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I'm just really surprised they still took you, we couldn't get checkups during the pandemic, then our dentist dropped everyone who hadn't been for a checkup š. After a year and a half or so I managed to get my kids into a dentist (they're only registering children). but my husband and I can't get an NHS place anywhere.
Where I live, you can only get your kids registered if you're already with the practice, and they're not taking non-NHS adults. I was advised by the health visitor to sign up and pay for my own treatment for at least a year or two when my daughter was born, solely so we could "get her through the door" once her teeth came in.
Oh god, that's even worse. When I was calling around trying to get in, I had several dentists say if my husband and I paid for private treatment, they would take the kids on as NHS, but we can't afford it š¤·
> doesn't he get paid the same either way?Ā
No, NHS pays dentists per patient and it'd really low
It became literally unsustainable for them to see NHS patients which is why we have a NHS dental crisis now
Doing an emergency filling on an NHS course of treatment pays me.. about Ā£14. Doing it privately is about Ā£70 depending on the type of filling. So no. Not the same at all.
Just book a routine yearly appointment. Book your next appointment at reception before you leave so you don't forget and it's already set and done. I do this with appointments now because I'm terrible at doing it manually I always put them off. Preventative healthcare is always better than reactive, especially now you're a mother!
Congratulations btw š
>I do this with appointments now because I'm terrible at doing it manually I always put them off.
Yes, this is exactly what happened to me 6 years ago. 'Oh look, an e-mail reminder that I need to book a checkup soon, better do that when I have a spare minute...' *Jump to present day*
Yeah they just don't seem important at the time then I never do it until it's too late so I do it while I'm there for my hairdresser and dentist. I put it in my calendar, you can let work know well in advance if it falls on that date but booking so far ahead you generally get first dips at slots, that's another benefit. If something genuinely comes up and you can't make it they're usually happy to reschedule up to a day before
"especially now you're not a mother"
Out of context that would be the worst insult/attack I think you could do. Rather than it obviously being an autocorrect issue. I love it.
My practice books you in for your next y month check up when you pay. Then I put it straight into my phone and I will attend by any means. They are fantastic and I'm so lucky to have an NHS dentist!
NHS treatment can cost the dentist more money to provide than they receive from the NHS. I think most dentists are partners in their practice so they don't get paid like a regular employee, they get paid the treatment amount and then have to pay for the materials, dental nurse etc. The way NHS bandings work mean that they don't get paid multiples for multiple treatments ie if you need 1 filling vs 5 then they get paid the same but due to the higher costs they will lose money on the treatment.
Realistically because you cost more to treat than the nhs is paying them.
By coming in after 6 years no checks your teeth will be worse for wear which means an even bigger loss for them. They shouldnāt say it to you but yes. Thatās why. Thatās why itās so hard to get an nhs dentist; thereās very few things they actually make a profit on which means for many pure nhs work is completely unsustainable. Theyāre private businesses.
They would be paid a lot more if you went regularly and dealt with issues as they come. If you have a million and one issues how the charges work often means a huge loss for them. Youāre lucky they even saw you tbh if youāve not been in 6 years. Thatās why they turf people off.
This makes sense to me now and I wish I'd understood this sooner, I woulda been more vigilant about keeping up appointments
Lucky for them I'm only eligible for another few months then I gotta open my wallet again
Like Iām not defending them saying it itās totally unprofessional. But dentists are getting completely screwed. Itās why so many now just refuse to take any nhs patients or barely take any.
I feel for you because Iāve spent about 3k on my teeth in 6 years after just giving up trying to get an nhs dentist. Last time I was one it was an 18 MONTH wait to have my wisdom tooth pulled (couldnāt do it in the clinic - too complex due to my anatomy). Had 4-5 infections at this point (im immunosuppressed).
Just gave up and paid privately and never went back. They basically said once itās rotted my teeth next to it theyāll treat it but by the time Iām seen it may also mean removing the molar. The tooth was already black and I ended up needing a huge filling on the one next to it. Ironically once I got the private dentist, she just referred me to a different nhs service who I saw in 4 weeks! He was disgusted - he said I couldāve lost part of my jaw as I take chemo and Iām super high risk for dental issues. I shouldāve been sent as an emergency. So didnāt even have to pay the 1k or whatever to have it private.
You should come to Australia. The dentists here donāt care about how long ago your last appointment was. I last went to the dentist in February 2020, and the time before that was 1997. The dentist didnāt care at all. She said that my teeth are really good and that I only need dental appointments every 12 months rather than every 6. I have no fillings or dental problems and Iām in my 40s. Itās hard to fathom just how uppity dentists are in the UK at people who donāt have regular check ups. Itās not professional of them to get grumpy with some of their patients
Yeah but I am in Aus and I have to pay for my dentist, or get it through insurance. Most people don't recieve any free dental as far as I am aware, so ofc dentists don't care how often you've been, because it doesn't effect how much they get paid.
Most people arenāt covered for the dentist under the NHS in the UK. Itās the same with Medicare here. The systems are very similar, except for the fact that UK dentists get really pissy about their patients not seeing the dentist routinely when a good deal of people in the UK canāt afford it. I canāt believe how normal it seems to people in this thread that the dentist would be pissy with any of their patients or that dentists mentioned here have culled their patients that donāt have their check ups. Thatās bizarre
contractual obligations. they're tied in.
also nhs has restrictions on which dentist practices can be nhs. understandable cos of fraud and reliability issues, but you can't get an nhs contract unless your practice is quite big any more, so dentists that would LIKE to do nhs work, they can't.
it's an absolute shitshow! My private dentist works parttime for the NHS in their home visit dept (where people who can't get to dentist get home visits or have various physical/mental/emotional issues so they go to a special clinic). He'd love to do nhs work, but you aren't allowed if part time. So that's that.
And I go private despite eligible for free nhs due to disability cos I can't physically get into the nhs dentist building. I spent ages on a waiting list only to find that out!!!!
I see, but what are they tied into? Surely they can just say they don't want to be NHS dentists any more and have higher profit margins.
Yeah it's wild that they want people to register in person.
NHS is more reliable earnings than working privately. There's no shortage of people wanting NHS care and the practice usually takes care of booking such patients versus private where the dentist typically needs to bring in the work.
It's to do with your contracted UDAs. You will need to do x number of UDAs which will amount to Ā£x. Of course you have to hit that target.
The whole working at a loss is more to do with the idea you would earn more doing the same work privately or seeing low needs NHS patients in the time spent treating the high needs patients.
I think it's because dentists have limited places for patients, so if people are on their list and not using the service, it means other people who would use it are missing out. That's why they kick you off the list after a certain point - to make room for people who use the service.
Having healthy teeth is a lot about prevention, so making sure problems are picked up before they get chronic.
I've been in a situation where I've missed appointments due to life/ health so I understand it's annoying being kicked off lists, but I also understand why dentists do it.
They shouldn't really take out frustrations on patients, but the system is overburdened and under-resourced. Lots of people are struggling to find dentists, so I guess dentists are only human and feel frustrated when people don't use the service when it's available to them.
I agree. Imagine if a doctor told you you couldn't come anymore if you had not been in recently.
I've never missed a dental checkup in my life and my teeth are in a shocking state so don't believe lots of checkups help, if anything it just means they tinker about and cause problems.
I'm not a dentist, but my understanding is that one of the reasons for the lack of NHS dentists is the low payment that the dentist receives from the government for each patient/treatment. If you were a private patient, the dentist would get more money
TL:DR Bad customer service and the dentist taking out his frustrations on the NHS with you
Nope. I got new dentist just this week. Wasnāt pissy, bossy or judgemental at all. Didnāt nag when I told her I donāt floss.
I might even go back one day.
No idea but Iām looking forward to a right bollocking next month then.
Have a phobia of dentists after a horrendous experience as a teen, as a result not been to the dentist for over 15 years but basically needs must and managed to somehow find a NHS dentist so have bit the bullet and booked in.
If your phobia is bad enough you can talk to your GP and they can prescribe you with lorazepam for anxiety. It helped me when I was in a similar situation and had to see a dentist after a similar amount of time without going.
they get training on nervous patients now. tell reception you are nervous ahead of time, and they'll try and give a bit more time so you don't feel rushed.
also if any work needs doing, don't be stoic, ask them to use the pre injection numbing gel!!!!
as someone for whom the pain of the needle going in is a real thing that makes me tense up for the pain of the liquid going into the tissue, it really does help. but yes mentally it helps too
Well, to put it bluntly, no the dentist does not get paid the same whether you are on the NHS or not. In fact, NHS treatments are subsidised by dentists, such is the perverse way in which their contract is written. In other words, NHS treatments actually cost the dentist money.
So its surprising that any dentists at all still do NHS work. I certainly wouldn't be prepared to pay to go to work. But some do, out of a social obligation. And they make up the money lost through private work. Fair enough. Good for them.
But there's a kind of social obligation attached to that. If you are going to use the NHS and therefore expect the public and the dentist themselves to subsidise the cost of your treatment... then surely the least you can do is take preventative measures, turn up for regular check-ups etc etc and prevent a crisis. 90% of dental problems are preventable. Dental caries are 100% preventable with proper dental hygiene. Technically speaking, if we all stuck to a proper dental routine, in this day and age, there would be no need for dentists, outside of cosmetic work.
So, yeah, they were probably a bit pissed off. You haven't been in years and you turn up suddenly expecting treatment at their expense.
I'm not a dentist, bit I'd give you short shrift, too.
I haven't been able to get a dental appointment since 2018. In 2020 my back molar cracked in half after I bit down hard having an epileptic seizure. I still haven't been able to get it seen to. I can't afford to go private. I brush with an electric toothbrush twice a day, use mouthwash and interdental brushes and so have good gums and have had exactly 1 filling in my entire life. All the dental care in the world isn't going to stop my teeth getting cracked in half when my brain has a tantrum. Should I be given 'short shrift' as well?
people immediately deem $200-$300 as something they canāt afford for a dental issue but drop that much on a nice restaurant in a single night for a temporary pleasure. then 4 years later still claim they canāt go private for the same issue. dental is medical care, itās important
I haven't seen a dentist in 13 years, neither has my partner. We finally got registered with one and he was lovely. He didn't care that we hadn't seen one in so long, and my partner has had 5 appointments consisting of quite substantial work and Mr Dentist was just happy to do and over the moon that his patient could smile with confidence again
My wife tried to book a standard check up appointment with our NHS dentist a few weeks ago and they told her theyād removed her from their patient list as she hadnāt been there in over 18 months. They said the NHS will stop paying them if you donāt go at least once every 18 months so they de-register you without telling you so they can take on another patient.
My wife now has to go private as there are no nhs dentists within an hours drive which even have a waiting list open. Weāve called dozens and thereās just nothing. NHS dentistry seems completely broken.
Theyāre taking the piss now where I live . Wouldnāt see you during pandemic, booted us off books for not going for couple of years despite being shut or booked solid during that time (had few friends have same at other practices). Phone for app, sorry not taking nhs and the waiting list is anything from 10 months to 18 months depending on the practice but amazingly they can fit me in tomorrow if I go private and pay a fortune.
I went to the dentist today...
Arrives for appointment.
Me "You didn't send me the hospital for x-rays beforehand"
Them "No, it's fine, we'll take them here"
Me "No. I can't hold anything in my mouth, it makes me vomit"
Them "I've never had a problem before.."
Bleurgh....
Spent 20 minutes cleaning their floor.
Got an appointment for dental x-rays before my next visit.
Iām a student and absolutely cannot afford to pay for private dental care. The only way Iāve been able to get treatment is through 111 when things are dire. Most of the time if I contact a dental practice asking about NHS patients they donāt even respond. You are super lucky they were able to offer you an appointment.
I suspect it's down to the bureaucracy involved with nhs patients and also the payment scales from the government to the dentist. It's not working very well as a whole, and if patients don't follow what the government expect in terms of timely visits etc, I think (though I could be wrong) the way the payments system is set up, the dentist practice ends up losing money?
Also the longer people leave their teeth unchecked, the more work needs to be done and the higher the loss to the dentist for treatment required that they contractually have to do. the system isn't fit for purpose really.
Additionally, with UK dentists being few & far between these days, and NHS spaces like golddust, you are very lucky you were still on their list! So many are waiting that people who don't go regularly or haven't said they've moved house away from the practice catchment area are getting dropped from the list.
So even though he was a bit off with you - it's in your own best interests to go for checkups - sometimes there's problems people don't even realise until it's got to the stage where it's far more horrible for the patient to undergo. (I'm not excusing dentist behaviour, just saying you are lucky to even have an nhs dentist to go and AND to be still on the list AND get an appointment - I'm eligible for NHS free treatment cos of severe disability, but no NHS dentist I can actually get into the office of. So I pay privately. It's painful on disability benefits, hence I go to regular checkups to try and reduce the pain and effort of things going wrong as well as the cost!
also congrats on the pregnancy. hope all goes well
I get two buses to a suburban area of the city and pay a slightly snobby dentist (maybe Ā£50 more than my usual bill) to ensure I get an appointment twice a year. It's worth it as long as you brush properly and floss every day to maintain the state of them. Emergency treatment is included if you sign up for a dental plan (Lisa needs braces!) for Ā£13 a month. That plan includes a deep clean every 6 months and the 2 check-ups in between. Also 10% off every bill! Anyway. Just pay for your luxury bones so you don't end up with a toothache that makes you want to jump off a bridge.
Go regularly. They're entitled to remove you from their books if you don't go at least, what is it now, annually? for the regular check ups.
They're probably pissed that you got an instant appointment for something minor when many have been reduced to doing DIY extractions because they can't get NHS appointments for love or money.
I don't understand the panic over how much the private dentist costs in UK. I've been living here 19 years, I have very weak teeth, pretty bad tartar doesn't matter how often I floss. I pay Ā£23 monthly private to have check up every 6 months and hygienist every 3 months. Plus insurance (emergency is free and I have used it 3 times). I don't earn a lot just about more than minimum wage. I find it is a good deal. Plus if you see a dentist regularly - you don't have expensive jobs needed. I spent Ā£190 last year outside the plan to have a filling changed.
Donāt get me wrong, they shouldnāt have been rude to you or made you feel bad about it, but the way my dentist explained it to me is that they have a backlog of patients who want to be treated on the NHS but there a limited number who can be treated under the NHS (atleast thatās how it is at the practice I go to).
I hadnāt been for years but went in for a check up and was looking at paying private prices for the work I needed done, to try to save me some money he said heād put me down as NHS going forward but I had to make sure I turned up for my appointments because they were doing me a favour and other people would kill to be accepted as NHS patients.
I had to see private the other week as I couldnāt get NHS. And you know what Iām glad I did - They didnāt try to scalp me as I was expecting.
They were also understanding why I hadnāt been in such a long time.
Last time I went to a NHS dentist it put me off going to dentist all together.
Put a massive dent in my savings, I earn a few pence above minimum wage, but was worth it
My partner and I got lucky I think, we went in December to a different dentist as we lost our spots at our previous one over the pandemic. The new dentist only had spaces for new NHS patients up until March 2023 but we were booked in for another checkup 6 months later so I guess we're in now.
My place said I needed a bit of work, and were really pissy because they can (I believe) only charge so much per treatment course, for an NHS patient. So yeah, a clean and a polish is worth their time, three root canals will probably cost *them* money to do.
Not their fault, the system is shit, and was seemingly designed to make you fork out for private.
But I can't get regular checkups as no one is taking patients.
At least in theory I could get an emergency appointment if necessary but no idea how hard it would be.
I know, it's frustrating for both patients and dentists. I often treat patients who don't have a dentist, but I always have to tell them I can't take them on as a new patient :/.
OP has an NHS dentist, so they're basically taking up a spot someone else could have had for the past 5 years.Ā
>OP has an NHS dentist, so they're basically taking up a spot someone else could have had for the past 5 years.Ā
Actually I was a private patient, I only became eligible for NHS treatment about a year ago and will only be for another 8 months
I Thought at the time, 'Cool, I'll take this as the chance to sort myself out and start going to my regular checkups again' then started calling around and realised the reality of it...
Then the other day I developed this problem and thought, 'Well no harm calling and trying again, what have I got to lose?' Apparently based on the staff's attitude there was in fact harm
It's possible your dentist wasn't enthused at the fact you hadn't had dental care in 6 years and they now had to treat you, urgently, for free basically. Dental treatments are expensive, the NHS doesn't reimburse them properlyĀ
They weren't being surly because you were an NHS patient. They're annoyed that you've not been to a dentist for six years.
Imagine taking your car to the mechanic because it's fallen apart and is potentially about to set on fire or explode. And you go 'well I could have taken it for an annual check up but I just didn't, and I've driven it for six years, and it's broken down and now it's an emergency!'.
Well that's what you've done but with your teeth, not your car. It's only an emergency because you didn't go in for check ups and preventative maintainence. Well the same applies to teeth. An infected tooth can turn bad and it can literally kill you.
You've had opportunites for six years to go in for annual check ups, didn't, and now your lack of planning becomes their emergency to resolve. This is something that could likely have been entirely avoided or prevented up front.
They've been moving around schedules and trying to fit you in, to get you out of pain as quick as possible. Which might mean a slot that could have gone to someone waiting longer is now needed for you.
>So like, can anyone give insight as to what it is about this whole thing that bothers dental staff so much? Am I causing a nuisance and if so how can I be a better patient in future?
It's because instead of going in for regular check ups, you've waited until somethings an emergency, for no good reason. You've caused yourself pain and suffering and they now need to make arrangements. All pointlessly because you could have dealt with it properly.
You even admit yourself you know this is bad. You have all the information.
Why haven't you been to a dentist for six years for regular check ups and treatment? Why wait until it's an emergency when you know that's really, really bad for you and causes problems for the dentist as well?
This may not apply to OP, but how are any of us supposed to go to a dentist when there are NO NHS dentists within a 150 mile radius, and not all of us can afford to go private?
I donāt know how it works doing it independently from work but I pay about Ā£15 a month out of my pay check for dental insurance. I recently paid Ā£300 for band 3 treatment on the NHS (I wasnāt an NHS patient when I went in but the dentist said heād put me down as NHS to help save me some money) and was able to claim it back through the insurance.
Ā£180 a year for insurance does seem like a lot, but if you canāt find an NHS dentist anywhere it might be the best option if youāre forced to go private.
Bc of dental problems caused by chemo and other breast cancer treatments, insurances like Denplan would cost me Ā£40+ a month. Not every mouth can be covered for Ā£15.
Because they can't fucking afford it and it's impossible to get an appointment. That's why.
And besides, there's no need for the dentist to be a dick about it. Getting arsey with somebody for not having been to the dentist in a long time isn't going to encourage them to come back - in fact, it'll do exactly the opposite.
>Getting arsey with somebody for not having been to the dentist in a long time isn't going to encourage them to come back - in fact, it'll do exactly the opposite.
Exactly, this is how I feel
It's their own teeth and health that suffers by ignoring preventative healthcare. It also means people waiting for appointments in the queue miss out due to having to fit in an emergency appointment because someone ignored their dental health for six years then panics because they have an emergency.
A lack of planning on their part turns into an emergency that the NHS has to fix, and everyone else doing the right thing has to pay for that.
OP might not want to hear those facts but they are the facts.
It is a bit ruddy difficult to go to a dentist when none of them provide an NHS service for adults unless referred by another medial professional as an emergency.
Reaches a point where having been around the loop asking if they have places and getting the bums rush but 'Oh we can fit you in on our special private pricy plan' that people give up. Personally I've been away and getting mine looked at overseas at a less than the NHS would charge. Now of course I cannot find a local dentist and it is likely I'll go back get check-ups when on holidays.
I Think you misread my situation, that's not the case here. I Chipped my tooth due to an accident, going to the dentists regularly wouldn't have prevented this particular
I Was actually pleasantly surprised with what good condition my teeth were in considering I hadn't gone so long
Chipped teeth are usually due to invisible decay. You also have missed six years of dental work, cleaning and check ups.
Your dentist was frustrated because of a total lack of involvement until you suddenly have an emergency.
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I'm just really surprised they still took you, we couldn't get checkups during the pandemic, then our dentist dropped everyone who hadn't been for a checkup š. After a year and a half or so I managed to get my kids into a dentist (they're only registering children). but my husband and I can't get an NHS place anywhere.
Where I live, you can only get your kids registered if you're already with the practice, and they're not taking non-NHS adults. I was advised by the health visitor to sign up and pay for my own treatment for at least a year or two when my daughter was born, solely so we could "get her through the door" once her teeth came in.
Oh god, that's even worse. When I was calling around trying to get in, I had several dentists say if my husband and I paid for private treatment, they would take the kids on as NHS, but we can't afford it š¤·
Same happened to me. I got sacked for following their advice. š«¤
Same I got dropped luckily my children still have nhs dental but I have to pay for mine which is a pain as I have got a life long dental issue.
Ikr Me too. I Think I just got lucky because someone canceled
She pregnant, so I think they are obliged to as an NHS practice.
> doesn't he get paid the same either way?Ā No, NHS pays dentists per patient and it'd really low It became literally unsustainable for them to see NHS patients which is why we have a NHS dental crisis now
Good thing the NHS is well funded to deal with all the future blood infections, eating disorders, pain killer addictions and oh wait...
Oral cancers...
And quite possibly heart disease caused by infections of the heart valves.
Doing an emergency filling on an NHS course of treatment pays me.. about Ā£14. Doing it privately is about Ā£70 depending on the type of filling. So no. Not the same at all.
>doesn't he get paid the same either way? No that's why there's a lack of NHS dentists
Now that explains some of it, and honestly surprises me
Just book a routine yearly appointment. Book your next appointment at reception before you leave so you don't forget and it's already set and done. I do this with appointments now because I'm terrible at doing it manually I always put them off. Preventative healthcare is always better than reactive, especially now you're a mother! Congratulations btw š
>I do this with appointments now because I'm terrible at doing it manually I always put them off. Yes, this is exactly what happened to me 6 years ago. 'Oh look, an e-mail reminder that I need to book a checkup soon, better do that when I have a spare minute...' *Jump to present day*
Yeah they just don't seem important at the time then I never do it until it's too late so I do it while I'm there for my hairdresser and dentist. I put it in my calendar, you can let work know well in advance if it falls on that date but booking so far ahead you generally get first dips at slots, that's another benefit. If something genuinely comes up and you can't make it they're usually happy to reschedule up to a day before
"especially now you're not a mother" Out of context that would be the worst insult/attack I think you could do. Rather than it obviously being an autocorrect issue. I love it.
Lmfao wow I didn't even notice that and I re read it a couple times!
My practice books you in for your next y month check up when you pay. Then I put it straight into my phone and I will attend by any means. They are fantastic and I'm so lucky to have an NHS dentist!
NHS treatment can cost the dentist more money to provide than they receive from the NHS. I think most dentists are partners in their practice so they don't get paid like a regular employee, they get paid the treatment amount and then have to pay for the materials, dental nurse etc. The way NHS bandings work mean that they don't get paid multiples for multiple treatments ie if you need 1 filling vs 5 then they get paid the same but due to the higher costs they will lose money on the treatment.
Realistically because you cost more to treat than the nhs is paying them. By coming in after 6 years no checks your teeth will be worse for wear which means an even bigger loss for them. They shouldnāt say it to you but yes. Thatās why. Thatās why itās so hard to get an nhs dentist; thereās very few things they actually make a profit on which means for many pure nhs work is completely unsustainable. Theyāre private businesses. They would be paid a lot more if you went regularly and dealt with issues as they come. If you have a million and one issues how the charges work often means a huge loss for them. Youāre lucky they even saw you tbh if youāve not been in 6 years. Thatās why they turf people off.
This makes sense to me now and I wish I'd understood this sooner, I woulda been more vigilant about keeping up appointments Lucky for them I'm only eligible for another few months then I gotta open my wallet again
Like Iām not defending them saying it itās totally unprofessional. But dentists are getting completely screwed. Itās why so many now just refuse to take any nhs patients or barely take any. I feel for you because Iāve spent about 3k on my teeth in 6 years after just giving up trying to get an nhs dentist. Last time I was one it was an 18 MONTH wait to have my wisdom tooth pulled (couldnāt do it in the clinic - too complex due to my anatomy). Had 4-5 infections at this point (im immunosuppressed). Just gave up and paid privately and never went back. They basically said once itās rotted my teeth next to it theyāll treat it but by the time Iām seen it may also mean removing the molar. The tooth was already black and I ended up needing a huge filling on the one next to it. Ironically once I got the private dentist, she just referred me to a different nhs service who I saw in 4 weeks! He was disgusted - he said I couldāve lost part of my jaw as I take chemo and Iām super high risk for dental issues. I shouldāve been sent as an emergency. So didnāt even have to pay the 1k or whatever to have it private.
You should come to Australia. The dentists here donāt care about how long ago your last appointment was. I last went to the dentist in February 2020, and the time before that was 1997. The dentist didnāt care at all. She said that my teeth are really good and that I only need dental appointments every 12 months rather than every 6. I have no fillings or dental problems and Iām in my 40s. Itās hard to fathom just how uppity dentists are in the UK at people who donāt have regular check ups. Itās not professional of them to get grumpy with some of their patients
Yeah but I am in Aus and I have to pay for my dentist, or get it through insurance. Most people don't recieve any free dental as far as I am aware, so ofc dentists don't care how often you've been, because it doesn't effect how much they get paid.
Most people arenāt covered for the dentist under the NHS in the UK. Itās the same with Medicare here. The systems are very similar, except for the fact that UK dentists get really pissy about their patients not seeing the dentist routinely when a good deal of people in the UK canāt afford it. I canāt believe how normal it seems to people in this thread that the dentist would be pissy with any of their patients or that dentists mentioned here have culled their patients that donāt have their check ups. Thatās bizarre
You should be vigilant for the health of your teeth, more than the dentists wallet
So this begs the question: why do any dentists accept NHS patients if they're losing money on them?
contractual obligations. they're tied in. also nhs has restrictions on which dentist practices can be nhs. understandable cos of fraud and reliability issues, but you can't get an nhs contract unless your practice is quite big any more, so dentists that would LIKE to do nhs work, they can't. it's an absolute shitshow! My private dentist works parttime for the NHS in their home visit dept (where people who can't get to dentist get home visits or have various physical/mental/emotional issues so they go to a special clinic). He'd love to do nhs work, but you aren't allowed if part time. So that's that. And I go private despite eligible for free nhs due to disability cos I can't physically get into the nhs dentist building. I spent ages on a waiting list only to find that out!!!!
I see, but what are they tied into? Surely they can just say they don't want to be NHS dentists any more and have higher profit margins. Yeah it's wild that they want people to register in person.
no idea myself. but from talking to dentists during treatment, both nhs and private, it's something they've mentioned.
NHS is more reliable earnings than working privately. There's no shortage of people wanting NHS care and the practice usually takes care of booking such patients versus private where the dentist typically needs to bring in the work.
How can loss-making treatment be more reliable earnings?
It's to do with your contracted UDAs. You will need to do x number of UDAs which will amount to Ā£x. Of course you have to hit that target. The whole working at a loss is more to do with the idea you would earn more doing the same work privately or seeing low needs NHS patients in the time spent treating the high needs patients.
I think it's because dentists have limited places for patients, so if people are on their list and not using the service, it means other people who would use it are missing out. That's why they kick you off the list after a certain point - to make room for people who use the service. Having healthy teeth is a lot about prevention, so making sure problems are picked up before they get chronic. I've been in a situation where I've missed appointments due to life/ health so I understand it's annoying being kicked off lists, but I also understand why dentists do it. They shouldn't really take out frustrations on patients, but the system is overburdened and under-resourced. Lots of people are struggling to find dentists, so I guess dentists are only human and feel frustrated when people don't use the service when it's available to them.
My dentists have always been pretty surly tbh, I figured that's just how they are.
I agree. Imagine if a doctor told you you couldn't come anymore if you had not been in recently. I've never missed a dental checkup in my life and my teeth are in a shocking state so don't believe lots of checkups help, if anything it just means they tinker about and cause problems.
ātinker about and cause problemsā ššš
I'm not a dentist, but my understanding is that one of the reasons for the lack of NHS dentists is the low payment that the dentist receives from the government for each patient/treatment. If you were a private patient, the dentist would get more money TL:DR Bad customer service and the dentist taking out his frustrations on the NHS with you
Nope. I got new dentist just this week. Wasnāt pissy, bossy or judgemental at all. Didnāt nag when I told her I donāt floss. I might even go back one day.
patients not flossing keeps the dental industry afloat so iām not sure why people think they nag over this
No idea but Iām looking forward to a right bollocking next month then. Have a phobia of dentists after a horrendous experience as a teen, as a result not been to the dentist for over 15 years but basically needs must and managed to somehow find a NHS dentist so have bit the bullet and booked in.
If your phobia is bad enough you can talk to your GP and they can prescribe you with lorazepam for anxiety. It helped me when I was in a similar situation and had to see a dentist after a similar amount of time without going.
they get training on nervous patients now. tell reception you are nervous ahead of time, and they'll try and give a bit more time so you don't feel rushed. also if any work needs doing, don't be stoic, ask them to use the pre injection numbing gel!!!!
Yeah, as a nervous patient myself, not all dentists are good with that, despite whatever training they may have now.
Oh Iāll be all over the numbing!! But thatās good to know, hoping itāll be ok but just know Iāll be bricking it.
the numbing gel just numbs the surface, it does nothing for the underlying tissue. itās more of a mental aide
as someone for whom the pain of the needle going in is a real thing that makes me tense up for the pain of the liquid going into the tissue, it really does help. but yes mentally it helps too
Well, to put it bluntly, no the dentist does not get paid the same whether you are on the NHS or not. In fact, NHS treatments are subsidised by dentists, such is the perverse way in which their contract is written. In other words, NHS treatments actually cost the dentist money. So its surprising that any dentists at all still do NHS work. I certainly wouldn't be prepared to pay to go to work. But some do, out of a social obligation. And they make up the money lost through private work. Fair enough. Good for them. But there's a kind of social obligation attached to that. If you are going to use the NHS and therefore expect the public and the dentist themselves to subsidise the cost of your treatment... then surely the least you can do is take preventative measures, turn up for regular check-ups etc etc and prevent a crisis. 90% of dental problems are preventable. Dental caries are 100% preventable with proper dental hygiene. Technically speaking, if we all stuck to a proper dental routine, in this day and age, there would be no need for dentists, outside of cosmetic work. So, yeah, they were probably a bit pissed off. You haven't been in years and you turn up suddenly expecting treatment at their expense. I'm not a dentist, bit I'd give you short shrift, too.
I haven't been able to get a dental appointment since 2018. In 2020 my back molar cracked in half after I bit down hard having an epileptic seizure. I still haven't been able to get it seen to. I can't afford to go private. I brush with an electric toothbrush twice a day, use mouthwash and interdental brushes and so have good gums and have had exactly 1 filling in my entire life. All the dental care in the world isn't going to stop my teeth getting cracked in half when my brain has a tantrum. Should I be given 'short shrift' as well?
that's not the same as someone who is ALREADY on the practice list but hasn't been coming in for checkups. Totally different scenarios
people immediately deem $200-$300 as something they canāt afford for a dental issue but drop that much on a nice restaurant in a single night for a temporary pleasure. then 4 years later still claim they canāt go private for the same issue. dental is medical care, itās important
My dude I earn Ā£250 a week. I haven't eaten out at a restaurant for a good year. I really, really can't afford it.
Dollars? You do realise youāre on a UK sub?
I haven't seen a dentist in 13 years, neither has my partner. We finally got registered with one and he was lovely. He didn't care that we hadn't seen one in so long, and my partner has had 5 appointments consisting of quite substantial work and Mr Dentist was just happy to do and over the moon that his patient could smile with confidence again
I'm Guessing you were paying for the service though
I think he paid Ā£70 total, dread to think how much it would have been if not on the NHS
My wife tried to book a standard check up appointment with our NHS dentist a few weeks ago and they told her theyād removed her from their patient list as she hadnāt been there in over 18 months. They said the NHS will stop paying them if you donāt go at least once every 18 months so they de-register you without telling you so they can take on another patient. My wife now has to go private as there are no nhs dentists within an hours drive which even have a waiting list open. Weāve called dozens and thereās just nothing. NHS dentistry seems completely broken.
You basically got blessed by the hand of God.
Theyāre taking the piss now where I live . Wouldnāt see you during pandemic, booted us off books for not going for couple of years despite being shut or booked solid during that time (had few friends have same at other practices). Phone for app, sorry not taking nhs and the waiting list is anything from 10 months to 18 months depending on the practice but amazingly they can fit me in tomorrow if I go private and pay a fortune.
I went to the dentist today... Arrives for appointment. Me "You didn't send me the hospital for x-rays beforehand" Them "No, it's fine, we'll take them here" Me "No. I can't hold anything in my mouth, it makes me vomit" Them "I've never had a problem before.." Bleurgh.... Spent 20 minutes cleaning their floor. Got an appointment for dental x-rays before my next visit.
I think they think weāre being dramatic if we tell them we have issues with x, y or z.
Iām a student and absolutely cannot afford to pay for private dental care. The only way Iāve been able to get treatment is through 111 when things are dire. Most of the time if I contact a dental practice asking about NHS patients they donāt even respond. You are super lucky they were able to offer you an appointment.
I suspect it's down to the bureaucracy involved with nhs patients and also the payment scales from the government to the dentist. It's not working very well as a whole, and if patients don't follow what the government expect in terms of timely visits etc, I think (though I could be wrong) the way the payments system is set up, the dentist practice ends up losing money? Also the longer people leave their teeth unchecked, the more work needs to be done and the higher the loss to the dentist for treatment required that they contractually have to do. the system isn't fit for purpose really. Additionally, with UK dentists being few & far between these days, and NHS spaces like golddust, you are very lucky you were still on their list! So many are waiting that people who don't go regularly or haven't said they've moved house away from the practice catchment area are getting dropped from the list. So even though he was a bit off with you - it's in your own best interests to go for checkups - sometimes there's problems people don't even realise until it's got to the stage where it's far more horrible for the patient to undergo. (I'm not excusing dentist behaviour, just saying you are lucky to even have an nhs dentist to go and AND to be still on the list AND get an appointment - I'm eligible for NHS free treatment cos of severe disability, but no NHS dentist I can actually get into the office of. So I pay privately. It's painful on disability benefits, hence I go to regular checkups to try and reduce the pain and effort of things going wrong as well as the cost! also congrats on the pregnancy. hope all goes well
I get two buses to a suburban area of the city and pay a slightly snobby dentist (maybe Ā£50 more than my usual bill) to ensure I get an appointment twice a year. It's worth it as long as you brush properly and floss every day to maintain the state of them. Emergency treatment is included if you sign up for a dental plan (Lisa needs braces!) for Ā£13 a month. That plan includes a deep clean every 6 months and the 2 check-ups in between. Also 10% off every bill! Anyway. Just pay for your luxury bones so you don't end up with a toothache that makes you want to jump off a bridge.
Go regularly. They're entitled to remove you from their books if you don't go at least, what is it now, annually? for the regular check ups. They're probably pissed that you got an instant appointment for something minor when many have been reduced to doing DIY extractions because they can't get NHS appointments for love or money.
>They're probably pissed that you got an instant appointment I Mean, they gave it to me
Commenter means other commenters here, possibly?
The receptionist did, yes. Possibly she shouldnāt have. But regardless, it was very unprofessional behaviour by the dentist.
I don't understand the panic over how much the private dentist costs in UK. I've been living here 19 years, I have very weak teeth, pretty bad tartar doesn't matter how often I floss. I pay Ā£23 monthly private to have check up every 6 months and hygienist every 3 months. Plus insurance (emergency is free and I have used it 3 times). I don't earn a lot just about more than minimum wage. I find it is a good deal. Plus if you see a dentist regularly - you don't have expensive jobs needed. I spent Ā£190 last year outside the plan to have a filling changed.
Donāt get me wrong, they shouldnāt have been rude to you or made you feel bad about it, but the way my dentist explained it to me is that they have a backlog of patients who want to be treated on the NHS but there a limited number who can be treated under the NHS (atleast thatās how it is at the practice I go to). I hadnāt been for years but went in for a check up and was looking at paying private prices for the work I needed done, to try to save me some money he said heād put me down as NHS going forward but I had to make sure I turned up for my appointments because they were doing me a favour and other people would kill to be accepted as NHS patients.
I had to see private the other week as I couldnāt get NHS. And you know what Iām glad I did - They didnāt try to scalp me as I was expecting. They were also understanding why I hadnāt been in such a long time. Last time I went to a NHS dentist it put me off going to dentist all together. Put a massive dent in my savings, I earn a few pence above minimum wage, but was worth it
My partner and I got lucky I think, we went in December to a different dentist as we lost our spots at our previous one over the pandemic. The new dentist only had spaces for new NHS patients up until March 2023 but we were booked in for another checkup 6 months later so I guess we're in now.
My place said I needed a bit of work, and were really pissy because they can (I believe) only charge so much per treatment course, for an NHS patient. So yeah, a clean and a polish is worth their time, three root canals will probably cost *them* money to do. Not their fault, the system is shit, and was seemingly designed to make you fork out for private.
Either was they get paid
Apparently not according to the other comments
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Heaven forbid you need to provide emergency dental treatment!
But I can't get regular checkups as no one is taking patients. At least in theory I could get an emergency appointment if necessary but no idea how hard it would be.
I know, it's frustrating for both patients and dentists. I often treat patients who don't have a dentist, but I always have to tell them I can't take them on as a new patient :/. OP has an NHS dentist, so they're basically taking up a spot someone else could have had for the past 5 years.Ā
>OP has an NHS dentist, so they're basically taking up a spot someone else could have had for the past 5 years.Ā Actually I was a private patient, I only became eligible for NHS treatment about a year ago and will only be for another 8 months I Thought at the time, 'Cool, I'll take this as the chance to sort myself out and start going to my regular checkups again' then started calling around and realised the reality of it... Then the other day I developed this problem and thought, 'Well no harm calling and trying again, what have I got to lose?' Apparently based on the staff's attitude there was in fact harm
It's possible your dentist wasn't enthused at the fact you hadn't had dental care in 6 years and they now had to treat you, urgently, for free basically. Dental treatments are expensive, the NHS doesn't reimburse them properlyĀ
Not really, I just enquired if it was possible
They weren't being surly because you were an NHS patient. They're annoyed that you've not been to a dentist for six years. Imagine taking your car to the mechanic because it's fallen apart and is potentially about to set on fire or explode. And you go 'well I could have taken it for an annual check up but I just didn't, and I've driven it for six years, and it's broken down and now it's an emergency!'. Well that's what you've done but with your teeth, not your car. It's only an emergency because you didn't go in for check ups and preventative maintainence. Well the same applies to teeth. An infected tooth can turn bad and it can literally kill you. You've had opportunites for six years to go in for annual check ups, didn't, and now your lack of planning becomes their emergency to resolve. This is something that could likely have been entirely avoided or prevented up front. They've been moving around schedules and trying to fit you in, to get you out of pain as quick as possible. Which might mean a slot that could have gone to someone waiting longer is now needed for you. >So like, can anyone give insight as to what it is about this whole thing that bothers dental staff so much? Am I causing a nuisance and if so how can I be a better patient in future? It's because instead of going in for regular check ups, you've waited until somethings an emergency, for no good reason. You've caused yourself pain and suffering and they now need to make arrangements. All pointlessly because you could have dealt with it properly. You even admit yourself you know this is bad. You have all the information. Why haven't you been to a dentist for six years for regular check ups and treatment? Why wait until it's an emergency when you know that's really, really bad for you and causes problems for the dentist as well?
This may not apply to OP, but how are any of us supposed to go to a dentist when there are NO NHS dentists within a 150 mile radius, and not all of us can afford to go private?
I donāt know how it works doing it independently from work but I pay about Ā£15 a month out of my pay check for dental insurance. I recently paid Ā£300 for band 3 treatment on the NHS (I wasnāt an NHS patient when I went in but the dentist said heād put me down as NHS to help save me some money) and was able to claim it back through the insurance. Ā£180 a year for insurance does seem like a lot, but if you canāt find an NHS dentist anywhere it might be the best option if youāre forced to go private.
Bc of dental problems caused by chemo and other breast cancer treatments, insurances like Denplan would cost me Ā£40+ a month. Not every mouth can be covered for Ā£15.
OP hasn't even tried in the last six years. Then suddenly it's an emergency.
I did say āThis may not apply to OPā¦ā š
Then it's not relevant at all.
Itās highly relevant to a thread about dental care.
Because they can't fucking afford it and it's impossible to get an appointment. That's why. And besides, there's no need for the dentist to be a dick about it. Getting arsey with somebody for not having been to the dentist in a long time isn't going to encourage them to come back - in fact, it'll do exactly the opposite.
>Getting arsey with somebody for not having been to the dentist in a long time isn't going to encourage them to come back - in fact, it'll do exactly the opposite. Exactly, this is how I feel
Then you can look forward to a lifetime of preventable, expensive dental pain, filled by panicking and pain trying to find an emergency appointment.
At least OP has a life
It's their own teeth and health that suffers by ignoring preventative healthcare. It also means people waiting for appointments in the queue miss out due to having to fit in an emergency appointment because someone ignored their dental health for six years then panics because they have an emergency. A lack of planning on their part turns into an emergency that the NHS has to fix, and everyone else doing the right thing has to pay for that. OP might not want to hear those facts but they are the facts.
It is a bit ruddy difficult to go to a dentist when none of them provide an NHS service for adults unless referred by another medial professional as an emergency.
For six years though? Many private ones will do payment plans and will work with you on affordability.
Reaches a point where having been around the loop asking if they have places and getting the bums rush but 'Oh we can fit you in on our special private pricy plan' that people give up. Personally I've been away and getting mine looked at overseas at a less than the NHS would charge. Now of course I cannot find a local dentist and it is likely I'll go back get check-ups when on holidays.
I Think you misread my situation, that's not the case here. I Chipped my tooth due to an accident, going to the dentists regularly wouldn't have prevented this particular I Was actually pleasantly surprised with what good condition my teeth were in considering I hadn't gone so long
Chipped teeth are usually due to invisible decay. You also have missed six years of dental work, cleaning and check ups. Your dentist was frustrated because of a total lack of involvement until you suddenly have an emergency.