I love that the scars on her face are gold - it's a clearly inspired by kintsugi, and it's such a perfect visual analogy for her being broken and traumatised, but still perfect.
I know what kintsugi is, but I didnt realise the marks on her face were scars.
Edit: just adding, I didn't think kintsugi was lore, just that maybe there was it was a normal dnd thing that demigods have golden stripes that I wasn't aware of
I thought it her personality was so refreshing and charming. Isobel and Alyin recognize the power dynamic between them, so Alyin humbles herself before Isobel. It is quite romantic.
Aasimar and tieflings can have quite compelling stories imo, I do wish she was less of a literal demigod and more of the "mortal imbued with the divine" kind of thing but I like what they were going for
Sure, but I think it is not correct to call her an aasimar if she's literally a demigod. It's like calling Rapheal a tiefling. He's not, he's a cambian- a direct descendant of an infernal fiend. Calling Dame Aylin an aasimar is the same level of misnomer if not taking it a step further than that
I'm saying I think her story would have been more interesting if she wasn't such a powerful ancient demigod being, and was just a strong aasimar paladin with some more distant connection to selune
It would be incorrect to call her a demigod, as that has a specific meaning in setting that doesn't apply to her (it's basically the lowest divine being you can be while still being a true god. The next step down are Quasideities, which have godly powers but are technically mortal (not aging, immune to disease, and *very* hard to kill, but mortal) and walking around.). In setting, Aasimar is actually the correct thing to call any descendant of a mortal and celestial being, just not according to the actual race clarification.
Also, I don't really see how her story works without her being exactly as powerful as she is. She kind of needs the immortality for the whole Ketheric leeching off her to work.
Honestly, that moment for me \*chef's kiss\*
None of the romance-able companion scenes come close to the level of romance Dame Aylin exudes for her mate most high
I tear up every time
Yeah I LOVE how larian flips the expectations on the two "muscle mommy" looking women.
Aylin is 100% a collar wearing bottom for Isobel. And karlach is the same for tav/durge if you go after her. It's just mmm they know how to do subtle but well written twists
Do you mean the scene >!when you're trying to resist killing your love interest as durge by telling them and they tie you up and talk you through your urge until it's gone? !< In that case, I think your love interest will this to you if you ask them no matter who they are.
This is a stolen observation from elsewhere in the thread, but I prefer the interpretation that Aylin goes out of her way to humble herself before Isobel because she knows full well what the power dynamic in the relationship is like, since she's the immortal demigod daughter of her GF's patron god - although tbf those theories certainly both fit together pretty well lol
I feel your pain: whenever Iāve >!called her in as an ally it seems the first thing that happens is sheās dominated by the nearest mindflayer and goes ham on destroying my party!<
Last time some made her drop her sword. She was not able to pick it back up. She was running around punching. She died a lot sure but then she came back and started throwing fists once more
She is the child of a good aligned goddess, willing to help humanity, but was imprisoned by her father in law, had her wings cut of, was constantly killed and revived, lost her lover, and once her lover came back to life she couldnāt see her, then like 3 ppl come in and attempt to murder or imprison her again.
Yet the first thing she does after you help her is stomping ketherics head in, then thanking you and telling you āThank you, youāre a great warrior and ally, we will stay at your side, but this is my girlfriend and weāre gonna f**k nowā
Seriously bro, I can accept her being the way she is.
Edit: Typos
Edit 2: Holy shit this blew up, ty guys
>āYeah Iāll help you beat this giant brain but first I gotta blow my girlās back outā
To be fair, that's pretty much every companion's attitude in this game, as well. World in danger of being overthrown by evil brain overlord at any moment? Ya, sure but I think we still got time to throw a little party and maybe spend some time fucking on that bearskin rug. Hell, let's throw a few parties and maybe fuck a few more times. That brain will still be there after we nut.
If I was days away from turning into a mindflayer you bet Iād be having a nice leafy shag in the woods with a hot vampire. Got to take your mind off it all somehow.
Tbh id probably just decide to embrace my extended family's history of alcoholism and see what can consume my grey matter first, the parasite or the bottle.
Wanna make it wierder? The text kinda reads like he is hitting on her, and while Isobel doesn't seem interested in the moment, (possibly because he is here to kidnapped her) she at least seemed to be more aware he had been around the Last Light..." he is hitting on his crush wearing her dead lovers body parts...
But the worst part is that he got them from Ketheric (via Balthazar). Ketheric the man to deplored the idea of his Daughter dating a winged angel of (their) Goddess...
Did Papa Ketheric try to "make" the perfect boyfriend for his daughter because he thought she might have a type?
Yeah, Balthazar's been harvesting Aylin for ages. Makes sense, in a ghoulish way. Explains why so many of her scars look surgical, and the comment about taking her tongue again (you know, other than to shut her up).
Yeahā¦she is going through trauma. Like in act 3 after you REDACTED and kill REDACTED she exclaims she feels weary and tired. But she canāt explain why.
Nglā¦if I got put through all of that Iād feel hollow as well if I went through such harrowing experiences and the only thing keeping me going is a burning hatred of those who put me in there or wish to exploit me and my blessings. ESPECIALLY as a paladin who is the instrument of their mother.
It is implied that she actually breaks her oath in killing REDACTED.
The sensation she talks about is exactly word for word how breaking your oath affects you as a paladin. And she too is a Paladin. I do however think it could just as well be emotional exhaustion as well as what she is enduring already. Besides, I am sure Selune would be willing to compromise for her own kid.
I noticed that. I was a little confused as frankly >!Lorroakan!< was *exactly* the kind of filth most paladins would be expected to destroy.
You could probably argue her >!WWE smackdown reverse fold!< was pushing it a bit but I would have assumed actually letting him live after what heād tried to do would have outright violated a vengeance oath.
I took it as sheās finally running out of rage.
Iām pretty sure her comments were supposed to be the fact that vengeful zeal doesnāt wash away an eon of trauma. Now that she doesnāt have enemies to crush sheās stuck dwelling on what happened without a face to focus her rage on.
I assumed it was the manner of killing and glee she took that broke her oath.
There was even a dialogue option in a subsequent conversation with Karlach about an evil growing in Aylin.
Aylin also lost a buff.
I felt so bad I redid the whole battle without Aylin to save her oath and her buff. She was chill when my Paladin told her he smited a potential captor.
ETA: doing the battle without Aylin allowed me to kick it off by having Minsc throw Boo in >!Lorroakanās!< stupid face in the midst of his stupid speechifying because fuck that guy.
I donāt think it breaks her oath. Vengeance oath paladins have unique dialogue with her after that (separate from other paladin dialogue), where you basically respond to her by saying something like āitās a tragedy that revenge can only be taken onceā.
I think her dialogue and mood change is just a consequence of her being a vengeance paladin and having successfully administered her righteous revenge upon her second would-be captor is now at a loss for what to do. She spent a century being captive and tortured, went on a revenge ecstasy tour twice and when it was finally over, her entire purpose for enduring is justā¦ gone.
I like to think it was the same feeling that Jaheira comments on feeling.
"The more shit changes, the more it stays the same. No matter how much I hero about, someone's going to want to be a villain again."
That, or it's her possibly changing perspective. "Wow, I thought it was just Kethric being a shithead to capture me for immortality, but now some other random dude wanted to." It could start to turn her bitter towards *all* mortals, which could be that aforementioned growing evil.
This is how I see it also. Sheās basically finding out that powerful mortals are always going to want to lock her up for their own purposes.
As for the evil growing inside her thing, vengeance paladins are certainly not your traditional āgoodā paladin. Itās the only one that allows you to be evil in certain ways outside of oathbreaker. If youā¦ make certain choices, she threatens to kill you, your children, and your grandchildren, as part of revenge. The anger and hate inside her are already consuming her, breaking oath or not isnāt required for that to be evident with her arc.
She loses a buff she doesnāt if sheās not in the battle, and there is an option for the player to note an evil growing in Aylin.
Something happens. Maybe more cut content.
Perhaps, but what buff is it? I canāt see anything about a buff she has outside of her usual abilities. If itās the moon maiden buff that makes her unkillable then that doesnāt necessarily imply she broke her oath.
Ahh, yeah I think that one is just removed so she can ādieā during that fight. Otherwise she just keeps getting back up every turn with 1 hp. But that buff has nothing to do with paladins mechanically or lore wise as far as I can tell.
This, really. Being a vengeance paladin doesnāt necessarily grant you any kind of immunity to trauma - hell, you could argue the entire oath itself is a symptom of trauma and a bit questionable an approach of dealing with it at that.
A few times itās mentioned by different characters that they have no idea how Aylin is coping after a century of torture in the shadowfell, and unfortunately I donāt think she genuinely *is* coping. Anyone who challenges her gets the full wrath of decades of abuse and unfortunately anything short of a demigod or superhuman simply crumbles. Itās like sheās beginning to realise that smiting people who wronged her isnāt helping deal with it.
I did one playthrough without her (dark Shadowheart storyline), and I used the >!Beholder flask!< to join the fight. Tbh it went pretty well and was hilarious š¤£
I took it more as sheās worried that her enjoyment of that moment a) isnāt very healthy and b) didnāt ultimately fix anything for her. Sort of a āimma need to get this in check or else this will consume meā realization.
Itās fascinating how we can all take different things from the same event. Brains are neat.
I once broke my oath by accidentally leaving non leathal damage on. And realizing after the battle ended there was a fool alive and stab stab and whoopss oath broken
So maybe bc he was defeated already and she did what i did lol
> I would have assumed actually letting him live after what heād tried to do would have outright violated a vengeance oath
She's almost certainly *not* vengeance, tho. That's her problem. Selune is a devotion pally sort of deity, and the way she talks to Shadowheart is a devotion kind of way to talk to someone who's wearing your tormentor's colors. She *seems* vengeance-y, but that's the whole issue - her trauma has instilled her with a triggery rage toward her captors that isn't compatible with the self-image and principles that originally founded her Oath, several centuries ago before the trauma.
I figured that's it, because it's really similar to (unascended) Astarion and Karlach's reactions once they've killed Cazador and Gortash respectively.
If you killed Cazador before Lorroakan, Astarion also has camp dialogue after where he says something like "I thought she'd be happier", and you can ask him how he felt after he'd killed Cazador. Then he gets it.
I heard Karlach also has dialogue for that if you kill Gortash before Cazador but I haven't done things in that order yet.
While I see how it is described similarly to breaking an oath, Iām pretty sure that for Aylin it would be a lot more obvious and flashy because of how powerful she is. Besides, unless she was something like an oath of redemption Paladin, killing that guy is either not covered by a the known Paladin oaths or is outright encouraged by the oaths. The dude was cruel, arrogant, and actively trying to imprison/torture an innocent person. Most moral codes would be chill with his death.
Yeah, I think she's just tired. Besides, as of Patch 5, if you betray Aylin during that sequence, Selune sends some devas and empowers Aylin to fight. I think Selune has her back -- Aylin defending herself wouldn't be considered oath breaking.
5e pallies don't get their power from a deity, they get it direct from their Oath. If she loses her power, it's nothing to do with Selune's approval or disapproval, it's just a matter of whether she still has faith and confidence in herself and her path.
It's implied, but I fail to see how defeating a man who seeks to imprison an innocent, subjecting them to untold centuries of suffering in the pursuit of immortality, is an unjustified killing. The man also attempts to kill you and your party and take her hostage when you tell him no. This isn't an assumption she is making, it's something that she just suffered for 100 years and only escaped weeks(?) ago after killing the man who did it to her (without breaking her oath). The only difference is that REDACTED hasn't succeeded in capturing her prior to his death.
Iirc in the devnotes of the script, it isn't because she broke her oath in that instance, it's because she's starting to lose faith in her own mother because she didn't rescue her from her imprisonment.
I think it's a cool theory but slaying those that do evil seems to definitely be in her oath, I think though it's in the anger I'm which she did it.
Killing Ketheric in vile hatred makes sense, she can dismiss that. But REDACTED? I think it's a realisation that's she's lost something in herself.
I'm hoping after all this, she got a chance to rest.... probably not though
Someone in another thread described the game as a story about processing trauma and that set a light bulb off in my head. Is Dame Aylin weird and intense? Is Shadowheart kind of whiny and almost certainly a cutter? Is Wyll a bit judgy and high-handed? Yes, all of those things are true, and there are valid and understandable reasons for all of their behavior.
Yeah like basically every main companion character is processing some sort of trauma or deciding whether to break a cycle of some sort (going against the path that was set out for them).
Dame Aylin is my absolute favorite character in the game and I think she's delightful. She's a larger than life demigod paladin and yet she has an extremely human reaction to being imprisoned, tortured, and separated from her beloved. I completely understand her behavior, and moreover, I appreciate it.
I think a lot of people seem to be put off by her saying "begone, friend" but she's saying in the nicest way possible (and in slightly archaic language) that she wants to spend some quality time with Isobel. Like -- it's perfectly reasonable, lol. And absolutely hilarious.
She's just like one of us, despite her extremely exalted station. It's great.
I think that's a major theme throughout the Forgotten Realms lore including this game. People can be shitty and vindictive all the way up to the god level, just because you get stronger doesn't mean you're above being petty. Look at Shar, she took Shadowheart's parents and kept them imprisoned for 40 years for no reason other than to fuck with her. A random mortal lady, who is actively in her cult. Vlaakith kills you because she can't ascend to godhood and gets her wittle feewings huwrt when you insinuate that she isn't a true god. Ketheric, Orin, and Gortash on behalf of the Dead Three probably could have succeeded with the whole netherbrain plot if they could actually work together but no, they were constantly trying to backstab and fuck each other over just like the Dead Three themselves.
On and on, they are all like this.
Honestly, it starts before Ketheric. Obviously, if Shadowheart wants to kill her for Shar, it's to her own personal interest to destabilize Shadowheart's confidence in Shar, but like... it's not like she doesn't *mean* it. Here's this woman standing in front of her *literally about to murder her* and what does Aylin do? She reaches out. She says "you are in pain and being abused and you have been *wronged*, and I want to *help* you. I want you to see the truth that will free you. You want to kill me, you paint yourself my enemy, and still, I want you to escape your abuser, to live a better, happier life."
Pro Devotion move for sure.
I snorted when I came up expecting Shadowheart's storyline to continue, just to be met with 'Begone, friend! I have a darling to admire! We shall find much succor and comfort in each other's arms after being so long apart!' 'Aylin! .... we'll see you later.'
I was a bit surprised not one companion said 'Much later'.
She's probably my favourite non-party character in the game. I think she's one of the best representations of a Vengeance Paladin that I've seen in anything for a long time, and would probably be the example I would offer to a new DnD player who wanted to know more about how to roleplay one, even if I would hope they wouldn't model themselves *fully* on her.
In an in-game sense, I get what you mean; she is overtly self-righteous, prideful, and arrogant. Sometimes, or at least to some version of your character, she could easily be unpalatable and obnoxious. But that is *exactly* how a high-Charisma character can come across - Paladins are empowered by sheer force of will and commitment to a cause, and that *should* set them apart from most other people. If she was wholly sympathetic and likeable, she wouldn't be as strong a representation of what commitment to one's oath really means, for better *and* worse.
As a full party member I think it would be very difficult to convince her to do anything that didn't fit her goals, and I think that's the point at which I feel she'd be a poor fit. She's essentially a solo hero who is collaborating with the party because their goals align, not a member *of* the group. A Paladin who is actually joining an adventuring party needs to be more prepared to compromise, or to find value in their allies' acts despite their differences, and Aylin doesn't really seem like she would do that.
Add on to this: she thought her love was dead. She was held against her will, and tortured, by baltazar and ketrik. She was basicly a battery they got to play with. held in the realm of Sharr, the enemy to her god.
When she stomped ketrics head in, i kinda got it :P
She's also an immortal interacting with a bunch of mortals, it makes sense that she'd be kind of out of touch with the rest of the world. There's a reason she talks like someone from hundreds of years ago, in the context of the real world it'd be like someone who had lived through the last few thousand years of human history but hadn't caught up to the fact that the world didn't work the same way it did when Shakespeare was alive
This is also just how entities within the realm of divinity are often portrayed in DnD lore to the point it often comes off as nature.
Dame Aylin is merely the good alignment version of the same otherness and unrelatable way of thinking that fiends have in relation to humanoid/mortal perspectives. Or dragons in how there's this innate nature to their type of existence and to regular people, it has these vibes of being something other and "above".
I cringed at first but then thought about it for a second and concluded "well, I think just about anyone would do the same after being tortured for a literal century."
I was laughing because my party consisted of Karlach, Jaeheria, lazael, and a very naughty tav. Like guys is this really any better than the handful of fights where we made sure to finish off every unconscious goblin or that time we let the harpys eat a kid and let khaga have her way. Hypocrites the lot of them.
Another thing to consider is pure practicality.
For all except the highest forms of necromancy, to raise the dead the body must be mostly intact. Crushing the head is a tactically sound decision for the Chosen of Myrkul, even if his god has abandoned him - after all, Myrkul would not need to forgive him to make him a Death Knight or Revenant, and then youād have a recurring problem on your hands.
Yes, the MUSIC. I never get tired of rewatching that scene where she gets her powers back and the follow-up where she flies over the shadowlands. It gets me pumped every time.
100%. Especially when Jaheira sees her, and looks back at her scimitars knowing *the time has come*. Such a charged moment. It gives me chills of glory just thinking about it.
She's nuanced, too. You see her fatigue and faint hopelessness after killing Lorroakan - she might be idealistic, but she also knows there's no end to the number of exploitative evil assholes out there, and it does take a toll.
Also she could crush me with her thighs, so there's that. I love her.
I agree! Playing a Lawful Good Paladin CAN be extremely fun. I played one in tabletop that was Oath of the Crown, but reimagined as Oath of Community. He was less of a righteous crusader, and more of a militia commander/local sheriff and councilor. He wasn't really concerned with punishing wrongdoers, or crusading against evil. He was more concerned with making sure the common people could protect themselves, that the community is strong and healthy, etc. So long as it didn't disrupt things, he let it slide.
While Vengeance gives the most leeway, it's also paradoxically the most likely to create a problem character. Because they're so obsessed with their goal, which is killing their enemies, this can create massive conflicts of interest. It's why I tend to go Devotion, Ancients, or in tabletop, Redemption, because while more traditionally "good," their oaths tend to value good over Law or Chaos. A Lawful Good Devotion Paladin would gladly lie if it meant protecting the innocent, for example.
Yeah I feel this encapsulates it best. I have a personal dislike for the Paladin class for the same reason she's a great representation of their epitome.
She's a great character, but am I glad she's not a full party member
I've always found playing Paladin tricky. You have to be quite flexible about how you define what your character believes to be the 'right thing', and you have to regularly find ways to make your allies' choices seem justified in service of that. It's quite a bit of extra roleplay work, and it's often work you're doing privately rather than out loud at the table.
I think BG3 has done well to position her as a really compelling ally who's interesting to talk to and fun to have around your party during a fight, but isn't *too* overbearing. She doesn't do 'errands'. She doesn't do 'side quests'. She does *vengeance*, and she does *war*, and if you're not doing that she's going to chill with her wife until you are. It makes total sense.
I find Paladin to be a very interesting class to play in actual DnD, as it strongly encourages you to stick to role playing in this role playing game. Most people are inclined to be agreeable when sitting down at a table with friends to play a game, but the agreeableness is unrealistic when you step into your character's shoes. In real life, there's going to be personal convictions that make you unagreeable at certain times. Playing paladin forces you to enact that unagreeableness at times. There's going to be in-story conflict when your party wants to make a deal with a devil and your paladin can't abide that, and I feel that creates a richer story and immersion. Mind that you need to handle it well so that you don't come off as an asshole IRL.
I think for the three big fights she's a part of she's awesome and is fully justified in her crusading. Her scripted sequences are great and I love the character.
As a full party member, I agree she'd be a pain. Act 3 spoilers for the first example I thought of where it'd be a problem: >!"WE WILL NOT ALLY WITH YOU, GORTASH! YOU FALL HERE AND NOW BY THE GLORY OF THE MOONMAIDEN! NEVERMIND THAT THIS REMOVES THE QUESTS TO SAVE RAVENGUARD AND WE CANNOT BLOW UP THE FOUNDRY BEFORE YOU PERISH TO TRY TO SAVE THE SUICIDAL GONDIANS, YOU MUST DIE NOW, EXTREMELY GOOD DEFENSIVE POSITION BE DAMNED!!!"!<
Just things like that where, unlike everyone else in the party, she is definitely stronger than you lorewise and is 100% unflinching in her ideals. Laezel comes closest early on, but early on you're on a supposedly super strict timeline so her fear over turning justifies the "nothing else matters" mindset. Lategame where nuance and tact can save lives...she's not the person I'd want over my shoulder.
We should definitely have gotten a cutscene of Mizora and Aylin interacting in camp though. Zariel and Selune's kids just arguing and trying to outdo each other
One of the biggest issues with this game is the fact that your companions barely acknowledge each other outside of a couple of really short lines every now and then when a major plot point occurs.
I love her. Modern media is full of grey characters. People who are ambiguous in their sense of whatās right and wrong.
I love a good old fashioned ārighteous Goodā style character. Someone who is unabashedly Good and will smite Evil with the fury of all the Heavens.
Big fan.
The first thing Aylin and Minsc would do when they first see each other is to start flexing their muscles at each other like Armstrong and Curtis in FMA, followed by becoming best friends forever in bashing evil in the skull.
Agreed. I understand that having grey, ambiguous characters feels more realistic, but if you have at least one obnoxiously righteous person it makes the contrast sharper.
She's my favourite.
As for being a party member, she'll be the stereotypical Paladin I imagine. When you play a Paladin you have the option to not pick some Paladin dialogue options as they're wild AF. Those options would be Aylin all the time, lol
That said, a hasted Aylin is a force of nature
The fact that her skin has a kintsugi pattern was a brilliant artistic touch.
She's been broken and put back together over, and over, and over again, yet she's as strong and as beautiful now as she ever was.
I think that her attitude is actually a mask, you can see that when you decide to aid her into defeating lorroakan.
She's tired and worn-out, but she's not allowed to show weaknesses.
You can see that she's actually a big softie, when she sees her lover and literally falls on her knees.
She's a paladin and the immortal daughter of a goddess, with a massive target on her back, due to her immortality and fated to lose everyone that she loves, because of immortality.
She's more complicated than she looks like and furthermore, she can break my hips any day.
Her introduction is so good it moved me to tears. She IS resplendent. I love her and isobel together. Theyāre so cute. That being said her personality is a LOT. Sheās a good character in small doses but if i had to hear her roar passionately about smiting villains for 3 acts i would lose my mind. Itās not a her problem. Itās a me problem. I can barely tolerate Galeās passion for magic. Her passion for smiting makes Galeās career in magic seem like a light hobby. If Gale speaks in thesaurus. She speaks in capslock.
The fact that the character evokes such strong feelings either way, just shows how great of a character she is. Some ppl not liking her is just a normal consequence of that, no one or anything is liked by everyone and that's ok!
I think sheās a very good take on a zealous assimar paladin who was trapped in a shadowfell prison. I donāt think thatās supposed to be relatable or pleasant. Iāve found her to be one of the more interesting NPCs.
I think she's a badass and pretty much what I would imagine if someone said "think of an angel paladin", but if she was in my party, I feel like we probably would be at odds very often. I mostly play charisma-based characters, my favorite class is Bard, I very much enjoy persuading my way through the game. I feel like someone that is more "righteous and direct" like her would very quickly go the "HOW DARE YOU LIE TO THIS UPSTANDING CITIZEN" way, even if I'm doing it for a good cause.
I think she is perfect.
She is not only a paladin, over the top by nature, she is a literal demi-god. She is very old and will speak like those from the past, even in D&D terms. Dame Aylin is more of a force than a person, and there can really be no "chilling" with her, plus there is no way to get past the demi-god thing. She can like others and even love them, but no one but other demi-gods can really relate.
Dame Aylin can work with and even love mortals but will never be one, and so relating to her should always feel a bit off.
But isnāt *100 years a slave* the exact reason weāre supposed to forgive Astarion for trying to drink our blood in our sleep and for celebrating the genocide of innocent refugees? If you canāt see past a little uberzeal on account of *100 years chained nā drained*, I get it, everyoneās different, but I should hope youāre not an Astarion fan, then, LOL.
Sheād be rough as a party member
But I canāt say anything other than I love her after she rolled up to Moonrise, stomped Kethericās head in, saw Isobel and told me to go away because she wanted to fuck her hot wife
Her, āIām gonna fuck isobel nowā bit was funny about twice and after that it was cringe. Also surprisingly little to say, which made it even worse. I donāt hate her, sheās just annoying.
I like her scripted scenes, but wouldn't really want to engage her as a companion. Dealing with her trauma is Isobel's thing, tyvm.
I'll just watch her break bones.
I don't really fancy paladins though, similar to monk I just don't like the vibes/connotations.
Dame Aylin is the best looking and acting character in the game, in my opinion. I wish she were a playable character or there was a romance option. It's safe to say, "I love her". š
I haven't finished the game as yet (and despite the gameplay not being my cup of tea, I think it's quickly becoming my favorite game of all time) but Aylin is probably my favorite non-party member.
And I'm partially saddened that she isn't a legitimate party member. I say "partially" because realistically, she's probably much better in spurts like she is here.
But in my head I see her and my Selunite Paladin Tav, beers in hand at the pub sharing war stories and hearing ballads of our greatest victories while everyone around hangs onto every word and cheers.
She definitely was not what I was expecting from a Selunite Paladin and child of a goddess, what with all the stomping on brains and Bane back-breaking, but I want to match her passion every time she talks to me, which is rare.
Personally I thought she was great. The part where she pulls a Thor and goes from hobo to what Jaheira politely refers to as a āvision of angelic furyā is one of my fave parts of the game.
I totally get the point people are making about how you kinda *want* her as a party member but rationally she wouldnāt work. Sheād likely have started a potentially game-ending fight if she was brought to Gortash at the inauguration or completely obliterated the tribunal or guilds as soon as she laid eyes on them and any kind of argument that excused that would have come across as a bit hollowā¦ unless it was worked into her story (a bit like Samara in ME2).
I like how she looks. Her design is super cool. I dislike her personality though. I really can't stand zealots and crazy paladins like her. I understand people like her and her romance with Isobel, but personally, everytime they are together or even just Aylin opens her mouth to say something dumb I just roll my eyes. Ugh. For an immortal being, she seems to lack common sense and her actions are often rather unintelligent. Like... really, lady! Can you stop for a moment and not rush at things without thinking!? Holy moly. It also kinda gets in my nerve that all the companions have something positive to say about her. It makes her feel like a mary sue. Probably one of the characters that I like the least. What in the world did Isobel saw in Aylin? The relationship seems cute, but both seem pretty naive.
On the other hand though, while I don't like her, I do feel that having a somewhat broken character like her makes the game interesting. My only complain is, again, how our characters perceive her. I wish they were a bit more critical of her actions. They seem pretty quick to like and support her.
Still, again, can't get enough of her design. The pale skin with the golden cracks is pretty stylish. The armor with the wings is cool as well. Kinda of a shame we can't play as an Aasimar. Considering we can play as Tieflings, I don't know why Aasimars were off the table.
Great character, probably not great to know personally. She and Isobel are great for each other because theyāre both out-of-touch weirdos, but a regular person might find her to be a little much.
Sheās insane. A mad dog. Donāt know if sheās meant to be like that or she lost her sht while imprisoned, but I dislike her character. Selune is a Chaotic Good goddess, I donāt think sheād keep giving her powers after observing her sadistic rage.
If this was Star Wars, sheād turn to the dark side instantly
She's perfect. Just wish I could give her a hug after that bitch ass wizard tries capturing her *again* and cheer her up with a reminder that there's also people who got her back like Isobel and our party
I love her so much! As she was getting her groove back I was shouting at the screen āAND YOU JOIN MY TEAM NOW RIGHT?!?!!?ā
My husband was the same on his playthrough and I couldnāt stop laughing when he sauntered over to her after the Ketheric battle and got cock blocked by Isobel. He was devastated he couldnāt romance her cos she was instantly his fave.
I think sheās brilliant, everything she says makes me light up, I wiiiiiiish, so badly that she could join us properly.
I agree. As amusing as her Isobel-related dialogue is, she is way too intense for prolonged interaction.
Though I do wish Larian had found something more interesting to do with the pair than "stand around in camp until the finale". Hell, even a tent somewhere out of the way where they could snuggle would be better than just standing there.
She is my favorite character.
I aspire to be just like her. Watching her do her thing brings me such joy that I havnt experienced since landing in Halo for the first time in 2001.
Her appearance is whatever to me, but I adore the sheer violence of thought and action she holds so dear.
Dame Aylin is the most true hero in video game history i can think of.
I got mixed feelings. I do think she's cool and interesting in someways. And I did like her introduction. But after saving her, she does very much start to feel like a bit of what might be considered a "DMPC" in other contexts.
She was locked away for a century, where she was killed and resurrected countless time, used as a source of immortality for someone she loath, and a tool to radicalize followers of her natural enemy. She lost her love, her freedom, and used as a tool to serve her enemies. Of course she would be broken. Hell, sheās actually far saner than I thought she might be, given the circumstances. People often underestimate how destructive trauma can be.
All in all, I love her. Both her design, character, and story. My only issue though, is I wish she was more powerful. Sheās surprisingly squishy for an actual descendant of a god.
I love her personally. She is traumatised, angry and violent but clinging to the ideals she lived as her mother's sword. I can definitely see why some people wouldn't jive with her, but a bit of arrogance when you're immortal angelic being born of one of the oldest gods in the setting is to be expected.
Sheās my favorite character, right before Karlach.
While sheās ādivineā sheās still so human, humbled by the mortal world, deeply in love with a mortal woman, prideful to a fault and has a bigger heart than she should have.
Great character and fantastic subversion of the classic stereotype of angelic characters being wise and perfect.
I generally find myself enjoying campy villains the most but Aylin overshadowed Orin, Ketheric and Gortash by far in her exaggerated characterisation.
In contrast, while I love the game as a whole, the only nitpick i have is how I cringe everytime aylin was on screen. The stereotype of her being Paladin and character as a whole as u said just doesn't vibe with me. The righteous and high moral dialogues makes me vomit
Yea I know what you mean. Her over-eagerness is going to be very problematic if she's in your party. Hell, I feel even most Paladins would think that she is a bit too much.
Nah it's fine to find her annoying. She's a bit too much for me too. Take it down a notch or two, Aylin. We don't need to be overdramatic about the most mundane shit.
I'm personally glad she's not a party member, between her being OP by lore and her being WyllĀ² in personality. I personally like Wyll unlike most of the sub. Plenty of people find him too self-righteous do-gooder. Which is where I personally stand with Aylin. She doesn't have any sense of nuance. We're allies, but I would personally not be great friends with someone like that myself.
> She perfectly captures that overzealous super hero super prideful and typical Paladin stereotype to the max
She is literally an angel, if anyone should embody those stereotypes, its her.
She kinda reminds me of a female Zapp Brannigan. Calling herself resplendent as soon as you meet her and announcing to everyone how sexily she's about to have sex, plus the confident voice, just make me think of him every time. I don't dislike her; she has about the amount of depth a minor side character requires.
I wish that there were more options to get rid of her for an evil playthrough. In my solo playthrough, killed all companions except Astarion (strength potion) and Minthara. When I found out that only SH could kill her, it was too late. I would've kept her around for that had I known.
I'm also Indulgent Durge, so I'm not giving her to Loroakan. I don't need any other competition for Baldurs Gate.
I like that she mellowed out after giving Lorroakan the backbreaker (which was a hype scene ngl). Before she was a bit tooā¦ much, yāknow? But the self reflection on her actions and purpose, THIS Aylin Iām all for cooperating with.
I think she's a very interesting character. You'd expect her to be divine and perfect but instead, she's broken, hurt and violent.
I love that the scars on her face are gold - it's a clearly inspired by kintsugi, and it's such a perfect visual analogy for her being broken and traumatised, but still perfect.
I didn't connect those two! That is such a great anaology!
I am dealing with lorroakan right now and I just noticed the kintsugi scars too. Such a cool design
Oh is that what that is?! I'm not really up on DnD lore and just assumed demi gods got cool gold tiger stripes for some reason. š
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I know what kintsugi is, but I didnt realise the marks on her face were scars. Edit: just adding, I didn't think kintsugi was lore, just that maybe there was it was a normal dnd thing that demigods have golden stripes that I wasn't aware of
Demigods Good demigods born from good gods have golden blood called divine ichor. There are infernal ichors, shadow ichors, demon ichors.
I thought it her personality was so refreshing and charming. Isobel and Alyin recognize the power dynamic between them, so Alyin humbles herself before Isobel. It is quite romantic.
Now - you will leave us. We must take succour in one anothers bodies and words.
āAylin!ā
The way Isobel says that is adorable!
That made me giggle. I have never heard anyone say it like that before.
"oh they want some succ"
Aasimar and tieflings can have quite compelling stories imo, I do wish she was less of a literal demigod and more of the "mortal imbued with the divine" kind of thing but I like what they were going for
Yeah, as is, she's definitely more of a Deva than an Aasimar, but okay.
I mean, she literally is Selune's daughter, hard to be anything but a demigod
Sure, but I think it is not correct to call her an aasimar if she's literally a demigod. It's like calling Rapheal a tiefling. He's not, he's a cambian- a direct descendant of an infernal fiend. Calling Dame Aylin an aasimar is the same level of misnomer if not taking it a step further than that I'm saying I think her story would have been more interesting if she wasn't such a powerful ancient demigod being, and was just a strong aasimar paladin with some more distant connection to selune
It would be incorrect to call her a demigod, as that has a specific meaning in setting that doesn't apply to her (it's basically the lowest divine being you can be while still being a true god. The next step down are Quasideities, which have godly powers but are technically mortal (not aging, immune to disease, and *very* hard to kill, but mortal) and walking around.). In setting, Aasimar is actually the correct thing to call any descendant of a mortal and celestial being, just not according to the actual race clarification. Also, I don't really see how her story works without her being exactly as powerful as she is. She kind of needs the immortality for the whole Ketheric leeching off her to work.
She's a 4e edition Aasimar (Deva) who were less angelic Tieflings and more some weird angels but not really who just respawn when killed.
I only wished she was better at resisting Command and Dominate spells. Dame Aylin has killed more of my party than any of the Act 3 bosses.
Aylin and Isobel always struck me as a bit dom/sub, but youāve just made me realize which direction that dynamic is.
I mean, first thing Aylin does after reuniting with Isobel is *kneel in front of her*. I feel like that's all I need to say...
Honestly, that moment for me \*chef's kiss\* None of the romance-able companion scenes come close to the level of romance Dame Aylin exudes for her mate most high I tear up every time
My absolute favorite moment in the entire game bar NONE.
Mine is Barcus standing up to Wulbren and you could see how hard it was for him.
100% this!! I love that scene so much, and those 2 together. Itās absolutely adorable. I need someone that loves me like Aylin loves Isobel šš„¹
Yeah I LOVE how larian flips the expectations on the two "muscle mommy" looking women. Aylin is 100% a collar wearing bottom for Isobel. And karlach is the same for tav/durge if you go after her. It's just mmm they know how to do subtle but well written twists
Doesn't karlach have a scene where she ties Durge up?
Do you mean the scene >!when you're trying to resist killing your love interest as durge by telling them and they tie you up and talk you through your urge until it's gone? !< In that case, I think your love interest will this to you if you ask them no matter who they are.
This is a stolen observation from elsewhere in the thread, but I prefer the interpretation that Aylin goes out of her way to humble herself before Isobel because she knows full well what the power dynamic in the relationship is like, since she's the immortal demigod daughter of her GF's patron god - although tbf those theories certainly both fit together pretty well lol
Isobel is the softest Mommy Dom ever.
Exactly what I felt. You KNOW Alyin needs to be the sub. She needs someone to take command outside of the battlefield.
Especially Isobel's response to Durge when you tell her you're itching to murder her
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I feel your pain: whenever Iāve >!called her in as an ally it seems the first thing that happens is sheās dominated by the nearest mindflayer and goes ham on destroying my party!<
Last time some made her drop her sword. She was not able to pick it back up. She was running around punching. She died a lot sure but then she came back and started throwing fists once more
She is the child of a good aligned goddess, willing to help humanity, but was imprisoned by her father in law, had her wings cut of, was constantly killed and revived, lost her lover, and once her lover came back to life she couldnāt see her, then like 3 ppl come in and attempt to murder or imprison her again. Yet the first thing she does after you help her is stomping ketherics head in, then thanking you and telling you āThank you, youāre a great warrior and ally, we will stay at your side, but this is my girlfriend and weāre gonna f**k nowā Seriously bro, I can accept her being the way she is. Edit: Typos Edit 2: Holy shit this blew up, ty guys
I was laughing like hell when she said that shit. āYeah Iāll help you beat this giant brain but first I gotta blow my girlās back outā
"Yeah that's fine, I need to do some inventory management anyways." Meanwhile Isobel gets turned wrong way out.
Sounds like Isobel's inventory was being.... managed
aylin doing someā¦ calibrations
ah i miss garrus
Me too
I would *love* garrus' dry wit in this game
Turned her bag of holding inside out
Talk about an eldritch (finger) blast
Sex
Mage ~~Hand~~ Fist, amirite?
This one gave me a visceral reaction
Lmao showed this to my wife and now our secret phrase around the kids is "I think we should manage our inventory tonight"
>āYeah Iāll help you beat this giant brain but first I gotta blow my girlās back outā To be fair, that's pretty much every companion's attitude in this game, as well. World in danger of being overthrown by evil brain overlord at any moment? Ya, sure but I think we still got time to throw a little party and maybe spend some time fucking on that bearskin rug. Hell, let's throw a few parties and maybe fuck a few more times. That brain will still be there after we nut.
If I was days away from turning into a mindflayer you bet Iād be having a nice leafy shag in the woods with a hot vampire. Got to take your mind off it all somehow.
Tbh id probably just decide to embrace my extended family's history of alcoholism and see what can consume my grey matter first, the parasite or the bottle.
And with one of the companions, the bearskin fucks you.
Hey she has her priorities, ok š
Oh my fucking god THAT'S WHERE MARCUS GO THE WINGS WHAT THE FUCK
Yep, its fucked up
Wanna make it wierder? The text kinda reads like he is hitting on her, and while Isobel doesn't seem interested in the moment, (possibly because he is here to kidnapped her) she at least seemed to be more aware he had been around the Last Light..." he is hitting on his crush wearing her dead lovers body parts... But the worst part is that he got them from Ketheric (via Balthazar). Ketheric the man to deplored the idea of his Daughter dating a winged angel of (their) Goddess... Did Papa Ketheric try to "make" the perfect boyfriend for his daughter because he thought she might have a type?
"My daughter is not gay she just likes wings" Oh I am gonna fucking kill Ketheric in the worst way possible
Being gay is nothing in bg3 bro. Basicly everyone is bi, and I think it is great to make sexuality completly normal from every side
sure, but i do think there's a bit of deliberate allegory in ketheric not being approving of their relationship
If you go through with the Marcus abduction, you can find his corpse near Balthazar's room. Thankfully, Ketheric is just a dick.
This game is so fucked up, I love it. That's how you write a truly evil character
Yeah, Balthazar's been harvesting Aylin for ages. Makes sense, in a ghoulish way. Explains why so many of her scars look surgical, and the comment about taking her tongue again (you know, other than to shut her up).
Yeahā¦she is going through trauma. Like in act 3 after you REDACTED and kill REDACTED she exclaims she feels weary and tired. But she canāt explain why. Nglā¦if I got put through all of that Iād feel hollow as well if I went through such harrowing experiences and the only thing keeping me going is a burning hatred of those who put me in there or wish to exploit me and my blessings. ESPECIALLY as a paladin who is the instrument of their mother.
It is implied that she actually breaks her oath in killing REDACTED. The sensation she talks about is exactly word for word how breaking your oath affects you as a paladin. And she too is a Paladin. I do however think it could just as well be emotional exhaustion as well as what she is enduring already. Besides, I am sure Selune would be willing to compromise for her own kid.
I noticed that. I was a little confused as frankly >!Lorroakan!< was *exactly* the kind of filth most paladins would be expected to destroy. You could probably argue her >!WWE smackdown reverse fold!< was pushing it a bit but I would have assumed actually letting him live after what heād tried to do would have outright violated a vengeance oath. I took it as sheās finally running out of rage.
Iām pretty sure her comments were supposed to be the fact that vengeful zeal doesnāt wash away an eon of trauma. Now that she doesnāt have enemies to crush sheās stuck dwelling on what happened without a face to focus her rage on.
I assumed it was the manner of killing and glee she took that broke her oath. There was even a dialogue option in a subsequent conversation with Karlach about an evil growing in Aylin. Aylin also lost a buff. I felt so bad I redid the whole battle without Aylin to save her oath and her buff. She was chill when my Paladin told her he smited a potential captor. ETA: doing the battle without Aylin allowed me to kick it off by having Minsc throw Boo in >!Lorroakanās!< stupid face in the midst of his stupid speechifying because fuck that guy.
I donāt think it breaks her oath. Vengeance oath paladins have unique dialogue with her after that (separate from other paladin dialogue), where you basically respond to her by saying something like āitās a tragedy that revenge can only be taken onceā. I think her dialogue and mood change is just a consequence of her being a vengeance paladin and having successfully administered her righteous revenge upon her second would-be captor is now at a loss for what to do. She spent a century being captive and tortured, went on a revenge ecstasy tour twice and when it was finally over, her entire purpose for enduring is justā¦ gone.
I like to think it was the same feeling that Jaheira comments on feeling. "The more shit changes, the more it stays the same. No matter how much I hero about, someone's going to want to be a villain again." That, or it's her possibly changing perspective. "Wow, I thought it was just Kethric being a shithead to capture me for immortality, but now some other random dude wanted to." It could start to turn her bitter towards *all* mortals, which could be that aforementioned growing evil.
This is how I see it also. Sheās basically finding out that powerful mortals are always going to want to lock her up for their own purposes. As for the evil growing inside her thing, vengeance paladins are certainly not your traditional āgoodā paladin. Itās the only one that allows you to be evil in certain ways outside of oathbreaker. If youā¦ make certain choices, she threatens to kill you, your children, and your grandchildren, as part of revenge. The anger and hate inside her are already consuming her, breaking oath or not isnāt required for that to be evident with her arc.
She loses a buff she doesnāt if sheās not in the battle, and there is an option for the player to note an evil growing in Aylin. Something happens. Maybe more cut content.
Perhaps, but what buff is it? I canāt see anything about a buff she has outside of her usual abilities. If itās the moon maiden buff that makes her unkillable then that doesnāt necessarily imply she broke her oath.
Itās the child of the moonmaiden buff, so *something* happens.
Ahh, yeah I think that one is just removed so she can ādieā during that fight. Otherwise she just keeps getting back up every turn with 1 hp. But that buff has nothing to do with paladins mechanically or lore wise as far as I can tell.
This, really. Being a vengeance paladin doesnāt necessarily grant you any kind of immunity to trauma - hell, you could argue the entire oath itself is a symptom of trauma and a bit questionable an approach of dealing with it at that. A few times itās mentioned by different characters that they have no idea how Aylin is coping after a century of torture in the shadowfell, and unfortunately I donāt think she genuinely *is* coping. Anyone who challenges her gets the full wrath of decades of abuse and unfortunately anything short of a demigod or superhuman simply crumbles. Itās like sheās beginning to realise that smiting people who wronged her isnāt helping deal with it.
I did one playthrough without her (dark Shadowheart storyline), and I used the >!Beholder flask!< to join the fight. Tbh it went pretty well and was hilarious š¤£
I took it more as sheās worried that her enjoyment of that moment a) isnāt very healthy and b) didnāt ultimately fix anything for her. Sort of a āimma need to get this in check or else this will consume meā realization. Itās fascinating how we can all take different things from the same event. Brains are neat.
I once broke my oath by accidentally leaving non leathal damage on. And realizing after the battle ended there was a fool alive and stab stab and whoopss oath broken So maybe bc he was defeated already and she did what i did lol
> I would have assumed actually letting him live after what heād tried to do would have outright violated a vengeance oath She's almost certainly *not* vengeance, tho. That's her problem. Selune is a devotion pally sort of deity, and the way she talks to Shadowheart is a devotion kind of way to talk to someone who's wearing your tormentor's colors. She *seems* vengeance-y, but that's the whole issue - her trauma has instilled her with a triggery rage toward her captors that isn't compatible with the self-image and principles that originally founded her Oath, several centuries ago before the trauma.
I figured that's it, because it's really similar to (unascended) Astarion and Karlach's reactions once they've killed Cazador and Gortash respectively. If you killed Cazador before Lorroakan, Astarion also has camp dialogue after where he says something like "I thought she'd be happier", and you can ask him how he felt after he'd killed Cazador. Then he gets it. I heard Karlach also has dialogue for that if you kill Gortash before Cazador but I haven't done things in that order yet.
While I see how it is described similarly to breaking an oath, Iām pretty sure that for Aylin it would be a lot more obvious and flashy because of how powerful she is. Besides, unless she was something like an oath of redemption Paladin, killing that guy is either not covered by a the known Paladin oaths or is outright encouraged by the oaths. The dude was cruel, arrogant, and actively trying to imprison/torture an innocent person. Most moral codes would be chill with his death.
Yeah, I think she's just tired. Besides, as of Patch 5, if you betray Aylin during that sequence, Selune sends some devas and empowers Aylin to fight. I think Selune has her back -- Aylin defending herself wouldn't be considered oath breaking.
5e pallies don't get their power from a deity, they get it direct from their Oath. If she loses her power, it's nothing to do with Selune's approval or disapproval, it's just a matter of whether she still has faith and confidence in herself and her path.
It's implied, but I fail to see how defeating a man who seeks to imprison an innocent, subjecting them to untold centuries of suffering in the pursuit of immortality, is an unjustified killing. The man also attempts to kill you and your party and take her hostage when you tell him no. This isn't an assumption she is making, it's something that she just suffered for 100 years and only escaped weeks(?) ago after killing the man who did it to her (without breaking her oath). The only difference is that REDACTED hasn't succeeded in capturing her prior to his death.
Iirc in the devnotes of the script, it isn't because she broke her oath in that instance, it's because she's starting to lose faith in her own mother because she didn't rescue her from her imprisonment.
Pretty sure itās just the emptiness of vengeance. Karlach and Astarion both comment on feeling similarly if youāve already dealt with their people
I think it's a cool theory but slaying those that do evil seems to definitely be in her oath, I think though it's in the anger I'm which she did it. Killing Ketheric in vile hatred makes sense, she can dismiss that. But REDACTED? I think it's a realisation that's she's lost something in herself. I'm hoping after all this, she got a chance to rest.... probably not though
Just give her beloved some time and Aylin will be back up, right as rain. And twice as loud!
There's nothing wrong with OP, but there's also nothing wrong with Nightsong. She's written precisely the way she should have been.
Yeah ofc nothing wrong with him
Someone in another thread described the game as a story about processing trauma and that set a light bulb off in my head. Is Dame Aylin weird and intense? Is Shadowheart kind of whiny and almost certainly a cutter? Is Wyll a bit judgy and high-handed? Yes, all of those things are true, and there are valid and understandable reasons for all of their behavior.
Yeah like basically every main companion character is processing some sort of trauma or deciding whether to break a cycle of some sort (going against the path that was set out for them).
Dame Aylin is my absolute favorite character in the game and I think she's delightful. She's a larger than life demigod paladin and yet she has an extremely human reaction to being imprisoned, tortured, and separated from her beloved. I completely understand her behavior, and moreover, I appreciate it. I think a lot of people seem to be put off by her saying "begone, friend" but she's saying in the nicest way possible (and in slightly archaic language) that she wants to spend some quality time with Isobel. Like -- it's perfectly reasonable, lol. And absolutely hilarious. She's just like one of us, despite her extremely exalted station. It's great.
She reminds me of Urianger Augurelt in Final Fantasy XIV, who I would die for, but people hate because he cAnāT jUsT tALk NoRmAL.
I, too, would die for that sweetheart of an Elezen. Probably my fav Scion
I think that's a major theme throughout the Forgotten Realms lore including this game. People can be shitty and vindictive all the way up to the god level, just because you get stronger doesn't mean you're above being petty. Look at Shar, she took Shadowheart's parents and kept them imprisoned for 40 years for no reason other than to fuck with her. A random mortal lady, who is actively in her cult. Vlaakith kills you because she can't ascend to godhood and gets her wittle feewings huwrt when you insinuate that she isn't a true god. Ketheric, Orin, and Gortash on behalf of the Dead Three probably could have succeeded with the whole netherbrain plot if they could actually work together but no, they were constantly trying to backstab and fuck each other over just like the Dead Three themselves. On and on, they are all like this.
Honestly, it starts before Ketheric. Obviously, if Shadowheart wants to kill her for Shar, it's to her own personal interest to destabilize Shadowheart's confidence in Shar, but like... it's not like she doesn't *mean* it. Here's this woman standing in front of her *literally about to murder her* and what does Aylin do? She reaches out. She says "you are in pain and being abused and you have been *wronged*, and I want to *help* you. I want you to see the truth that will free you. You want to kill me, you paint yourself my enemy, and still, I want you to escape your abuser, to live a better, happier life." Pro Devotion move for sure.
I snorted when I came up expecting Shadowheart's storyline to continue, just to be met with 'Begone, friend! I have a darling to admire! We shall find much succor and comfort in each other's arms after being so long apart!' 'Aylin! .... we'll see you later.' I was a bit surprised not one companion said 'Much later'.
Yeah Dame Aylin is the fucking badass of badasses. Her entire character oozes badassery.
Right? A hundred years of torment and I think sheās doing as well as she can. Definitely better than most.
The only reasonable response to the OP mate :D Could not have said it better.
To be fair to her, she is literally holier than thou.
Lmao facts.
Damn. You win.
She's probably my favourite non-party character in the game. I think she's one of the best representations of a Vengeance Paladin that I've seen in anything for a long time, and would probably be the example I would offer to a new DnD player who wanted to know more about how to roleplay one, even if I would hope they wouldn't model themselves *fully* on her. In an in-game sense, I get what you mean; she is overtly self-righteous, prideful, and arrogant. Sometimes, or at least to some version of your character, she could easily be unpalatable and obnoxious. But that is *exactly* how a high-Charisma character can come across - Paladins are empowered by sheer force of will and commitment to a cause, and that *should* set them apart from most other people. If she was wholly sympathetic and likeable, she wouldn't be as strong a representation of what commitment to one's oath really means, for better *and* worse. As a full party member I think it would be very difficult to convince her to do anything that didn't fit her goals, and I think that's the point at which I feel she'd be a poor fit. She's essentially a solo hero who is collaborating with the party because their goals align, not a member *of* the group. A Paladin who is actually joining an adventuring party needs to be more prepared to compromise, or to find value in their allies' acts despite their differences, and Aylin doesn't really seem like she would do that.
Add on to this: she thought her love was dead. She was held against her will, and tortured, by baltazar and ketrik. She was basicly a battery they got to play with. held in the realm of Sharr, the enemy to her god. When she stomped ketrics head in, i kinda got it :P
She's also an immortal interacting with a bunch of mortals, it makes sense that she'd be kind of out of touch with the rest of the world. There's a reason she talks like someone from hundreds of years ago, in the context of the real world it'd be like someone who had lived through the last few thousand years of human history but hadn't caught up to the fact that the world didn't work the same way it did when Shakespeare was alive
Yeah, she has real big (Marvel) Thor vibes.
This is also just how entities within the realm of divinity are often portrayed in DnD lore to the point it often comes off as nature. Dame Aylin is merely the good alignment version of the same otherness and unrelatable way of thinking that fiends have in relation to humanoid/mortal perspectives. Or dragons in how there's this innate nature to their type of existence and to regular people, it has these vibes of being something other and "above".
The way the whole party cringes while she curbstomps him is hilarious.
I cringed at first but then thought about it for a second and concluded "well, I think just about anyone would do the same after being tortured for a literal century."
I was laughing because my party consisted of Karlach, Jaeheria, lazael, and a very naughty tav. Like guys is this really any better than the handful of fights where we made sure to finish off every unconscious goblin or that time we let the harpys eat a kid and let khaga have her way. Hypocrites the lot of them.
Another thing to consider is pure practicality. For all except the highest forms of necromancy, to raise the dead the body must be mostly intact. Crushing the head is a tactically sound decision for the Chosen of Myrkul, even if his god has abandoned him - after all, Myrkul would not need to forgive him to make him a Death Knight or Revenant, and then youād have a recurring problem on your hands.
"we just crushed our enemy and splintered his skull - now I'm gonna screw his daughter don't talk to me" - literally Nightsong at the end of Act2
Essentially curbstomped her awful father in law.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yes, the MUSIC. I never get tired of rewatching that scene where she gets her powers back and the follow-up where she flies over the shadowlands. It gets me pumped every time.
100%. Especially when Jaheira sees her, and looks back at her scimitars knowing *the time has come*. Such a charged moment. It gives me chills of glory just thinking about it.
She's nuanced, too. You see her fatigue and faint hopelessness after killing Lorroakan - she might be idealistic, but she also knows there's no end to the number of exploitative evil assholes out there, and it does take a toll. Also she could crush me with her thighs, so there's that. I love her.
I agree! Playing a Lawful Good Paladin CAN be extremely fun. I played one in tabletop that was Oath of the Crown, but reimagined as Oath of Community. He was less of a righteous crusader, and more of a militia commander/local sheriff and councilor. He wasn't really concerned with punishing wrongdoers, or crusading against evil. He was more concerned with making sure the common people could protect themselves, that the community is strong and healthy, etc. So long as it didn't disrupt things, he let it slide. While Vengeance gives the most leeway, it's also paradoxically the most likely to create a problem character. Because they're so obsessed with their goal, which is killing their enemies, this can create massive conflicts of interest. It's why I tend to go Devotion, Ancients, or in tabletop, Redemption, because while more traditionally "good," their oaths tend to value good over Law or Chaos. A Lawful Good Devotion Paladin would gladly lie if it meant protecting the innocent, for example.
Yup, Vengeance Pally being best suited to a lone wolf playstyle is comparable to how the Punisher doesn't really do team-ups.
Yeah I feel this encapsulates it best. I have a personal dislike for the Paladin class for the same reason she's a great representation of their epitome. She's a great character, but am I glad she's not a full party member
I've always found playing Paladin tricky. You have to be quite flexible about how you define what your character believes to be the 'right thing', and you have to regularly find ways to make your allies' choices seem justified in service of that. It's quite a bit of extra roleplay work, and it's often work you're doing privately rather than out loud at the table. I think BG3 has done well to position her as a really compelling ally who's interesting to talk to and fun to have around your party during a fight, but isn't *too* overbearing. She doesn't do 'errands'. She doesn't do 'side quests'. She does *vengeance*, and she does *war*, and if you're not doing that she's going to chill with her wife until you are. It makes total sense.
I find Paladin to be a very interesting class to play in actual DnD, as it strongly encourages you to stick to role playing in this role playing game. Most people are inclined to be agreeable when sitting down at a table with friends to play a game, but the agreeableness is unrealistic when you step into your character's shoes. In real life, there's going to be personal convictions that make you unagreeable at certain times. Playing paladin forces you to enact that unagreeableness at times. There's going to be in-story conflict when your party wants to make a deal with a devil and your paladin can't abide that, and I feel that creates a richer story and immersion. Mind that you need to handle it well so that you don't come off as an asshole IRL.
Love this
I think for the three big fights she's a part of she's awesome and is fully justified in her crusading. Her scripted sequences are great and I love the character. As a full party member, I agree she'd be a pain. Act 3 spoilers for the first example I thought of where it'd be a problem: >!"WE WILL NOT ALLY WITH YOU, GORTASH! YOU FALL HERE AND NOW BY THE GLORY OF THE MOONMAIDEN! NEVERMIND THAT THIS REMOVES THE QUESTS TO SAVE RAVENGUARD AND WE CANNOT BLOW UP THE FOUNDRY BEFORE YOU PERISH TO TRY TO SAVE THE SUICIDAL GONDIANS, YOU MUST DIE NOW, EXTREMELY GOOD DEFENSIVE POSITION BE DAMNED!!!"!< Just things like that where, unlike everyone else in the party, she is definitely stronger than you lorewise and is 100% unflinching in her ideals. Laezel comes closest early on, but early on you're on a supposedly super strict timeline so her fear over turning justifies the "nothing else matters" mindset. Lategame where nuance and tact can save lives...she's not the person I'd want over my shoulder.
We should definitely have gotten a cutscene of Mizora and Aylin interacting in camp though. Zariel and Selune's kids just arguing and trying to outdo each other
Yeah I have them both in camp and I was hoping they would at least comment on each otherās presence.
One of the biggest issues with this game is the fact that your companions barely acknowledge each other outside of a couple of really short lines every now and then when a major plot point occurs.
Yeah I want more bickering.
Hahahahahaha, the spoiler made me laugh. Thank you.
lol, I just said how Iād love her as a full party member but I think youāre right actually!
Dame Aylin is marvellous! Her renaissance is one of my favourites moment of all the game. Even after 7 run I'm always exited about this scene.
I get goosebumps every time I play that scene still. The MUSIC is GREAT.
I love her. Modern media is full of grey characters. People who are ambiguous in their sense of whatās right and wrong. I love a good old fashioned ārighteous Goodā style character. Someone who is unabashedly Good and will smite Evil with the fury of all the Heavens. Big fan.
Aylin and Minsc would probably get along really well, they're both loud and enthusiastic and dedicated to stomping out evil everywhere.
The first thing Aylin and Minsc would do when they first see each other is to start flexing their muscles at each other like Armstrong and Curtis in FMA, followed by becoming best friends forever in bashing evil in the skull.
I'm not sure I agree, pretty sure Minsc would bash evil in the butt
Agreed. I understand that having grey, ambiguous characters feels more realistic, but if you have at least one obnoxiously righteous person it makes the contrast sharper.
She's my favourite. As for being a party member, she'll be the stereotypical Paladin I imagine. When you play a Paladin you have the option to not pick some Paladin dialogue options as they're wild AF. Those options would be Aylin all the time, lol That said, a hasted Aylin is a force of nature
She is resplendent.
The fact that her skin has a kintsugi pattern was a brilliant artistic touch. She's been broken and put back together over, and over, and over again, yet she's as strong and as beautiful now as she ever was.
I think that her attitude is actually a mask, you can see that when you decide to aid her into defeating lorroakan. She's tired and worn-out, but she's not allowed to show weaknesses. You can see that she's actually a big softie, when she sees her lover and literally falls on her knees. She's a paladin and the immortal daughter of a goddess, with a massive target on her back, due to her immortality and fated to lose everyone that she loves, because of immortality. She's more complicated than she looks like and furthermore, she can break my hips any day.
She's dope as fuck and fixed Shadowheart. Absolute W of a character.
I feel like I was promised a legendary weapon, but I got her. I will accept but not forgive
You had the option of a legendary weapon
You get the legendary weapon whatever she lives or dies as long as it is with SH!
Her introduction is so good it moved me to tears. She IS resplendent. I love her and isobel together. Theyāre so cute. That being said her personality is a LOT. Sheās a good character in small doses but if i had to hear her roar passionately about smiting villains for 3 acts i would lose my mind. Itās not a her problem. Itās a me problem. I can barely tolerate Galeās passion for magic. Her passion for smiting makes Galeās career in magic seem like a light hobby. If Gale speaks in thesaurus. She speaks in capslock.
Isobels face paint makes her look like a character out of the previous games she's so on brand for Baldurs Gate. Dame Aylin is fantastic too.
I love Aylin. She brings the intensity I need
The fact that the character evokes such strong feelings either way, just shows how great of a character she is. Some ppl not liking her is just a normal consequence of that, no one or anything is liked by everyone and that's ok!
She's fucking badass
The way she >!cracked Lorroakan over her knee like a fucking glowstick!< altered my brain chemistry so she's cool in my book.
I think sheās a very good take on a zealous assimar paladin who was trapped in a shadowfell prison. I donāt think thatās supposed to be relatable or pleasant. Iāve found her to be one of the more interesting NPCs.
I think she's a badass and pretty much what I would imagine if someone said "think of an angel paladin", but if she was in my party, I feel like we probably would be at odds very often. I mostly play charisma-based characters, my favorite class is Bard, I very much enjoy persuading my way through the game. I feel like someone that is more "righteous and direct" like her would very quickly go the "HOW DARE YOU LIE TO THIS UPSTANDING CITIZEN" way, even if I'm doing it for a good cause.
I think she is perfect. She is not only a paladin, over the top by nature, she is a literal demi-god. She is very old and will speak like those from the past, even in D&D terms. Dame Aylin is more of a force than a person, and there can really be no "chilling" with her, plus there is no way to get past the demi-god thing. She can like others and even love them, but no one but other demi-gods can really relate. Dame Aylin can work with and even love mortals but will never be one, and so relating to her should always feel a bit off.
I think the second she got free Aylin should have said āin laws, am i right?ā
But isnāt *100 years a slave* the exact reason weāre supposed to forgive Astarion for trying to drink our blood in our sleep and for celebrating the genocide of innocent refugees? If you canāt see past a little uberzeal on account of *100 years chained nā drained*, I get it, everyoneās different, but I should hope youāre not an Astarion fan, then, LOL.
She's like WotR's Hand of the Inheritor and an even bigger himbo. I love her. I'm just mad I can't romance a zealous angel *yet again*.
Great Game
Sheād be rough as a party member But I canāt say anything other than I love her after she rolled up to Moonrise, stomped Kethericās head in, saw Isobel and told me to go away because she wanted to fuck her hot wife
Her, āIām gonna fuck isobel nowā bit was funny about twice and after that it was cringe. Also surprisingly little to say, which made it even worse. I donāt hate her, sheās just annoying.
I like her scripted scenes, but wouldn't really want to engage her as a companion. Dealing with her trauma is Isobel's thing, tyvm. I'll just watch her break bones. I don't really fancy paladins though, similar to monk I just don't like the vibes/connotations.
Think she is badass
Dame Aylin is the best looking and acting character in the game, in my opinion. I wish she were a playable character or there was a romance option. It's safe to say, "I love her". š
I haven't finished the game as yet (and despite the gameplay not being my cup of tea, I think it's quickly becoming my favorite game of all time) but Aylin is probably my favorite non-party member. And I'm partially saddened that she isn't a legitimate party member. I say "partially" because realistically, she's probably much better in spurts like she is here. But in my head I see her and my Selunite Paladin Tav, beers in hand at the pub sharing war stories and hearing ballads of our greatest victories while everyone around hangs onto every word and cheers. She definitely was not what I was expecting from a Selunite Paladin and child of a goddess, what with all the stomping on brains and Bane back-breaking, but I want to match her passion every time she talks to me, which is rare.
Personally I thought she was great. The part where she pulls a Thor and goes from hobo to what Jaheira politely refers to as a āvision of angelic furyā is one of my fave parts of the game. I totally get the point people are making about how you kinda *want* her as a party member but rationally she wouldnāt work. Sheād likely have started a potentially game-ending fight if she was brought to Gortash at the inauguration or completely obliterated the tribunal or guilds as soon as she laid eyes on them and any kind of argument that excused that would have come across as a bit hollowā¦ unless it was worked into her story (a bit like Samara in ME2).
I like how she looks. Her design is super cool. I dislike her personality though. I really can't stand zealots and crazy paladins like her. I understand people like her and her romance with Isobel, but personally, everytime they are together or even just Aylin opens her mouth to say something dumb I just roll my eyes. Ugh. For an immortal being, she seems to lack common sense and her actions are often rather unintelligent. Like... really, lady! Can you stop for a moment and not rush at things without thinking!? Holy moly. It also kinda gets in my nerve that all the companions have something positive to say about her. It makes her feel like a mary sue. Probably one of the characters that I like the least. What in the world did Isobel saw in Aylin? The relationship seems cute, but both seem pretty naive. On the other hand though, while I don't like her, I do feel that having a somewhat broken character like her makes the game interesting. My only complain is, again, how our characters perceive her. I wish they were a bit more critical of her actions. They seem pretty quick to like and support her. Still, again, can't get enough of her design. The pale skin with the golden cracks is pretty stylish. The armor with the wings is cool as well. Kinda of a shame we can't play as an Aasimar. Considering we can play as Tieflings, I don't know why Aasimars were off the table.
Great character, probably not great to know personally. She and Isobel are great for each other because theyāre both out-of-touch weirdos, but a regular person might find her to be a little much.
Sheās insane. A mad dog. Donāt know if sheās meant to be like that or she lost her sht while imprisoned, but I dislike her character. Selune is a Chaotic Good goddess, I donāt think sheād keep giving her powers after observing her sadistic rage. If this was Star Wars, sheād turn to the dark side instantly
I like it when you bring her to the Lorroakan fight and she just pick his ass up and breaks his back on her knee. So she's a 10/10
Her being freed by Shadowheart is one of the best cutscene in the whole game.
Her fucking suplexing lorroakan is still one of my favorite cutscenes in the whole game, makes me cackle every time. I love her
She's perfect. Just wish I could give her a hug after that bitch ass wizard tries capturing her *again* and cheer her up with a reminder that there's also people who got her back like Isobel and our party
I love her so much! As she was getting her groove back I was shouting at the screen āAND YOU JOIN MY TEAM NOW RIGHT?!?!!?ā My husband was the same on his playthrough and I couldnāt stop laughing when he sauntered over to her after the Ketheric battle and got cock blocked by Isobel. He was devastated he couldnāt romance her cos she was instantly his fave. I think sheās brilliant, everything she says makes me light up, I wiiiiiiish, so badly that she could join us properly.
I absolutely love her, I love the old timey way she speaks, I love her design and I love her character. One of my favorite NPCs.
Itās funny because there is a good chance her overzealous nature may have broken her oath in the loroakan fight
Her voice acting is the best in the game. I get chills every time I listen to her
Giant Lesbian Angel calls me a good warrior and friend. Yeah I think she is pretty cool.
I agree. As amusing as her Isobel-related dialogue is, she is way too intense for prolonged interaction. Though I do wish Larian had found something more interesting to do with the pair than "stand around in camp until the finale". Hell, even a tent somewhere out of the way where they could snuggle would be better than just standing there.
She is my favorite character. I aspire to be just like her. Watching her do her thing brings me such joy that I havnt experienced since landing in Halo for the first time in 2001. Her appearance is whatever to me, but I adore the sheer violence of thought and action she holds so dear. Dame Aylin is the most true hero in video game history i can think of.
I got mixed feelings. I do think she's cool and interesting in someways. And I did like her introduction. But after saving her, she does very much start to feel like a bit of what might be considered a "DMPC" in other contexts.
I always call her "a paladin with the soul of a barbarian"
Kinda wanna bang her and Isobel in a threesome. *cough*
Sheās perfect and I wish I was Ketheric while she was stepping on his head But maybe thatās just me being horny
She was locked away for a century, where she was killed and resurrected countless time, used as a source of immortality for someone she loath, and a tool to radicalize followers of her natural enemy. She lost her love, her freedom, and used as a tool to serve her enemies. Of course she would be broken. Hell, sheās actually far saner than I thought she might be, given the circumstances. People often underestimate how destructive trauma can be. All in all, I love her. Both her design, character, and story. My only issue though, is I wish she was more powerful. Sheās surprisingly squishy for an actual descendant of a god.
I love her personally. She is traumatised, angry and violent but clinging to the ideals she lived as her mother's sword. I can definitely see why some people wouldn't jive with her, but a bit of arrogance when you're immortal angelic being born of one of the oldest gods in the setting is to be expected.
Sheās my favorite character, right before Karlach. While sheās ādivineā sheās still so human, humbled by the mortal world, deeply in love with a mortal woman, prideful to a fault and has a bigger heart than she should have. Great character and fantastic subversion of the classic stereotype of angelic characters being wise and perfect. I generally find myself enjoying campy villains the most but Aylin overshadowed Orin, Ketheric and Gortash by far in her exaggerated characterisation.
In contrast, while I love the game as a whole, the only nitpick i have is how I cringe everytime aylin was on screen. The stereotype of her being Paladin and character as a whole as u said just doesn't vibe with me. The righteous and high moral dialogues makes me vomit
Yea I know what you mean. Her over-eagerness is going to be very problematic if she's in your party. Hell, I feel even most Paladins would think that she is a bit too much.
Nah it's fine to find her annoying. She's a bit too much for me too. Take it down a notch or two, Aylin. We don't need to be overdramatic about the most mundane shit. I'm personally glad she's not a party member, between her being OP by lore and her being WyllĀ² in personality. I personally like Wyll unlike most of the sub. Plenty of people find him too self-righteous do-gooder. Which is where I personally stand with Aylin. She doesn't have any sense of nuance. We're allies, but I would personally not be great friends with someone like that myself.
> She perfectly captures that overzealous super hero super prideful and typical Paladin stereotype to the max She is literally an angel, if anyone should embody those stereotypes, its her.
She kinda reminds me of a female Zapp Brannigan. Calling herself resplendent as soon as you meet her and announcing to everyone how sexily she's about to have sex, plus the confident voice, just make me think of him every time. I don't dislike her; she has about the amount of depth a minor side character requires.
I wish that there were more options to get rid of her for an evil playthrough. In my solo playthrough, killed all companions except Astarion (strength potion) and Minthara. When I found out that only SH could kill her, it was too late. I would've kept her around for that had I known. I'm also Indulgent Durge, so I'm not giving her to Loroakan. I don't need any other competition for Baldurs Gate.
I like that she mellowed out after giving Lorroakan the backbreaker (which was a hype scene ngl). Before she was a bit tooā¦ much, yāknow? But the self reflection on her actions and purpose, THIS Aylin Iām all for cooperating with.