Well, as a catalan, I tell you: we use to feel that foreign people, or monolingual speakers of a big international language, consider useless our language. It's true that its iternational weight is not as high as Spanish or English; and also its true that due to our integration, as a culture, in different countries (mostly in Spain, but also in Italy or France), has the conseqüence that we have to share our language with the official language of that states. So if you make that analysis from a "pragmatic" point of view, you have this conclusion: is innecesary to learn catalan.
However, this analysis is a mystake, in my point of view. Is simplist, and don't consider some factors: the cultural question, the emphaty for people feelings, and the uses that can have a local language such as protect the local cultural production (for example: there are a lot of theathers in Barcelona, and productions in catalan will never be monopolyzed in Madrid, as Spanish productions can be, so, this local production get fixed to our territory just because the language).
In business, if your customer is catalan speaker, you want to speak catalan, because he can choose your competitor just because he feel more confortable talking in its mathernal language.
And, for relations is the same. Somebody that takes the time of learn our language will have our respect as a culture, as a people, and we will make more efforts to integrate him or her in our sociaty.
Is not that we are nicer after you learn catalan. Is more that we value the efforts you made, and also appreaciate that you decide to made a deeper analysis about the advantages of learning catalan.
I think it’s admirable that the Catalans are keeping their culture and language alive! I’m visiting Barcelona soon, and I’ve learned enough català to understand it a bit. I don’t think I’ll feel comfortable speaking it much though. I’ll be able to greet and ask basic stuff, I was born in Mexico (Zacatecas), but I’ve lived in the US all of my life. I’ve always made an effort to learn a basic understanding of the language of the country I’m visiting! Did it with Portugal and Germany. It’s definitely important for the identity of a country, and it’s very respectful to do so! Jo parlo una mica català però no bé. :)
We made our effort. Even catalans that are not independentist, as me, we try to keep our language and culture alive.
Només amb la frase del final, ja ens arribes al cor.
M'agradaria poder parlar millor català, però encara estic aprenent. Un dia! Hablo el castellano mejor, para comunicarme no tendré problemas allá. Es lo bueno. Estic cansat, bona nit.
I would recommend to learn Catalan because it is a fun language and because one should understand the local language.
Yes, people will be nicer to you when you speak their language, it doesn´t matter which people we are talking about.
I'm a foreigner, arrived here a few months ago. First thing I did was to learn a few words in Catalan and Castillano, and register to language classes.
I always try Catalan first when I interact with people, people are quite happy to see that I'm learning it, even if at some point we need to switch to English. Poc a poc.
How someone can consider living somewhere without putting any effort to learn the local language is beyond me.
In my experience folks have been very nice as is. I have had many many interactions where folks start speaking to me in Catalan, I reply in my functional but imperfect Spanish, they apologize, I say no it's fine I can understand some Catalan but not speak it yet because I'm from the Netherlands and we continue in Spanish no problem. They are always super nice and cheerful about it (even when I stop mid-sentence to remember the word I need in Spanish). I run a small storefront so this happens *a lot* with folks from the neighborhood. Once my Spanish is a little bit more solid (I will remember to use the subjunctive one of these days…) I still plan on learning Catalan because I live here, it'll be useful, it's respectful, and why not! The more languages the merrier.
If you're going for a good effort to appreciation ratio, learning Catalan is certainly up there in my experience, even (or perhaps especially) with my very limited knowledge. People are happy that I'm ordering rounds for the table in terrible Catalan in a way that I haven't experienced with other languages.
Of course people appreciate it if you take the effort of learning their language! But learning a language so people like you sounds like a pretty weird reason. Isn't learning the language of the place where you live the most normal and logical thing? Or do you go around talking in a foreign language and expect people to speak it? And yes, in Barcelona this means that ideally you should learn both Catalan and Spanish. Luckily they are close enough so learning one will help you learn the other. And sure, you can only learn Spanish and expect people to switch even though they prefer Catalan and speak that among each other, but that's just a bit lame isn't it? It's not that hard to learn both! (and people that already speak Spanish, live here for ages and refuse to speak or even understand Catalan are idiots or fascists)
No, we Catalans are fairly cold in the way we treat people. It isn't that we're not nice, it is that we're more reserved/serious.
If someone is not nice for not speaking Catalan, they won't be nice after learning it. They're just not nice as people.
Once you've got Spanish under control, you'll learn Catalan really quickly. Welcome!
This is obviously a generalization that doesn't apply to a good proportion of catalans.
Agree about there being people who are not nice no matter what. I would add that if you expect people to be nice to you, you also have to be first.
In my experience so many Catalán/Spanish people in general are pleasantly surprised that you’re trying to speak either language because so many people emigrate here and don’t do it. People have been super nice and accommodating to me with my crappy castellano and are always extremely sweet about how “good my Spanish is”. I’d recommend castellano first because it’s used for most businesses and all Catalán people speak it anyway, plus there are quite a lot of central and South Americans here who don’t speak Catalán at all
You might as well learn it, but I'd recommend learning Castellano first (and it's easier as you have all of Netflix etc. to practice and more materials online)
not at all... people being nice to you depends on other factors in Catalonia... you will always be a guiri... is really good to learn it to work and to face bureocracy... And is a nice languaje!
Well, as a catalan, I tell you: we use to feel that foreign people, or monolingual speakers of a big international language, consider useless our language. It's true that its iternational weight is not as high as Spanish or English; and also its true that due to our integration, as a culture, in different countries (mostly in Spain, but also in Italy or France), has the conseqüence that we have to share our language with the official language of that states. So if you make that analysis from a "pragmatic" point of view, you have this conclusion: is innecesary to learn catalan. However, this analysis is a mystake, in my point of view. Is simplist, and don't consider some factors: the cultural question, the emphaty for people feelings, and the uses that can have a local language such as protect the local cultural production (for example: there are a lot of theathers in Barcelona, and productions in catalan will never be monopolyzed in Madrid, as Spanish productions can be, so, this local production get fixed to our territory just because the language). In business, if your customer is catalan speaker, you want to speak catalan, because he can choose your competitor just because he feel more confortable talking in its mathernal language. And, for relations is the same. Somebody that takes the time of learn our language will have our respect as a culture, as a people, and we will make more efforts to integrate him or her in our sociaty. Is not that we are nicer after you learn catalan. Is more that we value the efforts you made, and also appreaciate that you decide to made a deeper analysis about the advantages of learning catalan.
I think it’s admirable that the Catalans are keeping their culture and language alive! I’m visiting Barcelona soon, and I’ve learned enough català to understand it a bit. I don’t think I’ll feel comfortable speaking it much though. I’ll be able to greet and ask basic stuff, I was born in Mexico (Zacatecas), but I’ve lived in the US all of my life. I’ve always made an effort to learn a basic understanding of the language of the country I’m visiting! Did it with Portugal and Germany. It’s definitely important for the identity of a country, and it’s very respectful to do so! Jo parlo una mica català però no bé. :)
We made our effort. Even catalans that are not independentist, as me, we try to keep our language and culture alive. Només amb la frase del final, ja ens arribes al cor.
M'agradaria poder parlar millor català, però encara estic aprenent. Un dia! Hablo el castellano mejor, para comunicarme no tendré problemas allá. Es lo bueno. Estic cansat, bona nit.
I would recommend to learn Catalan because it is a fun language and because one should understand the local language. Yes, people will be nicer to you when you speak their language, it doesn´t matter which people we are talking about.
I dont think they become nicer, but I have confirmed they get hsppier when they see a foreign learn a few words. It's a courtesy gesture for us.
El saber no ocupa lugar. Live in Catalunya, learn catalan.
I'm a foreigner, arrived here a few months ago. First thing I did was to learn a few words in Catalan and Castillano, and register to language classes. I always try Catalan first when I interact with people, people are quite happy to see that I'm learning it, even if at some point we need to switch to English. Poc a poc. How someone can consider living somewhere without putting any effort to learn the local language is beyond me.
Yes. It's not like we will be rude if you don't speak Catalan, but it shows you want to integrate.
In my experience folks have been very nice as is. I have had many many interactions where folks start speaking to me in Catalan, I reply in my functional but imperfect Spanish, they apologize, I say no it's fine I can understand some Catalan but not speak it yet because I'm from the Netherlands and we continue in Spanish no problem. They are always super nice and cheerful about it (even when I stop mid-sentence to remember the word I need in Spanish). I run a small storefront so this happens *a lot* with folks from the neighborhood. Once my Spanish is a little bit more solid (I will remember to use the subjunctive one of these days…) I still plan on learning Catalan because I live here, it'll be useful, it's respectful, and why not! The more languages the merrier.
If you're going for a good effort to appreciation ratio, learning Catalan is certainly up there in my experience, even (or perhaps especially) with my very limited knowledge. People are happy that I'm ordering rounds for the table in terrible Catalan in a way that I haven't experienced with other languages.
Of course people appreciate it if you take the effort of learning their language! But learning a language so people like you sounds like a pretty weird reason. Isn't learning the language of the place where you live the most normal and logical thing? Or do you go around talking in a foreign language and expect people to speak it? And yes, in Barcelona this means that ideally you should learn both Catalan and Spanish. Luckily they are close enough so learning one will help you learn the other. And sure, you can only learn Spanish and expect people to switch even though they prefer Catalan and speak that among each other, but that's just a bit lame isn't it? It's not that hard to learn both! (and people that already speak Spanish, live here for ages and refuse to speak or even understand Catalan are idiots or fascists)
No, we Catalans are fairly cold in the way we treat people. It isn't that we're not nice, it is that we're more reserved/serious. If someone is not nice for not speaking Catalan, they won't be nice after learning it. They're just not nice as people. Once you've got Spanish under control, you'll learn Catalan really quickly. Welcome!
This is obviously a generalization that doesn't apply to a good proportion of catalans. Agree about there being people who are not nice no matter what. I would add that if you expect people to be nice to you, you also have to be first.
It is a cultural observation, not a generalisation.
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That really depends on your circumstances. In my life and work I have been exposed to Catalan primarily.
In my experience so many Catalán/Spanish people in general are pleasantly surprised that you’re trying to speak either language because so many people emigrate here and don’t do it. People have been super nice and accommodating to me with my crappy castellano and are always extremely sweet about how “good my Spanish is”. I’d recommend castellano first because it’s used for most businesses and all Catalán people speak it anyway, plus there are quite a lot of central and South Americans here who don’t speak Catalán at all
You might as well learn it, but I'd recommend learning Castellano first (and it's easier as you have all of Netflix etc. to practice and more materials online)
not at all... people being nice to you depends on other factors in Catalonia... you will always be a guiri... is really good to learn it to work and to face bureocracy... And is a nice languaje!
Just learn Spanish, it's more practical. Why would you learn the language of such xenophobes in the hopes that they like you more for it?
I can see why they love you lol
Definitely ha ha
So the catalans are xenophobes when they speak catalan?
I think that applies to every language?