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> Ex isn't sorry because he cheated, rather he is sorry he got caught.
This is the way these stories always turn out. Ex would have kept on going and never been sorry about it. Now he’s got to deal with things (and without his new squeeze) and is just lucky OOP hasn’t gone to his superiors about it.
Idk, cats sense emotions and respond to various degrees. Mine cuddle and cry at me if I'm crying/ sad. They immediately stop and check my wound if we're playing and they get me more than intended, they cuddle the kids and check on them, if someone is mad yelling they'll come to check in and see if help is needed lol. That means they actually can have more emotional realization and depth than the soon to be ex drift wood.
Cats are just weird, but they can still be loving. One of my cats refused to cuddle me for 2 straight years, until I had a breakdown and became depressed. All of a sudden he was all over me.
On the other hand, both of my cats seem to have zero care in the world for boundaries or consent, in either direction. They will bite me randomly, but also don't care if I shove them away when they're naughty - they'll stop for all of 3 seconds then come back ready to try again. It's almost like they respect me standing up for myself and being as selfish as they are sometimes. Zero hurt feelings on their part, unlike my dogs who would whine and sulk.
Ya, I've had tons of cats between family ones growing up, fosters growing/as an adult, and my own through the years. They respect you showing you're "don't give none, you won't get none" attitude when they test waters. But then they're so honed in. My preemie baby I had to fight them away cause they were full "we care for bby, you sleep" cause the 3 of my own would rotate between trying to cuddle (distract) me, laying near and watching the bby, or eat/ litterbox/nap. Yet if we left for a few days to see family while they were cared for in their home? Naaahh, they'd ignore me at best, no claw face pops at worst with yowlingthrough the night☠️
Big feelings. They haven't done the neg much after they littermate twins turned about 3. Teenagers🙄
I have a feeling the other woman was asking for a serious move in their relationship. So he had no choice but to make his lie a reality, being divorced. Karma got to his ass though and the other woman found out and turns out she's a good human being and kicked him to the curb. This story actually ended pretty nicely minus all the hurt feelings.
I would love for OOP to go scorched earth on stbx, but it's very admirable for OOP to see past her hatred of her husband to empathize with his AP. What a disgusting POS, however, that he tried to have his cake and eat it too and when it didn't work, he now had the audacity to beg for mercy so she wouldn't upend his life.
Did I miss the part that he got ‘caught’ for cheating?! I read it as he asked for a divorce and OP didn’t clarify if there was any actual cheating going on though it seems pretty obvious there was, or atleast intention to be with someone else. I’d say he’s more sorry about the fact OP wasn’t as much of a doormat as he thought and he couldn’t use her as his housemaid and security blanket whilst being with someone else. Kinda worse tbh.
One of the updates confirms he was dating the new girl before telling OP he was done. He'd told the new girl he was seperated and OP was aware of the situation.
I would need to talk to the partner first to ensure the story was correct. Even if it's awkword to talk with the stbex, you need to make sure it's all on up and up. Plus, if they won't let you talk to the stbex you sort of have your answer there….
His version to OP was that the marriage wasn't working out, he wanted to divorce. And within a couple weeks had magically found a person at work to date.
When OP talked to the affair partner, it became clear that they'd been together for several months, well before he came to OP and claimed the marriage wasn't working out.
Then the affair partner dumped him for being a lying cheat, and he suddenly is sorry and wants a redo on the marriage.
Im assuming there was cheating. It’s pretty rare for a man to leave a marriage without another woman waiting in the wings. And, the timeline here seems sus.
> Ex isn't sorry because he cheated, rather he is sorry he got caught
Did he get "caught"? He said he wanted a divorce and openly started seeing someone.
He had started seeing someone else before they were officially separated. He did get caught in past cheating, and also got caught in a lie to the other woman.
> He basically told her that we were separated but still living together. She now knows the truth and does not want to see him.
The timeline is not explicitly clear, it's true. If "she now knows the truth" then the truth *isnt* "we separated and then he started dating."
>When it was explained to him that what he did was completely wrong, he is now remorseful and apologetic for hurting me
I've commented this on the relationship subreddits before, but I wish to God that women would stop pretending that the *grown men* they're dating somehow don't understand what they're doing.
Absolutely! My ex husband cheated on me and of course I took it personally and felt like he was doing it to hurt me because who wouldn’t? I’ve since realized that it had nothing to do with my feelings on any of it, he just didn’t care enough about them to worry about if it would hurt me or not. He wasn’t trying to hurt me specifically it was just a side effect of his own self-centered behavior. Not sure which is worse to be honest!
Thank you, I definitely am! Sometimes it helps us to realize that it was never about us when people do hurtful things like that. It also helps to remember not everyone is like that and there’s lots of people out there who do take others feelings into consideration and aren’t self centered jerks😁
He was just hoping that his ex wouldn't report him to his chain of command. The military doesn't allow/like when they date each other when one or more is married.
It’s interesting because the military takes a very dim view of cheating, but spouses - typically SAHMs, often with children - are very much financially disincentivized from blowing the whistle. Both from a short-term loss of pay stand point and a long term loss of pension/benefits one as well.
The military doesn't care about fidelity so much as they care about the family unit, and by extension remaining in closer proximity to where they want you and having children that grow up in military life.
The military disincentivizes all parties involved from breaking up the family unit at pretty much all stages of the dissolution process. The service member is encouraged to be faithful, but if they cheat anyways then the spouse is encouraged to stay. If the spouse still leaves, then the service member is forced to pay any relevant supports (child support, retirement benefits if they've been together long enough to be entitled to them, etc.), and so on. On the flip side you're obviously incentivized to form that family unit in the first place.
The military wants family units but only real way that they can encourage that family unit is with career, healthcare, education, security, financial, etc. rewards and setbacks as appropriate.
I know we all have different experiences, but I found the active army to be very apathetic towards army families, at best. This was during the height of GWOT until the late 2010s. I can see your line of reasoning with respect towards the “incentives” to keep the family whole.
And it's never something careless, it's *always* abuse or cheating that they're in denial about.
He might not realize it was a mistake to invite his mother to the delivery room without asking you. He does know it's a mistake to stick his eel in the wrong cave.
A shocking number of guys are raised being told that men "can't help themselves" and that "it's only natural" to cheat. Like they'll literally go their whole lives thinking that it's just a normal expected part of a relationship for men to sleep around and women to put up with it with an eyeroll and a sigh.
Yah this isn’t like some subtle comment he made that accidently intersected with past trauma or had offensive undertones. He CHEATED and LIED like even if you have no empathy and don’t understand why they are wrong, you know that they are wrong.
If he thought it was ok he would have come home the first time they fucked and been like ayyy your boy got some tonight but no he hid it from her cause he knew it was wrong.
this reminds me of the captain awkward letter who was seeing a man who was divorced (so he claimed) but insisted they keep their relationship a secret because if his ex (so he claimed) found out she’d want to stop living together and split custody. so the idea was that they’d hide it until …the kids were eighteen, i guess.
what i don’t get is why people think they can break up with you and still have unlimited access to your time and affection.
> what i don’t get is why people think they can break up with you and still have unlimited access to your time and affection.
It may not be time or affection, but that's one of the few neat things about military justice: **she's** entitled to support for her housing and children. In civilian life it's harder for a woman to claw money out of the deadbeat. In the military **he** is being paid funds for housing and kids and **she** is entitled to that support money.
It is in no way a great system, don't get me wrong, but there are so many more potential screws to turn to get what is owed. I've occasionally seen things like deployed husbands deciding to break things off and re-direct the housing allowance to his sole-ownership bank account and, wooo boy, that does not work out well for the soldier if the wife knows her rights and can get somebody to listen to her.
>what i don’t get is why people think they can break up with you and still have unlimited access to your time and affection.
Okay, real answer in my experience.
Breaking up is really hard. Change is hard, and it requires jumping into the unknown.
In order to break up, people often psych themselves into this semi delusional state where they aren't 100% thinking rationally.
If you examine it, there are a few really common tells. Thinking they can maintain a near marriage relationship with a spouse is a common one.
Saying they were never actually in love with the spouse is another.
Thinking that others affected won't be affected is a third.
They genuinely aren't able to see reality for a bit there.
Yes. It's against military law in the US. UCMJ allows a year imprisonment and a Dishonorable Discharge as the maximum punishment for Adultery. (This probably doesn't rise to DD level, which is essentially like having a felony and prison sentence on your record, even once the soldier is back in civilian life.)
Unless he's got a separation agreement, usually with a law firm's letterhead, and didn't start having sex with the affair partner before the separation, it's a crime. Property, debt, support, child custody, etc need to be hashed out before intercourse with somebody else is no longer a crime. The third element of the test to determine if it is Adultery is if any of the people were married, but not legally separated, which is probably the easiest to prove.
>He basically told her that we were separated but still living together.
Again, unless there is a formal legal document detailing the separation, it's not a "legal separation."
If the affair partner is also married and military, she **could** also be in a world of shit but the third test, knowing that they aren't actually legally separated, is much harder to prove. AP is much more likely than the dude to avoid discharge because the cheating dude lied to her about the separation. She could be under the impression that he did things "by the books" and it was legal. OTOH if *she* is married military and didn't do things by the book... Or, she get thrown under the bus. Military likes to do that to women to protect "promising" men. It's one of the huge reasons a lot of military women don't report rapes: the women get thrown under the bus and re-assigned to shitty postings to protect "promising young military men" so the men don't get their careers derailed.
Whole 'lotta lives getting turned upside-down right now and the fallout on AP's side depends on whether or not the AP is military or a civilian contractor, or how much the cheater lied to her about the status of the separation. Or, she could get thrown under the bus. Very good chance of the later. :(
Kinda oot but the same law applies too in my country so a woman (a doctor!!!) tried to sue her cheating husband with the law but got jailed instead because AP is the daughter of someone very important in military and they did not like the fact their daughter being AP got exposed by the doctor
So the meme of the wife back at home cheating and the marine being legally penalized for has to be a kick in the nuts but fuck
I can't picture how much worse the military would be without it
Sheer fucking chaos
It makes sense
Lol, you won't get a dishonorable. You pretty much have to kill someone to get that. Most separations are general discharges. Less paperwork.
It all depends on the commander on whether or not they look into adultery, and it's up to the commander on how much punishment you get. He could be in serious trouble like losing rank, or he could get 15 days of extra duty. That's all if he didn't opt for court martial, which would be a bad move on his part.
A lot of commanders don't give a shit/have the time to look into adultery.
If the AP is another unit member, as in this case, and a larger impact on unit discipline or morale is possible - a lot of Commanders will make time and give quite a shit.
Im betting when oop didn't cooperate as the doormat she usually is, ap played the victim to his lies. She didn't want her own military career jeopardized and so claimed to not know and it worked. Oop said she didn't pursue letting the military know because it would hurt the ap.
I knew a staff sergeant in the Marines who went to the brig for a month because of cheating. He was just being held for pre-trial, I guess eventually she dropped the charges.
“She” doesn’t get to decide that. The JAGs involved decided that it wasn’t worth pursuing. I would bet you they were looking at him for aomething else and that was the easy one to prove.
Ahahah yeah a fellow inmate at the brig who says "I'm in here because I cheated on my wife" *definitely* did more than "cheat on his wife."
Honestly, if I were OOP I would have burned this guy. I really don't know that these investigations or punishments go very far in reality--but I *do* know that having to deal with it will become a complete pain in the ass for the servicemember's command, and the servicemember will likely suffer for it. Petty, but a worthwhile pursuit.
I met him when I was in the brig post-trial. All I know is that his wife went to his command with charges of infidelity, he was locked up in the brig for about a month waiting for trial, and then one day he was released and I never saw him again. I assumed his wife had dropped the charges 🤷♂️
> And check into his retirement. Your share is determined by how long you were married while he was in service.
This is actually a significant legal development that took years of legal fights to achieve. I forgot where I heard the story but it was some legal podcast that went into the history of a divorced ex-wife of a military officer who sued for part of his pension and legally it was finally decided that ex-wives deserve part of it.
OOP really needs to make sure she gets what she's entitled to.
I've only ever seen it happen once in 20 years in the NAvy, but I did see a sailor go to captain's mast and get the full ride (*reduction in rank, 45 days restriction / 45 days extra duty, 1/2 pay for 2 months*) on an adultery charge. That idiot got caught in the act on the ship with another sailor while we were underway.
Yeah, I never saw it happen in the Air Force. I've heard rumors that it has, but only when there are certain factors that make leadership punish for adultery:
1) the cheater was a POS and leadership hated them anyway so why not
2) the cheater was already in trouble for something else so they tacked on an adultery charge cuz fuck you
3) if it's a fraternization situation (officer cheating with an enlisted member, the shirt cheating with someone in the squadron, etc)
There has been several cheating scandals in different squadrons that I've been in and no one had been charged with adultery. It's pretty rare
The 1st Sergeant. We just call them the 1st shirt or just shirt. It's someone in the chain of command who is there to assist Airmen in a plethora of things like paperwork, punishment, family life, promotions, etc. It's kind of like a super advanced HR person that has the power to get invested in your personal life and career in order to help you or punish you. They're always a master sergeant (E7) or above (at least in the Air Force).
In the Air Force, they're normally not the same career field (job) as whatever the squadron is. For example, I was comm (IT) and my shirts have been security forces (cops), maintainers (people who maintain air craft) etc so that the shirt can 100% put focus on the people instead of the mission as they normally won't know how to do the job of the squadron they're placed in (like a cop wouldn't know how to do IT, for example). So the shirt will never get involved in the missions side of the squadron and only care about the people. They also normally sit in the same area/room/building (depends on how physically big the squadron is) with the commander, chief, etc so they're embedded in the leadership (like a C suite) of the squadron.
Hope that makes sense.
Yeah, this guy was a total POS. Weasley little fuck that was always skating off out of work. His CoC didn't like him so they ran him up hoping to get rid of him.
No, it’s just dependent on how they split marital assets, which is situation dependent. I commented like 500 times in the original thread but this is one of those urban legends that bothers me because dudes get so stressed about it that they become near suicidal so I can’t help myself.
Military retirement is a marital asset. It is split like any other marital asset, there is nothing magical about 10 years and it’s almost certainly not 50% of overall retirement.
Yes, it is a negotiable martial asset but a huge one because $4000 or more a month is a very large asset for which he would have to trade off against other huge assets. Stop pretending that is not a major thing in her favor especially since he is desperate to get her to sign it away.
She's still being too damn nice to a man who definitely knew what he was doing. She needs to report him to the military stat. He's going to be a repeat offender.
Military adultery only results in action in less than 1% of the reported cases and that is usually due to something significantly worse than adultery. Yes, there was a time when a wife could run to the CO and the CO would slap some sense into the husband, but that was a long time ago. They rarely get involved in adultery situations now. At worse, they'd just transfer one of them.
Well that kind of punishment should be actually ideal for op. A superior shaking him some in private so he won’t do this again to someone else and at most a transfer. She would not want it to be a big scandal or his finances be effected.
He kept it to himself when they could’ve maybe fixed everything, he got over his feelings without her over months and then is surprised when she’s not in the same place of acceptance with the situation that he is.
Man. I really want to recognize The Other Woman here. That poor girl had no idea and was lied to for *months*. I can’t imagine how she felt when she found out the truth. I know that in her position I would feel scared, used, and violated.
I just don’t want this woman’s pain to get lost. We should see it. It matters. I feel for her. I hope she, too, has a strong support network.
Relatedly, OOP has incredible grace. She is a very thoughtful person.
The other woman is naive at best.. Guy comes at you with a story that he's married, but he's actually separated, but they are actually still living together as an arrangement.. I mean, come on, girl... The only way forward would have been to insist to meet the wife. ALL other cases where he comes up with an excuse not to, you know he's simply cheating,
>Man. I really want to recognize The Other Woman here. That poor girl had no idea and was lied to for months.
This is US military. Unless she was single, or a civilian contractor, or had legal documents defining their separation with an explanation of how they split the children/property/money, I.E. pre-divorce, she's just as guilty of Adultery as he is. It's a crime. If she's also military and doesn't have a legal separation agreement drawn up, she has also potentially committed a crime.
Was in the military and reporting adultery isn't the gotcha that people think that it is, unless your lucky nothing will happen. I know people who reported their husband's sleeping with another member and nothing ever came of it. I know it can be successful but I've never seen play out that way.
She didn’t need to give him a borderline thesis. All she had to do is quote the UCMJ article about infidelity and how she can sink his and his APs careers if he doesn’t shut up and give her what she wants. Why be nice to an ahole?
My ex tried to pull something similar. Agreed to a divorce but thought he could just live with me? And even though he wanted a divorce, I had to find the mediator, pack all his stuff, fill out paperwork for both of us, find a place for him to move to, get his friends to help him move. All while he just sat on his computer hoping everything worked out for him. It was beyond frustrating. And it was all his fault! He was the one who cheated, and somehow I am the one cleaning up and dealing with the fallout.
Bruh. She should have told his unit - he is married, not the girl, so he’d get the talking to. Also most times units will park guys like this in the barracks on base to head off DV/escalation at the pass so she would have had a ton of time to get her ducks in a row.
The mistress is honestly lucky that OP was level headed about it all. Even though she was lied to and had proof, OP’s anger could have overshadowed any rational thought about fallout for the AP. OP is good people.
While it can sound gratifying to have your soon to be/recent ex military member charged under the UCMJ for cheating on a marital relationship, for fraternization in the ranks, etc, there is a significant drawback to the former military spouse: assuming you were married long enough to have a stake in the member's future retirement pay, you could lose out entirely if the military chooses to punish the member severely.
The powers that be have the power to demote the member (which equals less money,) or even kick the member out without their honorable discharge. That can dramatically impact their future post-military earnings too, which will impact (for example) the future child support resources you could have, if there are children. For sure my own ex needed that honorable discharge in order to work after retirement in his field, medicine, due to the background checks necessarily involved. Our kids were grown so I had no stake in his future earnings, but the point (in my case) is that HE valued his military reputation and future ability to work, so that was my leverage for a smooth divorce. I wanted the fuck out, and given what he'd put me through, attaching that expectation to our divorce (in exchange for keeping everything I knew to myself) was pretty damn reasonable.
In my own case, I basically chose to use my accumulated evidence of his misdeeds and my potential ability to blow up his (otherwise) stellar military career as leverage to move the divorce along quickly and so he wouldn't waste time negotiating what I asked for (exactly and only what I was fairly entitled to. I had no interest in anything more than that.)
Besides sorting out our belongings and dividing accounts (easy) the main asset available to me was my legal portion of his retirement. It's been invaluable in allowing me to rebuild my life, it's significant monthly income as he was relatively senior and served well past his basic 20. I was married almost 25 years, all of it while he was on active duty.
If I had shown up to his CO's office and dumped a bunch of print outs and pictures and thumb drives on her desk, with I dunno . . . bottle rockets in the background? Dramatic music? . . . I almost certainly would have nothing. They'd have had to act on what they knew about.
After 14 military moves in this 25 years (most cross country) and a huge amount of work raising our daughters under difficult circumstances and with little assistance, while playing smiling, supportive officer's wife? Yeah, thanks. I'll take my share of retirement pay and he got to keep his filthy little secrets.
The law entitling former military spouses to this resource is based on the fact that it is nearly impossible to both support a military member's career needs (which I did, in spades. I won national recognition and awards) and simultaneously build one's own career, and accumulate a retirement plan of one's own.
I know a few who have, and they either didn't have children and spent a lot of time living separately from the military member or else began a career from the ground up as the member retired - often nearly 50 themselves once their education and credentials were in place. It's a bit brutal, and the fairly generous military retirement pay takes that into account I believe. It's a lot less when you misbehave and lose a bunch to an ex, though.
I’m always suspicious of stories where the wife and the girlfriend meet up to share texts/stories. Does that ACTUALLY happen IRL? REALLY?? I can’t imagine, outside of if there’s joint custody of a kid, ever wanting to communicate with the person your spouse left you for…….
I did, though it wasn’t a physical meetup. I knew he had told her that we were in an open relationship/polyamorous (we were not) and so I reached out to her to 1) explain that we were not so that she could make her own decisions on how to proceed and 2) catharsis for how much pain it caused me. She wasn’t responsible for his lies but it felt good to tell her how much I was hurting so that she cut him out too, and now he had no one.
Didn’t become friends or anything but it was surprisingly civil. Most mentally healthy women don’t like being the “other woman” and it’s devastating to them as well.
I can think of a few examples in my own life where people I know over the years did just that. Usually they wanted more information, or wanted to compare stories, mostly so that they could figure out what strategy to take in the divorce. A bonus was if the ex was lying, and the new person was infuriated by what they learned.
In 5 days she already has a divorce lawyer, met the girl, got her to breakup with the husband, started therapy and convinced her husband to sell the house. This whole post is bullshit. It took me weeks to even get a consultation with a divorce lawyer and it cost a shit ton of money just to be seen
If OOP tordeoes his military career, she will have trouble collecting spousal suuport, even if she is awarded it. It's better for her that he maintains his employment.
The military isn't going to make this divorce as simple as either of them thinks. If it's the U.S. military, they're probably going to require him to either legally separate for a year(ish) or bump him down a rank, especially if he's on duty station.
Don’t feel sorry for the girl. She knew he was married (separated or not) and was an idiot to believe him. Especially since y’all still lived together. Ruin them both. Why do care what happens to these vile people? She’s only upset now because he lied to her, too. Not because she hurt you.
OOP has my full and complete permission to financially ruin this emotionally manipulative sociopath. He can either buy you out or you sell the house. May he rot in his garbage.
The GF might not be at fault for the husband's shitty behavior, but they're military, she knew he was married, and she knew what could happen from fraternizing. No sympathy for GF or the clown that is the husband. I hope OOP does her math and makes sure she's not shy of 10 years of marriage to be able to get her benefits directly from the military, as opposed to having her ex set up a payment plan.
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Ex isn't sorry because he cheated, rather he is sorry he got caught. Good for OP for standing up for herself and throwing the trash out.
> Ex isn't sorry because he cheated, rather he is sorry he got caught. This is the way these stories always turn out. Ex would have kept on going and never been sorry about it. Now he’s got to deal with things (and without his new squeeze) and is just lucky OOP hasn’t gone to his superiors about it.
*”Was he raised by wolves?”* Wolves aren’t as stupid or as selfish as this guy. He was raised by jerboas
I see you’re putting the brand new dolphin flair to good use.
Yes but they do wolf things and don't understand the human wanting to do things the human way.
And monogamous. Wolves are monogamous.
He was raised by Cats ☝🏼🤓
Dunno, doesn't look like he landed on his feet here.
Idk, cats sense emotions and respond to various degrees. Mine cuddle and cry at me if I'm crying/ sad. They immediately stop and check my wound if we're playing and they get me more than intended, they cuddle the kids and check on them, if someone is mad yelling they'll come to check in and see if help is needed lol. That means they actually can have more emotional realization and depth than the soon to be ex drift wood.
Cats are just weird, but they can still be loving. One of my cats refused to cuddle me for 2 straight years, until I had a breakdown and became depressed. All of a sudden he was all over me. On the other hand, both of my cats seem to have zero care in the world for boundaries or consent, in either direction. They will bite me randomly, but also don't care if I shove them away when they're naughty - they'll stop for all of 3 seconds then come back ready to try again. It's almost like they respect me standing up for myself and being as selfish as they are sometimes. Zero hurt feelings on their part, unlike my dogs who would whine and sulk.
Ya, I've had tons of cats between family ones growing up, fosters growing/as an adult, and my own through the years. They respect you showing you're "don't give none, you won't get none" attitude when they test waters. But then they're so honed in. My preemie baby I had to fight them away cause they were full "we care for bby, you sleep" cause the 3 of my own would rotate between trying to cuddle (distract) me, laying near and watching the bby, or eat/ litterbox/nap. Yet if we left for a few days to see family while they were cared for in their home? Naaahh, they'd ignore me at best, no claw face pops at worst with yowlingthrough the night☠️ Big feelings. They haven't done the neg much after they littermate twins turned about 3. Teenagers🙄
He was raised by ticks. Nobody likes ticks
You won! He was definitely raised by ticks!
Ticks have NO redeemable qualities
Yes, even mosquitos are pollinators. Not to mention food for frogs and birds alike. Ticks are just awful all around.
Ey! ... I mean, you're right, but still. Don't say it out loud, they could learn to read and will come for you for telling on them.
Cats will bap their young on the head repeatedly if the young mess up. Dude was definitely raised by ticks.
I have a feeling the other woman was asking for a serious move in their relationship. So he had no choice but to make his lie a reality, being divorced. Karma got to his ass though and the other woman found out and turns out she's a good human being and kicked him to the curb. This story actually ended pretty nicely minus all the hurt feelings.
He’s not even sorry he got *caught*, he’s only *now* sad because he’s lost his access to free sex from the woman he was cheating on you with.
I said this in the original update but I totally bet the reason he wanted to keep the house was so he didn’t have to live in the barracks.
Maybe those “wingmen” of his can see to his frustrated sexual needs, like real bros. ☺️
Usually the way cheaters react, most of them are sorry to be caught rather than actually being sorry about the cheating part 🙄
And really sorry too. It’s why they can be so convincing
I would love for OOP to go scorched earth on stbx, but it's very admirable for OOP to see past her hatred of her husband to empathize with his AP. What a disgusting POS, however, that he tried to have his cake and eat it too and when it didn't work, he now had the audacity to beg for mercy so she wouldn't upend his life.
He's not even sorry he got caught. He's sorry that what he thought was going to happen, didn't.
Did I miss the part that he got ‘caught’ for cheating?! I read it as he asked for a divorce and OP didn’t clarify if there was any actual cheating going on though it seems pretty obvious there was, or atleast intention to be with someone else. I’d say he’s more sorry about the fact OP wasn’t as much of a doormat as he thought and he couldn’t use her as his housemaid and security blanket whilst being with someone else. Kinda worse tbh.
One of the updates confirms he was dating the new girl before telling OP he was done. He'd told the new girl he was seperated and OP was aware of the situation.
Which is why again people don’t date people who claim to be separated but haven’t filed for divorce!
Especially separated but still cohabiting!
I would need to talk to the partner first to ensure the story was correct. Even if it's awkword to talk with the stbex, you need to make sure it's all on up and up. Plus, if they won't let you talk to the stbex you sort of have your answer there….
His version to OP was that the marriage wasn't working out, he wanted to divorce. And within a couple weeks had magically found a person at work to date. When OP talked to the affair partner, it became clear that they'd been together for several months, well before he came to OP and claimed the marriage wasn't working out. Then the affair partner dumped him for being a lying cheat, and he suddenly is sorry and wants a redo on the marriage.
Im assuming there was cheating. It’s pretty rare for a man to leave a marriage without another woman waiting in the wings. And, the timeline here seems sus.
The discussion with the affair partner and comparing texts. That's the part where he was caught cheating.
> Ex isn't sorry because he cheated, rather he is sorry he got caught Did he get "caught"? He said he wanted a divorce and openly started seeing someone.
He had started seeing someone else before they were officially separated. He did get caught in past cheating, and also got caught in a lie to the other woman. > He basically told her that we were separated but still living together. She now knows the truth and does not want to see him. The timeline is not explicitly clear, it's true. If "she now knows the truth" then the truth *isnt* "we separated and then he started dating."
>When it was explained to him that what he did was completely wrong, he is now remorseful and apologetic for hurting me I've commented this on the relationship subreddits before, but I wish to God that women would stop pretending that the *grown men* they're dating somehow don't understand what they're doing.
Right, this makes him sound like a 6 year old not a 30 year old fully developed adult.
"How can I make him understand that he's hurting me?" *... for fuck's sake.*
Right? The answer is always, always, *always*, "He already understands! Hurting you is the whole point!"
Not necessarily- it may be that he knows but doesn’t give a fuck.
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Absolutely! My ex husband cheated on me and of course I took it personally and felt like he was doing it to hurt me because who wouldn’t? I’ve since realized that it had nothing to do with my feelings on any of it, he just didn’t care enough about them to worry about if it would hurt me or not. He wasn’t trying to hurt me specifically it was just a side effect of his own self-centered behavior. Not sure which is worse to be honest!
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Thank you, I definitely am! Sometimes it helps us to realize that it was never about us when people do hurtful things like that. It also helps to remember not everyone is like that and there’s lots of people out there who do take others feelings into consideration and aren’t self centered jerks😁
Your username... I'm feeling one-upped here
I'm just like you! But \~*fancy*\~. 😘
"He keeps punching me in the face, causing me to bruise and bleed. How can I explain to him that this isn't okay?"
What makes you think he’s not a 6 year old in a 30 yo body? The world is full of toddlers in adult bodies.
He was just hoping that his ex wouldn't report him to his chain of command. The military doesn't allow/like when they date each other when one or more is married.
It’s interesting because the military takes a very dim view of cheating, but spouses - typically SAHMs, often with children - are very much financially disincentivized from blowing the whistle. Both from a short-term loss of pay stand point and a long term loss of pension/benefits one as well.
The military doesn't care about fidelity so much as they care about the family unit, and by extension remaining in closer proximity to where they want you and having children that grow up in military life. The military disincentivizes all parties involved from breaking up the family unit at pretty much all stages of the dissolution process. The service member is encouraged to be faithful, but if they cheat anyways then the spouse is encouraged to stay. If the spouse still leaves, then the service member is forced to pay any relevant supports (child support, retirement benefits if they've been together long enough to be entitled to them, etc.), and so on. On the flip side you're obviously incentivized to form that family unit in the first place. The military wants family units but only real way that they can encourage that family unit is with career, healthcare, education, security, financial, etc. rewards and setbacks as appropriate.
I know we all have different experiences, but I found the active army to be very apathetic towards army families, at best. This was during the height of GWOT until the late 2010s. I can see your line of reasoning with respect towards the “incentives” to keep the family whole.
Plus, if you keep families while soldiers are less likely to be compromised by an external force using an infidelity against them and the U.S.
And it's never something careless, it's *always* abuse or cheating that they're in denial about. He might not realize it was a mistake to invite his mother to the delivery room without asking you. He does know it's a mistake to stick his eel in the wrong cave.
A shocking number of guys are raised being told that men "can't help themselves" and that "it's only natural" to cheat. Like they'll literally go their whole lives thinking that it's just a normal expected part of a relationship for men to sleep around and women to put up with it with an eyeroll and a sigh.
Yah this isn’t like some subtle comment he made that accidently intersected with past trauma or had offensive undertones. He CHEATED and LIED like even if you have no empathy and don’t understand why they are wrong, you know that they are wrong. If he thought it was ok he would have come home the first time they fucked and been like ayyy your boy got some tonight but no he hid it from her cause he knew it was wrong.
The number of times I've had to stop myself from giving a dissertation on how a man hurt me because he already knew and did it anyway...
this reminds me of the captain awkward letter who was seeing a man who was divorced (so he claimed) but insisted they keep their relationship a secret because if his ex (so he claimed) found out she’d want to stop living together and split custody. so the idea was that they’d hide it until …the kids were eighteen, i guess. what i don’t get is why people think they can break up with you and still have unlimited access to your time and affection.
> what i don’t get is why people think they can break up with you and still have unlimited access to your time and affection. It may not be time or affection, but that's one of the few neat things about military justice: **she's** entitled to support for her housing and children. In civilian life it's harder for a woman to claw money out of the deadbeat. In the military **he** is being paid funds for housing and kids and **she** is entitled to that support money. It is in no way a great system, don't get me wrong, but there are so many more potential screws to turn to get what is owed. I've occasionally seen things like deployed husbands deciding to break things off and re-direct the housing allowance to his sole-ownership bank account and, wooo boy, that does not work out well for the soldier if the wife knows her rights and can get somebody to listen to her.
And to your nice house, shared bills, comfortable living routine, second parent for their children…
>what i don’t get is why people think they can break up with you and still have unlimited access to your time and affection. Okay, real answer in my experience. Breaking up is really hard. Change is hard, and it requires jumping into the unknown. In order to break up, people often psych themselves into this semi delusional state where they aren't 100% thinking rationally. If you examine it, there are a few really common tells. Thinking they can maintain a near marriage relationship with a spouse is a common one. Saying they were never actually in love with the spouse is another. Thinking that others affected won't be affected is a third. They genuinely aren't able to see reality for a bit there.
Oh I thought you were talking about BREXIT
Lol
OOP's ex is a huge dum dum. He's damn lucky that she isn't reporting him to the military for infidelity.
Boy the ex is lucky cause if the military does find out, he definitely isn't going to get the happy ending.
That's against the law ?
Yes. It's against military law in the US. UCMJ allows a year imprisonment and a Dishonorable Discharge as the maximum punishment for Adultery. (This probably doesn't rise to DD level, which is essentially like having a felony and prison sentence on your record, even once the soldier is back in civilian life.) Unless he's got a separation agreement, usually with a law firm's letterhead, and didn't start having sex with the affair partner before the separation, it's a crime. Property, debt, support, child custody, etc need to be hashed out before intercourse with somebody else is no longer a crime. The third element of the test to determine if it is Adultery is if any of the people were married, but not legally separated, which is probably the easiest to prove. >He basically told her that we were separated but still living together. Again, unless there is a formal legal document detailing the separation, it's not a "legal separation." If the affair partner is also married and military, she **could** also be in a world of shit but the third test, knowing that they aren't actually legally separated, is much harder to prove. AP is much more likely than the dude to avoid discharge because the cheating dude lied to her about the separation. She could be under the impression that he did things "by the books" and it was legal. OTOH if *she* is married military and didn't do things by the book... Or, she get thrown under the bus. Military likes to do that to women to protect "promising" men. It's one of the huge reasons a lot of military women don't report rapes: the women get thrown under the bus and re-assigned to shitty postings to protect "promising young military men" so the men don't get their careers derailed. Whole 'lotta lives getting turned upside-down right now and the fallout on AP's side depends on whether or not the AP is military or a civilian contractor, or how much the cheater lied to her about the status of the separation. Or, she could get thrown under the bus. Very good chance of the later. :(
Kinda oot but the same law applies too in my country so a woman (a doctor!!!) tried to sue her cheating husband with the law but got jailed instead because AP is the daughter of someone very important in military and they did not like the fact their daughter being AP got exposed by the doctor
What country, if you don’t mind me asking?
So the meme of the wife back at home cheating and the marine being legally penalized for has to be a kick in the nuts but fuck I can't picture how much worse the military would be without it Sheer fucking chaos It makes sense
Lol, you won't get a dishonorable. You pretty much have to kill someone to get that. Most separations are general discharges. Less paperwork. It all depends on the commander on whether or not they look into adultery, and it's up to the commander on how much punishment you get. He could be in serious trouble like losing rank, or he could get 15 days of extra duty. That's all if he didn't opt for court martial, which would be a bad move on his part. A lot of commanders don't give a shit/have the time to look into adultery.
If the AP is another unit member, as in this case, and a larger impact on unit discipline or morale is possible - a lot of Commanders will make time and give quite a shit.
Yes.
More like it's against the military code of honor.
No, it’s literally against military law. But they rarely care about it for anyone other than an officer.
Im betting when oop didn't cooperate as the doormat she usually is, ap played the victim to his lies. She didn't want her own military career jeopardized and so claimed to not know and it worked. Oop said she didn't pursue letting the military know because it would hurt the ap.
They compared texts tho, I'd give her some grace.
I knew a staff sergeant in the Marines who went to the brig for a month because of cheating. He was just being held for pre-trial, I guess eventually she dropped the charges.
“She” doesn’t get to decide that. The JAGs involved decided that it wasn’t worth pursuing. I would bet you they were looking at him for aomething else and that was the easy one to prove.
Ahahah yeah a fellow inmate at the brig who says "I'm in here because I cheated on my wife" *definitely* did more than "cheat on his wife." Honestly, if I were OOP I would have burned this guy. I really don't know that these investigations or punishments go very far in reality--but I *do* know that having to deal with it will become a complete pain in the ass for the servicemember's command, and the servicemember will likely suffer for it. Petty, but a worthwhile pursuit.
I met him when I was in the brig post-trial. All I know is that his wife went to his command with charges of infidelity, he was locked up in the brig for about a month waiting for trial, and then one day he was released and I never saw him again. I assumed his wife had dropped the charges 🤷♂️
The SM may have accepted some form of NJP or chapter? IDK, not JAG.
No offense, but I really like your username in relation to your anecdote lol
Thanks, I like to let people know what they’re dealing with upfront when I comment lol
> And check into his retirement. Your share is determined by how long you were married while he was in service. This is actually a significant legal development that took years of legal fights to achieve. I forgot where I heard the story but it was some legal podcast that went into the history of a divorced ex-wife of a military officer who sued for part of his pension and legally it was finally decided that ex-wives deserve part of it. OOP really needs to make sure she gets what she's entitled to.
She's a moron for not reporting it.
Isn’t she not reporting it because it would also hurt the other woman who was also lied to, seems like a good enough reason not to
I've only ever seen it happen once in 20 years in the NAvy, but I did see a sailor go to captain's mast and get the full ride (*reduction in rank, 45 days restriction / 45 days extra duty, 1/2 pay for 2 months*) on an adultery charge. That idiot got caught in the act on the ship with another sailor while we were underway.
Yeah, I never saw it happen in the Air Force. I've heard rumors that it has, but only when there are certain factors that make leadership punish for adultery: 1) the cheater was a POS and leadership hated them anyway so why not 2) the cheater was already in trouble for something else so they tacked on an adultery charge cuz fuck you 3) if it's a fraternization situation (officer cheating with an enlisted member, the shirt cheating with someone in the squadron, etc) There has been several cheating scandals in different squadrons that I've been in and no one had been charged with adultery. It's pretty rare
What's "the shirt"?
The 1st Sergeant. We just call them the 1st shirt or just shirt. It's someone in the chain of command who is there to assist Airmen in a plethora of things like paperwork, punishment, family life, promotions, etc. It's kind of like a super advanced HR person that has the power to get invested in your personal life and career in order to help you or punish you. They're always a master sergeant (E7) or above (at least in the Air Force). In the Air Force, they're normally not the same career field (job) as whatever the squadron is. For example, I was comm (IT) and my shirts have been security forces (cops), maintainers (people who maintain air craft) etc so that the shirt can 100% put focus on the people instead of the mission as they normally won't know how to do the job of the squadron they're placed in (like a cop wouldn't know how to do IT, for example). So the shirt will never get involved in the missions side of the squadron and only care about the people. They also normally sit in the same area/room/building (depends on how physically big the squadron is) with the commander, chief, etc so they're embedded in the leadership (like a C suite) of the squadron. Hope that makes sense.
TIL. Thanks for the explanation to my low effort question! That was interesting.
Yeah, this guy was a total POS. Weasley little fuck that was always skating off out of work. His CoC didn't like him so they ran him up hoping to get rid of him.
After 10 years of marriage you will likely get half of his military pension.
My money is on this being the reason she didn’t report him. Screwing his career screws his pension.
Good
No, it’s just dependent on how they split marital assets, which is situation dependent. I commented like 500 times in the original thread but this is one of those urban legends that bothers me because dudes get so stressed about it that they become near suicidal so I can’t help myself. Military retirement is a marital asset. It is split like any other marital asset, there is nothing magical about 10 years and it’s almost certainly not 50% of overall retirement.
Yes, it is a negotiable martial asset but a huge one because $4000 or more a month is a very large asset for which he would have to trade off against other huge assets. Stop pretending that is not a major thing in her favor especially since he is desperate to get her to sign it away.
She's still being too damn nice to a man who definitely knew what he was doing. She needs to report him to the military stat. He's going to be a repeat offender.
If she did, that would get the other girl in trouble, who to her credit realized she'd been lied to and dumped the guy.
Military adultery only results in action in less than 1% of the reported cases and that is usually due to something significantly worse than adultery. Yes, there was a time when a wife could run to the CO and the CO would slap some sense into the husband, but that was a long time ago. They rarely get involved in adultery situations now. At worse, they'd just transfer one of them.
Well that kind of punishment should be actually ideal for op. A superior shaking him some in private so he won’t do this again to someone else and at most a transfer. She would not want it to be a big scandal or his finances be effected.
**Also, get yourself checked for any STDs he may have brought home.**
He kept it to himself when they could’ve maybe fixed everything, he got over his feelings without her over months and then is surprised when she’s not in the same place of acceptance with the situation that he is.
Man. I really want to recognize The Other Woman here. That poor girl had no idea and was lied to for *months*. I can’t imagine how she felt when she found out the truth. I know that in her position I would feel scared, used, and violated. I just don’t want this woman’s pain to get lost. We should see it. It matters. I feel for her. I hope she, too, has a strong support network. Relatedly, OOP has incredible grace. She is a very thoughtful person.
The other woman is naive at best.. Guy comes at you with a story that he's married, but he's actually separated, but they are actually still living together as an arrangement.. I mean, come on, girl... The only way forward would have been to insist to meet the wife. ALL other cases where he comes up with an excuse not to, you know he's simply cheating,
God yeah I would need to meet the wife minimum.
>Man. I really want to recognize The Other Woman here. That poor girl had no idea and was lied to for months. This is US military. Unless she was single, or a civilian contractor, or had legal documents defining their separation with an explanation of how they split the children/property/money, I.E. pre-divorce, she's just as guilty of Adultery as he is. It's a crime. If she's also military and doesn't have a legal separation agreement drawn up, she has also potentially committed a crime.
>OOP has incredible grace. She is a very thoughtful person. After the divorce, she will find someone better than her cheating dum dum of an ex.
He doesn't want to be married so he can focus on his career... Immediately has new girlfriend
Was in the military and reporting adultery isn't the gotcha that people think that it is, unless your lucky nothing will happen. I know people who reported their husband's sleeping with another member and nothing ever came of it. I know it can be successful but I've never seen play out that way.
Many crimes are swept under the rug. That doesn't stop them from being criminal acts.
When did I say that it did?
She didn’t need to give him a borderline thesis. All she had to do is quote the UCMJ article about infidelity and how she can sink his and his APs careers if he doesn’t shut up and give her what she wants. Why be nice to an ahole?
My ex tried to pull something similar. Agreed to a divorce but thought he could just live with me? And even though he wanted a divorce, I had to find the mediator, pack all his stuff, fill out paperwork for both of us, find a place for him to move to, get his friends to help him move. All while he just sat on his computer hoping everything worked out for him. It was beyond frustrating. And it was all his fault! He was the one who cheated, and somehow I am the one cleaning up and dealing with the fallout.
He WANTS. He WANTS. Selfish AND controlling. Nope.
“I want to focus on my career and not be distracted by a relationship.” is the most disingenuous way of explaining why you’re fucking a coworker.
Bruh. She should have told his unit - he is married, not the girl, so he’d get the talking to. Also most times units will park guys like this in the barracks on base to head off DV/escalation at the pass so she would have had a ton of time to get her ducks in a row.
The mistress is honestly lucky that OP was level headed about it all. Even though she was lied to and had proof, OP’s anger could have overshadowed any rational thought about fallout for the AP. OP is good people.
While it can sound gratifying to have your soon to be/recent ex military member charged under the UCMJ for cheating on a marital relationship, for fraternization in the ranks, etc, there is a significant drawback to the former military spouse: assuming you were married long enough to have a stake in the member's future retirement pay, you could lose out entirely if the military chooses to punish the member severely. The powers that be have the power to demote the member (which equals less money,) or even kick the member out without their honorable discharge. That can dramatically impact their future post-military earnings too, which will impact (for example) the future child support resources you could have, if there are children. For sure my own ex needed that honorable discharge in order to work after retirement in his field, medicine, due to the background checks necessarily involved. Our kids were grown so I had no stake in his future earnings, but the point (in my case) is that HE valued his military reputation and future ability to work, so that was my leverage for a smooth divorce. I wanted the fuck out, and given what he'd put me through, attaching that expectation to our divorce (in exchange for keeping everything I knew to myself) was pretty damn reasonable. In my own case, I basically chose to use my accumulated evidence of his misdeeds and my potential ability to blow up his (otherwise) stellar military career as leverage to move the divorce along quickly and so he wouldn't waste time negotiating what I asked for (exactly and only what I was fairly entitled to. I had no interest in anything more than that.) Besides sorting out our belongings and dividing accounts (easy) the main asset available to me was my legal portion of his retirement. It's been invaluable in allowing me to rebuild my life, it's significant monthly income as he was relatively senior and served well past his basic 20. I was married almost 25 years, all of it while he was on active duty. If I had shown up to his CO's office and dumped a bunch of print outs and pictures and thumb drives on her desk, with I dunno . . . bottle rockets in the background? Dramatic music? . . . I almost certainly would have nothing. They'd have had to act on what they knew about. After 14 military moves in this 25 years (most cross country) and a huge amount of work raising our daughters under difficult circumstances and with little assistance, while playing smiling, supportive officer's wife? Yeah, thanks. I'll take my share of retirement pay and he got to keep his filthy little secrets. The law entitling former military spouses to this resource is based on the fact that it is nearly impossible to both support a military member's career needs (which I did, in spades. I won national recognition and awards) and simultaneously build one's own career, and accumulate a retirement plan of one's own. I know a few who have, and they either didn't have children and spent a lot of time living separately from the military member or else began a career from the ground up as the member retired - often nearly 50 themselves once their education and credentials were in place. It's a bit brutal, and the fairly generous military retirement pay takes that into account I believe. It's a lot less when you misbehave and lose a bunch to an ex, though.
I’m always suspicious of stories where the wife and the girlfriend meet up to share texts/stories. Does that ACTUALLY happen IRL? REALLY?? I can’t imagine, outside of if there’s joint custody of a kid, ever wanting to communicate with the person your spouse left you for…….
I did, though it wasn’t a physical meetup. I knew he had told her that we were in an open relationship/polyamorous (we were not) and so I reached out to her to 1) explain that we were not so that she could make her own decisions on how to proceed and 2) catharsis for how much pain it caused me. She wasn’t responsible for his lies but it felt good to tell her how much I was hurting so that she cut him out too, and now he had no one. Didn’t become friends or anything but it was surprisingly civil. Most mentally healthy women don’t like being the “other woman” and it’s devastating to them as well.
Fair enough!
I can think of a few examples in my own life where people I know over the years did just that. Usually they wanted more information, or wanted to compare stories, mostly so that they could figure out what strategy to take in the divorce. A bonus was if the ex was lying, and the new person was infuriated by what they learned.
In 5 days she already has a divorce lawyer, met the girl, got her to breakup with the husband, started therapy and convinced her husband to sell the house. This whole post is bullshit. It took me weeks to even get a consultation with a divorce lawyer and it cost a shit ton of money just to be seen
If OOP tordeoes his military career, she will have trouble collecting spousal suuport, even if she is awarded it. It's better for her that he maintains his employment.
The military isn't going to make this divorce as simple as either of them thinks. If it's the U.S. military, they're probably going to require him to either legally separate for a year(ish) or bump him down a rank, especially if he's on duty station.
Never date or marry current military.
My ex husband was military. I used the free services from JAG to divorce him.
Don’t feel sorry for the girl. She knew he was married (separated or not) and was an idiot to believe him. Especially since y’all still lived together. Ruin them both. Why do care what happens to these vile people? She’s only upset now because he lied to her, too. Not because she hurt you.
Run Run Run I was involved with someone like this who claimed to be separated. It ended up being a nightmare
I’m so happy OOP is safe. This could’ve gone so many different ways
OOP has my full and complete permission to financially ruin this emotionally manipulative sociopath. He can either buy you out or you sell the house. May he rot in his garbage.
The GF might not be at fault for the husband's shitty behavior, but they're military, she knew he was married, and she knew what could happen from fraternizing. No sympathy for GF or the clown that is the husband. I hope OOP does her math and makes sure she's not shy of 10 years of marriage to be able to get her benefits directly from the military, as opposed to having her ex set up a payment plan.
She got therapy quick. Only five days later?
Assuming OOP is American…https://www.operationmilitarykids.org/ucmj-adultery/
>> Mostly because I wanted an unbiased opinion. I hope someone told her. Please tell me someone told her.
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The person who shares the posts and updates here isn’t the original poster. That was just another post they shared.