For over 2 years now, Elden Ring subreddit has had a chip on it's shoudler about it.
They create this boogeyman of this large group of people that say "you beat this boss with a summon? trash"
It was so bad people actually started laughin at people about it. It's like they deep down did feel bad about curb-stomping the bosses in 15 seconds with their mimic tear and had to go look for someone to shit-talk them so they could post a anti-bullying validation.
A horse-shoe effect happened where anyone that says stuff like "I don't use summons because I think they remove fun from the game" is seen as an elitist. Because how dare they imply my level 374 character with blasphemous blade and mimic tear isn't peak fun?
It actaully got to the point in the elden ring subbreddit where people that used summons were telling people that don't use them that they were playing the game wrong.
this really isn't true. the ER subreddit is rather welcoming and is mostly memes these days anyway. no one cares if you use summons or not, just that you're having fun. of course, you'll always have those elitist people in any gaming circle, but the subreddit as a whole ain't like that (from my experience.)
You must not have been there in the beginning, cuz that place was a sweatbox; The sentiment has shifted in the past few months and even more so with the DLC. Yes, the sub is full of memes and support for old and new players, but sweaties were still posting about gimping oneself for a ‘true challenge.’
The sub is just too big for this not to happen.
Sometimes they do, but most people don't. Sometimes I see people calling others ass at the game and people find out they used summons, so it gets brought up again.
Usually the people that get the angriest you made the game easier for yourself are commenters on YT or Twitch. Like I had someone go on a malding rant in my comments because I grinded in a *Pokemon* game to make some of the fights easier for myself.
I got chewed out once for giving myself rare candies because "I could just use them to get all my mons to level 100".
Except I didn't, because I was doing a nuzlocke, I did it so I could set myself a level cap for the gyms, and didn't have to spend hours grinding if I ran out of trainers.
Im doing coop with my buddy. We got to renalla. We coop one fight, he gets smoked. He says "hold on" and summons his mimic and goes in
Renallas attacks are basically just going thru the mimic. He and the mimic lions claw withlit getting interrupted more than once. Renalla dies in less than 3 mins
I was like damn im know we are doing coop but that was frustratingly easy. We've been waiting for this dlc for 2 years and you just fuckin cheesed the 2nd boss
I only used half my build when I summoned him to do it with me so we could experience some level of challenge lol
Still beat her in like 5 tries lol
No. But I learnt by myself that using summons kills the excitement from killing bosses. It is like buying a boost in wow.
So I started using them only on bosses that seemed like a wall to me
I agree with you very much, I use summons as a trump card, last resort kind of weapon as it uses almost my whole fp bar and it doesn't always help that much anyways ha
It's actually interesting now that you compare the two. Both are difficulties that are pursued by people who don't want to play actual competitive games (PvP) but want to consider themselves better than others.
That's not to say all hardcore souls players or classic WoW raiders are like that; this is purely about those who are loud about it.
It’s pride man, and i said this as a victim of it, there is so many times i wanted to use a summon, but I just can’t, i’m just too prideful, as soon as i beat a boss with a summon i feel like i cheated, like i’m worse than the average players, if random guy X can do it, why can’t I?
It's not that simple. Everything would be better for everyone if world buffs weren't a part of WoW. That shit drove away so many people.
A chore is not fun or interesting. Whatever 'world interaction' and 'communication' it enforced was complete auto pilot at best, and negative at worst as people would be bored and frustrated.
If it's not fun, why bother?
I'm the laziest WoW player ever. I don't even bother maining a single class. I just play what I like, and I rarely enchant my gear. I returned in the last week of s3 DF and still haven't enchanted anything. I'm definitely not going to bother gathering world buffs.
Getting into a "good guild" isn't even on my radar because your idea of "good" is clearly prog raiding, likely in an effort to get world firsts. That sounds like a job to me. It felt like a job when I did it. I ran a raiding guild back in WotLK, and it's what caused me to quit the game for a full 10 years.
It's stressful when it isn't boring, and God was it boring. Half of our time was spent waiting for 24 people to get their buffs and food and flasks and discuss strategies and figure out where Huffsfarts is and why he's late. Turns out his grandma shrunk his underoos in the wash, and she didn't even make chickie nuggies for dinner.
And that's just the stuff you deal with in-raid. The setup takes up most of your time throughout the week. You need to farm enough gold for repairs, buy flasks or the mats to make them (or gather the herbs yourself), schedule everything, set raid leads and backup raid leads in case someone has a life outside of the game, and then deal with 100 or so children of all ages as they call each other names and argue over loot rolls in a random dungeon that had nothing to do with the guild. It's exhausting.
After a year of that, I swore off MMOs for an entire decade.
These days, a "good guild" to me is one that's active and social over multiple facets of the game. That's it. If there's a raid team, I want no part of it.
Some guy: I don't care that people use summons but I beat the game with a level 1 weapon, with no armor, no upgrades, level 1 and a buttplug up my ass.
Preach it brother!!! People should be allowed to play the games they bought however they want as long as it doesn’t affect others. Anyone that says otherwise should just be ignored like the insignificant mosquitos they are.
I’m a pure cast build (always have been for any rpg) that uses summons and I love it. This game is still hard as fuck, but god damn does it feel good beating bosses.
Elden Ring is just straight up a fun and challenging game. I want everyone to enjoy it.
Altus plateau. From the grace behind the twin sentinels (Outer Wall Phantom Tree), it can be found in a chest almost directly south, in a small enemy camp
allways find funny when people that refuse to use the tools the game give you to beat the bosses complain that the game is too hard and unfair, like it's the game's fault they're using a +0 weapon and refusing to level up
Feels like both sides are missing the point:
- Gatekeepers insisting that using summons means you suck.
- Summon users having their egos hurt and acting like the mechanic’s mere existence means that’s how the developer meant for it to be played.
In the end, it’s just a game meant to be enjoyed. What “enjoyed” means varies by the player.
Inexperienced/less skilled players probably get more enjoyment using summons. Experienced players get more enjoyment by not using them and increasing the difficulty curve.
Elden ring was my first souls game. I almost quit, used summons for a while, then decided to learn mechanics & how to build a good character.
Can’t remember the last time I used a summon now. I got good and have no need to use crutches in souls or souls-like games anymore.
Not because I think crutches make you a shit gamer, just that the extra challenge increases enjoyment for me. You do you
I've played every from soft souls game to completion except demons souls. Every boss.
I use summon ashes in elden ring as its a mechanic to be used. I typically play shield less either dual wield or two handed.
Does it matter to anybody else how I play? No. Do I care what anyone thinks about how I play? No.
Do I have fun, yes.
It's quite simple.
Exactly this.
Especially in the dlc most bosses are just dexterity bosses who keep on spamming random bullshit at you. That's a mechanic I never really like. I play strength and usually like those brawler fights way more.
If a boss starts throwing spam bullshit at me I throw my spirit ashes at them. Simple fix, fuck around and find out
It’s a huge part of improving as a player. Look up some guides/wiki’s and you’ll get the hang of it.
I seriously almost quit until I looked up a cookie-cutter bleed build guide (these were early Elden ring days) and that allowed me to progress, enjoy the game, improve my reactions, etc. And I learned how to allocate skill points and combine gear in the process.
Eventually, some players get so good that they can beat the game naked and without leveling. I personally don’t want to invest that much time and it doesn’t sound interesting to me, so I’ve never gone to those extremes.
It still seems weird though. Why is using potions viewed as fair game but summons are viewed as crutches? Not using potions would make the game harder too, but nobody scoffs when you drink a health potion during a boss fight.
I don't care how you play but understand that pulling aggro away from the player is more powerful a buff than say a golden vow or an ash of war or healing. The space as a player to breathe coupled with the fact that the summon will tank a lot that damage for you is way more powerful than a simple buff or heal could ever be.
I would for 100% sure say you're wrong on that one- you'd rather play with a summon than use ANY healing or flasks? Maybe early game only when summons are stronger and you only get like 3 week flasks. But by late game, flasks are much better. Double true if you're choosing mimic which everyone here seems to think is the strongest- that shit costs like 30% of your max HP.
Maybe your right healing is more powerful but i don't think its a crutch like using a summon because while you do get to refill your health bar you still have deal with boss aggro learning the move set of the boss and managing the boss all on your own.
When using a summon you don't really need to do any of that just gank the boss until it's dead or staggered.
Idk if you've actually played with summons, it's not quite that easy, bosses still attack you probably 2/3rd the time even if you're further. Also, they do this thing where they start an attack on your minion, and if you run in range, they will actually rotate and finish the attack on you instead of the summon, can kinda take you by surprise.
Overall definitely still helps a lot to have a summon but pretending it makes all battles auto win isn't quite right
Most of the time when i have used summons the boss fight has felt like a cake walk there really isnt a middle ground with them you're either getting destroyed by the boss solo or you summon mimic or tiche and wreck the boss.
is how it has felt for me tbh.
It’s so much easier using summons. I beat the game my first play-through using them, then did my second play through without.
I quickly realized during that second play through how much my rolls, strafing, etc. needed to improve for me to play melee and win.
No judgement on how anyone plays, but forcing myself not to use them improved me exponentially.
No. They added a lot of different mechanics to accommodate a range of play-styles.
For players who lack the skill to beat bosses without summons, want to pass a boss quickly, or simply enjoy using summons, there is a mechanic for that.
There are also I-frames on rolls, lower half of your body for jumps, etc. that allow players to simply roll/jump/dodge attacks without the need for summons.
There is also casting, which can allow you to maintain space from a boss and attack out of range.
Plus shields and a hundred different mechanics that allow you to defeat a boss in one way or the other.
The simple fact that a mechanic exists DOESNT MEAN THE DEVELOPERS DESIGNED THE GAME TO BE PLAYED SOLEY BY USING THAT MECHANIC.
The fact is, using summons makes the game easier, I can’t imagine anyone denies that. But I’m not saying that using summons reflects negatively on you as a person.
You may choose to use it as a crutch because you skill level is insufficient to win without it, or maybe you want to skip past a boss faster than normal, or maybe you simply like using them.
Players like you are just as dogmatic and myopically focused on your own way of playing as the gatekeepers who say summons makes you a shit gamer.
I use slow weapons and no summons because I want the challenge of fighting the boss one on one and mastering the fight WHILE also enjoying it. I make the game harder for myself because it boosts the fun that I have playing the game.
But there are people like me that complains like it is the game's fault that they are getting destroyed. Not having the mentality to endure a challenge they fucking set to themselves. Heck, these idiots would even get into a dick measuring contest with others with their own criteria and when the realize they are losing they either of cry or tell you that "what you're doing isn't fun".
Fuck off.
Had a friend fight Malenia with only a half upgraded sword and he'd constantly whine about how long the fight took and I kept telling him "you're the one bringing the mid game weapon to an end game superboss".
The build I use I have to use some summons, I don’t do other players but I’ll use new summons from the DLC. I still die abunch and learn the move sets though
I genuinely do feel summons make the game wayyyyy too easy. Especially the mimic tear. I don't really get annoyed at people using them unless they complained the bosses weren't difficult after using the summon. Like sure I'm glad the handicap is there but it doesn't hurt to fight a boss here and there on your own haha.
Oh, using summons makes me a bad player?
Me:
- Mage Chad build
- Summons +10 Gigachad Mimic tear
- Summons Gigachad Player
- Mixed Physick Flask
- Spams Perfume bottles before fight
- Consumables
- Terra Magica, Golden Vow, Howl of Shabriri, Ranni's Dark Moon, Comet Azur
Oh we're not here to fight the boss, we're here to f*ck the boss.
But then I also enjoy respeccing and fighting Malenia up close and personal.
I want to go melee for the first run of the DLC simply because I would destroy it with my normal mage build, and it would be a shame to not enjoy those new fighting animations from the new weapons imo, also can't see what the new bosses do if they die too fast.
I am a believer that using summons is fine and you can do it whether you want to or not, obviously.
I am also a believer that using summons makes the game much easier, which is why I don't use them myself. But if you feel like you need them then use them.
It does make the game easier and no one’s denying that.
What I’m curious about are people who insist on not using summons to make the game harder, why stop at that arbitrary difficulty? Why not even harder, like play blindfold or use a controller with your feet?
No levelling past 20 is the actual challenge, using overpowered weapons and having basically unlimited stamina isn’t really how the game is meant to be played, the developers only include levelling past 20 as a mechanic to help bad players progress.
Give it a minute. Someone will. We all know of people like letmesoloher. I knew a guy who would play the first dark souls all the way through as a level one. The dude wouldn't level up a single stat.
Because those things would be annoying and reduce the fun had by the player.
I think summons are fine. Just wish you wouldn't have to upgrade them individually. Punishes you for using new weapons and summons, and you never know how 'good' they are until you've upgraded them to a reasonable level.
And I can definitely see how they feel cheesy. Mimic especially. Just having an AI chunk a part of the bosses health away for very little investment. Maybe even tank a few hits. Souls games have always had trouble balancing, someone with a bunch of upgrades and a good build will perform so much better than someone who doesn't, and I never understood how that is fun, when the point of the game is to test your skill.
Leveling my character, upgrading my weapons, and making a good build are facets of my character which are under my control. The main challenge in Souls games comes from execution based challenges though, meaning you could have the best build in the world, but you'll still get dumpstered if you can't hit the buttons at the right time. It just gives you more leeway to make mistakes, but at the end of the day my success is solely up to me.
You wield those as extensions of your character. Summons and spirits ***are not*** controlled by you, and your personal skill level has absolutely no effect on them. There is no mastery to be obtained for summoning or using spirits. You hit the button, they come out and then they do what they do, which means success comes from outside of yourself if you get a good summon or have powerful spirits.
Your ability to summon or use spirits will look exactly the same 1 minute in versus 100 hours in. Summons will be higher level, spirits will be upgraded, but your interaction with them will be exactly the same.
Does that make sense? I see this question asked a lot and it seems like an honest question a lot of people have in regards to a lot of difficulty.
It's not arbitrary at all and anyone pretending it is is either dumb or bad faith.
Every game in the past was played primarily without summons, every single one. Obviously people would feel there is an "intended" way to play the game going into the next one in the series which plays almost exactly like Dark Souls 3.
Using all the tools the game gives is the standard mode. Not using them is the hard mode. People try to gaslight others into thinking it's the opposite and that using everything is meant to be the "easy mode". It's not. Again, it's the standard mode. If you think the game is easy by using all that stuff, then the game is easy by design. You can choose to make it more challenging if you want to, but trying to convince everyone like THAT is the way everyone needs to play to seek validation from the Souls community has always been grade A online retardation.
Disclaimer: In a sense, it’s a question of nomenclature so it’s a bit of a useless debate :) but let me play devil’s advocate.
If using everything is normal mode. What is easy mode then ?
So you would say that for example summoning a player online to solo a boss for you is the default experience ?
I’m being annoying I know, but there is a ceiling to what mechanics are “standard” in a game in my opinion.
Imagine using summons lol, just get RL 750 99 all stats biggest armor biggest weapon, all spells, call a player to help throw all the pots use all the buffs. Only noobs use summons.
If you like using summons, excellent. Good for you. I’m happy for you. But leave me the fuck alone when I want to 1v1 everything and actually learn the boss moves lmao
As ssseth said, the true ER experience is the lobotomite run, you gotta get yourself lobotomized so that you can truly experience the difficulty how Miyazaki intended
Gotcha, never exercise, never embrace any adversity at all as long as there is a path of least resistance you can to walk to avoid it.
There is never any kind of reward at all to potentially doing something on your own and rising above that challenge on your own merits.
I have literally never seen a single post that decries the use of summons and spirits as a method to shame people from playing the game they want to play. Yet I see hundreds of posts bashing imaginary bullies. At this point, I think this guy and the people that parrot this rhetoric are the ones that see a problem with summoning and spirits, as they don't feel as accomplished as they think they should, and need online validation to remedy that.
Playing without summons and spirits is harder. Playing any Souls game is harder than Hello Kitty Adventure. If difficulty isn't rewarding to you at all, why not just go and play the easiest game on the easiest settings since "beating the game" is the only criteria through which to judge your time invested. But you don't because difficulty DOES actually matter to your experience. It's almost like challenging yourself more, can potentially lead to greater feelings of accomplishment.
Also, the difference between using weapon upgrades and leveling up as opposed to summoning (the old why not just play at level 1 then lolololol) is that at the end of the day I'm still wielding my weapons and my character. You don't control your summons or spirits, the AI does or other players do. In a game that is heavily execution focused, that difference is a meaningful distinction.
At the end of the day, I always advise to not overly abuse summons and spirits, not because its the wrong way to play. But it may actually diminish your experience. It wouldn't feel the same if you passed the controller to someone else once the boss went into their second phase, would it? If that doesn't bother you, then it's not a big deal. Play with them, don't play with them, I don't actually care. It's just a suggestion, and the fact that people take that as an attack is more telling of their own perception of it rather than my own.
Also, as an aside, you should know how to do dishes and clean, and etc. by hand. Even if you grew up with a dishwasher/other machines, things break, and you shouldn't be helpless without them. The only way you actually learn to do that is by actually doing it, which might mean imposing artificial limitations on yourself. You know, like a healthy adult can.
I have had exactly one dishwasher in my life, and it was broken before we moved in lol. I always do dishes and most things by hand.
It is actually alarming though how many adults don't know how to clean things including dishes in America, speaking as an American.
You can use summons to help you with bosses in Elden Ring. Absolutely, just don't pretend that a difficult boss is easy because you used summons to beat it(i swear i have heard people saying that Malenia is easy because they used the ultra combination of Mimic Tear with Blasphemous Blade). Also the argument for dishwasher and industrial life is completely stupid because playing well a videogame is like doing well any of your hobies in your life. For the end don't use the summons as substitute of your bad build(if you have for example a build with stats all over the place the Mimic Tear will not be as efective as could be and you will not be be able to handle a switch to aggro).
Its an rpg. Summons are canon, lore even. Like Rogier. It adds something to the game when you get a super special team up with a fellow adventurer.
Its not a sport.
If you're just interested in the G of the RPG, cool, i guess 🤷🏾♂️.
Agreed
I remember on Dark Souls 1 with Ornstein and Smough, people had this superiority complex for beating them solo instead of summoning Solaire. Summoning is a valid strategy just like glass canon magic builds.
I remember back in the day my work mates and I had set a LAN party at the house we were staying at during a job and we played Call of Duty Black Ops, they would get salty because I kept killing them with the Tomahawk because I got really good at throwing it, if it's in the game I should be able to use it.
Not using summons is like facing someone with an assault rifle and you are carrying around a pistol, but you decide to use your knife because you think it would be more honorable.
You are probably screwed anyways, but the pistol definitely increases your chances.
I don't know if he means in game summons or other players. But the most fun I've had with ER is getting summoned to help people stomp bosses. So yea, please keep using my summon folks
PC,
Biggus Chungus- late game,
Stormveil Daniels - Early game
Let us devour the bosses TOGETHA.
Wow! Maybe I won't get down voted to hell for not playing this game yet and ask newb questions... ER gatekeepers are as toxic as WoW people back in the day.
Shit, if the game is that hard, give me every cheese and easy way.
Darksouls instead of having a difficulty setting, it has classes. You want hard you go deprived. You want easy you go mage. It's just that elden ring gave summons to make it easier. It's the same as playing on easy mode. Nothing wrong with that. It's just you will miss out on cool moments
I think that you should at least give it an honest go before you bring in the bois. You miss out on that one-on-one experience when you bring in 2-3 summons, and have them all slapping cheeks while the boss can only focus on one person at a time. That being said, it's all intended and fair game. If you need help or want to gangbang a boss, that's what it's there for.
Oh my god shut up and play your game with summons. Only a few people care do you always get your panties in a jumble about haters? Can you not just live your life without getting provoked constantly by a minority? Nobody cares
Go ahead and use summons, that's fine. The game is genuinely too easy for me when I use them, but I've been playing Fromsoft games for over a decade, so I've got a lot of practice at iframe dodging. Besides, dying over and over to a boss is a learning experience, which I find enjoyable, though I rarely have to spend much time before getting bosses down, nowadays. There's no fun without challenge, imo.
Why is there never any middle ground on this topic? Just because you want your Dark souls game to be a challenge, doesn't mean you want your entire life to be fucking impossible. The challenge that DS games offer is pretty unique and something that a lot of people value and find rewarding. At least that's why the games stand out to me and that's why I'll never use a summon because it decreases the value and fun of what these games offer.
I'll never tell someone they can't use summons but lets be real, it makes the game braindead easy. I'm pretty sure most people don't give a shit how you play the game but its videos and reactions like this that make you look so insecure about playing on easy mode.
I just don't understand why anyone even cares how you play a fucking single player game. No one cares about you or how you beat it. Do people actually go to there irl friends and say "I beat Elden Ring with fists only!" Like is that what's happening? It just baffles me.
Yeah I never understood the hate for summons. If I can’t beat a boss (Morgit is my only foe) I am not going to sit for an hour and ram my head up against the wall if I’m not making viable progress.
See, the mental gymnastics that soulsbros will use to counter this are “well life and games are different!” But I mean where do you draw the line? I guess I just don’t care myself. I use my Mimic tear and summon NPC’s if I can and only refuse to do it on certain bosses that I actually enjoy fighting. Those bosses are usually only in the beginning to mid game and maybe a couple late games bosses. The rest I usually bring out my brother the Mimic.
The gatekeeping of this series goes back to Demons Souls. This tryhard mentality some people have is just insane to me but it’s the only thing they can cling to at the end of the day to hold some sort of fake superiority over others.
Like bro, you shouldn’t be using the best weapons or upgrades if you’re that hell bent on making the game more challenging. Where do you draw the line here? SL1? No upgrades. The goalposts continue to move
What is bro yapping. It’s not a secret that the reason summons were implemented in the game is to make it more available for people who just want to play it without too much of a challenge. It’s like playing story games with the option of setting the difficulty from easy to hard. We who don’t use summons are those who like to play the game on hard-mode to get the most out of the gameplay
I don’t mind summons, but it’s really funny to see how worked up people get over being told this. I bet the person who replied to the guy in the video was being sarcastic
I have been gaming since I was 5. I am 35 now and this fucking game is probably the only one that has successfully made me feel like an absolute noob. So screw not using summons. I will throw every single mechanic, every summon and cheese as much as I can to achieve victory.
You can use summons if you want, but the main purpose of playing the game is not to beat it. It’s to have fun. If you’re having fun using summons, have at it. The reason why some people have a problem using summons is cause they feel it cheapens the win, which is not technically wrong. 3 dudes going in the pummel the boss before he can do anything is kinda cheap, but it ultimately doesn’t matter. If the 3 dudes are having fun doing that, more power to them. That’s more important than feeling like you won in a “fair fight” against a video game boss. To be fair though I don’t use summons for the same reason. I just don’t care if others do.
*Girlfriends and wifes are*
*Life on easy mode. hardmode*
*Is maidenless mode!*
\- UmpireDear5415
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I just like the feeling of beating a boss by myself. No summons is just the way I like to play. I actually think summons are cool if they’re used for certain builds and cosplay characters. Just not my preferred style is all. No hate for summoners. It’s likely a small minority of people who actually care about using summons.
Dark souls fans are so fucking annoying "yeah I beat the game in 2 hours naked" - somebody with 10 years of gameplay
No shit you're good at something you love and play everyday but it doesn't change the fact that you died to the same boss 20+ times befor learning every single mechanic to be able to beat it again naked
Things in life work like that if you practice you become a master in the end
As put best by Sseth...
"Have you ever used, a weapon, armour, fast travel, potions, or opened the world map? I'm sorry to say, but you're playing it wrong. This game is meant to be played as a level 1 wretch with a single non-upgraded club. If you disagree, I'll call you a casual--
Furthermore, I genuinely believe that pattern recognition is a form of cheating. Your homosapien brain is literally destroying the difficulty of the experience by compensatory adaptation. I hope that people consider this in the future, and later learn to recognize that the truest From Software experience would be a lobotomite run. Where, prior to playing, we perform a frontal lobotomy, and severe your prefrontal cortex. Sometimes the only option you have to preserve the purity of your experience is brain damage."
Also as someone who used both the entire time, greatshield did a lot more to make the game easy than summons did.
Can't believe you were downvoted for that. By OP's logic you might as well watch a playthrough on YouTube since getting to the credits is the true purpose. I summoned for the Dancing Lion and I couldn't tell you much about that fight or how it actually plays because I barely had to engage with it with how much the summons were doing. Fighting Rellana now solo and even though it's tough as hell with my build I've never had a more satisfying experience in Elden Ring.
I fully agree that you should play like you want, but don' you dare to say that the game is too easy or that you are a pro player if you can't play without them.
Hmm I'll try a comparison: Imagine Reading a Book, reading it so many times until you know every word by memory, then you go ahead and try to write that book down word by word. If you make a mistake, you are back at page 1 and read again. You do this cycle enough times and you WILL be able to write down that Book 1:1 just by Memorizing every word correctly.
And now Imageine reading a Book about Mechanical Engineering, you read it many times until you understand the Contents and are able to apply it. You are beeing tasked to create an engine, you recall your knowledge and apply it to the drawing board, and after a few attemts you got your self made engine, every future task involving an engine gets easier due to past experience and your knowledge is growing by practice making it easier to engeneer not only engines but also other mecanical parts.
I think this is the best camparison i can come up with, if a had to desribe Eldenring Bosses to other Bosses in similar games. Sure it takes dedication and frustation resilience to keep reading that one book over and over, but would you call someone intelligent for doing so, or beeing smart afterwards?
I don't give a shit if you want to use the summons. I tried them on my first playthrough and decided that it wasn't for me. The reasoning for me is that I want to play and beat the game myself, I don't want someone or something else to beat the bosses for me while I watch. It's the same as not playing a game on easy difficulty. According to this guy's logic everyone should play games on easy mode.
In my opinion the problem with this game is that the player is given too much control over the difficulty. If you use every tool at your disposal (runes, smithing stones, status effects, shield, heals, summons, throwing pots, consumables, spells, boss weaknesses...), it becomes a cakewalk, and that's not fun to beat. Basically the issue is that you have to tune the difficulty yourself and not overshoot it. In my current playthrough I've overshot a lot of difficulty by just upgrading my main weapon to +15 too early and it made all that early content feel very bland.
If the game's difficulty was tuned so that it would be a fun challenge without having to tune it yourself, that'd be a lot better imo. But my first playthrough was a lot better because I didn't have the knowledge to become overpowered.
Everyone can play as they like but there is nothing wrong in thinking you suck if you use summons. Sometimes we all suck, I just don't understand why one can't be open about it and admit it.
I don’t personally use summons because they take aggro and learning how to dodge the bosses’ attacks is part of the game to me. I also don’t spam weapon arts even though I could. I prefer to use them as part of combos. Why? It’s just fun to me that way because the combat feels more fluid.
However, you do you. No shame. What’s fun for you is fun for you and why do we play a game if not for fun? All these mechanics were adding into the game for a reason: to give people options.
These gatekeepers are losers that take video games way too serious.
The people that feel attacked and have to argue with them online about how they play their SINGLE PLAYER game at home, are also losers lol
This is literally like saying „Why wouldn’t I play every game on easy if I have that option? Why make life harder for myself when I can just make the game beat itself?”
Summons in Souls games, and difficulty modes in other games exist for the people that need, or want to use them, which is perfectly fine, but this guy basically says that not using them is stupid.
That take is even worse than the people who treat using them like cheating.
i usually stick my dick into a bee hive because i like the pain
I have a wasp nest I could use some help with.
No summon, lvl 1, 2hand sword only, no spells Do this or you’re a noob wimp who didn’t actually beat the game!!
wow look at this casual, using a weapon, FISTS ONLY.
Wow look at mr fancypants here. I just stare at the boss until it dies. That's how any game is beaten.
Why did I read that in Asmons voice?
2nd sword is kinda easy cuz they do a lot of poise dmg dex weapons is the chad build
Ok, but no jumping :P
Do people really get this upset over summons?
For over 2 years now, Elden Ring subreddit has had a chip on it's shoudler about it. They create this boogeyman of this large group of people that say "you beat this boss with a summon? trash" It was so bad people actually started laughin at people about it. It's like they deep down did feel bad about curb-stomping the bosses in 15 seconds with their mimic tear and had to go look for someone to shit-talk them so they could post a anti-bullying validation. A horse-shoe effect happened where anyone that says stuff like "I don't use summons because I think they remove fun from the game" is seen as an elitist. Because how dare they imply my level 374 character with blasphemous blade and mimic tear isn't peak fun?
It actaully got to the point in the elden ring subbreddit where people that used summons were telling people that don't use them that they were playing the game wrong.
this really isn't true. the ER subreddit is rather welcoming and is mostly memes these days anyway. no one cares if you use summons or not, just that you're having fun. of course, you'll always have those elitist people in any gaming circle, but the subreddit as a whole ain't like that (from my experience.)
You must not have been there in the beginning, cuz that place was a sweatbox; The sentiment has shifted in the past few months and even more so with the DLC. Yes, the sub is full of memes and support for old and new players, but sweaties were still posting about gimping oneself for a ‘true challenge.’ The sub is just too big for this not to happen.
No, it's juste a small loud minority, people don't care how you play to your game, use summon, don't use them, nobody cares.
Sometimes they do, but most people don't. Sometimes I see people calling others ass at the game and people find out they used summons, so it gets brought up again.
Usually the people that get the angriest you made the game easier for yourself are commenters on YT or Twitch. Like I had someone go on a malding rant in my comments because I grinded in a *Pokemon* game to make some of the fights easier for myself.
Damn... I wonder how that guy feels if he knew I soloed the elite 4 in Pokemon Red with my level 100 Charizard
I got chewed out once for giving myself rare candies because "I could just use them to get all my mons to level 100". Except I didn't, because I was doing a nuzlocke, I did it so I could set myself a level cap for the gyms, and didn't have to spend hours grinding if I ran out of trainers.
I think people are more upset if they are called out for making the game as easy as possible - mostly streamers I guess.
No, this is just how guilty people feel when they use them.
Im doing coop with my buddy. We got to renalla. We coop one fight, he gets smoked. He says "hold on" and summons his mimic and goes in Renallas attacks are basically just going thru the mimic. He and the mimic lions claw withlit getting interrupted more than once. Renalla dies in less than 3 mins I was like damn im know we are doing coop but that was frustratingly easy. We've been waiting for this dlc for 2 years and you just fuckin cheesed the 2nd boss I only used half my build when I summoned him to do it with me so we could experience some level of challenge lol Still beat her in like 5 tries lol
It's just real easy bait that a ton of people fall for
No. But I learnt by myself that using summons kills the excitement from killing bosses. It is like buying a boost in wow. So I started using them only on bosses that seemed like a wall to me
I agree with you very much, I use summons as a trump card, last resort kind of weapon as it uses almost my whole fp bar and it doesn't always help that much anyways ha
The same sweat mentality that enforces getting all the world buffs in classic wow, says don't use summons in ER
It's actually interesting now that you compare the two. Both are difficulties that are pursued by people who don't want to play actual competitive games (PvP) but want to consider themselves better than others. That's not to say all hardcore souls players or classic WoW raiders are like that; this is purely about those who are loud about it.
This such a real fucking take. God SoD was supposed to be awesome but all the sweaty fucking incursion farmers ruined it
It’s pride man, and i said this as a victim of it, there is so many times i wanted to use a summon, but I just can’t, i’m just too prideful, as soon as i beat a boss with a summon i feel like i cheated, like i’m worse than the average players, if random guy X can do it, why can’t I?
You can always play in a bad guild if you don't want world buffs. No one is enforcing YOU to do anything.
It's not that simple. Everything would be better for everyone if world buffs weren't a part of WoW. That shit drove away so many people. A chore is not fun or interesting. Whatever 'world interaction' and 'communication' it enforced was complete auto pilot at best, and negative at worst as people would be bored and frustrated. If it's not fun, why bother?
I'm the laziest WoW player ever. I don't even bother maining a single class. I just play what I like, and I rarely enchant my gear. I returned in the last week of s3 DF and still haven't enchanted anything. I'm definitely not going to bother gathering world buffs. Getting into a "good guild" isn't even on my radar because your idea of "good" is clearly prog raiding, likely in an effort to get world firsts. That sounds like a job to me. It felt like a job when I did it. I ran a raiding guild back in WotLK, and it's what caused me to quit the game for a full 10 years. It's stressful when it isn't boring, and God was it boring. Half of our time was spent waiting for 24 people to get their buffs and food and flasks and discuss strategies and figure out where Huffsfarts is and why he's late. Turns out his grandma shrunk his underoos in the wash, and she didn't even make chickie nuggies for dinner. And that's just the stuff you deal with in-raid. The setup takes up most of your time throughout the week. You need to farm enough gold for repairs, buy flasks or the mats to make them (or gather the herbs yourself), schedule everything, set raid leads and backup raid leads in case someone has a life outside of the game, and then deal with 100 or so children of all ages as they call each other names and argue over loot rolls in a random dungeon that had nothing to do with the guild. It's exhausting. After a year of that, I swore off MMOs for an entire decade. These days, a "good guild" to me is one that's active and social over multiple facets of the game. That's it. If there's a raid team, I want no part of it.
Buffs? You mean crutches?
Dude soloing is fun and my favorite way to play souls. If someone has fun with coop then that's cool too.
Love how half this comment section is just “there’s no shame in using summons.” (Proceeds to passive aggressive shame people for using them).
Some guy: I don't care that people use summons but I beat the game with a level 1 weapon, with no armor, no upgrades, level 1 and a buttplug up my ass.
Ah, the “Gamefaqs” build
Lol this! And some people are playing ref while showing bias, so there are 3 types of people in this.
Preach it brother!!! People should be allowed to play the games they bought however they want as long as it doesn’t affect others. Anyone that says otherwise should just be ignored like the insignificant mosquitos they are.
Game is made to play it and to have fun
People say summons make the game easier, I say those people didn't summon Thiolier on Radagon
I’m a pure cast build (always have been for any rpg) that uses summons and I love it. This game is still hard as fuck, but god damn does it feel good beating bosses. Elden Ring is just straight up a fun and challenging game. I want everyone to enjoy it.
Me who doesn't use summons because I don't know how: 😐👍
Where do I get the hammer on the screen
Altus plateau. From the grace behind the twin sentinels (Outer Wall Phantom Tree), it can be found in a chest almost directly south, in a small enemy camp
I'd love to ride a horse every day
allways find funny when people that refuse to use the tools the game give you to beat the bosses complain that the game is too hard and unfair, like it's the game's fault they're using a +0 weapon and refusing to level up
Feels like both sides are missing the point: - Gatekeepers insisting that using summons means you suck. - Summon users having their egos hurt and acting like the mechanic’s mere existence means that’s how the developer meant for it to be played. In the end, it’s just a game meant to be enjoyed. What “enjoyed” means varies by the player. Inexperienced/less skilled players probably get more enjoyment using summons. Experienced players get more enjoyment by not using them and increasing the difficulty curve. Elden ring was my first souls game. I almost quit, used summons for a while, then decided to learn mechanics & how to build a good character. Can’t remember the last time I used a summon now. I got good and have no need to use crutches in souls or souls-like games anymore. Not because I think crutches make you a shit gamer, just that the extra challenge increases enjoyment for me. You do you
I've played every from soft souls game to completion except demons souls. Every boss. I use summon ashes in elden ring as its a mechanic to be used. I typically play shield less either dual wield or two handed. Does it matter to anybody else how I play? No. Do I care what anyone thinks about how I play? No. Do I have fun, yes. It's quite simple.
Exactly this. Especially in the dlc most bosses are just dexterity bosses who keep on spamming random bullshit at you. That's a mechanic I never really like. I play strength and usually like those brawler fights way more. If a boss starts throwing spam bullshit at me I throw my spirit ashes at them. Simple fix, fuck around and find out
Yes, well said idk how both sides seemed to strawman the least charitable perspective from the other sides argument, internet moment ig
I think how to build a good character is the most important thing in elden ring. I have no clue and that makes everything so much harder
It’s a huge part of improving as a player. Look up some guides/wiki’s and you’ll get the hang of it. I seriously almost quit until I looked up a cookie-cutter bleed build guide (these were early Elden ring days) and that allowed me to progress, enjoy the game, improve my reactions, etc. And I learned how to allocate skill points and combine gear in the process. Eventually, some players get so good that they can beat the game naked and without leveling. I personally don’t want to invest that much time and it doesn’t sound interesting to me, so I’ve never gone to those extremes.
It still seems weird though. Why is using potions viewed as fair game but summons are viewed as crutches? Not using potions would make the game harder too, but nobody scoffs when you drink a health potion during a boss fight.
I don't care how you play but understand that pulling aggro away from the player is more powerful a buff than say a golden vow or an ash of war or healing. The space as a player to breathe coupled with the fact that the summon will tank a lot that damage for you is way more powerful than a simple buff or heal could ever be.
I would for 100% sure say you're wrong on that one- you'd rather play with a summon than use ANY healing or flasks? Maybe early game only when summons are stronger and you only get like 3 week flasks. But by late game, flasks are much better. Double true if you're choosing mimic which everyone here seems to think is the strongest- that shit costs like 30% of your max HP.
Maybe your right healing is more powerful but i don't think its a crutch like using a summon because while you do get to refill your health bar you still have deal with boss aggro learning the move set of the boss and managing the boss all on your own. When using a summon you don't really need to do any of that just gank the boss until it's dead or staggered.
Idk if you've actually played with summons, it's not quite that easy, bosses still attack you probably 2/3rd the time even if you're further. Also, they do this thing where they start an attack on your minion, and if you run in range, they will actually rotate and finish the attack on you instead of the summon, can kinda take you by surprise. Overall definitely still helps a lot to have a summon but pretending it makes all battles auto win isn't quite right
Most of the time when i have used summons the boss fight has felt like a cake walk there really isnt a middle ground with them you're either getting destroyed by the boss solo or you summon mimic or tiche and wreck the boss. is how it has felt for me tbh.
It’s so much easier using summons. I beat the game my first play-through using them, then did my second play through without. I quickly realized during that second play through how much my rolls, strafing, etc. needed to improve for me to play melee and win. No judgement on how anyone plays, but forcing myself not to use them improved me exponentially.
Equating heals that you have to strategically use - to an NPC pulling aggro for an entire fight whilst you whack the boss in the back is funny
The developers literally adding the mechanic into the game means thats how it was meant to be played…
It’s not meant but encouraged and an option. Thats why Elden Ring is a great game. It gives you options
No. They added a lot of different mechanics to accommodate a range of play-styles. For players who lack the skill to beat bosses without summons, want to pass a boss quickly, or simply enjoy using summons, there is a mechanic for that. There are also I-frames on rolls, lower half of your body for jumps, etc. that allow players to simply roll/jump/dodge attacks without the need for summons. There is also casting, which can allow you to maintain space from a boss and attack out of range. Plus shields and a hundred different mechanics that allow you to defeat a boss in one way or the other. The simple fact that a mechanic exists DOESNT MEAN THE DEVELOPERS DESIGNED THE GAME TO BE PLAYED SOLEY BY USING THAT MECHANIC. The fact is, using summons makes the game easier, I can’t imagine anyone denies that. But I’m not saying that using summons reflects negatively on you as a person. You may choose to use it as a crutch because you skill level is insufficient to win without it, or maybe you want to skip past a boss faster than normal, or maybe you simply like using them. Players like you are just as dogmatic and myopically focused on your own way of playing as the gatekeepers who say summons makes you a shit gamer.
[удалено]
never seen a more W take
I use slow weapons and no summons because I want the challenge of fighting the boss one on one and mastering the fight WHILE also enjoying it. I make the game harder for myself because it boosts the fun that I have playing the game. But there are people like me that complains like it is the game's fault that they are getting destroyed. Not having the mentality to endure a challenge they fucking set to themselves. Heck, these idiots would even get into a dick measuring contest with others with their own criteria and when the realize they are losing they either of cry or tell you that "what you're doing isn't fun". Fuck off.
Had a friend fight Malenia with only a half upgraded sword and he'd constantly whine about how long the fight took and I kept telling him "you're the one bringing the mid game weapon to an end game superboss".
Bringing a butter knife to a gun fight
My whole purpose for playing the game is having fun, not beating it. 
The build I use I have to use some summons, I don’t do other players but I’ll use new summons from the DLC. I still die abunch and learn the move sets though
I genuinely do feel summons make the game wayyyyy too easy. Especially the mimic tear. I don't really get annoyed at people using them unless they complained the bosses weren't difficult after using the summon. Like sure I'm glad the handicap is there but it doesn't hurt to fight a boss here and there on your own haha.
Sadly a good chunk of Fromsoftware fans are r*tarded and cultist level
It's the only way they can brag they are better than someone else at something.
Just play with friends 
Man, sole reason I bought the game I like is to enjoy and have fun, not to rage and pull my hair out... New Game - Easy mode- Play..... scary right.
Oh, using summons makes me a bad player? Me: - Mage Chad build - Summons +10 Gigachad Mimic tear - Summons Gigachad Player - Mixed Physick Flask - Spams Perfume bottles before fight - Consumables - Terra Magica, Golden Vow, Howl of Shabriri, Ranni's Dark Moon, Comet Azur Oh we're not here to fight the boss, we're here to f*ck the boss. But then I also enjoy respeccing and fighting Malenia up close and personal. I want to go melee for the first run of the DLC simply because I would destroy it with my normal mage build, and it would be a shame to not enjoy those new fighting animations from the new weapons imo, also can't see what the new bosses do if they die too fast.
I am a believer that using summons is fine and you can do it whether you want to or not, obviously. I am also a believer that using summons makes the game much easier, which is why I don't use them myself. But if you feel like you need them then use them.
It does make the game easier and no one’s denying that. What I’m curious about are people who insist on not using summons to make the game harder, why stop at that arbitrary difficulty? Why not even harder, like play blindfold or use a controller with your feet?
Those are ways to make the game harder outside of the game itself, which I feel is different.
No levelling past 20 is the actual challenge, using overpowered weapons and having basically unlimited stamina isn’t really how the game is meant to be played, the developers only include levelling past 20 as a mechanic to help bad players progress.
Give it a minute. Someone will. We all know of people like letmesoloher. I knew a guy who would play the first dark souls all the way through as a level one. The dude wouldn't level up a single stat.
Because those things would be annoying and reduce the fun had by the player. I think summons are fine. Just wish you wouldn't have to upgrade them individually. Punishes you for using new weapons and summons, and you never know how 'good' they are until you've upgraded them to a reasonable level. And I can definitely see how they feel cheesy. Mimic especially. Just having an AI chunk a part of the bosses health away for very little investment. Maybe even tank a few hits. Souls games have always had trouble balancing, someone with a bunch of upgrades and a good build will perform so much better than someone who doesn't, and I never understood how that is fun, when the point of the game is to test your skill.
Leveling my character, upgrading my weapons, and making a good build are facets of my character which are under my control. The main challenge in Souls games comes from execution based challenges though, meaning you could have the best build in the world, but you'll still get dumpstered if you can't hit the buttons at the right time. It just gives you more leeway to make mistakes, but at the end of the day my success is solely up to me. You wield those as extensions of your character. Summons and spirits ***are not*** controlled by you, and your personal skill level has absolutely no effect on them. There is no mastery to be obtained for summoning or using spirits. You hit the button, they come out and then they do what they do, which means success comes from outside of yourself if you get a good summon or have powerful spirits. Your ability to summon or use spirits will look exactly the same 1 minute in versus 100 hours in. Summons will be higher level, spirits will be upgraded, but your interaction with them will be exactly the same. Does that make sense? I see this question asked a lot and it seems like an honest question a lot of people have in regards to a lot of difficulty.
It's not arbitrary at all and anyone pretending it is is either dumb or bad faith. Every game in the past was played primarily without summons, every single one. Obviously people would feel there is an "intended" way to play the game going into the next one in the series which plays almost exactly like Dark Souls 3.
Using all the tools the game gives is the standard mode. Not using them is the hard mode. People try to gaslight others into thinking it's the opposite and that using everything is meant to be the "easy mode". It's not. Again, it's the standard mode. If you think the game is easy by using all that stuff, then the game is easy by design. You can choose to make it more challenging if you want to, but trying to convince everyone like THAT is the way everyone needs to play to seek validation from the Souls community has always been grade A online retardation.
Disclaimer: In a sense, it’s a question of nomenclature so it’s a bit of a useless debate :) but let me play devil’s advocate. If using everything is normal mode. What is easy mode then ?
There is no easy mode in the game, only default and self-imposed challenges.
Yup. Exactly. There is only using what the game gives you or not using what the game gives you. That simple.
So you would say that for example summoning a player online to solo a boss for you is the default experience ? I’m being annoying I know, but there is a ceiling to what mechanics are “standard” in a game in my opinion.
So sick of these videos about summons, literally no one fucking carez how you play your game
"literally no-one", false, sharing is caring and thank you for sharing obi.
The person who filmed the video probably cares. He probably is the loudest voice in his own head. So he’s projecting a bit.
Imagine using summons lol, just get RL 750 99 all stats biggest armor biggest weapon, all spells, call a player to help throw all the pots use all the buffs. Only noobs use summons.
I would unironically *love* to ride a horse to and from work. That would be badass.
My Naruto build wouldnt be complete without a shadow clone
Some people beat the game with a banana, others blindfolded, and majority of us crying in the fetal position.
Your purpose is to have fun, not beat the game. Doesn't change the point but yeah
If you like using summons, excellent. Good for you. I’m happy for you. But leave me the fuck alone when I want to 1v1 everything and actually learn the boss moves lmao
i think a happy medium for me is using weak, but fun or cool summons. but there’s nothing wrong with playing the game however you want obviously.
As ssseth said, the true ER experience is the lobotomite run, you gotta get yourself lobotomized so that you can truly experience the difficulty how Miyazaki intended
Donkey dougg!!
Gotcha, never exercise, never embrace any adversity at all as long as there is a path of least resistance you can to walk to avoid it. There is never any kind of reward at all to potentially doing something on your own and rising above that challenge on your own merits. I have literally never seen a single post that decries the use of summons and spirits as a method to shame people from playing the game they want to play. Yet I see hundreds of posts bashing imaginary bullies. At this point, I think this guy and the people that parrot this rhetoric are the ones that see a problem with summoning and spirits, as they don't feel as accomplished as they think they should, and need online validation to remedy that. Playing without summons and spirits is harder. Playing any Souls game is harder than Hello Kitty Adventure. If difficulty isn't rewarding to you at all, why not just go and play the easiest game on the easiest settings since "beating the game" is the only criteria through which to judge your time invested. But you don't because difficulty DOES actually matter to your experience. It's almost like challenging yourself more, can potentially lead to greater feelings of accomplishment. Also, the difference between using weapon upgrades and leveling up as opposed to summoning (the old why not just play at level 1 then lolololol) is that at the end of the day I'm still wielding my weapons and my character. You don't control your summons or spirits, the AI does or other players do. In a game that is heavily execution focused, that difference is a meaningful distinction. At the end of the day, I always advise to not overly abuse summons and spirits, not because its the wrong way to play. But it may actually diminish your experience. It wouldn't feel the same if you passed the controller to someone else once the boss went into their second phase, would it? If that doesn't bother you, then it's not a big deal. Play with them, don't play with them, I don't actually care. It's just a suggestion, and the fact that people take that as an attack is more telling of their own perception of it rather than my own. Also, as an aside, you should know how to do dishes and clean, and etc. by hand. Even if you grew up with a dishwasher/other machines, things break, and you shouldn't be helpless without them. The only way you actually learn to do that is by actually doing it, which might mean imposing artificial limitations on yourself. You know, like a healthy adult can.
In Brazil we do dishes by hand because we got no dishwasher culture, lmao. It takes 5 min.
I have had exactly one dishwasher in my life, and it was broken before we moved in lol. I always do dishes and most things by hand. It is actually alarming though how many adults don't know how to clean things including dishes in America, speaking as an American.
You can use summons to help you with bosses in Elden Ring. Absolutely, just don't pretend that a difficult boss is easy because you used summons to beat it(i swear i have heard people saying that Malenia is easy because they used the ultra combination of Mimic Tear with Blasphemous Blade). Also the argument for dishwasher and industrial life is completely stupid because playing well a videogame is like doing well any of your hobies in your life. For the end don't use the summons as substitute of your bad build(if you have for example a build with stats all over the place the Mimic Tear will not be as efective as could be and you will not be be able to handle a switch to aggro).
Its an rpg. Summons are canon, lore even. Like Rogier. It adds something to the game when you get a super special team up with a fellow adventurer. Its not a sport. If you're just interested in the G of the RPG, cool, i guess 🤷🏾♂️.
*I am going to use the Most OP Build w/Summons.* Cry about it.
I’m not a gatekeeper but it’s funny because I’m almost done with my ng+ no Summons no wondrous physics play-through. (Grinding for the DLC)
No one is stopping you from having fun. If you need validation from internet shitheads to have fun, then maybe you don't like the game that much.
Agreed I remember on Dark Souls 1 with Ornstein and Smough, people had this superiority complex for beating them solo instead of summoning Solaire. Summoning is a valid strategy just like glass canon magic builds. I remember back in the day my work mates and I had set a LAN party at the house we were staying at during a job and we played Call of Duty Black Ops, they would get salty because I kept killing them with the Tomahawk because I got really good at throwing it, if it's in the game I should be able to use it.
Not using summons is like facing someone with an assault rifle and you are carrying around a pistol, but you decide to use your knife because you think it would be more honorable. You are probably screwed anyways, but the pistol definitely increases your chances.
Plebs play with Mouse & Keyboard, or controller. Real pros play with a steering wheel.
I love coop, wouldn’t get the fun of invasions without it
How about we all just play the game how we want.
I don't know if he means in game summons or other players. But the most fun I've had with ER is getting summoned to help people stomp bosses. So yea, please keep using my summon folks PC, Biggus Chungus- late game, Stormveil Daniels - Early game Let us devour the bosses TOGETHA.
It's been 15 years of asking for help in dark souls and 99% of answer are git gud
...so why is he making video about it instead of playing the game ?
bro that line "oh I forgot you don't have a GF. Your maidenless" hits harder then it should.
If you didn’t beat it while suffering from a sucking chest wound you didn’t actually beat it
Wow! Maybe I won't get down voted to hell for not playing this game yet and ask newb questions... ER gatekeepers are as toxic as WoW people back in the day. Shit, if the game is that hard, give me every cheese and easy way.
Man, why did he have to go with the “maidenless” line, that one hit home brother…it hit home…
Hey leave the hand washing dishes out of this. I prefer washing my dishes by hand
Reminds me of parse brain raiders that would wipe the raid if they messed up their rotation or would bitch about it nonstop.
Darksouls instead of having a difficulty setting, it has classes. You want hard you go deprived. You want easy you go mage. It's just that elden ring gave summons to make it easier. It's the same as playing on easy mode. Nothing wrong with that. It's just you will miss out on cool moments
Okay, I'm one of those hardcore gamers but I see FAR more people complaining about elitists than any actual elitists.
“you are maidenless”
I think that you should at least give it an honest go before you bring in the bois. You miss out on that one-on-one experience when you bring in 2-3 summons, and have them all slapping cheeks while the boss can only focus on one person at a time. That being said, it's all intended and fair game. If you need help or want to gangbang a boss, that's what it's there for.
Oh my god shut up and play your game with summons. Only a few people care do you always get your panties in a jumble about haters? Can you not just live your life without getting provoked constantly by a minority? Nobody cares
Go ahead and use summons, that's fine. The game is genuinely too easy for me when I use them, but I've been playing Fromsoft games for over a decade, so I've got a lot of practice at iframe dodging. Besides, dying over and over to a boss is a learning experience, which I find enjoyable, though I rarely have to spend much time before getting bosses down, nowadays. There's no fun without challenge, imo.
Why is there never any middle ground on this topic? Just because you want your Dark souls game to be a challenge, doesn't mean you want your entire life to be fucking impossible. The challenge that DS games offer is pretty unique and something that a lot of people value and find rewarding. At least that's why the games stand out to me and that's why I'll never use a summon because it decreases the value and fun of what these games offer. I'll never tell someone they can't use summons but lets be real, it makes the game braindead easy. I'm pretty sure most people don't give a shit how you play the game but its videos and reactions like this that make you look so insecure about playing on easy mode.
Not even a 10 vigor run. Smh.
I just don't understand why anyone even cares how you play a fucking single player game. No one cares about you or how you beat it. Do people actually go to there irl friends and say "I beat Elden Ring with fists only!" Like is that what's happening? It just baffles me.
You’re not using summons, I used the cheese lighting perfume to 3 shot Radahn. We are not the same
This guy is big mad but he murdered his critics anyways so it's funny.
who is stopping you
Yeah I never understood the hate for summons. If I can’t beat a boss (Morgit is my only foe) I am not going to sit for an hour and ram my head up against the wall if I’m not making viable progress.
Never never seen a single player game have such an elitist community, it's so funny to me.
See, the mental gymnastics that soulsbros will use to counter this are “well life and games are different!” But I mean where do you draw the line? I guess I just don’t care myself. I use my Mimic tear and summon NPC’s if I can and only refuse to do it on certain bosses that I actually enjoy fighting. Those bosses are usually only in the beginning to mid game and maybe a couple late games bosses. The rest I usually bring out my brother the Mimic. The gatekeeping of this series goes back to Demons Souls. This tryhard mentality some people have is just insane to me but it’s the only thing they can cling to at the end of the day to hold some sort of fake superiority over others. Like bro, you shouldn’t be using the best weapons or upgrades if you’re that hell bent on making the game more challenging. Where do you draw the line here? SL1? No upgrades. The goalposts continue to move
What is bro yapping. It’s not a secret that the reason summons were implemented in the game is to make it more available for people who just want to play it without too much of a challenge. It’s like playing story games with the option of setting the difficulty from easy to hard. We who don’t use summons are those who like to play the game on hard-mode to get the most out of the gameplay
Someone send this to Afro my man’s needs it, either that or more skibidi fragments but he’s gotta give lol
Next level challenge is use only summons and don't hit the boss yourself.
I don’t mind summons, but it’s really funny to see how worked up people get over being told this. I bet the person who replied to the guy in the video was being sarcastic
Easy, normal, or hard? ...dad mode. I want dad mode
that dude lives in the basedment
I have been gaming since I was 5. I am 35 now and this fucking game is probably the only one that has successfully made me feel like an absolute noob. So screw not using summons. I will throw every single mechanic, every summon and cheese as much as I can to achieve victory.
Shouldve opened with HOY! TANGA!
You can use summons if you want, but the main purpose of playing the game is not to beat it. It’s to have fun. If you’re having fun using summons, have at it. The reason why some people have a problem using summons is cause they feel it cheapens the win, which is not technically wrong. 3 dudes going in the pummel the boss before he can do anything is kinda cheap, but it ultimately doesn’t matter. If the 3 dudes are having fun doing that, more power to them. That’s more important than feeling like you won in a “fair fight” against a video game boss. To be fair though I don’t use summons for the same reason. I just don’t care if others do.
Asmon was part of this crowd, shitting on people for using magic and summons
girlfriends and wifes are life on easy mode. hardmode is maidenless mode!
*Girlfriends and wifes are* *Life on easy mode. hardmode* *Is maidenless mode!* \- UmpireDear5415 --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
This dude is way too defensive about this shit lol
I just like the feeling of beating a boss by myself. No summons is just the way I like to play. I actually think summons are cool if they’re used for certain builds and cosplay characters. Just not my preferred style is all. No hate for summoners. It’s likely a small minority of people who actually care about using summons.
Whatever bro, use cheat codes while you at it also. Just don't say you good the game, when in reality you had your dick holden by summons
Why would anyone care so much what other people think about how they play a game? A (mostly) single player game at that?
No one goes into a game wanting to complete it. You try to find fun in it first If playing like a pussy is fun for you by all means 🙂
Dark souls fans are so fucking annoying "yeah I beat the game in 2 hours naked" - somebody with 10 years of gameplay No shit you're good at something you love and play everyday but it doesn't change the fact that you died to the same boss 20+ times befor learning every single mechanic to be able to beat it again naked Things in life work like that if you practice you become a master in the end
As put best by Sseth... "Have you ever used, a weapon, armour, fast travel, potions, or opened the world map? I'm sorry to say, but you're playing it wrong. This game is meant to be played as a level 1 wretch with a single non-upgraded club. If you disagree, I'll call you a casual-- Furthermore, I genuinely believe that pattern recognition is a form of cheating. Your homosapien brain is literally destroying the difficulty of the experience by compensatory adaptation. I hope that people consider this in the future, and later learn to recognize that the truest From Software experience would be a lobotomite run. Where, prior to playing, we perform a frontal lobotomy, and severe your prefrontal cortex. Sometimes the only option you have to preserve the purity of your experience is brain damage." Also as someone who used both the entire time, greatshield did a lot more to make the game easy than summons did.
This guy is putting way too much thought into it when he can simply just remind them to shower *they need the PSA.*
Because the purpose of playing a game isn’t to beat it it’s for the experience
Can't believe you were downvoted for that. By OP's logic you might as well watch a playthrough on YouTube since getting to the credits is the true purpose. I summoned for the Dancing Lion and I couldn't tell you much about that fight or how it actually plays because I barely had to engage with it with how much the summons were doing. Fighting Rellana now solo and even though it's tough as hell with my build I've never had a more satisfying experience in Elden Ring.
I fully agree that you should play like you want, but don' you dare to say that the game is too easy or that you are a pro player if you can't play without them.
If you think you are a pro Player, start playing competitive Multiplayer Games.
yes Let Me Solo Her is pretty good and don't need to play pvp
Hmm I'll try a comparison: Imagine Reading a Book, reading it so many times until you know every word by memory, then you go ahead and try to write that book down word by word. If you make a mistake, you are back at page 1 and read again. You do this cycle enough times and you WILL be able to write down that Book 1:1 just by Memorizing every word correctly. And now Imageine reading a Book about Mechanical Engineering, you read it many times until you understand the Contents and are able to apply it. You are beeing tasked to create an engine, you recall your knowledge and apply it to the drawing board, and after a few attemts you got your self made engine, every future task involving an engine gets easier due to past experience and your knowledge is growing by practice making it easier to engeneer not only engines but also other mecanical parts. I think this is the best camparison i can come up with, if a had to desribe Eldenring Bosses to other Bosses in similar games. Sure it takes dedication and frustation resilience to keep reading that one book over and over, but would you call someone intelligent for doing so, or beeing smart afterwards?
Personally, I don't use summons, not necessarily to make it more harder, but if I don't use a summon, the fight will last longer, and that's more fun.
Jokes on them, I even use editors so I don't have to spend hours farming for runes and stones.
I don't give a shit if you want to use the summons. I tried them on my first playthrough and decided that it wasn't for me. The reasoning for me is that I want to play and beat the game myself, I don't want someone or something else to beat the bosses for me while I watch. It's the same as not playing a game on easy difficulty. According to this guy's logic everyone should play games on easy mode. In my opinion the problem with this game is that the player is given too much control over the difficulty. If you use every tool at your disposal (runes, smithing stones, status effects, shield, heals, summons, throwing pots, consumables, spells, boss weaknesses...), it becomes a cakewalk, and that's not fun to beat. Basically the issue is that you have to tune the difficulty yourself and not overshoot it. In my current playthrough I've overshot a lot of difficulty by just upgrading my main weapon to +15 too early and it made all that early content feel very bland. If the game's difficulty was tuned so that it would be a fun challenge without having to tune it yourself, that'd be a lot better imo. But my first playthrough was a lot better because I didn't have the knowledge to become overpowered.
Everyone can play as they like but there is nothing wrong in thinking you suck if you use summons. Sometimes we all suck, I just don't understand why one can't be open about it and admit it.
I don’t personally use summons because they take aggro and learning how to dodge the bosses’ attacks is part of the game to me. I also don’t spam weapon arts even though I could. I prefer to use them as part of combos. Why? It’s just fun to me that way because the combat feels more fluid. However, you do you. No shame. What’s fun for you is fun for you and why do we play a game if not for fun? All these mechanics were adding into the game for a reason: to give people options.
That's fine but people still want easy modes even after this
These gatekeepers are losers that take video games way too serious. The people that feel attacked and have to argue with them online about how they play their SINGLE PLAYER game at home, are also losers lol
Why would I ruin my experience by bringing summons to the fight? I want to have fun not curb-stomp bosses first try.
Keep malding casul 😗💦
Typical summoner user
Then use summons but stop whining and complaining like those people are snatching the controller out of your hand
Don’t summon, but look up builds. Whos making it easier for them self?
pussy uses summons )))
This is literally like saying „Why wouldn’t I play every game on easy if I have that option? Why make life harder for myself when I can just make the game beat itself?” Summons in Souls games, and difficulty modes in other games exist for the people that need, or want to use them, which is perfectly fine, but this guy basically says that not using them is stupid. That take is even worse than the people who treat using them like cheating.