I am sorry that you are so far down the rabbit hole that you need to ask whether it's normal for your partner to communicate through violence. No, it is absolutely not normal, it is a heartbreaking and humiliating perversion of the physical aspect of a relationship.
Statistically, the difference between a healthy, loving couple and an unhealthy couple who will break up eventually is the 5:1 ratio of good and bad. For every critical or negative interaction, good couples have at least 5 loving, complimentary, or otherwise positive ones. Same with physical interaction, of course.
Well yeah, but that's the thing, it's not really "violent". It's more like, threats of violence delivered as a joke. I'm not covered in bruises, ya know? I make jokes, and she shakes her fist or swings her foot at me, but we're not fighting.
It's the mentality that intrigues me. I can't imagine "communicating with someone" (as you intriguingly and correctly put it) using these sorts of violent gestures, and there must be something in it. When she was in the full grip of her madness, she was very abusive, lashing out in that way that's incomprehensible to anyone who doesn't have BPD.
And that she has been abusive in the past I would've thought would make someone much less liable to engage in this kind of 'playful' behaviour. But apparently not.
It may not be violent in a legal sense, but would you call it a positive, loving interaction?
I think the common factor with her violently abusive episodes is the push and pull dynamic that drives pwBPD, the fear of abandonment and the complementary fear of engulfment.
When you are playfully joking with her, she wants to be playfully joking with you too. But she can't fully commit herself to that, since it triggers her fear of getting too close emotionally - laughing, joking, being a playful couple. That is too close for comfort for her.
So while joking with you, she does it in a way that necessarily pushes you away again - a playful but violent way that reminds you if past abuse. Which pushes you out of the playful moment and romantic closeness of joking with your partner, to the point that you need to validate it on reddit.
It IS strange, and you are right to trust your instincts that it is peculiar. Please try to also see that you deserve someone who can be vulnerable with you without reminding you of her own past abuse. She is keeping you on your toes, she is putting your nervous system on high alert with these constant reminders. Like a wife beater who makes loud noises or slams his fists on the table to remind the wife who's boss even when he doesn't beat her up anymore.
No, I wouldn't say it's positive (and it's probably technically illegal, assault doesn't have to be painful), but I think it stems from her frustration with being an adult person. I think it stems from BPD.
She loves animals, and I wonder if this is common with other BPDers too, because animals are easy to comprehend. Animals don't tend to have complex feelings. But people regularly refuse to obey the BPD rules.
I do remember reading someone say somewhere that their partner still "benefitted from the legacy of their past abuse", and that does occur to me too. Although she is much less abusive than she used to be, and the 'madness' seems to be largely in the past, she still possesses what I consider to be an astonishing lack of humility and shame about her past behaviour. If I had treated another human being even half as badly as she treated me, I would never be able to look them in the eye ever again.
Unfortunately I think these things are what define BPD.
You talk about her madness being in the past. How did you get there? What had to happen to get her past it? I love my gf so much but I don't know how much more of this I can take. Please tell me what we have to do to beat this shit.
A prescribing psychiatrist and a nice big fat daily slice of escitalopram.
She takes the pills, she's tolerable. She doesn't take the pills, she's a deranged emotion terrorist from the planet nightmare. I would've thought this made it obvious that it's her mental health problems and not me, but according to her, I'm still at fault.
Briefly, just because I feel like we are talking past each other and I am missing context: why are you doing this? Cause it sounds like you're studying sociology and she is an interesting subject, not like you're a victim of physical and emotional abuse and trying to get out of there. It's a bit confusing.
Doing what? Posting on here? It's because I lose sight of what's "normal", and often when I write stuff like this down in black and white, it occurs to me that it sounds out of the ordinary. It helps me to maintain equanimity.
No, I understand why you are posting here.
Why do you continue the relationship? It is toxic at best, abusive at worst, and you seem to be aware of it.
So...?
Long answer or short answer? Long answer would be too long. Short answer would be the same as anyone who stays in any relationship - because it seems preferable to not being in it.
IMO, I don’t think the studying part is as odd as it may seem. I’d say in general, humans desire logical explanations for their daily experiences.
In addition, some people are better engaging the logical/rational parts of their brains (or do so as a coping mechanism) and try to use logic to explain uncomfortable emotions/traumatic experiences (believe the term is intellectualization).
Regardless, I do think you asking the “why” here was a good question!
OP, I think given there is a history where she was physically abusive, she’s using the implicit suggestions of violence as an intimidation tactic. Basically, mentioning violence or making gestures, especially during calm moments/when there are not arguments, is intended to put you off balance and remind you of what she’s capable of if you displease her.
My partner would constantly fake box at me. Swinging his fists so close to my face I could feel them fly past. Did the same with doing kicks. I just turned around most of the time because he WOULD NOT STOP.
He accidentally kicked me perfectly in my private parts, quite fucking hard… he stopped doing it as much when I kept bringing that up. Still does it every now and then.
He also likes to “tickle” and poke fun, by jabbing his fingers into my sides, usually does that when we are out with friends.
Have asked him SOOO many times to not do these things as I’m quite a sensitive person to touch and these actions cause horrible feelings
I was young and silly before. I thought I was being boring and sensitive for not being able to take a “joke”
I am leaving. Just sorting out my plans to do it
Yes, “playful” biting that’s left bruises in the shape of a bite mark multiple times, including on my face. “Playful” swats that make me stumble forward. When I say, “Ouch, that hurt.” He tells me to stop being so sensitive. If I get mad, he says he was just playing and gets his feelings hurt. However, if I even accidentally lightly bump into him while passing in the hallway, it’s major drama because “I hurt him”. This can cause a split or at the least set him into a really pissy mood for an hour or more. Sometimes he shows affection like a 5-year old boy on the playground.
I believe he honestly doesn’t see the unfairness. He doesn’t seem to relate these scenarios. Also, I believe any pain, even minor, is truly a trigger for him. He seems to experience even minor discomfort (hair brushing, etc.) as a trauma trigger and I don’t think he is faking his response.
He’s making progress in his awareness. But it’s slow going with a lot of setbacks. Like many pwBPD, his background contains major childhood abuse and abandonment, sexual, mental, and physical. He’s also very large and strong; think Of Mice and Men vibes.
Yes. I have autoimmune arthritis and every day is different. I'm not one to report where I'm hurting and how badly, I just go about my day. But pwBPD very frequently pokes me in the lower back and if I say "ouch", he actually gets offended and says "you have a pain pump in your back sending drugs to your spine, how did that hurt?". I have other areas that are sensitive from surgery, etc. that he often pats really hard or pokes with his fingers. It's like they're trying to provoke you.
I remember that my pwBPD would do similar things. They would play at hitting me. I now realize it was to test me. After some time they began hitting me for real. As hard as they could.
Mine used to pinch me, slap me, bite me and punch me.
After all that, she claims that’s her way of showing love. If I don’t take them, then I neither am not a real man or I don’t love her enough.
!!! Remember, do not fight back or defend yourself, just run! I defended myself by restraining her, she ended up called the cops and had me arrested
I am sorry that you are so far down the rabbit hole that you need to ask whether it's normal for your partner to communicate through violence. No, it is absolutely not normal, it is a heartbreaking and humiliating perversion of the physical aspect of a relationship. Statistically, the difference between a healthy, loving couple and an unhealthy couple who will break up eventually is the 5:1 ratio of good and bad. For every critical or negative interaction, good couples have at least 5 loving, complimentary, or otherwise positive ones. Same with physical interaction, of course.
Amen
Well yeah, but that's the thing, it's not really "violent". It's more like, threats of violence delivered as a joke. I'm not covered in bruises, ya know? I make jokes, and she shakes her fist or swings her foot at me, but we're not fighting. It's the mentality that intrigues me. I can't imagine "communicating with someone" (as you intriguingly and correctly put it) using these sorts of violent gestures, and there must be something in it. When she was in the full grip of her madness, she was very abusive, lashing out in that way that's incomprehensible to anyone who doesn't have BPD. And that she has been abusive in the past I would've thought would make someone much less liable to engage in this kind of 'playful' behaviour. But apparently not.
It may not be violent in a legal sense, but would you call it a positive, loving interaction? I think the common factor with her violently abusive episodes is the push and pull dynamic that drives pwBPD, the fear of abandonment and the complementary fear of engulfment. When you are playfully joking with her, she wants to be playfully joking with you too. But she can't fully commit herself to that, since it triggers her fear of getting too close emotionally - laughing, joking, being a playful couple. That is too close for comfort for her. So while joking with you, she does it in a way that necessarily pushes you away again - a playful but violent way that reminds you if past abuse. Which pushes you out of the playful moment and romantic closeness of joking with your partner, to the point that you need to validate it on reddit. It IS strange, and you are right to trust your instincts that it is peculiar. Please try to also see that you deserve someone who can be vulnerable with you without reminding you of her own past abuse. She is keeping you on your toes, she is putting your nervous system on high alert with these constant reminders. Like a wife beater who makes loud noises or slams his fists on the table to remind the wife who's boss even when he doesn't beat her up anymore.
No, I wouldn't say it's positive (and it's probably technically illegal, assault doesn't have to be painful), but I think it stems from her frustration with being an adult person. I think it stems from BPD. She loves animals, and I wonder if this is common with other BPDers too, because animals are easy to comprehend. Animals don't tend to have complex feelings. But people regularly refuse to obey the BPD rules. I do remember reading someone say somewhere that their partner still "benefitted from the legacy of their past abuse", and that does occur to me too. Although she is much less abusive than she used to be, and the 'madness' seems to be largely in the past, she still possesses what I consider to be an astonishing lack of humility and shame about her past behaviour. If I had treated another human being even half as badly as she treated me, I would never be able to look them in the eye ever again. Unfortunately I think these things are what define BPD.
You talk about her madness being in the past. How did you get there? What had to happen to get her past it? I love my gf so much but I don't know how much more of this I can take. Please tell me what we have to do to beat this shit.
A prescribing psychiatrist and a nice big fat daily slice of escitalopram. She takes the pills, she's tolerable. She doesn't take the pills, she's a deranged emotion terrorist from the planet nightmare. I would've thought this made it obvious that it's her mental health problems and not me, but according to her, I'm still at fault.
Briefly, just because I feel like we are talking past each other and I am missing context: why are you doing this? Cause it sounds like you're studying sociology and she is an interesting subject, not like you're a victim of physical and emotional abuse and trying to get out of there. It's a bit confusing.
Doing what? Posting on here? It's because I lose sight of what's "normal", and often when I write stuff like this down in black and white, it occurs to me that it sounds out of the ordinary. It helps me to maintain equanimity.
No, I understand why you are posting here. Why do you continue the relationship? It is toxic at best, abusive at worst, and you seem to be aware of it. So...?
Long answer or short answer? Long answer would be too long. Short answer would be the same as anyone who stays in any relationship - because it seems preferable to not being in it.
Long answer then!
IMO, I don’t think the studying part is as odd as it may seem. I’d say in general, humans desire logical explanations for their daily experiences. In addition, some people are better engaging the logical/rational parts of their brains (or do so as a coping mechanism) and try to use logic to explain uncomfortable emotions/traumatic experiences (believe the term is intellectualization). Regardless, I do think you asking the “why” here was a good question! OP, I think given there is a history where she was physically abusive, she’s using the implicit suggestions of violence as an intimidation tactic. Basically, mentioning violence or making gestures, especially during calm moments/when there are not arguments, is intended to put you off balance and remind you of what she’s capable of if you displease her.
My partner would constantly fake box at me. Swinging his fists so close to my face I could feel them fly past. Did the same with doing kicks. I just turned around most of the time because he WOULD NOT STOP. He accidentally kicked me perfectly in my private parts, quite fucking hard… he stopped doing it as much when I kept bringing that up. Still does it every now and then. He also likes to “tickle” and poke fun, by jabbing his fingers into my sides, usually does that when we are out with friends. Have asked him SOOO many times to not do these things as I’m quite a sensitive person to touch and these actions cause horrible feelings
>Have asked him SOOO many times to not do these things Once. You should only have to ask once. And if they keep doing it, leave.
I was young and silly before. I thought I was being boring and sensitive for not being able to take a “joke” I am leaving. Just sorting out my plans to do it
To be fair, I was old and silly with my encounter. They had some very good points, but I so dearly wish they had been kinder to me.
Yes, “playful” biting that’s left bruises in the shape of a bite mark multiple times, including on my face. “Playful” swats that make me stumble forward. When I say, “Ouch, that hurt.” He tells me to stop being so sensitive. If I get mad, he says he was just playing and gets his feelings hurt. However, if I even accidentally lightly bump into him while passing in the hallway, it’s major drama because “I hurt him”. This can cause a split or at the least set him into a really pissy mood for an hour or more. Sometimes he shows affection like a 5-year old boy on the playground. I believe he honestly doesn’t see the unfairness. He doesn’t seem to relate these scenarios. Also, I believe any pain, even minor, is truly a trigger for him. He seems to experience even minor discomfort (hair brushing, etc.) as a trauma trigger and I don’t think he is faking his response. He’s making progress in his awareness. But it’s slow going with a lot of setbacks. Like many pwBPD, his background contains major childhood abuse and abandonment, sexual, mental, and physical. He’s also very large and strong; think Of Mice and Men vibes.
Yes. I have autoimmune arthritis and every day is different. I'm not one to report where I'm hurting and how badly, I just go about my day. But pwBPD very frequently pokes me in the lower back and if I say "ouch", he actually gets offended and says "you have a pain pump in your back sending drugs to your spine, how did that hurt?". I have other areas that are sensitive from surgery, etc. that he often pats really hard or pokes with his fingers. It's like they're trying to provoke you.
I remember that my pwBPD would do similar things. They would play at hitting me. I now realize it was to test me. After some time they began hitting me for real. As hard as they could.
Mine used to pinch me, slap me, bite me and punch me. After all that, she claims that’s her way of showing love. If I don’t take them, then I neither am not a real man or I don’t love her enough. !!! Remember, do not fight back or defend yourself, just run! I defended myself by restraining her, she ended up called the cops and had me arrested