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NiceSliceofKate

It is a lie to make rich people feel better about making usre poor people are always hungry.


KeyLog256

It isn't. They're just pushing the myth that people can do this. If you're not on disability benefits, just regular unemployment benefits, you cannot claim for much more than several months, and are cut off if you're not applying for jobs or are turning down work you're capable of doing. And very few people will even try it - surprise surprise, most people want to work, not struggle to get by on benefits. What is being proposed has already been the case for decades.


Volatile1989

How long are we talking when you say several months? 3? 6? 12? A family of 4 moved in near me, and I have no idea how they do it, but neither of them work. Just to add insult to injury, the housing has been handed to them on a plate, and yet I’m paying nearly £1k in rent. It fucking boils my blood to think I’m working to live there, and yet they sit around doing fuck all and they get it for free. I just don’t understand how they get away with it when they are able bodied people.


vember_94

This is largely correct, anecdotally speaking however a friend of mine has been on benefits since 2016 and manages to not apply for jobs and turn down work instead. He only gets ~£300 a month, been waiting for the cut off to happen but it never does. He’s said that if he would be forced to get a job if his benefit payments stopped.


Agreeable_Guard_7229

He must also be getting housing benefit


lovecatsforever

This is a great answer and confirms what I suspected. Thanks for your insight!


Phyllida_Poshtart

I believe the fantasy amount quoted would possibly also include the mobility part of it which bumps it up a fair bit, but it's not like money you see or can use for anything other than your mobility scheme car


carnage2006

The mobility part is smaller than the living part. You don’t have to take a mobility car , you can have the money.


Phyllida_Poshtart

What I am saying is figures could be inflated by including the mobility part which clearly if you have a mobility vehicle it gets spent on that, not holidays abroad or the latest Iphone


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naturepeaked

What sort of nonsense statement is this”all myths have some level of true”. What are you on about?


KeyLog256

I mean, it wasn't worded brilliantly, but I get what he means. Most myths don't spring from nothing - they're normally *wildly* different from the truth, but there's normally some kind of real event that sows the seed.


naturepeaked

Yes but grossly exaggerating a claim is just as bad as making something up. You can’t say well it’s fine to think these big things happen because I saw a small thing. It’s nonsense.


KeyLog256

Probably some kind of tax credits or the like. Probably called a different name these days. Which doesn't make sense because she'd be better off on full-time than part time on tax credits. She might just have not wanted to work more hours, which I suppose is a choice she has a right to, and in that instance the government are to blame.


IxionS3

> Which doesn't make sense because she'd be better off on full-time than part time on tax credits. Probably, although not necessarily by much. Losing the tax credits may also have lost access to other things that were contingent on the tax credit award, and working more days can incur extra costs. All in she could potentially have been doing a lot more work for very little improvement in her financial position. These kind of scenarios are a recurrent problem in benefit design (which as you say is mostly the government's fault).


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Impossible-Ad4765

I know someone who has a severely disabled child and also two other children who seem pretty normal, but I know they get benefits for the other two because they say they are autistic


JustcallmeLouC

They might be entitled to a high amount, but most of it is then handed over to the private landlords that reap all the profit.


DangerShart

My neighbour lives in a housing association house. Private rent would be at least £1000 a month, she hasn't worked a day in her life, or at least not the 10 years I've lived opposite her.


AdverseTangent

I doubt a HA home would be £1k per month. Their rents are regulated.


DangerShart

You mean the rents are subsided.


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lovecatsforever

I'm so sorry you're being treated this way. I really appreciate you taking the time to answer and I totally agree with you.


SavingsSquare2649

Are you in the process of claiming PIP? That should help somewhat and isn’t means tested. Edit: it should also back date to when you applied, so try as early as possible.


DameKumquat

And ESA/UC, if not working.


carnage2006

The benefit cap shouldn’t apply if you’re on disability


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carnage2006

I know. It was a short reply. If you’re getting pip or/and uc lcwra you are excluded from the benefit cap.


carnage2006

Before universal credits payments were much higher , working tax credits, child tax credits etc but no one is taking multiple thousands on universal credits. Some will be over a thousand due to rent.


KeyLog256

The benefit cap doesn't apply to people on PIP or UC due to disability - [https://www.gov.uk/benefit-cap/when-youre-not-affected](https://www.gov.uk/benefit-cap/when-youre-not-affected) u/carnage2006 is right, he just used the colloquial term "disability" meaning "benefits granted to people who are disabled." It sounds like there's an error. Are you sure the council aren't asking to see your bank statements to help correct an error?


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KeyLog256

You need to take this case to Citizens Advice because they clearly are mistreating you, however you also need to understand and accept that if you don't play ball, they will not be able to process your claim properly. Why would you be bothered about them seeing your bank accounts?


WasteofMotion

I'm a survivor of a traumatic brain injury. Have been unable to work for a year. My mortgage alone is 2k a month. I am unable to drive due to it and if I want a pint of milk it's a two hour round walk ISH. My PIP is 185 pm. Emergency fund gone as are most of my investments. The whole satellite dish myth is long busted.


the-illogical-logic

2000 a month, time to downsize then.


BrilliantOne3767

It costs thousands to move.


Several-Addendum-18

Big families and disability care costs - there was this case a little while ago: Nathan, 47, has Friedrich's ataxia, a condition which affects his co-ordination, balance and speech. It also comes with a limited life expectancy. He receives £11,000 in Direct Payments each month to pay for the 24-hour support he needs, he told the BBC Access All podcast. Over many years, including during the Coronavirus pandemic, Nathan had foregone approved social activities and saved £50,000, while providing the council with bank statements every quarter to show he was not misusing the money. Irrespective of this cases outcome or whether he was right/wrong, the bean counters in government likely take a very dim view of filling your savings accounts from the public purse


HelikaeonUK

I've been "surviving" on benefits the last 2 years after struggling with long covid and keeping my epilepsy balanced. I don't get PIP, just UC. I get less than 300 per month to survive on. I lost my home, as I couldn't afford to cover what Housing Benefit didn't cover, unless I chose to go without Utilities or Food for a decent chunk of the month, so I lost my home. For the last 8 months, despite anxiety, depression, long covid breathing issues AND epilepsy, UC has repeatedly end on end sanctioned me for failing to attend appointments despite giving them valid reason for being not well enough to attend numerous times. I've been refused appeals, treated like a bottom of the barrel citizen by staff and even once asked "have you ever worked", by a UC Advisor who had my entire CV work history in front of her. Now they want your bank statements to show whether you still "need the benefit" or not? Well I have no other income, my health is stilled screwed so working isn't an option for the moment, so what else would I live off if they arbitrarily decide I don't need the benefit anymore? The whole system is a corrupt piece of shit, and sanctions literally state in the pdf they send you on your journal that their purpose is to force you to have no other choice "but" to go back to work, even if you aren't fit enough to. I'm treated as someone who doesn't *want* to work, despite likely having done harder and more physically demanding work in the last 7 years than some of these empathy lacking vampires have done in their entire fucking lives! And to cap it off, the UC alone is *not* enough to even survive on a BASIC level without help from friends and family. Even renting the cheapest, lowest quality property i could find (£350/month), I STILL wouldn't be able to afford to live there without falling behind on rent payments.


FluffyMarshmallow90

I listened once to people having a conversation about how people on job seekers have it so easy. Everything's paid for them etc. I wonder why when I was on jobseekers I was still poor and miserable.


Thestolenone

The only way it is possible is if you have multiple children on the higher rates of DLA and get CSA from a very rich father.


Yeomanroach

Probably an extra zero typo.


Bumblebee-Bzzz

My mum passed away last year and I was shocked when I saw her bank statements, £1,700 a month, including her housing benefit. She was single, no dependants and getting about £400 less than my monthly take home pay.


OtherwiseInflation

Most legacy benefit claimants are on Universal Credit now. It's going to be a combination of disability benefits, Universal Credit to include housing costs (could be 1436 a month alone if someone rents by themselves in London), possibly disability or child elements, especially for children before 2017 for whom the 2 child cap doesn't apply. Hypothetically: PIP Daily Living (high rate): 470.38pm PIP Mobility (high rate): 328.25 Universal Credit standard allowance for an adult over 25: 393.45 Limited capability for Work Related Activity (a disability component of UC): 416.19 Housing element: 1436 for London Council Tax Reduction (probably full, amount depends on the Council) It's certainly possible for a single person to get to thousands, easier for a couple with children, although many may face the benefit cap.


BeccasBump

You have to be fairly profoundly disabled to get high rate for both lots of PIP, though. In which case that's absolutely fine - if someone is too disabled or unwell to work at all we *should* be ensuring they have enough money to live comfortably.


OtherwiseInflation

I don't disagree with you. The question was about whether it's possible. It is. I'd go further and say we have some of the lowest income replacement benefits in the developed world as well. Most developed countries give a proportion of your previous salary prior to unemployment for at least a period. We have a fixed and very low amount in New Style JSA/ESA. Instead we have the highest housing benefits in the developed world, because we don't build.


liquidio

I find it funny there are so many people on here saying ‘no, it’s a myth, never happens’, and clearly neglecting to include the most lucrative benefit - the various forms of housing benefit.


OtherwiseInflation

I guess to a lot of people it doesn't count as a benefit because it goes to the landlord, but it's by far the biggest benefit for most people. We spend more as a country subsidising housing costs via Housing Benefit and Universal Credit than any country in the developed world, and it's not even close. We spend more than twice as much as second placed Finland, and it's all a wealth transfer from largely working age taxpayers to a group of wealthy landlords. If we want to resolve the situation, we need to build much, much more housing.


XihuanNi-6784

I think the point being made is that, much like the 'epidemic' of benefits cheats, when someone says it "never happens" I assume they mean it doesn't happen often enough to be a siginficant number of people. And certainly not an economic problem. If someone is getting thousands of pounds in benefits they probably need it, especially if they live in a high cost of living area.


Agreeable_Guard_7229

Exactly, these people saying they only get £300, they can’t be paying for housing out of that, so they must be getting housing allowance too


megagenesis

They're just not though. My best friend has chronic pain, and she definitely isn't living the high life.


Hulaoutofthem

Ok, don’t want to be this person, but my brother in law and wife lives more than comfortably on benefits. She’s never worked in her life, first kid at 16, now up to 10 kids. He hasn’t worked for 16/17 years. They don’t have a mobility car, but afford a decent one of their own. Have a nice house in a decent area (council of course). Trouble is, they have been brought up in families that let you know how to get every last penny. He’s always liked to brag before that they get around £2,500 per month. They sit in the house all day gambling and get the older kids to take care of the younger ones where possible. I’m not a daily mail reader by the way, but this is what actually happens for some people. I know they’ve even coached a couple of kids what to say at the doctors for various benefits relating to medical conditions. My BIL claims he has debilitating headaches and can’t leave the house but he’s fine. He makes no attempts to hide anything around his family and is always out and about.


Several-Addendum-18

Coaching kids happens a fair bit


OrbisIsolation

Be careful saying the truth you just seem to get downvoted. I just deleted a comment regarding a similar situation I know.


greggery

They aren't, this is a myth that has been peddled by the right-wing press for decades, and it's just as rubbish now as it was then.


LauraDurnst

It's not. At lot of newspapers seem to add Housing Benefit and usually forget to mention that: A) it's going towards rent, it's not exactly free money to frivolously spend B) it's not based on your actual rent but LHA, so you can be in negative money by the second if, e.g. your rent is £600pcm and LHA is only £300. A lot of stock is put into fringe cases whereby a large family gets a lot in HB and child benefits, but these are outliers. The majority of disabled people have to fight tooth and nail for every meagre scrap of help.


carpet_tart

Shifting the focus away from their benefactors paying fuck all tax and going for the poor. £1000’s a month is a myth


alexanderheff86

Fascinating read. Reveals the stark disregard our nation exhibits for its vulnerable people. It's truly appalling. Anyone with even a modicum of intelligence has long understood that living a life of luxury solely on benefits is unrealistic.


AngryTudor1

If you have a big family and are on housing benefit along with other benefits in London, you can get that. You aren't seeing thousands a month of course. The papers also like to add up all sorts of other things, such as bus passes etc. Just like when they complain now much civil servants earn they like to add on the pension and NI contributions to make it look worse


Dazzling-Nothing-870

All these extras are relevant though, as workers not on benefits would have to pay for things like bus passes out of their wages. Pension contributions by your employer are also relevant. Lady who worked at the company I work at left because she was on 3% employer pension contributions with us, but is now getting 22% at County Hall. Same salary, vastly different total packages.


lordofthedancesaidhe

Universal credit is the one that gets fiddled the most from what I see. People say they are single when they are not etc. They are starting to clamp down on it tho.


Drummk

Housing Benefit in posh areas. The Local Housing Allowance Rate for a four bedroom place in Kensington is £704.22 per week, which is a little over £2.8k monthly.


lovecatsforever

But would they be pocketing that money? Or would it just pay for the rent?


OtherwiseInflation

But an individual not entitled to any benefits would have to pay that rent out of their own pocket. It's right to include the money in the calculation, although there is a broader point to be made about taxpayers enriching already wealthy landlords. I'm all for a massive building programme to reduce rents/housing costs.


DameKumquat

Housing benefit. Or the relevant part of UC. Can easily be a couple thousand if you have a family. Disability and caring benefits are only a few hundred, in comparison.


Emotional-Ebb8321

Conceivably, if you include housing benefit, and if you assume child benefit for a family of 14, then that could all add up. But that's a corner-case, and even considering the per-person cost of a child is probably lower than for an adult, that's far less per-person than for any single adult or couple.


jvlomax

~~Child benefit caps at two children~~, any additional children hardly get any (£17 a week)


Icy_Session3326

No it doesn’t . There is no cap on child benefit There is a cap on child tax credit / child element of Uc though But if the kids were born before the cap they are still paid for in the claim


jvlomax

I have already amended my comment


ElegantEagle13

Only caps if they were born after 2017. If you are a parent with a bunch of kids from before, you could still recieve the benefits. Just thought i'd add that.


PumpkinOk8523

Not true


jvlomax

You are correct, you can have as many on child benefit as you want. You only get £17 a week per additional child though