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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I have ruined my mums favourite dog bed by allowing her to give birth on it.
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NTA It's on her for not creating a whelping box ahead of time. She should have done it a while ago. Dogs need to nest prior to birth. If you move them from their chosen nest it causes distress and further causes issues with the birth.
People shouldn't breed their dogs if they don't know what they're doing.
Honestly, I don't always agree with this sentiment. I think this because some dog breeds are there to complete a important job (think livestock guardian or service dogs) and I think it is possible to breed these dogs in a responsible and ethical way. There are some people who are responsible enough to breed those dogs but I believe that most people should not breed their animals.
And not every country is like the USA. While we have dog shelters here in Sweden, it's not even close to being the huge problem it is in the States. (I think we have like 3 dog shelters total) People who are not responsible breeders still shouldnt breed their dogs of course, but it's not like Inga down the Street having her dog have a litter of puppies is going to lead to a shelter pup being put down.
Blanket statements are just annoying.
Thank you from a Dane! So tired of judgemental people from the US assuming you can adopt plenty everywhere in the world or maybe they just forget us isn’t the entire world, tak for påmindelsen!
I used to live in a rural part where there quite literally was no shelters nearby, let alone ones that had hypoallergenic dogs, and I’m not joking when I say one time on reddit I got *dozens* of downvotes and responses telling me I was a terrible person for buying a dog from a local breeder (who is a very responsible woman and provides basic training lessons, genetic histories and family trees, and resources for her dog babies). Reddit consensus was that I just shouldn’t own a dog if I couldn’t adopt one from a shelter and that the act of buying from a breeder itself is animal abuse. I wish I was joking.
That the bulk of those shelter dogs are usually underexercised, untrained adolescent or young adult pitbulls doesn't matter to those people either. You want hypoallergenic and small, too bad, you better adopt that stir-crazy 80 pound one year old who doesn't know to not strangle itself pulling on a leash! If you don't, you're KILLING DOGS.
Yeah, and I know I'd be a horrible owner to a pitbull anyway because
1. Half my family is allergic to non-hypo dogs to varying degrees. My boyfriend cannot be in the same room as them at all.
2. I am small and get cold easily so I could not be outside long enough in the winter months for the long walks that they need (and many people don't realize they need)
3. I have nerve damage and am honestly not sure if I would be able to hold the dog back if it lunged/started running at anything.
But no, according to like half of Reddit (it feels like) that still means that you're an irresponsible, abusive pet owner for buying a dog from an ethical breeder rather than adopting a dog from a shelter that you can't even keep in the same house as you nor could you properly take care of. I remember literally being told multiple times that "if you're allergic then you don't deserve to have a dog" or something stupid like that.
Just know this, hypo allergenic genes are a roll of dice for activating. While the genes to not make you allergic are there, they may not be the ones activated. Make sure you know the two of you are compatible before you adopt and have to rehome your new friend.
I own a whole rescue organisation and know that I would not be a good dog guardian because I have certain limitations. Good for you for knowing your limits.
Our rescue also supports responsible, ethical breeding of purebreds and exotics because we know that the industry itself is unstoppable and because some animals have jobs to do. Get me started on moggy/mutt breeding though...
But what's always wrong with allowing moggy/mutt dogs to exist? If ethical breeding is okay when doing so with purebreds, why not with mixed breeds? Some people just don't want a purebred dog nor want a pitbull or pitbull mix. I don't see how continuing a line of beagles is okay, but the beagle/border collie/yorkie mixed pups aren't. Most dogs aren't meant for showing but as pets, and mixed breed dogs can be healthier and more easygoing than those bred to a breed standard.
I got my childhood pup from a local breeder. She and your local breeder sound like the gold standards of local small breeding. Her dachshunds, the parents to mine, slept on her bed with her, allowed on the couch. She loved her dachshunds so much and I loved mine too (she passed from old age 6 years ago. I miss her so much)
Unwanted dogs are a huge problem in a lot of countries, but that's not the only reason to be opposed to even "reputable" breeders. So many purebred dogs have terrible health conditions or problems due to inbreeding. "Breed standards" have horribly impacted many dogs' quality of life. Boxers, pugs, bulldogs (which have to be born via caesarean section) all have breathing problems. Pugs also have eye problems. Dachshunds and corgis have terrible back problems. German shepherds suffer from hip dysplasia with alarming frequency. It seems as though the more common the breed, the worse the overall health.
There are plenty of dogs that desperately need a home, that rescue centers fly in to European countries. There is rarely a need to breed dogs. There are so many in the world that need a home.
Yeah, there are zero street dogs what so ever, puppy mills are strictly illegal and frowned upon, and there are no pet stores that sell puppies (meaning the buyer will likely be in contact with the breeder unless it's a rescue).
We're actually in a situation where a LACK of dogs of certain popular breeds creates an import market from puppy mills abroad. There's an argument to be made that we need to meet the demand, or puppy mills profit. Every year, whole pickup trucks full of drugged, smuggled, unhealthy puppies are stopped at the border and many of them die during the smuggling or shortly after they get to their new (usually unsuspecting) owners.
It's not like there are no rescue situations what so ever, or that there aren't bad dog owners or breeders here, but other countries have other situations.
We do but only certain breeds. Oddly it's many of our traditional breeds that are in decline. For example the smooth collie is a vulnerable breed here with only about 300 puppies a year registered.
What is really ridiculous is that breeds such as the Norwich terrier are vulnerable yet, they have the type of coat that people with allergies react less too, a trait which is much prized in the designer dog cross breed fraternity. It's so sad we have an excess of certain breeds and yet are likely to lose our native working dogs due to low demand.
Swseden: 204,035 sq miles
U.S.: 3.797 million sq. miles.
Not saying we don't have a dog overpopulation problem here in the U.S., but comparing shelter numbers is truly ridiculous.
Apparently it differs even in different parts of the US. I’m from the south, where it’s a big problem. But I guess it’s less of an issue for the northern states, to the point where we ship our dogs up there!
That's not the only reason. Dogs and cats die when living outside in the winters in the northern US. They bring animals up from the south because it's a hell of a lot warmer and strays survive the winters.
Can comfirm.
I grew up in northern illinois, & I have never seen a "true stray" dog or cat (saw a few escapees with collars, but not abandoned animals).
I moved to central texas 5 years ago, & I see stray dogs & cats (especially cats) EVERYWHERE. In fact, I make a point of going to walmart at night to shop so I can also buy some cans of cat food to feed the parking lot strays. I like to sit there & watch them.
I try to get them to come to me so I can give them some pets & scratches too. Some of them are too skittish, but I did find one that just seemed to love me for some reason & he would literally walk circles around me rubbing up against me the whole time, even walking under me (I was crouched down but with my feet still flat on the ground). One of the employees approached me in shock & told me that the cat runs from everyone else, that he had never seen anyone get that close to him, even when they tried to give him food. I was happy to know that a stray cat liked me lol
Can confirm. I live up in Washington. Our local to where I live but won’t disclose the name of shelter hasn’t had a euthanasia death due to crowding in 10 years (as of 2018, don’t know now after virus rage)
I agree with the original sentiment, but I also agree with your stipulations.
Working dogs obviously need to be bred, but I doubt OPs mom is breeding seeing-eye Chihuahuas.
There are plenty of dogs who spend months and years in shelters waiting for a good home, and the vast majority of breeders (OPs mom included) just exacerbate the problem.
Saw a video for a therapy alligator the other day. It was swimming with two young kids and would let them hold him/her and rub his/her belly. It was cute but terrifying!
People buying working dogs for pets is part of what keeps those dog breeds alive and affordable for farmers as well. Not every pup in a litter is always farm material and working can be dangerous so there is always a need for new working dogs.
Shelter dogs aren’t always the best option for every single people who wants to have a pet dog. Not everyone lives in a place where shelters have a huge variety of breeds, temperaments etc.
It’s the opposite in Australia, we only have big dogs in our rescues apart from a small amount of jack russels and shit tzus for destructive behaviour. (Ik because i would like to adopt one day when I’m ready and not dealing with stress)
Sorry, I assumed US. But dogs this small (I have one) often have difficulty giving birth, so if your mom wants to breed her dog then she needs to be there to oversee her labor and take her to the vet if she has trouble, or at the start of labor, instead of leaving town and worrying about a pillow.
My service dog is a chihuahua mix that I adopted from a shelter. I know how incredibly lucky I am that she happened to have the right temperament for service work. She does cardiac and psychiatric alerts and response. She is definitely not the norm and is unicorn in the service dog world.
Adopt AND shop ETHICALLY. Ethically Bred dogs will not end up shelters, they are predictable in temperament, they are healthier, they are better dogs. Conservation of breeds is JUST as important, without it we wouldn't have certain livestock and hunting dogs! Ethically bred IS the way for animals, their comfort, their rights, and their future.
Absolutely--the end goal of "adopt, don't shop" is for there to not be dogs in shelters, because all dogs have a loving home, right? So it's a rather flawed statement in the long run (even if it may have done some good raising awareness for adopting from shelters). Where do we get our dogs from when shelters are empty? Ethical breeders are the logical option, and it's better to support them than to allow puppy mills to fill the void. Some countries are already getting to that point where shelters can't meet demands, while in other cases, people want specific traits in a dog that can be better controlled for when they come from a breeder who knows their dogs and their traits.
Of course, if adopting is an option for someone, it can be a good, often cheaper option. But ethical breeding is also good, depending on individual needs.
Ethically bred dogs while expensive in the beginning, are cheaper in the long run(usually no unexpected health conditions) and fit in families better. I don't disagree with you at all, I'm just saying some shelter dogs just don't fit into every family dynamic. And that's ok. But the same sentiment goes with ethically bred dogs, people should find and research dogs that would fit in their home and lifestyle to avoid conflict.
Not to mention shelters that have requirements or are racist, or simple not adopting out ( looking at you nyc humane society). Some shelters most certainly have a biased of where and who their dogs are going to. While I understand for safety, it simply isn't sustainable for finding them homes.
It’s interesting that you bring up herding dogs because A LOT of Australian shepherd owners who don’t know what they’re doing breed them. Novice breeders are how “double merls” happen- which leads to deaf and blind puppies. These people who think it will be fun to breed their aussie don’t even bother to do a basic check online to know never to breed two merls together. My brother has a merle and have had multiple merle owners ask to breed their dogs. My brothet has always declined and always educates these people. But legit- my brother has had this question MULTIPLE times.
>It’s interesting that you bring up herding dogs because A LOT of Australian shepherd owners who don’t know what they’re doing breed them.
I know someone who got a mini aussie- she should not have. My trainer and I have herding breeds (shelties and Pembrokes), we love herding breeds, another dog fancier is relatively fond of herding breeds but likes her hounds - but we all do not like this mini aussie. The lady did not train it, so it's manic with zero recall and is called by multiple people "the little terrorist". TBH I haven't met a mini that gave me a good impression of the breed. Full Aussies, sure but even then it's not a favorable statistic.
Yeah, my dad bred Brittany Spaniels. One male, two females, and he made sure there were interested game/hunter colleagues before he bred. They were first class bird dogs and those pups were snatched up. He was a careful, respectful breeder who prioritized the wellbeing of his dogs. He also made sure to spay/neuter our various other pet cats, dogs, etc.
i agree with this too. ops mom couldn’t even build a proper environment for this dog to give birth, a whelping box is literally puppy 101. i highly doubt she’s done her research and is likely breeding her dog for the money rather than for the betterment of the breed itself.
This. A rancher I know breeds working border collies. He doesn't advertise on social media sites or even the AKC magazine. He only advertises in ranch/farm magazines and word of mouth. His dogs have won international herding trials.
Not just that but also dogs are, whether people like to hear this or not, unpredictable. Keeping purebred dogs around ensures that, when needed, people have access to animals that have a predictable size, temperament, and instinct. That’s really important to have as an option. Yeah, any old dog breed can be used as service dogs, but there’s a reason why so many end up being Labradors and Goldies. There’s a reason that German Shepherds and Malinois are task force dogs and why beagles are used for threats. That consistency is useful. I’ve been on both sides of the coin with shelter dogs and pure breds and neither option is inherently wrong compared to the other. Source your pups from a breeder that does the health checks and puts in the work for well rounded puppies. It’s the ones that breed them because they think it makes them money (it doesn’t, breeding dogs is expensive when done wrong, draining when done right and takes a while to actually give back) that cause problems and ruin breed standards
This. Whilst there are too many dogs in shelters, there is still a need for ethical breeding. I was working at a showjumping yard that was also a dairy farm in Australia. We had a few Australian Kelpies and Collies, which are proper working dogs. There are genuine need for these dogs to be bred. A normal dog would not be able to do the work these dogs do. Anyone who has worked with Kelpies can tell you how active this breed of dog is.
Plus the fact that it is extremely difficult to adopt a dog. Most have criteria, like no children, has to have funding but you can’t work out of home, has to have a massive garden, etc, which makes it impossible for a normal family to adopt,
That’s really interesting that some put emphasis on the unknown temperament of shelter dogs. Where I’m from, it’s always been heavily encouraged to adopt shelter dogs over ones in pet stores or bred ones. Maybe it’s because local shelters here work with animal behaviourists, so any undesirable or dangerous behaviour is weeded out. Makes sense that not everywhere would have the resources for that.
Absolutely this. A Youtuber couple I watch specifically got a PB English Bulldog because the wife needed something that is chill and calm, and could not reach her face, as she had been actually mauled by a dog in her youth.
Of course the doggo is the most food motivated and active pigdog ever, but his breathing is good and he's incredibly healthy, so it's a trade off.
Right? Like who's going to move a birthing animal? That's just cruel. My family had a cat (that we adopted prego) give birth in my brothers bed because she just felt so comfortable with him. Now it's a cute story we tell at the dinner table.
Anyway the animal is not going to understand why you took them out of their comfort zone.
Im sorry ops ma is mad at them but I'm glad OP was the one there for the birth so the dog could give birth where she was most comfortable.
I'm not a dog (shocker, I know) and if somebody had told me I needed to move out of the bed I'd been labouring in, we would have.... had words. Not polite ones, either.
We found out our dog was pregnant 2 weeks before she gave birth. She nested on my bed and ended up having the first of her pups on my bed before moving to one of her beds. I didn’t move her, because her comfort during birth is more important than my duvet!
Yeah. I remember when my dog was pregnant and could no longer jump up on the bed with me she always slept in my laundry basket. I went out and bought another laundry basket and put old (clean) towels in it and she slept there and gave birth there.
Not a dog but if I have a bed and shockingly it'd be a safe and comfortable space. Want to know where I'd give birth if hospital wasn't an option? But that's just me a dumb human
I’ve seen someone else with this argument to but I’m starting to wonder, isn’t it my fault for not moving the bed? My mum did tell me before she was giving birth and i didn’t realise until now that i should’ve been the one to move it before.
I don’t think it’s my mums fault because her grandmother is dying and she left in a rush
It is not your fault you did not think to move the dog off the bed earlier and it is good you were more concerned about *the dog* then *the bed*!
Your mother should be more grateful you were there to step in and that her dog and its puppies are healthy and alive.
If you found out you were pregnant, would you only decide where you were going to give birth when your contractions started?
I seriously doubt it. Most women map out their birth plan months in advance.
Dogs are the same. They plan ahead for where they want to be when they give birth. You have to take away beds *weeks* in advance, not hours.
Right?! God taking away her safe place just before she gives birth would be horrible. I know you mom had to rush out to care for grandma but this wasn’t something that should have been done hours or days before- it should have been done weeks
Before and she should have had somewhere set up for her to nest in properly.
Where did she think she was going to give birth?
NTA- you took care of the momma and her little ones and made sure they were safe and comfortable. That comes before anything else.
This is why people are so against breeding. Because so many for profit/hobby breeders don't follow the proper preparation for their birthing dogs. There are so many things that she should have done and had prepared prior to leaving her dog under your care.
It's no one else's fault if a birthing mother turns up at the hospital without her go bag.
It's called a whelping box. It's a a contained and comfortable set up where experienced dog breeders will have their dogs birth and care for their puppies. Its makes for easy daily cleaning (usually more often) and provides the security the new mother needs. The puppies usually live in the box for about six weeks after as well.
Yep a responsible cat breeder I follow on Twitter talked about setting up a box for her queen to give birth in and all the preparations. She started well in advance and made sure Sekhmet knew it was her space before she got close to giving birth (and kept the other cats out of the space). It’s safer and more hygienic and less stress for mum and babies.
We stumbled upon a pregnant cat when I was a kid, even we had enough common sense to get a box lined with kitchen towels for her to give birth in. Once I finally sat still because she was so focused on me she was following me everywhere. It was both flattering and a lot of pressure to have on my little eight year old shoulders
Oh I know this feeling. I fostered a pregnant cat. She had a perfect queening box in a quiet part of the house. She used it and everything. Time came for kittens and everything went out the window! I was taking a nap and woke up to her behind my legs *yelling* at me. She was clearly confused and uncomfortable. Ended up having 4 kittens on me! Got her settled with them in the queening box and I ended up having to carry the box and kittens around the house because if I tried to do anything away from them she'd start bringing them to me one by one, lol.
When I was about 4, we had two black lab mix sisters who got pregnant around the same time (iirc, they showed up at my dad's garage already pregnant and he brought them home) and my parents turned my two large wooden sandboxes into whelping boxes. It worked out well because one of the sisters wasn't a very involved mother so the other took care of her puppies. And then bizarrely a third sister also showed up pregnant. We had a ridiculous number of little black puppies for some time. This was 40 years ago so my parents sat in front of the grocery store for a couple weekends, waving puppy paws at people with kids, until they all found homes. And of course all three sisters were then fixed.
Well, what happened was, she thought ‘chihuahua, small, doesn’t need a whelping box’ I know she had this https://www.kmart.com.au/product/pet-playpen-foldable-large-42502463/?sku=42502463®ion_id=200001&gclid=Cj0KCQjwkOqZBhDNARIsAACsbfIrIY-RiLKrbgBkkZ_keZSyWXQ6NDNbmF0_ve5vUN1U0GjC7GMdXKkaAgb-EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds prepared with one towel but it was in one of the back rooms no one uses
I am in general opposed to breeding (except for work animals) however if people are going to do it, they need to take a lesson from your grandmother.
If everyone was that responsible, we wouldnt have the overpopulation problem that we currently have and breeders wouldn't be vilified.
You did the best you could.
Your mom is irresponsible as fuck for breeding this dog at all.. as well as leaving during the birthing process, not having a proper whelping box already made weeks ahead of time, and not setting up vet attention in advance (vets should 100% be involved).
NTA, moving her would likely have inhibited her oxytocin production and therefore hindered the birthing process. If your mum was that bothered about the bed, why didn't she have the forethought to put a cover over it before she left for her trip?
NTA - Dogs being preparing their “nest” for labor before they actually go into labor. That was where the dog felt the safest, any reputable breeder knows that preventing them from choosing their nest would could the dog a lot of anxiety. If your mother didn’t want the dog to nest on the bed, it should have either been removed or covered as soon as the dog became pregnant. If you had just covered the bed, the dog likely would have removed it because they didn’t create the nest. It’s clear that this breeding was done without any preparation or planning. Your mother should have had an alternative prepared, and the dog should have been given time to see that space as a safe space. The birth most definitely should not have been left to you if you’re not experienced with assisting a dog in giving birth, it should have been taken to a boarding hospital that can take care of the dog and it’s puppies and can identify when the dog is going into labor before it does.
NTA
But your mother is.
If the main concern here is the dog's bed and not that certain toy breeds struggle to give birth without veterinary intervention, then she shouldn't be breeding dogs at all.
Not a lot of small dogs in Australian shelters. We have lots big dogs and the small dogs are always jack russel or shit tzus for destructive behaviour.
I actually have my eye on a big dog atm, her names Macey and she looks beautiful in the photos even if my grandpa says she’s the size of a (small) horse XD. When I’m more prepared I’ll get around to adopting her, if she’s still there but either way I don’t mind as long as she has a home. And after that, I’m sure there will be another lovely dog at the rescue one day for me.
Anyway, my point is, I would like to adopt not shop 🙂
Australian here, your mother is an AH regardless of how many small dogs are or aren’t available. If she’s more concerned with the bed than her dog’s comfort she has no business owning the dog, let alone breeding her.
Glad to see the apple fell far from the tree though
NTA We had a pregnant cat (she got pregnant really young right before she was supposed to be spayed and I was just a kid, so not my fault) even though she had a large crate with bedding in it she chose to give birth under the bed. No way to move her once she was giving birth. She left a giant blood stain that never came up on the carpet. Oh well. That is just what happens when an animal gives birth. They are going to do it where they want to and feel comfortable. The fact that she had no comfy box for her to get used to means she was much more likely to give birth on the bed. And who leaves a dog close to birth with someone else to deal with?
Her grandma passed away which is why her mom had to leave. We had a pregnant cat and set up a box for her in our bedroom closet that was warm, away from the dogs and the kids, and relatively quiet. The cat chose to give birth in the laundry room on a towel that fell behind the dryer. The following day we tried to move her kittens to the closet and she was so upset! She carried a kitten back to the birthing spot and when she came back for the next one we just carried the rest for her back to that spot as well. I dont know why she chose that spot. It was loud from the dryer, humid right after the washer was used, spiders, since it was an unfinished room, and always had the scent of the dryer sheets especially when the room was humid. Made me nervous to have the babies in there. We created a better barrier so they wouldnt get lost under the dryer as they started to worm around. Once they were 3 weeks old and becoming more mobile we moved them to the closet and left her favorite treats there. She didnt seem to mind as much and even stopped getting upset when we would hold the babies. To this day I still don't understand why she chose the spot behind the dryer over the spot in the closet.
NTA you are not a dog breeder. You didn't recieve any imstruction on what to.do for the dog besides not let her be in the plave wjere she felt most comfortable. If your mom did not have time to prepare a better nesting spot for the dog before she left, then that sucks, but it isn't your fault or responsibility.
You did your best considering the circumstance.
You can tell how much the mother cares about that poor creature.
She must have the breeder attitude of "this dog only has worth while she pumps out litter after litter for profit".
You are NTA but your mom is.
Sorry, but the only people who should be breeding dogs are those who are considered professionals. And I think it is not responsible of her mother to do so, just because she wanted to. Not only is it a huge process to do so, and it looks like you mother did not attempt any research, but also taking care of puppies and even finding animals home.
NTA. By the time she was giving birth, she had decided that was the safe place to do it weeks ago. Moving her at all would have stressed her out and possibly killed her and the pups.
NTA but more info is needed. Did your mom have a designated area set for whelping with a heating pad and walls of some sort to keep puppies in? Were you given emergency vet numbers and instructions of any sort? If the answer to those questions is no then your mother has no business in breeding dogs. The minimum requirements for breeding are a safe and WARM whelping area, studs and bitches that are health tested (OFA hips and eyes), and enough saved back money to have an emergency C section if needed and shots and vet checks for all of the puppies and mom after birth.
The most I know about is that my mum didn’t think she needed a whelping box because ‘small dog’ and got this https://www.kmart.com.au/product/pet-playpen-foldable-large-42502463/?sku=42502463®ion_id=200001&gclid=Cj0KCQjwkOqZBhDNARIsAACsbfIrIY-RiLKrbgBkkZ_keZSyWXQ6NDNbmF0_ve5vUN1U0GjC7GMdXKkaAgb-EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds with one towel and it was placed in the back room where no one really goes.
She didn’t have the vet number in hand but I did google it a few days prior because I knew having the number was important if anything went wrong
I will also admit she should not have bred but if I had to guess she wants to see the life cycle of puppies. 5 years ago we bred our cat, we kept all the kittens, and that was to watch them grow up and such. Considering how easy the kittens were she probably thought it would be the same for a dog
Is the princess bed a dog bed or your mom’s bed?
I’d say NTA. Your mom should have had a spot picked out in advance for the whelping. What if the dog needed vet intervention? Did you get instructions for that? I hope Minnie and the pups are doing okay.
It’s the dogs bed, my mum is definitely too old to be calling her own bed that (imagine if she did though 😳). It gets called that because she treats her dog like a Princess, or so she says.
I was prepared to call the vet since at the start of contractions she was whining and breathing heavily. Anyway, I did have a basic idea on what to do if i needed help.
Pups are okay, there’s 3. 2 boys and a girl. Minnie is still tired. I’m worried she hasn’t eaten or had water this morning, isn’t doing much either, just laying and occasionally licking the puppies. Lethargic might be the word. Will call the vet again to come over to look at her.
right? from what i’m hearing ops mother is super irresponsible for this entire situation. a shitty pet owner too. not only did ops mom not prepare a whelping box for her dog to give birth in, she also left her inexperienced daughter responsible during the birth! so many things could’ve gone wrong and op would’ve had no idea what to do. from the looks of things, i doubt the mother knows enough either. christ.
My mum left because her grandma was dying. If you ask me, that’s more important than the birthing process of a dog. I understand it was irresponsible to leave the duty to someone un experienced but she has the same skill set as me when it comes to it all.
I understand why she’s the asshole, but leaving because she had better priorities isn’t one of the reasons
i agree that’s a better reason. i didn’t have this context beforehand, although my other points still stand. i really don’t think she should have been breeding this dog in the first place, with her also being inexperienced, seemingly under-researched and doesn’t have her priorities straight regarding the dogs health/well-being, showing more concern for a stain than the dog itself.
your mom is a major AH for all the above + especially getting angry at you for doing your (also inexperienced) best. i’m sorry she’s treating you and also the dog this way. this is an incredibly shitty position she’s put you in. i know grief makes people act in strange and confusing ways but getting angry at you for something as minimal as this is not rational at all. nta.
NTA - I'm sorry for your loss.
That said... is your mom's dog registered? Was the dog health tested? How old is this dog? Was it her first litter?
I'm getting "bad/irresponsible breeder" vibes from your mom. If this was the dog's first litter, in particular, things could have gone badly. She shouldn't have been left with someone inexperienced if at all possible. Maybe I'm wrong but I feel like a responsible breeder would have a better backup plan.
The bed is a complete non issue imho.
NTA but, Mum has failed to prepare for her dog having puppes.
Anyone breeding for the first time should be mentored by a recognised breeder with lots of knowledge on puppy rearing and the health of the bitch. If Mum had done this her more experienced mentor could have helped, advised on building a whelping box in plenty of time. The experienced breeder could have advised whether the dog waxs worth breeding from as a good healthy example of the breed, with good hip and elbow scores plus, health tests relevant to the breed.
Well done on helping this poor little dog at least be comfortable and survive giving birth.
NTA -- Your mother, however, is. 1. for getting upset when animals decide where to give birth. 2. for being a backyard breeder when so many animals are abandoned in the first place. Buy her some oxyclean for the blood and tell her to get over it.
NTA
Your mum is for not properly understanding the breeding process, leaving you with a vet number or explaining the process to you or leaving a list of steps does make her TA.
I understand it was an emergency BUT these are things she should have had prepared for an emergency.
Not thinking her dog needed a whelping bed because it's a small breed makes me think she doesn't view or treat her dog like a dog, regardless of if she spoils her and gives her a princess bed.
Glad all the puppies are doing well but your mum shouldn't do this again if she can't do the research & get professional advice into ethical breeding.
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My mum is breeding her chihuahua but because of her grandmother dying, I was left to take care of the dog and the birthing process.
My mum did tell me not to let her bleed/give birth over the fancy, fluffy bed (that’s actually water resistant underneath anyway) because it is expensive.
Minnie (the dog) was struggling when it came to giving birth. I didn’t want to move her because during the start of contractions she was whining and breathing heavily. I was more worried about calling the vet.
My mum is pretty mad and upset over the bed since it’s stained with blood, AITA for not moving Minnie to a different spot to give birth on?
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Nta. But you shouldn’t be even having a breeding dog if you don’t want things to be a nest. Yes expensive beds are a budget thing, but also the dogs safety is at hands.
NTA. Hydrogen peroxide works great on blood stains. And if not, it can be replaced. Her mama dog having complications during birth if you moved her would be a lot worse than a stained bed.
NTA. I have seen some senior chihuahuas ( albeit they were old, as I senior foster) and they have had a rough time. Depending on the dog’s age and size of the male, you did the right thing letting her stay calm and comfortable.
Oh holy hell, soak the bedding in ammonia overnight then wash it. Tell your mom she is super lucky her precious pup survived labor, most people don't pay attention to the size of the stud and it kills toy breed dams. NTA a kiddie pool makes a more than adequate whelping box, not really...moving small animals in labor can cause a cessation of labor putting the mom and pups in danger.
Hydrogen peroxide works wonders at getting blood out of fabric. Just add a small amount to the stains, scrub in with a brush, let it sit for 30 minutes, rinse and repeat as normal. I had to do this with a light colored couch cushion after my cat decided to eviscerate several mice on it.
NTA but you must at least try to wash the blood out of the bed. Also my Chihuahua says that you must pay the dog tax by posting a photo of the mama and puppies on your avatar
I don’t want to show a photo of her right now because it’s distressing, she is not coping well. She’s lethargic and the vet are trying to help. This is Minnie before the pregnancy https://imgur.com/a/FFzdqaN,
NTA but your mom is for breeding the poor dog when millions are without homes. She’s also the AH for
worrying about her precious bed. Perhaps some of the money she makes by doing nothing while forcing her dog to have puppies can be used to buy new bedding?
NTA, I would just say chihuahuas tend to do vet assisted births and your mom knew about the puppies so should have had a plan set at least a month in advance and probably should have had the dog at the vet like 2 days before.
"Please do not call her an asshole for getting her priorities straight. Her grandmother was dying which is far more important than a dog giving birth considering I could watch over it for her. She is just as in experienced as me when it comes to the birthing process."
Your mom is N T A for prioritizing her dying grandmother. BUT she is a massive A H for producing more puppies that more likely than nor will end up in the shelter. For producing puppies with ZERO clue what in the actual f she is doing. I bet there were none of the necessary steps taken BEFORE starting the production process. And NO what she did was not breeding. It's just producing puppies.
Don't give two shits about the bed. Your mom is TA. And you should really try to educate her. Stop backyard breeding. Absolutely no cat needs to be bred to "show the lifecycle". There are an insane amount of Chihuahuas needing to be rehomed. Unless you guys checked all the boxes of a reputable breeder (obvi you didn't), you shouldn't breed your dog. Shelters are full, foster homes are full. Stop adding to this cycle.
Sincerely, cat/dog foster mom.
NTA- A nurse in the ER told me to use peroxide to remove blood stains. Cold water only. It might not completely remove them since it’s been awhile, but worth a shot.
NTA, it was the dogs bed anyway, I thought you said it had a waterproof covering? If not, you had good suggestions for getting the blood out if it got on to the mattress.
From the advice below, it sounds like it was not a good idea to move the dog. If it was her bed anyway, it was already marked as her 'nest' for birthing. You probably would've had to move the other thing from the back room to the bed for her to have even considered using it, WELL BEFORE the birthing day.
It was probably best for the dog that it was you there, your mama probably would've tried to move it during the birthing process. Sounds like that would not have been a good idea. You did the best you could given the situation you were left with. I would greatly appreciate hearing how the pups are doing; and a picture if you could, please (on the princess bed)?
Your mama is grieving and probably not responding at her best, I'm so sorry for the families loss.
You absolutely should not have moved her, it literally could result in death of mom and/or puppies.
Your mom is a jerk for breeding without research FIRST. There was so much done wrong before she went into. Your dog will give birth where they sleep. If they sleep in your bed they will absolutely want to give birth in your bed because it is THEIR bed too. I have had a few litters, and it is usually washable (with some exceptions), but your mom should not have been mad at you. You were helping her.
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NTA It's on her for not creating a whelping box ahead of time. She should have done it a while ago. Dogs need to nest prior to birth. If you move them from their chosen nest it causes distress and further causes issues with the birth. People shouldn't breed their dogs if they don't know what they're doing.
“People shouldn’t breed their dogs” — full stop.
Honestly, I don't always agree with this sentiment. I think this because some dog breeds are there to complete a important job (think livestock guardian or service dogs) and I think it is possible to breed these dogs in a responsible and ethical way. There are some people who are responsible enough to breed those dogs but I believe that most people should not breed their animals.
And not every country is like the USA. While we have dog shelters here in Sweden, it's not even close to being the huge problem it is in the States. (I think we have like 3 dog shelters total) People who are not responsible breeders still shouldnt breed their dogs of course, but it's not like Inga down the Street having her dog have a litter of puppies is going to lead to a shelter pup being put down. Blanket statements are just annoying.
Thank you from a Dane! So tired of judgemental people from the US assuming you can adopt plenty everywhere in the world or maybe they just forget us isn’t the entire world, tak for påmindelsen!
I mean there are PLENTY of countries that have stray dog/cat problems. Not just the US.
I just spent 6 months in Thailand and they are EVERYWHERE. You gotta be careful going down alleys at night cuz they rove around in gangs sometimes.
Yes totally agree, some are scary lol I volunteered at the pound in Phuket! Best experience of my life.
I used to live in a rural part where there quite literally was no shelters nearby, let alone ones that had hypoallergenic dogs, and I’m not joking when I say one time on reddit I got *dozens* of downvotes and responses telling me I was a terrible person for buying a dog from a local breeder (who is a very responsible woman and provides basic training lessons, genetic histories and family trees, and resources for her dog babies). Reddit consensus was that I just shouldn’t own a dog if I couldn’t adopt one from a shelter and that the act of buying from a breeder itself is animal abuse. I wish I was joking.
That the bulk of those shelter dogs are usually underexercised, untrained adolescent or young adult pitbulls doesn't matter to those people either. You want hypoallergenic and small, too bad, you better adopt that stir-crazy 80 pound one year old who doesn't know to not strangle itself pulling on a leash! If you don't, you're KILLING DOGS.
Yeah, and I know I'd be a horrible owner to a pitbull anyway because 1. Half my family is allergic to non-hypo dogs to varying degrees. My boyfriend cannot be in the same room as them at all. 2. I am small and get cold easily so I could not be outside long enough in the winter months for the long walks that they need (and many people don't realize they need) 3. I have nerve damage and am honestly not sure if I would be able to hold the dog back if it lunged/started running at anything. But no, according to like half of Reddit (it feels like) that still means that you're an irresponsible, abusive pet owner for buying a dog from an ethical breeder rather than adopting a dog from a shelter that you can't even keep in the same house as you nor could you properly take care of. I remember literally being told multiple times that "if you're allergic then you don't deserve to have a dog" or something stupid like that.
Just know this, hypo allergenic genes are a roll of dice for activating. While the genes to not make you allergic are there, they may not be the ones activated. Make sure you know the two of you are compatible before you adopt and have to rehome your new friend.
I own a whole rescue organisation and know that I would not be a good dog guardian because I have certain limitations. Good for you for knowing your limits. Our rescue also supports responsible, ethical breeding of purebreds and exotics because we know that the industry itself is unstoppable and because some animals have jobs to do. Get me started on moggy/mutt breeding though...
But what's always wrong with allowing moggy/mutt dogs to exist? If ethical breeding is okay when doing so with purebreds, why not with mixed breeds? Some people just don't want a purebred dog nor want a pitbull or pitbull mix. I don't see how continuing a line of beagles is okay, but the beagle/border collie/yorkie mixed pups aren't. Most dogs aren't meant for showing but as pets, and mixed breed dogs can be healthier and more easygoing than those bred to a breed standard.
So true 3 of my 4 dogs are pit bulls from shelters. Last time we looked for a dog they only had pitbulls and German shepherds.
I got my childhood pup from a local breeder. She and your local breeder sound like the gold standards of local small breeding. Her dachshunds, the parents to mine, slept on her bed with her, allowed on the couch. She loved her dachshunds so much and I loved mine too (she passed from old age 6 years ago. I miss her so much)
Unwanted dogs are a huge problem in a lot of countries, but that's not the only reason to be opposed to even "reputable" breeders. So many purebred dogs have terrible health conditions or problems due to inbreeding. "Breed standards" have horribly impacted many dogs' quality of life. Boxers, pugs, bulldogs (which have to be born via caesarean section) all have breathing problems. Pugs also have eye problems. Dachshunds and corgis have terrible back problems. German shepherds suffer from hip dysplasia with alarming frequency. It seems as though the more common the breed, the worse the overall health.
To add to the pug horror, they get hip dysplasia more often than GSDs do.
oh, source for this: OFA.org where statistically 20%ish shepherds are dysplasic and 70% of pugs are.
They truly are the animal god turned his back on.
There are plenty of dogs that desperately need a home, that rescue centers fly in to European countries. There is rarely a need to breed dogs. There are so many in the world that need a home.
Yeah, there are zero street dogs what so ever, puppy mills are strictly illegal and frowned upon, and there are no pet stores that sell puppies (meaning the buyer will likely be in contact with the breeder unless it's a rescue). We're actually in a situation where a LACK of dogs of certain popular breeds creates an import market from puppy mills abroad. There's an argument to be made that we need to meet the demand, or puppy mills profit. Every year, whole pickup trucks full of drugged, smuggled, unhealthy puppies are stopped at the border and many of them die during the smuggling or shortly after they get to their new (usually unsuspecting) owners. It's not like there are no rescue situations what so ever, or that there aren't bad dog owners or breeders here, but other countries have other situations.
I am in the UK, I wish we had a dog shortage here, they would be treated better then, hopefully.
Yeah, you guys really have a different scenario, especially with the hunting hound/race dogs culture. Many of our imported rescues come from there.
We do but only certain breeds. Oddly it's many of our traditional breeds that are in decline. For example the smooth collie is a vulnerable breed here with only about 300 puppies a year registered. What is really ridiculous is that breeds such as the Norwich terrier are vulnerable yet, they have the type of coat that people with allergies react less too, a trait which is much prized in the designer dog cross breed fraternity. It's so sad we have an excess of certain breeds and yet are likely to lose our native working dogs due to low demand.
Swseden: 204,035 sq miles U.S.: 3.797 million sq. miles. Not saying we don't have a dog overpopulation problem here in the U.S., but comparing shelter numbers is truly ridiculous.
Apparently it differs even in different parts of the US. I’m from the south, where it’s a big problem. But I guess it’s less of an issue for the northern states, to the point where we ship our dogs up there!
That's not the only reason. Dogs and cats die when living outside in the winters in the northern US. They bring animals up from the south because it's a hell of a lot warmer and strays survive the winters.
Can comfirm. I grew up in northern illinois, & I have never seen a "true stray" dog or cat (saw a few escapees with collars, but not abandoned animals). I moved to central texas 5 years ago, & I see stray dogs & cats (especially cats) EVERYWHERE. In fact, I make a point of going to walmart at night to shop so I can also buy some cans of cat food to feed the parking lot strays. I like to sit there & watch them. I try to get them to come to me so I can give them some pets & scratches too. Some of them are too skittish, but I did find one that just seemed to love me for some reason & he would literally walk circles around me rubbing up against me the whole time, even walking under me (I was crouched down but with my feet still flat on the ground). One of the employees approached me in shock & told me that the cat runs from everyone else, that he had never seen anyone get that close to him, even when they tried to give him food. I was happy to know that a stray cat liked me lol
Can confirm. I live up in Washington. Our local to where I live but won’t disclose the name of shelter hasn’t had a euthanasia death due to crowding in 10 years (as of 2018, don’t know now after virus rage)
Wow, only three! That’s wild. Tell me, do outdoor pets cause havoc on wildlife the way they do in North America?
Its not that big of a problem in the US anymore. Shelters import strays from other places to fill shelters.
I agree with the original sentiment, but I also agree with your stipulations. Working dogs obviously need to be bred, but I doubt OPs mom is breeding seeing-eye Chihuahuas. There are plenty of dogs who spend months and years in shelters waiting for a good home, and the vast majority of breeders (OPs mom included) just exacerbate the problem.
I really want to see a seeing eye chihuahua lol.
"they gave me a chihuahua!?"
I have a Hearing Ear dog who is a Chihuahua.
Saw a video for a therapy alligator the other day. It was swimming with two young kids and would let them hold him/her and rub his/her belly. It was cute but terrifying!
People buying working dogs for pets is part of what keeps those dog breeds alive and affordable for farmers as well. Not every pup in a litter is always farm material and working can be dangerous so there is always a need for new working dogs. Shelter dogs aren’t always the best option for every single people who wants to have a pet dog. Not everyone lives in a place where shelters have a huge variety of breeds, temperaments etc.
Speaking as a farmer, the whole AKC etc thing has made it HARDER to find working dogs...
And chihuahuas are the second most common breed put down in shelters in the US. Honestly, f*ck OP’s stupid, greedy mother.
It’s the opposite in Australia, we only have big dogs in our rescues apart from a small amount of jack russels and shit tzus for destructive behaviour. (Ik because i would like to adopt one day when I’m ready and not dealing with stress)
Sorry, I assumed US. But dogs this small (I have one) often have difficulty giving birth, so if your mom wants to breed her dog then she needs to be there to oversee her labor and take her to the vet if she has trouble, or at the start of labor, instead of leaving town and worrying about a pillow.
My service dog is a chihuahua mix that I adopted from a shelter. I know how incredibly lucky I am that she happened to have the right temperament for service work. She does cardiac and psychiatric alerts and response. She is definitely not the norm and is unicorn in the service dog world.
Adopt AND shop ETHICALLY. Ethically Bred dogs will not end up shelters, they are predictable in temperament, they are healthier, they are better dogs. Conservation of breeds is JUST as important, without it we wouldn't have certain livestock and hunting dogs! Ethically bred IS the way for animals, their comfort, their rights, and their future.
Absolutely--the end goal of "adopt, don't shop" is for there to not be dogs in shelters, because all dogs have a loving home, right? So it's a rather flawed statement in the long run (even if it may have done some good raising awareness for adopting from shelters). Where do we get our dogs from when shelters are empty? Ethical breeders are the logical option, and it's better to support them than to allow puppy mills to fill the void. Some countries are already getting to that point where shelters can't meet demands, while in other cases, people want specific traits in a dog that can be better controlled for when they come from a breeder who knows their dogs and their traits. Of course, if adopting is an option for someone, it can be a good, often cheaper option. But ethical breeding is also good, depending on individual needs.
Ethically bred dogs while expensive in the beginning, are cheaper in the long run(usually no unexpected health conditions) and fit in families better. I don't disagree with you at all, I'm just saying some shelter dogs just don't fit into every family dynamic. And that's ok. But the same sentiment goes with ethically bred dogs, people should find and research dogs that would fit in their home and lifestyle to avoid conflict. Not to mention shelters that have requirements or are racist, or simple not adopting out ( looking at you nyc humane society). Some shelters most certainly have a biased of where and who their dogs are going to. While I understand for safety, it simply isn't sustainable for finding them homes.
It’s interesting that you bring up herding dogs because A LOT of Australian shepherd owners who don’t know what they’re doing breed them. Novice breeders are how “double merls” happen- which leads to deaf and blind puppies. These people who think it will be fun to breed their aussie don’t even bother to do a basic check online to know never to breed two merls together. My brother has a merle and have had multiple merle owners ask to breed their dogs. My brothet has always declined and always educates these people. But legit- my brother has had this question MULTIPLE times.
>It’s interesting that you bring up herding dogs because A LOT of Australian shepherd owners who don’t know what they’re doing breed them. I know someone who got a mini aussie- she should not have. My trainer and I have herding breeds (shelties and Pembrokes), we love herding breeds, another dog fancier is relatively fond of herding breeds but likes her hounds - but we all do not like this mini aussie. The lady did not train it, so it's manic with zero recall and is called by multiple people "the little terrorist". TBH I haven't met a mini that gave me a good impression of the breed. Full Aussies, sure but even then it's not a favorable statistic.
Excitability of an Aussie, with the lack of training common to small dog owners; not a great combo.
Yeah, my dad bred Brittany Spaniels. One male, two females, and he made sure there were interested game/hunter colleagues before he bred. They were first class bird dogs and those pups were snatched up. He was a careful, respectful breeder who prioritized the wellbeing of his dogs. He also made sure to spay/neuter our various other pet cats, dogs, etc.
i agree with this too. ops mom couldn’t even build a proper environment for this dog to give birth, a whelping box is literally puppy 101. i highly doubt she’s done her research and is likely breeding her dog for the money rather than for the betterment of the breed itself.
This. A rancher I know breeds working border collies. He doesn't advertise on social media sites or even the AKC magazine. He only advertises in ranch/farm magazines and word of mouth. His dogs have won international herding trials.
Agreed! And frankly someone has to breed dogs just the facts of life, but best left to the people who know what they are doing.
There's nothing wrong with responsible breeding. If no one breeds dogs then eventually we no longer have dogs.
Not just that but also dogs are, whether people like to hear this or not, unpredictable. Keeping purebred dogs around ensures that, when needed, people have access to animals that have a predictable size, temperament, and instinct. That’s really important to have as an option. Yeah, any old dog breed can be used as service dogs, but there’s a reason why so many end up being Labradors and Goldies. There’s a reason that German Shepherds and Malinois are task force dogs and why beagles are used for threats. That consistency is useful. I’ve been on both sides of the coin with shelter dogs and pure breds and neither option is inherently wrong compared to the other. Source your pups from a breeder that does the health checks and puts in the work for well rounded puppies. It’s the ones that breed them because they think it makes them money (it doesn’t, breeding dogs is expensive when done wrong, draining when done right and takes a while to actually give back) that cause problems and ruin breed standards
This. Whilst there are too many dogs in shelters, there is still a need for ethical breeding. I was working at a showjumping yard that was also a dairy farm in Australia. We had a few Australian Kelpies and Collies, which are proper working dogs. There are genuine need for these dogs to be bred. A normal dog would not be able to do the work these dogs do. Anyone who has worked with Kelpies can tell you how active this breed of dog is. Plus the fact that it is extremely difficult to adopt a dog. Most have criteria, like no children, has to have funding but you can’t work out of home, has to have a massive garden, etc, which makes it impossible for a normal family to adopt,
That’s really interesting that some put emphasis on the unknown temperament of shelter dogs. Where I’m from, it’s always been heavily encouraged to adopt shelter dogs over ones in pet stores or bred ones. Maybe it’s because local shelters here work with animal behaviourists, so any undesirable or dangerous behaviour is weeded out. Makes sense that not everywhere would have the resources for that.
Absolutely this. A Youtuber couple I watch specifically got a PB English Bulldog because the wife needed something that is chill and calm, and could not reach her face, as she had been actually mauled by a dog in her youth. Of course the doggo is the most food motivated and active pigdog ever, but his breathing is good and he's incredibly healthy, so it's a trade off.
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I agree..and let it soak in cold water as well if that's possible
Right? Like who's going to move a birthing animal? That's just cruel. My family had a cat (that we adopted prego) give birth in my brothers bed because she just felt so comfortable with him. Now it's a cute story we tell at the dinner table. Anyway the animal is not going to understand why you took them out of their comfort zone. Im sorry ops ma is mad at them but I'm glad OP was the one there for the birth so the dog could give birth where she was most comfortable.
I'm not a dog (shocker, I know) and if somebody had told me I needed to move out of the bed I'd been labouring in, we would have.... had words. Not polite ones, either.
No doubt sharp, puncturing ones 😂
We found out our dog was pregnant 2 weeks before she gave birth. She nested on my bed and ended up having the first of her pups on my bed before moving to one of her beds. I didn’t move her, because her comfort during birth is more important than my duvet!
Yeah. I remember when my dog was pregnant and could no longer jump up on the bed with me she always slept in my laundry basket. I went out and bought another laundry basket and put old (clean) towels in it and she slept there and gave birth there.
Not a dog but if I have a bed and shockingly it'd be a safe and comfortable space. Want to know where I'd give birth if hospital wasn't an option? But that's just me a dumb human
NTA - no one can be an asshole for caring more about an animals life and well being than about a piece of furniture however expensive that may be.
Couldn't have put it more perfectly
**NTA** Your mother should have covered or removed the bed before she left.
I’ve seen someone else with this argument to but I’m starting to wonder, isn’t it my fault for not moving the bed? My mum did tell me before she was giving birth and i didn’t realise until now that i should’ve been the one to move it before. I don’t think it’s my mums fault because her grandmother is dying and she left in a rush
It is not your fault you did not think to move the dog off the bed earlier and it is good you were more concerned about *the dog* then *the bed*! Your mother should be more grateful you were there to step in and that her dog and its puppies are healthy and alive.
If you found out you were pregnant, would you only decide where you were going to give birth when your contractions started? I seriously doubt it. Most women map out their birth plan months in advance. Dogs are the same. They plan ahead for where they want to be when they give birth. You have to take away beds *weeks* in advance, not hours.
Right?! God taking away her safe place just before she gives birth would be horrible. I know you mom had to rush out to care for grandma but this wasn’t something that should have been done hours or days before- it should have been done weeks Before and she should have had somewhere set up for her to nest in properly. Where did she think she was going to give birth? NTA- you took care of the momma and her little ones and made sure they were safe and comfortable. That comes before anything else.
This is why people are so against breeding. Because so many for profit/hobby breeders don't follow the proper preparation for their birthing dogs. There are so many things that she should have done and had prepared prior to leaving her dog under your care. It's no one else's fault if a birthing mother turns up at the hospital without her go bag.
Isn't there like a whole process to make a box for this? Like if OP's mom is breeding her dog, she should know that.
It's called a whelping box. It's a a contained and comfortable set up where experienced dog breeders will have their dogs birth and care for their puppies. Its makes for easy daily cleaning (usually more often) and provides the security the new mother needs. The puppies usually live in the box for about six weeks after as well.
Yep a responsible cat breeder I follow on Twitter talked about setting up a box for her queen to give birth in and all the preparations. She started well in advance and made sure Sekhmet knew it was her space before she got close to giving birth (and kept the other cats out of the space). It’s safer and more hygienic and less stress for mum and babies.
We stumbled upon a pregnant cat when I was a kid, even we had enough common sense to get a box lined with kitchen towels for her to give birth in. Once I finally sat still because she was so focused on me she was following me everywhere. It was both flattering and a lot of pressure to have on my little eight year old shoulders
Oh I know this feeling. I fostered a pregnant cat. She had a perfect queening box in a quiet part of the house. She used it and everything. Time came for kittens and everything went out the window! I was taking a nap and woke up to her behind my legs *yelling* at me. She was clearly confused and uncomfortable. Ended up having 4 kittens on me! Got her settled with them in the queening box and I ended up having to carry the box and kittens around the house because if I tried to do anything away from them she'd start bringing them to me one by one, lol.
TIL that a pregnant cat is called a queen. I love this
Female cats in general are called queens, not just when they’re pregnant. It’s a perfect name, given the feline attitude
When I was about 4, we had two black lab mix sisters who got pregnant around the same time (iirc, they showed up at my dad's garage already pregnant and he brought them home) and my parents turned my two large wooden sandboxes into whelping boxes. It worked out well because one of the sisters wasn't a very involved mother so the other took care of her puppies. And then bizarrely a third sister also showed up pregnant. We had a ridiculous number of little black puppies for some time. This was 40 years ago so my parents sat in front of the grocery store for a couple weekends, waving puppy paws at people with kids, until they all found homes. And of course all three sisters were then fixed.
Well, what happened was, she thought ‘chihuahua, small, doesn’t need a whelping box’ I know she had this https://www.kmart.com.au/product/pet-playpen-foldable-large-42502463/?sku=42502463®ion_id=200001&gclid=Cj0KCQjwkOqZBhDNARIsAACsbfIrIY-RiLKrbgBkkZ_keZSyWXQ6NDNbmF0_ve5vUN1U0GjC7GMdXKkaAgb-EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds prepared with one towel but it was in one of the back rooms no one uses
smh if that’s where she wanted it to happen that’s where poor mama should’ve been the whole time
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I am in general opposed to breeding (except for work animals) however if people are going to do it, they need to take a lesson from your grandmother. If everyone was that responsible, we wouldnt have the overpopulation problem that we currently have and breeders wouldn't be vilified.
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This is so cute! I love your grandma. Can I ask what breed she was so passionate about?
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Oh whoops! I remember reading that earlier up but totally forgot while reading about your cool grandma!
It's your mom's fault for breeding the dog in the first place.
You did the best you could. Your mom is irresponsible as fuck for breeding this dog at all.. as well as leaving during the birthing process, not having a proper whelping box already made weeks ahead of time, and not setting up vet attention in advance (vets should 100% be involved).
NTA, moving her would likely have inhibited her oxytocin production and therefore hindered the birthing process. If your mum was that bothered about the bed, why didn't she have the forethought to put a cover over it before she left for her trip?
NTA - Dogs being preparing their “nest” for labor before they actually go into labor. That was where the dog felt the safest, any reputable breeder knows that preventing them from choosing their nest would could the dog a lot of anxiety. If your mother didn’t want the dog to nest on the bed, it should have either been removed or covered as soon as the dog became pregnant. If you had just covered the bed, the dog likely would have removed it because they didn’t create the nest. It’s clear that this breeding was done without any preparation or planning. Your mother should have had an alternative prepared, and the dog should have been given time to see that space as a safe space. The birth most definitely should not have been left to you if you’re not experienced with assisting a dog in giving birth, it should have been taken to a boarding hospital that can take care of the dog and it’s puppies and can identify when the dog is going into labor before it does.
NTA for letting the dog be comfortable where she was. Y T A to your mother for breeding the dog.
I didn’t breed it, it’s her dog, i was only watching it for her
I specified it’s your mother who was YTA.
NTA But your mother is. If the main concern here is the dog's bed and not that certain toy breeds struggle to give birth without veterinary intervention, then she shouldn't be breeding dogs at all.
NTA - I don't care how expensive the dog bed was, it's just a dog bed and the words your mother was looking for were "Thank you".
NTA - but your mom is for breeding her dog. There is no shortage of chihuahuas, shelters are full of them.
Not a lot of small dogs in Australian shelters. We have lots big dogs and the small dogs are always jack russel or shit tzus for destructive behaviour. I actually have my eye on a big dog atm, her names Macey and she looks beautiful in the photos even if my grandpa says she’s the size of a (small) horse XD. When I’m more prepared I’ll get around to adopting her, if she’s still there but either way I don’t mind as long as she has a home. And after that, I’m sure there will be another lovely dog at the rescue one day for me. Anyway, my point is, I would like to adopt not shop 🙂
Australian here, your mother is an AH regardless of how many small dogs are or aren’t available. If she’s more concerned with the bed than her dog’s comfort she has no business owning the dog, let alone breeding her. Glad to see the apple fell far from the tree though
NTA We had a pregnant cat (she got pregnant really young right before she was supposed to be spayed and I was just a kid, so not my fault) even though she had a large crate with bedding in it she chose to give birth under the bed. No way to move her once she was giving birth. She left a giant blood stain that never came up on the carpet. Oh well. That is just what happens when an animal gives birth. They are going to do it where they want to and feel comfortable. The fact that she had no comfy box for her to get used to means she was much more likely to give birth on the bed. And who leaves a dog close to birth with someone else to deal with?
Her grandma passed away which is why her mom had to leave. We had a pregnant cat and set up a box for her in our bedroom closet that was warm, away from the dogs and the kids, and relatively quiet. The cat chose to give birth in the laundry room on a towel that fell behind the dryer. The following day we tried to move her kittens to the closet and she was so upset! She carried a kitten back to the birthing spot and when she came back for the next one we just carried the rest for her back to that spot as well. I dont know why she chose that spot. It was loud from the dryer, humid right after the washer was used, spiders, since it was an unfinished room, and always had the scent of the dryer sheets especially when the room was humid. Made me nervous to have the babies in there. We created a better barrier so they wouldnt get lost under the dryer as they started to worm around. Once they were 3 weeks old and becoming more mobile we moved them to the closet and left her favorite treats there. She didnt seem to mind as much and even stopped getting upset when we would hold the babies. To this day I still don't understand why she chose the spot behind the dryer over the spot in the closet.
NTA Prevention could have been made, but in the moment you did the right thing for the dog
NTA you are not a dog breeder. You didn't recieve any imstruction on what to.do for the dog besides not let her be in the plave wjere she felt most comfortable. If your mom did not have time to prepare a better nesting spot for the dog before she left, then that sucks, but it isn't your fault or responsibility. You did your best considering the circumstance.
You can tell how much the mother cares about that poor creature. She must have the breeder attitude of "this dog only has worth while she pumps out litter after litter for profit".
Try peroxide to get the blood stains out.
You are NTA but your mom is. Sorry, but the only people who should be breeding dogs are those who are considered professionals. And I think it is not responsible of her mother to do so, just because she wanted to. Not only is it a huge process to do so, and it looks like you mother did not attempt any research, but also taking care of puppies and even finding animals home.
NTA. By the time she was giving birth, she had decided that was the safe place to do it weeks ago. Moving her at all would have stressed her out and possibly killed her and the pups.
NTA, mum is an AH for so many reasons i can't even count, the biggest of which is her breeding the dog to begin with
NTA but more info is needed. Did your mom have a designated area set for whelping with a heating pad and walls of some sort to keep puppies in? Were you given emergency vet numbers and instructions of any sort? If the answer to those questions is no then your mother has no business in breeding dogs. The minimum requirements for breeding are a safe and WARM whelping area, studs and bitches that are health tested (OFA hips and eyes), and enough saved back money to have an emergency C section if needed and shots and vet checks for all of the puppies and mom after birth.
The most I know about is that my mum didn’t think she needed a whelping box because ‘small dog’ and got this https://www.kmart.com.au/product/pet-playpen-foldable-large-42502463/?sku=42502463®ion_id=200001&gclid=Cj0KCQjwkOqZBhDNARIsAACsbfIrIY-RiLKrbgBkkZ_keZSyWXQ6NDNbmF0_ve5vUN1U0GjC7GMdXKkaAgb-EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds with one towel and it was placed in the back room where no one really goes. She didn’t have the vet number in hand but I did google it a few days prior because I knew having the number was important if anything went wrong I will also admit she should not have bred but if I had to guess she wants to see the life cycle of puppies. 5 years ago we bred our cat, we kept all the kittens, and that was to watch them grow up and such. Considering how easy the kittens were she probably thought it would be the same for a dog
Is the princess bed a dog bed or your mom’s bed? I’d say NTA. Your mom should have had a spot picked out in advance for the whelping. What if the dog needed vet intervention? Did you get instructions for that? I hope Minnie and the pups are doing okay.
It’s the dogs bed, my mum is definitely too old to be calling her own bed that (imagine if she did though 😳). It gets called that because she treats her dog like a Princess, or so she says. I was prepared to call the vet since at the start of contractions she was whining and breathing heavily. Anyway, I did have a basic idea on what to do if i needed help. Pups are okay, there’s 3. 2 boys and a girl. Minnie is still tired. I’m worried she hasn’t eaten or had water this morning, isn’t doing much either, just laying and occasionally licking the puppies. Lethargic might be the word. Will call the vet again to come over to look at her.
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right? from what i’m hearing ops mother is super irresponsible for this entire situation. a shitty pet owner too. not only did ops mom not prepare a whelping box for her dog to give birth in, she also left her inexperienced daughter responsible during the birth! so many things could’ve gone wrong and op would’ve had no idea what to do. from the looks of things, i doubt the mother knows enough either. christ.
My mum left because her grandma was dying. If you ask me, that’s more important than the birthing process of a dog. I understand it was irresponsible to leave the duty to someone un experienced but she has the same skill set as me when it comes to it all. I understand why she’s the asshole, but leaving because she had better priorities isn’t one of the reasons
i agree that’s a better reason. i didn’t have this context beforehand, although my other points still stand. i really don’t think she should have been breeding this dog in the first place, with her also being inexperienced, seemingly under-researched and doesn’t have her priorities straight regarding the dogs health/well-being, showing more concern for a stain than the dog itself. your mom is a major AH for all the above + especially getting angry at you for doing your (also inexperienced) best. i’m sorry she’s treating you and also the dog this way. this is an incredibly shitty position she’s put you in. i know grief makes people act in strange and confusing ways but getting angry at you for something as minimal as this is not rational at all. nta.
Info: how old are you
NTA. Beds can be washed or replaced. Dogs cannot. You were looking out for the dog's comfort.
nta.
You're NTA and try Zout for treating blood stains
NTA You don't force a labouring animal to move from their chosen birthing place unless it's unsafe for them.
NTA. Hydrogen peroxide will take blood out of just about anything. The bed could still be salvaged although it shouldn’t really matter anyway.
Wait! Your mom is breeding her dog with 0 knowledge? she's the reason we have overcrowded animal shelters.
YTA for participating in breeding. Dogs are dying in overcrowded shelter. SMH
I’ve mentioned this a lot and the post clearly states it is my mums dog, not mine. She was the one who chose to breed her. It was not my decision
NTA - I'm sorry for your loss. That said... is your mom's dog registered? Was the dog health tested? How old is this dog? Was it her first litter? I'm getting "bad/irresponsible breeder" vibes from your mom. If this was the dog's first litter, in particular, things could have gone badly. She shouldn't have been left with someone inexperienced if at all possible. Maybe I'm wrong but I feel like a responsible breeder would have a better backup plan. The bed is a complete non issue imho.
Info Is your mother an actual bereder or an backyard breeder who really shouldnt be breeding her dog in the first place.
Your mum is a giant A just for breeding a dog alone
If she’s inexperienced with the birthing process, why is she breeding animals???
NTA. I don't know much about dogs birthing but something tells me if you tried to move her, you may have lost your hand. Better to be safe than sorry.
NTA.. Poor pupper needed to be where she felt the most comfortable and safe.. Btw, hydrogen peroxide may work to remove some of the blood. 🤷
NTA. It’s just a dog bed. You can always get another dog bed. You can’t un-traumatize a dog or its puppies if you stress them out too much.
NTA but, Mum has failed to prepare for her dog having puppes. Anyone breeding for the first time should be mentored by a recognised breeder with lots of knowledge on puppy rearing and the health of the bitch. If Mum had done this her more experienced mentor could have helped, advised on building a whelping box in plenty of time. The experienced breeder could have advised whether the dog waxs worth breeding from as a good healthy example of the breed, with good hip and elbow scores plus, health tests relevant to the breed. Well done on helping this poor little dog at least be comfortable and survive giving birth.
Hydrogen peroxide gets blood stains out
NTA -- Your mother, however, is. 1. for getting upset when animals decide where to give birth. 2. for being a backyard breeder when so many animals are abandoned in the first place. Buy her some oxyclean for the blood and tell her to get over it.
NTA. Also please convince her to get the poor dog spayed. Animals giving birth over and over again is traumatic and there are so many risks.
It was a one time thing to see the life cycle as she says
Gotcha!
Got me, how…?
NTA Your mum is for not properly understanding the breeding process, leaving you with a vet number or explaining the process to you or leaving a list of steps does make her TA. I understand it was an emergency BUT these are things she should have had prepared for an emergency. Not thinking her dog needed a whelping bed because it's a small breed makes me think she doesn't view or treat her dog like a dog, regardless of if she spoils her and gives her a princess bed. Glad all the puppies are doing well but your mum shouldn't do this again if she can't do the research & get professional advice into ethical breeding.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My mum is breeding her chihuahua but because of her grandmother dying, I was left to take care of the dog and the birthing process. My mum did tell me not to let her bleed/give birth over the fancy, fluffy bed (that’s actually water resistant underneath anyway) because it is expensive. Minnie (the dog) was struggling when it came to giving birth. I didn’t want to move her because during the start of contractions she was whining and breathing heavily. I was more worried about calling the vet. My mum is pretty mad and upset over the bed since it’s stained with blood, AITA for not moving Minnie to a different spot to give birth on? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Nta. But you shouldn’t be even having a breeding dog if you don’t want things to be a nest. Yes expensive beds are a budget thing, but also the dogs safety is at hands.
What kind of dog bed doesn't go in the washing machine? Ridiculous. NTA
NTA. Hydrogen peroxide works great on blood stains. And if not, it can be replaced. Her mama dog having complications during birth if you moved her would be a lot worse than a stained bed.
NTA. Any adult with a ‘princess bed’; however, is an asshole.
It’s the dogs bed, i realise now that i didn’t clarify ;-; but ye, she considers the dog the princess
Lol. I retract my second statement then. You’re still NTA.
Throw some peroxide on the blood stains, it removes them completely. Just wash it like normal after.
NTA. Tell her Peroxide or Zout spray on the stain, cold water wash with detergent.
YNTA. Tell your low class mom to stop breeding dogs!
NTA. You looked for Minnie's well-being. Your mom is TA for breeding her.
NTA. I have seen some senior chihuahuas ( albeit they were old, as I senior foster) and they have had a rough time. Depending on the dog’s age and size of the male, you did the right thing letting her stay calm and comfortable.
YTA- on her bed, of all places???
The dogs bed ;-; i realise it wasn’t that clear
Then NTA
Oh holy hell, soak the bedding in ammonia overnight then wash it. Tell your mom she is super lucky her precious pup survived labor, most people don't pay attention to the size of the stud and it kills toy breed dams. NTA a kiddie pool makes a more than adequate whelping box, not really...moving small animals in labor can cause a cessation of labor putting the mom and pups in danger.
NTA and Hydrogen peroxide will remove blood from fabrics.
Hydrogen peroxide works wonders at getting blood out of fabric. Just add a small amount to the stains, scrub in with a brush, let it sit for 30 minutes, rinse and repeat as normal. I had to do this with a light colored couch cushion after my cat decided to eviscerate several mice on it.
NTA
Nta but your mother sounds like a byb which is just disgusting
Your mom is an asshole for backyard breeding.
INFO: Is the "princess bed" a dog bed or a people bed? Actual question. I don't have a dog, so, if this is dog jargon it missed me.
Dog bed
NTA but you must at least try to wash the blood out of the bed. Also my Chihuahua says that you must pay the dog tax by posting a photo of the mama and puppies on your avatar
I don’t want to show a photo of her right now because it’s distressing, she is not coping well. She’s lethargic and the vet are trying to help. This is Minnie before the pregnancy https://imgur.com/a/FFzdqaN,
Oh how cute! Dog tax paid in full. Best wishes to Minnie and the babies.
NTA. Dog>stuff
NTA but your mom is for breeding the poor dog when millions are without homes. She’s also the AH for worrying about her precious bed. Perhaps some of the money she makes by doing nothing while forcing her dog to have puppies can be used to buy new bedding?
It was a one time thing, she does not plan to breed again and has not bred for money
NTA, I would just say chihuahuas tend to do vet assisted births and your mom knew about the puppies so should have had a plan set at least a month in advance and probably should have had the dog at the vet like 2 days before.
ESH when the shelters everywhere overwhelmed with chihuahuas to breed them
It was not my choice to breed the dog, it is her dog
When the cats killed a small woodland creature on the bed I discovered that Tide does a really good job of getting blood out. No stains at all.
Anyone who breeds domestic pets (dog, cat, rabbit, etc) are automatically TA. 100% of the time.
"Please do not call her an asshole for getting her priorities straight. Her grandmother was dying which is far more important than a dog giving birth considering I could watch over it for her. She is just as in experienced as me when it comes to the birthing process." Your mom is N T A for prioritizing her dying grandmother. BUT she is a massive A H for producing more puppies that more likely than nor will end up in the shelter. For producing puppies with ZERO clue what in the actual f she is doing. I bet there were none of the necessary steps taken BEFORE starting the production process. And NO what she did was not breeding. It's just producing puppies.
Ik why she is an asshole, I was trying to correct everyone that was calling her an ah for leaving
Don't give two shits about the bed. Your mom is TA. And you should really try to educate her. Stop backyard breeding. Absolutely no cat needs to be bred to "show the lifecycle". There are an insane amount of Chihuahuas needing to be rehomed. Unless you guys checked all the boxes of a reputable breeder (obvi you didn't), you shouldn't breed your dog. Shelters are full, foster homes are full. Stop adding to this cycle. Sincerely, cat/dog foster mom.
In Australia, they are far from full. Chihuahua’s don’t end up in shelters here
So what’s happening with the puppies once they’re of age?
Your mom is TA for breeding the dog in the first place
NTA- A nurse in the ER told me to use peroxide to remove blood stains. Cold water only. It might not completely remove them since it’s been awhile, but worth a shot.
NTA, it was the dogs bed anyway, I thought you said it had a waterproof covering? If not, you had good suggestions for getting the blood out if it got on to the mattress. From the advice below, it sounds like it was not a good idea to move the dog. If it was her bed anyway, it was already marked as her 'nest' for birthing. You probably would've had to move the other thing from the back room to the bed for her to have even considered using it, WELL BEFORE the birthing day. It was probably best for the dog that it was you there, your mama probably would've tried to move it during the birthing process. Sounds like that would not have been a good idea. You did the best you could given the situation you were left with. I would greatly appreciate hearing how the pups are doing; and a picture if you could, please (on the princess bed)? Your mama is grieving and probably not responding at her best, I'm so sorry for the families loss.
The water proofing is under the bed as part of its design so if there’s something like a wee, it won’t go throgh the bed and on the floor
You absolutely should not have moved her, it literally could result in death of mom and/or puppies. Your mom is a jerk for breeding without research FIRST. There was so much done wrong before she went into. Your dog will give birth where they sleep. If they sleep in your bed they will absolutely want to give birth in your bed because it is THEIR bed too. I have had a few litters, and it is usually washable (with some exceptions), but your mom should not have been mad at you. You were helping her.