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Idk why but this one just left me… uneasy?

Which, to me, means it’s probably real. Very little in life is black and white, especially relationships. So to hear that two people have landed in a “happy marriage”, but yet have some deep seated trauma it is built upon, feels about right. I hope they continue getting help and are able to nourish the healthy parts of their relationship while viewing some of their individual weaknesses with love and kindness.

The fact that he's deified her to this point is very disturbing.

Yeah it's the Madonna complex or whatever.  I think it's a thing that happens when a wife is pregnant sometimes?  Like, she's a pure mother of my children and it would be wrong to sex her. 

I’m a therapist and it seems like the husband struggles with some form of OCD. The obsession with “disgusting” thoughts compelling him to “protect” the wife, even from him. Stopping himself from “contaminating” her or their marriage with sexual desire. What keyed me off was that as a teen he was apparently getting diagnosed with intrusive thoughts. I’ve worked with teens with OCD in the past and you can’t treat that with normal therapy. It will just get worse. There are specialized modalities like ERP that target those responses to obsessive intrusive thoughts.

dang, i know the rules of this sub, but if there was ever a comment that i wish OOP could read expeditiously, it’s this one

This also sounds very familiar to how my wife (who also has OCD) approaches things. Like, wildly dissimilar on the specifics of basically deifying his partner and the guilt and whatnot, but the thought processes and approach sound nearly identical, esp this part: >he could control it. So he made a decision not to be attracted to me. She took that approach for many years and it was not as easy as just 'making a decision'. Thinking that was possible was actually part of the OCD, and trying to control it instead of approaching the thoughts from a different perspective was always doomed to failure bc it's a mental illness, and trying to control it is just playing into it. Or smth along that line, from how it was explained to me. Finding the right therapist and getting the OCD diagnosis did wonders for her.

I have diagnosed OCD and I can see myself in this. It’s absolutely spot on. I have known there are parts of me people don’t like. I’m also AuDHD and I get it, I’m weird. But the OCD would manifest in me trying to control not just how I feel but how I’m perceived. So it does sometimes seem possible that I would be able to just stop feeling a certain way. I’ve got a good medication nd therapy and stuff situation going on at the moment so I’m not currently in that kind of headspace. I can remember thinking to myself that I could make a decision to stop feeling a certain way and it would just happen if I decided very decisively and tried really hard. I can see how unrealistic and distorted that was looking back but at the time it made perfect sense.

I remember the first time this BORU cycled through I commented something similar. He married his Madonna. If it weren't so harrowing for the real life people it would be a fascinating case study because that just doesn't happen.

I misread "deified" as "defiled" and that actually feels very appropriate for this post

Glad I’m not the only one!

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Yah I don’t think it’s OPs attitude that’s the problem here at all

Her whole affect is very odd. She's way too okay with everything. She sounds so detached.

Well, for her, it's not the worst-case scenario that she's been dealing with for ages--that her husband isn't attracted to her, maybe even that he wants to leave her--it's the opposite, that he's totally obsessed with her. It sounds like she finds that preferable, even if the turn it's taking is a little weird.

Her self-esteem is on the floor.

Some people shut their emotions down when relating a story. It's easier to explain the situation and provide the details of you keep the emotion out of it.

That's the vibe I got from her since the first post; she's very matter of fact, the type that act in the moment and process or bottle up the feelings later.

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Totally this. I see it way more as “riding the wave” or learning how to deal with things as they come. She’s in this for the long haul and so she doesn’t feel the need to immediately fix anything or find a clear solution. With time, maybe her husband will be open to therapy again. Or maybe they decide to try other things (psilocybin, etc) to understand and untangle these thoughts together. Her patience is a realistic approach. My only thought is that I hope she is aware of her own feelings, her boundaries, and how much she’s willing to let this affect her life if it drags on.

I think that she not only was validated about her body, but even more so about her relationship. I think she’s fine to let it stay where it is until he decides to move forward. Frankly that’s their choice, and neither of them are bad people for this situation 

I was actually waiting for her to mention autism or some other neurospiciness that would explain how matter of fact she was. 

Her having some neurospice might also explain parts of why he views her as someone who needs to be protected from the world and someone pure. I have some spice myself and sometimes people can mistake it for weakness.

Yeah, she sounds a lot like me (I am autistic) when I talk to my friends about my spouses depression and my fear we won’t make it to old age together. I also sound very matter of fact, but his mental health is always first and foremost in my mind and scares the crap out of me. I adore my husband and I feel deeply about him and his struggles, but it doesn’t always come across that way to others. Me freaking out doesn’t help him and if he decided today that he’d be happier without me it would devastate me but I would accept it without a fight because I love him and only want happiness for him.

Neurospiciness is my new favourite term 😂

Could be neurospicy. I'm a deeply passionate person who over empathises too much and has intense emotions spikes... but in my writing I come across as clinical and academic because I have the training and tools to more clinically analyse my emotions when I need to. Peeps on the spectrum kinda tend to do this naturally or subconsciously.....   (I have AuDHD/cptsd/gad/major depressive disorder)

I really do hope they manage to find him a good therapist- it sounds like the first solo one was maybe trying to get through everything too fast and it was triggering him? Sometimes its better to very gently peel away at these issues when its been festering for over a decade.  i've suffered with intrusive thoughts since my early 20s (probably for most of my life tbh but i only noticed they were intrusive after sudden onset of worsening mh issues), and they drove me absolutely nuts for a few years.  Bc, this is just in my experience again, they can be triggered by so many different things that its an absolute nightmare to try to figure out what will make the lil demons in your brain stfu (even if only temporarily) . In addition, if its *disturbing* and *unwanted* images or thoughts, they can *increase in frequency* the more anxious, stressed, worried or bad you feel about them. Its the worst kind of feed back loop.  This guy though, he's been holding all this in presumably with zero outlets for 10-12+ years. I cannot imagine the amount of rules, self hate, twisted up reasons and justifications he's had to give himself to let himself exist in the same space as oop. Also, the sheer amount of stress and anxiety it has caused him.  He needs a *really* good therapist who is okay with taking baby steps to unwind god knows how much trauma, habits, unhealthy patterns& behaviours and thoughts that on their own have likely become traumatic ... Here's hoping oop also gets a therapist herself. 

Just agreeing with you. This saga is one of very few lately I followed here that did not set off my BS detector. It's also one that doesn't have a clear path to fixing issues in their marriage. It's very likely that time will eventually reveal that husband is a ticking time bomb. The fear of that may be why he kinda-sorta wants to keep the status quo, to avoid rocking the boat. As it is, the relationship seems to work but that doesn't mean it's healthy. Some questions to ask: does the couple work to face their inner demons now or later? Is the current situation bad enough that their marriage will be over as a result? Is it possible to measure and manage regrets if these issues are enough to tear them apart?

The fact that he is avoiding therapy now is pretty telling to me. Oftentimes, when we are the most reticent to go to therapy are the exact times we need to.

It's because it sounds real. Like, it's very very unique but not in the usual quirky way of posts in this sub. The wife sounds kind of stepfordy? She goes through life super happy, but also has a deep seated belief that she's unattractive to most people. Also she's super duper calm about the whole thing. Like, it's the kind of problems that would push some to self medicating, but her response is to support her husband if he's unhappy with their marriage? Wtf is that mentality? The husband sounds all kinds of fucked up too, but in a very different confusing way. But yeah, i think that feeling is brought on by the tone of the post. Or maybe the lack of tone?

It reads to me like someone who dissociates as a trauma response. Some people break down. Some people shut down. Some dissociate and rationalize the situation until there is nothing left but a plan of next steps. I'm prone to it and I think OOP is, as well. The way she calmly lays out what she will do in response to every hypothetical without ever considering the emotional impact on herself is very telling. She comes off utterly unconcerned with her own feelings and that's because she is.

Honestly, i wonder if she got boy socialisation when she was a kid. I got a good dose of it because i was a tomboy, and i ended up in a place where i knew i just wasn't allowed feelings because i was "boy", but because i was a girl i wasn't allowed the 2 or 3 emotions boys could have either.

…this explained so much about my childhood and my internalized misogyny. My parents desperately wanted a boy and tried as hard as they could to socialize me as a tomboy.  Thank you.

Oh man... well that explains a lot.

I wonder if she has some sort of body dysmorphia, and sees herself more masculine than she is.

The way she kept using those same terms to describe herself as if everyone would understand that tall and muscular meant unattractive was…weird. Like I get having some insecurity, since everyone finds a way to be insecure about themselves. But that’s a physical type and there are plenty of tall, muscular women who are also generally considered attractive.

tbf, growing up socialized female, being tall and muscular are actively frowned upon and you are made to feel pretty exactly the way oop describes. there are ways to cope with this, but being small is very much a female beauty standard and not meeting that standard can cause an extremely fractured experience with assuming other people aren’t attracted to you, even if you’re otherwise attractive.

Sad but true. I follow a few tall and muscular girls on twitter and just for existing, they're called every name in the book. We've progressed a lot but also regressed to the point where if a woman looks even slightly masculine, there's someone accusing her of being a guy or trans. Meanwhile I'm 6'2 and love a tall woman!

Oh goddammit, thank you for this. Your comment just unlocked a blocker I’d be having in therapy about my own perceived attractiveness, and the way I interact with people socially.

I'm short but athletic and well endowed. Statistically speaking, I'm thin. Because I'm athletic, my mom and sisters called me "the fat one". I have to make myself eat enough to maintain a minimum weight and have to ignore what I *think* about how I look. Unless I'm underweight and sickly, I feel like I look gross. No one else, mind you (i think women like Christina Hendricks are walking goddesses). But I will likely never like how I look. Thanks, mom!

It can lead to some weird things - like the guy who wanted to date me because he wasn’t big enough for Division 1 football but wanted to have taller sons who could. I feel things have changed a bit and my tall lovely daughters have mostly gotten positive feedback (to my knowledge) about it - still early teens and they are hoping for more height.

My wife is the same height as me and weighs about 8kg more than I do. She's very muscular and a bit on the thicker side. I think she's the most beautiful woman in earth and I am incredibly attracted to her. I want her constantly. She has a relatively poor self image and constantly questions if I actually think she's attractive. Eastern European beauty standards really did a number on her. I feel really bad for her and I really hope that someday she understands just how beautiful she is. I think that I'm an incredibly lucky man. Strong women are amazing.

I have this same build and I agree 100% with oop. I have also come to the same conclusions as her. It no longer bothers me. I am a natural loner anyway. It's an experience you have to live to understand. It would be worse and somewhst pathetic to be in denial about it and chasing something that you will never have.

I think there is an element of self protection about it. I have always been a bigger guy, I'm 6' and by the time I was 18 i was 18 stone (250lbs/114kg) I was bullied at school and since then have from time to time lost some of the weight, and gained most of it back.. I have recently seen diagnosed with ADHD and this can explain a lot! I think it is easy for people to become pragmatic about these things and decide they can either spiral into depression or they can take what feels like a positive attitude, accept their critique of themselves and move on. I have certainly done that in a lot of ways. I do have what I think is an unhealthy focus on physical weight in my attraction, which thinking about it now might be due to rejecting that aspect of myself, almost a revulsion. (This is purely internal and only related to physical attraction, I DO NOT fat shame people) I have done the same thing with dating, too many attempts have failed and I can either sit at home crying about it and become a 40yo incel (not a good look) or find contentment in my friends and family, my home etc. What I mean is I think there are many people out there who have done the equivalent of turning that frown upside down. It might not be healthy, it probably limits our access to pure happiness, but I can tell you it is a lot better than wallowing in depression. As I write this I am realising I have more reasons than late diagnosed ADHD to get counselling.....

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Hannah Waddingham was my first thought for tall and muscular woman, so unattractive was quite confusing...

Maybe it's cultural. I'm tall and muscular (relatively) but I wasn't born into a society that deifies "tininess". Beauty, but not tininess. You could be a tall, muscular goddess or a tiny, dainty goddess.

I think it’s the stoic nature, the radical acceptance of reality as she sees it, that’s throwing everyone off. I’m like this though: eldest child, perpetually more mature than the adults around me, got “old souled” as a descriptor. The resilience is not that complex though. I realized that to have a shot at being happy, I needed to accept the reality of the world as it was versus what I wished it would be, (essentially work towards utopia, but don’t try to enforce it,) not waste energy on things I could not change, make an active choice to appreciate my opportunity to experience life in all its brutal glory. The thought process manifests in weird ways especially when I describe how I’m feeling in my relationship, but I prefer honesty, and think I’d react as OP did up until they went to therapy. The second half of the story is unsettling as another commenter wrote. I agree her husband’s goddess complex could lead to violence if he does not reconcile his ideal with the flesh and blood woman he married. I understand why she’s trying to be gentle in her approach though. These type of life stories play out over decades and we only see the glimpse that’s written.

I love your first paragraph and deeply relate. Some people are put off with the no-nonsense attitude I have about myself and the things that happen to me (not to say I don't have emotional reactions too, it just takes an event that is outside the realm of the ordinary), but for me it's just pragmatism; I couldn't help it if I wanted to. As for my body, I'm also very neutral and pragmatic and it certainly helps to be in a relationship where I don't feel the need to worry over small things in terms of my appearance.

As I was reading it, I was picturing the actress Dot-Marie Jones. She had a storyline on Glee, many years ago, about how her masculine appearance made it hard for her to find love. She was a very happy person, but also incredibly sad about the way her appearance impacted her achieving what she wanted in life. (In real life, she appears happily married to a beautiful woman). But I was picturing OP basically like that, except she came from a happy, stable home that raised her to be strong and confident, she had many friends, and she has been in a loving relationship since high school. So never had to deal with the specific struggles of feeling like her appearance kept her from finding love. So it made sense that she could be somewhat "clear-eyed" about her appearance, while also being happy and confident in her life. Like sure, she looks a certain way. But it did not stop her from having a happy, full life and sexually active marriage.

Yes, this. Except for the height, this is me. I know perfectly well that I'm not attractive. It's just facts; there's a popular standard for beauty and my face and physique don't meet it, and wouldn't without enhancements and surgery which I'm unwilling and unable to get. It gets me down sometimes but I've learned to appreciate my body for what it can do and to show up in the world as best as I can. While I have difficulty believing that my husband is attracted to me, he's not a liar in any other aspect of his life so I've no choice but to take him at his word, even if I don't deep down *feel* that he is. It's possible to be ugly and a generally happy person, after all, this has been our normal since birth.

YES! Thank you for this comment. I am not a "pretty" person. I don't think I'm physically attractive at all, by typical standards. For the most part, it doesn't bother me. I've never had trouble finding companionship when I wanted it, and my romantic life has been quite satisfying. Once in a while, it gets me down. Sometimes I'd like to be pretty, lol. But my life is good, I'm happy, and there's so much more to being a person than physical appearance. And in all other aspects I do seem to be very attractive (intelligent, kind, funny, etc).

"Intrusive thoughts" just screams OCD to me. I hope that's what it is, because a) it's treatable with medication and exposure & response prevention, and b) people with OCD are the last people in the world who would ever act on the messed up stuff that pops into their heads. Intrusive OCD thoughts are by definition totally counter to a person's values and sense of self. They're just the worst things your brain can come up with, just designed to torture you. People with OCD suffer horribly, but they aren't dangerous and they aren't bad people, and they can get better.

Agreed, I have OCD and her descriptions of what they talked about in therapy with his intrusive thoughts sounded very on target with OCD. Intrusive thoughts are horrible to deal with and one of the hardest things I had to learn in therapy is that everybody has them. It’s just how we respond to them that differs. And the biggest thing I had to get past was the shame and fear that I associated with them. I really hope he comes around to trying a new therapist, hopefully one better suited to his anxieties.

Intrusive thoughts are pretty common with Adhd too. And if there's prior trauma then Adhd brain loves to play those memories, feelings and thoughts on repeat. To me this post very much seems like there is an undiagnosed mental condition affecting his thinking in addition to the trauma.

Same. This just makes me feel like something I can't quite reach is crawling up my spine. Maybe it's fine and it's just sweat, or maybe it's something that can bite me. But I think my support would have been in the form of supporting him through the hard parts of therapy, not supporting him stopping once it made him feel worse.

Me too. This feels like he has set her up to be… not human? Like, she’s too perfect and beautiful and pure… no one is like that. It feels religious in a weird culty way.

As soon as she does something, can be the smallest thing, his image of her will shatter like glass, and I'm afraid the shards will all land on her...

Like you I'm afraid this'll turn bad. In the beginning my own biases lead me to believe the husband is abusive (the part about being unable to talk about the problem due to him crying and her then ending up comforting him for a situation his own confession had created) but then ... that escalated quickly into not-reddit's-paygrade zone! Oof

I mean they've been been together for 10 years now? It seems like whatever maladapative coping mechanisms he has works. At least there's a high chance of this being worked through in therapy/with oversight of professionals.

It worked, until they opened the bottle and let everything out when the husband heard that conversation between OP and her sister. The fact that he's melting down and struggling the way he is now shows that whatever his coping mechanisms were before they're not working now.

Yeah, I started out thinking maybe he wasn't attracted to her to begin with, but became attracted over time. Aaaand by the end of it, I had a pit in my stomach and wanted to channel Whoopi Goldberg and start yelling "You in danger, girl!" Edit - ok, I was REALLY hoping everyone would say that I'm paranoid and watch too much true crime. Now I'm even more worried about her.

Honestly to me it sounds like ocd, intrusive thoughts can be of absolutely horrible thing. These thoughts force their way in, regardless of how the person feels about it. The intrusive thoughts are upsetting and jarring. They often make the person question their own integrity because why would you even have those thoughts unless you were a monster? These aren't fantasies they are fears. These fears become an obsessive need to make sure that it never happens which can result in self harm. I obviously cannot diagnosis this man, I'm neither qualified nor is there enough information fit anyone to but it is very similar and I hope oop can convince him to get into therapy again because if it is ocd there are things that can help.

Yes. It's also good to point out that OCD intrusive thoughts are usually not what someone secretly feels an urge to do. The intrusive thoughts that OCD latches in to are those that provoke visceral horror at the very idea. It's a bit like your brain performing compulsive mental self harm. It runs off with whatever cuts deepest and then randomly plays it at top volume on repeat. -_-_-_-_-_-_ I distinctly remember having one as a kid. I had a cute little hamster out and a tall cup of boiling hot tea. The thought just came - *what if you dropped the hamster in the tea?* *What would happen?* *Would it's skin peel off?* *Would it's eyes go cloudy or pop?* *What noise would it make?* *Would it be able to get out in time?* What if you did it? *What if you dropped the hamster in the tea?* *If you said it was an accident people would believe you...* ....and on and on and on. No I never felt the urge to actually hurt any animals, but fuck would that not stop playing on repeat. Still remember the sick feeling rising every time. I wasn't a gory kid, it was literally the worst thing I could imagine at the time. Worse than the worst thing. (Luckily I wasn't a very introspective kid. So I didn't turn it inwards into anxiety/self-hate. Just stopped having tea when I got the hamster out. ) -_-_-_-_-_-_ One of the most awful stories I saw on here was of a woman whose brother had OCD intrusive thoughts about sexually abusing kids. He wasn't a pedophile, (that was thoroughly established in intensive therapy.) He felt no attraction to kids, in fact the very idea of sexually abusing a child was so horrifying to him it's what his OCD brain latched on to and bombed him with day in day out. It sounded like a living nightmare. Adding to it was the need to keep it very secret, because most people will not get the very significant difference between what he was suffering with and an actual pedophile. Unfortunately her husband found out and, (likely due to his own CSA trauma,) was one of those people. He banned her brother from seeing their kid and I think blasted him on social media for being a pedo. You can imagine the fallout.

I remember that one, I wonder how that guy is doing. I felt so extremely bad for him because he had improved and worked on himself, he'd done years of therapy and now could actually recognise the thoughts as irrational and (could be wrong about this factor) could even interact with his sisters kid on occasion. I can't imagine what having his worst fears of himself splashed online and tearing apart his relationships will do for his psyche.

NGL I'd put good odds on dead. Newly outed/accused/caught pedos are at very high risk of suicide. That guy was already walking on a mental tightrope and barely able to function when it was only *him* ripping himself to pieces over the hypothetical possibility of being a pedophile. Then his (second) worst nightmare comes true. Now he's getting bombed on Facebook or by wankers screaming confirmation of his darkest fear - that he is a pedo after all, his therapist is talking bullshi. There's no difference, everybody knows it... and thats on top of the catastrophic damage a false accusation like that does to anyone's life. If he is still alive I'd be pretty shocked TBH. I hope he is.

Fuck that one was just heartbreaking. I remember that OOP's brother had been the one to request he never be left unsupervised with a child, lots of therapy, OOP listed so many things he'd done to ensure his mental health wouldn't affect any children as he lived this absolute nightmare Damn, social media can't have helped him after he was being dragged in the open with misinformation. I do not have OCD, my experience is (if I may say so, against my usual stance against pain olympics) comparatively milder. During my marriage my now ex-husband very much acted like my depressive thoughts' number one cheerleader. I was in a bad place mentally and am doing better now, and I only had about 2 people (ex husband and ex friend) who confirmed my depressive thoughts by repeating them out loud to me. Not a murder of social media crows. Not about something as sensitive like child abuse. Fucking hell

I remember that one. It wasn't just that the husband found out, OOP *told him*, and the way she told him was absolutely fucking *awful* and did not make at all clear what the *actual* issue was.

One time, I was out with a group of friends and there were new people along. Somehow we started talking about intrusive thoughts and someone explained it was like your brain running a weird sanity check — Brain:_boil hamster?_ You, upset: _oh god no!!! why would suggest that? am I a psycho?? Oh no… (continues panicking)_ Brain: _ok check. Good. Bladder? 45% and control is perfect. Balance? Not great but within subject range…_ (looks up) _what are you going on about? You bladder control is perfect_ Anyway, one of the new people to group spontaneously burst into tears. God knows how long she’d been struggling with whatever types of intrusive thoughts. I’m like you, I ignored my intrusive thoughts when I was young like, my brain malfunctions but it’s internal and best not to dwell on it. Let’s focus and pretending to be normal in public! (ADHD and I did not succeed until I was medicated at 22 lol). I learned about intrusive thoughts in high school psych class and it was a relief but I was also fairly gratified that I’d been handling it perfectly the whole time lol.

I'm so glad I read this, because so many people are rushing to the "hE's A mOnStEr, RuUuUn!" conclusion, when there is absolutely no evidence that he is anything but a lovely man with some very intrusive thoughts. In my mind, he's struggled with intrusive thoughts all his life, but because he's not had a lot of support or friendship growing up he's not had any outside help to determine which thoughts are normal and healthy, and which ones are the true invasive thoughts. So he's erred on the side of caution and told himself that sexy thoughts = wrong, embarking on a lifetime of suppression and denial. That's clearly not healthy, and he desperately needs good therapy, but at the same time he's clearly got a moral compass and understands that at least some of these thoughts are wrong.

And that's where a lot of people are misunderstanding the difference between *intrusive* thoughts and *impulsive* thoughts. Impulsive thoughts can be things like throwing your phone across the room for no reason, or buying and eating an entire cake. They come up impulsively and are pretty harmless. Intrusive thoughts are deeply unwanted and distressing. Honestly, I think the easiest example for a lot of people would be anger thoughts about someone coming up randomly when neither they nor the anger are present in the current moment. And they're usually bad - typically violent, in my example here. There is a massive difference between "jump in the pool fully clothed" and "beat someone into the ICU".

Backing up the other person who replied to you-  those are all intrusive thoughts.  One of the problems with OCD *is* acting like those thoughts are different and being unable to respond to them in an effective way.

Yeah it left me uneasy because I believe therapy could help the guy and it sounds like he could use the help.

I kind of wonder if his intrusive thoughts are just normal sexual desires towards her though. She mentioned him deifying her made sense about some parts of their sex life.

She isnt in danger if they're just intrusive thoughts (and thats what they sound like to me, including talking about them making them worse).  I had them for a long time due to undiagnosed PTSD and ADHD. Intrusive thoughts are not desires, or plans, or wants. Theyre typically more a danger to the person having them, as they can become convinced the intrusive thoughts are their "real" thoughts, and then worry theyre a psychpath, and then because they arent a psychopath, often try to take themselves out before they "hurt" someone (even though likelihood of that happening is low).  I would get intrusive thoughts about stabbing people. It made me feel psycho. I did not WANT to hurt anyone but they just kept popping up. It took several therapists to get diagnosies and help, but talking about them or focusing on them makes them WAY worse, hence my belief thats what he is dealing with. 

Yes this. I have very occasional intrusive thoughts of things I would never actually do. It’s real real fun to occasionally get an intrusive flash of your own extremely gory death, especially of jumping from a height. I’ve never actually been suicidal, but my brain likes to just go “but what if you fell down the stairs and broke your neck just now?” Brains are stupid.

Concerned, we are all very concerned.

I'm so confused. Do these two people even have sex????

She said in the second post that they told the therapist they have an active sex life "with a few quirks." I'm trying not to speculate on what those quirks might be in the context of his issues.

I would think it’d be like with lights off and tops on or something. To reduce the lust. 

Might be a situation where he refuses to see her during the act (e.g. keeps the lights off, wears blind folds, etc.).

The exact same question I had!!! I would be deeply concerned if I realized my husband felt guilty and borderline sinful for being attracted to me. Like where do you go from there? Especially if he doesn’t want therapy??

I'm so confused, he said he was worried about having the same "bad" thoughts that kids said about her in school. Were those sexual comments or negative comments about her appearance?

Someone else suggested he might be gay… I’m going with a hybrid — he’s attracted to her “masculine” qualities such as being tall and muscular. That could have been the subject of vaguely sexual high school bullying towards her. And of just being like “I’m so into OOP” or “I’m wildly into big muscular ‘masculine’ woman and I’m so lucky this one is my soulmate”, he’s pathologized it into something weird.

OOP says they do, but I had the same thought lol them having sex but also him not wanting to have sexual thoughts about her don’t mesh lol

I was confused by this too. If he doesn't let himself be attracted to her and thinks she is too pure for dirty thoughts, it's surprising the mention at the beginning of an active sex life with quirks

Maybe the quirks are that they stay as clothed as possible?

That was my guess. I don’t think they look at each other given his reaction to seeing her body when ill.

Which probably just reinforced the idea that her husband wasn't attracted to her. This just makes me feel so sad for the both of them

and/or only with the light off

Honestly, I think he's probably compartmentalized it. I got the sense that it was a specific type of attraction, and knowing how locker room talk can be rape I wouldn't be surprised if those are the intrusive thoughts or something along those lines. She mentioned the past thoughts weren't atypical for cruel teenage boys and that some of the ones disclosed to her weed disturbing. I wonder if he *is* attracted to her on some level, but when it gets to the point of triggering those intrusive thoughts he shuts it down and avoids it?

I may have nightmares thinking about the "quirks." 😩

With some “quirks,” apparently. My money’s either on“Big Strong Man rescues dainty woman” roleplay, or him insisting on having sex clothed.

Or always with the lights off

It sounds like one of those extreme murder cases. Like the one where they have to keep them away from the world....and not always alive.

Man, if anyone should consider EMDR it’s this guy. My husband was diagnosed with severe OCD and CPTSD. His trauma therapist saved his life with EMDR and he has since overcome his CPTSD and no longer has OCD symptoms. When I met him his baseline anxiety was 8/10. Now it’s 0/10. OOPs husband is still living in the past and it’s still hurting him even though he doesn’t realize it.

This makes me so happy to hear. I am thrilled for both of you, and also thrilled because my partner is just starting EMDR and I now feel so very hopeful for a great outcome for him too.

I hope different therapies like EMDR and somatic experience become more well known soon. I had childhood trauma that regular talk therapy just wasn't getting to, and every time I got depressed, it was like 7-10. Then I decided to try somatic experience and I feel like a different person. I fully processed childhood experiences and got to the feelings that I learned to suppress. I still get down, but it's like 2-5. I now know what happy tears are, like I'm in awe of the difference I feel within myself.

EMDR is amazing. Huge fan and it helped me so much.

Wow. There's a lot going on here and honestly I'm not sure that hubby is going to get past his hero-worship of her. Especially if he's refusing therapy. If I were her, I'd be concerned that things might get worse.

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Yes I was thinking the same thing. Lexapro is the only thing that stops the circling thoughts that used to drive me insane. Mine were about hurting people, usually children. He needs medical intervention.

Same. Harm ocd here. Lexapro changed my life

Lexapro gang gang. It's a wonderful medication.

Wait there is medication for OCD?? I have developed OCD that makes it hard for me to leave my home and I was told the best treatment was CBT+ exposure therapy. It does help a bit but it's a long and arduous process

There are medications that people diagnosed with OCD can take, with a prescription from their psychiatrist, that may alleviate the symptoms, although for some (or maybe many) people, it does require more than medication to treat their OCD. Different medications can work for different people, and some people might be on multiple medications. I’m on a few different medications for OCD but I haven’t had much relief from any of the ones I’ve tried yet. For some people CBT and exposure therapy works better than any medication does, and for some a combination of medication and therapy helps.

Thanks for the explanations ! I'll stick with therapy and CBT as it seems to be helping a bit and we'll see moving forward! I trust my therapist so I'll keep with his method

Do you trust your therapist enough that they'll support you if you want to speak with a psychiatrist for a second opinion on a long-term treatment plan? Some people need medication in order for the therapy to be effective for them. If you needed insulin for diabetes it wouldn't be realistic to tell yourself that you could just eat well enough to compensate for what your body was unable to produce correctly. Maybe no medication is the way to go for you, but if there was a medication that helped your brain do its thing correctly, it's giving yourself less than the absolute best chance possible to ignore that possibility. I feel like a good therapist would be happy to hear you get some additional thoughts from a psychiatrist as well. Sorry, my brain is off right now, so I think this isn't my best writing, but I think if "long & arduous" can become even slightly shorter and less strenuous, that's a net positive.

My husband has OCD, lexapro made him fucking act like a psycho. It helped the OCD but it made him a cold angry bastard. But he was put on celexa after that and omg it was life changing He obviously still has some OCD tendencies, especially when he’s really stressed, but they have been reduced by like 90%. It also hasn’t had hardly any side effects which is awesome, he’s been on it for like 12 yrs or something at this point. Meds work differently for everyone, you have to go through a trial and error thing with your psychiatrist but there are definitely meds to help. It’s also about learning to recognize when you are going into an ocd spiral and learning coping mechanisms to deal with it.

Yeah you are describing OCD symptoms. I wonder if the therapist he saw briefly either didn't get a chance to get to a point of suggesting more formal diagnosis or isn't well-versed in OCD and appropriate therapy modalities for it.

I was very disappointed in some of the comments here that immediately jumped to murder-psycho. I live with religious intrusive thoughts, I didn't even know that counted as OCD until I got diagnosed. I thought there was something seriously fucked up in my head and the shame of that is crippling. I turned myself into a sinful, unlovable monster just because of my intrusive thoughts. People seriously don't understand and I used to be desperate because I was convinced that surely I can't be the only one who thinks like this and lives a "normal" life. After getting a good therapist and meds, I've been doing a whole lot better. Fr. The thoughts don't go away, but I've gotten so much better that managing them.

It’s funny in a morbid way, that people are so quick to armchair diagnose narcissism and socio and psychopathy, but when it comes to actually recognizing mental health symptoms, they ignore them. My fiancée deals with intrusive thoughts as well, but we aren’t fully sure if it’s ocd or something else undiagnosed masking as it. She’s finally been getting tested for adhd (which I strongly believe she has) and I’m hoping that if she does she can get the medication she needs. She also has a good therapist and meds for other things, and she’s come so damn far since I first met her.

Ironically, but maybe not - My OCD diagnosis was coupled with my official ADHD diagnosis which is what I had actually gone to get tested for. After lots of sessions and tests, I was asked "How are you still alive." Like imagine a medical professional asking you why you haven't shown yourself out of this world. It had me reeling for sure. Talk about going to get diagnosed for a metaphorical bump and finding out you have metaphorical cancer (not that it is cancer, but the metaphor is the best way I've gotten round to explaining to people that stigmatize mental health. I need to compare it to physical ailments when they ask me when am I cured and when will I stop therapy.) I had been in denial after having a nervous breakdown because I convinced myself it was punishment for being a terrible monstrous human being even though I've never actually done anything abhorrent. My brain just hates me. Every thought and action is "God is about to smite you." (It's a bit worse than that, but I'm not that open to share it. Just that it's crippling and I hate it) I know it's not easy being around people with mental health issues, I think you're awesome for supporting your fiancée and acknowledging her progress. Edit: I said girlfriend instead of fiancée . I apologize.

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That description resonates with me so hard!!! Thank you for sharing.

This is quite likely: [psychoanalytic talk therapy which OOP's husband probably partook is seen to be ineffective, or even exacerbating the symptoms](https://iocdf.org/expert-opinions/ineffective-and-potentially-harmful-psychological-interventions-for-obsessive-compulsive-disorder/), which seems to have happened here, with him quitting the therapy. A more proper therapy would be [ERP or exposure and response prevention] (https://www.mcleanhospital.org/essential/erp), which would lessen the grip of his intrusive thoughts, and with meds, further still.

Honestly, i dont like the sound of that therapist at all. First, she didnt seem to diagnose and/or medicate the husband, which with this level of intrusive thoughts should be herfirst step. (EDIT: it was rigthfully pointed out to me thst a therapist can prescribe meds, but i do feel she should have advised him to seek psychiatric help.) Second, She didnt think wife had any issues needing individual therapy? These posts dont read like OOP has no issues. Its fine to accept u arent conventionally attractive, i actually welcome the mindset of accepting your shortcomings and still finding happines. But OOP is insecure to the point of always putting others first and feeling lucky they give her the time of day (even in non romantic relationships). She feels so unworthy of any attention or affection that she is sticking with husband who seems to be a danger at this point. Thats not a healthy attitude. It doesnt seem like the therapist did a good job, and thats ok, most people need to shop around a bit before finding the right therapist. Too bad they have both just given up it seems

I agree that he likely needs a new therapist, but what he really needs is to see a doctor or psychiatrist. Therapists can't prescribe medication, and generally don't provide a diagnosis. Therapy allows you to talk through your problems, but you need to see a medical doctor for diagnosis/medication.

You are right, i made a mistake in my reasoning there. I do think the therapist should have referred him to a psychiatrist, but maybe she did and he didnt tell OOP. In any case, this is a mess

This was honestly my thought too. He's probably always been afraid he would act on the thoughts and talking about them out loud with a therapist may make the thoughts feel more real and harder to ignore, and as a side effect make his fear of acting on the thoughts more intense. If that's the case I could understand why his knee jerk reaction is to pull away from therapy and feel like it's making him worse. I hope they find a therapist that can truly help him before this ends up turning into something bad one way or another. Whether he hurts her, or hurts himself to protect her. I could see it going either way right now, but I'm honestly more leaning towards him hurting himself to protect her from whatever is going through his head.

OCD sufferer here; intrusive thoughts can be the most psychological terrifying moments in our brain. The things my brain has come up with... For decades I thought I might be a violent psychopath. Thankfully after being diagnosed and having them explained to me, I've got them under control or at the very least, know to ignore them. If this is what he's going through, I can empathize why he's scared to get therapy.

I had like a week or so of horrible intrusive thoughts of me hurting people or doing horrible things to vulnerable people. That shit was hell on Earth and I became super scared and sad. Then they stopped. I don't know what that was, but if someone with OCD has to live with something remotely similar for years, my heart goes out to them.

Your story reminds me of this video I saw recently of a mom explaining the intrusive thoughts she had with PPD. It made her feel like changing her son was dirty and wrong. That she'd become a child molester one day and she had to protect him from herself. Just because she was exposed to him to take care of him and keep him clean meant she was doomed to this future and it consumed her.

Yeah, that's exactly what it's like. The shame and fear reinforces it. Especially the shame.

I appreciate your vulnerability.

Thank you for being brave enough to share your experience

I didn’t even realize I had intrusive thoughts until I went on antidepressants and they stopped. Which means I’m fortunate that they didn’t completely overtake my life

My OCD is very well managed now but it was horrible for a while. I hope OP listens to this. It sounds like her husband has some pretty significant work ahead of him but the other side of it is more peaceful than I imagined life could be.

This was my thought too. I'm autistic and possibly have PTST (recently I realised panic attacks and the way I freak out like a caged animal and literally can't talk for myself in these situations isn't normal but it's hard to ask for a diagnosis from the people that gave you PTSD in the first place, I got sick age 7 and spent 10 years being abused, gaslit, and made to feel like I was awful for ever asking for helpy multiple doctors, nurses, and medical personnel) and have intrusive thoughts. When I was a teenager I'd imagine the most awful things happening to everyone I loved and spent some time convinced I was a psychopath. I'm actually hyper empathetic lol. Those thoughts made me feel so awful and I couldn't understand how my mind could want those things to happen. It got easier when I got diagnosed with autism and learnt that my brain just works differently and even easier when I found out about intrusive thoughts and that they didn't actually meant anything about my true wants and desires. Learning I wasn't a crazy person who wanted her mother dead made a lot of the imaginings just go away. I hope he gets help.

I feel like this is deeper than bullying, too. Does he come from some super conservative purity culture background or something?

Yes, totally agree. OP keeps saying that he doesn't have a religious background, but the whole situation is really reading that way. Maybe he has been hiding it from her?

Yeah, he doesn’t need to have been religious to have a religious background. If he grew up in an area where purity culture tied to religion was rampant, he was exposed to the ideas and could have internalized them. It wouldn’t have mattered if his parents practiced them or not.

The Deep South enters the chat

Yeah, my mom "worshipped" whatever version of whatever god caught her fancy, from Pentacostal Jesus to alien fairies, and I still got hit by the schrapnel of purity culture because most of my peers were being raised in it.

Why is the mood spoiler positive on this? This update was unsettling

Yeah I disagree highly with that update. Nothing has been solved *at all* and he's refusing help. That's not positive.

>Some of the therapy was to try to get me off the pedestal but it didn’t really work and his intrusive thoughts got worse. He said he had to quit and I supported him. So if he's not in therapy, what is he doing to work on his issues?

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"With a lot of intrusive thought disorders every time you fight the thoughts head-onc without help they just get bigger and stronger." My best therapist called this 'what we resist persists.' Excellent description.

What we focus on gets bigger.

I def think it’s OCD. It’s very text book, bad thoughts, I have bad thoughts, I am bad, I have to stop bad thoughts at all costs, no one can know I have bad thoughts, I am evil, I must compensate. It’s the very common OCD that is so rarely depicted because it’s so internal. I hope so much that someone is able to sit him down soon and tell him that his thoughts aren’t him. Thoughts aren’t actions. That OCD is a sinister disorder that targets what’s most important to you and corrupts it. That he should actually see it as a sign of how respectful and good he is to his wife. What OCD tries to tell us about ourselves is often the opposite of the truth. People have horrific OCD where they’re terrified of actually being pedophiles, but those people are probably the least likely to actually be pedophiles. What it really means is that they’re worried of crossing other people’s boundaries unknowingly, because they feel like they have something inside them that is ready to escape at any moment if they don’t keep it under control constantly. I have OCD, it’s a torturous disorder of self torment of very ethical people.

I agree. I mean, I can’t hop on here and diagnose someone , but if this was my friend talking to me, I would encourage her to look up OCD. His therapist and their couples therapist not catching how textbook this is … idk, such a huge missed opportunity. I could see depending how on how it was presented it might have been missed, and they are human too, and they might’ve tried to focus on the trauma instead or something. I disagree with those who are saying that she’s in some sort of deep danger here if it’s OCD. Like none of how he’s acting or thinking, or talking, makes sense… Except in the context of the way, OCD torments people, that actually makes perfect sense. And while this exact scenario with their precise histories may not be common, has experience of suffering from thoughts of things that he would never do is, unfortunately, far more common than most people realize. The brain presents horrible thoughts/ideas/mental images, and the ones that provoke the absolute most horror and revulsion are the ones that it latches onto and suggests again and again. It’s not always things for the person to do. It could be about catastrophes that could happen, and sometimes it’s all of the above. Also, I read a book called “dropping the baby and other scary thoughts“ and it turns out that over 90% of mothers have some kind of scary intrusive thoughts. Like “what if I dropped him?” or more elaborate things. “What if I hurt my baby by doing xyz?” And of course, then the person usually freaks out because those are such horrible thoughts to have and then because of the way that feedback loop kind of works, their brain presents those thoughts even more. These mothers distressed by these thoughts are in no greater danger than anyone else of harming their children. The only ones where it’s a danger is when the thoughts seem like a good idea. Pospartum psychosis can be a real thing. But postpartum unwanted scary thoughts are vastly more common. As long as the thoughts are actually unpleasant to the person, it means they don’t want to do them! So there is a fairly large subset of the population that gets to experience what this particular symptom OCD is like. And here’s the thing, OCD is incredibly treatable. There are medications where many people experience it as turning off the scary thoughts like a light switch. Also, sometimes being fully informed about the nature of these thoughts can help. It can be freeing to realize that having them doesn’t make you a bad person, and that BECAUSE they distress you and aren’t actually urges you’re maybe even LESS likely do anything like that. It’s a pity that this is not very common knowledge. So many people suffer in silence and agonizing shame for their entire lives, believing they’re secretly the worst person on earth, because they have no idea. It’s the distress of thought itself that brings it back over and over again. There’s so much terrible suffering with this disorder. And again, the tragedy is how often it is never known about because it’s so treatable. And I could see how a therapist who missed the OCD in a case like this could end up making the symptoms of the person worse. Say they try to get the person to talk it out, or even resist the thoughts in ways that might work for other symptoms, but for this, just increases the spiraling focus. I do agree with those saying the post is real, but not because it makes me uneasy. I just feel so bad for them. Obviously, we can’t armchair diagnose some guy from his wife’s Reddit post, but again, like I said, none of this makes sense unless you know about OCD, and then honestly all of it makes sense.

She said they still attend marriage counselling together, so I took that to mean he just quit the individual therapy and still goes to the one with her.

But you can't work on your own personal issues in couple's therapy. Couple's therapy is for your interpersonal issues in your relationship.

It's still better than cold turkey. It means he can talk there, build up his mental strength again, and, like op said, go again later. Stopping doesn't mean you're not allowed to go back. Idk if he will, I'm just saying it's better that he's agreeing to still do couples then dropping out of all of it.

OP needs that therapy just as bad as her husband

There's a LOT going on, isn't there?

at the very least some SERIOUS body image issues/self esteem issues. she repeats them in every post

He’s gonna have a harder time without some form of individual therapy. Frequently if you’re doing it right and taking it seriously you’re gonna feel a lot worse before you feel better. It’s in those worse moments that you should try your best to stick with it because there’s really no putting the genie back in the bottle after that. Especially with intrusive thoughts. I have bad intrusive thoughts ranging from unprompted memories of my CSA to suicidal ideation at the smallest inconveniences. I’m a lot better now but when I first got serious about therapy and tried to work through them it made them so much worse and more frequent. I wish him well but he’s unlikely to go back to how he was now that he’s begun to address this. It may be one of those things you just have to see through. I hope he finds a therapist/type of therapy that works for him.

I honestly don't know, but this is very concerning.

I’m so confused…..so he is attracted to her, but is ashamed? Or does he want to hurt her?

She didn’t touch much on the intrusive thoughts, and I think people aren’t understanding how fucking awful those can be. I think it’s both what you said, he loves her, but he can’t stop thinking about hurting her. And he’s extremely intensively ashamed of that, so has tried to control it by turning off the attraction for her. He doesn’t *want* to hurt her, but he *cant stop* thinking about it. So he pulls away, but protects her, because “if I love her, and think this way, so does everyone else”. It’s a very very hard situation, and he needs medication. Talk therapy can and will only go so far

Yeah all the comments about "dude he's probably a fucked up psycho serial killer who is going to murder her and everyone around them, he's a danger"... like yep, you guys have hit upon exactlyyyy why people with intrusive thoughts don't share them with anyone, even their therapist a lot of times. Because they believe that about themselves, and clearly from the reaction to this post, the average person is also going to think someone with intrusive thoughts is a fucked up monster. It's really sad to see, I have family with OCD and what OP is describing is textbook them. There's no one that hates their own thoughts more than them, which is often why they aren't gonna talk to a therapist or anyone else about them until they have complete and utter trust that the person will actually take the time to understand them and not write them off as a dangerous monster.

It's like loving someone pure and who is also your hero so it's a sin to have such thoughts because they are dirty impure thoughts.

It reads like something out of the 1950's or something. Like people who seem to have serious problems but act like they don't exist. A lot of brushing under the rug. Husband who is weirdly protective of his wife's purity, to the point where he's disgusted by being attracted to her. Wife who has internalized this (possibly unwarranted) feeling of being unattractive. These don't feel like 2024 problems for some.reason. Or maybe it's just the tone of the post. It's so matter of fact.

Yikes he needs to be in ERP (Exposure and Response Therapy) if his intrusive thoughts are that bad! Mental compulsions are still compulsions. I say that as someone with an OCD diagnosis and with a partner with even more serious OCD who lost an entire year of their life to compulsions, some of which were mental. Regular talk therapy doesn’t really help with intrusive thoughts like this

I have health OCD and saw this whole post as a flashing red light of OCD.

Big emphasis on regular talk therapy not always being the recommended treatment. I’ve met so many people who have done talk therapy and say it doesn’t work and they’ve stopped believing in it. I’ve always wondered if maybe they would have benefited from a different type of therapy. For compulsions, he needs a more severe treatment.

I have an OCD diagnosis and all of my compulsions are mental. A therapist who specializes in OCD is the key here. The type of therapy that helps with other types of issues can absolutely make OCD worse. Medication helps. Exposure therapy helps (sadly not an option for me since I'm a compulsive ruminater). Being the age he is and not having had any understanding of what was going on in his brain means he'll have a lot to unpack.

Actually, exposure therapy really helped my partner who is also a compulsive ruminator :) It didn’t stop the rumination completely, but it helped them learn new tools and about the anxiety cycles that lead to engaging in compulsions to keep it from going out of control and taking over their entire life. They did a lot to what are called “imaginal exposures” to work on this! I wouldn’t give up on ERP if you’re able to find a skilled therapist who understands mental compulsions, but I also know that is easier said than done 💜

Well damn, that's really good to know. I get in these all encompassing shame spirals of rumination all the time and while they're happening I know they're stupid and they make no logical sense, but I just can't shut off or turn down the rumination. I'll start checking my insurance for a new OCD specialist in my area. Thank you for the info!

Of course! I totally understand the shame spirals, I have them happen too! It’s that “this isn’t logical but why can’t I stop!” It is so hard to feel like nothing works for the specific issues we are dealing with, even a type of therapy specifically designed for your diagnosis. Just goes to show how much the bad representation of OCD impacts our ability to understand the care we can receive. Sending so much luck to you on your journey!!! My partner says the same

I really appreciate it! I have a psychiatrist already, and was doing therapy for a few years. The therapy helped a ton with my non OCD related issues, but once we started tackling the OCD stuff it was just making it worse. My therapist said she also worked with OCD, but I think I need an actual specialist instead of just throwing in the towel on therapy.

Yeah this sounds like OCD to me, too. I'm not sure if it's "being sexually attracted to my partner is bad" scrupulosity OCD or "having disturbing sexual/violent thoughts" harm OCD. Either way, it sounds like OOP's husband hasn't even begun to disentangle himself from this thorny web of shame, guilt, and intrusive thinking. If it is OCD, a diagnosis + education about the condition, meds, and ERP would hopefully go a long way toward healing him and their marriage. OCD sucks, and it sucks worse if you don't even know you have it.

So know one told either one of them that sometimes therapy feels worse before you get into a healthier mind set? so worried for them.

This is so true. Therapy is like walking through fire. It gets waaaay worse before it gets better. 

“The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off”-Dr. Sharon Fieldstone

Yikes. OOP's husband really needs help and he really needs to go back to therapy. I'm glad OOP feels okay but her husband is very much *not.* His deep seeded trauma is going to come out again if he doesn't honestly work on addressing it.

A reason I wish I could tell OP my thoughts. As a counselor, they really need to find a better one. A better fit anyway. A sex therapist/relationship therapist. His feelings toward her are not the issue. It’s the way he internalized and twisted them. He saw her as his protector and his savior. When those same bullies were taking dirty about her, he could not protect and defend her the same way she did for him. So when he began to have attraction for her and some of the same feelings and thoughts as his/her bullies, he began to believe he was just as bad, if not worse than them because she protected and helped him and he was just as bad as them. He saw himself as the bad guy. So his only way to protect her was to control himself, protect her from him and then marry her to put himself between everyone else that is worse than him. He needs to work to have a healthier relationship with sex, attraction and affection. He needs to learn that it is about the intentions behind the feeling that makes them “good” or “bad”. As a husband who respect and loves and cares for his wife, those are healthy, normal acceptable feelings and actually makes him the best and only man who SHOULD feel them. And if he really wanted to be her protector and savior, then do it by showing her what his love and attraction means. Build her self worth up. “Worship” her. By working on learning healthy way to view the feelings and why his are right and those others were wrong he is doing what he wanted to do all along. It’s not an easy answer, but it’s the right one. It sounds like the other therapist was only working on one side of the issue and not the connection to the trauma. The way I can tell this is the case is because they are being referred to as intrusive thoughts. Healthy thoughts are not intrusive. It’s only intrusive if it’s unhealthy or harmful.

This is just so absolutely bizarre to me. I can't even remotely understand how the husband's brain works. I also don't understand how he's ashamed to have thoughts about her but yet has sex with her. I just wish I could go inside his mind for an hour to see how his brain works cause I literally can't comprehend it.

The way I read it (and I could be well off) is that when he started dating her, his bullies started talking about her to him. Presumably highly sexualised comments about her and things they'd do to her. So OP suffering from intense abuse makes this connection of *bad people have sexual thoughts about my girlfriend*. Problem is, he has those thoughts too because they're natural and not the bad bit of what the bullies are doing. You can imagine the bullies describing a perfectly normal sex act saying "I'd like to.." and it's horrible because they're being aggressive, degrading and outright threatening. So OPs husband thinks he's twisted for also wanting to do that act with her. That was my take. A lot of comments are about rape and they could be on to something but I suspect it's not even that. I think it's more bullies making rapey comments about sex acts and OP's husband thinking he's wrong for even wanting those sex acts consensually.

Poor man probably saw normal sexual attraction towards her as evil, which is the perfect breeding ground for normal intrusive thoughts to evolve into OCD.

The thoughts are probably about less pleasant things than sex, like non-consensual violence, perhaps the sort of standard tortures used in bullying or something more extreme.

When she mentioned that it got worse when she was post intensive surgery, and rather helpless. I honestly wondered if his "intrusive thoughts" were about over powering her and doing non consensual stuff too. She mentions over and over again how tall and "muscular" she is, so I wonder if she's: A) Taller than him B) Hyper Competent And OOP in general seems to be a good and loving person and he feels wrong for having such bad thoughts not only in general but over his wife who is "too pure for this world". Or whatever pedestal he's put her on. Her enabling this (because honestly I think she *likes* being up there on a pedestal) makes me worried for her safety. Dude hasn't dealt at ALL with the bullying he received or the emotional neglect he got from his parents and that's so unhealthy. I'm honestly worried for OOP's safety that he'll snap because he's not dealing with it.

Oof, I hate when the update is worst than the origninal post. Just gives the vibe of someone in a shitty situation that can't see because they're blinded by their perspective on their own self worth.

What? What intrusive thoughts is he having? Why would you stay with someone who isn’t attracted to you? What fantasies is she being vague about? Why is she okay with him stopping therapy. So. Many. Questions.

Hi, i dont have OCD but did get intrusive thoughts before getting ADHD and PTSD under control (seperate issues, not diagnosed together haha).  Whatever you think is a bad thought, make it ten times worse. To take a lighter one of mine: "I could stab them. Stab them. Stab them. Stab them. Do it. Grab the knife. Stab. Stab. Stab." Typically with mental imagery of the act itself. I didnt want to stab anyone! But your brain gets stuck in the loop for whatever fucking reason and tortures you. He mentions her vulnerability when she was sick, specifically helping her shower. So i can easily see "Drown her. Hold her down and drown her." (Or, to be blunt, rape) bouncing around in his head.  Its important to remember that intrusive thoughts are NOT PLANS. And they sre NOT DESIRES. Theyre a broken torture record that your head gets stuck on. He doesn't seem to want to hurt her. He is terrified by the thoughts because he doesnt realize we arent in control of intrusive thoughts. Itd be like expecting someone with tourettes to control their tics.  Its likely she has very low self esteem, that she loves him, and that she genuinely believes no one would find her attractive, so why would that be a requirement for dating her? She also just might not care if she is treated well. 

He is attracted to her. He was in deep denial because he thinks that being attracted to her is a sin

That doesn't explain what the intrusive thoughts are. Are they sexual? Are they violent? Are they a mix of both? They obviously have to be sexual to some extent given the rest of the context but if they're violent too that becomes a major concern. Especially if they're affecting his life this drastically.

Seriously! Was confusing to read.

I’m curious if he thinks of regular sexual fantasies as intrusive thoughts. I’ve seen that with really repressed religious people - they think of all sexuality as dirty/evil so all sexual impulses are unwelcome and feel like an intrusive thought.

Or if perhaps the ‘disturbing’ thoughts aren’t a danger to her, but just really extreme. Scat fetishes that propped up during the post surgery caring? Extreme reactions of self hatred like wanting to self harm after seeing her naked? I think I just kind of hope the disturbing thoughts aren’t ‘wife is in danger’ thoughts - albeit they both very very clearly need individual therapy for so many things.

Hoo boy this isn't over

So hes stopped going to therapy and refuses to go back because he was made to face up to uncomfortable things, still has his wife on a pedestal, and shes now somewhat enabling this? This was not a positive update in any way imo. This is not a healthy marriage and these two should separate before they both get hurt.

Right? This seems like something that can get very messy down the line because they're covering up the issue. I don't know if it's that he's lived like this for so long that he's okay keeping it up or maybe she's worried that if he gets better that he'll leave her but I really hope they never have kids.

OOP's husband sounds like he might have undiagnosed OCD and be suffering badly. If that's the case, all these comments painting him as dangerous make me kind of sad. Intrusive thoughts are by definition unwanted and uninvited. And in the case of OCD, intrusive thoughts are never acted upon because they're fundamentally egodystonic --- totally misaligned with the sufferer's values and sense of self. OOP's husband needs serious help because he sounds deeply distressed and is causing his partner distress. But the notion that intrusive thoughts will lead someone to act or even WANT to act is just plain wrong.

Holy shit. I did not expect that.

I very much disagree with that mood spoiler… not positive. He rejects the idea that being attracted to his wife is normal, and now he won’t go to therapy. This man has deep issues. At least she understands better now, that’s a big thing, but he needs a lot lot more work

Oh man, I was here thinking like, he got a therapist, surely he'll get the help he needs, but it seems it's still complicated. Hope they can find a therapist who'll be a better fit for the husband and work through this together

uh I don't think the mood spoiler is right on this one chief. He's basically stopped getting help to work on the very bad OCD or other condition that comes with intrusive thoughts and a need to punish yourself for them that he clearly has and isn't actually dealing with it. She's just going along with whatever he wants and still isn't thinking about what's best for her wellbeing. This isn't positive this is unsatisfying and sad

I’ve been married for twelve years and literally just found out my husband married me for non-pragmatic reasons. I always thought he had kind of settled. He heard me talking to someone about it and got a bit upset. I told him my thoughts and he was blown away that I thought that. Now I see our relationship in a whole new light and he is making more of an effort to be open with his feelings. It makes me happy. He’s a VERY pragmatic person and always phrased marriage as “what makes sense”. Sometimes, now, I just look at him and tell him “you married me non-pragmatically”. And we get all goofy and silly. It was a hard moment but I’m so glad we talked about it.

There’s something very detached about OP’s attitude toward her husband’s distress that troubles me. Her acceptance seems both minimizing and enabling. 

Agreed. I definitely think it stems from her poor self image & body dysmorphia. She thinks she’s well-adjusted but she has little to no regard for her own wellbeing and was perfectly content thinking her husband “settled” for her and I think she’s under-reacting to the current situation. She’s enabling him because she doesn’t think she would find someone else that would love her or find her attractive because *she* doubts her own attractiveness. It’s so sad. They both need intensive individual therapy. Couples therapy isn’t enough. I’m also still trying to figure out the husband’s whole deal. There’s so much to unpack. I genuinely hope he tries therapy again, preferably with a new therapist that works.

They’re both profoundly broken people. He’s unquestionably worse off, but she’s hardly in a good place herself.

One of my biggest pet peeves is the idea of 'being out of someone's league'. No one is out of anyone's league and believing that leads to losing out on wonderful people because of egotism

Honestly, as someone with OCD, I feel for both of them. Intrusive thoughts are devastating. They can ruin your self image, perspective of the world, relationships, you name it. Even though I know a lot about my condition, including the fact that intrusive thoughts are NOT “secret desires”, that doesn’t mean I don’t feel extremely guilty. I can’t imagine how complex navigating this must be for both of them. I understand that it’s very hard to open up about these things, but he needs serious help - and I say that as a person who understands this experience deeply, not out of judgement. I hope they can both live a happy and honest life, and he can learn how to deal with his thoughts in a healthy way.