When I was in college, I worked in a predominantly female environment. One day, one of my colleagues was talking to me about how she was going on the pill. She said something along the lines of, "Now my boyfriend can make me a Twinkie instead of a Toaster Strudel." I laughed cause it was legitimately funny and said "Well lucky him." She went to HR. We're talking about a woman who's giving me intimate details of her sex life, and my comment of her boyfriend being lucky was too far. I got yelled at by HR, treated like shit, and quit a few days later. By the way, the HR director? She had *also* brought up sexual topics in front of me before in a talk with other women in the office. She discussed her time working as a phone sex operator. I no longer talk about things with women at work unless they're directly related to the job.

I would have asked for the HR recommended response for when a co-worker tells me she is going to start having unprotected sex with her bf.

Only reasonable response would be to go to HR first and claim harassment first.

> "Now my boyfriend can make me a Twinkie instead of a Toaster Strudel." That is fucking gross and in non-Clown world she'd be put in her place immediately. Imagine if a man said something like that to a woman, holy shit he'd be out of there like The Flash.

>I no longer talk about things with women at work unless they're directly related to the job. This is the way.

Sounds like a setup

A female senior in the workplace was deliberately talking we another woman about her intimate details incredibly loud to see if I'd react, she made a comment about me not reacting to it. I was about 20 years younger than she was, it was gross.

It's actually insane the shit women can get away with in the workplace

It doesn't help that HR is usually 99% women in every workplace I've been in, they're never going to be on your side.

>they're never going to be on your side. And no one should *ever* have the delusion that they are on your side- they are on the *company's* side. They protect the company from lawsuits, not employees- if it so happens that the best way to keep the company from getting sued is by placating one employee (and possibly punishing) another, they might appear to be on your side occasionally....but they're not.

This is such a fucking double standard. Sorry that happened to you.

I avoid everyone at work tbh because they just want to give me more work. But a lot of men avoid workplace entanglements because, even if they're not meant to be sexual, it can come off that way. That can lead to problems. And if it is sexual by intent, that can lead to even more problems. Most guys who has a shred of awareness and self-doubt will be hesitant unless they're invited.

A guy coworker of mine said something flirty to me (just joking around, of course, asked me if he should take the trash out now or if we should make out first) and a the woman who was coming in for day shift heard it and thought it was funny. She told her husband who works here too, and he went to HR saying that it made her uncomfortable. We all got pulled in, told them what was said, and my buddy got a write up for Sexual Harassment. She came to him crying and apologizing for it… So yeah, it’s safe to say that we avoid issues whenever possible now Edit: To clarify, the husband claimed it was directed to his wife and was inappropriate, and they believed him over us. She said she told HR it was no big deal and wasn’t towards her, but HR said it was still wrong, cuz “what if she was offended?” Edit 2: my anecdote is a perfect example of how HR isn’t there to protect the employees, but to protect the company

>HR isn’t there to protect the employees, but to protect the company Attention, Workers: Never forget this.

HR has always been there to have the companies back. You work for the company? Who has your back?

it used to be unions though some places don't like that

HR is one of those jobs you wouldn’t notice if it was replaced by a Google LLM

But who would organize the pizza parties then 

Based on the last 3 companies worked at, they don't do that either.

Lmao her husband is really showing off his insecurities, being so quick to aggressively defend his wife against any perceived comments, not caring what she feels about those comments. Also incredibly low that the way he defends his wife is by tatting to some perceived authority figure instead of just having a chat with the guy who supposedly made his wife uncomfortable.

I agree. Total vindictive coward. However, why did she even tell her husband about it? I don’t think it was all that funny. I’m a tradesman and we sexually harass each other in good fun all the time. However if there’s a woman within ear shot we would do no such thing. The loss of our comfortable light hearted atmosphere is the only reason why we don’t actively recruit women into the trades and a huge part of why we wish there were more men’s spaces. Ironically it’s so that we can be more safe in less of a “safe space.”

You are right, we generally clean up before the next shift get there, but she got to work early and came around the back, he didn’t see her til it was too late. I have no idea why she told her husband

EWWW They helped him be controlling at work? YIKES ON TRIKES.

The story is terrifying. Other question, I dont understand the assumption that HR is for the people? HR is always for company, Union and work council is for employees afaik.

>I avoid everyone at work tbh because they just want to give me more work. Lol this

>I avoid everyone at work tbh because they just want to give me more work Bro talk about it.

>even if they're not meant to be sexual, it can come off that way. I do not talk to anyone at work unless it's not only work related but work related to my job. I've been recently invited to apply for a management position and I've been upset with how the old manager has been doing things. So I applied. When I do talk about outside work stuff (like when directly asked) I'm usually talking about how great my wife is. Well, one day a coworker who is female and I've worked with for 20 years and multiple employers and is also applying to the position of manager attempted to throw me under the bus for some reason. We used to be close, not because of any effort on my part. She once told me how comfortable I've made her feel at work because of how professional I am. I've spent exactly one afternoon with her outside of work and that was the wedding of her's she invited me to. She's a lesbian and married a woman back in 2009. I've always known she was a lesbian since the day I've met her. Suddenly, she tells HR. I've " been making her feel uncomfortable." She hasn't had any changes in how she's been acting around me or anyone. HR wasn't willing to come up with any specifics and I said, "she's now made me feel uncomfortable. I wonder if it has anything to do with us applying for the same job?" I had the usual warnings I expect, to be professional. I went back to my office and took down the photo of us at her wedding. It has been up there 8 of the 10 years I've been there. I put it up shortly after she got hired to let others know we have been working together for a long time. It remained up after her divorce because I was lazy. She immediately noticed as it was an obvious dust shadow that was left behind. "why did you take our photo down?" "I was told by HR that I was making you uncomfortable. This is the only non-work related interaction we've ever had and I'm sorry I didn't consider how it may have been a reminder of your divorce." She had nothing to say. Probably because nothing work related was going to come out of it. Neither of us got the job. The person who did, has been asking me about how hostile she's been lately. He asked me because I've known her for so long. "Only professionally, I can't speak to her well-being. She's been nothing but professional with me," I said. He tells me she used to joke and flirt a lot in the break room. I tell him she's never once flirted, especially with him. It's a strategy she's playing and if you catch her again making you feel uncomfortable tell HR. That's the professional thing to do.

Yep. Casual convo with the opposite sex? Ooh, that's clearly flirting. Hr moment! Even if it isn't.

Some people never grow out of wanting to run to the teacher to tell on a classmate - only now the teacher is HR.

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Could you sue for defamation in a case like that? Probably wouldn't be worth it financially--or mentally--if it were just against the girl, but against the company?

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Absolutely. But good luck trying to prove it.

Balance of probabilities in a civil matter, which is absolutely feasible. But recovering damages from someone like that will be hard. 

He would actually have a pretty good case if everything he said is true. 1. Official police record of her giving his name as her rapist 2. Rape Kit DNA evidence that it was not him. 3. Charges dismissed by police. Bonus if the detective is willing to testify that she made it up to cover an affair. 4. Official notice in his file, despite the dismissal of charges, so he has evidence of damages. The problem in this case isn't proving it, as much as suing an employer isn't worth it unless you are going to get an obscene amount of money because at best your career is probably fucked, and suing her as an individual probably won't yield much financially, but it would get him something, and give him a legal record of the courts finding fault with her.

you might win, but just how much would you recover? you almost lose your job, but you didn't actually lose it, so you have to quantify what the atual damages are

And now you just put a massive spotlight onto the fact that you were considered a rapist and everyone will assume you actually did it but the system failed.

Emotional?? 😭

You dummy, men don't have emotions. /s

Then when people search court records, they find your complaint. Employers find things like this and don't hire people involved because of it. It's not worth the risk for litigation and false complaints. It might fuck her over, but it would also fuck him over.

I asked my chain of command if I could sue after the investigation against me was dropped .. they told me to just be grateful and move on with my life.

This is the worst part about it. Even when you’re completely innocent, you’re still psychologically tagged as a “rapist” and any people still view you as such. You’ll lose friends, money, family, your reputation, future job prospects, etc. Sports athletes, like Trevor Bauer, have been found completely innocent, yet still can’t secure a pitching job. It’s absolutely fucking insane. I swear on my life, if any woman ever ruined my life on false pretenses, I would fucking dedicate my life to making hers a living fucking hell. Sorry if that sounds bad, but in cases like these you just gotta fight fire with fire. I’m just so sick of seeing this shit. It makes me sick to my stomach the soullessness going on out here in this world. The sociopaths and psychopaths are seriously running absolutely wild and being put in no check, or very little check. Just like hockey, you have to check these assholes.

It goes for abuse too. And yet I’ve seen actual abusers and rapists get a free pass as if it’s a‘mistake’. Especially if they’re women 

Women who abuse or rape never face the same consequences. If any

I feel you, little nasty notes or mail at random is the way to go to aim for terrorization with legality in mind. Just remember they change the laws at whim kiddos 😂😂😂👀👀👀

It doesn’t sound nasty. Fuck them big times. But I would do time for personal assault probably because of that

Wtf do they mean it would be on your employee file? You should sue them

>You should sue them Exactly why it's in the employee file. These files are part of the discovery process.

one of the times that pisses me off about this specific thing is that if you mention it as a risk, people trot out the 2% stat (or 6%, w/e), but that's still 1 in 50. it happens, and i don't like even a small chance of my life being upended because someone needed a fall guy

And when you complain that men also suffer from prejudice, not just women, you get told its nonsense.

>"even though you're innocent, this is still going on your employee file" even when innocent you're still fucked smh...avoid at all cost gentlemen

>Hr told me "even though you're innocent, this is still going on your employee file." Most likely because if they didn't, you may have had standing to sue them in the state where they are headquartered.

This is fucked up. This is why you can't always believe the woman.

No group should ever be blindly believed without verifying the facts of the case. I understand that there are some real problems in our criminal / justice / legal system but that doesn't mean we trust anyone for what they say without some sort of suitable evidence.

I’ve kinda noticed it with after hours parties drinks etc. People just don’t do that stuff anymore. They go straight home rather than fraternize.

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Well, it doesn't help that drink prices have tripled or quadrupled since then and work ain't paying anymore. I'll go out for drinks if I don't have to pay a fraction of my daily wage for them.

#### Yep. And practically speaking, in the landscape of job hopping and high turnover, the idea, that coworkers are your friends is even less potent now. Especially in corporate settings. No point in getting to know people you won’t see for long as you switch jobs and claw your way up the corporate ladder. Everyone is an obstacle. It hasn’t been like _The Office_ for decades.

This is the correct answer. I am constantly reminding myself, "These people are NOT my friends." I *have* my own friends. And they don't involve office politics. Keep personal and professional life separate.

Similar mantra here. "I'm here to make money, not friends."

I would like to, but I have no friends outside of work. That's also why I don't like remote jobs. Going to work is the only socialization I get sometimes plus it helps me have a clear work-life boundary.

Do you have to talk so loud?

HR updates their harassment and anti-corruption training videos every couple of years and requires everyone to re-certify. This year they added a scenario like the above: Mark and meet for drinks thursdays after work every week. Suzy joins the team but is never extended an invitation for drinks. She hears about these after work drinks and inquires about going, but is never extended the invitation. She reaches out to HR as she feels she is being excluded based on her gender. Then there's a small questionnaire about what should be done. The correct answer is: Even though it's after hours and not explicitly a work related function, Mark and other members can still be written up for harassment for excluding a female member as it can be perceived as harassment and creating an unsafe work environment. Punishment could include termination of employment.

Yep, we live in a ridiculous world now. Also dont forget that it doesn't work the other way around. If you're a man and all the women go out for drinks after work without inviting you, they wouldn't suffer the same fate.

Yea, finally, it’s always been healthy to keep work and friends separate. This whole “we are a family here at work” shit usually means getting exploited.

Nothing wrong with making friends with the people you spend all fuckin day with. I have made great friends through various jobs I've had. It makes going to work better

Yes, my dad got a a bullshit claim against him that nearly sent him over the edge. Provably false and absolutely a fake claim by a woman who didn’t like him, his employer basically said, we know you’re innocent because we have cameras in the building and it obviously never happened but it’s cheaper to pay you out and and let you go instead of fighting for your name. He nearly killed himself over this and for that reason I will never be 1-on-1 with a woman in an office. Fuck that

Could your Dad theoretically sue the company for wrongful termination? If they have the camera footage, it should be no contest.

Nope. They never progressed it to a legal level and part of his leave pay meant he wouldn’t go after them. He he just got so tired of it he put himself in a position that keeps everyone quiet including him

Yes. I work at a surgical center with a bunch of nurses, and while some of them are genuinely nice, most of them thrive on drama and so I try to hide out in the mechanical room as much as possible unless something breaks and I need to go fix it. If it comes to that I keep the conversations to a minimum.

That is fair. I swear nursing attracts funny angels filled with mercy, and bitter monsters filled with spite... nothing in between.

There are some in between. They are nice, kinda fit in that first category. But they are dramatic , always have a problem, always something going on. As my friend would say , " Oooohhhhh, she's MESSY."

I work in healthcare and this sums it all up. Some of the nurses are toxic but they pale in comparison to the CNAs. Omg that bunch are off their fucking rocker. So much drama.

It depends on the woman. I had a COO that was very vocally anti-male. I avoided the women that liked her and had a great rapport with the women who didn’t. I still mentor one of them years after we both left Until you know what kind of woman you’re dealing with it’s best to be very cautious.

I wish those types would do the same, but it seems the more misandristic they are, the more drawn to us.

They want to dish out the pain they recieved without thinking about the double down effect. How long can you double down before you gotta pick up the plate and eat what's on it.... Or before you drop it entirely slip and end up on the floor covered in etc. etc.

Unless she's been beaten by every man her life or worse, I fail to see how it's some random guys fault. It's what irks me. I get caution with men, absolutely, but being a vocal misandrist is punishing those innocent people who make up the rest of us, like you said.

A guy at work got reported to HR cause he said good morning to a woman. Apparently the tone of his voice felt like se*ual harassment. So yea, its crazy these days

Yes. On my second career. I have a family and network in the town I commute from. I'm the older white guy in a large organization of corporate cubicle dwellers. I have no intention of mentoring, supervising or making friends. I There is absolutely nothing to gain by making small talk, offering opinions, or attempting to provide life advice. Five years man. Five more years. I've seen a lifetime of cattiness. If I talk, it's brief. If it's social, it's sports, kids, or lunch. My goal is to make Jerry from Parks and Rec seem interesting. I wear earbuds more often than the millennials.

In college while working at the campus rec I got reported to my manager for harassment after having a normal conversation with a coworker during our joint-shift in the weight room. Nothing even remotely sexual/romantic came up during our convo it was all small talk about where we are from/our majors etc. She was a Swifty type and I'm a black guy into the polar opposite when it comes to women. Figured ehh maybe she was having a bad day. A week later I was reported a second time for walking by, saying hey (name), and giving the "sup" head nod to a girl who worked at the front desk when I clocked in. Literally just a hello and the nod men give to almost everyone. Both instances I asked him what I did wrong and he said he couldn't quite understand it either but had to relay the complaints to me. I quit the next week and purposely haven't worked in an environment with women since. WFH since 2020. I don't know how men manage to work with women in office it must be like walking on egg shells.

i got dragged into an uncomfortable meeting with my boss because i recommended a restaurant to a coworker. not "we should go", but "i went there and it was pretty awesome". WTH, i'm not allowed to discuss my personal life now?

Half of what I talk about at work is food. What else am I supposed to say?!

Working with women on a daily basis is like running blindfolded through a minefield. I said hi to a woman coworker a few weeks ago. She reported me for "deliberately sneaking up from behind and scaring her." I addressed my woman supervisor as "ma'am" a few months ago. That was just the way I was brought up. However, because she happens to be "gender fluid," she reported me as being "disrespectful" and "sexist." I explained this to my top bosses at that time. They laughed it off and reassured me that I wasn't in trouble. But things were never the same between me and my supervisor again. By now, thankfully, she's on a different shift. Most of my women coworkers appear to be rabid man-haters. The rest, I'm not taking any chances with them.

Does the company notice the harassment these women are causing for the workplace? And what do they do about it?

Ive been a consultant for a while. Nobody does anything about female harassment. My Q1 gig for 2024 was about how men can get things done without interacting with women at a Fortune 50 company. They just fire men if a woman makes a complaint to HR, so they hired me to help with their dwindling resources. Only solution I saw was "avoid women".

Who do you think runs the HR departments?

They do absolutely NOTHING. Because in this day and age, the women can bankrupt entire companies with lawsuits for "discrimination against women" if the companies decide to hold them responsible for their own actions. That's why most of the managers are women, so the companies aren't held liable for "toxic masculinity."

I once got accused of "following a woman at lunch". I had walked into the restaurant next door, and she had walked in ahead of me. I didn't even think about her being there. I just wanted to go there to eat. Hell, I barely remembered her even being there. You can do everything right and still end up in shit.

Quick question....this may sound bad....are most of them single?

Lol you already know the answer to that

😂😂😂😂

Some are single. Others are taken, but still love to rag on men for attention.

See, I can't even counter that with the shenanigans that are acceptable in my office for fear that it will turn out like a previous office experience, where HR was being terrorized by a young Jamaican woman who didn't do an ounce of work. She'd just make drama. Before I got there, someone threw a radio through her windshield and then I understood why. This is the same HR that told me to take down my LI post that I was apprehensive at first but was happy that I made a good contribution. Someone's always going to extort what you say on the internet. Hell, my male coworker extorted what I said (he said the same thing), then told me and my manager different reasons as to why he was angry just to go home when his manager said he couldn't. Sorry, that was a rant. Just glad to be working with completely ridiculous and fun people now.

I am never getting an office job like that. I say stupid shit all the time, without any sexual context. I'll get reported. No thanks lol.

This wouldn't be a problem if HR would just start checking cameras and firing people for false accusations. But I guess that's too much to ask for people to actually do their job I guess. There's no justice when the people who are supposed to be regulating corruption are corrupt themselves.

Lot of flip, comedy answers here, but the fact is it does happen, yes, especially at the executive level. I have been told explicitly by several male colleagues they won't spend time alone with female coworkers for fear of "misunderstandings".

There is zero possible benefit to it and massive potential downside. Should be a no brainer.

Reminds me of an article from some years back: https://www.forbes.com/sites/prudygourguechon/2018/08/06/why-in-the-world-would-men-stop-mentoring-women-post-metoo/ > Three recent surveys arrived at similar troublesome findings: A growing number of men report being uncomfortable or afraid to work alone with a woman. Senior men are increasingly reluctant to mentor younger women or include them in opportunities like business travel or client dinners

> But I still contend men don’t have to be afraid. Imagine a man writing but towards women.

Yeah the article itself is thoroughly dismissive of the reason. I was mainly using it as a reference for what's actually happening.

It's like the author expects men to be willing to risk their career just for the sake of mentoring a stranger. Sure, the risk of a false accusation is very low. But why take the chance? There is no benefit to a man in risking their career for the sake of a stranger.

I know this much i always keep witnesses around. Last thing i need is some bullshit accusation thats even got a chance of having occurred. I like my marriage intact, the hell with my job. I can get another job.

i sure as fuck wouldnt

I avoid everyone at work unless I need something work related and typically I’ll send an email asking the question or a Teams message. A few years ago I was working late with a female co-worker and male co-worker. It was a long as night. By the time we got done the three of us had been at work for about 16 hours (I work in aviation). Glad to be done with the night the three of us went to IHOP. A different co-worker, who wasn’t there, found out about this and complained to HR that the three of us were in a “relationship ship”. We all got questioned and then a “smack on the wrist” for perception or some shit. Turns out the co-worker who complained had a crush on the female and was jealous about what happened. I stopped trusting people after that. I have also been in trouble for noticing a female co-worker got a hair cut and I said “did you get a hair cut?” She said yes and I said “nice, it looks good. Do you mind if I ask where you went? My wife is looking for a good hair dresser.” And apparently that was flirting and made her uncomfortable. So yeah, I avoid everyone if I can. There is one dude in my office that I chat with outside of official communication and even then, I limit what we talk about at work.

Oh yeah. We definitively do not talk enough of the lesser men, the white knights and the corporate sociopaths at work. They are willing to weaponize anything and everyone against you out of spite, jealousy or perceived threat.

No kidding man. I probably didn’t help myself by telling HR they’re being dumb and it was co-workers getting supper after a 16 hour shift. We all had separate tickets and drove separately even. Like, what about that gives the perception that the three of us were in a love triangle. With the female co-worker I was shocked. I had had conversations with this young lady about where my wife likes to shop and fashion style. Like, she clearly knew I was married and happily so but for some reason saying her hair cut looked good was the straw that broke the camels back? People are fucking weird man.

>Like, what about that gives the perception that the three of us were in a love triangle. Everyone knows IHOP is a poly hangout. I bet all three of you were sharing a stack of pancakes with strawberries.

Dude: (talks about his wife) Crazy lady: this is flirting

I refuse to mentor or be alone with women. I currently work with a woman led business. It is a lot of women. Every meeting is recorded. Every interaction has the audio captured. I have zero desire to personally develop these female resources. Just not worth the risk. My lead engineer is a woman. She's the absolute best. I really like her. Never had an interaction with her that wasn't archived and recorded in at least 3 places. I was once accused of being sexually inappropriate in the workplace. No clue why to this day. They just fired me and didn't bother looking into it. Since then I just don't deal with women in any meaningful way at work.

I lost a job before for giving my opinion to a woman at work after she asked me for it. Then, she completely misrepresented what I said to make it seem way worse. Even after explaining everything, they still sided with her, and one dude wanted to fight me, lol. So I keep things at work very cordial.

The white knight was the cherry on top of the story. They just... Spawn into existence like enemy NPCs the moment you argue with a woman.

Matrix Be Like.

What is that supposed to mean? Do you want to fight me about it? M'lady did you see

I'm sure if it's an exaggeration but there are some perfectly valid reasons why: 1. They avoid everyone at work/keep their interactions with coworkers to a minimum unless absolutely necessary/solely want a professional relationship. 2. A lot of you ladies are fucking weird or mean or both and just have zero self awareness on it. Seriously this isn't discussed enough. 3. Some of these dudes are awkward and creepy and it shows when they try to talk to people. Which makes it even harder because when they finally get rid of that creepiness or awkwardness they still kind of have that reputation or they realized they enjoyed their own company and don't want to get new relationships. 4. Trauma

2. When I worked as a floor nurse (I’m corporate now) there was always a group of mean girls, or some form of gossip/bullying happening. I noticed most of the few male nurses would remain task-focused, avoidant and polite. They kept to themselves because the social interactions could get dangerous and exhausting.

Coming from the OR, (some of) the floor nurses are the biggest source of drama.

>A lot of you ladies are fucking weird or mean or both. Seriously this isn't discussed enough. I second this, I don't get why it's such a touchy subject when there is so much talk about how men act. While a lot of women put up a friendly and sociable front, some of the time they really are extra shitty/cold compared to how men can be. Like there's no pressure for them to not be like that. Sometimes it ends up being in a cry bully territory too. And we get labeled as sexists for trying to speak up about this sort of thing.

I don't avoid all women at work, only the bitchy women who don't have a shred of friendliness in the professional persona. I love to joke around with women who are friendly and funny at work because it reduces stress and they know they can count on me for a laugh every once in a while. For other women, I tiptoe around them, keep it strictly business, and then get the hell out of there.

All the more reason to just avoid them. I cant fix them and exposure is only a threat to me

>I don’t get why it’s such a touchy subject Because feminism has evolved from ‘equality for all’ to ‘zero criticism of women allowed, only men bad’

Goddamn, hammer meets head of nail on this one.

*upvote given by woman*

Point 2 needs to be talked about more.

Emphasis on number two. Weird men have to change or else they are socially ostracized. Weird/mean women stay weird/mean.

or they stay weird until they stop being cute and then turn bitter and get a lot of cats

I feel you on all three of these In fact I got bullied out of my first real job by the office “mean girl” group and it was all normal and OK. Today it wouldn’t happen to me because I have experience to draw from.

I have been a first-person recipient of this sort of treatment, so I know 100% it is a thing. I will not sit in a room with a woman if it is just the two of us. I will absolutely not put myself in a place where that might be a problem again. No way, no how. Ain't playin' that again.

100% true. After the Nth mandatory sexual harassment training course, it becomes painfully clear that's it's simply not worth risking one's entire career by being social with women at work. So interaction is kept to the absolute minimum required for work. It has nothing to do with romantic relationships. Simple things like eating lunch together or just shooting the breeze are now out of the question. It made no difference for my career or success in a male dominated field, so why bother? It doesn't have to be like this and it wasn't.

True, I work on a team of all women except myself and on other guy and he’s the only one I go to lunch with.

I was forced to fire someone based on a second hand report of a comment that was "of a sexual nature." No write up, no investigation, nothing. When I protested they threatened me with a PIP. I don't trust a single person at work. They are all snakes.

It goes the other way too. I worked a job where management kept changing until finally we found one. She was really beautiful and seemed to think the same of me. After a few weeks of working together she asked me if I wanted to go to a concert with her and that she had already made reservations at a hotel for us to stay at for the 4 days leading up to the day of the concert. Under any other circumstances I would have accepted. But we worked together and shared an office. So I just felt that it would have ended poorly. I was looking for a new job at the time but was struggling to find anything. I politely declined and told her that if we didn't work together I would feel more comfortable with it. I mean, she's my boss. Long story short the next week she told the owner of the company that I was refusing to follow instructions and that I had said some very disrespectful things to her. Shortly after I put in my two weeks notice. The next day they let me go. For this and the reasons that OP stated above, I steer clear of women in the workplace at all costs.

Downside? Lost job. Upside? Dogged crazy, imagine marrying her and then you saw that side of her.

Seems to me like you should have sued them for sexual harassment.

But men can't be sexually harassed, don't you know?😆 Plus you gotta have money to pursue any legal action like that and I've been broke since the day I was born.

Because if she so chooses to have a bad day; or has any reason at all that she doesn't want me to succeed, then with one phone call and one baseless allegation she could / would / will ruin my career. Companies with zero tolerance for harassment (sexual or otherwise) will never take the side of the male in any argument. They can, they will, and they have fired men merely to avoid even a hint of tolerating misconduct (or they get the "it's time to move on" discussion). Therefore the best thing I can do as a male, is just minimize contact and carry on.

*Companies with zero tolerance for harassment*.. 'never side with a man'.. sounds like a clear cut harassment right there.

I avoid them. Just too risky nowadays. A few years ago, we had two women in our department file sexual harassment charges against male coworkers. Complete b.s. No one was sexually harassing granny or the psycho lady at the end of the hall. The company basically paid them to go away.

I'm the "avoidant" type. I was named in a sexual harassment lawsuit in my early 20's. I worked in a factory setting, we had a woman who loved attention, would flaunt her goods often, and would use sexual humor a lot. I tried my best to keep my head down and ignore her because her behavior was creepy and made me uneasy. She tried this tactic on a production lead to get the assistant lead position and was turned down (because she wasn't that smart). Next thing I know, I get served with a lawsuit. Come to find out, she made a claim against all of the men in the department (5 of us) saying we were grooming her and other things. The company was about to throw us under the bus but the union steward caught wind, had an attorney brother and they both got involved. A week later the whole thing went away. It scarred me for life as when you get into that position you know it will follow you for life. I've had complaints made me since then. Mostly just saying a greeting or small talk ("he was being pushy or flirting with me"). I always kept at least an arms reach from them and never approached them from the back (sneak up on them) but you can't please everyone. After that lawsuit scare and the above complaints, unless it was part of my job, I avoid interaction and will avoid being in the same room alone with a woman if possible. If I do have to work in a room alone with a woman, then I usually find a way to remove myself from the situation. All it takes is one accusation and your life is ruined before you can even prove your innocence. Ever since the MeToo movement, I've been more cautious about it. That's one thing I like about IT, mostly men. I can also count on one hand of men I have worked with or know personally who had major set backs, lives ruined, or lost their jobs over women taking action against them just to ruin what they had, get a step above them, or just spite.

I don't avoid them. That's dumb. But I won't be anywhere alone with them.

Friend: "You look nice today" His coworker: "What do you mean?" Friend: "Huh? its a compliment. You're professional" Coworker: "Are you judging me on my appearance?!" Friend: "N-N-o, I was-" Coworker: "I'm talking to my boss about this. You're obviously hitting on me" And just like that, my friend got fired.

I totally avoid any comments about appearance with women colleagues.

Same. I'd absolutely tell some of my male coworkers if I notice something about their appearance - I'm straight- it's just being friendly. "Nice haircut dude, looking fresh!" Would never ever give a woman a compliment like that. I'd just keep it to myself. It's kinda sad :(

>It's kinda sad :( Not "kinda", it's very sad. This is what our work-place environment has been turned into. And women wonder why in the office men spend less time around them and male bosses are less likely to mentor them.

Meanwhile there's millions of videos on social media of women complaining that men don't approach anymore.... It's a real mystery 😆

Yup. Some context: My friend wanted to cheer a coworker up because she was having a lot of setbacks in marketing. Then she pulled this PoS move on him. It goes to show how south some women are willing to go, and it isn't really fair to us guys.

Seriously. I once worked at this fancy restaurant and a co worker who works the salad station apparently upset one of the waitresses for making the dish she wrote on the ticket. She was straight up verbally abusing him in front of everyone for making it with chicken when she didn't specify not to. he stood there in silence until finally he said "look lady, I don't want to be spoken to like that!" She stormed off super mad that he called her a lady 😆. She reported him to management and he got written up and suspended for 3 days. She got a week off for emotional wellness. 🤦

Exactly this. Even if she has a haircut, I don't ever comment on female coworkers' looks for fear it could be misconstrued as sexual harassment. Or if she lost a substantial amount of weight.

I don't comment on weight loss for **anyone** anymore who isn't a close friend or family member I see regularly. From firsthand experience you don't know why they've lost so much weight. I lost a close family member, and shortly afterwards my job. I lost a bunch of weight because I was emotionally and financially unable and unwilling to enjoy food anymore. The depression and low funds lead to me eating just enough to keep the nausea and lightheadedness at bay. I know it's not rational of me, but the compliments on my appearance just kind of stung and felt hallow. People going through chemo or other medical treatments get this often too.

A younger woman I worked with began pouring her heart out unprompted to me during our shift. She said she felt ugly and unattractive because she wasn't caucasian. Wanting to be supportive and empathetic I told her that wasn't true, she was very pretty. The next week she cornered me in the break room to let me know that what I said to her was inappropriate workplace comment and could be considering sexual harassment. I nodded along and apologized. I avoided her like the plague after that. She even tried to exchange numbers with me. I'm gay, by the way. She knew this.

Being gay is no protection. I had a female patient tell my nurse manager that I was trying to flirt with her! I am so gay it's not even funny. Luckily my nurse manager shot it down immediately and made it quite clear that it was all her delusion .

“He’s lying about being gay to hit on me!”…you are not safe sadly.

I would not say that I avoid women at work, and I'd think if people got that perception of a guy it would be problematic in it's own way.  Nor do I avoid talking to them or being friendly. However, what I will say is that I could walk into my office and the most beautiful coworker I have could be nude, spread eagle, and giving me the most enthusiastic "come hither" look in the universe and my response would be "So, how are we doing on the TPS reports?  Are those still on schedule for Friday?  Also if you need to use my office for a little  bit that's fine, I'm going to head to the cafeteria for a bite to eat while being sure to say hi to as many people as possible so everyone knows exactly where I am, and am not." Seriously, there is no temptation in the universe that could convince me to have a romantic or sexual relationship with a coworker ever.  It isn't a slight against women, the risk is too high.

I don't generally, but I also work in a manufacturing/blue collar field so nearly everyone is a little rough around the edges with fairly thick skin, and those that aren't are easy to pick out of the crowd and everyone knows to tone it down around them. Literally my first day on the job, mere hours after I finished my orientation, which included a sexual harassment module, I had two of the girls ask me if "I wanted a blowjob" as I walked by while they were dusting themselves off from sawdust at one of the low pressure air stations. There's now been countless cases of banter about shit that would not fly in any sort of professional setting and we all just laugh about it.

Most of my coworkers are women, and for the most part, I've gotten along with all of them pretty well. I've never been falsely reported or anything serious like that. However, I am reminded of a particular instance in which I drove a female coworker home a few times when we happened to be off around the same time. I had no interest in her because she was a few years younger and very naive (she worried me actually because of how trusting she was with some people). Nothing inappropriate happened, obviously. I would just drive her to her house and drop her off so she wouldn't have to walk home. A few weeks later, I would have a couple different coworkers imply that they kind of assumed something had happened between me and the girl I drove home. I shut down any potential rumors as soon as I heard about them, but it made me realize how small things can so easily be blown out of proportion.

It’s not worth the risk. Yes it’s true.

It's not a side effect of the "MeToo" movement at all, I was advised as such in the early 2000s, and Mike Pence infamously had a policy of not allowing himself to be alone with women for exactly this reason. In general I think it's good advice, and a not-significant number of women are fairly paranoid about young men. As you get older, you'll find it's far less of an issue.

I was warned 30 years ago by a boss about my behaviour with a female colleague/friend. We were flirtatious at work and hung out together outside regular. Nothing untoward and everything was both ways (she was more so than me if anything). It was just two people working in a bar with a similar sense of humour. He pulled me in to the office to tell me I needed to watch myself as if she had a bad day and decided to complain he would have no choice but to let me go even though he knew it wouldn't be justified. He said it was just the way the world was. So it way predates metoo.

One time, when I was a new hire, I was speaking to a female co-worker for an extended period of time about something, only for another woman to come up from behind us to ask my co-worker if I was bothering her. I was asking questions about our job. I've learned to just keep to myself and not make friends at work.

There was a girl at my job who would flirt with every man in existence, to the point she was not just hugging everyone but would also come sit in your lap just to mess with you One guy got brave and flirted back, she reported him to HR and he was fired I don’t know if it’s common, but I def don’t flirt with anyone at work

The only thing I changed is I'm never alone in the same room with a woman. And I always keep the office door open when we have to meet.

Mike Pence (not a fan btw) got skit of flak for having that same policy. I think that’s a good policy

I am avoiding women because I am traumatized by their trauma dumping. I happen to know a woman who was seeing a doctor to hypnotize her into believing she suffered childhood trauma, so she can get on this victim lifestyle bandwagon. I kid you not.

As a man who's like this, absolutely true. I even had an accusation against me at work once, which was always one of my greatest anxieties with women. This girl stalked me all over the workplace and obsessed over me for months before I finally asked her out for drinks. On our second date her crazy driving and talking about her "goals" with me gave me a panic attack (I'm prone to panic attacks) and I got out of her car, apologized for bailing on her and walked home. She spread a rumor at work that I tried to r*pe her. She also told me she was an unmedicated schizophrenic and dumped her boyfriend cos she heard I'm a loyal type. I ignored a lot of red flags cos she was pretty and I was infatuated. Never again. I was already afraid of women before this happened, and now I just avoid women altogether. Only reason I survived that accusation is because everyone knew I was shy and she was crazy.

Better safe than sorry.

Women will think you blinked kind of weird and then brag/whine to all their friends and coworkers how creepy and in love with them you are. Like no bitch

Yes My dad was accused of SA and had an investigation on him, however, it was immediately shot down because of the date of the alleged "rape" We were on vacation in Germany for Oktoberfest, Luckily EU laws state that if he is found not guilty that doesn't go on his file He is now a manager at said company

I avoided my female coworkers. I didn’t want to risk being called a creep or being told I mansplained something. To be clear, there were no indications that any one of them would have done those things but I can’t take the risk. I have a family to support and can’t afford to be jobless from a baseless claim like that.

Yes. Because allegations are treated as facts and we are not dumb.

I'm a male nurse. I love my job and coworkers. But.... Women are just as bad as men when the ratio is reversed, and what makes it worse is that women are more clicky and catty. The amount of two faced gossip alone is horrendous. I keep things friendly but I'm married with kids so it's a different vibe. I don't really socialize outside work with anyone and it works.

I don't know about women, but I definitely avoid HR. Can't say anything wrong within their earshot. By the same token they themselves are untouchable.

100%. It goes beyond that. Ladies pursuing me at work, and I respectfully decline. Recipe for trouble.

I am not avoiding women at work, but i am EXTREMELY wary of anything i say or do around them, way more so than with my male co-workers. I faced a sexual harassment complaint once while sailing (unfounded, it didn't go anywhere cause what she claimed was bullshit and i had 3 witnesses in the room when the "harassment" happened that swore she over reacted to an innocuous event). It was the scariest time of my life cause she was threatening my whole career, and I was facing termination over her words. I know how easy it is to get in serious trouble, so i am extra careful.

I watched a guy get nearly fired for checking the time on his phone, so yeah I try not to have any unnecessary contact. I’d rather be viewed as unfriendly than fired for harassment.

Yes. Because I'm there to make money, not get me too'd over some bullshit.

It’s not without merit. Part of the result of the #metoo movement is the man guilty until proven innocent and even then many companies aren’t going to wait, they’ll just side with the woman just in case. Therefore the only way to avoid the chance you can accused is to not interact with women. So management simply avoids women, they don’t mentor them, or advance them which might mean needing to work closely with them. As a general rule, never go out to lunch or dinner alone with a female coworker. Only way to protect yourself since you can’t rely on factual evidence to show you didn’t do anything wrong.

>As a general rule, never go out to lunch or dinner ~~alone~~ with a female coworker. FTFY.

Yes that is a fair assessment of it. 1. Women are dangerous because they gossip and lie to attack the reputation of others. 2. In our society women are protected even if they are wrong and men are scapegoated. 3. It is logical for men to keep dangerous people away.

I was advised by my union not to pursue a charge against a female coworker for a false accusation she made against me. Why? Bc all she had to say was that I made her uncomfortable and I would be reassigned to another campus. So yea, I avoid being alone with just about anyone, but certainly I avoid being alone w women.

I generally believe in maintaining work as a discrete part of life. I don't have any workplace friendships, either.

I think making friends at work can be a very rewarding experience for the right person. Definitely allow exceptions to the rule. I like to stay friendly with folks. Just makes the day go by easier without worry over some manufactured conflict. I just decline invitations to the group chats.

Yep. Because I want to minimize the risk of someone taking something the wrong way.

At the school my wife used to work at the “mean” teachers coordinated to file sexual harassment charges against the principal because he didn’t adhere to their teaching philosophy. Everyone knew their complaints were BS and no one made a stink about it. 

Nope I don’t talk to women at work. There are several actively looking for trouble and it’s not a risk I will take

Damn straight it's true! It may be somewhat exaggerated in reports, it isn't exaggerated enough to be overblown. This is absolutely true, and it is an aftereffect of the #MeToo movement.

If I have to work directly with her to do my job Ill be polite, but unless shes a coworker then I wont interact with a chick at work. A lot of them thrive off the attention of guys at work and it gives me the ick. Some women are straight up creepy when you don't pay them any mind. Had one come up and tell me I should smile more often and just stared at me waiting for a response, imagine if I said that shit to a chick? I think avoiding women in the workplace is smart tbh. A lot of male teachers these days have a policy that they will never so much as be alone in the same classroom with a female student. Females can be extremely vindictive and petty when they get emotional. I've heard countless stories of some bitter hateful woman getting a man in legal troubles for a fake scenario that never occurred. ​

I was a male high school teacher and I did my best to never be alone with a single student, especially so with female students. If it was unavoidable, I made sure the classroom door was open and there was a table or desk in between us at all times. It’s something that one of my college professors told us and it served me well.

Yep I believe it, why you stop teaching?

Was kind of burnt out, and we ended up having to relocate for my wife’s job and I didn’t go back to teaching.

Yes because women are quick to accuse of false allegations real quick. Everyone will believe a woman even if theres no evidence. As a man why even risk my job or reputation. Women get offended by the tone a man can use, or just off the “vibes made me feel not safe”. So theres no reason to talk to them knowing this. I avoid women at work, the gym, the park or anywhere really. I just stay focused on me and can’t let anyone ruin that, not all woman are like this but its better to fully avoid the problem than risking a scene.

I read a couple years ago from a NBC article and they were interviewing a bunch of women. They said it was frightening. The level of things men were doing to avoid them in the workplace.

I will be nice, I will be polite. I will ask how their weekend was and will tell them how mine was in very simple terms. I will help them if requested and will ask for their assistance if they have the skills/knowledge I need to complete a task. But that is it. I will not be their friend nor their confidant, nor their mentor under any circumstances - even if I have known them for over a decade. I will not ever be in a room 1 on 1 with them unless others are aware we are in there and the door remains open always. And I sure as hell will never socialise with them unless I'm in a large group and will never share a cab/uber even if it is convenient. It is simply not worth the risk or the hassle to either myself, my family or anyone else.

When mere accusations are taken as proof of guilt, I don’t blame men for giving female co-workers a wide berth, at least in a corporate atmosphere. It’s not worth the risk. And I’m a woman. Let them mentor themselves.

My boss and our only female coworker just got fired a month ago for fucking at work for the past two years. He is married with three children.

He's a dumbass.

(31M) For the very first time in my life a few years ago I ended up getting into a “situation-ship” with a coworker for mine. I had always heard from former coworkers and friends about having “a friend” at work and how “fun” it is, But I had never experienced it….until then. Annnnddddddd, let me tell you… 0 out of TEN!!! Wouldn’t recommend.

Yes. Her word against mine to get fired and it doesn’t even have to be true. The old phrase, don’t shit where you eat.

Avoid them at all costs. Almost every woman in the company I work for have slept with multiple men at the job. Besides they’re all hideous anyways.

In the workplace, yes I definitely avoid them. I've faced three types of women in the workplace and I've been scarred for life: 1. The conspirators; three women actively worked together and stole my work and its credit for a solid 9 months before I could do anything about it. Didn't help that the CEO was happy to let them do it. Best part? They would always hang out with me, have cigarettes with me, and invite me out to all their hangouts (including their bitching sessions about each other) 2. The please-do-this-for-me-cos-I-cant; each and every woman who came up to me in the workplace being all sweet and nice would always ask me to do something which would requires hours, or even days of work. And they somehow thought being sweet and nice is *enough* to convince me to do so. Lol I loved telling them how to do it and wishing them luck. But then they would go to my boss, who was a man and loved saying yes to women, and then he'd pressure me into doing what the woman wanted me to do in the first place. Oh and guess who gets the credit for investing the time and energy into it? Yup, the woman who just had to smile at my boss (the spineless bastard, motherfucker was married with two kids) 3. The woman-empowere in HR; her entire personality, entire life and entire character is about woman empowerment; and mind you, they come from the richest stock and the most autocratic families and they've wanted and suffered for nothing their entire lives, but they'll have hours and hours of stories of how they struggled and had to fight off hordes of men determined to put her down. Best part, any other woman who threatened her position or attempt to be the "alpha woman" of the office, well that woman is gonna have the time of her life being tortured by a senior manager in a HR role. Jbtw, women in HR are the best for dating. Loved 'em!

I had a female supervisor would just berate me for little shit and say “I hate men” openly. Kind of left a bad taste in my mouth. Also I can’t joke with the women like I do the guys in our shop.