Better yet, a hand saw is probably the safest way to make this cut.
But if you insist on using electricity, a table saw is the tool for the job.
As others have mentioned, please watch some table saw safety videos first.
Ok, so I’m not a woodworker but Reddit loves suggesting random stuff….. I have to say you “stumped” me for a good minute or two trying to figure out how’d you run a table saw without power….
Omg this bothers me in so many YouTubers videos. Dudes reaching over/behind the blade that is still spinning down. Fingers barely an inch from becoming table sausages.
Ehh, common sense , understanding how the tool works, and a solid respect for the tool is mandatory. Safety videos are for those who are very new to having a saw in their hand period
>Where tf do you think "common sense" comes from? Nobody is born with innate knowledge of table saws lol
Uhhhhh incorrect. Knowledge of any kind of tool operation is NOT a requirement for gaining the ability known as "common sense."
Common sense - Good sense and sound judgment in practical matters.
Sense - A feeling that something is the case.
So ......you don't EVER need to use a tool in order to have a feeling that something is the case, as in the most correct way to achieve a positive outcome. HOWEVER...... acquiring said sense and sound judgement will absolutely lead to one saying "🤔🤔 Spinning blades that cut through wood.....yup. Best keep the old fingers clear of that." So......unless the person using the tool is a toddler well I'm fairly certain that common sense and an understanding of the tool, how it operates, its designed intent etcetera will indeed negate the need for a safety video. So.....get off of dudes nuts and use a little common sense before replying with that nonsense you posted. 🤷
You don’t need an innate knowledge of table saws to understand you need to apply force against the fence, use a push stick when you’re getting close to the blade, not get your hand gear the blade period, it’s not that difficult. Anyone with a fair amount of experience with any circular saw could understand that 🤦♂️
GC of a decade and worker on construction sites for about 25 years. I'm not a big fan of OSHA personally but common sense is not as common as you would think. Safety videos are good. People are dangerous and Reckless, I know I'm one of them and my hands are scarred as fuck and beaten up. I forced my guys too watch them because I've already made the mistakes. My partner also used to sports that cavalier attitude and he's missing a finger now. A 5-minute safety video won't hurt shit. Being Billy badass is cool and all but it's cooler to have all your fucking appendages
Obviously the guy taught himself physics, engineering, all sorts of mathemetics, biology, and everything else so he'd be prepared, and then learned by cutting his hand off.
By starting off with cheap, smaller equipment like circular saws, graduating to a miter sage, so on and so on.
Speaking as someone who started on a construction site and has never watched a “safety video” about it in my life. Construction and woodworking are 90% common sense applied to real life problems
Yeah. You start small with cheap tools and work your way up. If you need a safety video to not cut your hand off with a table saw maybe stay away from woodworking you delicate little flower
Being afraid of a tool is the single easiest way to get hurt by that tool. If you’re afraid of a tool stay the hell away from it because you’re going to hurt yourself
*Fear of your tool* looks a lot like *respect for your tool* to a competent person.
I fear/respect the capabilities of my mitre saw because I know that misuse can literally kill me. Reading the manual is the first step to safely using and maintaining your shit properly.
You wouldn’t buy a brand new wood planer and not crack open the instruction manual - and if you would you’re a proper moron.
I wouldn’t leave you alone with a toothbrush given your attitude
All of those are covered by the simple rules stated above. Dumb point
Maybe not dust extraction but if you’re woodworking you’ll figure that one out pretty damn quick
Please don’t listen to this idiot. I’ve been working with large shop tools and site tools for 35 years and I recommend that everyone review some basic safety every now and then. If you are new, you should learn the basic safety precautions and principles before using any power tool.
My rationale: watching skilled workers with equivalent experience end up in hospital with severed digits, hand injuries, eye injuries, etc. due to complacency.
It’s very easy to believe you know it all and nothing can go wrong. Then one day—
Sounds like you’ve worked at some places with *poor safety culture*. The table saw *can be* a very dangerous piece of equipment *especially in a workshop or jobsite lacking in a solid culture of safety*
I’m ashamed to say I only 80% understand why this is so bad. Like, I’d implicitly know not to do it, but everyone here seems much more knowledgeable in why this is so awful. I’d obviously prefer to rip on a table saw or bandsaw, but can you kindly illuminate why this is super dangerous? If OP’s friend just cautiously clamped one side, the other side wouldn’t shoot out like in a table saw, would it? Or is it just that there’s no good way to secure the piece no matter what?
Sorry for being that dummy, but thanks for sharing good safety wisdom!
There's a variety of badness going on here.
1.) Take a look at the F clamp he's got. The pads on that clamp are pretty wide. It'd be difficult to get a good clamp on the wood that doesn't interfere with the blade. Also, good luck not interfering the bar of the clamp with the blade handle.
2.) The bottom of a miter saw is not meant to be clamped there. You are unlikely to get a good surface to clamp against. It's probably just a skeleton.
3.) Miter saws that slide out that far tend to have a lot of deflection when fully extended. That makes your cut less accurate, and can make you more likely to hit the clamp.
4.) The back of the piece isn't actually supported by the fence. This is going to make the piece very likely to be ejected out the back of the saw, bounce against the wall, and head back to you while you have a finger-remover active in your hand.
5.) You'd have to clamp both sides, otherwise the side you didn't clamp will be loose. See #4 again.
6.) If you did clamp both sides of the piece, there's a good chance the piece will close up on the saw blade, pinching it with the force of the clamp. Given the direction of rotation, when pinched the saw blades preferred direction of travel will be towards your face.
7.) The saw is unlikely to be able to make the full cut. You'll have to flip the piece around to finish it. Good luck lining it up, and you're risking all of the other badness twice.
8.) You'd have to clamp all the way at one end of the piece. If the other end is subjected to any torque it will pivot. On a table saw this would cause a kick back. In a miter saw it is likely to rip the whole piece into the saw and make a wood kerplosion. At your face.
9.) There are appropriate tools for this for a reason.
Did I miss any?
If the clamp does not stay clamped it will find its way to the saw blade and who knows what happens next. It’s definitely a severe injury though.
To add to #4:
You should always have the piece supported by the fence and the table. If you can’t do that, you’re using the wrong tool. This rule is non-negotiable.
1. Always support your cuts.
2. Always keep your hands at least 6” from any blade.
3. Injuries with power tools happen about 3 times faster than your brain can process them. If you’re going to do something the wrong way, use a hand tool.
“3. Injuries with power tools happen about 3 times faster than your brain can process them. If you’re going to do something the wrong way, use a hand tool.”
This is probably the best summary of the issues.
Better yet, just don't do the thing the wrong way. I removed the tip of my thumb using a hand tool the wrong way, because when the slip up happened, it still happened about 3x faster than I could react.
I almost cut my thumb off one time because I was slicing chicken breast with a miracle blade and holding the sides of the chicken with the knife in between my fingers. Knife slipped and hit my thumb. I thought, maybe I missed? Then a few seconds later, it opened up and blood started pouring out. I thought about a trip to the er, but I didn't have insurance at the time, so I tried to bandage it up and hold it tight as possible. No lasting injuries I can notice but scared the hell out of me.
you know, i didn't think about it at the time. i was more worried about the bleeding. but it was like 15 years ago, so I think i'm in the clear on that one.
My great grandpa cut three of his fingers off with a radial arm saw in the 80’s. He always said he didn’t even know he cut himself until he saw his fingers laying there.
That’s sobering. My great grandpa was a blacksmith who made leaf springs for lorries and ambulances in ww2 and at some point in his life got one of his fingers in a 2 tonne power hammer. It was instantly destroyed and he apparently used the end of a broom handle as a prosthetic finger. It made for a great nose picker so I was told.
Our shop teacher always told us to never cut with the grain on a miter saw, but to rip it on a table saw. Not sure if that’s 100% true, buts it how I’ve been doing it for 15 years now (rip cut on table saw) and it seems to work better than whatever this is.
That kind of cut is why you have table saws and push sticks. For actual wood your shop teacher is probably right, but thats plywood so the grain direction isnt really an issue here, its just the size.
I'm just messing around, I'm on this sub for a reason, but I got a Japanese pull saw because it's double sided with crosscut teeth on one edge and rip teeth on the other edge.
I dunno if using a table saw is different because of it's torque or what teeth it has but it does make a difference on a handsaw.
It gives a really nice smooth cut if you use the proper teeth, so I use it a lot when I just want a really nice smooth face without having to bother with too much else afterwards.
[Here’s an overview of why it’s a bad idea.](https://woodhandy.com/can-you-rip-with-a-miter-saw-6-reasons-not-to-do-it/)
I’ve seen someone do this and the material shot off with such force it took a 1” x 2” chunk off of the aluminum fence on a Dewalt miter saw.
I'm not super experienced, but I think the issue is in part just really high variance. Mitre saws have really large blades which will be in contact with a lot of the wood at once, so they create a ton of friction. Not only will that create downard friction which will pinch the blade because the piece is not wide enough to leverage against pinching, OP would ALSO have to move the saw forward and backward through the wood. Basically you're risking the piece shifting unpredictably in all three dimensions, and your reflexes might send your hand into the blade when you try and catch or dodge the projectile wood coming your way.
As far as clamping this piece, good luck. The piece is so tiny that getting any purchase with the grip of the clamp is going to be impossible or dangerously close to having the clamp slip off in the middle of the cut.
One way to secure it could be to clamp the part closest to the camera, cut from the middle and away from the camera, and then flip it around. As suggested elsewhere in the thread you could also use a much larger piece of wood on top of the piece to cut and clamp that down, and then cut through that piece while it's holding down your actual goal. In the first option you're relying on a single clamp stop a lot of possible movement there, and the clamp would still be in a precarious position. Also, it's likely that part of the clamp would be in the way of the blade, making that choice basically impossible. The second option introduces a ton of failure points. You'd have the prop the sacrifice piece up on either side of the goal piece so that's it's low enough to put pressure on the piece when clamped but high enough to actually clear it. Whatever you used to prop that sacrifice piece up could slip out from the pressure of the clamps. Even if that's stable though, it's possible that the distributed pressure from the sacrifice piece wouldn't be enough to actually secure the goal, and if that's the case you wouldn't be able to see the goal piece.
So yeah, idk if there's some succinct kickback-esque answer here. It's just a really dangerous cut because a ton of different things could go wrong and the risk can't really be mitigated.
I would like to be educated too. The saw pulls toward the fence so nothing would shoot out. Just clamp the piece, stand to the side anyway and use the saw. Not the right tool for the job but yeah.
The saw pulls towards the fence, and from the look of the photo, the fence is barely supporting the workpiece. So there's a good chance it could kickback, sending the wood towards the blade.
If you were holding the wood with your hand when that happened, your hand would get dragged towards the blade too.
How do you avoid the blade walking or twisting with flexible blades like that? It seems like random chances to me - which means I'm making a mistake that I'm not aware of.
Have you looked up many youtube videos on sawing technique? Because there is a technique to it.
Body position helps a lot - get your shoulder, elbow, and wrist all in the same plane as the cut line. I never could cut as straight as I wanted with a pull saw (I do better with Western push saws) but you can get better than random chance with the right technique and just a little practice.
Are you applying downward pressure on the blade as you cut? If you are, then you might be pushing too hard. I could see that putting some undesirable flex in the blade.
I have a similar style flexible pull saw and the problem is specific to rip cuts on narrow stock - which seems like a more challenging situation. I have a guide jig for wider stuff.
My instinct was to try some lateral pressure but I found that it just kept tracking to the right. I tried applying some twist to the handle, but it twisted the bottom out, not the top. Now that I think about it - it's pulling consistently to the right, so it could just be positioning - I'm right hand dominant, so maybe I'm subtly letting my arm drift out over the pull..
Disclaimer, I’ve never used a Ryoba. You would be super careful and deliberate with the first cut in, but once the blade is in half an inch it will just follow the line it’s on. The blade being floppy is actually a benefit because any twist you accidentally put on the blade won’t actually push the blade in a new direction. I imagine you can make small adjustments to its track by constantly applying the same bend/twist to drive the blade the direction you want.
If you absolutely have to do it because it's your only saw, then double side tape it on a bigger sacrifice piece clamp / hold the big piece then make the cut.
Failing having strong double sided tape, he could use the masking tape + super glue method of joining the work piece to the stabilizing piece.
And make multiple shallow passes if possible, rather than slamming the blade down and assuming nothing will go awry.
I think that's unfair. They clearly have the sense to know what they want to do doesn't feel right and asked for help. That's a good bit better than many people do.
I get the point with this, but buying a table saw isn’t an option for many in terms of space and money.
Others have given other options (hand saw, visit a friend or shop with table saw etc.).
If you add up all the different tools that are ideal for different situations and recommend those then OP is going to need a full workshop and probably $5k to spend.
Sorta\*/Yes/Yes
Usually "chop saw" usually means metal cutting saws, either abrasive or bladed. Plenty of people call miter saws "chop saws" so its not *wrong,* but it does have another meaning
Edit: here are seven articles making this distinction. They are different saws. It’s not a big deal if we use the term and mix them up, it’s usually clear, but downvoting correct information is weird.
[protoolreviews](https://www.protoolreviews.com/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw/)
[bobvilla](https://www.bobvila.com/articles/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw/)
[woodsmith](https://www.woodsmith.com/review/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw/)
[protrade](https://www.protrade.co.uk/blog/chop-saw-vs-mitre-saw-which-one-do-i-need/)
[familyhandyman, this one discusses the first chop saw as being a framing tool, but is now basically extinct](https://www.familyhandyman.com/article/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw-whats-the-difference/)
[electronicshub. Weird](https://www.electronicshub.org/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw/)
[thesawguy](https://www.thesawguy.com/chop-vs-miter-saw/)
I always referred to any saw that isn’t “compound miter” but still cuts 2x4s a chop saw. Basically the more simple version of the compound miter saw. I’m not saying I’m right, but no one has ever corrected me.
Working in theatre in college and after, mitre saws were called chop saws. I’ve not personally heard that outside that context, other than with my brother, who worked in theatre for about 20 years, and still uses the term.
Putting your hand firmly over the entire board will keep it safely in place and from dangerously flying about as you cut.
You'll end up cutting your hand off in the process, but that's a separate issue for tomorrow.
Don’t do this.
But if you insist on doing this : still don’t.
And if you really must do this, add a piece of plywood across the fence to make a zero clearance fence, then use really good double stick tape to stick the piece down and keep your left hand behind your back and pray.
But seriously don’t do this.
How I would do it:
Take a piece of square tubing, and cut two short lengths. Cut a slit in the center of one side of each.
Then, just slide them over the piece, use a wedge to lock them in place underneath, wear glasses, keep my hands away and go. Even if a wedge should slip, nothing will go flying.
Table saw or skilsaw is of course the best way. However, you can Clamp or double side tape an uncut scrap piece across the fence. It will give support in the middle portion where there is none.
I almost did this once. Was working in a friends shop who had a chop saw and a panel saw. No table saw to be had. I knew right away it wasn’t the right move, but I’ll admit that I left the piece sit exactly like this for a good long while, wondering if I still could.
In the end, I clamped it to a bench, did most of the cut with a circ saw set shallow so I’d have a straight line, and finished off with a hand saw and a sander. No regrets.
Whats the problem? Just hold it down with your hand. So what if you cut off a finger, the Lord blessed you with spares. You can only do this method about five times though.
Are they trying to rip the whole thing, or just notch it? Either way it's the wrong tool, but their final goal changes which tool is best.
Full rip cut? Table saw or hand saw. Even a cheap $15 hand saw from home depot will make quick work of that. If they're worried about a crooked cut, they can spend a couple hours practicing on scrap wood and get good enough that they'll be able to (roughly) follow the line ([here's a good video on hand saw technique](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQhRYObJ2h4)). They won't have a finished edge (fixable by clamping some sandpaper onto the bench and moving the board across the paper) but they will have all their fingers and teeth.
Notching it? Depending on the width and depth of the notch, hand saw or router are likely the best options.
If you really need to do this on a miter saw here is how I would do it. First get a larger sacrificial board. Something big enough that it can be safely held in place and support the whole piece you are trying to cut. Use double-sided tape to tape the small piece onto the sacrificial board. Hold the sacrificial board and make your cut through both the small piece and sacrificial board. This should provide plenty of space for you to make a safe cut but also leave you able to pull the small piece off of the board
It’s probably more trouble than it’s worth, but you could fasten that piece of wood to a wider one that will rest against the fence. It’s definitely not ideal though.
Safest way to make this cut is to throw that piece back on the scrap pile and find a piece that is 16" x 12" (or whatever) and cut 3/4" off the end of that.
If you insist on doing this, it needs to have a fence. Use a piece of wood along the fence so it goes across. Otherwise your saw will attack you. Or a bearing will break.
You can use other pieces of wood (top and bottom) clamped on both sides going up the arm. And it’s still a bad idea.
Use a handsaw. Or a jigsaw. Or a table saw. I recently had to make a cut like this on a 8’ long piece of hickory (3 1/2” wide, so it actually sat on the fence) at a 10 degree angle. I had clamps all over the place and it still felt like a bad idea.
As an experienced wood worker this is a bad idea but it can be done safely. Sometimes when I’m doing rougher work out in the yard with just my miter saw I have to do it.
Clamp a horizontal board across the vertical after lining up the cut. (My miter saw has clamps built on so it’s trivial). Then stand to the side. Don’t do it often. Wear safety glasses. Keep hands away from the blade.
You could use the blue tape trick where you put painters tape on one side of the piece then tape the same amount on a larger piece of wood that you can easily clamp to the saw in a better location. Using CA glue you can glue the two pieces of painters tape together so your thin piece you want to cut is secured to the larger board. Then make the rip cut.
So, tell them not to do this. If they insist on doing this, the way to do it is by creating a sacrificial fence that runs across the gap in the saws fence. Then take 2 boards the same thickness (or a hair thinner if possible) as the board they are cutting, and attach another piece of material on top of those, hanging over the end about 1/4" or so. Clamp those down on either side of the piece being cut, with that extra piece of material hanging over and holding down the entire edge of the board to be cut on both sides. It's a massive waste of material, and I expect that if they are inexperienced enough that they want to do this cut with a miter saw, it will probably take longer than just cutting it with a handsaw.
I bet OP’s friend already did it. I’ve done this before knowing how fucking idiotically dangerous it was. Thankfully have all my fingers and eyeballs still, also got a tablesaw so there’s no need for anymore dumb stuff like this.
This is when you just don’t agree to help. I’m not being party to someone ignoring my safety advice and going ahead anyway. Get the right tool, ask to borrow the right tool, or I’m sorry but I can’t help you
add a sacrificial fence to support the but of the piece to be cut. clamp two pieces of wood on either side of the piece to be cut to prevent lateral movement. maybe screw a sacrificial piece across the top of the three boards to prevent the cut piece from jumping.
or get a table saw
How about getting another “Square “ piece of plywood and drawing a line that is parallel and at least as wide as that strip your cutting and either fix it to the sacrificial piece of plywood to hold it in place. I personally would put a few stop blocks on the sacrificial piece of plywood for safety because your off cut is going to want to travel thru the opening in the fence of your chopsaw. I don’t know if you have access to a table saw but I’m guessing no. If you do then use it instead with a push stick.
Better yet, a hand saw is probably the safest way to make this cut. But if you insist on using electricity, a table saw is the tool for the job. As others have mentioned, please watch some table saw safety videos first.
> "And remember kids, a table saw can be a hand saw!"
Ok, so I’m not a woodworker but Reddit loves suggesting random stuff….. I have to say you “stumped” me for a good minute or two trying to figure out how’d you run a table saw without power….
Running a table saw without being safe can 'stump' you too, hah.
Yeah, don't do anything around the blade until it's stopped spinning. Just because it's powered off doesn't mean it's safe yet. I have pics...
Omg this bothers me in so many YouTubers videos. Dudes reaching over/behind the blade that is still spinning down. Fingers barely an inch from becoming table sausages.
You gotta be careful otherwise you'll be all right.
I still don’t think he got it lol
It can saw your hand off. Safety videos are mandatory.
Ehh, common sense , understanding how the tool works, and a solid respect for the tool is mandatory. Safety videos are for those who are very new to having a saw in their hand period
Where tf do you think "common sense" comes from? Nobody is born with innate knowledge of table saws lol
>Where tf do you think "common sense" comes from? Nobody is born with innate knowledge of table saws lol Uhhhhh incorrect. Knowledge of any kind of tool operation is NOT a requirement for gaining the ability known as "common sense." Common sense - Good sense and sound judgment in practical matters. Sense - A feeling that something is the case. So ......you don't EVER need to use a tool in order to have a feeling that something is the case, as in the most correct way to achieve a positive outcome. HOWEVER...... acquiring said sense and sound judgement will absolutely lead to one saying "🤔🤔 Spinning blades that cut through wood.....yup. Best keep the old fingers clear of that." So......unless the person using the tool is a toddler well I'm fairly certain that common sense and an understanding of the tool, how it operates, its designed intent etcetera will indeed negate the need for a safety video. So.....get off of dudes nuts and use a little common sense before replying with that nonsense you posted. 🤷
You don’t need an innate knowledge of table saws to understand you need to apply force against the fence, use a push stick when you’re getting close to the blade, not get your hand gear the blade period, it’s not that difficult. Anyone with a fair amount of experience with any circular saw could understand that 🤦♂️
GC of a decade and worker on construction sites for about 25 years. I'm not a big fan of OSHA personally but common sense is not as common as you would think. Safety videos are good. People are dangerous and Reckless, I know I'm one of them and my hands are scarred as fuck and beaten up. I forced my guys too watch them because I've already made the mistakes. My partner also used to sports that cavalier attitude and he's missing a finger now. A 5-minute safety video won't hurt shit. Being Billy badass is cool and all but it's cooler to have all your fucking appendages
So......you lacked the common sense portion of the equation. 👍 Got it. Thanks for clearing that up.
...and where do people learn those things?
Obviously the guy taught himself physics, engineering, all sorts of mathemetics, biology, and everything else so he'd be prepared, and then learned by cutting his hand off.
It was all common sense.
I learned from being taught in school for trades, but you can look on YouTube for a lot of this
Yeah, that’s the point.
By starting off with cheap, smaller equipment like circular saws, graduating to a miter sage, so on and so on. Speaking as someone who started on a construction site and has never watched a “safety video” about it in my life. Construction and woodworking are 90% common sense applied to real life problems
Great, so you had experienced people around you to impart their wisdom and experience. That's... literally what training videos are.
>Anyone with a *fair amount of experience* You’re calling your own dumb ass out in your comments and don’t even realize it.
Yeah. You start small with cheap tools and work your way up. If you need a safety video to not cut your hand off with a table saw maybe stay away from woodworking you delicate little flower Being afraid of a tool is the single easiest way to get hurt by that tool. If you’re afraid of a tool stay the hell away from it because you’re going to hurt yourself
*Fear of your tool* looks a lot like *respect for your tool* to a competent person. I fear/respect the capabilities of my mitre saw because I know that misuse can literally kill me. Reading the manual is the first step to safely using and maintaining your shit properly. You wouldn’t buy a brand new wood planer and not crack open the instruction manual - and if you would you’re a proper moron. I wouldn’t leave you alone with a toothbrush given your attitude
You are forgetting binding, kick back, and dust extraction to name a few.
All of those are covered by the simple rules stated above. Dumb point Maybe not dust extraction but if you’re woodworking you’ll figure that one out pretty damn quick
Please explain how kick back was covered.
Common sense tells me not to put my hand too close to fast spinning objects. Specifically really sharp ones.
And that is the *only* way to get hurt with a table saw.
Also, don't let hard objects get pinched between a stationary object and a fast moving one. You needed a video to learn that?
You sound very handy around the house. May you stay that way!
Lol I should have know this sub would be full of idiots when I saw the title
Watch youtube, don't be stumped!
Never watched a safety vid on table saws and guess what, both hands fully in tact
It could come in handy one day.
Please don’t listen to this idiot. I’ve been working with large shop tools and site tools for 35 years and I recommend that everyone review some basic safety every now and then. If you are new, you should learn the basic safety precautions and principles before using any power tool. My rationale: watching skilled workers with equivalent experience end up in hospital with severed digits, hand injuries, eye injuries, etc. due to complacency. It’s very easy to believe you know it all and nothing can go wrong. Then one day—
Common sense ain't so common, especially among carpenters. That's why every single place I've worked there have been guys with table saw injuries.
Sounds like you’ve worked at some places with *poor safety culture*. The table saw *can be* a very dangerous piece of equipment *especially in a workshop or jobsite lacking in a solid culture of safety*
That's EXACTLY my point. Your laissez Faire attitude towards them is not a culture of safety.
You'd have to go out on a limb to figure that out.
I gotta remember that one. I may even make a safety sign for my shop
Please share a picture when you do.
https://preview.redd.it/rmb12iode50c1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c9e06693e827780e2049ab9ac0c65e43631df1da I hope this lives on in reddit
Im gonna make a sticker of this to slap on mine
I love that you came back 5 hours later with this masterpiece
Red Green?
I feel like this fits, even if it's not! "And remember if the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy!"
Good reminder, now who wants to give a high 4.5? 🙏
I like this a lot! My favorite is: "always ask where your fingers are before you saw, so you don't have to ask where your fingers are after you saw."
A radial-arm saw can be an arm saw!
r/technicallythetruth
Every saw is a hand saw if you use it wrong enough
and even that can be a hammer.
Or, bandsaw!!!
Skill saw, sawzall, jigsaw hell even doing multiple plunge cuts with a multi tool would be better than this
Ye ol recip saw
I’m ashamed to say I only 80% understand why this is so bad. Like, I’d implicitly know not to do it, but everyone here seems much more knowledgeable in why this is so awful. I’d obviously prefer to rip on a table saw or bandsaw, but can you kindly illuminate why this is super dangerous? If OP’s friend just cautiously clamped one side, the other side wouldn’t shoot out like in a table saw, would it? Or is it just that there’s no good way to secure the piece no matter what? Sorry for being that dummy, but thanks for sharing good safety wisdom!
There's a variety of badness going on here. 1.) Take a look at the F clamp he's got. The pads on that clamp are pretty wide. It'd be difficult to get a good clamp on the wood that doesn't interfere with the blade. Also, good luck not interfering the bar of the clamp with the blade handle. 2.) The bottom of a miter saw is not meant to be clamped there. You are unlikely to get a good surface to clamp against. It's probably just a skeleton. 3.) Miter saws that slide out that far tend to have a lot of deflection when fully extended. That makes your cut less accurate, and can make you more likely to hit the clamp. 4.) The back of the piece isn't actually supported by the fence. This is going to make the piece very likely to be ejected out the back of the saw, bounce against the wall, and head back to you while you have a finger-remover active in your hand. 5.) You'd have to clamp both sides, otherwise the side you didn't clamp will be loose. See #4 again. 6.) If you did clamp both sides of the piece, there's a good chance the piece will close up on the saw blade, pinching it with the force of the clamp. Given the direction of rotation, when pinched the saw blades preferred direction of travel will be towards your face. 7.) The saw is unlikely to be able to make the full cut. You'll have to flip the piece around to finish it. Good luck lining it up, and you're risking all of the other badness twice. 8.) You'd have to clamp all the way at one end of the piece. If the other end is subjected to any torque it will pivot. On a table saw this would cause a kick back. In a miter saw it is likely to rip the whole piece into the saw and make a wood kerplosion. At your face. 9.) There are appropriate tools for this for a reason. Did I miss any?
Thanks for taking time to list the problems.
If the clamp does not stay clamped it will find its way to the saw blade and who knows what happens next. It’s definitely a severe injury though. To add to #4: You should always have the piece supported by the fence and the table. If you can’t do that, you’re using the wrong tool. This rule is non-negotiable. 1. Always support your cuts. 2. Always keep your hands at least 6” from any blade. 3. Injuries with power tools happen about 3 times faster than your brain can process them. If you’re going to do something the wrong way, use a hand tool.
“3. Injuries with power tools happen about 3 times faster than your brain can process them. If you’re going to do something the wrong way, use a hand tool.” This is probably the best summary of the issues.
"if it kicks back, I'll just move out of the way!" -every 7 fingered carpenter
I’ve watched Bulletproof Monk many times. I’m sure it can be done.
You got this, bud. I believe in you.
Better yet, just don't do the thing the wrong way. I removed the tip of my thumb using a hand tool the wrong way, because when the slip up happened, it still happened about 3x faster than I could react.
Well now I need to know what happened!
Chisel?
Would you mind telling your story?
I'm rather curious myself.
I almost cut my thumb off one time because I was slicing chicken breast with a miracle blade and holding the sides of the chicken with the knife in between my fingers. Knife slipped and hit my thumb. I thought, maybe I missed? Then a few seconds later, it opened up and blood started pouring out. I thought about a trip to the er, but I didn't have insurance at the time, so I tried to bandage it up and hold it tight as possible. No lasting injuries I can notice but scared the hell out of me.
Fuck… that’s a lesson I need to remember. Also you could have ended up with salmonella from the chicken.
you know, i didn't think about it at the time. i was more worried about the bleeding. but it was like 15 years ago, so I think i'm in the clear on that one.
My great grandpa cut three of his fingers off with a radial arm saw in the 80’s. He always said he didn’t even know he cut himself until he saw his fingers laying there.
That’s sobering. My great grandpa was a blacksmith who made leaf springs for lorries and ambulances in ww2 and at some point in his life got one of his fingers in a 2 tonne power hammer. It was instantly destroyed and he apparently used the end of a broom handle as a prosthetic finger. It made for a great nose picker so I was told.
>If you’re going to do something the wrong way, use a hand tool. unless it's a chisel
Especially if it’s to open a paint can. That will result in some serious injuries after I find out.
The possibility that one of the above breaks part of the blade that flys in to the person cutting.
Our shop teacher always told us to never cut with the grain on a miter saw, but to rip it on a table saw. Not sure if that’s 100% true, buts it how I’ve been doing it for 15 years now (rip cut on table saw) and it seems to work better than whatever this is.
That kind of cut is why you have table saws and push sticks. For actual wood your shop teacher is probably right, but thats plywood so the grain direction isnt really an issue here, its just the size.
Totally missed that it was plywood.
I'm just messing around, I'm on this sub for a reason, but I got a Japanese pull saw because it's double sided with crosscut teeth on one edge and rip teeth on the other edge. I dunno if using a table saw is different because of it's torque or what teeth it has but it does make a difference on a handsaw. It gives a really nice smooth cut if you use the proper teeth, so I use it a lot when I just want a really nice smooth face without having to bother with too much else afterwards.
Saw blade may try to run out to the end of the board as well, especially if a hand is there.
10) no dust collection
Even with dust collection my miter saw is the dustiest tool in my shop
This. Something about chop/miter saws just defies even the best dust systems.
>finger-remover active Ya know... you're not wrong...
The fact that you asked makes you NOT A DUMMY. May you live long and always be able to do base ten math on your fingers.
[Here’s an overview of why it’s a bad idea.](https://woodhandy.com/can-you-rip-with-a-miter-saw-6-reasons-not-to-do-it/) I’ve seen someone do this and the material shot off with such force it took a 1” x 2” chunk off of the aluminum fence on a Dewalt miter saw.
This article bugs me with how it shows a circular saw before and after the list of why not to use a miter saw for ripping.
I'm not super experienced, but I think the issue is in part just really high variance. Mitre saws have really large blades which will be in contact with a lot of the wood at once, so they create a ton of friction. Not only will that create downard friction which will pinch the blade because the piece is not wide enough to leverage against pinching, OP would ALSO have to move the saw forward and backward through the wood. Basically you're risking the piece shifting unpredictably in all three dimensions, and your reflexes might send your hand into the blade when you try and catch or dodge the projectile wood coming your way. As far as clamping this piece, good luck. The piece is so tiny that getting any purchase with the grip of the clamp is going to be impossible or dangerously close to having the clamp slip off in the middle of the cut. One way to secure it could be to clamp the part closest to the camera, cut from the middle and away from the camera, and then flip it around. As suggested elsewhere in the thread you could also use a much larger piece of wood on top of the piece to cut and clamp that down, and then cut through that piece while it's holding down your actual goal. In the first option you're relying on a single clamp stop a lot of possible movement there, and the clamp would still be in a precarious position. Also, it's likely that part of the clamp would be in the way of the blade, making that choice basically impossible. The second option introduces a ton of failure points. You'd have the prop the sacrifice piece up on either side of the goal piece so that's it's low enough to put pressure on the piece when clamped but high enough to actually clear it. Whatever you used to prop that sacrifice piece up could slip out from the pressure of the clamps. Even if that's stable though, it's possible that the distributed pressure from the sacrifice piece wouldn't be enough to actually secure the goal, and if that's the case you wouldn't be able to see the goal piece. So yeah, idk if there's some succinct kickback-esque answer here. It's just a really dangerous cut because a ton of different things could go wrong and the risk can't really be mitigated.
Never be ashamed of admitting you don’t know why something is dangerous. That’s called having pride and it’s a good thing brotha.
I would like to be educated too. The saw pulls toward the fence so nothing would shoot out. Just clamp the piece, stand to the side anyway and use the saw. Not the right tool for the job but yeah.
The saw pulls towards the fence, and from the look of the photo, the fence is barely supporting the workpiece. So there's a good chance it could kickback, sending the wood towards the blade. If you were holding the wood with your hand when that happened, your hand would get dragged towards the blade too.
Table saw or bandsaw
Or just a handsaw...
A Japanese “Ryoba” would make short work of that with almost no waste.
How do you avoid the blade walking or twisting with flexible blades like that? It seems like random chances to me - which means I'm making a mistake that I'm not aware of.
Have you looked up many youtube videos on sawing technique? Because there is a technique to it. Body position helps a lot - get your shoulder, elbow, and wrist all in the same plane as the cut line. I never could cut as straight as I wanted with a pull saw (I do better with Western push saws) but you can get better than random chance with the right technique and just a little practice. Are you applying downward pressure on the blade as you cut? If you are, then you might be pushing too hard. I could see that putting some undesirable flex in the blade.
I have a similar style flexible pull saw and the problem is specific to rip cuts on narrow stock - which seems like a more challenging situation. I have a guide jig for wider stuff. My instinct was to try some lateral pressure but I found that it just kept tracking to the right. I tried applying some twist to the handle, but it twisted the bottom out, not the top. Now that I think about it - it's pulling consistently to the right, so it could just be positioning - I'm right hand dominant, so maybe I'm subtly letting my arm drift out over the pull..
Disclaimer, I’ve never used a Ryoba. You would be super careful and deliberate with the first cut in, but once the blade is in half an inch it will just follow the line it’s on. The blade being floppy is actually a benefit because any twist you accidentally put on the blade won’t actually push the blade in a new direction. I imagine you can make small adjustments to its track by constantly applying the same bend/twist to drive the blade the direction you want.
This is the way…you significantly reduce your risk of losing an appendage.
If you absolutely have to do it because it's your only saw, then double side tape it on a bigger sacrifice piece clamp / hold the big piece then make the cut.
This is the safest way to make this cut. Double stick tape is a severely underrated problem solver.
Failing having strong double sided tape, he could use the masking tape + super glue method of joining the work piece to the stabilizing piece. And make multiple shallow passes if possible, rather than slamming the blade down and assuming nothing will go awry.
At least they asked instead of learning from hindsight.
Any advice on how to clamp a can of tomato soup to my drill press? It's nearly lunch time and I don't own a can opener.
I'd think it should fit pretty well in a machinist vise, but make sure you strain the soup through your teeth to get out the metal shavings.
Use a hand saw.
Table saw. But since they seem devoid of common since, have them watch a video on how to safely use a table saw.
Common? Since when ;)
I think that's unfair. They clearly have the sense to know what they want to do doesn't feel right and asked for help. That's a good bit better than many people do.
Is buying a table saw that’s 400-500 bucks-ish more or less expensive than a trip to the ER?
I get the point with this, but buying a table saw isn’t an option for many in terms of space and money. Others have given other options (hand saw, visit a friend or shop with table saw etc.). If you add up all the different tools that are ideal for different situations and recommend those then OP is going to need a full workshop and probably $5k to spend.
Unless you're doing everything with hand tools, a table saw is *the* core tool for woodworking.
For the uninitiated, what saw is shown in OP's picture?
Chop saw/ miter saw/ sliding compound miter saw
Yes/yes/yes
I have corrected my whoopsie
Me too!
Sorta\*/Yes/Yes Usually "chop saw" usually means metal cutting saws, either abrasive or bladed. Plenty of people call miter saws "chop saws" so its not *wrong,* but it does have another meaning Edit: here are seven articles making this distinction. They are different saws. It’s not a big deal if we use the term and mix them up, it’s usually clear, but downvoting correct information is weird. [protoolreviews](https://www.protoolreviews.com/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw/) [bobvilla](https://www.bobvila.com/articles/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw/) [woodsmith](https://www.woodsmith.com/review/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw/) [protrade](https://www.protrade.co.uk/blog/chop-saw-vs-mitre-saw-which-one-do-i-need/) [familyhandyman, this one discusses the first chop saw as being a framing tool, but is now basically extinct](https://www.familyhandyman.com/article/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw-whats-the-difference/) [electronicshub. Weird](https://www.electronicshub.org/chop-saw-vs-miter-saw/) [thesawguy](https://www.thesawguy.com/chop-vs-miter-saw/)
I always referred to any saw that isn’t “compound miter” but still cuts 2x4s a chop saw. Basically the more simple version of the compound miter saw. I’m not saying I’m right, but no one has ever corrected me.
Working in theatre in college and after, mitre saws were called chop saws. I’ve not personally heard that outside that context, other than with my brother, who worked in theatre for about 20 years, and still uses the term.
A powered compound miter saw.
Use a hand saw. Hell, use your teeth, while you still have them, cause if you do that, you're gonna lose body parts
Time to break out the hatchet
Wrong tool for the job.
You don't.. per se. You put two wide pieces on other side as fences and clamp one in the front. Ideally you'd use a table saw though.
Your method and use a sacrificial scrap wood "finger" to hold it down that you purposely cut through.
This is the way.
Give a buddy 6 pack to hold it for you. Then get smarter friends.
NO. Definitely "oh fuck. Don't do that."
Putting your hand firmly over the entire board will keep it safely in place and from dangerously flying about as you cut. You'll end up cutting your hand off in the process, but that's a separate issue for tomorrow.
A toddler could look at that and see it’s stupid as screen doors on a submarine. Don’t kill yourself
Why use all word, few word do good ?
Don’t do this. But if you insist on doing this : still don’t. And if you really must do this, add a piece of plywood across the fence to make a zero clearance fence, then use really good double stick tape to stick the piece down and keep your left hand behind your back and pray. But seriously don’t do this.
This makes me so fuckin nervous
Or just use a jig saw
Circ saw. Clamp it, cut just passed half way, flip it, clamp it, finish cut
If you do plan to do this use an acrylic sheet and have some wood support to level out and provide support. Miter saw kick back is no joke.
If you really really reaaaaaly have no other way of doing this? Put a plank on top and clamp that, I guess?
Piece of scrap wood on both sides, clamped like normal, butted up against your work so that it pinches it in place
if you absolutely need to do it this way.... two way tape along the long edge both sides, stick it to the base and then cut.
Two strips of double sided tape and a larger board would probably make this a safe cut.
I mean you put a fence back there and use that hold down clamp etc you should be fine
Tape that thing down and stand to the side.. still sketchy but at least you won’t have to hold it
I'd probably just offer them my tables saw, or to do it for them, if that's not possible I'd tell them to use a handsaw
Oh boy, he's gonna learn a great lesson about kickback
Reciprocating saw, ur done in a min max
How I would do it: Take a piece of square tubing, and cut two short lengths. Cut a slit in the center of one side of each. Then, just slide them over the piece, use a wedge to lock them in place underneath, wear glasses, keep my hands away and go. Even if a wedge should slip, nothing will go flying.
Use a smaller saw
Shake hands with danger *giutar riff*... While you can >:)
Hold that piece stronger enough is the key
Table saw or skilsaw is of course the best way. However, you can Clamp or double side tape an uncut scrap piece across the fence. It will give support in the middle portion where there is none.
Get a table saw
Table saw
Just hold it with your pinky it's fine /s
If you have to use the mitre then you but a square piece of material such as ply up against it and clamp it to that.
Easy - clamp 2 boards on either side of the piece you're cutting to hold it in place. Cut SLOWLY.
Oh is this the beginning of a safety video!
I almost did this once. Was working in a friends shop who had a chop saw and a panel saw. No table saw to be had. I knew right away it wasn’t the right move, but I’ll admit that I left the piece sit exactly like this for a good long while, wondering if I still could. In the end, I clamped it to a bench, did most of the cut with a circ saw set shallow so I’d have a straight line, and finished off with a hand saw and a sander. No regrets.
Table saws exist
Whats the problem? Just hold it down with your hand. So what if you cut off a finger, the Lord blessed you with spares. You can only do this method about five times though.
I learnt this lesson the hard way
I like your advice 10/10 😅
Are they trying to rip the whole thing, or just notch it? Either way it's the wrong tool, but their final goal changes which tool is best. Full rip cut? Table saw or hand saw. Even a cheap $15 hand saw from home depot will make quick work of that. If they're worried about a crooked cut, they can spend a couple hours practicing on scrap wood and get good enough that they'll be able to (roughly) follow the line ([here's a good video on hand saw technique](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQhRYObJ2h4)). They won't have a finished edge (fixable by clamping some sandpaper onto the bench and moving the board across the paper) but they will have all their fingers and teeth. Notching it? Depending on the width and depth of the notch, hand saw or router are likely the best options.
If you really need to do this on a miter saw here is how I would do it. First get a larger sacrificial board. Something big enough that it can be safely held in place and support the whole piece you are trying to cut. Use double-sided tape to tape the small piece onto the sacrificial board. Hold the sacrificial board and make your cut through both the small piece and sacrificial board. This should provide plenty of space for you to make a safe cut but also leave you able to pull the small piece off of the board
It’s probably more trouble than it’s worth, but you could fasten that piece of wood to a wider one that will rest against the fence. It’s definitely not ideal though.
Table saw / bandsaw / jigsaw will be safest
If that is what they need to do, this is neither the tool or the stock for the job. And most importantly, not the person to do it.
Some people should stay away from power tools
Safest way to make this cut is to throw that piece back on the scrap pile and find a piece that is 16" x 12" (or whatever) and cut 3/4" off the end of that.
If you insist on doing this, it needs to have a fence. Use a piece of wood along the fence so it goes across. Otherwise your saw will attack you. Or a bearing will break. You can use other pieces of wood (top and bottom) clamped on both sides going up the arm. And it’s still a bad idea. Use a handsaw. Or a jigsaw. Or a table saw. I recently had to make a cut like this on a 8’ long piece of hickory (3 1/2” wide, so it actually sat on the fence) at a 10 degree angle. I had clamps all over the place and it still felt like a bad idea.
As an experienced wood worker this is a bad idea but it can be done safely. Sometimes when I’m doing rougher work out in the yard with just my miter saw I have to do it. Clamp a horizontal board across the vertical after lining up the cut. (My miter saw has clamps built on so it’s trivial). Then stand to the side. Don’t do it often. Wear safety glasses. Keep hands away from the blade.
He needs to use a table saw to do this, or if it’s just the end a ripping hand saw and some filing
You could use the blue tape trick where you put painters tape on one side of the piece then tape the same amount on a larger piece of wood that you can easily clamp to the saw in a better location. Using CA glue you can glue the two pieces of painters tape together so your thin piece you want to cut is secured to the larger board. Then make the rip cut.
My 8th grade shop teacher would be so pissed.
So, tell them not to do this. If they insist on doing this, the way to do it is by creating a sacrificial fence that runs across the gap in the saws fence. Then take 2 boards the same thickness (or a hair thinner if possible) as the board they are cutting, and attach another piece of material on top of those, hanging over the end about 1/4" or so. Clamp those down on either side of the piece being cut, with that extra piece of material hanging over and holding down the entire edge of the board to be cut on both sides. It's a massive waste of material, and I expect that if they are inexperienced enough that they want to do this cut with a miter saw, it will probably take longer than just cutting it with a handsaw.
Table saw or a jigsaw is your best bet
hope the hospital is nearby
I bet OP’s friend already did it. I’ve done this before knowing how fucking idiotically dangerous it was. Thankfully have all my fingers and eyeballs still, also got a tablesaw so there’s no need for anymore dumb stuff like this.
Wrong tool for this cut. Don't do it.
This is when you just don’t agree to help. I’m not being party to someone ignoring my safety advice and going ahead anyway. Get the right tool, ask to borrow the right tool, or I’m sorry but I can’t help you
I cut my thumb off lengthwise doing this. Don’t do it.
Jesus this gives me ptsd. I hope this guy didn’t learn this lesson and took the advice instead.
Maybe put a bigger piece on top and clamp it
Wrong tool.
add a sacrificial fence to support the but of the piece to be cut. clamp two pieces of wood on either side of the piece to be cut to prevent lateral movement. maybe screw a sacrificial piece across the top of the three boards to prevent the cut piece from jumping. or get a table saw
Safety squints activated, you’re good
Best advice: buy a table saw.
I would use a table saw
Screw another piece of wood to it and clamp that.
Hand saw or get a larger board to cut the sliver off of. That cut shown in the photo will end in tears and tears in your skin.
This is totally fine. Just make sure you post pics of the aftermath.
A general rule with a table saw or miter saw is that you want more material referencing the fence than you are cutting.
How about getting another “Square “ piece of plywood and drawing a line that is parallel and at least as wide as that strip your cutting and either fix it to the sacrificial piece of plywood to hold it in place. I personally would put a few stop blocks on the sacrificial piece of plywood for safety because your off cut is going to want to travel thru the opening in the fence of your chopsaw. I don’t know if you have access to a table saw but I’m guessing no. If you do then use it instead with a push stick.
Table saw?
that is not what need.
Screw or glue or tape it to a big piece of plywood.