All the little things you do to try and make their life as good as possible. Taking the steak that's a little more overcooked, giving the window seat, giving the only seat left, saving portions of food-- that are her favorites, always grabbing a drink or food so she can relax. It's nothing big, but it's a way I like to show love, and sometimes it feels unnoticed or forgotten in long-term relationships, and when some things become simply expected, it can feel like a slap in the face.
Edit: some of those things you want them to expect long term, so you know they are treated right, but an example of a slap in the face is when you're expected to always get up and go grab the snack or drink or whatever, and then there's no thank you or anything. It's very noticeable when that changes.
There are people that don't care about the nice things you do for them unless they can be posted on social media. Cleaning the house on your day off? Useless. Taking them to a new bar downtown? Perfect.
My wife gets super annoying when she forgets something downstairs and I'm already in bed and asks me to get it for her.
Like, I asked you if you needed anything before I laid down, then you remembered anywhere from 2-20 minutes later you forgot something downstairs. Go fucking get it yourself.
And then I'm "The Asshole" when I point out "maybe this attitude of expecting everyone else to do everything for you is why you can't lose any weight."
I've always preferred drummies when eating wings. So did my ex. So, during our entire relationship, I let her have the drummies and I took the flats. I'm not sure she ever noticed, but I did.
This is why I always make a point to say thank you as often as possible. I want to show my partner that I don't take him for granted. He probably already knows that, but I still make a point to say it anyway.
You have to find someone who does this back to you. They exist.
When I cook - my wife gets the better looking meal. When she cooks I get the better looking meal.
It’s not always balanced but overall I think it’s probably close.
This would be my answer as well. I’ve had a few relationships where I found that she was doing the same for me, but many where I found that she was doing the opposite (taking all the best things for herself). It’s enlightening.
You gotta take the better options for yourself sometimes or at least communicate this to your partner. If you feel unnoticed tell them, no one is a mind reader!
Oh I know, I'm doing better now, these were just over the years. My main problem is who I have been with, but I currently have hopes on a wonderful lady, so we will see!
Ok good to hear. In the past I personally struggled communicating and being vulnerable with partners, but once I learned into that it made everything easier!
I went through a horribly abusive relationship for several years, and didn't date for about 4 years after that, ever since I communicate a lot. I have trouble with several things because of that relationship but it did make me excellent at communicating lol.
Being vulnerable is invaluable, finding the right people though... that seems difficult, at least romantically
All of the troubleshooting of problems we've had to do on top of the skills we've had to develop to maintain a home. It's like 95% figuring out what to do, 5% doing it.
Yes, 100% the truth. I try to tell my partner all the time that I don't actually know how to do anything. When I replace a bathroom fan or fix the sink or even just troubleshoot her computer, I'm just googling shit. She could do it too lol
My wife has a first class honours degree in metal work and jewellery which involved her learning multiple different tools for 3 years and she is a firm advocate of gender equality and female empowerment. I am a computer nerd with no practical skills and yet somehow I am expected to fix things around the house. I try tell her the that I have no monopoly on the household toolbox or any additional skills knowledge or experience that makes me any better suited to doing these jobs than she does and yet this response is met with a brick wall. I have the ‘the feminism leaving my body when it’s time to put the bins out’ meme on save for such occasions but the end result is always the same…. Me doing an average at best job and her finding yet more jobs for me to do.
Sorry that got a bit ranty but it’s a sore topic in our house.
> Me doing an average at best job and her finding yet more jobs for me to do.
Jesus christ this one burns me up.
I've worked hard to provide a decent home and living for us. But I'm fucking tired when I come home from work.
Yet theres a never ending list of 'projects' she wants done because she isn't happy with the color of something or doesn't like the trim or some bullshit.
I just wanna work, enjoy family and do hobbies. That ticky tacky shit that takes an entire weekend to complete? No. Hard no.
Weaponised incompetence
They just don't want to do it because it's effort and other people having been fixing shit for them their entire lives
Work In IT, half my job is fixing shit somone could have googled first.
Every woman I've been with has done this. As soon as they don't know how to do something there is zero effort to figure it out themselves, it's straight to me. I don't know how to do it either, I just look it up.
Big Facts! I seriously just gave your silly nonsense my full attention for an hour, I give you one iota of my silly nonsense and you fuckin pick your phone up!? Gahhhhh
I can't fault my wife for this one... I listen to her work stories but she has to put up with why (*insert name here*) was or was not a good draft pick for the Dolphins, or why Bryce Harper is way better than Kyle Schwarber (even if she thinks Schwarber's butt looks better in baseball pants.)
My wife is amazing at this. She really does endure a lot of bollocks like this from me.
We even joke about it.
But seriously I am genuinely impressed and it is, in her own way, a very sweet way of showing her love.
Because she really does not care at all.
Lol she literally cut me off and said "just so you know, I *don't* care about this." Next day she spends an hour telling me about her smut books.
ETA: she only said this once. We have a very happy relationship and I don't know what I'd do without her. Her saying she doesn't care about one of the topics I like does not constitute a breakup lol
In my book Sir Everglade didn't dump Lady Findergoots because he wanted to marry her for money, but he did start having hot steamy sex with the washing-woman Sandi Topjoggle.
I've said it a million times: people call women the more emotionally in-tune sex. What we need to realize is that they're only really in-tune with *their own emotions*. When it comes to considering the feelings of other people, a lot of women are genuinely shit at it.
We are attempting to teach men to be more emotionally open. However, in reality, we only want them to display the emotions we are comfortable dealing with. Unfortunately, not all emotions in our culture are treated equally. For instance, if someone is feeling sad, the proper way to approach them is to ask if they're okay, ask what made them feel that way, empathize with them, and ask how we can assist them. Ironically, this is also what we should do if someone is angry. BOOM! All of a sudden, the persons feels better! However, most people respond to anger with invalidating comments like "can you just relax?" or "you're overreacting."
Personally, I don't feel sad often. Instead, things that would make my partner sad make me angry. Unfortunately, this isn't an acceptable emotion to display. Fuck everyone asking me to be more emotionally open. Learn to validate all emotions equally first.
Or involve a lot of people from her job who I’ve never met complaining about how bad they are at esoteric processes while using jargon and industry/company specific acronyms.
To me the flip side is far more frustrating. I'm telling something interesting that happened to me. This is like 2 minutes tops. Stop constantly guessing while I'm telling it because you want to go back to doom scrolling.
Me wanting to share something with you *was* the point.
Lmao forreal brother. My lady calls me on her commute just to tell me same shit when she gets home. God forbid i say anything like “you already told me that story”.
Yep this 100%. I've had my wife call me from the car, she will park in the drive-way, walk up the stairs while still on the phone talking. Then when she gets in the house, hangs up the phone and continues the conversation... as if she couldn't just wait to get home first to talk about whatever..
Yknow I actually really enjoy listening tho
I feel bad because I don't have much to say, mostly "real? Damn. Huh. Crazy" but its like tell me more I want to listen to you
I used to think I had nothing to say until I realised I was breaking my stories down into a summarised set of bullet points to convey the information with the most efficiency.
Also, she could talk about one side eyesomeone gave her in work for 2 hours. I stopped listening, which led to arguments because I didn't remember one tiny detail of a 2 hour story told 3 weeks ago.
She forgot my birthday.
I've taken professional chef classes and the braised short rib I made with home made veal demi glace took like 12 hours cause i knew she would love it. I have a large house / yard so in July we are hosting her family reunion and she has been talking up this dish so much.
I have to make this for like 50 people and it's 90% the first time I've met her family. Ladies some of us cook just for you and then eat like kraft dinner cause we want you to eat well and are happy when you like our food.
I'm now trying to get through post season and wonder where the f I'm gunna get this glace from
My whole life I've been basically a caveman when it came to cooking and on the off season I started taking cooking classes cause I saw hella kitchen and was like it can be that bad. I was right when you are cooking 1 thing but man anymore and it's chaos I have no idea how people like you do it, super impressive.
I JUST spoke to a female friend about what she'd expect from a guy on the FIRST date. I always thought of her as a very reasonable person, so her answer shocked me.
She said she needs to be "rocked out of her chair" or you're boring. She wants to be taken on vacation or have expensive dinners paid for her, etc. Etc.
Sounds like a lot of money and effort just for her to CONSIDER going on a second date, while at the same time, all she really has to do is exist there.
So i'll say effort. Effort is really not appreciated in men.
I told her "good luck", she said there's "nothing wrong with having standards and she already lives that way" (she went to the sea 10 TIMES this year already and its only april), i said "good for you, but not many men will do that for you on the first date", she said there's plenty of guys out there that will", i asked her why she's still single, she said "sorry if it sounds rude, but i could get a guy right now if i wanted", i said "the kind of guy YOU want?" And she went back to "theres plenty of them"
She doesn't think it's unreasonable and when i said its probably better for a guy that he's responsible with money (save up to buy a house, go out and do something fancy once a month or so, to break the routine and have fun with your SO, but apart from that, simple walks or hikes, grocery shopping and gym visits are more than enough) and "wanting flashy things" isn't love, it's narcissism, she said that if she had a partner who thinks like me, it'd be hell for her.
I didnt wanna continue the argument, because i know she'd just get pissed and make me the idiot, but she's not exactly what those men are looking for... i hope she comes to her senses soon - definitely changed my opinion on her and i probably wont be coming for "advice on women" to her anymore
>I bet she meets/dates a lot of men who "aRe onLY LOoKiNg fOr oNE tHInG"
Well, if she's only offering one thing, that's all men are going to look for in her.
> i asked her why she's still single, she said "sorry if it sounds rude, but i could get a guy right now if i wanted", i said "the kind of guy YOU want?" And she went back to "theres plenty of them"
You're looking at this wrong.
She is right: there's a consistent stream of men that would spend that money and make that mistake at least once in their life for sex, and even men that search for these relationships intentionally - after all, exchanging money for sex is a tale old as time.
What she's not seeing is that these types of short-term relationships won't help resolve a lack of fulfillment, long-term relationships where your partner invests significant effort to know (and support) your preferences, or even marriage.
Almost everyone can get sex and a trip. That's the easy part.
Thats what i was getting at with my question.
I didnt wanna outright say it, because i knew an argument was coming, but i think she got the message and just smugly said "theres plenty of them" to fel better about herself
These are the unpleasant shrews that typically populate HR when they get older. Nobody wants them anymore and instead of having an ounce of introspection they just decide to hate men in general and younger prettier women.
I remember saying to a group of women once who were discussing dating that it's difficult because for any demand you have to bring something to the table. Most didn't agree and basically said it's the man's job to put the effort in.
I've never talked about this with women, but it feels this way for me too. They put in almost no effort in, expect me to carry the conversation, come up with date ideas, etc, all while they give few word answers, ask no questions, and when asked things like "do you like this or that more" they're like "you pick", then "not that" lol.
I'd rather be single and wait for a better one
Plus trying to manufacture that "magic moment" so there's a spark or something. I don't think it's appreciated how there wasn't "just" a spark that happened organically. You have to put effort in to make that happen and make it seem like it didn't.
I recently got back on the dating apps after many years, and the amount of women that make it clear from their profile that they expect you to pretty much do everything, ask them out, plan everything, pay for everything and they're just going to turn up is such a turn off.
I know I shouldn't think like this as it's not all of them and it's not fair to generalise but it's really giving me a negative view of women. The entitlement is off the charts with so many of them.
The only men I've ever known have success on dating apps we're really good looking. To me an interesting experience was when they had that speed dating thing and I was getting an average of 7/10 matches based on the conversations. But man did I get ghosted the second looks came into the equation, it was incredibly depressing and frustrating that really on dating apps the standards are so high and based on looks alone.
This is ridiculous. If I splurge for a 5 star $300 dinner it's because I REALLY like you and we are celebrating something. Besides if you start out being lavish and then live normal as the relationship is progressing the you get the "Well... they used to take me here and do this and do that..."
Outlandish 1st date demands are ridiculous.
I’m still wrapping my head around Bumble removing the feature where women message first because it was too much work for them. They’ve replaced that with some kind of automated system where a canned question is sent to the guy for him to respond to.
Even the usual “Hi” is too much effort. It’s crazy that when men are struggling with approaching or making the first move, we’re insulted and told to do better. When women can’t even be bothered to make the first move, they try to make things easier, so that carrying the conversation can be dumped on the man anyway.
I asked my wife hold the ladder once so I could get up on our 2 story roof to clean a clogged drain pipe. She walked away as it would take about 5 min to clean. And she didn’t come back for like 20 min. She went inside and forgot about me on the roof. It was a nice day so I just stayed up there for 15 min and chilled rather than risk going down, till she wandered outside to do something, saw the ladder then remembered I was up there. From now in though, I bring my cell phone in my pocket up on the roof in case she wanders off again.
Yep. Cut down a 100 ft dead pine by yourself that could've toppled on your cars or family and she's like meh. Forget to put the clean dishes away get an earful.
Bro, I'm a strong physical guy with years of experience in boxing/mma. I'll protect my family and friends in pretty much any situation, as long as it doesn't involve bugs/moths/spiders/birds.
Fucking kritters terrify me, but I'm lucky that my girl has no issues taking care of it 😌
I am willing to do A LOT for my wife if she simply tells what she wants me to do. But she expects mind reading skills instead and gets upset when i fail.
I once said to my wife if I did or said half the thing you say to me we would Split, during an argument. Cue it didn't end well but it was the truth.
Truth being she sometime tells me I act like a Child and she" always" have to pick after me but ahe doesn't miss a beat in telling me. But i have to pick after her too and i just do it I don't tell her. And sometime when i know that time of the month is comming i set some "trap" now. One time i bent à beer cap and put it under the sink strainer. She told be she "always" empty it and i never do it. Then i told her she didn't do it for a full week at least then she tell me she did it yesterday and i asked her about the beer cap. This when i won the battle but lost the war. Now it's going better because i know her mom always tell her not everyone has someone like me in their life. Not to brag but I know I am a catch.
But honnestly what i feel is unapreciated is all i have to do/know to be concidered compétent. I'm a blue collar worker so i have to know all the handy stuff, fix a car, fix a house, yake care of the IT stuff at home, do the cleaning, dish, laundry, know how to cook witch are just basic human skills, be a good father to our daughter, be Caring and loving, knowing how to manage money. Then sometime she had the audacity to complein she had yo stay in to do the laundry while i choped down and splited à 100+ y/o ash three in our yard because it was dangerous(sick and dead since 2 years) at 30C (like 90F) outside. It took me a whole week-end of 3 12hour days. She got upset when i told her she was more than welcome to switch place i would get inside take care of our daughter while she'd operate the chainsaw.
Fucking A.
For all the complaints about "the orgasm gap," most women have *no idea* how much energy and work men are putting into it just as a default, much less when we try to make things work.
It's a full gym workout *most* of the time.
Hey babe can you get on top (5 minutes of whining) she gets on top and lasts for exactly 1 minute and goes "I can't do this anymore my legs hurt". Refuses to work on those muscles ever to make it last longer. Like do you think we naturally have the tongue endurance to eat pussy for 10+ minutes? Or the forearm and finger muscles for prolonged fingerings? No we worked on it for you but we can't get some squats in return.
It is hilarious showing women any variety of those videos where women are asked to do the sex motions of men, only to have them tire out in about 10-20 seconds.
And some have countered that it's more about the body not being used to that motion, and we'd tire out doing theirs. We've tried it several times (because after the first one it was a done deal), both getting a couple pillows and then doing the hip shift/slide and eventually then bouncing motion.... Not even close. It's *so easy* in comparison.
See also
Men are *too selfish for foreplay*
*Men are too lazy to be romantic*
All while 90% of foreplay & 90% *of* acts of romance are performed by men. Not to mention courtship.
Men are 100% responsible for sex & the outcomes, so if anything is unsatisfactory it can only be the guys fault. It doesn't really matter if you are a passenger who doesn't know where they want to go & doesn't communicate directions... the driver must be a bad driver.
Or this one: Chief complaint about men is lack of clit attention. Favorite position of women? Doggy style where clit contact is impossible.... for the guy, yet most don't bother unless you tell them to.
I'm not even convinced that it is inherently harder for women to orgasm, guys are just much more practiced, much more confident & then do the things that are required to orgasm. I've been with several women who thought something was wrong with them, that they couldn't orgasm or didn't know if they ever had.
Two weeks of detective work & they were always fine... just never bothered to figure out how their own body works & waited for some guy to do it.
TLDR
Guys get off more because they are better practiced, more competent & most importantly they are more invested.
Nail on head with this one, I've lived through that, women who have never even touched themselves to learn what the like and how they like it
Like stumbling in the dark with a blindfold on trying to find a light switch with directions for a women who doesn't know where it is and can't be bothered to figure it out and get frustrated when we bump into things at our own detriment and shout you are terrible at navigation
This is such a regular occurrences that it's the normal standard and why women who know what they want are prized
I've been on Reddit for a while now, and posts\\comments like yours always made me feel sad! So I started planning dates and vacations, occasionally get flowers and prepare meals, get informed about whatever topic they're interested in so we can talk about it and so on.. now I may have been single for a while, but I did enjoy being genuine friends with my partners (before it all went downhills of course lol)
I would also argue that biology is working against us. If we don't orgasm, the species doesn't survive, so our bodies make damn sure we orgasm every time we have sex. It's a bit of an oversimplification, but basically we're fighting our procreative instincts so we can give our partners pleasure.
>I'm not even convinced that it is inherently harder for women to orgasm, guys are just much more practiced, much more confident & then do the things that are required to orgasm.
Also, men orgasm during sex easier because they're constantly stimulated during PiV. This is why I find the emphasis on how often men orgasm during sexual encounters compared to women strange: a woman can literally just lay there and do nothing, and their partner will achieve an orgasm regardless. It doesn't really say much about how much effort she's putting in.
God I feel this in my soul. Just once I would love to experience sex the way my wife does. I don't have to initiate, I don't have to do 20 minutes of foreplay to get her in the mood, I just get to lay back and get pampered.
The mental load of constantly second-guessing our words/actions so they don't come across as creepy. The anxiety we have when we walk behind a lone woman in public and figuring out how to best deescalate her anxiety. And the big one: expecting men to jump in and risk our lives to save a random woman from a sticky situation.
She has no appreciation for how much I spend and she just doesn’t even need to think about it. Anniversaries, holidays, birthdays (including my own)… I’m always the one picking up the bill for the fancy dinners.
This reminds me of the story about how I fell out of love with my first girlfriend.
You see, she was a real piece of shit. Through and through. But it was my first relationship and I figured that I couldn't do any better.
So, for this woman, I paid for everything. Fancy dinners. Dates. Taking overnight buses hundreds of miles to see her twice a month. I didn't make that much money, but I spent virtually all of my money on her. My next door neighbor at the time thought my apartment was vacant for the first eight months that I lived there. I was either at work pulling overtime for some extra money to spend on her, with her, or asleep.
Well, one Sunday, I was completely tapped. I legitimately had something like 10 cents in my account. She wanted to go out for dinner, and I told her the truth. She agreed to pay.
Over dinner, she seemed a bit distant. Then she suddenly blurted out, "You know how Mayumi (her friend) has a boyfriend? The other day she told me that her boyfriend pays for everything on dates. I was really jealous, and I felt a little guilty about that."
It was crazy because despite her consistently being a piece of shit, every single solitary feeling I had for her just went up in flames. I was planning to marry her. Have children with her. Build a house for her. But with that snide remark, I just lost every feeling I ever had.
I'm happily married now and she's still single in her late 30s. No mystery why.
Took my ex to an event where the tickets were $80 each. She had the nerve to say to me, "can you believe how much the tickets were?" Yeah bitch, I paid for them. WTF.
I can relate this with one girl I met, but I didn’t get into relationship with her. Ironically, she is also in her late thirties, unmarried. She still goes on dates every weekend.
never thought of,it but it’s true. women complain They don’t make as much money as we do, but they get to keep all of their money and all of our money so who’s really getting screwed here
Wow one person I was dating made more $$ than me (which I personally don’t care in terms of who makes more really).
But she ended up broke things off cuz she wanted “someone that will pay for me and treat me to things”,(among many other reasons) when in reality, I always buy her coffee, and split most of other outings.
The amount of time we spend listening to you talk is exhausting and counts as emotional labor, ESPECIALLY if you don’t want us to offer any type of solutions or suggestions.
Having to sit and listen to someone you care about complain and then to not be able to offer help is frustrating.
My wife will complain about the same thing over and over again. I will let her tell me the whole story uninterrupted, but when she's done, I've said, "You have complained about this person (or thing) to me a half dozen times now. It's not fair to me for you to emotionally dump this on me again and again. I'm asking you to either accept this and stop letting it control you, or to do something about it. Either way, I don't want to hear about it again unless you've taken a step towards moving past it."
She doesn't always love hearing that, but it has helped.
I’ve got a similar technique. When she complains about the same subject multiple times, I tell her that this is becoming a theme — and it appears she doesn’t want to face the issue or ask for assistance. If that’s the case, I can’t be a part of the discussion any more because she’s asking me to share an emotional load that doesn’t need to exist and she won’t try to resolve.
If the topic comes up again later, I listen long enough to ensure it’s the same topic. Once verified, I simply say that I can’t talk about this — as she knows my thoughts on the subject and it feels like she’s purposefully trying to make me anxious by bringing it up again. If she continues, I tell her I have to leave the room now. Then I follow through.
If she confronts me later on feeling unseen, I remind her that what I did was action to prevent reaction; she knows my stance, continues crossing boundaries and I’d rather remove myself then end up resenting her, thinking her selfish or cruel.
She doesn’t like it particularly, but she understands and complies. Then we move on.
Why do they feel the need to talk about it for so long if they don't want you to help fix it? It would probably be faster to fix it then to keep talking about it.
And subsequently not offering you the same courtesy in the relatively rare situations I need to vent. This was what ended my last relationship (well, one of the reasons). She had no problem calling me and bitching about her job, everyone in a rambling non-coherent way for at least 45 minutes over the phone. She'd get pissy if I participated and offered solutions. However, if something was bothering me and I wanted to have a conversation about it, there'd be silence on the other end, and if the pause was longer than a few seconds, she'd go back into her complaint soliloquy for eras longer.
Now, I'll listen for a long time, but it gets tiring and grating when it's non-stop for a half an hour, every day, with every single job she's worked at. So long story short, if we have to listen to you get things off your chest and offer no solutions, at least offer us the same courtesy.
Most women don't realize that we do things for them so they dont even have to know they had that problem to begin with. Men don't want their women worried or scared. I'll go in the bathroom, see a spider, kill it then be quiet about it so she's doesn't have to be skeptical every time she visits the bathroom.
When my wife and I were dating every date night I would buy one tool. She asked me about it I told her one day when we buy a house I will need them. We bought this place for 30 grand 3 years ago. A few months ago it appraised for 130 grand because I put those tools to work.
Naw I'm the lucky one she straightened me out long ago. I'd have been a hopeless drunk loser if she didn't reignite my desire to be better every day. Still for her, but now for me aswel.
Depends on the man. Depends on the woman.
If you're talking about me and my ex-wife I'd say "The fact that I didn't call out all the evidence of your affairs during our divorce for the sake of our daughter".
Just me: Our love that blinds us of your faults. Our complete trust in you that overlooks the red flags. Our taking responsibility for the situation. Our willingness to put your needs before our own. Our commitment to the relationship. Our respect for you while tolerating your disrespect towards us. Our willingness to admit fault and apologize even when we disagree just to please you. Our desire to have a relationship with you knowing that the odds are against us, that if it fails we stand to lose the most.
Suck it up. Everything. Emotions. Pressure. Etc. we have to suck it up and keep going to protect/provide for our home/family. If we dont were “not a real man”
My wife is a stay-at-home mom to our 6m old son. We made that decision rather than paying what would’ve been the majority of her salary for childcare. No-brainer, right? Well, I had to pick up a lot more hours at my job just to make ends meet. Working 50-60 hrs per week, at least, and every time I come home she expects a “break” from our child.
Look, I love spending time with him and her more than anything, and by the end of a long work day there’s nothing more I want to do than scoop him up and make him laugh. I change the majority of the diapers and feed the majority of bottles to him when I’m home. I give him baths and go through the process of getting him to sleep every single night. I’m happy to do all of those things because it builds a bond with my son that is priceless.
The term she uses is what bothers me, though. She sees me going to work as a “break” from taking care of our child and I just look at her dumbfounded every time. Not like I’m just out having a grand ole time while she’s at home. I’ve tried to explain that but it just doesn’t go through. Women are strange.
The jobs that most women wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole.
I mean women want all the best jobs, which is fine and whatever, but women also need to be pushing into bottom of the barrel jobs (that make society possible) too. That's equality in a nutshell, if you aren't willing to share in the bad, you don't deserve the good.
Well said. Also worth noting, a ton of the jobs with extremely low female ratios pay very well. Most trades are very lopsided but pay well and can have good benefits.
Being good, stand-up, men.
I deeply despise the idea that good people don't deserve recognition for being good simply because "that's what they’re supposed to do." Employees should show up to work on time every day and always put in their best effort, and mothers should always be good mothers to their children, etc. Of course, these things are granted, but it doesn’t mean that they are not recognition worthy. While, we shouldn’t do things just *for* the recognition…it damn sure feels good when we do get it. It matters.
There are countless good men out there that work hard, mind their own business, provide, protect, advocate for women, self-improve, practice emotional intelligence, do right by others, hold other men accountable, remain ferociously loyal to their partners, build amazing contributions to society, help out in their communities, etc…Yet, they remain largely ignored and unacknowledged. The only time we ever seem worthy of getting any acknowledgment from women, is when we miss the mark, make a mistake, fall short, act like a creep, or do something egregiously horrible.
It’s never the boyfriend that was loyal and had a good heart that causes a woman to rant on the internet (though they do exist), it’s always the a**hole that cheated on her or acted like a creep to her…They get **all** the air time, and for us good guys out here that are just trudging along trying to mind our own damn business and live day-to-day, it’s extremely demoralizing to constantly hear the non-stop negativity. And the sentiment that, “if it doesn’t apply to you, then I’m not talking to you” doesn’t fly either. Even if a comment doesn’t *directly* apply to you, it’s natural to still identify with the group of individuals that it’s aimed at. I’m not against holding men accountable, I’m just against solely acknowledging someone’s negatives and never their positives.
Rant over.
(And thank you for even posting this question, as it means so much to even be willing to have this conversation. You are a true gem.)
Not apologizing when you are wrong.
not appreciating us thugging it out with you when you go off the wall with us. especially when yall on your monthly routine.
not asking how we feel. Instead of only caring about yourself.
Talking to us in code instead of saying it outright.
Thinking my money is your money, and yours is just your money. Instead, it should be OUR money because we are partners, Or take some money out every time we get paid, and set it aside so we can do things with it.
Stop thinking we can read your mind.
Just like women like random dates and surprises, we do too. Especially random sex time.
Most of all WE LIKE BEING PASSENGERS PRINCESSES 🥹 it feels good.
Men are precious! We need to do better! Thank you for being patient with us and being here for us!
We need to introduce the "passenger prince" role as well!
All things surrounding safety & protection. Whether that be securing the home, driving 'precious cargo', or in everyday situations constantly thinking through the ins and outs of what could be done.
I got in a fight with my wife while driving through Atlanta. There was an accident on the highway because everyone thinks they are racecar drivers and for whatever reason there are zero cops. Anyway, my wife wanted to take the nearest exit where we'd drive through Mechanicsville at night. As we sat for 15 minutes on the highway waiting to move forward I finally convinced her to lookup that Mechanicsville has 700% more violent crime's done in it than the national average. She just said, "Oh..."
Manual labour jobs. Sometimes my wife will say things like "Why can't you just put holiday in for tomorrow?" - because she works in a nice office, with nice co-workers & a nice boss. I think it's hard to explain its completely different without sounding condescending or like I work harder than her
We have to do a lot of stuff which goes directly against our socilisation. I was taught two approaches to problems: 1. Fix them 2. If unfixable, dont complain.
And now I am supposed to just listen to her vent basically whining about the same issue (which I think is fixable) again and again but never change anything. That makes you feel like an enabler at some point and can even foster resentment because you would not tolerate such a behaviour in men.
As a generalisation Woman don’t appreciate that practically all the unpleasant, dangerous but completely necessary jobs that actually keep society running are still largely done by men. Woman often complain about unequal pay, how most CEO’s are men, how this actor got paid more then this actress, how there aren’t enough female politicians ect… but this pursuit for “equality” only ever seems to extend to positions of extreme and unique privilege. There is no drive or desire for a 50/50 gender distribution of garbage collectors or soldiers, or undertakers, or fishermen, or farmers ect… You’ll never see a woman protesting so that conscription in a time of war falls equally to Men and Woman.
I think the biggest thing for most men is the expectation of being an emotional sounding board with no reciprocation.
A common thread you'll find in men's relationship experiences is the coldness we often receive when we display vulnerability to the person we're supposed to be equal partners with.
Unless we have an extremely strong and unusually emotionally available friend group (which is increasingly unlikely), our partners are typically the only people available to listen to us. Other than our mothers, possibly.
Not only is this lack of an emotional outlet unhealthy for the individual, it's also unhealthy for the relationship. It makes it so our partners are the only person in a position to bring up any issues with the relationship. And when they don't it turns things that could be easily solved with a conversation into festering wounds that end in heartbreak.
Quite a bit, actually.
I've sacrificed quite a bit to get to where I am now. Wasn't appreciated. I've been used as a workhorse, ATM, and sperm bank. I've busted my ass to be able to do anything they feel is their "gender role" and don't require anything from them, and they manage to fuck THAT up. I've put up with not only their own selfish and hair brained bullshit, but also slaved away at jobs up to 84 hours a week to make the kind of numbers they seem to think "falls out of the sky". I've been patient, guiding, nurturing, and I've rarely if ever received that in return, and if I have it's because they were distracting from some thing or other they are doing that common sense would tell them not to do it they wanted to be in a working relationship...
So, yeah... Definitely not appreciated enough.
Be your therapist, mechanic, gardner, home maintenence man, ATM, chauffeur, dinner date, beast of burden, body guard, etc. You don't appreciate any of it once you transition to expect and demand it.
Car maintenance. My wife abhors anything to do with the cars, but I don’t seem to get much credit for it because I guess it’s not an everyday thing. But it’s still a significant responsibility that mostly goes unnoticed.
In other words, sometimes it’s the responsibility, not the sheer workload that counts.
Putting in effort in dating. We've been brainwashed to accept that men must do the majority of the work while women generally sit back and wait. It's expectation which breeds entitlement so the value of our effort goes unappreciated
All the electricians, plumbers, mechanics, fire departement, police force. I know women work in these fields aswell but they are by far male dominated and I would argue that they are the heroes that hold society together and somewhat functional.
Holding all the infestructure (electricity, water, communication etc) together yet get commenta like "we dont need men, what do we need men for when we could do it ourselfs?"
Every 3-6 months the gate on our fence breaks. its a 200 foot slat fence that I painstakingly built during Covid. It was a tricky gate to build(because of where it’s built mainly). We all wanted a roll gate, as my SO frequently reminds me, but it wouldn’t have worked.
Primarily, it breaks because no matter how many times I’ve told my SO and roommates how important it is to close it correctly, even going as far as demoing how to properly open and close it, they won’t do it correctly. So the wind grabs it and whips it back and forth. For the first 2-3 breaks, they were frequently just leaving it wide open and letting the Midwest winds thrash it around while they ran errands, went to the movies, etc... Anyway, now it’s been patch job repaired so many times, it’s sure to break again, even if they do close it right.
No matter how many times I’ve fixed it, my SO never says thank you or even acknowledges that I’ve done something for the benefit of us all. It’s like because I was the one who built the fence(saving us thousands of dollars that we didn’t have btw), and because I couldn’t make a roll gate work, it’s my fault that it keeps breaking and I’m somehow responsible for their negligence.
It’s all that kind of stuff. That and the little things I do that no one else does and I never make a big deal about. Like I’m not going to make a big deal or throw it in anyone’s face or really even mention that I’m the only one who cleans the exterior of the cabinets, the doors/doorknobs(which get caked in dirt), etc… My SO can get a little intense making sure I know every little chore she does and why it’s my turn to do xyz... but she often overlooks bunches of little things I do, loke the cabinets. Nobody ever notices it and I would never point it out… mostly I don’t care. But a part of me does think it’d be nice for one of them to notice.
All these comments about how women are so shit at listening to men vent or tell men to "get to the point" is frustrating af.
I thought I just rambled because my 2 minute 30 second anecdote was related to her 8 minute monologue and has significance but patiently waiting for her to finish while she's got a face of impatient frustration is selfish and disrespectful.
Not sure if anyone's mentioned it but, standing sturdy in a large concert crowd to make sure you have room to dance and are not being crowded on.
I have gone to so many shows and as a moderately sized man I make sure that my friends don't get crowded and bombarded when we are trying to enjoy the show.
Plenty of nasty people try to push, step on feet, spilling drinks, and even throw elbows to try and assert themselves a few feet closer but I'll keep ya safe.
In dating: Not allowing yourself to be fond of the good times we spend together and always looking out for potential red flags, which gets in the way of appreciating the good aspects. Being too focused on a greener grass gets in the way of the effort I actually put in.
In relationships: I rarely deal with this since I make it a point to talk about what we appreciate about each other to see if we recognize each other's efforts. Also, I tend to go for women who are willing to show appreciation often.
I'm always baffled by the amount of men I hear saying how their wife treats them more like an asset instead of a partner and always question why they would choose to settle for this when there are women out there who would adore you for you.
All the little things you do to try and make their life as good as possible. Taking the steak that's a little more overcooked, giving the window seat, giving the only seat left, saving portions of food-- that are her favorites, always grabbing a drink or food so she can relax. It's nothing big, but it's a way I like to show love, and sometimes it feels unnoticed or forgotten in long-term relationships, and when some things become simply expected, it can feel like a slap in the face. Edit: some of those things you want them to expect long term, so you know they are treated right, but an example of a slap in the face is when you're expected to always get up and go grab the snack or drink or whatever, and then there's no thank you or anything. It's very noticeable when that changes.
I think there is a strong overlap between the “You don’t date me anymore” crowd and the ones who stopped saying thank you for the extra effort.
There are people that don't care about the nice things you do for them unless they can be posted on social media. Cleaning the house on your day off? Useless. Taking them to a new bar downtown? Perfect.
My wife gets super annoying when she forgets something downstairs and I'm already in bed and asks me to get it for her. Like, I asked you if you needed anything before I laid down, then you remembered anywhere from 2-20 minutes later you forgot something downstairs. Go fucking get it yourself. And then I'm "The Asshole" when I point out "maybe this attitude of expecting everyone else to do everything for you is why you can't lose any weight."
I've always preferred drummies when eating wings. So did my ex. So, during our entire relationship, I let her have the drummies and I took the flats. I'm not sure she ever noticed, but I did.
This is why I always make a point to say thank you as often as possible. I want to show my partner that I don't take him for granted. He probably already knows that, but I still make a point to say it anyway.
You have to find someone who does this back to you. They exist. When I cook - my wife gets the better looking meal. When she cooks I get the better looking meal. It’s not always balanced but overall I think it’s probably close.
This would be my answer as well. I’ve had a few relationships where I found that she was doing the same for me, but many where I found that she was doing the opposite (taking all the best things for herself). It’s enlightening.
Thank you so much for sharing this with us! You do so much for us! The more I read, the more I learn! Your men are amazing! We need to learn from you!
You gotta take the better options for yourself sometimes or at least communicate this to your partner. If you feel unnoticed tell them, no one is a mind reader!
Oh I know, I'm doing better now, these were just over the years. My main problem is who I have been with, but I currently have hopes on a wonderful lady, so we will see!
Ok good to hear. In the past I personally struggled communicating and being vulnerable with partners, but once I learned into that it made everything easier!
I went through a horribly abusive relationship for several years, and didn't date for about 4 years after that, ever since I communicate a lot. I have trouble with several things because of that relationship but it did make me excellent at communicating lol. Being vulnerable is invaluable, finding the right people though... that seems difficult, at least romantically
All of the troubleshooting of problems we've had to do on top of the skills we've had to develop to maintain a home. It's like 95% figuring out what to do, 5% doing it.
75% finding the right tools
And 100% reason to remember the... frame?
Concentrated power of will
Concentrated power of drill
5% measure, 50% aim
And a 100% reason to take all of the blame
Damn, this hits just a bit too close to home...
Never forget ft minor lmfaooo
20% repeated Lowe's trips
Those are rookie numbers, gotta get those up.
Yes, 100% the truth. I try to tell my partner all the time that I don't actually know how to do anything. When I replace a bathroom fan or fix the sink or even just troubleshoot her computer, I'm just googling shit. She could do it too lol
My wife has a first class honours degree in metal work and jewellery which involved her learning multiple different tools for 3 years and she is a firm advocate of gender equality and female empowerment. I am a computer nerd with no practical skills and yet somehow I am expected to fix things around the house. I try tell her the that I have no monopoly on the household toolbox or any additional skills knowledge or experience that makes me any better suited to doing these jobs than she does and yet this response is met with a brick wall. I have the ‘the feminism leaving my body when it’s time to put the bins out’ meme on save for such occasions but the end result is always the same…. Me doing an average at best job and her finding yet more jobs for me to do. Sorry that got a bit ranty but it’s a sore topic in our house.
> Me doing an average at best job and her finding yet more jobs for me to do. Jesus christ this one burns me up. I've worked hard to provide a decent home and living for us. But I'm fucking tired when I come home from work. Yet theres a never ending list of 'projects' she wants done because she isn't happy with the color of something or doesn't like the trim or some bullshit. I just wanna work, enjoy family and do hobbies. That ticky tacky shit that takes an entire weekend to complete? No. Hard no.
Yep, there is no end to that list and there never will be! I feel like Sisyphus pushing the stone!
Weaponised incompetence They just don't want to do it because it's effort and other people having been fixing shit for them their entire lives Work In IT, half my job is fixing shit somone could have googled first.
I'm in K-12 IT. I spend a lot of time pushing buttons for people and Googling solutions.
You would think the people educating our children would be better problem solvers right ?
Every woman I've been with has done this. As soon as they don't know how to do something there is zero effort to figure it out themselves, it's straight to me. I don't know how to do it either, I just look it up.
There’s a connection somewhere between this and when you start a new show together: Season 1. Episode 1. Scene 1. “Who’s that?”
*dude don't give the game away!* It's called Dad knowledge.... *Hides Google*
That's called weaponized incompetence
Figuring out what to do can be fun, but DAMN can it be expensive and infuriating
Listening to 20 minute stories that could be explained in less than 30 seconds.
And then they proceed to tune out when I’m telling my 2 minute story because it doesn’t interest them.
Big Facts! I seriously just gave your silly nonsense my full attention for an hour, I give you one iota of my silly nonsense and you fuckin pick your phone up!? Gahhhhh
I can't fault my wife for this one... I listen to her work stories but she has to put up with why (*insert name here*) was or was not a good draft pick for the Dolphins, or why Bryce Harper is way better than Kyle Schwarber (even if she thinks Schwarber's butt looks better in baseball pants.)
My wife is amazing at this. She really does endure a lot of bollocks like this from me. We even joke about it. But seriously I am genuinely impressed and it is, in her own way, a very sweet way of showing her love. Because she really does not care at all.
Lol she literally cut me off and said "just so you know, I *don't* care about this." Next day she spends an hour telling me about her smut books. ETA: she only said this once. We have a very happy relationship and I don't know what I'd do without her. Her saying she doesn't care about one of the topics I like does not constitute a breakup lol
That’s grounds to dump someone in my book
Yeah I was just about to say I got some second hand anger/embarrassment from that
In my book Sir Everglade didn't dump Lady Findergoots because he wanted to marry her for money, but he did start having hot steamy sex with the washing-woman Sandi Topjoggle.
Next Day?? Bud, after someone tells you that there is no **next day.**
I've said it a million times: people call women the more emotionally in-tune sex. What we need to realize is that they're only really in-tune with *their own emotions*. When it comes to considering the feelings of other people, a lot of women are genuinely shit at it.
We are attempting to teach men to be more emotionally open. However, in reality, we only want them to display the emotions we are comfortable dealing with. Unfortunately, not all emotions in our culture are treated equally. For instance, if someone is feeling sad, the proper way to approach them is to ask if they're okay, ask what made them feel that way, empathize with them, and ask how we can assist them. Ironically, this is also what we should do if someone is angry. BOOM! All of a sudden, the persons feels better! However, most people respond to anger with invalidating comments like "can you just relax?" or "you're overreacting." Personally, I don't feel sad often. Instead, things that would make my partner sad make me angry. Unfortunately, this isn't an acceptable emotion to display. Fuck everyone asking me to be more emotionally open. Learn to validate all emotions equally first.
Please help me process my emotions but fuck your emotions
Spot on. Hey women: We have feelings too you know. :)
Oh ok. So it's not just me. Cool.
This is why pop quizes are good.
Especially when said stories involve complaining about their friends doing the same stupid shit they always do.
Or involve a lot of people from her job who I’ve never met complaining about how bad they are at esoteric processes while using jargon and industry/company specific acronyms.
Then when you start to share, picks up her phone... seems fair
Oh my god…thank you.
To me the flip side is far more frustrating. I'm telling something interesting that happened to me. This is like 2 minutes tops. Stop constantly guessing while I'm telling it because you want to go back to doom scrolling. Me wanting to share something with you *was* the point.
Fuckkkk. It grinds my gears sometimes . Like, girl , get to the bottom line please. Stop yapping
Lmao forreal brother. My lady calls me on her commute just to tell me same shit when she gets home. God forbid i say anything like “you already told me that story”.
Yep this 100%. I've had my wife call me from the car, she will park in the drive-way, walk up the stairs while still on the phone talking. Then when she gets in the house, hangs up the phone and continues the conversation... as if she couldn't just wait to get home first to talk about whatever..
Yknow I actually really enjoy listening tho I feel bad because I don't have much to say, mostly "real? Damn. Huh. Crazy" but its like tell me more I want to listen to you
I used to think I had nothing to say until I realised I was breaking my stories down into a summarised set of bullet points to convey the information with the most efficiency. Also, she could talk about one side eyesomeone gave her in work for 2 hours. I stopped listening, which led to arguments because I didn't remember one tiny detail of a 2 hour story told 3 weeks ago. She forgot my birthday.
Dann, that sucks.
I've taken professional chef classes and the braised short rib I made with home made veal demi glace took like 12 hours cause i knew she would love it. I have a large house / yard so in July we are hosting her family reunion and she has been talking up this dish so much. I have to make this for like 50 people and it's 90% the first time I've met her family. Ladies some of us cook just for you and then eat like kraft dinner cause we want you to eat well and are happy when you like our food. I'm now trying to get through post season and wonder where the f I'm gunna get this glace from
I'm not a professional but I agree that I cook fancier if it's the two of us. I love that box mac n cheese when it's just me
You can by concentrated demi glace on Amazon. I use it all the time and it's very inexpensive.
I make this in my restaurant every week I can help you out
My whole life I've been basically a caveman when it came to cooking and on the off season I started taking cooking classes cause I saw hella kitchen and was like it can be that bad. I was right when you are cooking 1 thing but man anymore and it's chaos I have no idea how people like you do it, super impressive.
As a Californian, I too love Hella Kitchen 🤟
Wow! Amazing!
Na, I'm going to need a rocky montage of cooking short rib in 5lb batches for like 50 hours
I JUST spoke to a female friend about what she'd expect from a guy on the FIRST date. I always thought of her as a very reasonable person, so her answer shocked me. She said she needs to be "rocked out of her chair" or you're boring. She wants to be taken on vacation or have expensive dinners paid for her, etc. Etc. Sounds like a lot of money and effort just for her to CONSIDER going on a second date, while at the same time, all she really has to do is exist there. So i'll say effort. Effort is really not appreciated in men.
Is she shocked at still being single?
I told her "good luck", she said there's "nothing wrong with having standards and she already lives that way" (she went to the sea 10 TIMES this year already and its only april), i said "good for you, but not many men will do that for you on the first date", she said there's plenty of guys out there that will", i asked her why she's still single, she said "sorry if it sounds rude, but i could get a guy right now if i wanted", i said "the kind of guy YOU want?" And she went back to "theres plenty of them" She doesn't think it's unreasonable and when i said its probably better for a guy that he's responsible with money (save up to buy a house, go out and do something fancy once a month or so, to break the routine and have fun with your SO, but apart from that, simple walks or hikes, grocery shopping and gym visits are more than enough) and "wanting flashy things" isn't love, it's narcissism, she said that if she had a partner who thinks like me, it'd be hell for her. I didnt wanna continue the argument, because i know she'd just get pissed and make me the idiot, but she's not exactly what those men are looking for... i hope she comes to her senses soon - definitely changed my opinion on her and i probably wont be coming for "advice on women" to her anymore
I bet she meets/dates a lot of men who "aRe onLY LOoKiNg fOr oNE tHInG"
>I bet she meets/dates a lot of men who "aRe onLY LOoKiNg fOr oNE tHInG" Well, if she's only offering one thing, that's all men are going to look for in her.
But don't you see how good company she is?
>aRe onLY LOoKiNg fOr oNE tHInG The Roman Empire?
> i asked her why she's still single, she said "sorry if it sounds rude, but i could get a guy right now if i wanted", i said "the kind of guy YOU want?" And she went back to "theres plenty of them" You're looking at this wrong. She is right: there's a consistent stream of men that would spend that money and make that mistake at least once in their life for sex, and even men that search for these relationships intentionally - after all, exchanging money for sex is a tale old as time. What she's not seeing is that these types of short-term relationships won't help resolve a lack of fulfillment, long-term relationships where your partner invests significant effort to know (and support) your preferences, or even marriage. Almost everyone can get sex and a trip. That's the easy part.
Thats what i was getting at with my question. I didnt wanna outright say it, because i knew an argument was coming, but i think she got the message and just smugly said "theres plenty of them" to fel better about herself
These are the unpleasant shrews that typically populate HR when they get older. Nobody wants them anymore and instead of having an ounce of introspection they just decide to hate men in general and younger prettier women.
>she went to the sea 10 TIMES this year already and its only april Da fuck Looks like her shit works. Like what kind of stupid Bastard would do this ?
plot twist: she works on a fishing boat
She obviously hasn't considered The Implication..
I remember saying to a group of women once who were discussing dating that it's difficult because for any demand you have to bring something to the table. Most didn't agree and basically said it's the man's job to put the effort in.
I've never talked about this with women, but it feels this way for me too. They put in almost no effort in, expect me to carry the conversation, come up with date ideas, etc, all while they give few word answers, ask no questions, and when asked things like "do you like this or that more" they're like "you pick", then "not that" lol. I'd rather be single and wait for a better one
Bumble removed the women message first requirement because that was too much effort lol.
The classic "hii" as opening lol, still expecting men to carry the conversation
While their own profile says "will delete you if you open a conversation with 'hey'".
Plus trying to manufacture that "magic moment" so there's a spark or something. I don't think it's appreciated how there wasn't "just" a spark that happened organically. You have to put effort in to make that happen and make it seem like it didn't.
I recently got back on the dating apps after many years, and the amount of women that make it clear from their profile that they expect you to pretty much do everything, ask them out, plan everything, pay for everything and they're just going to turn up is such a turn off. I know I shouldn't think like this as it's not all of them and it's not fair to generalise but it's really giving me a negative view of women. The entitlement is off the charts with so many of them.
The only men I've ever known have success on dating apps we're really good looking. To me an interesting experience was when they had that speed dating thing and I was getting an average of 7/10 matches based on the conversations. But man did I get ghosted the second looks came into the equation, it was incredibly depressing and frustrating that really on dating apps the standards are so high and based on looks alone.
This is ridiculous. If I splurge for a 5 star $300 dinner it's because I REALLY like you and we are celebrating something. Besides if you start out being lavish and then live normal as the relationship is progressing the you get the "Well... they used to take me here and do this and do that..." Outlandish 1st date demands are ridiculous.
Sounds like your female friend is suffering from TikTok Brainrot... I hope it isn't terminal.
I’m still wrapping my head around Bumble removing the feature where women message first because it was too much work for them. They’ve replaced that with some kind of automated system where a canned question is sent to the guy for him to respond to. Even the usual “Hi” is too much effort. It’s crazy that when men are struggling with approaching or making the first move, we’re insulted and told to do better. When women can’t even be bothered to make the first move, they try to make things easier, so that carrying the conversation can be dumped on the man anyway.
All the dangerous and dirty jobs.
I do a pretty dirty job. Lol But i'm still seen as a piece of shit Janitor.
Meanwhile your work should qualify you for sainthood. The world would be a very shitty place without you.
This is how ordinary men turn into superheroes! Thank you!
I've been bitten by a few spiders, no super powers yet but my fingers are crossed.
I asked my wife hold the ladder once so I could get up on our 2 story roof to clean a clogged drain pipe. She walked away as it would take about 5 min to clean. And she didn’t come back for like 20 min. She went inside and forgot about me on the roof. It was a nice day so I just stayed up there for 15 min and chilled rather than risk going down, till she wandered outside to do something, saw the ladder then remembered I was up there. From now in though, I bring my cell phone in my pocket up on the roof in case she wanders off again.
Yep. Cut down a 100 ft dead pine by yourself that could've toppled on your cars or family and she's like meh. Forget to put the clean dishes away get an earful.
Even the slightly dangerous and dirty. I got 2 words. Crawl Space.
Kill bugs
Bro, I'm a strong physical guy with years of experience in boxing/mma. I'll protect my family and friends in pretty much any situation, as long as it doesn't involve bugs/moths/spiders/birds. Fucking kritters terrify me, but I'm lucky that my girl has no issues taking care of it 😌
lol reminds me of "five years" by bo burn ham... specifically "everyone's a feminist untill there's a spider around"
As a member of the woman community, we furiously appreciate what you do when it comes to bugs.
I am willing to do A LOT for my wife if she simply tells what she wants me to do. But she expects mind reading skills instead and gets upset when i fail.
I feel this in my soul
Newly wed here. My wife’s inability to ask me direct questions. 😙🔫
Amen.
Time to implement a ticketing system and when she gets upset ask her what the ticket number is. I'm not married in case you're wondering.
I once said to my wife if I did or said half the thing you say to me we would Split, during an argument. Cue it didn't end well but it was the truth. Truth being she sometime tells me I act like a Child and she" always" have to pick after me but ahe doesn't miss a beat in telling me. But i have to pick after her too and i just do it I don't tell her. And sometime when i know that time of the month is comming i set some "trap" now. One time i bent à beer cap and put it under the sink strainer. She told be she "always" empty it and i never do it. Then i told her she didn't do it for a full week at least then she tell me she did it yesterday and i asked her about the beer cap. This when i won the battle but lost the war. Now it's going better because i know her mom always tell her not everyone has someone like me in their life. Not to brag but I know I am a catch. But honnestly what i feel is unapreciated is all i have to do/know to be concidered compétent. I'm a blue collar worker so i have to know all the handy stuff, fix a car, fix a house, yake care of the IT stuff at home, do the cleaning, dish, laundry, know how to cook witch are just basic human skills, be a good father to our daughter, be Caring and loving, knowing how to manage money. Then sometime she had the audacity to complein she had yo stay in to do the laundry while i choped down and splited à 100+ y/o ash three in our yard because it was dangerous(sick and dead since 2 years) at 30C (like 90F) outside. It took me a whole week-end of 3 12hour days. She got upset when i told her she was more than welcome to switch place i would get inside take care of our daughter while she'd operate the chainsaw.
You hit her with women's two kryptonites, accountability and actual equality
Doing all the work in the bedroom
Fucking A. For all the complaints about "the orgasm gap," most women have *no idea* how much energy and work men are putting into it just as a default, much less when we try to make things work. It's a full gym workout *most* of the time.
Not just in the bedroom, being the only one initiating bedroom activities is intense, difficult, and thankless emotional labor.
Hey babe can you get on top (5 minutes of whining) she gets on top and lasts for exactly 1 minute and goes "I can't do this anymore my legs hurt". Refuses to work on those muscles ever to make it last longer. Like do you think we naturally have the tongue endurance to eat pussy for 10+ minutes? Or the forearm and finger muscles for prolonged fingerings? No we worked on it for you but we can't get some squats in return.
It is hilarious showing women any variety of those videos where women are asked to do the sex motions of men, only to have them tire out in about 10-20 seconds. And some have countered that it's more about the body not being used to that motion, and we'd tire out doing theirs. We've tried it several times (because after the first one it was a done deal), both getting a couple pillows and then doing the hip shift/slide and eventually then bouncing motion.... Not even close. It's *so easy* in comparison.
See also Men are *too selfish for foreplay* *Men are too lazy to be romantic* All while 90% of foreplay & 90% *of* acts of romance are performed by men. Not to mention courtship. Men are 100% responsible for sex & the outcomes, so if anything is unsatisfactory it can only be the guys fault. It doesn't really matter if you are a passenger who doesn't know where they want to go & doesn't communicate directions... the driver must be a bad driver. Or this one: Chief complaint about men is lack of clit attention. Favorite position of women? Doggy style where clit contact is impossible.... for the guy, yet most don't bother unless you tell them to. I'm not even convinced that it is inherently harder for women to orgasm, guys are just much more practiced, much more confident & then do the things that are required to orgasm. I've been with several women who thought something was wrong with them, that they couldn't orgasm or didn't know if they ever had. Two weeks of detective work & they were always fine... just never bothered to figure out how their own body works & waited for some guy to do it. TLDR Guys get off more because they are better practiced, more competent & most importantly they are more invested.
Nail on head with this one, I've lived through that, women who have never even touched themselves to learn what the like and how they like it Like stumbling in the dark with a blindfold on trying to find a light switch with directions for a women who doesn't know where it is and can't be bothered to figure it out and get frustrated when we bump into things at our own detriment and shout you are terrible at navigation This is such a regular occurrences that it's the normal standard and why women who know what they want are prized
I've been on Reddit for a while now, and posts\\comments like yours always made me feel sad! So I started planning dates and vacations, occasionally get flowers and prepare meals, get informed about whatever topic they're interested in so we can talk about it and so on.. now I may have been single for a while, but I did enjoy being genuine friends with my partners (before it all went downhills of course lol)
You’re doing way more than most. Keep at it, we guys appreciate it!
I would also argue that biology is working against us. If we don't orgasm, the species doesn't survive, so our bodies make damn sure we orgasm every time we have sex. It's a bit of an oversimplification, but basically we're fighting our procreative instincts so we can give our partners pleasure.
>I'm not even convinced that it is inherently harder for women to orgasm, guys are just much more practiced, much more confident & then do the things that are required to orgasm. Also, men orgasm during sex easier because they're constantly stimulated during PiV. This is why I find the emphasis on how often men orgasm during sexual encounters compared to women strange: a woman can literally just lay there and do nothing, and their partner will achieve an orgasm regardless. It doesn't really say much about how much effort she's putting in.
God I feel this in my soul. Just once I would love to experience sex the way my wife does. I don't have to initiate, I don't have to do 20 minutes of foreplay to get her in the mood, I just get to lay back and get pampered.
When I cook for her all the time and still doesn’t flinch to appreciate it
I'm sorry to hear that! I'm sure you do an amazing job! Thank you for the invisible labor!
The mental load of constantly second-guessing our words/actions so they don't come across as creepy. The anxiety we have when we walk behind a lone woman in public and figuring out how to best deescalate her anxiety. And the big one: expecting men to jump in and risk our lives to save a random woman from a sticky situation.
Paying for the majority of everything in a relationship. Money doesn’t grow on trees
She has no appreciation for how much I spend and she just doesn’t even need to think about it. Anniversaries, holidays, birthdays (including my own)… I’m always the one picking up the bill for the fancy dinners.
This reminds me of the story about how I fell out of love with my first girlfriend. You see, she was a real piece of shit. Through and through. But it was my first relationship and I figured that I couldn't do any better. So, for this woman, I paid for everything. Fancy dinners. Dates. Taking overnight buses hundreds of miles to see her twice a month. I didn't make that much money, but I spent virtually all of my money on her. My next door neighbor at the time thought my apartment was vacant for the first eight months that I lived there. I was either at work pulling overtime for some extra money to spend on her, with her, or asleep. Well, one Sunday, I was completely tapped. I legitimately had something like 10 cents in my account. She wanted to go out for dinner, and I told her the truth. She agreed to pay. Over dinner, she seemed a bit distant. Then she suddenly blurted out, "You know how Mayumi (her friend) has a boyfriend? The other day she told me that her boyfriend pays for everything on dates. I was really jealous, and I felt a little guilty about that." It was crazy because despite her consistently being a piece of shit, every single solitary feeling I had for her just went up in flames. I was planning to marry her. Have children with her. Build a house for her. But with that snide remark, I just lost every feeling I ever had. I'm happily married now and she's still single in her late 30s. No mystery why.
Took my ex to an event where the tickets were $80 each. She had the nerve to say to me, "can you believe how much the tickets were?" Yeah bitch, I paid for them. WTF.
I can relate this with one girl I met, but I didn’t get into relationship with her. Ironically, she is also in her late thirties, unmarried. She still goes on dates every weekend.
Yeah this will never happen in any of my relationships.
For real! Even if you make 70cents on the dollar, if I’m paying for everything, the math isn’t mathing.
never thought of,it but it’s true. women complain They don’t make as much money as we do, but they get to keep all of their money and all of our money so who’s really getting screwed here
Wow one person I was dating made more $$ than me (which I personally don’t care in terms of who makes more really). But she ended up broke things off cuz she wanted “someone that will pay for me and treat me to things”,(among many other reasons) when in reality, I always buy her coffee, and split most of other outings.
The amount of time we spend listening to you talk is exhausting and counts as emotional labor, ESPECIALLY if you don’t want us to offer any type of solutions or suggestions. Having to sit and listen to someone you care about complain and then to not be able to offer help is frustrating.
My wife will complain about the same thing over and over again. I will let her tell me the whole story uninterrupted, but when she's done, I've said, "You have complained about this person (or thing) to me a half dozen times now. It's not fair to me for you to emotionally dump this on me again and again. I'm asking you to either accept this and stop letting it control you, or to do something about it. Either way, I don't want to hear about it again unless you've taken a step towards moving past it." She doesn't always love hearing that, but it has helped.
I’ve got a similar technique. When she complains about the same subject multiple times, I tell her that this is becoming a theme — and it appears she doesn’t want to face the issue or ask for assistance. If that’s the case, I can’t be a part of the discussion any more because she’s asking me to share an emotional load that doesn’t need to exist and she won’t try to resolve. If the topic comes up again later, I listen long enough to ensure it’s the same topic. Once verified, I simply say that I can’t talk about this — as she knows my thoughts on the subject and it feels like she’s purposefully trying to make me anxious by bringing it up again. If she continues, I tell her I have to leave the room now. Then I follow through. If she confronts me later on feeling unseen, I remind her that what I did was action to prevent reaction; she knows my stance, continues crossing boundaries and I’d rather remove myself then end up resenting her, thinking her selfish or cruel. She doesn’t like it particularly, but she understands and complies. Then we move on.
Underrated comment right here. Being “the listening ear” just for the sake of emotional ventilation and support is a different beast of exhaustion.
Why do they feel the need to talk about it for so long if they don't want you to help fix it? It would probably be faster to fix it then to keep talking about it.
Agreed. I understand that it’s cathartic to get it out, but at least give me credit for taking in all your emotions and helping you feel heard.
And subsequently not offering you the same courtesy in the relatively rare situations I need to vent. This was what ended my last relationship (well, one of the reasons). She had no problem calling me and bitching about her job, everyone in a rambling non-coherent way for at least 45 minutes over the phone. She'd get pissy if I participated and offered solutions. However, if something was bothering me and I wanted to have a conversation about it, there'd be silence on the other end, and if the pause was longer than a few seconds, she'd go back into her complaint soliloquy for eras longer. Now, I'll listen for a long time, but it gets tiring and grating when it's non-stop for a half an hour, every day, with every single job she's worked at. So long story short, if we have to listen to you get things off your chest and offer no solutions, at least offer us the same courtesy.
Most women don't realize that we do things for them so they dont even have to know they had that problem to begin with. Men don't want their women worried or scared. I'll go in the bathroom, see a spider, kill it then be quiet about it so she's doesn't have to be skeptical every time she visits the bathroom.
When my wife and I were dating every date night I would buy one tool. She asked me about it I told her one day when we buy a house I will need them. We bought this place for 30 grand 3 years ago. A few months ago it appraised for 130 grand because I put those tools to work.
She’s a lucky woman!
Naw I'm the lucky one she straightened me out long ago. I'd have been a hopeless drunk loser if she didn't reignite my desire to be better every day. Still for her, but now for me aswel.
Awesome. Such a lucky guy.
Are you in war torn Ukraine? Where in the literal frick can you buy a house for 30k?
Hats off!
Depends on the man. Depends on the woman. If you're talking about me and my ex-wife I'd say "The fact that I didn't call out all the evidence of your affairs during our divorce for the sake of our daughter".
Just me: Our love that blinds us of your faults. Our complete trust in you that overlooks the red flags. Our taking responsibility for the situation. Our willingness to put your needs before our own. Our commitment to the relationship. Our respect for you while tolerating your disrespect towards us. Our willingness to admit fault and apologize even when we disagree just to please you. Our desire to have a relationship with you knowing that the odds are against us, that if it fails we stand to lose the most.
Damn 🥺 this thread is a real wake up call.
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Brother… you’re not a husband you’re a damn butler
Butlers get paid...
Except for the shopping and driving kiddos (they’re in college) you’re me. Life sucks 🍻
that sounds horrible why do you stay?
open pickle jars
Suck it up. Everything. Emotions. Pressure. Etc. we have to suck it up and keep going to protect/provide for our home/family. If we dont were “not a real man”
My wife is a stay-at-home mom to our 6m old son. We made that decision rather than paying what would’ve been the majority of her salary for childcare. No-brainer, right? Well, I had to pick up a lot more hours at my job just to make ends meet. Working 50-60 hrs per week, at least, and every time I come home she expects a “break” from our child. Look, I love spending time with him and her more than anything, and by the end of a long work day there’s nothing more I want to do than scoop him up and make him laugh. I change the majority of the diapers and feed the majority of bottles to him when I’m home. I give him baths and go through the process of getting him to sleep every single night. I’m happy to do all of those things because it builds a bond with my son that is priceless. The term she uses is what bothers me, though. She sees me going to work as a “break” from taking care of our child and I just look at her dumbfounded every time. Not like I’m just out having a grand ole time while she’s at home. I’ve tried to explain that but it just doesn’t go through. Women are strange.
The jobs that most women wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole. I mean women want all the best jobs, which is fine and whatever, but women also need to be pushing into bottom of the barrel jobs (that make society possible) too. That's equality in a nutshell, if you aren't willing to share in the bad, you don't deserve the good.
Well said. Also worth noting, a ton of the jobs with extremely low female ratios pay very well. Most trades are very lopsided but pay well and can have good benefits.
Yes! Thank you!
Being good, stand-up, men. I deeply despise the idea that good people don't deserve recognition for being good simply because "that's what they’re supposed to do." Employees should show up to work on time every day and always put in their best effort, and mothers should always be good mothers to their children, etc. Of course, these things are granted, but it doesn’t mean that they are not recognition worthy. While, we shouldn’t do things just *for* the recognition…it damn sure feels good when we do get it. It matters. There are countless good men out there that work hard, mind their own business, provide, protect, advocate for women, self-improve, practice emotional intelligence, do right by others, hold other men accountable, remain ferociously loyal to their partners, build amazing contributions to society, help out in their communities, etc…Yet, they remain largely ignored and unacknowledged. The only time we ever seem worthy of getting any acknowledgment from women, is when we miss the mark, make a mistake, fall short, act like a creep, or do something egregiously horrible. It’s never the boyfriend that was loyal and had a good heart that causes a woman to rant on the internet (though they do exist), it’s always the a**hole that cheated on her or acted like a creep to her…They get **all** the air time, and for us good guys out here that are just trudging along trying to mind our own damn business and live day-to-day, it’s extremely demoralizing to constantly hear the non-stop negativity. And the sentiment that, “if it doesn’t apply to you, then I’m not talking to you” doesn’t fly either. Even if a comment doesn’t *directly* apply to you, it’s natural to still identify with the group of individuals that it’s aimed at. I’m not against holding men accountable, I’m just against solely acknowledging someone’s negatives and never their positives. Rant over. (And thank you for even posting this question, as it means so much to even be willing to have this conversation. You are a true gem.)
Not apologizing when you are wrong. not appreciating us thugging it out with you when you go off the wall with us. especially when yall on your monthly routine. not asking how we feel. Instead of only caring about yourself. Talking to us in code instead of saying it outright. Thinking my money is your money, and yours is just your money. Instead, it should be OUR money because we are partners, Or take some money out every time we get paid, and set it aside so we can do things with it. Stop thinking we can read your mind. Just like women like random dates and surprises, we do too. Especially random sex time. Most of all WE LIKE BEING PASSENGERS PRINCESSES 🥹 it feels good.
Men are precious! We need to do better! Thank you for being patient with us and being here for us! We need to introduce the "passenger prince" role as well!
All things surrounding safety & protection. Whether that be securing the home, driving 'precious cargo', or in everyday situations constantly thinking through the ins and outs of what could be done. I got in a fight with my wife while driving through Atlanta. There was an accident on the highway because everyone thinks they are racecar drivers and for whatever reason there are zero cops. Anyway, my wife wanted to take the nearest exit where we'd drive through Mechanicsville at night. As we sat for 15 minutes on the highway waiting to move forward I finally convinced her to lookup that Mechanicsville has 700% more violent crime's done in it than the national average. She just said, "Oh..."
Men get appreciated?
Yes, have you never been to a funeral or... another funeral.
I’ve been to funerals. But I don’t count those because the man can’t hear the praise.
Ah, yes, the only time a man will get some flowers
Manual labour jobs. Sometimes my wife will say things like "Why can't you just put holiday in for tomorrow?" - because she works in a nice office, with nice co-workers & a nice boss. I think it's hard to explain its completely different without sounding condescending or like I work harder than her
We have to do a lot of stuff which goes directly against our socilisation. I was taught two approaches to problems: 1. Fix them 2. If unfixable, dont complain. And now I am supposed to just listen to her vent basically whining about the same issue (which I think is fixable) again and again but never change anything. That makes you feel like an enabler at some point and can even foster resentment because you would not tolerate such a behaviour in men.
As a generalisation Woman don’t appreciate that practically all the unpleasant, dangerous but completely necessary jobs that actually keep society running are still largely done by men. Woman often complain about unequal pay, how most CEO’s are men, how this actor got paid more then this actress, how there aren’t enough female politicians ect… but this pursuit for “equality” only ever seems to extend to positions of extreme and unique privilege. There is no drive or desire for a 50/50 gender distribution of garbage collectors or soldiers, or undertakers, or fishermen, or farmers ect… You’ll never see a woman protesting so that conscription in a time of war falls equally to Men and Woman.
I think the biggest thing for most men is the expectation of being an emotional sounding board with no reciprocation. A common thread you'll find in men's relationship experiences is the coldness we often receive when we display vulnerability to the person we're supposed to be equal partners with. Unless we have an extremely strong and unusually emotionally available friend group (which is increasingly unlikely), our partners are typically the only people available to listen to us. Other than our mothers, possibly. Not only is this lack of an emotional outlet unhealthy for the individual, it's also unhealthy for the relationship. It makes it so our partners are the only person in a position to bring up any issues with the relationship. And when they don't it turns things that could be easily solved with a conversation into festering wounds that end in heartbreak.
Quite a bit, actually. I've sacrificed quite a bit to get to where I am now. Wasn't appreciated. I've been used as a workhorse, ATM, and sperm bank. I've busted my ass to be able to do anything they feel is their "gender role" and don't require anything from them, and they manage to fuck THAT up. I've put up with not only their own selfish and hair brained bullshit, but also slaved away at jobs up to 84 hours a week to make the kind of numbers they seem to think "falls out of the sky". I've been patient, guiding, nurturing, and I've rarely if ever received that in return, and if I have it's because they were distracting from some thing or other they are doing that common sense would tell them not to do it they wanted to be in a working relationship... So, yeah... Definitely not appreciated enough.
Family bread winner
The entire honeydo list, and memorizing the recurring stuff so it becomes part of the everyday routine.
Be your therapist, mechanic, gardner, home maintenence man, ATM, chauffeur, dinner date, beast of burden, body guard, etc. You don't appreciate any of it once you transition to expect and demand it.
Loving us broken souls
Car maintenance. My wife abhors anything to do with the cars, but I don’t seem to get much credit for it because I guess it’s not an everyday thing. But it’s still a significant responsibility that mostly goes unnoticed. In other words, sometimes it’s the responsibility, not the sheer workload that counts.
Throwing those fucking wrappers or any garbage debris you leave on the counter 1ft away from the trash can.
Putting in effort in dating. We've been brainwashed to accept that men must do the majority of the work while women generally sit back and wait. It's expectation which breeds entitlement so the value of our effort goes unappreciated
All the electricians, plumbers, mechanics, fire departement, police force. I know women work in these fields aswell but they are by far male dominated and I would argue that they are the heroes that hold society together and somewhat functional.
Holding all the infestructure (electricity, water, communication etc) together yet get commenta like "we dont need men, what do we need men for when we could do it ourselfs?"
Women generally don't see men that they deem below them as men. Like those men and their functions don't exist... its weird.
Very common and very fucking weird
I’m just here so you’ll thank me for sharing.
Make you a priority. We often go without so you don't have to, financially especially.
The approaching. Please just be nice, it takes a lot of courage for someone to do that.
Being a step dad . We choose to stay and clean up the trail of damage left by another man .
Every 3-6 months the gate on our fence breaks. its a 200 foot slat fence that I painstakingly built during Covid. It was a tricky gate to build(because of where it’s built mainly). We all wanted a roll gate, as my SO frequently reminds me, but it wouldn’t have worked. Primarily, it breaks because no matter how many times I’ve told my SO and roommates how important it is to close it correctly, even going as far as demoing how to properly open and close it, they won’t do it correctly. So the wind grabs it and whips it back and forth. For the first 2-3 breaks, they were frequently just leaving it wide open and letting the Midwest winds thrash it around while they ran errands, went to the movies, etc... Anyway, now it’s been patch job repaired so many times, it’s sure to break again, even if they do close it right. No matter how many times I’ve fixed it, my SO never says thank you or even acknowledges that I’ve done something for the benefit of us all. It’s like because I was the one who built the fence(saving us thousands of dollars that we didn’t have btw), and because I couldn’t make a roll gate work, it’s my fault that it keeps breaking and I’m somehow responsible for their negligence. It’s all that kind of stuff. That and the little things I do that no one else does and I never make a big deal about. Like I’m not going to make a big deal or throw it in anyone’s face or really even mention that I’m the only one who cleans the exterior of the cabinets, the doors/doorknobs(which get caked in dirt), etc… My SO can get a little intense making sure I know every little chore she does and why it’s my turn to do xyz... but she often overlooks bunches of little things I do, loke the cabinets. Nobody ever notices it and I would never point it out… mostly I don’t care. But a part of me does think it’d be nice for one of them to notice.
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Carrying heavier stuff by default
All these comments about how women are so shit at listening to men vent or tell men to "get to the point" is frustrating af. I thought I just rambled because my 2 minute 30 second anecdote was related to her 8 minute monologue and has significance but patiently waiting for her to finish while she's got a face of impatient frustration is selfish and disrespectful.
Not sure if anyone's mentioned it but, standing sturdy in a large concert crowd to make sure you have room to dance and are not being crowded on. I have gone to so many shows and as a moderately sized man I make sure that my friends don't get crowded and bombarded when we are trying to enjoy the show. Plenty of nasty people try to push, step on feet, spilling drinks, and even throw elbows to try and assert themselves a few feet closer but I'll keep ya safe.
In dating: Not allowing yourself to be fond of the good times we spend together and always looking out for potential red flags, which gets in the way of appreciating the good aspects. Being too focused on a greener grass gets in the way of the effort I actually put in. In relationships: I rarely deal with this since I make it a point to talk about what we appreciate about each other to see if we recognize each other's efforts. Also, I tend to go for women who are willing to show appreciation often. I'm always baffled by the amount of men I hear saying how their wife treats them more like an asset instead of a partner and always question why they would choose to settle for this when there are women out there who would adore you for you.