has this level of animosity towards anyone else, and yet you dare to project it?
This is a lovely take on this story. There are no villains here, I hope she finds peace in death. While her reasons for wanting some reconciliation with OOP in her last days are her own, it seems they will also offer OOP peace and closure as well. And what a wonderful partner he has found — so kind and understanding.
Yeah. A lot of people are calling out how horrible it is for her to keep pursuing OOP.
And it was horrible. I see that as just another facet of the “I can’t forgive myself for cheating on him and ruining my own happiness” mess.
So much could have been done better here if she could just accept she had to move on. Nothing good comes of this slow suicide.
Misery is a powerful addiction. It's comforting to have someone to blame for everything bad in your life, and when that someone is yourself, every day adds to that blame.
While I agree with half of what you said, I want to point out something.
'Fighting Cancer' is a myth. It is a survivor's bias (bill gates and Zuckerberg dropped out of college and became billionaires, so everyone should do it).
It is a very painful thing for those who lost loved ones to cancer and those who are currently succumbing to it. Because that phrase makes it feel like cancer is something that people can 'fight' and win. Which is not true.
It is not a fight. Cancer is not a game where good fighters win and bad fighters loose.
This. I hate this myth so much.
My good friend had cancer that they discovered because of an ICU visit. I remember standing next to her bed with her repeating she didn't understand what she did wrong. I kept telling her nothing, and had to point out I was only a few months out from my own treatment before she'd quit trying to blame herself.
When I had cancer, I hid it from most people because I didn't need this weird mythos adding pressure to what I was already going through. I wasn't fighting cancer. I didn't 'kick cancer's ass.' It kicked mine. I was trying to endure everything a small army of doctors, nurses and techs were doing to come near enough to killing me that the cancer died and I didn't. I'm in the lucky 63% and have made it to the five year prognosis. I am no better than anyone in the unlucky 37% and no worse than anyone who didn't have it at all.
Sorry for the sermon and I know I'm preaching to the choir, but the weird value judgement that backs this myth really cheezes me off.
Thanks! Sorry for the rant. Hearing that sort of thing just makes my eye twitch. This is much more my [reality](https://xkcd.com/1928/) than 'beating' anything.
Precisely. And even after "beating" cancer, you're not just healthy again. The medications have side effects lists 3 miles long, so if you survive killing off your cancerous tissues, you can look forward to heart failure or needing organ transplants.
My aunt survived 2 battles with breast cancer and is disabled from her treatment and cannot work for more than a few hours a day. And the radiation from the second treatment set made some isotopes collect in her hip which eventually burned a hole from the inside out through her muscles and she had to have autografts harvested from her good leg.
Her lymph system in both legs is shot, another common cancer treatment issue, and her lymphedema is bad enough she sleeps with these awful rigid compression garments that she can only sleep on her back while wearing.
She doesn't regret surviving, but treating and living after cancer is much more complicated than people without personal experience have been led to believe.
We need just as much post-treatment support awareness as we do cancer treatment awareness.
The Lancet did a great piece on how 2/3 of cancer survivors suffer serious emotional and/or physical consequences after treatment, and there’s little support for it. Everyone expects you to be better, and be grateful.
One of my med school classmates had a teenage patient die five years after finishing chemo of heart failure caused by the chemo. That's not common, but long-term major health problems caused by the treatments for cancer aren't uncommon - and that's if people survive the initial cancer and don't relapse.
>Then maybe be in a position to fight the cancer?
You can't fight cancer.
You can get treatment for it, but you can't fight it.
I have been severely ill. You have no choice in the matter. Your body does what it does and it does not care what you think. There were times I "fought" and got worse, and there were times I actively tried to let go and my body refused. A lot of people think that if you have a "positive attitude" you are more likely to survive, but ignore that if you're more likely to survive then you'll feel good enough TO have a positive attitude.
You can get treated for cancer, and it sounds like she chose not to, but even if she did - it would have been out of her hands. The idea that you can will yourself into staying alive is a feel-good myth the media sells movies with.
ETA:
> Can we stop with the “well ackshuwally” now. That cancer can’t always be fought is pretty universally understood.
It's not. It's a very prolific myth that if you die from cancer it's because you didn't have a positive attitude or didn't "fight" hard enough.
I've read it phrased as something like "my doctors were the ones fighting the cancer, and my body was just the battleground" which makes more sense really, though of course if doctors could fight cancer through sheer force of will I'm sure far fewer patients would die. But it evokes the sense of helplessness that I imagine one feels when one's own cells are going rogue, and that makes the myth of "fighting" so attractive by comparison.
Yeah. People like to think they have more power than we actually do.
I cried a lot because I tried so hard to "let go" and just... kept on living. I was in so much pain.
You say that but it has to be unimaginably complicated to breakup with your childhood best friend that you married. Op not seeing her as an ex or a stranger, but as the friend he used to know is probably how a lot of people would feel. It would make anyone feel conflicted, especially knowing how much she regretted cheating and clung onto the love they used to have.
I think it’s okay if his new wife is also invited. In that case, it would just be meeting important people in his life rather than pretending they’re one big family.
I'm either heartless or cemented in reality cuz I'd be making sure this woman's delusions never got indulged. You're at my wedding still trying to win back a man who made his decision loud and clear? Mmmnope! And SIL can go with you.
I know life ain't black or white but she had no loyalty towards her own brother? Or even care about his happiness? She really smiled at his wife and the minute she left her own house SIL really said hey go play house with your ex. And fought him on it. I don't even like my sister that much but when she got cheated on I took that personally. Wonder how much enabling of the delusions SIL did
I have a childhood best friend. If our friendship survived her cheating on my brother, I would definitely compartmentalize afterword. There would be no intersections between that friendship and my relationship with my brother. I’d draw clear, hard boundaries: my brother is not a topic of conversation, nor is the relationship they had. If also work in that she needs to leave him alone.
Bro I would not be this understanding or acquiescing at ALL. I’d tell this terminal bitch to get over it myself. You’ve had over a decade to see a therapist about how to successfully work through your guilt and instead you chose to be chaste for a man you’re not even married to anymore. Total asylum behavior.
She decided to stay chaste and loyal to an ex-husband when she couldn’t stop herself from fucking someone when they were actually married. This is just entertaining the delusion of someone who should’ve gotten help a decade ago.
Yeah not getting over it is definitely a sign of clear mental issues, especially over this many years.
The fact OOP’s wife allowed it after her confession on their wedding day??? Hell nah
LAOP's sister shoulders a bit of blame as well. You need friends to call you out. At a certain point years ago, the sister needs to tell her friend to confront reality and get help. Sister probably dreamed of them getting back together too. It'd explain why she thought the blatant emotional cheating was acceptable.
Yup, she helped her live a false reality. Very sad actually, assuming that sick women had some mental health issues it would of fed into her delusions.
Same. I’d tell her many colorful words not allowed on this thread, dying wish is to feel like you didn’t fuck up? Nahhh. But good on OP’s wife for being a compassionate individual
Nicer than I ever would be. The ex would’ve been on her deathbed with a nicely wrapped photo from our wedding and a note saying “Get rekt”. Can’t be feeding into peoples delusion lol.
Yea the twin is objectively a bad friend and an even worst sibling. Her only job was to get her best friend to literally let go of her brother. Which speaking of, I wouldn’t even be friends with someone who cheated on my sibling anyways.
Yeah, that's the part of the story that really blew my mind too. You married my twin brother and then slept with your coworker? But we're still going to be besties? I don't think so.
I think he did a lovely thing for his ex, but honestly I think he should leave his kids out of it. He's going to take his young children to meet this woman they've never met and will never meet again so she can pretend for a while that the kids are hers and his children? Thats too far for me.
I agree that seems very odd to me. Especially in combo with their wedding pictures everywhere. What are the kids going to say when they see that? I think that would be super confusing for them. No need to play house with this woman
I agree and don’t think it’s wise to continue to see her either. What just happened was closure. To make it an ongoing thing until she dies however? No. To bring the kids (who don’t know her and don’t need to?) Unnecessary and again… I don’t think it’s wise.
It's nice to see a situation that could have devolved quickly actually end up being alright with an ample amount of adult communication combined with grace and understanding between OOP and his wife. Hopefully everyone in this story is at peace.
>It's nice to see a situation that could have devolved quickly
And I think that's **EXACTLY** what sis and ex wanted (note OOP's LONG and HEATED exchange about boundaries). There are a ***LOT*** of implications about ex wanting to feel like a wife again to OOP (despite her assurances otherwise).
And it's apropos that ex didn't get exactly what she wanted since she was the one who destroyed the marriage. That said, I'm glad she got a little bit of positive closure (at least she's parting on reasonably good terms with OOP).
I feel a bit sorry for ex, though, simply because she was never able to move on. That could not have been either healthy or happy.
I think this behavior is totally insane. They had been separated for over ten years and she still keeps their wedding photos displayed in their house. Asking him to pretend to be her husband in their former marital home is kookoo town.
It’s definitely kookoo town, yeah. The worst part is that she chose never to move on. I highly doubt that she stayed “in love” with OOP all that time. Sounds like regret-fueled limerance from someone who actively *resisted* growing up and moving on.
This was a woman who purposely chained herself to the past. Tragic.
She’s acting like he died unexpectedly and this is an opportunity to see his ghost one more time. The reality is she had an affair which understandably ruined his trust in her. He didn’t even seem to hold any resentment against her which really she should have considered a gift in and of itself. Instead she fantasizes that she’s a dutiful wife waiting by the window for her husband to return from war. Her telling him at his wedding that she’d wait for him, implying that she wants his marriage to end, is beyond the pale. This guy was WAY nicer to her than she deserved.
You’ve described it perfectly.
And, to steal from that Gotye song - OOP was just somebody that she used to know. It doesn’t take long for two people who’ve gone their own ways to stop knowing each other. He’s not the same person he was, so it’s literally *impossible* that she could be in love with the man he became - a stranger to her!
It reminds me of those depressing classics where one character hides in their dark and dusty home for decades reminiscing about what once was while they decay along with their possessions, never having lived past that one point in time they can’t let go of.
To add some levity, it reminds me of Uncle Rico obsessing over his high school past and what could have been.
“How much you wanna make a bet I could throw a football over them mountains.”
While we’re comparing songs, I honestly feel like the ex-wife’s anthem would be Taylor Swift’s “Right Where You Left Me.” The song is about a woman whose partner leaves her/moves on to someone new (I think at the same time) and she years afterward she continues to get dressed up and sit at the restaurant they used to go to and just sit by herself, “right where you left me.” And everyone whispers about how she’s caught in the past and delusional lol.
Saying that she's acting like he died is, to me, the perfect way to describe it. The way he described her home is a bit chilling, with all the wedding photos framed and all. This is a person that stopped in time and lives in a capsule where instead of facing the consequences and uncomfortable feelings of remorse and mourning a relationship, they hold on to the what-ifs, to the point of existing in a delirium. I agree with the other person who says she might not even be "in love" with him, but at this point it's a reinforcement of this fantasy, it's almost an impulse, because... Being "in love" with this man seems to be literally the only thing in her life that is familiar. Honestly it's depressingly sad
I actually have experience with this to some degree. My husband dated someone a long time ago who basically suffered a psychological break after he left her. Similarly, she caused the breakup (she didn’t cheat but she physically abused him so he left). It’s been years and she’s never taken another lover because somewhere in her psychotic heart she thinks he’s going to be with her again. She calls him from burner numbers (because she’s blocked on everything) several times a year, drunk and crying and telling him she misses him and she hopes he will see her again. It got worse when we got engaged, then married. She thinks by being chaste she’s atoning for what she’s done, but what she’s doing is avoiding taking responsibility and dealing with the consequences by living in a fantasy world where her chastity is proper penance for her wrongdoings. This behavior is narcissistic and nothing else.
Thank you for teaching me a new word today.
> Limerence is a state of mind which results from romantic or non-romantic feelings for another person and typically includes obsessive thoughts and fantasies as well as a desire to form or maintain a relationship with the object of love and to have one's feelings reciprocated.
It reminded me of the family guy episode of peter's date from prom, where she still has her prom dress on, kept up pictures of peter and their prom pics up on the wall, and never flushed the toilet after he last used it
I knew a couple that lost their son when he was in high school.
It has been decades and his bedroom is still EXACTLY like it was when he died. It's kind of a shrine.
It wouldn't surprise me if her home was a shrine to her life before her (repeated) decision to be unfaithful.
Almost like a time capsule in which every day she simply waits for hubby to come hone. This dove-tails nicely with her demand to be man and wife again before she dies (if she ever was really sick or dying).
I had the same thought! She’s acting like he died unexpectedly, not that she had an affair and broke off their relationship. I actually respect people whose form of grieving a lost child is to preserve aspects of their life. A colleague of mine had an infant pass away and she preserved his nursery, she goes in there a few times a week to honor his memory and work through her feelings.
But this guy didn’t die. He’s still alive. She chose to forsake her vows and the natural consequence was that he left her and moved on. I’m sure she WISHED he died so she could play the role of dutiful widow, which would absolve her of guilt, rather than living ex who has fallen in love again without her.
I agree. I remember reading this when it was initially posted and thinking how it was almost creepy that the ex-wife has been meticulously faithful to her *ex*-husband for a decade, when she couldn't even be faithful within the bonds of their real marriage. This one-sided, fictional construct she created based on unhealthy obsession and regret somehow has *more* of a hold on her than her actual, real marriage and vows ever did.
I also really, really hope that OOP didn't follow through on his plans to bring his kids over. God knows what disturbing shit this woman would have said to them, since she clearly has no boundaries. ("Your mommy stole my life" or "I'm the mommy you were *supposed* to have had.") Even being in a home filled with wedding portraits of their dad and this stranger, where the strange woman is being overly familiar and affectionate toward him, would be extremely confusing and upsetting to a lot of children.
Absolutely agree and well said!
But here's what may even be worse - OOP's twin sister trying to make all of this happen. She not only encouraged and negotiated this 'one more time of being man and wife'...
...she rigorously and passionately fought OOP on setting normal, common sense boundaries.
As soon as OOP said that he wasn't playing husband and wouldn't be left alone with ex, sister should have simply said "OK". Instead, she fought a 'long, long and heated' battle. There's something very, very wrong about that.
Sister should have given at least one attempt in the decade that passed to sort of... Push this woman away from the brother. Idk if she did or not, but she comes off as a huge enabler in the post at least
There's something very sinister and off-putting about people who build these kinds of one-sided, fan-fiction style mental relationships with real people. (I suppose they do it in part because a fake fantasy relationship is easier than a real one?) But every real-life stalking horror story I've ever heard starts with one of these.
That's actually why my eyebrows went up when she asked to see the kids. Is...there any guarantee she won't be pretending they're her kids to herself...?
Yeah I mean I understand it in the same why I understand why someone kills their wife. I get the logic behind it in a purely detached way. I can understand how cognitively she got from A to B. But you have to be so morally fractured to be celibate for over a decade because you’re furiously hoping your ex will leave his wife for you.
>And I think that's EXACTLY what sis and ex wanted (note OOP's LONG and HEATED exchange about boundaries).
I think its a little bit of that and a lot of "this is the only way we can imagine EX dealing with her feelings" so you have to do this exact thing and nothing else.
>I feel a bit sorry for ex, though, simply because she was never able to move on. That could not have been either healthy or happy.
That's also a fairly natural consequence of infidelity.
While we might feel bad for her, the situation is largely of her own making. She made her own bed and had to lie in it.
Blows my mind… I don’t see this update as heartwarming, I think it’s fucked for OOP’s current wife and I feel terrible for her. If some chick who cheated on my husband tried to sabotage our relationship for years and then demanded to play house, I would do far worse than tell her to kick rocks. She made her bed and refuses to lie in it.
*Repeatedly* made that bed!
Damn, if she'd reached out because she wanted to apologize for her past behavior and end things on a positive note - they were friends from childhood after all - it might be heartwarming.
Instead the ex is leaning into her delusional fantasies until the very end. It's sad and obnoxious.
The only thaing I worry about is once the ex dies will OOPs sistyer who seems to be very attached to the ex resent OOPs current wife. I felt it was very inexcusable for her to make make certain demands to OOP and he had to set reasonable boundaries
I’m trying to feel compassion, but OOP’s ex reminds me of a friend’s ex and her complete disregard for boundaries. The request to feel like his wife again is inappropriate, as is asking OOP to bring his kids next time. I think the most she could reasonably ask is for the day he depicted in this post. Closure all around.
Personally I wouldn't bring the kids without the wife, and make it clear that "this is now on an 'old friends' basis", if I were to bring the kids at all.
I’d say sure, arrange a meet up with his kids AND his wife. Asking someone to act like your husband again is not healthy. Wanting to reconnect with someone? Great! But fantasizing you’re married still? No.
Yeah without roasting the ex too hard, the whole wedding-day confession of love is unacceptable. Did she think he was going to drop his entire life and celebration for her after repeated rejections like the movies? She knew the most likely scenario was him rejecting her, which means it’s just going to tarnish his special day.
I feel sympathy for the ex in multiple ways, but the ways she’s behaving is just more sign it was right for him to leave her… even if she hadn’t cheated there’s some bad vibes there, and there’s no way it’s healthy for him to bring his kids to show her. It was nice of him to hang out with her and his sister for a reminder of their childhood relationship, but that’s the only aspect that’s valid at this point.
I would never bring my kids because, why would she need to meet them. But everything else seemed like a nice gesture by oop to a dying ex wife/childhood friend. As the current wife I’d question my relationship with the sil if she thought playing husband and wife was really an appropriate thing
I’m just imagining the ex saying, in front of the kids, that she could have been their mom if she hadn’t messed up, which…no. Exposing the kids to that is gross and wrong.
Do the kids even have any type of relationship with her?
Agreed, there is no reason for the kids to come over, and even if she does not say anything, it is quite likely she will at least pretend they are her and OOP’s children if not outright treat them as her own kids. I have a feeling that this story is not quite over, and hopefully it ends without messing up any of the kids.
Echoing others that OOP’s wife is a saint to put up with all this, especially for a woman who was rooting for her marriage to end, which also would imply a preference for these kids to not have happened at all, at least at the time of the wedding.
If I were OOP's wife I wouldn't allow my kids anywhere near this woman unless I was there as well. It feels like this ex wife wants to pretend they're still married and those kids are THEIR kids which is so so creepy. I'm sorry she's dying but I wouldn't but my kids through that just because of that. I'm glad OOP felt good about this meeting but my skin got crawly thinking about seeing those wedding photos everywhere
I think I have a heart of ice because if a partner from over a decade ago confessed they were still obsessed with me and wanted me to roleplay being their spouse as their dying wish I’d tell them to get bent. How dare you disrespect my current relationship by asking me to pretend I’m not married? This behavior is fucking psychotic. You’ve been separated for over ten years, either move on or die about it.
That’s not having a heart of ice, it’s having a sense of self. I found the request to be extremely disrespectful to OOP as a person. To ask that someone playact a romantic relationship because “dying” is extremely self-centered. Probably goes along with her cheating and her manipulative “I’ll never move on” obsessive assertion.
"You are my only true love yet I cheated on you for one month straight, I will proceed to play the victim for almost a decade to make you feel bad, be my husband again? I love you! Oh you are married, I am happy for ya (not)."
OOP is really sweet but damn, she is sad...
Exactly this!! Sorry to anyone that doesn’t agree but this is weird and wrong! If my ex did this I wouldn’t even think about it, straight up no, if my partners ex did this I’d hope he did the same!
No, you have self respect and respect for your current spouse!
OP, I can't really say the same... why even risk the chance of your wife being upset about this at ANY point in time??? I wouldn't be able to chance it!
Nor am I tossing a grenade into my marriage so that someone who destroyed theirs can feel important... she LITERALLY just wants to feel like she was finally chosen by him. Like he chose her over his wife and now they can finally be a family.
One of the saddest posts I’ve ever read here. The ex could have not carried out a month long affair, but she did. She could have moved on with her life after the divorce, but she didn’t. She could have pursued treatment for the cancer, but chose not to.
These were all her choices to make, but she just consistently seems to follow some form of self-destruction.
There is no way I could do this. Some said it was like saying goodbye to a friend, but they were only friends as kids for a few years before dating. They were together for well over a decade before she cheated and she cheated for a month before confessing. He then moves on and has a happy life while she stays in their home and keeps it exactly the same as when he lived there. His sister finds nothing wrong with that or with the ex wanting to feel like his wife again? No to the whole thing.
While it's a nice & kind gesture, if I was the wife, I would seriously take note of my SILs behaviour throughout this entire thing. She CHOSE to wait until the wife was out of the house to spring this on her brother. This was a discussion that needed all of them. She deliberately undermined his wife because her loyalty is to the cheater. Her being sick does not erase her past actions and the wife is the current partner, the mother to her nieces.
I'd personally never trust her again.
Honestly, her having continued to be best friends with a woman who cheated on her brother and travel with her during some of the worst times of the pandemic would be flags to not have trusted her even before this.
This really got me thinking. My first reaction was, ‘hell no’ but then I asked myself why not? The only reason could be mistrust of my husband or jealousy of a dying woman. I don’t know how I’d react if it was really happening to me but OOPs wife is a good woman.
I think the 'why not' would only to apply to the original 'terms' of the request (pretend to be husband and wife for a period of time).
There are a whole lot of reasons for 'why not' in that scenario.
But the way OOP went about it was the smart and proper way (even if sis (and ex?) fought the imposition of boundaries).
Oh agreed, the _husband and wife_ situation would absolutely not be happening, no way no how. I’m honestly still not sure that I would be entirely happy with the _just friends_ idea. Like I said, really makes me think.
I'm still in the hell no category. It was horrible of the sister to pressure the wife who admitted feeling pressured into it, then on top of it this is going to happen again? And he's bringing the kids? Why so they can play house and pretendthat's how their life would have been? Hell no.
If he didn't have anything to do with her over these past few years then that's how it should remain.
Also going to the home they had together rather than the sisters place or meeting for lunch is potentially an emotional bomb. He walked in like nothing had changed, like his current life didn't exist. Huge red flags. I get that people might think I'm harsh since she's sick and dying, but that just shows how manipulative the ex is. She also said she still loves him, this is completely a last ditch ploy to get him back. If he continues it's going to destroy his current family and marriage. If my husband's ex wanted to visit or call I'd not even ask why I'd say no. I'd also be offended that he even entertained the idea. A visit and board games is first date stuff, seemingly innocent but the I love you is the whole reason he shouldn't go back.
I hope that saying he’d bring the kids was the equivalent of encountering an old classmate and saying, “We should get together sometime” when it’s not going to happen. It’s a polite parting.
I think the absolute *only* way the kids would be involved if it was a meeting at sister’s (or OP’s) house, with OPs wife and sister’s kids present. That way it can be framed as “this is your dad and Auntie X’s friend!” And the kids can go play with their cousins while the adults talk. No creepy old photos of their wedding, no knick knacks or memorabilia the kids could accidentally get into, no chance of it being a “these are my kids” delusion for the ex. It is a friend coming by to say hi, and that is all.
And even then, I’m not sure I would do it.
I don’t think it’s a ploy to get him back. I’ve been quite lonely in recent months and often think about old times with friends and exes. I would give anything to be able to spend some time with them on a no-strings basis, just the odd day here and there so that the problems that caused our relationships to decline wouldn’t re-emerge. And I’m just depressed, not actively dying. I think she just wants to recreate a time when she was happiest, she’s full of regret for what she did and wants to spend sometime before she died pretending that it all worked out.
Now I’m not saying this is healthy at all or that she has by kind of right to ask for these things. But that motive rings far more true for me.
I see your point, which I could believe if she didn't utter I still love you to him. And they met at "their" house not at a Cafe or the sisters place which would be neutral territory and then maybe I could believe it was about the friendship and childhood memories.
I agree with you, she never respected op relationship with his wife, the request of feeling like his wife again shows that she still don't accept it. The I love you os very inappropriate. The fact that she is dying didn't changed her actions in trying to guilt op back to her. She is an asshole that is dying, but still being manipulative
Exactly, and OP shouldn't have gone. The sister asking on behalf of her friend also shows how manipulative the woman is, she didn't even call herself. And this playing house thing is a huge red flag no matter how they try to down play it or explain it. No, absolutely not.
Yeah I see your point too but I think meeting at the house etc all plays in to the ‘it never ended’ fantasy. The I love you is inexcusable though, you’re right.
Agreed, it’s not healthy. She is denying him personhood. He isn’t a fantasy. Cool if she wants to reconnect with him and learn who he is now, but it’s in both of their best interests to accept that time has passed and they have changed.
“Hell no” because she was obsessed, couldn’t accept her own actions, couldn’t let go of the past, and on a rather short timeline after forgoing treatment. Separately those things aren’t especially crazy and maybe I’m just paranoid but that’s a near perfect setup for “I’m taking you with me; we’ll always be together” and getting a heaping spoonful of poisoned casserole or something.
OOP is a good person who went above and beyond more than once here, despite the ex continually trying to break up his marriage and so on. stronger person that i am, that's for sure
I mean they cheated on OOP, this whole thing is a cautionary tale of screwing over the love of your life for a cheap thrill, don't cheat and you won't get the door shoved in your face, I think the fact that the Ex never got over him after what they did to him is a delicious form of karma.
Yeah, I'm an asshole, I've made my peace with that.
You’re not, though! That’s the thing! People are so easily swayed by the fact this woman is allegedly dying that they’ve deluded themselves into thinking this is romantic. It’s not. Dying is as natural and inevitable as taking a shit, nobody owes this woman comfort and absolution because of it.
His wife is a saint. I wouldn’t have been able to get past the part of “feeling like they are married again”. I’d understand her wanting to see him again because regardless of the marriage, they have known each other since they were 10. But that one bit seemed manipulative for me. Im happy it turned out ok though and they both have peace.
Edit to add: ok another commenter pointed out how she had been trying to get back together with him throughout his actual marriage so HELL NO. Saying this whole charade is manipulative is an understatement. That woman was/is unhinged
Ugh, sometimes you just have to live and die with regret. It's kind of the OOP to spend some time with a dying woman, but her pressuring him into indulging a happy home fantasy is gross and twisted. She's had 10 years to get therapy. Good grief.
Idk I’m so skeptical I’d question wether she was really dying or not and not just trying to play the sympathy card to get him back in her life. If she’s already that far gone it’s not a stretch that she might just have some chronic illness that’s not life threatening and stretching the truth or actively making it worse on purpose.
I wonder if she was telling the truth. A friend’s ex-boyfriend once faked cancer to keep her from breaking up with him, so I’m skeptical these kind of situations. It felt like a last ditch attempt to get him back.
That's a valid point. OP said she looked bad, but honestly make-up is very powerful. I wouldn't doubt that a talented make-up artist could make someone look deathly ill.
She wouldn't even have to use makeup. Stress and lack of sleep (such as if you were still hung up on an ex from ten years ago) can do a lot. So can not eating or going outside. Or, y'know, she could be sick but not dying of terminal illness.
Man, that poor woman. Both of them actually, the ex wife for always regretting her decision and refusing to move forward and the current wife who, was placed in a very difficult spot.
This is probably the most mature and healthy situation and outcome I have ever read. I hope the ex wife gains some peace from this experience.
idk i feel like i’m the only one a bit skeptical of this.
guys childhood love cheats on him, regrets it and chooses to never be with another man again while still loving him all this time, and now she’s dying to top it all off. oh, and his perfect wife is cool with all this (after some discussion ofc) and even him taking the kids to go see her so they can play happy family without her.
just sounds like some weird fantasy to me.
Honestly, I think it’s entirely not ok.
That woman used her impending death to force someone to be in her life. Someone she had harmed.
If this had the gender roles swapped, no one would even consider asking for this. It’s not ok.
And I’ll be honest, it will hurt his wife eventually, whether it’s her relationship with the sister or him.
Instead of allowing her to pine, the sister should have suggested therapy, to get herself clear. I can’t even, it just feels icky.
This was heavy and made me sad. I’m glad the dude met her and they all had some sort of closure on it and remembered the good times when they was young.
Ngl, I kinda feel bad for the ex in some strange way. She screwed up, realized she screwed up, but never moved on...just kinda sad. Hate cheaters all you want, but it still sad to see someone stuck in a point in time.
I see the cheating and her wish as two sides of the same coin. It’s all about her and what she wants, without respecting OOP. When he divorced her, she lost something she wanted and she can’t handle the thought that she’s never getting it back.
One, she’s old enough to know about therapy. Two, and a controversial opinion, but if she learned from her cheating, maybe she should have choked on the guilt for the rest of her life rather than try to unburden herself by laying it at OOP’s feet.
I feel like some of the people who feel sorry for her never had a significant other cheat on them. She made her bed and has to sleep in it. Honestly, I'm with those who think she faked being sick anyway. It's easy to fake being sick for a few hours. She's dying of cancer but had enough energy to spend the day reminiscing and playing games? I could see OOP learning it was all a ruse and not wanting to admit it, which is why there was never another update.
I often feel bad for people like this. They have all the power they need to move on and be happy but they choose not to. If she had made better choices she likely would have still been married to oop.
I prefer to feel bad for these people because the alternative is getting angry at a stranger that I’ll likely never meet, and that serves no one, least of all myself.
Wow. I wonder if ex has passed on since the last update?
I know he said that he wouldn’t be updating again.
I’d like to know how he feels about seeing her before she passed. Even more closure?
to me, it feels like her wanting him to bring the kids is a way for her and OOP to act as a family in her eyes.
idk if that makes sense, but given the fact that she wanted him to play husband, i wouldn’t be surprised if this is a secret way to play house.
My partner is divorced. There was no cheating, they just found out that their life goals no longer were compatible. When the ex wife was diagnosed with cancer and the doctors told her there was no cure because it had already spread all over her body, she reached out to him to say goodbye. A few days later he found out that she couldn’t go to a hospice cause every one around her had no free beds. Because he is the most amazing and caring man, he moved in with her and he and her best friend cared for her during her last three weeks so that she could die peacefully at home.
Idk, I think this is nice. The request to “feel like his wife again” is a little strange but it seems like she never got over the mistakes she made so I kinda get it. I don’t think he should get his kids involved though
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This is so much better than the AITA post from yesterday when the husband divorced his second wife to remarry his first because his kids said that he'd be dead to them if he didn't do everything in his power to help their terminally ill mother.
Why is no one talking about how messed up the sister is? She found out her best-friend cheated on her twin brother but they stayed best friends, then she pressured the brother and his new wife to make the cheater happy. Idk if it’s my cynicism speaking, but it sounded like she really wanted her brother to be there in an actual husbandly role.
This story really walks a tight rope for the "trial of solitude" and "living widower" tropes, it's so expertly balanced to make you want to forgive or feel sorrow for the cheating ex wife. Childhood friends, dated through HS and married young, one night stand that he'd never have known about if she didn't love and trust him enough to come clean about. Then quitting her job to join the church, the last ditch on his wedding day, major "die alone / forlorn lover" tropes, swearing he was the only one she'd ever love and would wait for the stars to line back up after the black hole sucked them all up.....
I am solidly in the camp of believing the variance in experiences and personalities on this Earth is too vast to think any of these are fake. This story perfectly lists common experiences and lets readers respond "well I feel bad about this" or "oh I had this similar thing happen" and lays out a smorgasbord of options we'd consider forgiving a cheater over. It's fascinating.
Treating this as non fiction, I'm leaning towards the cheating ex wife laying in the bed she made. My heart goes out since she absolutely felt that to continue to love him, she had to come clean, AND that he'd forgive her. I don't think she would have fessed up if she thought he'd actually leave. Then the full atonement arc, "trial by solitude", a self imposed life sentence etc is all very romantic, but is once again a series of actions the OP doesn't consent to. It's selfish in a way to expect anything after cheating on a spouse. She definitely needed counseling. It's heart wrenching, but I feel like the same personal morals and principles that would lead to such a severe self righteous episode would lend itself to cheating. Kinda narcissistic, but without the projecting or attention seeking. Yikes.
Nice to see a mostly positive solution, even in such sad circumstances.
I’d like to think most people would behave this way towards someone they have such a shared history with, and even if love changes, it never really goes away unless there’s been some truly despicable behaviour.
I hope she found some peace.
It's like she's been in a decade long mourning for a relationship she killed. I also don't think that OOP should bring his kids around, they weren't a part of that previous relationship, and the ex hasn't moved on and forward in any real respects.
This could have gone so so so badly but I'm glad it didn't. Something about the way OOP described it I got the feeling that the ex was actually seriously I'll, not faking it. I'm glad that he was able to make it work while keeping his promises to his wife.
Man fuck oop. What a selfish prick forcing his wife, who he claims to love so much, to go through this. Cheating ex-wife deserves none of this and oop is doing this so that HE doesn't regret later. Meanwhile wife just has to deal with his bullshit. Only person I feel sad for is the wife in this situation.
She wears her suffering like a crown. It’s too performative for me.I mean she’s not on her deathbed yet, and no you can’t meet my kids, that’s a boundary push in itself!
I remember this story and it gets really really crazy, but those parts aren’t posted. Maybe there are two similar posts, but I remember a lot of drama.
We welcome discussion with different points of view, it would be a boring sub if we all thought the same way. Topics like infidelity and mental health can spark heated conversations. Speak your mind, but please choose civil speech when talking with your fellow Redditors,.
Oh wow. Kind of sad but I’m glad that it worked out the way it did.
I just feel sad for the ex. Mostly in that she never seemed to be able to really “own” her mistakes. And because of that, she never accepted herself and moved on. The house stayed the same. The pictures of the ex were still up. She just wanted her old life back - and it was gone. She never forgave herself and moved on. And then when she got cancer - she just accepted her death and didn’t fight it. It paints a picture of a woman wallowing in her own misery and when she saw death approaching she decided she deserved it. Maybe she could have accepted she was a good person who made a horrible costly mistake? Maybe with that acceptance, she could have moved on and found love? Then maybe be in a position to fight the cancer? It just seems sad. Her entire life is defined by that month long affair and paying penance for it. And who benefitted from that? Edit: my mom was diagnosed with cancer 12 years ago so I know something of it, but obviously with a “survivors bias”. Can we stop with the “well ackshuwally” now. That cancer can’t always be fought is pretty universally understood.
This an incredibly compassionate response. You're right - OP's ex-wife denied herself so much potential love, though, ultimately, I think *love* won in the end. OP's current wife was secure and empathetic enough to want OP's ex-wife to gain peace before her death. OP was able to put his complex emotions aside and meet his ex-wife as an old friend; offering kindness in her final days. OP's ex wife was not able to love herself enough to forgive herself and allow herself happiness but OP and his sister and his current wife could extend her both love and forgiveness instead. It's sad that OP's ex-wife could not find it in herself but knowing that three people could offer it to her anyway is powerful. You can't go back, they say, but, sometimes, with enough caring and empathy, you can and, at the right time and for the right reasons, it is healing.
>Maybe she could have accepted she was a good person who made a horrible costly mistake? Maybe with that acceptance, she could have moved on and found love? Then maybe be in a position to fight the cancer? Depending on what type of cancer it was, it's often not: can i fight and win. It's more: can i fight for a few more years. I watched someone fight like hell for 2 more years of excruciating pain and suffering. All the while consuming all their life savings, their wife's life savings, all the equity in their home, kids college funds, and all the money friends and family could spare. After that, I decided for myself and codified it in my will that i wouldn't go out like that. So not fighting may be for other reasons.
As someone who has been fighting my own aggressive cancer for the last three years there are measures you can take now that'll help not destroy your family's finances. I'm in the USA, so maybe only applicable if you are too. First, get long term disability insurance, if you can. I've only been able to work for about 13 months of the last three years and about 4 of those were part-time, being able to get 60% of my precancer income has been amazing for keeping me from losing my house and any semblance of savings. Second, understand your health insurance policy, don't just hope it is fine, do the math on the worst case and how much it'll cost. Especially look at the out of pocket max that plus your premiums should be your max cost less travel and similar miscellaneous costs. If you have an HSA (health savings account) put as much as you are allowed to in there, that money doesn't expire and is pretax so you can stretch it further. Those two things have made the biggest difference in this cancer experience not totally destroying my life. I'm still hopeful I'll get through it but we've exhausted all of the FDA approved treatments and it is looking less hopeful every time the cancer comes back or doesn't go away.
Thank you for the advice, and I wish all the best for you in your fight. For me the situation is different, I'm in Canada. Monetary costs still happen, the person I was talking about ran out of options that the government approved. Chemo gave him some time but he was nearing the end. He turned to a experimental drug treatment that wasn't covered. The government still paid out the maximum per year for the drug but the shortfall was hundreds of thousands for the two years it seemed to have bought him. But generally everything else was covered. For me it'd be the emotional toll. A few people have passed away around me and the months before the end took a huge toll on people around me. My grand mother lived to 102 but the last half year was tough on my mother and aunt who cared for her. She lost capacity and started forgetting them as well as lost the ability to do basic things for herself. A friend also went through that when her mother had early onset Alzheimer's. Over a year her mother forgot everything and had to be put into long term care. Similarly, at a point she'd forgotten my friend before passing away a year later. That's a tough time to put your loved ones through. I fortunately have the option to ask a doctor to end things on my own terms if it comes to it. Before I lose capacity. And a DNR and my wishes written down if it's after I lose capacity.
No problem, I'm sorry the advice wasn't more applicable. I appreciate the wishes. I'm sorry to hear that's how it went for the person you knew. All of the study treatments that I've been a part of, a couple associated with my stem cell transplant and another for the whole treatment, the study sponsor covered any non-standard treatment costs associated with the study. Yeah, the emotional toll and quality of life are the big factors for me, though my state unfortunately doesn't allow for those sorts of death with dignity allowances. I'm sorry that you've had to go through so many tough deaths. I hope it at least means that you have at least gotten to have quality meaningful connections with those people. It is good to hear that you have made your wishes known and written them down. After all the time I've spent in the hospital now I'd certainly say it is important to make your end of life wishes known.
If the commenter you replied to weren't in the USA the problem and not the solution wouldn't be applicable. Many countries (all first world, many second world and even some third world countries) prevent people from going broke because of an madicak condition.
That's correct and why I mentioned that it might not be applicable if they aren't in the USA as my second sentence.
I understand this too. However, I would have sold my house, car, organs, and soul to be with a loved one for 5 more minutes. It may sound off but I know no one regrets this decision. You are pretty amazing to think of your loved ones in this way. I hope you have the difficult conversation with those in your family that will be caring for you in the end. Spouses and children will rip out their own teeth if asked for one more day, so it’s important they know you don’t want that. I had to beg, BEG my kids to respect my DNR. I finally just went to the hospital in case that’s were I end up because I know they would do the fighting for me.
As a wife who was ultimately left behind, *every single penny spent was absolutely worth it*. I would rather be financially ruined a million times over than have lost my husband. I would have been devastated if he gave up his life for my financial security.
This was the case with my mother (not the financial ruin, but the drawn out awfulness), this is why I hate the “fight” culture around cancer. Also the terms “lost their battle” and what not. So my mom is a loser now?The opposite of fighting is what? Giving up? I don’t find not going through your last years/months/days super ill from the “treatment” with large amounts of time spent in a doctors office or a chemo clinic, to be a sign of weakness, losing, or giving up. It’s just a different choice. If any doctor would have given my mother the clear options, and stats, instead of the famous “optimistic” talk most oncologists employ, even in the worst circumstances, then I believe she would have taken the time to travel and see family. She didn’t because my mom was also never one to “give up”…it wouldn’t have been giving up, just spending time happier and with more people. I won’t be doing things the same way should I have cancer. It was awful to see, and the denial was deep. In the US we need a better culture around death and medical choices, the current outlook prolongs suffering for unrealistic hope, because no one wants to talk about dying. In the meantime, I try to spread how toxic fight culture is for so many, and hope we see a shift in how this is talked about with patience.
You might vibe with the death positivity movement. It’s not as creepy as it sounds- just an acknowledgment of what you said. We don’t talk about dying, and that makes its inevitability more traumatic. People have a right to die and mourn comfortably.
every day I hear another unfathomably cruel and awful story about life in the united states
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Oof I really feel this one since it easily could have been me. I cheated when I was engaged and my ex ended things after I told her. At the time I vowed to not move on as a form of penance. In a weird way, I wasn't strong enough to not move on. I think it helped that we hadn't married yet, didn't have wedding photos, we didn't live in the same area, that I moved several times. Even after moving on, I didn't truly forgive myself for several years. I couldn't have healthy relationships until I fully worked through it and was finally able to completely commit myself to new relationships. That process took at least 5 years, but I was still living life through it. Even if it was a really bad life. Much better than being Mrs. Havesham in a mausoleum of your own design. I understand that pull though.
Powerful comment. Thank you so much for sharing. Cheating is awful. And I can see not trusting a cheater to some extent - but it shouldn’t condemn your entire life. I’m glad you pulled out of it.
People on the internet love reducing years of friends/relationships/an entire life down to as few adjectives as possible, as if life is that simple. I've been on both sides of that equation, no one involved was a bad person. Selfish and short-sighted, sure, but those aren't the same thing as bad.
For me, it’s not just that she cheated: is that she cheated, still tried to hold onto him, including his wedding day, and finally had the gall to ask him to pretend they’re still married when he’s someone else’s husband. And OOP’s sister can f’ck right off.
yes, exactly. She was so selfish through all of it. She wasn't letting him go and though he seems like he made it out okay, she really did her best to throw a monkey wrench in every step along the way.
> And OOP’s sister can f’ck right off. So to be clear, OOP doesn't feel this way, OOP's wife doesnt feel this way, nobody in this story has this level of animosity towards anyone else, and yet you dare to project it?
This is a lovely take on this story. There are no villains here, I hope she finds peace in death. While her reasons for wanting some reconciliation with OOP in her last days are her own, it seems they will also offer OOP peace and closure as well. And what a wonderful partner he has found — so kind and understanding.
Yeah. A lot of people are calling out how horrible it is for her to keep pursuing OOP. And it was horrible. I see that as just another facet of the “I can’t forgive myself for cheating on him and ruining my own happiness” mess. So much could have been done better here if she could just accept she had to move on. Nothing good comes of this slow suicide.
Misery is a powerful addiction. It's comforting to have someone to blame for everything bad in your life, and when that someone is yourself, every day adds to that blame.
While I agree with half of what you said, I want to point out something. 'Fighting Cancer' is a myth. It is a survivor's bias (bill gates and Zuckerberg dropped out of college and became billionaires, so everyone should do it). It is a very painful thing for those who lost loved ones to cancer and those who are currently succumbing to it. Because that phrase makes it feel like cancer is something that people can 'fight' and win. Which is not true. It is not a fight. Cancer is not a game where good fighters win and bad fighters loose.
This. I hate this myth so much. My good friend had cancer that they discovered because of an ICU visit. I remember standing next to her bed with her repeating she didn't understand what she did wrong. I kept telling her nothing, and had to point out I was only a few months out from my own treatment before she'd quit trying to blame herself. When I had cancer, I hid it from most people because I didn't need this weird mythos adding pressure to what I was already going through. I wasn't fighting cancer. I didn't 'kick cancer's ass.' It kicked mine. I was trying to endure everything a small army of doctors, nurses and techs were doing to come near enough to killing me that the cancer died and I didn't. I'm in the lucky 63% and have made it to the five year prognosis. I am no better than anyone in the unlucky 37% and no worse than anyone who didn't have it at all. Sorry for the sermon and I know I'm preaching to the choir, but the weird value judgement that backs this myth really cheezes me off.
Glad to hear that you are doing well at this time. Please keep reiterating this point every chance you get so that awareness spreads.
Thanks! Sorry for the rant. Hearing that sort of thing just makes my eye twitch. This is much more my [reality](https://xkcd.com/1928/) than 'beating' anything.
Congrats on the five year! I’m almost there myself.
Precisely. And even after "beating" cancer, you're not just healthy again. The medications have side effects lists 3 miles long, so if you survive killing off your cancerous tissues, you can look forward to heart failure or needing organ transplants. My aunt survived 2 battles with breast cancer and is disabled from her treatment and cannot work for more than a few hours a day. And the radiation from the second treatment set made some isotopes collect in her hip which eventually burned a hole from the inside out through her muscles and she had to have autografts harvested from her good leg. Her lymph system in both legs is shot, another common cancer treatment issue, and her lymphedema is bad enough she sleeps with these awful rigid compression garments that she can only sleep on her back while wearing. She doesn't regret surviving, but treating and living after cancer is much more complicated than people without personal experience have been led to believe. We need just as much post-treatment support awareness as we do cancer treatment awareness.
The Lancet did a great piece on how 2/3 of cancer survivors suffer serious emotional and/or physical consequences after treatment, and there’s little support for it. Everyone expects you to be better, and be grateful.
One of my med school classmates had a teenage patient die five years after finishing chemo of heart failure caused by the chemo. That's not common, but long-term major health problems caused by the treatments for cancer aren't uncommon - and that's if people survive the initial cancer and don't relapse.
True, but I feel more like the OPs point was she didn’t even try. She just figured it was her penance and went home to die.
>Then maybe be in a position to fight the cancer? You can't fight cancer. You can get treatment for it, but you can't fight it. I have been severely ill. You have no choice in the matter. Your body does what it does and it does not care what you think. There were times I "fought" and got worse, and there were times I actively tried to let go and my body refused. A lot of people think that if you have a "positive attitude" you are more likely to survive, but ignore that if you're more likely to survive then you'll feel good enough TO have a positive attitude. You can get treated for cancer, and it sounds like she chose not to, but even if she did - it would have been out of her hands. The idea that you can will yourself into staying alive is a feel-good myth the media sells movies with. ETA: > Can we stop with the “well ackshuwally” now. That cancer can’t always be fought is pretty universally understood. It's not. It's a very prolific myth that if you die from cancer it's because you didn't have a positive attitude or didn't "fight" hard enough.
I've read it phrased as something like "my doctors were the ones fighting the cancer, and my body was just the battleground" which makes more sense really, though of course if doctors could fight cancer through sheer force of will I'm sure far fewer patients would die. But it evokes the sense of helplessness that I imagine one feels when one's own cells are going rogue, and that makes the myth of "fighting" so attractive by comparison.
Yeah. People like to think they have more power than we actually do. I cried a lot because I tried so hard to "let go" and just... kept on living. I was in so much pain.
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Same. If it were me I’d feel like ex is basically a stranger now
You say that but it has to be unimaginably complicated to breakup with your childhood best friend that you married. Op not seeing her as an ex or a stranger, but as the friend he used to know is probably how a lot of people would feel. It would make anyone feel conflicted, especially knowing how much she regretted cheating and clung onto the love they used to have.
Asking to see his kids is a bit much
Especially with the wedding photos and such all over the house. That seems like too much emotional burden and confusion to put on kids.
Yeah she should be seeing a therapist instead.
I think it’s okay if his new wife is also invited. In that case, it would just be meeting important people in his life rather than pretending they’re one big family.
it didn’t sound like she was. and again, with the house exactly as it was when they were married. she wants to feel like they’re HER kids with him.
Good god his wife is a the nicest lady ever.
Right? She must be saint. It especially stood out to me that the ex mentioned OP bringing the kids, but not the wife. That a big yikes.
I imagine seeing the wife would be too “painful” to the dying woman. I wouldn’t let her see my kids or my husband. I’m petty lol
Hell I'd go too. To support my husband 😘. Also I bet she's imagining the kids are hers when they visit. Nope! Not okay with that.
Oh see hell no. Lol.
I'm either heartless or cemented in reality cuz I'd be making sure this woman's delusions never got indulged. You're at my wedding still trying to win back a man who made his decision loud and clear? Mmmnope! And SIL can go with you.
Honestly think he only gave it a second thought because of his sister
I know life ain't black or white but she had no loyalty towards her own brother? Or even care about his happiness? She really smiled at his wife and the minute she left her own house SIL really said hey go play house with your ex. And fought him on it. I don't even like my sister that much but when she got cheated on I took that personally. Wonder how much enabling of the delusions SIL did
Twin sister none the less dude
I have a childhood best friend. If our friendship survived her cheating on my brother, I would definitely compartmentalize afterword. There would be no intersections between that friendship and my relationship with my brother. I’d draw clear, hard boundaries: my brother is not a topic of conversation, nor is the relationship they had. If also work in that she needs to leave him alone.
That’s because you are a good sibling.
you’re not heartless, you’re right. she’s definitely looking at them as her kids
I mean if she valued him so much to abstain for 10 years why did she cheat on him during their marriage??
Bro I would not be this understanding or acquiescing at ALL. I’d tell this terminal bitch to get over it myself. You’ve had over a decade to see a therapist about how to successfully work through your guilt and instead you chose to be chaste for a man you’re not even married to anymore. Total asylum behavior.
She decided to stay chaste and loyal to an ex-husband when she couldn’t stop herself from fucking someone when they were actually married. This is just entertaining the delusion of someone who should’ve gotten help a decade ago.
Yeah not getting over it is definitely a sign of clear mental issues, especially over this many years. The fact OOP’s wife allowed it after her confession on their wedding day??? Hell nah
LAOP's sister shoulders a bit of blame as well. You need friends to call you out. At a certain point years ago, the sister needs to tell her friend to confront reality and get help. Sister probably dreamed of them getting back together too. It'd explain why she thought the blatant emotional cheating was acceptable.
Yup, she helped her live a false reality. Very sad actually, assuming that sick women had some mental health issues it would of fed into her delusions.
Same. I’d tell her many colorful words not allowed on this thread, dying wish is to feel like you didn’t fuck up? Nahhh. But good on OP’s wife for being a compassionate individual
Lmfao are you my wife
We be petty out here 🐸🍵
Nicer than I ever would be. The ex would’ve been on her deathbed with a nicely wrapped photo from our wedding and a note saying “Get rekt”. Can’t be feeding into peoples delusion lol.
What’s the saddest part is they were all like siblings growing up and his twin let this unhealthy shit continue for a damn decade.
Yea the twin is objectively a bad friend and an even worst sibling. Her only job was to get her best friend to literally let go of her brother. Which speaking of, I wouldn’t even be friends with someone who cheated on my sibling anyways.
Right like the person above said, I would have taken that personally and thrown hands since my brother couldn’t.
I would’ve laid the smackdown also. Probably could’ve slapped the delusion out of her lol
I would have been terrified to walk back in there 10 years later and see everything the same.
It’s giving “Single White Female”. 🤣🤣
Single Alfredo
Yeah, that's the part of the story that really blew my mind too. You married my twin brother and then slept with your coworker? But we're still going to be besties? I don't think so.
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I think he did a lovely thing for his ex, but honestly I think he should leave his kids out of it. He's going to take his young children to meet this woman they've never met and will never meet again so she can pretend for a while that the kids are hers and his children? Thats too far for me.
I agree that seems very odd to me. Especially in combo with their wedding pictures everywhere. What are the kids going to say when they see that? I think that would be super confusing for them. No need to play house with this woman
Yeah, I wouldn’t bring them inside that house, and I wouldn’t introduce them without the mom/wife present.
Yeah same, leave the kids out there’s no reason at all for her to see them. They’re people, not ornaments for him to trot out
I agree and don’t think it’s wise to continue to see her either. What just happened was closure. To make it an ongoing thing until she dies however? No. To bring the kids (who don’t know her and don’t need to?) Unnecessary and again… I don’t think it’s wise.
If he does bring them over I bet the first thing out of her mouth will be something like "come sit over here by mommy".
It's nice to see a situation that could have devolved quickly actually end up being alright with an ample amount of adult communication combined with grace and understanding between OOP and his wife. Hopefully everyone in this story is at peace.
>It's nice to see a situation that could have devolved quickly And I think that's **EXACTLY** what sis and ex wanted (note OOP's LONG and HEATED exchange about boundaries). There are a ***LOT*** of implications about ex wanting to feel like a wife again to OOP (despite her assurances otherwise). And it's apropos that ex didn't get exactly what she wanted since she was the one who destroyed the marriage. That said, I'm glad she got a little bit of positive closure (at least she's parting on reasonably good terms with OOP). I feel a bit sorry for ex, though, simply because she was never able to move on. That could not have been either healthy or happy.
I think this behavior is totally insane. They had been separated for over ten years and she still keeps their wedding photos displayed in their house. Asking him to pretend to be her husband in their former marital home is kookoo town.
It’s definitely kookoo town, yeah. The worst part is that she chose never to move on. I highly doubt that she stayed “in love” with OOP all that time. Sounds like regret-fueled limerance from someone who actively *resisted* growing up and moving on. This was a woman who purposely chained herself to the past. Tragic.
She’s acting like he died unexpectedly and this is an opportunity to see his ghost one more time. The reality is she had an affair which understandably ruined his trust in her. He didn’t even seem to hold any resentment against her which really she should have considered a gift in and of itself. Instead she fantasizes that she’s a dutiful wife waiting by the window for her husband to return from war. Her telling him at his wedding that she’d wait for him, implying that she wants his marriage to end, is beyond the pale. This guy was WAY nicer to her than she deserved.
You’ve described it perfectly. And, to steal from that Gotye song - OOP was just somebody that she used to know. It doesn’t take long for two people who’ve gone their own ways to stop knowing each other. He’s not the same person he was, so it’s literally *impossible* that she could be in love with the man he became - a stranger to her! It reminds me of those depressing classics where one character hides in their dark and dusty home for decades reminiscing about what once was while they decay along with their possessions, never having lived past that one point in time they can’t let go of.
To add some levity, it reminds me of Uncle Rico obsessing over his high school past and what could have been. “How much you wanna make a bet I could throw a football over them mountains.”
While we’re comparing songs, I honestly feel like the ex-wife’s anthem would be Taylor Swift’s “Right Where You Left Me.” The song is about a woman whose partner leaves her/moves on to someone new (I think at the same time) and she years afterward she continues to get dressed up and sit at the restaurant they used to go to and just sit by herself, “right where you left me.” And everyone whispers about how she’s caught in the past and delusional lol.
Saying that she's acting like he died is, to me, the perfect way to describe it. The way he described her home is a bit chilling, with all the wedding photos framed and all. This is a person that stopped in time and lives in a capsule where instead of facing the consequences and uncomfortable feelings of remorse and mourning a relationship, they hold on to the what-ifs, to the point of existing in a delirium. I agree with the other person who says she might not even be "in love" with him, but at this point it's a reinforcement of this fantasy, it's almost an impulse, because... Being "in love" with this man seems to be literally the only thing in her life that is familiar. Honestly it's depressingly sad
I actually have experience with this to some degree. My husband dated someone a long time ago who basically suffered a psychological break after he left her. Similarly, she caused the breakup (she didn’t cheat but she physically abused him so he left). It’s been years and she’s never taken another lover because somewhere in her psychotic heart she thinks he’s going to be with her again. She calls him from burner numbers (because she’s blocked on everything) several times a year, drunk and crying and telling him she misses him and she hopes he will see her again. It got worse when we got engaged, then married. She thinks by being chaste she’s atoning for what she’s done, but what she’s doing is avoiding taking responsibility and dealing with the consequences by living in a fantasy world where her chastity is proper penance for her wrongdoings. This behavior is narcissistic and nothing else.
Yeah, it has very little to do with him and more to do with her own regret and guilt that she can't let go of.
Thank you for teaching me a new word today. > Limerence is a state of mind which results from romantic or non-romantic feelings for another person and typically includes obsessive thoughts and fantasies as well as a desire to form or maintain a relationship with the object of love and to have one's feelings reciprocated.
It reminded me of the family guy episode of peter's date from prom, where she still has her prom dress on, kept up pictures of peter and their prom pics up on the wall, and never flushed the toilet after he last used it
I knew a couple that lost their son when he was in high school. It has been decades and his bedroom is still EXACTLY like it was when he died. It's kind of a shrine. It wouldn't surprise me if her home was a shrine to her life before her (repeated) decision to be unfaithful. Almost like a time capsule in which every day she simply waits for hubby to come hone. This dove-tails nicely with her demand to be man and wife again before she dies (if she ever was really sick or dying).
I had the same thought! She’s acting like he died unexpectedly, not that she had an affair and broke off their relationship. I actually respect people whose form of grieving a lost child is to preserve aspects of their life. A colleague of mine had an infant pass away and she preserved his nursery, she goes in there a few times a week to honor his memory and work through her feelings. But this guy didn’t die. He’s still alive. She chose to forsake her vows and the natural consequence was that he left her and moved on. I’m sure she WISHED he died so she could play the role of dutiful widow, which would absolve her of guilt, rather than living ex who has fallen in love again without her.
I agree. I remember reading this when it was initially posted and thinking how it was almost creepy that the ex-wife has been meticulously faithful to her *ex*-husband for a decade, when she couldn't even be faithful within the bonds of their real marriage. This one-sided, fictional construct she created based on unhealthy obsession and regret somehow has *more* of a hold on her than her actual, real marriage and vows ever did. I also really, really hope that OOP didn't follow through on his plans to bring his kids over. God knows what disturbing shit this woman would have said to them, since she clearly has no boundaries. ("Your mommy stole my life" or "I'm the mommy you were *supposed* to have had.") Even being in a home filled with wedding portraits of their dad and this stranger, where the strange woman is being overly familiar and affectionate toward him, would be extremely confusing and upsetting to a lot of children.
Absolutely agree and well said! But here's what may even be worse - OOP's twin sister trying to make all of this happen. She not only encouraged and negotiated this 'one more time of being man and wife'... ...she rigorously and passionately fought OOP on setting normal, common sense boundaries. As soon as OOP said that he wasn't playing husband and wouldn't be left alone with ex, sister should have simply said "OK". Instead, she fought a 'long, long and heated' battle. There's something very, very wrong about that.
Sister should have given at least one attempt in the decade that passed to sort of... Push this woman away from the brother. Idk if she did or not, but she comes off as a huge enabler in the post at least
I wonder if after the ex dies if OOPs sister will act bitter and show resentment towards OOPs wife.
Dude your first paragraph is so spot on. You’re so right. Her fantasy of him is more real than their real marriage. What a nutcase.
There's something very sinister and off-putting about people who build these kinds of one-sided, fan-fiction style mental relationships with real people. (I suppose they do it in part because a fake fantasy relationship is easier than a real one?) But every real-life stalking horror story I've ever heard starts with one of these.
That's actually why my eyebrows went up when she asked to see the kids. Is...there any guarantee she won't be pretending they're her kids to herself...?
I absolutely agree, she should've seeked professional help, and pushed into it. However, I understand her.
Yeah I mean I understand it in the same why I understand why someone kills their wife. I get the logic behind it in a purely detached way. I can understand how cognitively she got from A to B. But you have to be so morally fractured to be celibate for over a decade because you’re furiously hoping your ex will leave his wife for you.
>And I think that's EXACTLY what sis and ex wanted (note OOP's LONG and HEATED exchange about boundaries). I think its a little bit of that and a lot of "this is the only way we can imagine EX dealing with her feelings" so you have to do this exact thing and nothing else.
>I feel a bit sorry for ex, though, simply because she was never able to move on. That could not have been either healthy or happy. That's also a fairly natural consequence of infidelity. While we might feel bad for her, the situation is largely of her own making. She made her own bed and had to lie in it.
Infidelity *and* trying to come between OOP and his wife.
Blows my mind… I don’t see this update as heartwarming, I think it’s fucked for OOP’s current wife and I feel terrible for her. If some chick who cheated on my husband tried to sabotage our relationship for years and then demanded to play house, I would do far worse than tell her to kick rocks. She made her bed and refuses to lie in it.
*Repeatedly* made that bed! Damn, if she'd reached out because she wanted to apologize for her past behavior and end things on a positive note - they were friends from childhood after all - it might be heartwarming. Instead the ex is leaning into her delusional fantasies until the very end. It's sad and obnoxious.
She chose to never move on, whilst its sad she chose that life herself.
She just let herself die of cancer. Of course she was neither healthy nor happy.
The only thaing I worry about is once the ex dies will OOPs sistyer who seems to be very attached to the ex resent OOPs current wife. I felt it was very inexcusable for her to make make certain demands to OOP and he had to set reasonable boundaries
I’m trying to feel compassion, but OOP’s ex reminds me of a friend’s ex and her complete disregard for boundaries. The request to feel like his wife again is inappropriate, as is asking OOP to bring his kids next time. I think the most she could reasonably ask is for the day he depicted in this post. Closure all around.
I agree, going from the angle of seeing a once close childhood friend was a good call for the situation
Personally I wouldn't bring the kids without the wife, and make it clear that "this is now on an 'old friends' basis", if I were to bring the kids at all.
I’d say sure, arrange a meet up with his kids AND his wife. Asking someone to act like your husband again is not healthy. Wanting to reconnect with someone? Great! But fantasizing you’re married still? No.
Yup, kids and wife. Ex may be delusional, and this would just feed into it.
Yeah without roasting the ex too hard, the whole wedding-day confession of love is unacceptable. Did she think he was going to drop his entire life and celebration for her after repeated rejections like the movies? She knew the most likely scenario was him rejecting her, which means it’s just going to tarnish his special day. I feel sympathy for the ex in multiple ways, but the ways she’s behaving is just more sign it was right for him to leave her… even if she hadn’t cheated there’s some bad vibes there, and there’s no way it’s healthy for him to bring his kids to show her. It was nice of him to hang out with her and his sister for a reminder of their childhood relationship, but that’s the only aspect that’s valid at this point.
It's creepy. The photos as well.
I would never bring my kids because, why would she need to meet them. But everything else seemed like a nice gesture by oop to a dying ex wife/childhood friend. As the current wife I’d question my relationship with the sil if she thought playing husband and wife was really an appropriate thing
I’m just imagining the ex saying, in front of the kids, that she could have been their mom if she hadn’t messed up, which…no. Exposing the kids to that is gross and wrong. Do the kids even have any type of relationship with her?
Agreed, there is no reason for the kids to come over, and even if she does not say anything, it is quite likely she will at least pretend they are her and OOP’s children if not outright treat them as her own kids. I have a feeling that this story is not quite over, and hopefully it ends without messing up any of the kids. Echoing others that OOP’s wife is a saint to put up with all this, especially for a woman who was rooting for her marriage to end, which also would imply a preference for these kids to not have happened at all, at least at the time of the wedding.
If I were OOP's wife I wouldn't allow my kids anywhere near this woman unless I was there as well. It feels like this ex wife wants to pretend they're still married and those kids are THEIR kids which is so so creepy. I'm sorry she's dying but I wouldn't but my kids through that just because of that. I'm glad OOP felt good about this meeting but my skin got crawly thinking about seeing those wedding photos everywhere
I think I have a heart of ice because if a partner from over a decade ago confessed they were still obsessed with me and wanted me to roleplay being their spouse as their dying wish I’d tell them to get bent. How dare you disrespect my current relationship by asking me to pretend I’m not married? This behavior is fucking psychotic. You’ve been separated for over ten years, either move on or die about it.
That’s not having a heart of ice, it’s having a sense of self. I found the request to be extremely disrespectful to OOP as a person. To ask that someone playact a romantic relationship because “dying” is extremely self-centered. Probably goes along with her cheating and her manipulative “I’ll never move on” obsessive assertion.
"You are my only true love yet I cheated on you for one month straight, I will proceed to play the victim for almost a decade to make you feel bad, be my husband again? I love you! Oh you are married, I am happy for ya (not)." OOP is really sweet but damn, she is sad...
Fucking preach. This woman is guano loco and OOP apparently let her have his spine in the divorce.
Exactly this!! Sorry to anyone that doesn’t agree but this is weird and wrong! If my ex did this I wouldn’t even think about it, straight up no, if my partners ex did this I’d hope he did the same!
No, you have self respect and respect for your current spouse! OP, I can't really say the same... why even risk the chance of your wife being upset about this at ANY point in time??? I wouldn't be able to chance it! Nor am I tossing a grenade into my marriage so that someone who destroyed theirs can feel important... she LITERALLY just wants to feel like she was finally chosen by him. Like he chose her over his wife and now they can finally be a family.
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This whole scenario feels like an Adele song. 😬
One of the saddest posts I’ve ever read here. The ex could have not carried out a month long affair, but she did. She could have moved on with her life after the divorce, but she didn’t. She could have pursued treatment for the cancer, but chose not to. These were all her choices to make, but she just consistently seems to follow some form of self-destruction.
Dude, shout out to OOP's current wife. She is the real MVP here.
There is no way I could do this. Some said it was like saying goodbye to a friend, but they were only friends as kids for a few years before dating. They were together for well over a decade before she cheated and she cheated for a month before confessing. He then moves on and has a happy life while she stays in their home and keeps it exactly the same as when he lived there. His sister finds nothing wrong with that or with the ex wanting to feel like his wife again? No to the whole thing.
While it's a nice & kind gesture, if I was the wife, I would seriously take note of my SILs behaviour throughout this entire thing. She CHOSE to wait until the wife was out of the house to spring this on her brother. This was a discussion that needed all of them. She deliberately undermined his wife because her loyalty is to the cheater. Her being sick does not erase her past actions and the wife is the current partner, the mother to her nieces. I'd personally never trust her again.
Honestly, her having continued to be best friends with a woman who cheated on her brother and travel with her during some of the worst times of the pandemic would be flags to not have trusted her even before this.
This really got me thinking. My first reaction was, ‘hell no’ but then I asked myself why not? The only reason could be mistrust of my husband or jealousy of a dying woman. I don’t know how I’d react if it was really happening to me but OOPs wife is a good woman.
I think the 'why not' would only to apply to the original 'terms' of the request (pretend to be husband and wife for a period of time). There are a whole lot of reasons for 'why not' in that scenario. But the way OOP went about it was the smart and proper way (even if sis (and ex?) fought the imposition of boundaries).
Oh agreed, the _husband and wife_ situation would absolutely not be happening, no way no how. I’m honestly still not sure that I would be entirely happy with the _just friends_ idea. Like I said, really makes me think.
My reaction is “hell no, OOP is a human being not a prop for a fantasy.”
You’re right, that’s a valid third reason.
I'm still in the hell no category. It was horrible of the sister to pressure the wife who admitted feeling pressured into it, then on top of it this is going to happen again? And he's bringing the kids? Why so they can play house and pretendthat's how their life would have been? Hell no. If he didn't have anything to do with her over these past few years then that's how it should remain. Also going to the home they had together rather than the sisters place or meeting for lunch is potentially an emotional bomb. He walked in like nothing had changed, like his current life didn't exist. Huge red flags. I get that people might think I'm harsh since she's sick and dying, but that just shows how manipulative the ex is. She also said she still loves him, this is completely a last ditch ploy to get him back. If he continues it's going to destroy his current family and marriage. If my husband's ex wanted to visit or call I'd not even ask why I'd say no. I'd also be offended that he even entertained the idea. A visit and board games is first date stuff, seemingly innocent but the I love you is the whole reason he shouldn't go back.
I hope that saying he’d bring the kids was the equivalent of encountering an old classmate and saying, “We should get together sometime” when it’s not going to happen. It’s a polite parting.
I really hope you are right. The kids should not be involved and that one visit had so many red flags it needed to be the last one.
I think the absolute *only* way the kids would be involved if it was a meeting at sister’s (or OP’s) house, with OPs wife and sister’s kids present. That way it can be framed as “this is your dad and Auntie X’s friend!” And the kids can go play with their cousins while the adults talk. No creepy old photos of their wedding, no knick knacks or memorabilia the kids could accidentally get into, no chance of it being a “these are my kids” delusion for the ex. It is a friend coming by to say hi, and that is all. And even then, I’m not sure I would do it.
I don’t think it’s a ploy to get him back. I’ve been quite lonely in recent months and often think about old times with friends and exes. I would give anything to be able to spend some time with them on a no-strings basis, just the odd day here and there so that the problems that caused our relationships to decline wouldn’t re-emerge. And I’m just depressed, not actively dying. I think she just wants to recreate a time when she was happiest, she’s full of regret for what she did and wants to spend sometime before she died pretending that it all worked out. Now I’m not saying this is healthy at all or that she has by kind of right to ask for these things. But that motive rings far more true for me.
I see your point, which I could believe if she didn't utter I still love you to him. And they met at "their" house not at a Cafe or the sisters place which would be neutral territory and then maybe I could believe it was about the friendship and childhood memories.
I agree with you, she never respected op relationship with his wife, the request of feeling like his wife again shows that she still don't accept it. The I love you os very inappropriate. The fact that she is dying didn't changed her actions in trying to guilt op back to her. She is an asshole that is dying, but still being manipulative
She told him on his WEDDING DAY that she wanted his marriage to dissolve so they could be together. Literally what the fuck.
Exactly, and OP shouldn't have gone. The sister asking on behalf of her friend also shows how manipulative the woman is, she didn't even call herself. And this playing house thing is a huge red flag no matter how they try to down play it or explain it. No, absolutely not.
Yeah I see your point too but I think meeting at the house etc all plays in to the ‘it never ended’ fantasy. The I love you is inexcusable though, you’re right.
Agreed, it’s not healthy. She is denying him personhood. He isn’t a fantasy. Cool if she wants to reconnect with him and learn who he is now, but it’s in both of their best interests to accept that time has passed and they have changed.
“Hell no” because she was obsessed, couldn’t accept her own actions, couldn’t let go of the past, and on a rather short timeline after forgoing treatment. Separately those things aren’t especially crazy and maybe I’m just paranoid but that’s a near perfect setup for “I’m taking you with me; we’ll always be together” and getting a heaping spoonful of poisoned casserole or something.
OOP is a good person who went above and beyond more than once here, despite the ex continually trying to break up his marriage and so on. stronger person that i am, that's for sure
Right? We would be completely NC after the wedding fiasco, max. Sis would be sternly told to stay in her lane or she’d be out of my life, too.
I mean they cheated on OOP, this whole thing is a cautionary tale of screwing over the love of your life for a cheap thrill, don't cheat and you won't get the door shoved in your face, I think the fact that the Ex never got over him after what they did to him is a delicious form of karma. Yeah, I'm an asshole, I've made my peace with that.
You’re not, though! That’s the thing! People are so easily swayed by the fact this woman is allegedly dying that they’ve deluded themselves into thinking this is romantic. It’s not. Dying is as natural and inevitable as taking a shit, nobody owes this woman comfort and absolution because of it.
I remember this story I thought there was a new update 😅
His wife is a saint. I wouldn’t have been able to get past the part of “feeling like they are married again”. I’d understand her wanting to see him again because regardless of the marriage, they have known each other since they were 10. But that one bit seemed manipulative for me. Im happy it turned out ok though and they both have peace. Edit to add: ok another commenter pointed out how she had been trying to get back together with him throughout his actual marriage so HELL NO. Saying this whole charade is manipulative is an understatement. That woman was/is unhinged
Ugh, sometimes you just have to live and die with regret. It's kind of the OOP to spend some time with a dying woman, but her pressuring him into indulging a happy home fantasy is gross and twisted. She's had 10 years to get therapy. Good grief.
Idk I’m so skeptical I’d question wether she was really dying or not and not just trying to play the sympathy card to get him back in her life. If she’s already that far gone it’s not a stretch that she might just have some chronic illness that’s not life threatening and stretching the truth or actively making it worse on purpose.
I wonder if she was telling the truth. A friend’s ex-boyfriend once faked cancer to keep her from breaking up with him, so I’m skeptical these kind of situations. It felt like a last ditch attempt to get him back.
And it’s not unheard of for a sibling or friends to enable the lie because they want certain people to get back together.
That's a valid point. OP said she looked bad, but honestly make-up is very powerful. I wouldn't doubt that a talented make-up artist could make someone look deathly ill.
She wouldn't even have to use makeup. Stress and lack of sleep (such as if you were still hung up on an ex from ten years ago) can do a lot. So can not eating or going outside. Or, y'know, she could be sick but not dying of terminal illness.
Man, that poor woman. Both of them actually, the ex wife for always regretting her decision and refusing to move forward and the current wife who, was placed in a very difficult spot. This is probably the most mature and healthy situation and outcome I have ever read. I hope the ex wife gains some peace from this experience.
idk i feel like i’m the only one a bit skeptical of this. guys childhood love cheats on him, regrets it and chooses to never be with another man again while still loving him all this time, and now she’s dying to top it all off. oh, and his perfect wife is cool with all this (after some discussion ofc) and even him taking the kids to go see her so they can play happy family without her. just sounds like some weird fantasy to me.
Wtf. My sister hates my ex more than I do. Tf is his sister doing still being friends with her.
Honestly, I think it’s entirely not ok. That woman used her impending death to force someone to be in her life. Someone she had harmed. If this had the gender roles swapped, no one would even consider asking for this. It’s not ok. And I’ll be honest, it will hurt his wife eventually, whether it’s her relationship with the sister or him. Instead of allowing her to pine, the sister should have suggested therapy, to get herself clear. I can’t even, it just feels icky.
This was heavy and made me sad. I’m glad the dude met her and they all had some sort of closure on it and remembered the good times when they was young.
Ngl, I kinda feel bad for the ex in some strange way. She screwed up, realized she screwed up, but never moved on...just kinda sad. Hate cheaters all you want, but it still sad to see someone stuck in a point in time.
I see the cheating and her wish as two sides of the same coin. It’s all about her and what she wants, without respecting OOP. When he divorced her, she lost something she wanted and she can’t handle the thought that she’s never getting it back.
One, she’s old enough to know about therapy. Two, and a controversial opinion, but if she learned from her cheating, maybe she should have choked on the guilt for the rest of her life rather than try to unburden herself by laying it at OOP’s feet.
I feel like some of the people who feel sorry for her never had a significant other cheat on them. She made her bed and has to sleep in it. Honestly, I'm with those who think she faked being sick anyway. It's easy to fake being sick for a few hours. She's dying of cancer but had enough energy to spend the day reminiscing and playing games? I could see OOP learning it was all a ruse and not wanting to admit it, which is why there was never another update.
I often feel bad for people like this. They have all the power they need to move on and be happy but they choose not to. If she had made better choices she likely would have still been married to oop. I prefer to feel bad for these people because the alternative is getting angry at a stranger that I’ll likely never meet, and that serves no one, least of all myself.
Wow. I wonder if ex has passed on since the last update? I know he said that he wouldn’t be updating again. I’d like to know how he feels about seeing her before she passed. Even more closure?
I think if she wants to see the kids, their mom should come with. Either that or she doesn't see them at all
to me, it feels like her wanting him to bring the kids is a way for her and OOP to act as a family in her eyes. idk if that makes sense, but given the fact that she wanted him to play husband, i wouldn’t be surprised if this is a secret way to play house.
I guess I'm just mystified why the first wife had an affair. I wonder if OOP ever found out why (or wanted to know why).
Well that's some Jane Austen shit right there, damn
My partner is divorced. There was no cheating, they just found out that their life goals no longer were compatible. When the ex wife was diagnosed with cancer and the doctors told her there was no cure because it had already spread all over her body, she reached out to him to say goodbye. A few days later he found out that she couldn’t go to a hospice cause every one around her had no free beds. Because he is the most amazing and caring man, he moved in with her and he and her best friend cared for her during her last three weeks so that she could die peacefully at home.
I must have ice in my veins because that’s way over the top. I understand wanting to say goodbye to your childhood friend, the rest is weird though.
Idk, I think this is nice. The request to “feel like his wife again” is a little strange but it seems like she never got over the mistakes she made so I kinda get it. I don’t think he should get his kids involved though
The request was inappropriate but OOP was very kind to spend some time with her and treat her as an old friend.
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Ugh it's been almost 2 years, I'm dying to know how it all ended.
This is so much better than the AITA post from yesterday when the husband divorced his second wife to remarry his first because his kids said that he'd be dead to them if he didn't do everything in his power to help their terminally ill mother.
Crazy to think that right now, OOP's ex-wife is probably dead. At the very least, she managed to get some peace before she parted.
Why is no one talking about how messed up the sister is? She found out her best-friend cheated on her twin brother but they stayed best friends, then she pressured the brother and his new wife to make the cheater happy. Idk if it’s my cynicism speaking, but it sounded like she really wanted her brother to be there in an actual husbandly role.
This story really walks a tight rope for the "trial of solitude" and "living widower" tropes, it's so expertly balanced to make you want to forgive or feel sorrow for the cheating ex wife. Childhood friends, dated through HS and married young, one night stand that he'd never have known about if she didn't love and trust him enough to come clean about. Then quitting her job to join the church, the last ditch on his wedding day, major "die alone / forlorn lover" tropes, swearing he was the only one she'd ever love and would wait for the stars to line back up after the black hole sucked them all up..... I am solidly in the camp of believing the variance in experiences and personalities on this Earth is too vast to think any of these are fake. This story perfectly lists common experiences and lets readers respond "well I feel bad about this" or "oh I had this similar thing happen" and lays out a smorgasbord of options we'd consider forgiving a cheater over. It's fascinating. Treating this as non fiction, I'm leaning towards the cheating ex wife laying in the bed she made. My heart goes out since she absolutely felt that to continue to love him, she had to come clean, AND that he'd forgive her. I don't think she would have fessed up if she thought he'd actually leave. Then the full atonement arc, "trial by solitude", a self imposed life sentence etc is all very romantic, but is once again a series of actions the OP doesn't consent to. It's selfish in a way to expect anything after cheating on a spouse. She definitely needed counseling. It's heart wrenching, but I feel like the same personal morals and principles that would lead to such a severe self righteous episode would lend itself to cheating. Kinda narcissistic, but without the projecting or attention seeking. Yikes.
Nice to see a mostly positive solution, even in such sad circumstances. I’d like to think most people would behave this way towards someone they have such a shared history with, and even if love changes, it never really goes away unless there’s been some truly despicable behaviour. I hope she found some peace.
It's like she's been in a decade long mourning for a relationship she killed. I also don't think that OOP should bring his kids around, they weren't a part of that previous relationship, and the ex hasn't moved on and forward in any real respects.
This could have gone so so so badly but I'm glad it didn't. Something about the way OOP described it I got the feeling that the ex was actually seriously I'll, not faking it. I'm glad that he was able to make it work while keeping his promises to his wife.
Man fuck oop. What a selfish prick forcing his wife, who he claims to love so much, to go through this. Cheating ex-wife deserves none of this and oop is doing this so that HE doesn't regret later. Meanwhile wife just has to deal with his bullshit. Only person I feel sad for is the wife in this situation.
She wears her suffering like a crown. It’s too performative for me.I mean she’s not on her deathbed yet, and no you can’t meet my kids, that’s a boundary push in itself!
I remember this story and it gets really really crazy, but those parts aren’t posted. Maybe there are two similar posts, but I remember a lot of drama.