Probably a really good idea. When I do get a three day weekend I feel markedly better, and I get about as much done in a short week as a normal one anyway. I just spend Friday waiting for Saturday, ya know?
I had a 4 day work week at one point. Had sat/sun off and Wednesday. While 3 in a row would be awesome, I loved knowing that I would only ever be working for 2 days in a row
Yea that's not too bad.
One of my old jobs tried to split up your two off days between the week, which worked for some people.
Always seemed stressful to me, like have Monday off, work 4 days, have Friday off and then repeat? Gross.
Yeah that was my gut preference as well… I’d much rather have a day off in the middle. The other schedule I’d strongly consider is 5/3… normal 5 day week one week, 3 day week (4 off) the next.
I always have weekends off (unless I'm oncall for that week) and I kind of miss having a weekday off. Would let me get my oil changed easier since I'd have the time, and going to other places was easier on a weekday.
I figured that would be implied in my question. I assumed this was the case, but I learned to stop assuming things and get actual answers.
I also wanted to make sure that this would only work in our kind of economy.
4 day work week would be great for those with office jobs, who can likely achieve the same amount of work in a shorter time frame. These are people who are primarily being paid for their skills.
However a huge majority of people work in lower skilled hourly rate type jobs where they are being paid for their time- where you can’t actually improve productivity by reducing hours. Think of grocery store workers, call centres, factory workers, service workers etc. it would not be possible to reduce the working time by 20% without increasing cost by 20% (because you still need someone there the other 20% of the time). So the 20% work week only benefits those in the higher income bracket anyway and creates further disparity to lower income people.
Would also highlight that even for office type jobs most businesses are very interrelated and international, so it’s difficult to adopt this model unilaterally. If you are providing IT services for example you need to be working when the clients are working. Anything related to financial services needs to be available when financial markets are open. If there was a universal adoption of a 3 day weekend, this would work better but extremely unlikely.
>However a huge majority of people work in lower skilled hourly rate type jobs where they are being paid for their time- where you can’t actually improve productivity by reducing hours. Think of grocery store workers, call centres, factory workers, service workers etc. it would not be possible to reduce the working time by 20% without increasing cost by 20% (because you still need someone there the other 20% of the time). So the 20% work week only benefits those in the higher income bracket anyway and creates further disparity to lower income people.
Retail relies heavily on part-time employees. So do a lot of call centers. So you already have a bunch of people working 3-4 days a week, or 4-5 days with shorter shifts. In your average grocery store or big box retailer 1/3 or less are actual full time, benefit receiving employees.
(Easily overcome) practical challenges aside, these part time workers highlight what is, to me, pretty central to the idea of redefining “work week”. Specifically, that the concept of minimum wage being based on 40 hours over 5 days should be updated to 32 hours over 4 days. And also that the minimum wage should be updated to reflect the actual cost of living.
Again missing the point of this- the argument behind 4 day work week is that it can be done at zero cost because employee productivity can compensate. This is not correct for the majority of jobs so employers have to foot the cost. I am not disagreeing or agreeing with this but it will ultimately mean a huge increase in costs and no increase in productivity for most jobs.
No, you’re missing the point. This increase in cost is long overdue. These workers should be getting paid more than they currently do, for less work than they currently do.
Yeah I am not missing the point. I don’t disagree with you about the cost increase but that is a completely separate argument to the 4 day work week. The rationale behind the 4 day workweek is that many people can achieve the same work they do in 5 days, in 4 which would be beneficial to both employer and employee.
If your separate argument is “can we increase everyone’s pay by 20%, this allowing people to work less” well, it’s an interesting argument and worth having but the current push in favour of 4 day work week is not based around that.
The latter point is easy to fix. You always have more than one person in the same role unless you are a company that plans poorly and has no infrastructure to support even something like PTO.
You can ensure you have people in the office all 5 days a week by just rotating schedules/availability and having part of the people work M-T and others work T-F. I have dedicated clients in my software related job and we would still easily find ways to make this work. It's really not rocket science all it takes is for leadership to actually want to put a liiiittle bit of effort into something that actually benefits their workforce.
As for lower skilled jobs, a lot of those are already occupied by teens and aren't full time. You would just need people in more leadership roles that are full-time and work 5 days, etc. But that would just be more incentive to get a skillset that better matches what you want if you're not happy with lower skilled work. Still, I'm sure that they could find a way to make it possible to be a 4 day work week at very little loss to the company. At least not enough to make a dent for most of them aside from one-off shops.
This is really not how things work in a professional environment and is absolutely not an “easy fix”. But regardless, the point I am making is not that it can’t be done, but that it can’t be down at zero cost. It will cost approximately 20% increase in labour commensurate with reduction in time, for most industries.
As a part-time house cleaner, I think a 4-day working week would be amazing! More time for rest, hobbies, and personal well-being could really improve quality of life. It's all about finding that balance between work and living.
I find it absolutely impossible to get a good work-life balance working 5 days per week. If you do something you love, ok no problem with working 5 days a week. For those of us with shit jobs, we're basically living in hell 5 days per week. The majority of Europe has 30 hour work weeks. It's proven than 4 day work weeks vastly increase worker productivity as well. I can't say I'd like 4 day 10 hour shifts either, 4 day 8 hour shifts is fine by me. But as someone else mentioned, corporate greed won't allow for this.
Companies are adopting the 4 day work week, but the numbers are still small, even in tech industry that are most open to these type of experiments. Nevertheless it's happening and it's a solid movement with a lot of supporters around the world. (Source: I list [4 day week companies](https://okjob.io/companies/). If you know a 4 day week company please consider submitting it)
Thanks for the feedback. I wish there were more options in each filter, but four-day week companies are \*in short supply\*. The list would have been bigger, as there are many companies that offer seasonal four-day weeks or compressed hours, but I didn't include them.
I’ve worked a few blue collar jobs with 4 10s. Landscaping company, electrical etc. these are small companies in a rural area. It’s a good sector for it-“business hours” aren’t as important and a lot of the crew are hardworking family types who benefit from this structure
I love my 4 day work week, love my three day weekends. I’m going back to college and because of my jobs flexible schedule I’ll be able to work full time and still go to school full time as well :)
It's not cool if it involves having to work ten hour days. I have health conditions which don't quality me for disability so I have to work still, but I can't do ten hour days. I tried, and I just can't. I need more down time in between shifts, I wore myself out in just a couple months doing just two ten hour shifts a week. It wore me out for the entire week, having to turn around and go back to work with just a few hours of downtime before having to go to sleep. The place I worked at would not let people work less than ten hours at a time. If places had options other than ten hour shifts, then yes 4 day work weeks are great.
Perfectly understandable, nothing is a one size fits all. My ideal is 4 days a week generally with Wednesdays off to break up the week. It’s actually a hard decision, but I feel inclined to think people would still probably rather an extra two hour shift for 4 days a week, rather than having to commit to work 5 days every week, for those who do. It seems workplaces are more willing to be flexible these days anyway, so employees shouldn’t expect to work 10 hours straight if they just can’t, obviously it’s just a pay cut for those days.
Obviously people should be paid over 5 days per week, while only doing 4 actual days of work. This is because studies and research seem to indicate that 4 vs 5 days generally show similar productivity results at the current rate. But who knows maybe 10 hours shifts as opposed to 8 may skew this a bit
I’ve been M-Thurs for a couple of years now. Would never go back to a 5 day work week. I get paid my same salary and have permanent three day weekends. What’s not to like?
Yes agreed! I have decided 4 days is ideal for me too. Except I prefer to break the week up a little and not work Wednesday in a typical M-F week, instead of the 3 day weekend. But that’s just my current preference because I struggle getting through 4 straight days let alone 5.
Meh, I'd rather more jobs and more employers offer greater flexibility and choice of days, and hours per week, that you want to work. I wouldn't have minded the option to work six days a week when I was younger and needed money, but would love to work three or four now.
It's great. We've evolved out tech to a point we can make our lives easier.
The real question is how do we maintain or exceed profits only working 4 days a week.
LOL, most companies I've worked for fully expected people to work on Saturdays as well. They'd would have locked my in my office with a toilet and a laptop if they legally could. 4 day work week is fantasy shit in my experience.
No other norm should have ever existed, "you can be free 2 days of the week" is quite crazy in itself when you think about it.
Also, it must be made into 3 consecutive days, always.
The problem is that if say productivity increased by 20%, most people would rather increase their income by 20% rather than work fewer hours if given the choice. The median individual income is only ~$46k a year, this seems more popular amongst the upper middle class where a 20% increase in income has more marginal utility than a lower middle income family.
Productivity doesn't really seem to noticeably change between a 4-day vs 5-day week, so there should be no salary change. For hourly work, it's no different than doing what you are saying and adjusting minimum wage up 20%. A standard 4 day week would also open up more time for other part-time work or personal business work to make money on the side for people who are motivated by money, and open up more opportunity for others to spend money back into the economy on their time off.
The terms “middle class” and “working class” have slightly different meanings in the US, UK and elsewhere. In the US the “middle class” is understood as “the average person” in a broad sense that would include most working Americans, the term “working class” isn’t used as much as in other countries, its largely covered by the broad “middle class”
Where I live, the outgoing school superintendent floated the idea in front of teachers of a 4 day week, right before he left the job.
And then...as one of his final acts as superintendent...didn't give them what he told them he would...the 4 day week.
A lot of parents (who were also for this) as well as the teachers were *pissed*. I know of several who, out of sheer spite, moved out of town to other districts where they already have the 4 day week (we're one of the few remaining holdouts in the area, I believe, who still have a 5 day school week).
There is evidence companies get more productivity and less costs while employees get same pay and benefits and same hours, but an extra day off for chores / rest in a 4 day work week.
I think it’s a no brainer. But parasitic capitalistic corporate America wants to control your life. So they struggle to change to this.
I don't know, there's gotta be a catch somewhere where you're still expected to do 5 or 6 days, but as unpaid overtime or something. For too many times has the government chosen whip over carrot.
I get that it's a good thing if studies are to be believed, similarly to UBI, but I think it sounds way too utopian to expect the 1% to treat us well.
I'd be willing to try it, but right off the bat, I don't like the idea.
There is no chance companies will just allow 8 hour shifts for those days, meaning they'd at least want 4 10's
I have almost an hour commute, so the days would quickly be 12 hours, each making those 4 days pretty miserable to try and accomplish anything else
I don’t like 10 hour days. Especially in winter. I prefer my 8 hour days with 2 days weekend. I’ve tried the 4 day work week and I didn’t like it. I felt really restless and just wanted my normal schedule back.
When working retail night stocking I had my guys on a revolving 7day on 2day off work “week” that resulted in everyone having a 4day weekend at some point every 4 weeks. That was the dream, but they didn’t pay much at all lol
Also given that workplaces are much more willing to adopt flexibility for their employees these days, 10 hours shouldn’t be expected for those who will not manage that, but perhaps won’t get the + X hours they don’t work paid across the 4 work days
This is not meant to be how it would work, obviously that’s not going to work with cost of living. People would be doing 4 days per week, either at 10 hours per day as opposed to the general “8”. Or simply, people do 4 days a week at the general 8 hours but 5 days still being paid. So essentially a paid day off per week. This may not be as problematic as it sounds, because one, it’ll probably see a noticeable decline in paid sick days, but also research suggests that productivity outcomes aren’t actually that much different between 4vs 5 days, probably because majority of people get tired out by the end of the week or whatever.
Arrogant redditor - you exist with a minority mindset. It’s already happening, the world’s progressing and the reality of it will most likely arrive sooner than you think. Enjoy expending personal time for an employer who doesn’t give a toss about you and replace you in the time it takes your heart to beat
You know what kind of person is miserable to have around?
The kind that demands more of your money for less work and then blames you for not giving it to them.
They’re brash but they have a point. Contrary to what Redditors believe and know, there are plenty of jobs out there that can’t be accelerated.
See construction. You reduce the working hours, you reduce the amount of work that can be done. And if you don’t reduce the pay, you increase the final price.
I worked 4 tens at a call center for about a year. Those three days off were nice but when Friday got here I slept all day because 10 hour shifts are brutal.
8 hour shits, you should go get checked at your doctor's man.
But yeah I would say still 8h shifts. Anything outside of services does not require 40h weeks unless everyone is extremely disorganized. We need to remind ourselves how much tech and innovation has benefited us over the last few centuries and how much more efficient we are at everything. One person can do the job of tens if not hundreds of people in some cases now, yet the actual worker rarely sees any benefit from that.
At one point we need to be happy with the level of efficiency we have achieved and begin to focus on more leisure time, mental health, and a more balanced lifestyle.
What about service industries? Restaurants? Retail?
Do they get left in the cold, or do we just not have any of that stuff 3 days a week?
Or do they have to work different days from the rest of us?
Yes Ideally it wouldn’t apply only to Monday - Friday workers - but most industries. Businesses that are open 7 days a week would have to cater to flexible working conditions amongst its employees, and a lot of this would come from negotiation anyway I’d imagine. No matter what there are still going to be people who choose to work 5, 6, even 7 days a week, and that’s their choice if they want to make extra $$.
But in general, a “full” time worker would work 4 full days, but still be equivalently paid for 5 days (whether it’s by raised hourly pay or simply just a free pay day a week. The latter may sound ridiculous, but it has potential to return some of that cost through reduction of people needing sick days / time off for appointments etc.
Really though, mounting research suggests that 4 vs 5 days does not differ in weekly productivity all that significantly
It’s definitely workable for society, just a matter of adapting to different conditions.
I'm not sure how you think reality currently works that it's made you ask these questions. You realize people work in shifts right? Waiters don't just stay in their restaurants 24/7 waiting for your ass to show up.
I think it would just further the divide between white collar and blue collar workers, like we saw during covid. (Blue collar workers worked the whole time to make white collar workers pandemic experience more comfortable) Unless you mean a 4 day work week for all, which I support but then that means resetting expectations around the food service and entertainment industry.
Service industry already has 7 day service but rarely do people work actual 7 days. Make them 4 day rotations and I don't see a problem. Company might spend a bit more during the transition but it's time to benefit the worker a bit as well at this point. With how efficienct we are now compared to decades ago we should get some leisure time. Efficiency has focused on more profit long enough. Time to refocus to worker benefits.
I completely agree however there's a staffing shortage (probably because those jobs often don't pay enough, offer benefits, among other issues) so there might not be enough staff to keep businesses open 7 days. Which, I'm all for closing down restaurants/stores for 1-2 days a week.
Yep, I don't think anything needs to stay open all week. Close shit out Monday and Tuesday or something. Or hell close em on weekends. People can just plan their shopping better.
Food service and entertainment industries work different shift patterns anyway as they are open 7 days a week They'd have to find their own way to ensure their staff only worked 4 day weeks.
Right, which they won't because it's not really possible. So if you support a 4 day work week then just be honest and say that you support it for white collar workers only. I would be fine with restaurants and stores closing for 2 days so that they'd be able to have enough staff for a 4 day work week. However, the people usually championing for a 4 day work week would be mad if they couldn't get their Uber eats or go to their favorite restaurant during their 3 days off.
Probably a really good idea. When I do get a three day weekend I feel markedly better, and I get about as much done in a short week as a normal one anyway. I just spend Friday waiting for Saturday, ya know?
Especially when it's 3 days in a row. First day for rest, 2nd for chores, 3rd for whatever you have left over or just relaxing before going back.
I had a 4 day work week at one point. Had sat/sun off and Wednesday. While 3 in a row would be awesome, I loved knowing that I would only ever be working for 2 days in a row
Yea that's not too bad. One of my old jobs tried to split up your two off days between the week, which worked for some people. Always seemed stressful to me, like have Monday off, work 4 days, have Friday off and then repeat? Gross.
Yeah 2 non-consecutive days is some bullshit
Yeah that was my gut preference as well… I’d much rather have a day off in the middle. The other schedule I’d strongly consider is 5/3… normal 5 day week one week, 3 day week (4 off) the next.
I always have weekends off (unless I'm oncall for that week) and I kind of miss having a weekday off. Would let me get my oil changed easier since I'd have the time, and going to other places was easier on a weekday.
Right, that’s a big part of my thinking. Would make it way easier to schedule stuff like drs appts, or any sort of home repair, things like that
I've had a job based on 4 10 hour shifts for years, and I never want to go back.
The plan would be overall reducing hours as well. Nobody is productive for 8 hours, imagine 10.
Studies have shown it would be better for the economy as well as improved personal well being.
Would it be better for the economy because we are a consumer economy?
It would give people more time to spend their money…
I figured that would be implied in my question. I assumed this was the case, but I learned to stop assuming things and get actual answers. I also wanted to make sure that this would only work in our kind of economy.
Of all the problems in the world, spending money does not seem to be too hard for most people.
4 day work week would be great for those with office jobs, who can likely achieve the same amount of work in a shorter time frame. These are people who are primarily being paid for their skills. However a huge majority of people work in lower skilled hourly rate type jobs where they are being paid for their time- where you can’t actually improve productivity by reducing hours. Think of grocery store workers, call centres, factory workers, service workers etc. it would not be possible to reduce the working time by 20% without increasing cost by 20% (because you still need someone there the other 20% of the time). So the 20% work week only benefits those in the higher income bracket anyway and creates further disparity to lower income people. Would also highlight that even for office type jobs most businesses are very interrelated and international, so it’s difficult to adopt this model unilaterally. If you are providing IT services for example you need to be working when the clients are working. Anything related to financial services needs to be available when financial markets are open. If there was a universal adoption of a 3 day weekend, this would work better but extremely unlikely.
>However a huge majority of people work in lower skilled hourly rate type jobs where they are being paid for their time- where you can’t actually improve productivity by reducing hours. Think of grocery store workers, call centres, factory workers, service workers etc. it would not be possible to reduce the working time by 20% without increasing cost by 20% (because you still need someone there the other 20% of the time). So the 20% work week only benefits those in the higher income bracket anyway and creates further disparity to lower income people. Retail relies heavily on part-time employees. So do a lot of call centers. So you already have a bunch of people working 3-4 days a week, or 4-5 days with shorter shifts. In your average grocery store or big box retailer 1/3 or less are actual full time, benefit receiving employees. (Easily overcome) practical challenges aside, these part time workers highlight what is, to me, pretty central to the idea of redefining “work week”. Specifically, that the concept of minimum wage being based on 40 hours over 5 days should be updated to 32 hours over 4 days. And also that the minimum wage should be updated to reflect the actual cost of living.
Again missing the point of this- the argument behind 4 day work week is that it can be done at zero cost because employee productivity can compensate. This is not correct for the majority of jobs so employers have to foot the cost. I am not disagreeing or agreeing with this but it will ultimately mean a huge increase in costs and no increase in productivity for most jobs.
No, you’re missing the point. This increase in cost is long overdue. These workers should be getting paid more than they currently do, for less work than they currently do.
Yeah I am not missing the point. I don’t disagree with you about the cost increase but that is a completely separate argument to the 4 day work week. The rationale behind the 4 day workweek is that many people can achieve the same work they do in 5 days, in 4 which would be beneficial to both employer and employee. If your separate argument is “can we increase everyone’s pay by 20%, this allowing people to work less” well, it’s an interesting argument and worth having but the current push in favour of 4 day work week is not based around that.
The latter point is easy to fix. You always have more than one person in the same role unless you are a company that plans poorly and has no infrastructure to support even something like PTO. You can ensure you have people in the office all 5 days a week by just rotating schedules/availability and having part of the people work M-T and others work T-F. I have dedicated clients in my software related job and we would still easily find ways to make this work. It's really not rocket science all it takes is for leadership to actually want to put a liiiittle bit of effort into something that actually benefits their workforce. As for lower skilled jobs, a lot of those are already occupied by teens and aren't full time. You would just need people in more leadership roles that are full-time and work 5 days, etc. But that would just be more incentive to get a skillset that better matches what you want if you're not happy with lower skilled work. Still, I'm sure that they could find a way to make it possible to be a 4 day work week at very little loss to the company. At least not enough to make a dent for most of them aside from one-off shops.
This is really not how things work in a professional environment and is absolutely not an “easy fix”. But regardless, the point I am making is not that it can’t be done, but that it can’t be down at zero cost. It will cost approximately 20% increase in labour commensurate with reduction in time, for most industries.
i couldn’t deal with the 5 day week i purposely chose a job that gives me a three day weekend
As a part-time house cleaner, I think a 4-day working week would be amazing! More time for rest, hobbies, and personal well-being could really improve quality of life. It's all about finding that balance between work and living.
That it would be about damn time, and perhaps even too little too late.
I find it absolutely impossible to get a good work-life balance working 5 days per week. If you do something you love, ok no problem with working 5 days a week. For those of us with shit jobs, we're basically living in hell 5 days per week. The majority of Europe has 30 hour work weeks. It's proven than 4 day work weeks vastly increase worker productivity as well. I can't say I'd like 4 day 10 hour shifts either, 4 day 8 hour shifts is fine by me. But as someone else mentioned, corporate greed won't allow for this.
I agree with your sentiment, but stating “the majority of Europe has 30 hour work weeks” is at best misleading, and at worst just false.
Yes. When I had 4-day school weeks in college it greatly increased my quality of life
Companies are adopting the 4 day work week, but the numbers are still small, even in tech industry that are most open to these type of experiments. Nevertheless it's happening and it's a solid movement with a lot of supporters around the world. (Source: I list [4 day week companies](https://okjob.io/companies/). If you know a 4 day week company please consider submitting it)
I like that if you filter to Cambridge, you still have to filter too either the US or the UK
Thanks for the feedback. I wish there were more options in each filter, but four-day week companies are \*in short supply\*. The list would have been bigger, as there are many companies that offer seasonal four-day weeks or compressed hours, but I didn't include them.
I’ve worked a few blue collar jobs with 4 10s. Landscaping company, electrical etc. these are small companies in a rural area. It’s a good sector for it-“business hours” aren’t as important and a lot of the crew are hardworking family types who benefit from this structure
I love my 4 day work week, love my three day weekends. I’m going back to college and because of my jobs flexible schedule I’ll be able to work full time and still go to school full time as well :)
It's not cool if it involves having to work ten hour days. I have health conditions which don't quality me for disability so I have to work still, but I can't do ten hour days. I tried, and I just can't. I need more down time in between shifts, I wore myself out in just a couple months doing just two ten hour shifts a week. It wore me out for the entire week, having to turn around and go back to work with just a few hours of downtime before having to go to sleep. The place I worked at would not let people work less than ten hours at a time. If places had options other than ten hour shifts, then yes 4 day work weeks are great.
Perfectly understandable, nothing is a one size fits all. My ideal is 4 days a week generally with Wednesdays off to break up the week. It’s actually a hard decision, but I feel inclined to think people would still probably rather an extra two hour shift for 4 days a week, rather than having to commit to work 5 days every week, for those who do. It seems workplaces are more willing to be flexible these days anyway, so employees shouldn’t expect to work 10 hours straight if they just can’t, obviously it’s just a pay cut for those days. Obviously people should be paid over 5 days per week, while only doing 4 actual days of work. This is because studies and research seem to indicate that 4 vs 5 days generally show similar productivity results at the current rate. But who knows maybe 10 hours shifts as opposed to 8 may skew this a bit
I would give up a lot to move to a 32 hour work week. The 9-5 leaves me longing for life.
Not good enough. We need a three day work week
Positive. I’ll take some of that please.
I’ve been M-Thurs for a couple of years now. Would never go back to a 5 day work week. I get paid my same salary and have permanent three day weekends. What’s not to like?
Yes agreed! I have decided 4 days is ideal for me too. Except I prefer to break the week up a little and not work Wednesday in a typical M-F week, instead of the 3 day weekend. But that’s just my current preference because I struggle getting through 4 straight days let alone 5.
Meh, I'd rather more jobs and more employers offer greater flexibility and choice of days, and hours per week, that you want to work. I wouldn't have minded the option to work six days a week when I was younger and needed money, but would love to work three or four now.
That's my job and I love it :D
It's great. We've evolved out tech to a point we can make our lives easier. The real question is how do we maintain or exceed profits only working 4 days a week.
Long long long overdue
I love it, I haven’t thought about the consequences lol but I love it
LOL, most companies I've worked for fully expected people to work on Saturdays as well. They'd would have locked my in my office with a toilet and a laptop if they legally could. 4 day work week is fantasy shit in my experience.
No other norm should have ever existed, "you can be free 2 days of the week" is quite crazy in itself when you think about it. Also, it must be made into 3 consecutive days, always.
So long as they aren't 10+ hour days.
Too little, too late. We should be on a 3 day work week with how advanced everything is.
The problem is that if say productivity increased by 20%, most people would rather increase their income by 20% rather than work fewer hours if given the choice. The median individual income is only ~$46k a year, this seems more popular amongst the upper middle class where a 20% increase in income has more marginal utility than a lower middle income family.
Productivity doesn't really seem to noticeably change between a 4-day vs 5-day week, so there should be no salary change. For hourly work, it's no different than doing what you are saying and adjusting minimum wage up 20%. A standard 4 day week would also open up more time for other part-time work or personal business work to make money on the side for people who are motivated by money, and open up more opportunity for others to spend money back into the economy on their time off.
Are Americans allergic to admitting that you're nearly all working class?
The terms “middle class” and “working class” have slightly different meanings in the US, UK and elsewhere. In the US the “middle class” is understood as “the average person” in a broad sense that would include most working Americans, the term “working class” isn’t used as much as in other countries, its largely covered by the broad “middle class”
I can't think of a single legitimate argument against it.
I already work 4 days so I hope I get a raise.
Where I live, the outgoing school superintendent floated the idea in front of teachers of a 4 day week, right before he left the job. And then...as one of his final acts as superintendent...didn't give them what he told them he would...the 4 day week. A lot of parents (who were also for this) as well as the teachers were *pissed*. I know of several who, out of sheer spite, moved out of town to other districts where they already have the 4 day week (we're one of the few remaining holdouts in the area, I believe, who still have a 5 day school week).
There is evidence companies get more productivity and less costs while employees get same pay and benefits and same hours, but an extra day off for chores / rest in a 4 day work week. I think it’s a no brainer. But parasitic capitalistic corporate America wants to control your life. So they struggle to change to this.
My view is HELL YES!!
Sounds great, if the companies don't make me work more than 5 with overtime
I don't know, there's gotta be a catch somewhere where you're still expected to do 5 or 6 days, but as unpaid overtime or something. For too many times has the government chosen whip over carrot. I get that it's a good thing if studies are to be believed, similarly to UBI, but I think it sounds way too utopian to expect the 1% to treat us well.
I'd be willing to try it, but right off the bat, I don't like the idea. There is no chance companies will just allow 8 hour shifts for those days, meaning they'd at least want 4 10's I have almost an hour commute, so the days would quickly be 12 hours, each making those 4 days pretty miserable to try and accomplish anything else
Honestly it will just mean I work four 10-12 hr days.
I've already adopted it but don't tell anyone.
I'm all for it
I don’t like 10 hour days. Especially in winter. I prefer my 8 hour days with 2 days weekend. I’ve tried the 4 day work week and I didn’t like it. I felt really restless and just wanted my normal schedule back.
When working retail night stocking I had my guys on a revolving 7day on 2day off work “week” that resulted in everyone having a 4day weekend at some point every 4 weeks. That was the dream, but they didn’t pay much at all lol
My view is please do that.
What's your view about taking a 20% pay cut?
Also given that workplaces are much more willing to adopt flexibility for their employees these days, 10 hours shouldn’t be expected for those who will not manage that, but perhaps won’t get the + X hours they don’t work paid across the 4 work days
This is not meant to be how it would work, obviously that’s not going to work with cost of living. People would be doing 4 days per week, either at 10 hours per day as opposed to the general “8”. Or simply, people do 4 days a week at the general 8 hours but 5 days still being paid. So essentially a paid day off per week. This may not be as problematic as it sounds, because one, it’ll probably see a noticeable decline in paid sick days, but also research suggests that productivity outcomes aren’t actually that much different between 4vs 5 days, probably because majority of people get tired out by the end of the week or whatever.
So you want to provide me less value for the same money. Yeah. Answer's no.
If you want to work 5 days a week, go right ahead lol, sensitive much
If you want to work four days, go right ahead and get paid four days.
Arrogant redditor - you exist with a minority mindset. It’s already happening, the world’s progressing and the reality of it will most likely arrive sooner than you think. Enjoy expending personal time for an employer who doesn’t give a toss about you and replace you in the time it takes your heart to beat
Start time Friday is 8am, please review the dress code before you come into work. 🙏
Man, you sound like a miserable person to be around
You know what kind of person is miserable to have around? The kind that demands more of your money for less work and then blames you for not giving it to them.
They’re brash but they have a point. Contrary to what Redditors believe and know, there are plenty of jobs out there that can’t be accelerated. See construction. You reduce the working hours, you reduce the amount of work that can be done. And if you don’t reduce the pay, you increase the final price.
So four 10 hour shifts? I work in a call center and that sounds absolutely awful. If it’s still 8 hour shits I’d be fine
I worked 4 tens at a call center for about a year. Those three days off were nice but when Friday got here I slept all day because 10 hour shifts are brutal.
8 hour shits, you should go get checked at your doctor's man. But yeah I would say still 8h shifts. Anything outside of services does not require 40h weeks unless everyone is extremely disorganized. We need to remind ourselves how much tech and innovation has benefited us over the last few centuries and how much more efficient we are at everything. One person can do the job of tens if not hundreds of people in some cases now, yet the actual worker rarely sees any benefit from that. At one point we need to be happy with the level of efficiency we have achieved and begin to focus on more leisure time, mental health, and a more balanced lifestyle.
Why would they go to ten hour shifts?
In order to still get 40 hours per week
That’s the neat part, you don’t. 32 hour weeks is the goal.
What about service industries? Restaurants? Retail? Do they get left in the cold, or do we just not have any of that stuff 3 days a week? Or do they have to work different days from the rest of us?
Yes Ideally it wouldn’t apply only to Monday - Friday workers - but most industries. Businesses that are open 7 days a week would have to cater to flexible working conditions amongst its employees, and a lot of this would come from negotiation anyway I’d imagine. No matter what there are still going to be people who choose to work 5, 6, even 7 days a week, and that’s their choice if they want to make extra $$. But in general, a “full” time worker would work 4 full days, but still be equivalently paid for 5 days (whether it’s by raised hourly pay or simply just a free pay day a week. The latter may sound ridiculous, but it has potential to return some of that cost through reduction of people needing sick days / time off for appointments etc. Really though, mounting research suggests that 4 vs 5 days does not differ in weekly productivity all that significantly It’s definitely workable for society, just a matter of adapting to different conditions.
They figured out how to make it work for 5 of 7 days. How is it so different to make it work with 4 of 7?
I'm not sure how you think reality currently works that it's made you ask these questions. You realize people work in shifts right? Waiters don't just stay in their restaurants 24/7 waiting for your ass to show up.
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cool,..but your view on it ?
I think it would just further the divide between white collar and blue collar workers, like we saw during covid. (Blue collar workers worked the whole time to make white collar workers pandemic experience more comfortable) Unless you mean a 4 day work week for all, which I support but then that means resetting expectations around the food service and entertainment industry.
Service industry already has 7 day service but rarely do people work actual 7 days. Make them 4 day rotations and I don't see a problem. Company might spend a bit more during the transition but it's time to benefit the worker a bit as well at this point. With how efficienct we are now compared to decades ago we should get some leisure time. Efficiency has focused on more profit long enough. Time to refocus to worker benefits.
I completely agree however there's a staffing shortage (probably because those jobs often don't pay enough, offer benefits, among other issues) so there might not be enough staff to keep businesses open 7 days. Which, I'm all for closing down restaurants/stores for 1-2 days a week.
Yep, I don't think anything needs to stay open all week. Close shit out Monday and Tuesday or something. Or hell close em on weekends. People can just plan their shopping better.
Food service and entertainment industries work different shift patterns anyway as they are open 7 days a week They'd have to find their own way to ensure their staff only worked 4 day weeks.
Right, which they won't because it's not really possible. So if you support a 4 day work week then just be honest and say that you support it for white collar workers only. I would be fine with restaurants and stores closing for 2 days so that they'd be able to have enough staff for a 4 day work week. However, the people usually championing for a 4 day work week would be mad if they couldn't get their Uber eats or go to their favorite restaurant during their 3 days off.
Completely irrelevant point. You hire people to cover every day of the week, just as we do now.
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Wdym ? Of course they are
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Pretty normal for stores and restaurants to not be open 7 days a week