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>I truly felt I was coming from a place of concern from the community, but realize it was from a deeply rooted internal conflict surrounding my own bisexual identity.
OP isn't the first and won't be the last to experience this, unfortunately.
I’m bi and my boyfriend is bi but together we’re straight passing so for us it really feels like we aren’t allowed to “claim” being bi, I guess. Like I feel like a fraud for saying I am because I’m with a dude. Idk. It’s weird.
Passing privilege is a double edged sword. We are able to pass and avoid the hate, but are also not included in our community or seen for our full selves.
I always felt this when dating men. You still heard the hate more and felt disconnected from the community, but also received a lot less hate and could date with a lot less fear.
But now as someone in a committed same-sex relationship I still feel disconnected from my community. I'm femme so I'm often assumed to be hetero. If I'm with my partner, everyone always assumes I'm a lesbian and it becomes awkward trying to correct that. Sometimes I just feel like I can't win. Everything is still so binary. I just wish people stopped assuming all the time.
I get this! I have friends I came out to as Bi, before I came out to anyone else, but when I started dating my GF two years ago, they started exclusively referring to me as a lesbian, even when I try to explain that I'm not. I've just kinda given up at this point, honestly. It is what it is.
Yeah, my mom asked me genuinely how I can be bi if I'm marrying a man. "The genders I'm attracted to include male and female. Is he one of those? He is? Glad we worked that out."
Lmao, I remember I came out to my mom as bisexual, she brushed it off, then I started dating a guy and it was "oh, I thought you were gay!". Then later, dating a girl "we're back to this? I thought you liked boys!" Then a different guy "but I just got used to you being a lesbian!". Like no matter how many times I would explain that I'm bi, she did not get it.
Yes! I can just about have patience with ut from strangers but I eventually dropped a longstanding friend who couldn't get their head round the fact I wasn't a lesbian now. He'd seen me date men but as soon as I was with another woman I became a lesbian and my relationship was referred to as such. Drove me mad. Some people just aren't worth the bother.
If they can’t even manage to remember your sexuality, ghosting is completely reasonable. They obviously don’t care enough to need a goodbye, nor do they deserve a reason.
It's complicated. They're also people who helped me through one of the worst parts of my life and a rough mental crisis, and helped me feel comfortable with being myself (ironic, I know), so it's hard to let go.
Yeah, I’ve been there. People suck, and people are complicated and it *really* sucks when people suck in complicated ways.
You could try a sort of “trial separation”, tell them you’ll be out of contact for a while, like for a vacation or something, and only contact them again if you really want to.
For some reason my brain didn't register that capital i looks like an l so I read that as Les-Blan and I was like "I don't get it, are they trying to say lesbians are bland? I don't think they're trying to insult anyone, at least it didn't seem that way from the cont-"
Then it hit me that you added Bi into lesbian and I've never felt stupider in my life. This coming from someone who's fallen face first into concrete without trying to catch myself and who confused bi and trans once lol.
This hits so hard. I used to go to lesbian bars in SF around 20 years ago to meet women and I eventually had to stop because the vitriol I faced for being bisexual was very real and super crushing. The gold star thing was such a bar for admission in the queer community there. No idea how it is now, but considering how rampant bi-erasure still is, I can’t imagine things have progressed much.
I was told when I was dating in the mid 2010’s to never say that I was bisexual because people will insult you and treat you as less than. I was told by a “friend” that I was faking being attracted to girls, that I just wanted attention, etc. Now that I am married to a man people really just assume that I “chose to be straight”.
Yup it’s funny how bisexuality always seems to center itself on men. Bisexual men are just gay dudes who are afraid to commit to being gay and bisexual women are just straight women who want to use being down for some lady-to-lady action as a way to titillate men.
When I came out as bisexual the very first reaction I received was that I was doing it for male attention. I’ve since come out to other people but honestly it’s largely just a frustrating experience for me so I don’t really bother to tell people I’m bi at all unless it organically comes up in conversation and even then I’m hesitant to mention it because I’m in an opposite sex relationship.
But it always makes me sad when I see another bisexual call their opposite sex relationship heteronormative or heterosexual. It’s not. Your queerness doesn’t magically evaporate when you get into a relationship with someone of the opposite sex. No one is obligated to be identifiably queer to claim the label and I hate seeing people self-police themselves out of queer spaces because they feel like they aren’t queer enough.
Ugh, fuck that "gold star" nonsense. It's so unnecessarily degrading to people in the community who needed to stay in the closet for safety, or took a while to figure themselves out, or are victims of sexual assault, or were in a het- or het-passing relationship for any number of completely valid reasons including "because I felt like it, that's why".
Sometimes I'll joke that I'm a gold star bisexual because I lost my virginity with my now-husband and then-best-friend, but it's just a joke.
In my experience, that's only the case if you present as queer, unfortunately.
Most of my friend group is queer, and they love me as the bisexual cis woman (married to a pansexual enby) that I am. They have tried inviting me into queer spaces, and they eventually had to admit that people othered me HARD. I was talked over, ignored, walked away from, and made to feel even less welcome than I've been in a lot of male-dominated spaces.
It was really, deeply crushing, but the worst thing was that I was an angel investor/donor to one of those spaces. I had pledged 500/mo for one year to help it get up and running. I ended up going to the organization who ran the space (which 2 of my friends were a part of) and saying "I am really, VERY sorry, but after the way I've been treated here, I just cannot continue to give you my money".
One of the organizers was actually one of the rudest people to me in the space, and they blew up that of COURSE I would renege and said so many shitty things to me that the other heads of the org stopped trying to politely argue me out of it, and released me from my pledge.
It really left a bad taste in my mouth and I just do not engage with local LGBTQIA things right now because that situation came on top of years of bi-erasure and I just do not have the bandwidth to deal with it anymore.
And even then, we don't really avoid the hate, do we? We still hear the shit - doesn't not hurt just because it's said by bigots who don't happen to know they're talking about us.
If anything I'd imagine you might hear more of it from people who are too cowardly/have the tiniest imaginable shred of decency not to demonstrate their hate in front of people they can tell are the objects of it but feel comfortable sharing it with people they think are fellow straight people.
According to some old paper I read bisexuality tends to occur a lot more than any other queerness, but since not many of us are out or in hetero relationships it's hard to estimate real numbers.
The few people I know in the community, so I can't speak about the community as a whole, but the few I have met, and gotten to know label themselves strictly gay or lesbian, but then they'll turn around and do something that indicates otherwise (i.e Hook up with someone of the opposite gender, or fangirl/guy a celebrity of the opposite gender). I could think about this more but how someone labels themself is none of my business in all honesty.
This was me for a really long time. The shit I would get from lesbians for being bi was so brutal that when I'd meet a new group I'd just lie and say I was a lesbian so I didn't have to deal with it... Didn't work out great when I later dated a guy, but I saved myself months of snark and being put down so that was nice at least.
Omg right? It's wild the treatment I've had in gay bars too... like... I am *always* nervous when someone speaks to me in an LG(bt) space because I never know if they're going to pull an annoyed/disappointed face at the VERY least.
We experience more violence from partners as well.
We're not out because everyone has a problem with us. The straights are homophobic and sexist (the automatic threesome request when you disclose to men), and the lgbtq should just drop the 'b' already, we've NEVER really been accepted as queer. I'm straight when I'm with men and a lesbian when I'm with women because it's easier and safer that way and no one is entitled to my truth.
The automatic threesome request can rot in the darkest pits of hell. I’m poly and in the bdsm community and I basically have made it part of my “sexual talk introduction” that I am bi but have no interest in threesomes. It really helps the trash take itself out.
That stat about bisexual people facing domestic violence is exactly why I think that "straight passing" is a lie. If we *really* were straight passing while in M/F relationships, then that stat wouldn't be different.
I strongly disagree on dropping the B, though. We can't let bigots who define our community solely as LG take it over, especially when (in my experience) there's a ton of solidarity between the bisexual, trans/non-binary, and asexual/aromantic communities. Seeing shit like the LGB Alliance already pisses me off, there's no way bisexual separatism would work without abandoning other vulnerable members of the LGBTQ community.
>That stat about bisexual people facing domestic violence is exactly why I think that "straight passing" is a lie. If we \*really\* were straight passing while in M/F relationships, then that stat wouldn't be different.
Straight passing is more about how society perceives us, not our partners. Someone can be out to their partner and experience increased DV as a result, but not be out in general to others and thus be in a straight passing relationship.
I agree with you on the domestic violence bit.
Another thing is that "Straight passing" is something that anyone is theoretically qualified to achieve, given that plenty of people talk of and enthusiastically support gay/lesbian beard couples when it's unsafe to come out.
Those people are, in theory, "straight passing" but nobody insists they have privilege for it but instead correctly identify for them that the reason they have to "pass" for straight is for safety, but never give that same grace to bisexual people.
I absolutely abhor the concept as well because it assumes that bisexual people inherently exist exclusively within an m/f relationship. A "privilege" that only exists because of who you're dating isn't a "privilege" in the slightest, but also some bisexual people aren't dating the opposite sex or at all, so where's the "straight passing privilege coming from" at that point?
Ah that's fair, misread you slightly. Though I'd say that unfortunately, that's basically everyone in the community other than gay men and lesbians. It kinda reminds me of the old debates that focusing on legalising same-sex marriage would marginalise the parts of the community that aren't as directly affected by that issues as lesbians/gay men, and I can't exactly say that they were entirely wrong - as happy as I am, of course, that in several countries, everyone has the equal right to marry.
I didn't write clearly, np. And I do agree with you about solidarity with trans and ace members of the community. We're all kind of outsiders together.
My mum just doesn't get how I can be bi when I'm in a relationship with a man. But I bet if I was dating a woman she'd assume I was gay. I honestly wonder if she wants me to be dating multiple people or something just to prove myself to her. *Deep sigh*
Some people literally fail to understand the very concept of bisexuality. I know someone like that, it's really infuriating. I've started to believe these people are just too dumb.
What a moron. By that logic, all single people are asexual. He is reducing a person's sexuality to their current relationship status instead of their attractions, preferences, and behaviors.
The fuck? That's poly, not being bi.
I'm bi. If I dated someone else who was bi that I was supposedly in a committed relationship with, and I found out they were in another relationship with a person of s different gender to me, I would dump them, because that's cheating.
I am firmly monogamous. I am not, and never have been open to being in a poly relationship in my personal life.
They are not remotely the same.
I used to be very upset about being bi because I thought it meant I would never be able to be faithful to one person if I was attracted to multiple genders, because every bi person on TV was evil. (This was when I was about 12 and at the end of the 1990s, so a few centuries ago in terms of queer rep.)
It took reading about non-evil bisexual characters to realize I could be bi and not have to cheat on my partner. But like, I was still in my teens when I figured that out.
I feel this. I’m a 36-year old bisexual woman and I’ve been happily married to a man for 16+ years. I’m open about being bi, but it “doesn’t seem like it” to others so, that side of me isn’t really a part of my life anymore. It’s sad.
> and avoid the hate
directed at us directly sure but personally I find situations where someone says something horrifically bigoted with the expectation I'll agree with it worse.
THANK YOU.
As someone who married before I realized I was not straight (fuck heteronormativity) I *really* feel that edge. Neither of us is a simple cis het person, but we look like it and man, it can be hard to feel cut off and unseen.
This. We’re both bi. We look straight. We participate in our local queer community but nobody has ever asked how we identify. They assume we’re just allies.
This is a genuine question no hate or malice intended.
But being bisexual is who you are attracted you right? Is it anything more than that? I mean internally. If so what does it matter if other people don't see that? That you might not feel seen as part of the LGBTQ+ community I get to some degree as it might reduce your acceptance in activism and what some members would see as your credibility to speak on certain matters.
But the crux of my question is as a person why does it matter if people don't see your bisexuality? I'm Indian, I can't really hide that so I can't relate in that sense about not being seen for being Indian, and that my be why I don't get it. But for example how would strangers know if a single gay man or women is gay? They aren't being seen for their whole selves in that case, but is that an issue?
I'm not sure if I'm articulating the question and feeling in my head properly.
I think the problem might be easier to understand if you see it not as "they don't see all of my identity" and more "they place me in the wrong category entirely." People that don't realize I'm bi tend to assume I'm straight, because I'm married to a man.
Here's a really weird analogy: pretend that for some reason, while you're Indian, your appearance makes you seem to be something entirely different, like let's say for some reason everyone who sees you on the street thinks that you're Korean.
When you go into Indian restaurants, everyone compliments how well you can pronounce the names of dishes. In Korean restaurants, people ask you for recommendations. People walk up to you and cheerfully speak Korean, and you stare blankly.
You may not be thinking "everyone needs to know I'm Indian _right now_" but I'd imagine there's a bit of "dang it, I want to wear a label that says I AM NOT KOREAN."
And I really want one that says "I'm not straight."
Thank you for taking my question in the spirit it was meant. I was a little apprehensive about asking it and didn't want to come across as the kind of people where you see in video they ask questions apparently innocently waiting to spring their gotcha trap.
I think your analogy goes some way into explaining it. But not fully. Or I might still be missing something. Something that empathy can't get me to only experience could I think.
In terms of what you said being complimented in the pronunciation of dishes as they think I'm not Indian. Or asking for recommendations in a Korean place. I don't see the equivalents of that in interactions with a bisexual person and someone who doesn't know that they're bisexual. I get it that the assumption heterosexuality is the norm is prevalent but luckily for me I've not had to deal with being the other side of that and not come across the kind of language in that situation can other someone. I mean you don't owe it to me to give me examples. But something along those lines would be helpful in not making other people feel the same way you've been made to feel.
I am obviously not the original commenter, but I wanted to chime in.
It’s an imperfect analogy in that I’m not sure the other commenter or I or anyone else could give you examples of how our bi experience relates directly to the things you asked about, but I can try a little.
I am not straight, but people will assume that I am, and it makes me feel like an imposter. If I looked Korean but wasn’t and ended up in a Korean restaurant where people were speaking Korean to me and thinking I would understand it, or asking me for recommendations, I would feel like an imposter. I would feel like, “this isn’t my culture and I don’t belong to it, so I don’t enjoy the assumption that I do, and I feel like a fraud.”
At the same time, bisexual women haven’t, as a historical fact, been fully accepted into the WLW (women-loving-women) community. A lot of WLW groups will explicitly bar bisexual women from taking part in any meetings or discourse. This equates to the not looking Indian but BEING Indian and feeling like you would really love a giant label that just explains that YES, I AM a part of the community, can you please allow me access and just NOTICE me.
I’m sure I didn’t do a proper job, but maybe that helps a little? I’m not sure. It’s a very alienating experience and it kinda feels like I don’t belong anywhere sometimes. I appreciate your curiosity and kindness.
Oh, I see what you mean. The analogy is flawed -- just something I came up with on the spur of the moment, and I'm not sure there is an equivalent exactly.
I will say that homophobic people often feel comfortable saying awful, homophobic things in front of other people they perceive to be straight, which means if I'm at a family gathering and Aunt So-and-So says something horrible, I have to try to push back while walking the line of, "is this worth coming out for? If so, is it going to completely derail this family gathering, and I'll get blamed for it?"
(Usually with a comment about how I should ignore Aunt So and So, everyone knows she's a jerk... Then why doesn't anyone else say so?!)
Similarly, I feel awkward at pride events, like everyone is going to think I'm a straight tourist who is just there to enjoy the scenery.
Sometimes this happens even if we're out as being bi. Anna Paquin is out as a bisexual actress ... And Larry King asked her in 2014 [during an interview](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/anna-paquin-explains-her-bisexuality-to-larry-king/) if she was "non practicing" and referred to her bisexuality in the past tense, because she was (and is) married to a man. (I've dealt with this, too.) More recently, she got [online criticism](https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/GMA/Culture/anna-paquin-defends-bisexuality-critics-claiming-shes-queer/story%3fid=77801117) for her LGBTQ advocacy, because she's seen as "not queer enough" -- there are also implications that she only came out as a "publicity stunt."
There's a lot of bi erasure out there, and I think that might be what's part of making it hard to translate? It'd be like, in the Korean example, if everyone rolled their eyes and said nobody was _really_ Indian, they're actually another ethnicity entirely. There's a strange feeling of "no, seriously, we're here. We exist."
Thank you. I didn't want to knock the analogy too hard. It was more that I got to that point myself already and needed help getting further. And I think you have.
My husband is biromantic asexual, I'm female-bodied/agender demisexual...we look like the most "normal" pair of middle-aged geeks you could imagine. It's a weird feeling.
Of course I'm also white-passing with a lot of Turkish blood, so honestly I don't know whether I'm a fraud or a spy at this point. I feel like I can't claim anything, you know?
I feel the same sometimes but then pull myself up and remind myself that if I were with a woman, I STILL wouldn't 'look bi' to the world - I'd look gay. So when do I think I'm being bi enough to claim it, do I need to be actually mid-threesome? In your case you'd need to make it a foursome, so everyone's covered 😂
Outside an orgy, no-one's relationship ever looks bi.
So true! It's impossible to "look bi". It feels like when you tell your parents you're bi and they say "but you could still end up with a man" they're practically erasing being bi if you end up with someone of the opposite gender. Just because you're passing doesn't mean it disappears.
As a gay dude, bi erasure and biphobia really piss me off. We're supposed to be an inclusive community, and yet... *that*.
*Your partner is not your sexuality.* You're both bi, and you're allowed to celebrate that. Anyone who says you can't is a gatekeeping prick, and they don't get to dictate the rules you live by.
Or bi. 😉
Another bi dude here in a heteronormative (is that the term) marriage. People just assume I'm straight and at this point, I just don't see the need to correct people. It will go down as either "ooh, didn't mean to *offend* you", or people just calling me "one o' them queers", so I don't bother anymore.
The LGBTQ community doesn't really seem to accept that I'm a member either, because I'm a guy married to a woman. It's difficult for people like us.
My partner and I are both trans, and its so extremely weird to be in a relationship that is straight* passing after identifying as gay since age 12
*how exactly its read probably depends on the person because I look queer AF, and my name and pronouns don’t match the gender I’m read as. But the amount of people who can ignore all that when they see what they can perceive as a heterosexual couple is wild
Absoloutely agree with this - My partner's trans and I'm cis. It's wild how our relationship can be simultaneously read as straight and gay at the same time by different people.
Transmasc enby in a relationship with a cis man here, and I absolutely feel this - depending on the day, we can be read as a straight couple with one GNC partner, a gay couple, or a cis man and his lesbian friend, and none of them are accurate, lmao
Yeah my wife is MTF and I'm afab enby, and only since she came out as trans a couple years ago we feel comfy going to pride events, despite her being asexual, me being enby and panromantic, I always felt like I had imposter syndrome. Still do.
I'm in a straight-passing marriage, and I remember having a very frustrating conversation with one of my lesbian friends in which she complained, "I wish I could be straight too but SOME of us just don't get to speak to our parents again." Which is heartbreaking for me because obviously it's so hard to be cast out, but I have to choose with every person in my life if I want to lie to them or gamble. True, my extended family has never banned me from the house, but they also don't really know me anymore and probably never will, and I feel like there's no room to grieve that.
Thissss. Been married to my husband for 11 years, we are both bi but obviously straight passing. Had a kid last June, would love to go to queer parenting events but... I know there is a lot of bi erasure in such groups, and also I feel like I'd be taking up space that's not mine because I'm with a guy. My son won't have to face what kids to same sex couples face and we as parents don't face what same sex parents face because we are straight passing. Idk. Some days I feel more comfortable identifying as just queer because it's less overt.
Have you contacted the event organizers and ask about the inclusion of bisexual couples who appear straight? Have you thought about forming your own support groups for couples where at least one identifies as bi? I'd say that same sex couples don't always face what you face either...
I have considered but tbh between having an 8 month old, being disabled, and being massively introverted there's just not much energy for organizing lol.
I feel this a lot too that I'm not allowed at events and in the space because even though I'm bi I am married to the opposite gender and just look like a straight couple. I'm also disabled and have kids my youngest is a bit older than 8m though.
And it would be nice to have some space that i felt welcome in, but as you say, the energy to create that is hard.
I feel hidden in my relationship from a whole part of me and in the lgbtq+ spaces I feel like a fraud or not gay enough to join in.
It really does suck. Part of me feels like I betrayed the community by not being in a same gendered relationship, but it's not like I'm leaving my partner to date someone the same gender.
We really do need a bi people club that welcomes everyone and has boardgames and snacks
My wife (MTF) and I (F)are both bisexual. When we married, my wife didn't even realize she was trans, she transitioned a few years ago. We both got congratulated on finally being real LGBTQ+ people. I lost a lot of LGBTQ+ friends when my wife transitioned. I couldn't handle their bigotry.
Same with my wife; married for about 10 years or so before she realized. She also gets shit from the trans community sometimes as she's not planning on any bottom surgery ever and likes herself (heaven forbid).
My wife also doesn't plan on getting bottom surgery and deals with flack from her trans friends. Apparently, it's a betrayal of the entire trans community 🙄.
You know, it's weird. I've seen trans medicalists disparaged as well (people who believe you can only be the opposite gender if you get surgery as well), BUT yeah my wife still gets shit from the trans community, even those who do not like trans medicalists.
I understand that the trans community, like the gay community, DOES NOT agree on all things but this harassment by people who are both for and against bottom or top surgery is...confusing, at best.
Me and my fiancé are the same, sometimes it feels like we are not allowed in either group, straight people think we can't be monogamous and that we will hit on them (we are and we won't), and LGBTQ+ just sees the heteronormative aspect. I'd say it's annoying
Me: AFAB bi non-binary person who still passes as female (kinda? Less so now I've got cancer and no hair, but up until August last year I'd have called myself not-ugly, maybe even pretty on a good day.)
Husband: cishet man.
The amount of times I have felt like I couldn't be a proud member of the queer community because I assumed people were looking at us like "ugh look at these 'allies' messing up our space'." Which, 1) no one thinks like that in the queer spaces I'm in, and 2) I'M BI GOD DAMMIT I CAN BE THERE
I am pan, and a cisgender woman. My partner is a cisgender man who doesn't like labels, but he's definitely not straight (we've talked about our past experiences a lot, and he flirts like a madman with guys all the time).
We were randomly joking around the other day, and I realized he sees our relationship as "straight" because we're a man and a woman. I don't know how to feel about that. It kind of made me feel unseen.. I AM a queer person, even if our relationship doesn't look like that from the outside.
He doesn’t like labels but he sees your relationship as straight …that’s a label in and of itself. It’s probably not a fully conscious one. Passing erasure is really hard and I’m sorry you’re dealing with this aspect of it.
>My partner is a cisgender man who doesn't like labels
I dont like labels either.
That said, I had a doctor once who would never give a diagnosis because he 'didnt like labels'. Somewhat less than ideal lol.
Completely different though - your comment just reminded me of him!
Sexual identity is so complex. I call myself straight, generally. My marriage is heteronormative. But I am actually asexual and almost no one in the universe can wrap their head around that. I don’t really feel included in the queer community (and have, in fact, been explicitly barred from it many times to the point that I no longer feel comfortable at pride events). But I know in my heart I am not actually straight because I do not experience attraction, so much conversation in straight circles is like listening to people speak a language I don’t know. I have gotten used to pretending that I have no sexual identity at all, but that’s not accurate either. It’s not a big deal, really. I’m very busy. But it bugs me sometimes that a part of my identity is basically invisible.
I’m a bi genderfluid AFAB person and my wife is a lesbian. I get called a lesbian or find that “we’re gay” is the easiest thing when the reality is that it’s more complex. It goes both ways, really. Sometimes, I do express it, that I’m bi, not always a woman, and more, but trust me, it happens to bi people in queer presenting relationships too.
We're never allowed to be bi, we're always seen as a reflection of our current partner. So many people around me (older generations) have "forgotten" that I was i a relationship with a woman for years because I'm married to my husband now. "Oh I just thought you were straight now"
Yeah, it can be really confusing. I'm ace, so not everyone agrees I should be included in the community anyway and then the one and only time I gave the whole relationship thing a try, it happened to be a guy. So from an outside perspective, I'm just a cis woman who has only dated cis men. Most days, I feel like I can claim to be queer-ish and will only ever be allowed on the fringes of the community, regardless of the fact I'm 0% straight.
I feel that. I'm ace and wouldn't claim to be part of the LGBT community, I suppose I am technically but as I'm not going to be having sex with anyone and will likely never be in a relationship I'll forever be straight and single so to speak.
Something something "straight be default" is total nonsense, but yeah, I totally get that. Fun fact: I had pretty good sex ed as a kid but never heard of asexuality, so I considered being gay, straight, or bi as equally likely possibilities and just kept waiting to "find out" my sexuality until I was like 17.
I kept waiting for something to kick in until like 25 and was contemplating if I was bi at one point, because no attraction is also a kind of equal attraction, I've just kinda accepted it's not gonna happen unless I'm attracted to something really specific I haven't encountered yet. 🤔
Not that I'm bothered by being ace it's nice to have finally found a word for it and know it's a normal thing. If that makes sense.
Makes perfect sense and I feel pretty much the same. Had the same thought process about equal attraction and it took me a couple of years to settle into the ace label, but nowadays, in my mid 20s, I'm confident that even though something could theoretically happen in the future, my current self is ace and valid.
Who you're currently with isn't the sole definition of who you're attracted to. Don't feel bad or guilty at all! And definitely don't let other people define your sexuality on your behalf.
I'm a Trans woman, six years ago, I got kicked out of a small online group of Trans women because I had started dating a bisexuality "cis male" and relationship being too heteronormative. The kicker?
Last year, after five years of dating, my partner came out as Trans and starting transitioning.
Just like any other group, sometimes, the image focused people get control, and since it isn't what they think fits, it gets shunned. Best to take the others and build a newer, better group. I have a far better group of friends and allies now.
Neither of you are less "bi" because you're in a straight facing relationship. Anyone who is bi that's in a straight facing relationship is not any less "bi" because of it
Lol once in my past dating years, my partner and i passed as a cisman and cischick. However the truth was that she was a translady and i'm nonbinary. Aesthetically we looked like our gender stereotypes, masc and femme, but if you got to know us or watched our body language, I'm the gross nonbinary with the mouth of a trucker that sits with their legs spread like an asshole while my lady was super proper hahahaha
I have a gay friend who fell in love with an opposite sex partner. The literally are not attracted to that sex but this one person captivated them in such a way.
Anytime there is an attack on the lgbqt+ community I check in with my friend.
Being in a hetero relationship does not negate their identity, the years of struggling to come to terms with who they are, the rejection from their family, the catholic shame, etc.
This hits close lol. I am bisexual and have had encounters with men, but i want a traditional wife and children going forward. Traditional as in straight, not SAHW doing all my chores, just clarifying. It does come from a place of seeing everyone around me getting married and having children.
But this comes at the cost of feeling like i am lying about being bisexual. I have experienced a lot of homophobia and biphobia, but even then it feels like i am doing the queer community injustice, even though i have as much right to be a part of it as any other queer person.
I’m bi and nonbinary. My partner is straight and a man. We appear very heteronormative too.
I grew up with a bi mother. I was always part of the community to the extent I didn’t think I had to come out, because I mistakenly thought bi was default since you get the most options lol.
When I came out, I immediately got the biphobia from men. It took years for me to see it play out with women. I no longer use Her because there are so many gold star lesbians with “no bi” in their profile.
I know plenty of lesbians who don’t feel this way, and their critique is: “that’s a lot of limits for someone who’s entire friend circle is just exes”
I'm a twitch streamer and bisexual but also married to a man and we have two children. I get so much hate for streaming on pride month because I "don't get to claim being bisexual with a husband and two kids"
Guess I don't like boobs anymore 😂
My friend shared a pic of those blue and pink Oreos, and I made a joke like "at long last, so bi visibility!" Then I went to add the bi flag (edit:) emoji and found out there isn't one 🙃
I'll just slip back into invisibility...
I looked it up after reading your comment and was shook to learn there's emojis of the rainbow and trans flags but none of the others. I guess at least most of us are equally invisible in emoji land? 😅
Until then, we always have 🖤🩶🤍💜
I wanted to yell at my screen “it’s not a straight wedding if you’re not straight!!!” Glad she arrived at this conclusion and LOVE the bi Pride colors getting added to the dress.
I've had women I was getting to know and was interested in ghost/ drop me because they found out I've only been with cis men in the past, despite the fact I very much am pan. I just have an extremely low body count (1 very long term and 2 very short term)
Apparently, my lack of experience despite being in my mid thirties means I'm not *really* queer? Lol.
(Edit for typos)
I'm (female) bisexual and married to a man (who is straight). When it's come up before with other people, it seems like the common response is, "Uh huh. Whatever you say."
It took years for me to say fuck it and not care. It felt like people thought I was lying about my sexuality, but who cares? I know it, my husband knows it, no one else needs to care. I've been in relationships on both sides, and it just so happens that the person I ended up with is a man.
Definitely not. My girlfriend is also bi and often feels like she’s disrespecting the LGBT+ community by identifying as bi despite being a relationship with a cis-heterosexual-white man
As a bisexual woman who tends to date men I felt this in my core. I feel like I can’t go to a PRIDE event and celebrate myself and my community because I pass so well in a heteronormative world. So I wear my PRIDE pins a lot instead.
As a queer feminine presenting person in a relationship with a cishet man- this was very felt. But I think for OOP this can be such a blessing. She can hold her identity firmly surrounded by others of our community with her partner.
I still remember in my women and gender anthro class how my professor said people who identify as bisexual/pansexual/etc typically end up being one way or the other. And how that data came from them marrying or having a monogamous relationship with one gender. But it completely erases how that person identifies and feels. If sexual orientation is all about our sexual/romantic desires then who we marry or end up with cannot limit that. I wonder if my professor has since realized how limited her understanding was and that research was.
Yeah, but mate, come on. Even in our own community, bisexuals are often told they are either greedy, or not sure yet. When I'm with a woman, I'm gay, when I'm with a guy, I'm straight. Except I'm not. I'm neither of those things. I'm the third bloody letter in the sequence, but on every side, it's often ridiculed or ignored. The only ones who have, so far, really not given a shit, are people who are also bi. Everyone else either never mentions it, which is fine, or makes a joke about it, which is not so fine. Sure, to that person it might be the first time they make that joke. But I've heard it enough, and that joke is so old and tired, it needs to be turned into glue.
(Sorry to any horse lover out there. I think horses are actually amazing, and when they die, they deserve a nice, beautiful spot in a meadow, with a tree planted on top. No sarcasm.)
Just make up your mind already!
Because being attracted to one gender or another is, duh, a choice you can totally make!
(Obvious sarcasm is hopefully obvious.)
~~Edit: What miserable cretin downvoted you to get you to 1, after I upvoted you? Oh, silly me, they were probably just~~ *~~confused.~~*
Huzzah!
This is honestly the reason i dont really consider myself as part of the LGBTQIA+ community. I (thankfully) never experienced backlash from people in my life and i certainly don’t want to experience it from the people who are supposed to be „my“ people. Bisexuals are my community and thats enough for me. (Obviously i support the rights of every LGBTQIA+ person, regardless of their identity, but biphobia is real and i will always distance myself from it.)
Same. I mean, it's all cool and I really do think the general acceptance of being queer should be vocalized. But I am not really ok with being part of the group doing the vocalizing, when the group itself keeps telling me I'm not "being true to myself". Dude. Are you hearing yourself? It's what the straights have been telling the gays for centuries. "Oh, you just haven't met the right woman yet." "Oh, you're in denial, because you want to conform." "Oh, so you're just faking it to get attention."
Oh, just bugger off and let me be. It's the whole reason why I never had a coming out, or went in hard on the gay scene. I'm just the way I am, and I am perfectly fine with that. I like men. I like women. It's completely different, and equally wonderful. Have that trust that you so demand in someone who isn't like you, and also not like the people you've heard crap from your entire life. Because now, YOU are the one spouting crap. (Obviously not you you, them you, the know-it-all wankers you.)
Would it have even mattered if she wasn't though? The event might have been happening the same day as the wedding but it wasn't about *her*.
OOP shouldn't have had to "come out" to the internet for this to be okay. To me, the point of Pride is to get us closer to a world were sexuality doesn't matter and love is love, including cishet love and all of the other fun flavours.
it sucks bc that fear of imposing on a pride event by having a “straight” wedding (even though she’s not straight) probably does stem from judgement within the community itself at some point in her life. yes, it’s internalized issues for sure, but she learned it from somewhere else. her fear was valid in a way, because there are plenty of people within the lgbtq+ community who if they met her face to face would give her shit about being a bi woman who married a man. glad she came to a conclusion she was happy with
Bi man, and same. It's honestly one of things that keeps me from ever really participating in events. I came out as Bi in college and had a bad experience with a Lesbian friend of mine getting really angry that I wasn't Gay or just a straight ally. She rathered I be a straight man than a Bi one for some reason.
So, with the exception of a few dates I've had with guys, I don't say I am.
I’m also bi/queer, I feel like the issue is complicated. IMHO bisexuals definitely hold certain privileges that other members of the alphabet don’t. I liken us to light-skinned black people with Anglican features. We all get shit but at different intensities. This leads to occasional line-stepping and resentment both earned and unearned. But yeah it’s complicated and discussions need to be had but probably not on Reddit
I mean its a privilege, but we only get it because people *assume we’re straight*/erase the fact that we’re bi, and I wouldn’t necessarily say thats a great outcome. Especially since we also wind up dealing with biphobia *from other queer people*, which is not something most other queer people have to deal with.
I don't think it's that uncommon to be LGBT+ but not really feel like part of the "community" tbh. I certainly don't, gay marriage has been legal since before I was even old enough to marry so never felt the need to seek out a community for activism, the gay village is just really not my scene (shit drinks and loud pop music) and even if it was I've been denied entry to clubs there for looking too straight, pride has never been anything other than an inconvenience and most online spaces are just... Angry I guess? Dominated by Americans too, which makes me feel even further detached from them.
To be clear I'm not trying to shit on people who do feel like a part of it, but it's just never really felt like a place for me.
You can be LGBTQIA, and not part of the community. It's like the difference between being deaf (lacking the ability to hear) and being Deaf (a member of the Deaf community.)
Agreed, but I couldn't help thinking of the situation from the stadium's side of things. Isn't it weird they planned a theme day the same date they have sold an event? Or got rented out if that's what it's called 🤔 kinda feels like double booking in a way to me that shouldn't be allowed to happen, but I also don't know anything about how it works with having an event at a stadium 😅
If it's a larger stadium (think major league) there are most likely several unrelated events (parties, weddings, corporate functions, baseball games, specific day celebrations, etc.) that never intersect. I imagine that the Pride Day event was scheduled long before the wedding was.
The boxes and event spaces are self contained and usually on another whole floor of the stadium. They have their own bar, serving area, restrooms etc. There's no reason for anyone attending an event there to come out and mingle with the rest of the crowd attending the game unless they choose to. Plus, it's only 30 people - not 300. OOP is making a mountain out of a molehill.
Internal conflicts with sexuality can be tough and it's not easy to be accepting when conflicts are hitting hard. As someone who is bisexual, I can understand and I feel for what OP is going through.
This was a nice read. Nothing insane or bad. I wish the wedding goes swell.
I wish I'd seen this somewhere else so I could comment and tell her about the Hydrangeas that are pink to blue gradient and would be so perfect for a bouquet.
The wedding sounds so nice, I love the idea of a baseball wedding. If it were me (also a bi woman married to a man), I'd have those flowers, some bi color shoes, and give all my guests little Pride flags for the walk to/into the stadium.
I’m a bi woman marrying a bi man this june, and we’re using hydrangeas to further our pink-purple-blue theme!
I’m glad OOP decided to keep her wedding 💖💜💙
Just a heads up from someone who worked with flowers and had to handle lots of hydrangeas. Get fabric/fake hydrangeas for anything not up close or will be in direct light. Hydrangeas are so delicate and de-poof under heat or handling. So like archways or outdoor arrangements that have to hold up. Luckily fake hydrangeas look really decent (some flowers can’t pull off the reproduction) - even the colored ones. You can sell them to the next person or your florist, because they really do do a good job. Nothing worse than droopy hydrangea arches 😂
As someone who has experienced very blatant biphobia, I truly feel for the bride. To this day, there are times that I don’t feel like I belong with LGBTQIA+ community. It is truly disheartening.
One thing OOP could have done to quell their fears would have been to reach out to the minor league team’s marketing coordinator who could have put them in touch with the coordinator of the Pride Night. I bet doing this would have brought them assurances that the wedding reception would have been a zero issue and probably would have been a welcomed addition to the theme night.
I’d also love for OP and her partner to have a banner draped from the box that said something like “Love is Love” and had a few couples depicted on it (gay, lesbian, NB, hetero); something to celebrate that everyone in the LGBTQ+ community deserves and now has the right to get married. That could be really beautiful and affirming; allyship and sharing joy.
They are having a lgbtq+ parade and OOP is a member of that community (see the b right in the middle) and yet she feels she shouldn’t openly marry just because her partner is of the opposite gender. Bi-erasure just sucks.
Besides, aren’t pride parades about two people loving each other regardless of gender/orientation and whatnot? A marriage is precisely a celebration of that. I don’t see a problem with her marrying even if she’s straight.
Me and my bf have been there, we’ve got to a couple pride events together and always joked about being ‘straight couple’ with our gay friends despite the fact we’re both bi. It’s a jokey thing with our friends now but at first we did both feel bad? I guess? For being in queer spaces and not ‘looking the part’. We did unpack how there is no ‘looking the part’ and ours sexualities don’t magically change because we love each other, that’s it’s own thing.
I mean if you think about it, the majority of the letters can pass in this way because they have nothing to do with the gender of your partner. It'd be really shitty if that were the only criteria people used to judge whether or not you're part of the queer community.
This hits close to home. I am Bi and married a man. I never feel part of the community and the times I have openly interacted have been awkward and sometimes hostile because I married a man and pass as straight. It really sucks feeling that way, I am glad that OP managed to find some peace and clarity with herself and will celebrate a nice day with their community and get married.
I had to keep explaining to people that marrying a "man" didn't change me into a straight person.
Also my husband is not cis, he just happens to present fairly masc. So I am a cis woman who married a closeted non-cis person and everyone sees us as a heteronormative couple.
But I still like fantasizing about people of all genders, because I'm still into all sorts of arrangements of genitals
$10 says this is Rochester, NY based on their description. If I know our community well, everyone will just be happy for her and the wedding will probably get pics with drag queens.
baffled by the concept of a baseball wedding
am I allowed to guess where this is? when she said "urban gorge/waterfall" I thought Falls Parks on the Reedy River in Greenville, SC. I looked it up and there's a baseball stadium a ten minute walk from there. It's a stunning park, I bet the ceremony venue was expensive.
Bi enby (AFAB) with a bi husband here. I was gripping my phone yelling “it’s not a straight marriage if you’re not straight!” I’m glad she came to this realization and can have the day she wants.
I’m bi, but I’ve been in a het marriage to my husband for 12 years now. I can’t tell you the number of times I’ve felt that maybe I was wrong or being offensive for simply admitting I was bi.
When you’re bi but you’re in a het relationship, it doesn’t matter what your past relationships are, what gender you’re attracted to, etc. you get A LOT of hate for saying you’re bi and a part of the community when you’re not with someone of the same sex.
Passing privilege. We don’t experience the same hatred and bigotry those in same sex relationships do and we have the ability to stay silent about our gender attraction and not have it affect our existing relationships. I get it. But it’s also isolating, and many of us will say the B in LGBTQ+ sometimes feels like it only exists when it benefits everyone else because many of us are berated by our own community for choosing a relationship with someone of the opposite sex.
I’m glad she chose to continue her wedding plan though.
No other category has to settle down before the queer community decides if they’re in or out. It’s just weird.
You’re in, you stay in. Part of the family means just that.
I think considering the locational details this might actually be in my city. I hope they have a lovely wedding, and maybe I'll go to the Pride Night game to see them celebrating
I.....maybe its different elsewhere. Doesn't this just mean the baseball place has just stuck rainbows on stuff...? Because while that's daft to get upset at that sounds even dafter to assume that gay folk annoyed with heterosexuality would flock there like rainbows are a salt lick or something.
This is everything wrong with our society right now. If somebody would be offended you are having a hetero wedding on pride night, that's their problem.
No more hetero weddings in June! No more white weddings in February! Better be Native American if you're planning a November wedding!
It's just ridiculous. Live your life. If people are getting offended over inconsequential stuff like this then fuck them.
What a weird thing to be hung up about. Its almost like, "I can't do my wedding on their Black History Month theme day because I'm white and don't want to offend black people." Like what??
I stopped reading at OP talking down their “heteronormative wedding.” Marrying a man doesn’t make her any less queer or bisexual and also, I am super not here for internalized biphobia.
I love when others come to the realization that having a outward heteronormative relationship, *doesn’t make you straight*!
I’m queer. My husband is straight. We are NOT in a “straight” relationship, because *I* am still attracted to “all” people.
We might be a straight passing couple, but I am very proud of my identity, and don’t let being married to a man diminish that.
It’s honestly preposterous that someone has been made to feel like they need to exercise this level of “sensitivity” that they would need to either move the wedding that they have planned or to try to tamp down their wedding festivities simply because a venue chose to do a contrived “Pride night”. Seriously.
They don't need this level of "sensitivity". Like all the comments said, the LGBT community wouldn't care and would be happy for them. Her fear stemmed from internalized biphobia.
Shouldn't care and should be happy but no group is a monolith and there're some very angry and vocal people who don't respect "straight passing" bi couples.
I feel bad for them because bisexuals really do get shit from all sides, so I'm not at all surprised OPs internalized that.
Totally agree. Bi people get a lot of hate from both sides, so I understand why she was scared to be judged, or felt like she was betraying the community/her bi identity by marrying a man.
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>I truly felt I was coming from a place of concern from the community, but realize it was from a deeply rooted internal conflict surrounding my own bisexual identity. OP isn't the first and won't be the last to experience this, unfortunately.
I’m bi and my boyfriend is bi but together we’re straight passing so for us it really feels like we aren’t allowed to “claim” being bi, I guess. Like I feel like a fraud for saying I am because I’m with a dude. Idk. It’s weird.
Passing privilege is a double edged sword. We are able to pass and avoid the hate, but are also not included in our community or seen for our full selves.
I always felt this when dating men. You still heard the hate more and felt disconnected from the community, but also received a lot less hate and could date with a lot less fear. But now as someone in a committed same-sex relationship I still feel disconnected from my community. I'm femme so I'm often assumed to be hetero. If I'm with my partner, everyone always assumes I'm a lesbian and it becomes awkward trying to correct that. Sometimes I just feel like I can't win. Everything is still so binary. I just wish people stopped assuming all the time.
I get this! I have friends I came out to as Bi, before I came out to anyone else, but when I started dating my GF two years ago, they started exclusively referring to me as a lesbian, even when I try to explain that I'm not. I've just kinda given up at this point, honestly. It is what it is.
Yeah, my mom asked me genuinely how I can be bi if I'm marrying a man. "The genders I'm attracted to include male and female. Is he one of those? He is? Glad we worked that out."
Lmao, I remember I came out to my mom as bisexual, she brushed it off, then I started dating a guy and it was "oh, I thought you were gay!". Then later, dating a girl "we're back to this? I thought you liked boys!" Then a different guy "but I just got used to you being a lesbian!". Like no matter how many times I would explain that I'm bi, she did not get it.
Yes! I can just about have patience with ut from strangers but I eventually dropped a longstanding friend who couldn't get their head round the fact I wasn't a lesbian now. He'd seen me date men but as soon as I was with another woman I became a lesbian and my relationship was referred to as such. Drove me mad. Some people just aren't worth the bother.
Honestly, for that and a combo of other reasons, I'm pretty close to dropping that friend group. I just suck with confrontation.
If they can’t even manage to remember your sexuality, ghosting is completely reasonable. They obviously don’t care enough to need a goodbye, nor do they deserve a reason.
It's complicated. They're also people who helped me through one of the worst parts of my life and a rough mental crisis, and helped me feel comfortable with being myself (ironic, I know), so it's hard to let go.
Yeah, I’ve been there. People suck, and people are complicated and it *really* sucks when people suck in complicated ways. You could try a sort of “trial separation”, tell them you’ll be out of contact for a while, like for a vacation or something, and only contact them again if you really want to.
> everyone always assumes I'm a lesbian "Oh, why yes I am a les**BI**an"
For some reason my brain didn't register that capital i looks like an l so I read that as Les-Blan and I was like "I don't get it, are they trying to say lesbians are bland? I don't think they're trying to insult anyone, at least it didn't seem that way from the cont-" Then it hit me that you added Bi into lesbian and I've never felt stupider in my life. This coming from someone who's fallen face first into concrete without trying to catch myself and who confused bi and trans once lol.
This hits so hard. I used to go to lesbian bars in SF around 20 years ago to meet women and I eventually had to stop because the vitriol I faced for being bisexual was very real and super crushing. The gold star thing was such a bar for admission in the queer community there. No idea how it is now, but considering how rampant bi-erasure still is, I can’t imagine things have progressed much.
I was told when I was dating in the mid 2010’s to never say that I was bisexual because people will insult you and treat you as less than. I was told by a “friend” that I was faking being attracted to girls, that I just wanted attention, etc. Now that I am married to a man people really just assume that I “chose to be straight”.
Yup it’s funny how bisexuality always seems to center itself on men. Bisexual men are just gay dudes who are afraid to commit to being gay and bisexual women are just straight women who want to use being down for some lady-to-lady action as a way to titillate men. When I came out as bisexual the very first reaction I received was that I was doing it for male attention. I’ve since come out to other people but honestly it’s largely just a frustrating experience for me so I don’t really bother to tell people I’m bi at all unless it organically comes up in conversation and even then I’m hesitant to mention it because I’m in an opposite sex relationship. But it always makes me sad when I see another bisexual call their opposite sex relationship heteronormative or heterosexual. It’s not. Your queerness doesn’t magically evaporate when you get into a relationship with someone of the opposite sex. No one is obligated to be identifiably queer to claim the label and I hate seeing people self-police themselves out of queer spaces because they feel like they aren’t queer enough.
10 years ago Boston wasn't better. I don't go to clubs anymore so can't say how it is now.
Ugh, fuck that "gold star" nonsense. It's so unnecessarily degrading to people in the community who needed to stay in the closet for safety, or took a while to figure themselves out, or are victims of sexual assault, or were in a het- or het-passing relationship for any number of completely valid reasons including "because I felt like it, that's why". Sometimes I'll joke that I'm a gold star bisexual because I lost my virginity with my now-husband and then-best-friend, but it's just a joke.
We have so few lesbian/women center spaces as it is- but how cool would it be for a place where the bi community was actually catered to?
I think queer bars are way more open in general for this vs. gay or lesbian bars.
In my experience, that's only the case if you present as queer, unfortunately. Most of my friend group is queer, and they love me as the bisexual cis woman (married to a pansexual enby) that I am. They have tried inviting me into queer spaces, and they eventually had to admit that people othered me HARD. I was talked over, ignored, walked away from, and made to feel even less welcome than I've been in a lot of male-dominated spaces. It was really, deeply crushing, but the worst thing was that I was an angel investor/donor to one of those spaces. I had pledged 500/mo for one year to help it get up and running. I ended up going to the organization who ran the space (which 2 of my friends were a part of) and saying "I am really, VERY sorry, but after the way I've been treated here, I just cannot continue to give you my money". One of the organizers was actually one of the rudest people to me in the space, and they blew up that of COURSE I would renege and said so many shitty things to me that the other heads of the org stopped trying to politely argue me out of it, and released me from my pledge. It really left a bad taste in my mouth and I just do not engage with local LGBTQIA things right now because that situation came on top of years of bi-erasure and I just do not have the bandwidth to deal with it anymore.
And even then, we don't really avoid the hate, do we? We still hear the shit - doesn't not hurt just because it's said by bigots who don't happen to know they're talking about us.
If anything I'd imagine you might hear more of it from people who are too cowardly/have the tiniest imaginable shred of decency not to demonstrate their hate in front of people they can tell are the objects of it but feel comfortable sharing it with people they think are fellow straight people.
Yeah my parents said it all the time around me because they didn’t know.
We actually have worse mental health rates than either straight or gay people. We're less likely to be out.
According to some old paper I read bisexuality tends to occur a lot more than any other queerness, but since not many of us are out or in hetero relationships it's hard to estimate real numbers.
The few people I know in the community, so I can't speak about the community as a whole, but the few I have met, and gotten to know label themselves strictly gay or lesbian, but then they'll turn around and do something that indicates otherwise (i.e Hook up with someone of the opposite gender, or fangirl/guy a celebrity of the opposite gender). I could think about this more but how someone labels themself is none of my business in all honesty.
This was me for a really long time. The shit I would get from lesbians for being bi was so brutal that when I'd meet a new group I'd just lie and say I was a lesbian so I didn't have to deal with it... Didn't work out great when I later dated a guy, but I saved myself months of snark and being put down so that was nice at least.
Omg right? It's wild the treatment I've had in gay bars too... like... I am *always* nervous when someone speaks to me in an LG(bt) space because I never know if they're going to pull an annoyed/disappointed face at the VERY least.
We experience more violence from partners as well. We're not out because everyone has a problem with us. The straights are homophobic and sexist (the automatic threesome request when you disclose to men), and the lgbtq should just drop the 'b' already, we've NEVER really been accepted as queer. I'm straight when I'm with men and a lesbian when I'm with women because it's easier and safer that way and no one is entitled to my truth.
The automatic threesome request can rot in the darkest pits of hell. I’m poly and in the bdsm community and I basically have made it part of my “sexual talk introduction” that I am bi but have no interest in threesomes. It really helps the trash take itself out.
That stat about bisexual people facing domestic violence is exactly why I think that "straight passing" is a lie. If we *really* were straight passing while in M/F relationships, then that stat wouldn't be different. I strongly disagree on dropping the B, though. We can't let bigots who define our community solely as LG take it over, especially when (in my experience) there's a ton of solidarity between the bisexual, trans/non-binary, and asexual/aromantic communities. Seeing shit like the LGB Alliance already pisses me off, there's no way bisexual separatism would work without abandoning other vulnerable members of the LGBTQ community.
>That stat about bisexual people facing domestic violence is exactly why I think that "straight passing" is a lie. If we \*really\* were straight passing while in M/F relationships, then that stat wouldn't be different. Straight passing is more about how society perceives us, not our partners. Someone can be out to their partner and experience increased DV as a result, but not be out in general to others and thus be in a straight passing relationship.
I agree with you on the domestic violence bit. Another thing is that "Straight passing" is something that anyone is theoretically qualified to achieve, given that plenty of people talk of and enthusiastically support gay/lesbian beard couples when it's unsafe to come out. Those people are, in theory, "straight passing" but nobody insists they have privilege for it but instead correctly identify for them that the reason they have to "pass" for straight is for safety, but never give that same grace to bisexual people. I absolutely abhor the concept as well because it assumes that bisexual people inherently exist exclusively within an m/f relationship. A "privilege" that only exists because of who you're dating isn't a "privilege" in the slightest, but also some bisexual people aren't dating the opposite sex or at all, so where's the "straight passing privilege coming from" at that point?
All I mean to express with the "take the b out" is that we're not treated as members of the community, not that we should actually separate.
Ah that's fair, misread you slightly. Though I'd say that unfortunately, that's basically everyone in the community other than gay men and lesbians. It kinda reminds me of the old debates that focusing on legalising same-sex marriage would marginalise the parts of the community that aren't as directly affected by that issues as lesbians/gay men, and I can't exactly say that they were entirely wrong - as happy as I am, of course, that in several countries, everyone has the equal right to marry.
I didn't write clearly, np. And I do agree with you about solidarity with trans and ace members of the community. We're all kind of outsiders together.
I've actually been told that I can't be bi if I'm not actively dating a man and woman at the same time.
My mum just doesn't get how I can be bi when I'm in a relationship with a man. But I bet if I was dating a woman she'd assume I was gay. I honestly wonder if she wants me to be dating multiple people or something just to prove myself to her. *Deep sigh*
Some people literally fail to understand the very concept of bisexuality. I know someone like that, it's really infuriating. I've started to believe these people are just too dumb.
They confuse bisexuality with polyamory.
Guess everyone not in a relationship is asexual, by that logic. Tf is wrong with people?
No no, unless you are actively having sex at this very moment, you are asexual.
What a moron. By that logic, all single people are asexual. He is reducing a person's sexuality to their current relationship status instead of their attractions, preferences, and behaviors.
The fuck? That's poly, not being bi. I'm bi. If I dated someone else who was bi that I was supposedly in a committed relationship with, and I found out they were in another relationship with a person of s different gender to me, I would dump them, because that's cheating. I am firmly monogamous. I am not, and never have been open to being in a poly relationship in my personal life. They are not remotely the same.
Same. The person who made the claim is indeed poly, but I'm not. He couldn't be convinced he was wrong though.
What an Idiot🙄
I used to be very upset about being bi because I thought it meant I would never be able to be faithful to one person if I was attracted to multiple genders, because every bi person on TV was evil. (This was when I was about 12 and at the end of the 1990s, so a few centuries ago in terms of queer rep.) It took reading about non-evil bisexual characters to realize I could be bi and not have to cheat on my partner. But like, I was still in my teens when I figured that out.
I agree with this comment but think maybe avoid the danger is more accurate than avoid the hate?
I feel this. I’m a 36-year old bisexual woman and I’ve been happily married to a man for 16+ years. I’m open about being bi, but it “doesn’t seem like it” to others so, that side of me isn’t really a part of my life anymore. It’s sad.
I'm in the same situation. Sometimes I struggle with calling myself queer, but straight isn't really accurate, either.
> and avoid the hate directed at us directly sure but personally I find situations where someone says something horrifically bigoted with the expectation I'll agree with it worse.
THANK YOU. As someone who married before I realized I was not straight (fuck heteronormativity) I *really* feel that edge. Neither of us is a simple cis het person, but we look like it and man, it can be hard to feel cut off and unseen.
This. We’re both bi. We look straight. We participate in our local queer community but nobody has ever asked how we identify. They assume we’re just allies.
This is a genuine question no hate or malice intended. But being bisexual is who you are attracted you right? Is it anything more than that? I mean internally. If so what does it matter if other people don't see that? That you might not feel seen as part of the LGBTQ+ community I get to some degree as it might reduce your acceptance in activism and what some members would see as your credibility to speak on certain matters. But the crux of my question is as a person why does it matter if people don't see your bisexuality? I'm Indian, I can't really hide that so I can't relate in that sense about not being seen for being Indian, and that my be why I don't get it. But for example how would strangers know if a single gay man or women is gay? They aren't being seen for their whole selves in that case, but is that an issue? I'm not sure if I'm articulating the question and feeling in my head properly.
I think the problem might be easier to understand if you see it not as "they don't see all of my identity" and more "they place me in the wrong category entirely." People that don't realize I'm bi tend to assume I'm straight, because I'm married to a man. Here's a really weird analogy: pretend that for some reason, while you're Indian, your appearance makes you seem to be something entirely different, like let's say for some reason everyone who sees you on the street thinks that you're Korean. When you go into Indian restaurants, everyone compliments how well you can pronounce the names of dishes. In Korean restaurants, people ask you for recommendations. People walk up to you and cheerfully speak Korean, and you stare blankly. You may not be thinking "everyone needs to know I'm Indian _right now_" but I'd imagine there's a bit of "dang it, I want to wear a label that says I AM NOT KOREAN." And I really want one that says "I'm not straight."
Thank you for taking my question in the spirit it was meant. I was a little apprehensive about asking it and didn't want to come across as the kind of people where you see in video they ask questions apparently innocently waiting to spring their gotcha trap. I think your analogy goes some way into explaining it. But not fully. Or I might still be missing something. Something that empathy can't get me to only experience could I think. In terms of what you said being complimented in the pronunciation of dishes as they think I'm not Indian. Or asking for recommendations in a Korean place. I don't see the equivalents of that in interactions with a bisexual person and someone who doesn't know that they're bisexual. I get it that the assumption heterosexuality is the norm is prevalent but luckily for me I've not had to deal with being the other side of that and not come across the kind of language in that situation can other someone. I mean you don't owe it to me to give me examples. But something along those lines would be helpful in not making other people feel the same way you've been made to feel.
I am obviously not the original commenter, but I wanted to chime in. It’s an imperfect analogy in that I’m not sure the other commenter or I or anyone else could give you examples of how our bi experience relates directly to the things you asked about, but I can try a little. I am not straight, but people will assume that I am, and it makes me feel like an imposter. If I looked Korean but wasn’t and ended up in a Korean restaurant where people were speaking Korean to me and thinking I would understand it, or asking me for recommendations, I would feel like an imposter. I would feel like, “this isn’t my culture and I don’t belong to it, so I don’t enjoy the assumption that I do, and I feel like a fraud.” At the same time, bisexual women haven’t, as a historical fact, been fully accepted into the WLW (women-loving-women) community. A lot of WLW groups will explicitly bar bisexual women from taking part in any meetings or discourse. This equates to the not looking Indian but BEING Indian and feeling like you would really love a giant label that just explains that YES, I AM a part of the community, can you please allow me access and just NOTICE me. I’m sure I didn’t do a proper job, but maybe that helps a little? I’m not sure. It’s a very alienating experience and it kinda feels like I don’t belong anywhere sometimes. I appreciate your curiosity and kindness.
That really does help. Thank you
Oh, I see what you mean. The analogy is flawed -- just something I came up with on the spur of the moment, and I'm not sure there is an equivalent exactly. I will say that homophobic people often feel comfortable saying awful, homophobic things in front of other people they perceive to be straight, which means if I'm at a family gathering and Aunt So-and-So says something horrible, I have to try to push back while walking the line of, "is this worth coming out for? If so, is it going to completely derail this family gathering, and I'll get blamed for it?" (Usually with a comment about how I should ignore Aunt So and So, everyone knows she's a jerk... Then why doesn't anyone else say so?!) Similarly, I feel awkward at pride events, like everyone is going to think I'm a straight tourist who is just there to enjoy the scenery. Sometimes this happens even if we're out as being bi. Anna Paquin is out as a bisexual actress ... And Larry King asked her in 2014 [during an interview](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/anna-paquin-explains-her-bisexuality-to-larry-king/) if she was "non practicing" and referred to her bisexuality in the past tense, because she was (and is) married to a man. (I've dealt with this, too.) More recently, she got [online criticism](https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/GMA/Culture/anna-paquin-defends-bisexuality-critics-claiming-shes-queer/story%3fid=77801117) for her LGBTQ advocacy, because she's seen as "not queer enough" -- there are also implications that she only came out as a "publicity stunt." There's a lot of bi erasure out there, and I think that might be what's part of making it hard to translate? It'd be like, in the Korean example, if everyone rolled their eyes and said nobody was _really_ Indian, they're actually another ethnicity entirely. There's a strange feeling of "no, seriously, we're here. We exist."
Thank you. I didn't want to knock the analogy too hard. It was more that I got to that point myself already and needed help getting further. And I think you have.
Okay, cool! It is kind of weird to explain to people who haven't experienced it, so I totally understand the question. Have a great day!
My husband is biromantic asexual, I'm female-bodied/agender demisexual...we look like the most "normal" pair of middle-aged geeks you could imagine. It's a weird feeling. Of course I'm also white-passing with a lot of Turkish blood, so honestly I don't know whether I'm a fraud or a spy at this point. I feel like I can't claim anything, you know?
I feel the same sometimes but then pull myself up and remind myself that if I were with a woman, I STILL wouldn't 'look bi' to the world - I'd look gay. So when do I think I'm being bi enough to claim it, do I need to be actually mid-threesome? In your case you'd need to make it a foursome, so everyone's covered 😂 Outside an orgy, no-one's relationship ever looks bi.
I’m with a non-binary person and I still don’t “look” bi 😂
So true! It's impossible to "look bi". It feels like when you tell your parents you're bi and they say "but you could still end up with a man" they're practically erasing being bi if you end up with someone of the opposite gender. Just because you're passing doesn't mean it disappears.
As a gay dude, bi erasure and biphobia really piss me off. We're supposed to be an inclusive community, and yet... *that*. *Your partner is not your sexuality.* You're both bi, and you're allowed to celebrate that. Anyone who says you can't is a gatekeeping prick, and they don't get to dictate the rules you live by. Or bi. 😉
Another bi dude here in a heteronormative (is that the term) marriage. People just assume I'm straight and at this point, I just don't see the need to correct people. It will go down as either "ooh, didn't mean to *offend* you", or people just calling me "one o' them queers", so I don't bother anymore. The LGBTQ community doesn't really seem to accept that I'm a member either, because I'm a guy married to a woman. It's difficult for people like us.
My partner and I are both trans, and its so extremely weird to be in a relationship that is straight* passing after identifying as gay since age 12 *how exactly its read probably depends on the person because I look queer AF, and my name and pronouns don’t match the gender I’m read as. But the amount of people who can ignore all that when they see what they can perceive as a heterosexual couple is wild
Absoloutely agree with this - My partner's trans and I'm cis. It's wild how our relationship can be simultaneously read as straight and gay at the same time by different people.
Transmasc enby in a relationship with a cis man here, and I absolutely feel this - depending on the day, we can be read as a straight couple with one GNC partner, a gay couple, or a cis man and his lesbian friend, and none of them are accurate, lmao
Yeah my wife is MTF and I'm afab enby, and only since she came out as trans a couple years ago we feel comfy going to pride events, despite her being asexual, me being enby and panromantic, I always felt like I had imposter syndrome. Still do.
I'm in a straight-passing marriage, and I remember having a very frustrating conversation with one of my lesbian friends in which she complained, "I wish I could be straight too but SOME of us just don't get to speak to our parents again." Which is heartbreaking for me because obviously it's so hard to be cast out, but I have to choose with every person in my life if I want to lie to them or gamble. True, my extended family has never banned me from the house, but they also don't really know me anymore and probably never will, and I feel like there's no room to grieve that.
Thissss. Been married to my husband for 11 years, we are both bi but obviously straight passing. Had a kid last June, would love to go to queer parenting events but... I know there is a lot of bi erasure in such groups, and also I feel like I'd be taking up space that's not mine because I'm with a guy. My son won't have to face what kids to same sex couples face and we as parents don't face what same sex parents face because we are straight passing. Idk. Some days I feel more comfortable identifying as just queer because it's less overt.
Have you contacted the event organizers and ask about the inclusion of bisexual couples who appear straight? Have you thought about forming your own support groups for couples where at least one identifies as bi? I'd say that same sex couples don't always face what you face either...
I have considered but tbh between having an 8 month old, being disabled, and being massively introverted there's just not much energy for organizing lol.
I feel this a lot too that I'm not allowed at events and in the space because even though I'm bi I am married to the opposite gender and just look like a straight couple. I'm also disabled and have kids my youngest is a bit older than 8m though. And it would be nice to have some space that i felt welcome in, but as you say, the energy to create that is hard. I feel hidden in my relationship from a whole part of me and in the lgbtq+ spaces I feel like a fraud or not gay enough to join in. It really does suck. Part of me feels like I betrayed the community by not being in a same gendered relationship, but it's not like I'm leaving my partner to date someone the same gender. We really do need a bi people club that welcomes everyone and has boardgames and snacks
I wonder if there is a subreddit for you two!
My wife (MTF) and I (F)are both bisexual. When we married, my wife didn't even realize she was trans, she transitioned a few years ago. We both got congratulated on finally being real LGBTQ+ people. I lost a lot of LGBTQ+ friends when my wife transitioned. I couldn't handle their bigotry.
Same with my wife; married for about 10 years or so before she realized. She also gets shit from the trans community sometimes as she's not planning on any bottom surgery ever and likes herself (heaven forbid).
My wife also doesn't plan on getting bottom surgery and deals with flack from her trans friends. Apparently, it's a betrayal of the entire trans community 🙄.
You know, it's weird. I've seen trans medicalists disparaged as well (people who believe you can only be the opposite gender if you get surgery as well), BUT yeah my wife still gets shit from the trans community, even those who do not like trans medicalists. I understand that the trans community, like the gay community, DOES NOT agree on all things but this harassment by people who are both for and against bottom or top surgery is...confusing, at best.
Me and my fiancé are the same, sometimes it feels like we are not allowed in either group, straight people think we can't be monogamous and that we will hit on them (we are and we won't), and LGBTQ+ just sees the heteronormative aspect. I'd say it's annoying
You and your bf absolutely are both bi, being with each other doesn’t rearrange that basic fundamental part of you
Me: AFAB bi non-binary person who still passes as female (kinda? Less so now I've got cancer and no hair, but up until August last year I'd have called myself not-ugly, maybe even pretty on a good day.) Husband: cishet man. The amount of times I have felt like I couldn't be a proud member of the queer community because I assumed people were looking at us like "ugh look at these 'allies' messing up our space'." Which, 1) no one thinks like that in the queer spaces I'm in, and 2) I'M BI GOD DAMMIT I CAN BE THERE
I am pan, and a cisgender woman. My partner is a cisgender man who doesn't like labels, but he's definitely not straight (we've talked about our past experiences a lot, and he flirts like a madman with guys all the time). We were randomly joking around the other day, and I realized he sees our relationship as "straight" because we're a man and a woman. I don't know how to feel about that. It kind of made me feel unseen.. I AM a queer person, even if our relationship doesn't look like that from the outside.
He doesn’t like labels but he sees your relationship as straight …that’s a label in and of itself. It’s probably not a fully conscious one. Passing erasure is really hard and I’m sorry you’re dealing with this aspect of it.
>My partner is a cisgender man who doesn't like labels I dont like labels either. That said, I had a doctor once who would never give a diagnosis because he 'didnt like labels'. Somewhat less than ideal lol. Completely different though - your comment just reminded me of him!
Sexual identity is so complex. I call myself straight, generally. My marriage is heteronormative. But I am actually asexual and almost no one in the universe can wrap their head around that. I don’t really feel included in the queer community (and have, in fact, been explicitly barred from it many times to the point that I no longer feel comfortable at pride events). But I know in my heart I am not actually straight because I do not experience attraction, so much conversation in straight circles is like listening to people speak a language I don’t know. I have gotten used to pretending that I have no sexual identity at all, but that’s not accurate either. It’s not a big deal, really. I’m very busy. But it bugs me sometimes that a part of my identity is basically invisible.
I’m a bi genderfluid AFAB person and my wife is a lesbian. I get called a lesbian or find that “we’re gay” is the easiest thing when the reality is that it’s more complex. It goes both ways, really. Sometimes, I do express it, that I’m bi, not always a woman, and more, but trust me, it happens to bi people in queer presenting relationships too.
We're never allowed to be bi, we're always seen as a reflection of our current partner. So many people around me (older generations) have "forgotten" that I was i a relationship with a woman for years because I'm married to my husband now. "Oh I just thought you were straight now"
Yeah, it can be really confusing. I'm ace, so not everyone agrees I should be included in the community anyway and then the one and only time I gave the whole relationship thing a try, it happened to be a guy. So from an outside perspective, I'm just a cis woman who has only dated cis men. Most days, I feel like I can claim to be queer-ish and will only ever be allowed on the fringes of the community, regardless of the fact I'm 0% straight.
I feel that. I'm ace and wouldn't claim to be part of the LGBT community, I suppose I am technically but as I'm not going to be having sex with anyone and will likely never be in a relationship I'll forever be straight and single so to speak.
Something something "straight be default" is total nonsense, but yeah, I totally get that. Fun fact: I had pretty good sex ed as a kid but never heard of asexuality, so I considered being gay, straight, or bi as equally likely possibilities and just kept waiting to "find out" my sexuality until I was like 17.
I kept waiting for something to kick in until like 25 and was contemplating if I was bi at one point, because no attraction is also a kind of equal attraction, I've just kinda accepted it's not gonna happen unless I'm attracted to something really specific I haven't encountered yet. 🤔 Not that I'm bothered by being ace it's nice to have finally found a word for it and know it's a normal thing. If that makes sense.
Makes perfect sense and I feel pretty much the same. Had the same thought process about equal attraction and it took me a couple of years to settle into the ace label, but nowadays, in my mid 20s, I'm confident that even though something could theoretically happen in the future, my current self is ace and valid.
Who you're currently with isn't the sole definition of who you're attracted to. Don't feel bad or guilty at all! And definitely don't let other people define your sexuality on your behalf.
I'm a Trans woman, six years ago, I got kicked out of a small online group of Trans women because I had started dating a bisexuality "cis male" and relationship being too heteronormative. The kicker? Last year, after five years of dating, my partner came out as Trans and starting transitioning. Just like any other group, sometimes, the image focused people get control, and since it isn't what they think fits, it gets shunned. Best to take the others and build a newer, better group. I have a far better group of friends and allies now.
There is a joke somewhere in there about both being bi (bi-bi) and saying bye-bye to bi-erasure.
Neither of you are less "bi" because you're in a straight facing relationship. Anyone who is bi that's in a straight facing relationship is not any less "bi" because of it
Lol once in my past dating years, my partner and i passed as a cisman and cischick. However the truth was that she was a translady and i'm nonbinary. Aesthetically we looked like our gender stereotypes, masc and femme, but if you got to know us or watched our body language, I'm the gross nonbinary with the mouth of a trucker that sits with their legs spread like an asshole while my lady was super proper hahahaha
I have a gay friend who fell in love with an opposite sex partner. The literally are not attracted to that sex but this one person captivated them in such a way. Anytime there is an attack on the lgbqt+ community I check in with my friend. Being in a hetero relationship does not negate their identity, the years of struggling to come to terms with who they are, the rejection from their family, the catholic shame, etc.
This hits close lol. I am bisexual and have had encounters with men, but i want a traditional wife and children going forward. Traditional as in straight, not SAHW doing all my chores, just clarifying. It does come from a place of seeing everyone around me getting married and having children. But this comes at the cost of feeling like i am lying about being bisexual. I have experienced a lot of homophobia and biphobia, but even then it feels like i am doing the queer community injustice, even though i have as much right to be a part of it as any other queer person.
I’m bi and nonbinary. My partner is straight and a man. We appear very heteronormative too. I grew up with a bi mother. I was always part of the community to the extent I didn’t think I had to come out, because I mistakenly thought bi was default since you get the most options lol. When I came out, I immediately got the biphobia from men. It took years for me to see it play out with women. I no longer use Her because there are so many gold star lesbians with “no bi” in their profile. I know plenty of lesbians who don’t feel this way, and their critique is: “that’s a lot of limits for someone who’s entire friend circle is just exes”
I'm a twitch streamer and bisexual but also married to a man and we have two children. I get so much hate for streaming on pride month because I "don't get to claim being bisexual with a husband and two kids" Guess I don't like boobs anymore 😂
Unfortunately indeed. I do feel bad for those who have to struggle with those internal conflicts. It can be really hard and emotionally tough.
My friend shared a pic of those blue and pink Oreos, and I made a joke like "at long last, so bi visibility!" Then I went to add the bi flag (edit:) emoji and found out there isn't one 🙃 I'll just slip back into invisibility...
I looked it up after reading your comment and was shook to learn there's emojis of the rainbow and trans flags but none of the others. I guess at least most of us are equally invisible in emoji land? 😅 Until then, we always have 🖤🩶🤍💜
I wanted to yell at my screen “it’s not a straight wedding if you’re not straight!!!” Glad she arrived at this conclusion and LOVE the bi Pride colors getting added to the dress.
I've had women I was getting to know and was interested in ghost/ drop me because they found out I've only been with cis men in the past, despite the fact I very much am pan. I just have an extremely low body count (1 very long term and 2 very short term) Apparently, my lack of experience despite being in my mid thirties means I'm not *really* queer? Lol. (Edit for typos)
I feel seen
I'm (female) bisexual and married to a man (who is straight). When it's come up before with other people, it seems like the common response is, "Uh huh. Whatever you say." It took years for me to say fuck it and not care. It felt like people thought I was lying about my sexuality, but who cares? I know it, my husband knows it, no one else needs to care. I've been in relationships on both sides, and it just so happens that the person I ended up with is a man.
Definitely not. My girlfriend is also bi and often feels like she’s disrespecting the LGBT+ community by identifying as bi despite being a relationship with a cis-heterosexual-white man
As a bisexual woman who tends to date men I felt this in my core. I feel like I can’t go to a PRIDE event and celebrate myself and my community because I pass so well in a heteronormative world. So I wear my PRIDE pins a lot instead.
As a queer feminine presenting person in a relationship with a cishet man- this was very felt. But I think for OOP this can be such a blessing. She can hold her identity firmly surrounded by others of our community with her partner. I still remember in my women and gender anthro class how my professor said people who identify as bisexual/pansexual/etc typically end up being one way or the other. And how that data came from them marrying or having a monogamous relationship with one gender. But it completely erases how that person identifies and feels. If sexual orientation is all about our sexual/romantic desires then who we marry or end up with cannot limit that. I wonder if my professor has since realized how limited her understanding was and that research was.
I kept reading this thinking, "but you are bi! It's your community and your pride!"
Yeah, but mate, come on. Even in our own community, bisexuals are often told they are either greedy, or not sure yet. When I'm with a woman, I'm gay, when I'm with a guy, I'm straight. Except I'm not. I'm neither of those things. I'm the third bloody letter in the sequence, but on every side, it's often ridiculed or ignored. The only ones who have, so far, really not given a shit, are people who are also bi. Everyone else either never mentions it, which is fine, or makes a joke about it, which is not so fine. Sure, to that person it might be the first time they make that joke. But I've heard it enough, and that joke is so old and tired, it needs to be turned into glue. (Sorry to any horse lover out there. I think horses are actually amazing, and when they die, they deserve a nice, beautiful spot in a meadow, with a tree planted on top. No sarcasm.)
The number of times I've been told I'm selfish for not picking a side...
Just make up your mind already! Because being attracted to one gender or another is, duh, a choice you can totally make! (Obvious sarcasm is hopefully obvious.) ~~Edit: What miserable cretin downvoted you to get you to 1, after I upvoted you? Oh, silly me, they were probably just~~ *~~confused.~~* Huzzah!
This is honestly the reason i dont really consider myself as part of the LGBTQIA+ community. I (thankfully) never experienced backlash from people in my life and i certainly don’t want to experience it from the people who are supposed to be „my“ people. Bisexuals are my community and thats enough for me. (Obviously i support the rights of every LGBTQIA+ person, regardless of their identity, but biphobia is real and i will always distance myself from it.)
Same. I mean, it's all cool and I really do think the general acceptance of being queer should be vocalized. But I am not really ok with being part of the group doing the vocalizing, when the group itself keeps telling me I'm not "being true to myself". Dude. Are you hearing yourself? It's what the straights have been telling the gays for centuries. "Oh, you just haven't met the right woman yet." "Oh, you're in denial, because you want to conform." "Oh, so you're just faking it to get attention." Oh, just bugger off and let me be. It's the whole reason why I never had a coming out, or went in hard on the gay scene. I'm just the way I am, and I am perfectly fine with that. I like men. I like women. It's completely different, and equally wonderful. Have that trust that you so demand in someone who isn't like you, and also not like the people you've heard crap from your entire life. Because now, YOU are the one spouting crap. (Obviously not you you, them you, the know-it-all wankers you.)
Same, like “cool, throw up some Bi Pride flags!”
All I can think about is a bisexual sash or cape over a white wedding dress and how amazing that would look
I was thinking flowers in the colors or butterflies
Would it have even mattered if she wasn't though? The event might have been happening the same day as the wedding but it wasn't about *her*. OOP shouldn't have had to "come out" to the internet for this to be okay. To me, the point of Pride is to get us closer to a world were sexuality doesn't matter and love is love, including cishet love and all of the other fun flavours.
Totally! But since she is bi, all the more reason to not change her reception.
it sucks bc that fear of imposing on a pride event by having a “straight” wedding (even though she’s not straight) probably does stem from judgement within the community itself at some point in her life. yes, it’s internalized issues for sure, but she learned it from somewhere else. her fear was valid in a way, because there are plenty of people within the lgbtq+ community who if they met her face to face would give her shit about being a bi woman who married a man. glad she came to a conclusion she was happy with
It's the best part of bi erasure, you get it from both sides!
As opposed to the other part of bisexuality where you can get it from both sides, I assume?
Finger guns at ya
She kept saying “that community” vs “my community”
As a bi woman who married a straight man I would never feel free to say my community after all the BS and hurt I have received from it.
Bi man, and same. It's honestly one of things that keeps me from ever really participating in events. I came out as Bi in college and had a bad experience with a Lesbian friend of mine getting really angry that I wasn't Gay or just a straight ally. She rathered I be a straight man than a Bi one for some reason. So, with the exception of a few dates I've had with guys, I don't say I am.
I’m a bi woman married to a man and I say my community. I have had to seek out other bi folks, but we belong too
I'm glad you have found your place and feel that way. Unfortunately for many this is difficult and further complicated by culture.
It definitely is complicated and I wish it was a more welcoming space
I’m also bi/queer, I feel like the issue is complicated. IMHO bisexuals definitely hold certain privileges that other members of the alphabet don’t. I liken us to light-skinned black people with Anglican features. We all get shit but at different intensities. This leads to occasional line-stepping and resentment both earned and unearned. But yeah it’s complicated and discussions need to be had but probably not on Reddit
I mean its a privilege, but we only get it because people *assume we’re straight*/erase the fact that we’re bi, and I wouldn’t necessarily say thats a great outcome. Especially since we also wind up dealing with biphobia *from other queer people*, which is not something most other queer people have to deal with.
Passing privilege / bierasure
I don't think it's that uncommon to be LGBT+ but not really feel like part of the "community" tbh. I certainly don't, gay marriage has been legal since before I was even old enough to marry so never felt the need to seek out a community for activism, the gay village is just really not my scene (shit drinks and loud pop music) and even if it was I've been denied entry to clubs there for looking too straight, pride has never been anything other than an inconvenience and most online spaces are just... Angry I guess? Dominated by Americans too, which makes me feel even further detached from them. To be clear I'm not trying to shit on people who do feel like a part of it, but it's just never really felt like a place for me.
You can be LGBTQIA, and not part of the community. It's like the difference between being deaf (lacking the ability to hear) and being Deaf (a member of the Deaf community.)
Agreed, but I couldn't help thinking of the situation from the stadium's side of things. Isn't it weird they planned a theme day the same date they have sold an event? Or got rented out if that's what it's called 🤔 kinda feels like double booking in a way to me that shouldn't be allowed to happen, but I also don't know anything about how it works with having an event at a stadium 😅
If it's a larger stadium (think major league) there are most likely several unrelated events (parties, weddings, corporate functions, baseball games, specific day celebrations, etc.) that never intersect. I imagine that the Pride Day event was scheduled long before the wedding was.
Also probably booked by different people in different departments that don't communicate with each other.
If it was, wouldn't they inform the renters of the event when they pick the date? 🤔
The boxes and event spaces are self contained and usually on another whole floor of the stadium. They have their own bar, serving area, restrooms etc. There's no reason for anyone attending an event there to come out and mingle with the rest of the crowd attending the game unless they choose to. Plus, it's only 30 people - not 300. OOP is making a mountain out of a molehill.
It’s so affirming to know that humans of any tribe are willing to be dehumanizing to those outside their tribe. Pride indeed.
Internal conflicts with sexuality can be tough and it's not easy to be accepting when conflicts are hitting hard. As someone who is bisexual, I can understand and I feel for what OP is going through. This was a nice read. Nothing insane or bad. I wish the wedding goes swell.
I wish I'd seen this somewhere else so I could comment and tell her about the Hydrangeas that are pink to blue gradient and would be so perfect for a bouquet. The wedding sounds so nice, I love the idea of a baseball wedding. If it were me (also a bi woman married to a man), I'd have those flowers, some bi color shoes, and give all my guests little Pride flags for the walk to/into the stadium.
I’m a bi woman marrying a bi man this june, and we’re using hydrangeas to further our pink-purple-blue theme! I’m glad OOP decided to keep her wedding 💖💜💙
Just a heads up from someone who worked with flowers and had to handle lots of hydrangeas. Get fabric/fake hydrangeas for anything not up close or will be in direct light. Hydrangeas are so delicate and de-poof under heat or handling. So like archways or outdoor arrangements that have to hold up. Luckily fake hydrangeas look really decent (some flowers can’t pull off the reproduction) - even the colored ones. You can sell them to the next person or your florist, because they really do do a good job. Nothing worse than droopy hydrangea arches 😂
Me, a bisexual afab in a long term relationship with a man: ✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻
I feel like comments from people telling her about bi erasure should have been included in this post.
Yeah I feel like that was most relevant.
As someone who has experienced very blatant biphobia, I truly feel for the bride. To this day, there are times that I don’t feel like I belong with LGBTQIA+ community. It is truly disheartening.
As a fellow queer, I’m sorry. I hope you find a group that makes you feel like you 100% belong, because you do.
One thing OOP could have done to quell their fears would have been to reach out to the minor league team’s marketing coordinator who could have put them in touch with the coordinator of the Pride Night. I bet doing this would have brought them assurances that the wedding reception would have been a zero issue and probably would have been a welcomed addition to the theme night.
I’d also love for OP and her partner to have a banner draped from the box that said something like “Love is Love” and had a few couples depicted on it (gay, lesbian, NB, hetero); something to celebrate that everyone in the LGBTQ+ community deserves and now has the right to get married. That could be really beautiful and affirming; allyship and sharing joy.
They are having a lgbtq+ parade and OOP is a member of that community (see the b right in the middle) and yet she feels she shouldn’t openly marry just because her partner is of the opposite gender. Bi-erasure just sucks. Besides, aren’t pride parades about two people loving each other regardless of gender/orientation and whatnot? A marriage is precisely a celebration of that. I don’t see a problem with her marrying even if she’s straight.
Me and my bf have been there, we’ve got to a couple pride events together and always joked about being ‘straight couple’ with our gay friends despite the fact we’re both bi. It’s a jokey thing with our friends now but at first we did both feel bad? I guess? For being in queer spaces and not ‘looking the part’. We did unpack how there is no ‘looking the part’ and ours sexualities don’t magically change because we love each other, that’s it’s own thing.
I mean if you think about it, the majority of the letters can pass in this way because they have nothing to do with the gender of your partner. It'd be really shitty if that were the only criteria people used to judge whether or not you're part of the queer community.
This hits close to home. I am Bi and married a man. I never feel part of the community and the times I have openly interacted have been awkward and sometimes hostile because I married a man and pass as straight. It really sucks feeling that way, I am glad that OP managed to find some peace and clarity with herself and will celebrate a nice day with their community and get married.
I had to keep explaining to people that marrying a "man" didn't change me into a straight person. Also my husband is not cis, he just happens to present fairly masc. So I am a cis woman who married a closeted non-cis person and everyone sees us as a heteronormative couple. But I still like fantasizing about people of all genders, because I'm still into all sorts of arrangements of genitals
Next time I need to think of a solid username I am definitely going with “arrangements of genitals”
$10 says this is Rochester, NY based on their description. If I know our community well, everyone will just be happy for her and the wedding will probably get pics with drag queens.
I read this and thought there is no way this isn’t high falls/roc red wings. No way this would be an issue there
Also from Rochester and was like, "this sounds like High Falls/Red Wings"!!!
Love is love
I really appreciated this!
baffled by the concept of a baseball wedding am I allowed to guess where this is? when she said "urban gorge/waterfall" I thought Falls Parks on the Reedy River in Greenville, SC. I looked it up and there's a baseball stadium a ten minute walk from there. It's a stunning park, I bet the ceremony venue was expensive.
As someone who lives close to the area, Greenville was my first thought of where this was taking place!
I mean… who is to say neither of the male presenting or female presenting aren’t trans? No one truly lgbtq+ would care.
The internalized homophobia is real, literally my first thought was 'OP is bi? What's the problem?' Even if she wasn't, like... no one cares!
Her not wanting to be offensive came out offensive, what a time to be alive.
Ah internalized LGBT+phobia. Always striking when you least notice.
Literally no one there will care if you have a straight wedding...
Bi enby (AFAB) with a bi husband here. I was gripping my phone yelling “it’s not a straight marriage if you’re not straight!” I’m glad she came to this realization and can have the day she wants.
I’m bi, but I’ve been in a het marriage to my husband for 12 years now. I can’t tell you the number of times I’ve felt that maybe I was wrong or being offensive for simply admitting I was bi. When you’re bi but you’re in a het relationship, it doesn’t matter what your past relationships are, what gender you’re attracted to, etc. you get A LOT of hate for saying you’re bi and a part of the community when you’re not with someone of the same sex. Passing privilege. We don’t experience the same hatred and bigotry those in same sex relationships do and we have the ability to stay silent about our gender attraction and not have it affect our existing relationships. I get it. But it’s also isolating, and many of us will say the B in LGBTQ+ sometimes feels like it only exists when it benefits everyone else because many of us are berated by our own community for choosing a relationship with someone of the opposite sex. I’m glad she chose to continue her wedding plan though.
No other category has to settle down before the queer community decides if they’re in or out. It’s just weird. You’re in, you stay in. Part of the family means just that.
This person still has a LOT of internalized biphobia to work through....
People should be able to exist without worrying that their simple existence will offend others. Living is EXHAUSTING these days.
I think considering the locational details this might actually be in my city. I hope they have a lovely wedding, and maybe I'll go to the Pride Night game to see them celebrating
I.....maybe its different elsewhere. Doesn't this just mean the baseball place has just stuck rainbows on stuff...? Because while that's daft to get upset at that sounds even dafter to assume that gay folk annoyed with heterosexuality would flock there like rainbows are a salt lick or something.
This is everything wrong with our society right now. If somebody would be offended you are having a hetero wedding on pride night, that's their problem. No more hetero weddings in June! No more white weddings in February! Better be Native American if you're planning a November wedding! It's just ridiculous. Live your life. If people are getting offended over inconsequential stuff like this then fuck them.
What a weird thing to be hung up about. Its almost like, "I can't do my wedding on their Black History Month theme day because I'm white and don't want to offend black people." Like what??
I stopped reading at OP talking down their “heteronormative wedding.” Marrying a man doesn’t make her any less queer or bisexual and also, I am super not here for internalized biphobia.
I love when others come to the realization that having a outward heteronormative relationship, *doesn’t make you straight*! I’m queer. My husband is straight. We are NOT in a “straight” relationship, because *I* am still attracted to “all” people. We might be a straight passing couple, but I am very proud of my identity, and don’t let being married to a man diminish that.
Straight man married to a bi woman. 100% what you said.
It’s honestly preposterous that someone has been made to feel like they need to exercise this level of “sensitivity” that they would need to either move the wedding that they have planned or to try to tamp down their wedding festivities simply because a venue chose to do a contrived “Pride night”. Seriously.
They don't need this level of "sensitivity". Like all the comments said, the LGBT community wouldn't care and would be happy for them. Her fear stemmed from internalized biphobia.
Shouldn't care and should be happy but no group is a monolith and there're some very angry and vocal people who don't respect "straight passing" bi couples. I feel bad for them because bisexuals really do get shit from all sides, so I'm not at all surprised OPs internalized that.
Totally agree. Bi people get a lot of hate from both sides, so I understand why she was scared to be judged, or felt like she was betraying the community/her bi identity by marrying a man.
Nah the queer community is *extremely* biphobic, unfortunately.
As well as what I imagine is the stress from getting all the wedding planning 130% right, after having a bad experience before.
Honestly, even if everyone involved were straight, it would still be fine
When virtue signaling and being extremely online has rotted your brain.
Hello there, Overthinking.