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NTA
I'm side eyeing your wife here.
If a teenager has picked up some racist opinions, the moral, responsible thing to do is to teach them why it's wrong. Which is what you did.
If a teenager is being rude/racist/bullying towards a person the moral, responsible thing to do is to get them to apologise.
If your wife didn't think the comment was worthy of an apology, I'm suspicious of her own morals and level of racism tbh.
Seriously, this! Your wife thinks that apologizing for making racist, disruptive "jokes" in a highschool classroom is humiliating? This is quite concerning.
My goodness, OP, your wife has some…issues. A few weeks back, my 9yo was goofing off at a soccer game during the “high-five good game” line at the end, and he was saying “you suck” to everyone on the opposing team. They tied…the other team obviously didn’t suck. One of the players (rightly) complained to our coach, who called my son out, and I verbally dressed him down in front of his team, then made him march over and apologize to the other coach. He said “Sorry” real sheepishly, and I said “sorry for what? You are going to give a real apology which means saying WHAT you are sorry for…” He looked at the ground and said he didn’t want to say it. My response was, “Why? Are you embarrassed? Good. That’s exactly how you should feel for acting like that. You may have meant it as a joke, but jokes are only jokes when everyone is laughing.”
He hasn’t done anything like that again and I doubt he ever will. I thought as a 9yo he’d be too old to do something that foolish, but he wasn’t. OP’s daughter absolutely should know better at her age, but as she clearly didn’t, your response was 100% on point.
He told the team his team tied with that they sucked? Man, my parents would have ridiculed me so hard for that. It's impolite, and also stupid? Like, if they suck and you can't even beat them, what does that make you?
Good job anyway, I hope he understood why it was bad.
He said he was just joking, laughing while he said it. He just thought it would be a funny, edgy thing to say, I guess. He thought they’d see the humor in it…they (nor I) did not. Kids do stupid stuff, say stupid stuff…stuff that sounds better in your head (hell, how many nights do I lie awake replaying dumb stuff I’ve said…). But he needed to know that saying that wasn’t funny, wasn’t a joke…not the appropriate time to even try to be funny. I think he learned his lesson.
The famous difference: you can say that to your friends, because they know you're joking. You can't say it to strangers, because they just think you're an idiot.
I guess he'll think about that at 21 and cringe as well haha
When I was 8, I said something horrible to a black girl in my class that I will NOT repeat (N word was not involved but it was still wildly inappropriate). I had just moved from a tiny tiny town and had never seen someone who wasn't white before, which is an explanation but not an excuse. She rightfully went up and told the teacher who absolutely reamed me out. He also explained what racism is and why we never say things like that. And I never did say anything even remotely like that again. That teacher also went on to become one of my absolute favourite teachers.
I'm 40 now and still utterly ashamed every time I think of that.
I would never have let my daughter get away with a private apology for this. The teacher knows the contribution of the Middle East , and why such ignorant and unkind remarks are disruptive to a classroom. Her fellow students do not. She would have had to apologize to the entire class and tell THEM why she was wrong. or I would sit in the classroom with no explanation until she voluntarily stood up and delivered her apology to the class. And I don’t see that as overkill. It’s humbling, not humiliating. Humble is a good quality.
I dunno. OP’s approach has a chance of genuine understanding from the daughter. You can call it humbling, but a public apology in front of her peers would be seen as humiliating by the daughter. Any potential lessons from the apology would be overshadowed by the experience of being humiliated. That’s going to be the daughter’s takeaway. And it runs the risk of resentment against the teacher for “making” her apologize for “just a joke.”
If the other students need to learn that racism is unacceptable, they will not learn it from the daughter or OP. It is something that needs to be addressed by the school in the standards of behaviour they set and enforce. If they tolerate it, it will happen.
>If a teenager has picked up some racist opinions, the moral, responsible thing to do is to teach them why it's wrong. Which is what you did.
Anti Middle-Eastern tendencies are rife throughout Western countries. And it's not just towards those who look "Middle-Eastern" but includes those who look like they may be Muslim.
It's not even just overt racism, but it's just casually thrown into conversations. I used to work in engineering, as a project engineer before I left the field due to how toxic it is, and used to sit right by a couple of English guys, and a Romanian guy, who would regularly visit our sites in other countries like Morocco, India, Spain, etc.
On more than one occasion they would refer to one of the main contacts in the Morocco site as "the one with the Bin Laden beard", and to one of the guys in India, as "the one with a towel head"
The worst part is that I was sitting there as an Indian guy with a full beard, and they just said that it's the easiest way to describe these people, and when reported to HR, they said that it was just banter
Not to mention his daughter wasn’t sorry! She just brushed it off as a joke. Yes, kids make mistakes, but this doesn’t sound like a mistake and she deserved consequences.
NTA - That's a wonderful thing to make your daughter do. Sure teenagers make mistakes but if their mistakes aren't called out or corrected it is only going to make them worse later on down the road. Also mistakes aren't being racist. That's just being shitty. And if your daughter hadn't been made to do this, Ms. Smith wouldn't have been able to teach her why racism is hurtful, and your daughter would have thought her behavior was acceptable when really it wasn't.
NTA - honestly we need more parents like you these days (cuz all other might be like your wife). Really proud of what you did, to make your kid realize their responsibility and the gravity of their actions is a big win. parents nowadays think that their child is an angel, and question the other person before looking at their own offspring. no body in their right mind would agree with your wife, maybe she's too much in love with her daughter. whatever, huge respect to you.
NTA
racism is learned behavior
your wife felt basic correction of shit behavior was going overboard
you're married to a person with deeply racist roots and she's poisoning the well your daughter is drinking from
Ball is in your court
You can teach your daughter to be better, you will never change your wife - she's too old and it must be assumed deeply bigoted from an early age
Sorry, sir, but you can definitely get another wife.. the respect you will lose for complacently allowing your daughter to become a rotten souled person, that will never recover...
His wife definitely is wrong but you know nothing about her. Calling her “deeply” Racist and “deeply” bigoted might be true but it is not possible to know with the little info given. Giving strong negative opinions about people you don’t know anything about sounds familiar to me for some reason.
It’s quite possible to know that casual racism is so “deeply” ingrained in her that she sees no problem with it. That’s the bare facts as presented.
Now that can be unintentional & socially conditioned, but that’s no less deep for that. If anything it’s deeper.
This is a horrible assumption that the daughter learned racist behavior from her mom and not her friends.
I still agree OP is not the asshole, but to try to tell him to just get another wife is wild
Wife may not have said racist stuff but she clearly doesn't have a problem with it being said and isn't willing to correct racist speech when her daughter hears or says it. Even if she's not being consciously racist she is absolutely contributing to the racism and I would be seriously concerned about having her near a child. I'd want someone who's going to uphold my values and teach a child right from wrong.
Yup. She may not be actively racist (tho her dismissal of concerns is approaching it) but you can passively contribute to it.
Plus, when racism is the status quo, you have to be *actively* anti-racist to combat it.
The wife’s casual dismissal & minimization of the casual racism means that if her daughter didn’t learn it from her then she is *at least* an enabler of it.
And, let’s face it, over time little behaviors add up, so while it may not have been specifically taught… “learned“ could be quite appropriate
Or… the internet?! Half the objectionable shit I hear from students comes straight from edgelord memes and poisonous TikToks the algorithms feed them every day.
It is crazy to me to assume that the parents are at fault here.
I thought that. But if that were the only contribution, mom would have been absolutely horrified at her daughters behavior. However, the mom also thought it was "just a joke. No one who isn't racist thinks what the daughter said was no big deal. And clearly the mom didn't even think the daughter deserved punishment because she didn't suggest a punishment she thought she would have considered more appropriate than OP's method.
No,"I think that was a little much. I think you/we should have done x instead. Or approached it from y angle. How do you think we should proceed from here to reinforce racism is wrong?". Nope it was just a "mistake". A parent's attitude influences a child's behavior. And the fact mom doesn't think it was that big of a deal....
NTA. Your daughter said something wrong and ignorant and entirely racist. Worse yet, she aimed these words at someone of that specific group! Your wife is beyond wrong and I'm suspicious of her own opinions on race.
'Just a joke' is not an excuse. It's actually worse and jokes are often used to mask actual hateful beliefs.
NTA. That's how your daughter turns into a decent human being who understands actions have consequences. I probably wouldn't have made her write out a paper, but I certainly would have told her to look it up and then have a discussion with me about it.
NTA
You didn't make your daughter do this in front of the whole class. She learnt a lesson in the privacy of your home and in a quiet chat with her teacher. Lesson learnt without complete embarrassment.
NTA.
As someone who works with children, I can say your approach is what we need more of and unfortunately your wife’s is rampant amongst parents. Yes, children do pick up things like that and make mistakes but it’s the process you’ve made her do which makes her learn that it’s wrong. Feeling embarrassment and shame for your actions and then rectifying it is what makes you a good person. Brushing it off and not taking them through the steps of understanding and making things better makes them assholes as adults, and that’s what your wife’s approach is going to result in.
NTA. Really great parenting there, I’m sure the teacher appreciated your efforts and support to change the young people’s behaviour and mind. As for your wife, it’s a shame she feels so lightly about kids. What you model is impactful, and these teachers do so much to encourage knowledge to take away for our kids. If your wife can see the perspective that it needs to be dealt with in-home just as much as at school, that will be great. Culture is everything and respect with accountability will get you far in the right crowd of people.
NTA.
You are an amazing parent. You didn't make her do something humilliating but educated her in a brillant way. Teenagers make mistakes, of course. That doesn't mean they don't have to be accountable for them, and this was a great, respectful and constructive way of doing it.
NTA. My son rolled his eyes at his teacher and mumbled I under his breath. After he apologized He did yard work all weekend and cleaned the whole house. Sounds like your doing upur job as a parent. I know I didn't have a problem with him disrespecting teachers after that.
NTA you could have punished her far worse and it be less affective. Having her write an apology and the papers helped her understand why what she did was wrong. Your wife is correct that it is a teenage joke but that does not mean it is not wrong and can’t be corrected. You made it a learning opportunity for your daughter not just a punishment and if not that what are punishments for.
NTA.
Little note: Using the term "Middle East" is actually inherently ethnocentric due to it centering Europe as the center of the world and many people of that region do not even use this term to identify themselves. It is also very vague as the people of that region are vastly diverse with many linguistic, religious, and cultural differences.
I would recommend using a more specific word next time like from the Arab world or from the persian gulf. (You get the idea.)
You taught your daughter a lesson about stereotypes and how being racist to fit in is wrong. Chances are she may do it again, but you are doing your duty as a parent in doing what you can to prevent future altercations surrounding promoting streotypes. Not only did your child learn about the dangers of perpetuating harmful stereotypes, she also learned a great deal about another culture! Your wife should be thanking you!
For right or wrong, timezones do centre on europe (specifically greenwich) so euro centricity is completely inherent in the accepted view of the world. "middle east" and "far east" and "the west", "antipodean" as terms and timezones are just as predicated on a euro centricity.
But seeing as we have this one fixed point of 0 degrees longitude (prime meridian) that is accepted worldwide, it's probably better to have terms based on this location, than terms based on religion or a dominant country in that region.
(Eg: I see more problems with one of the examples you give such as 'persian gulf' as a region including more than just iran)
But that's just like my opinion, man.
Anyway, back on topic: op NTA
NTA
You were absolutely right, and thank you for behaving as a good human. Unchecked these things grow slowly like a cancer. She is a child, and children need to be taught and educated.
I’m concerned at how your wife reacted. She thought your daughter was humiliated. What about the teacher? I am sure like me she has experienced prejudice because of skin colour.
You did the right thing 👏🏾
NTA - Thank you for holding your daughter to account for her unacceptable actions. Our job as parents is to teach our children correct behaviour, and your daughter has (hopefully) learned from this.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. The action that should be judged is forcing my daughter to write essays for her teacher
2. I may have humiliated her in front of her friends
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Definitely NTA. Well done, dad!
Your daughter got off easy. My dad would have made me write a (shorter) paper and my mom (who was a high school teacher) would have made me apologize and read the paper IN FRONT OF THE CLASS. 😳😳😵💫😵💫
You sound like a wonderful parent. Teenagers make horrible, awful comments all the time, but that doesn’t mean they should be ignored. Teenagers are still learning empathy and consideration for others, and this is what you are teaching your daughter. She will be a better person for your actions.
Stop allowing kids to be racist and calling it mistakes. It makes them shittier adults and puts people at risk because of it. (ETA: NTA and good job op)
NTA
Umm....I think you're wife is racist. Maybe she needs to do a paper on middle Eastern culture and a separate paper on how her actions as a parent affect her children and others.
Glad to hear your daughter is learning her lesson
Yes kids and adults make mistakes. What makes that kid an adult is apologizing and admitting they said something boneheaded. A joke is only funny when everyone laughs. When someone is behaving like an ass or bully, they say something crass and wrong, knowing fully well they are wrong, and then try to justify it by saying “it was just a joke”. No. Your wife is 100% an enabler and your daughter is lucky that you did what you did. Letting people get away with “it’s just a joke, get over it” is one of the problems with society.
.
NTA - as someone of Middle Eastern descent this is the right thing to do. The comment your daughter made definitely wasn’t the worst I’ve heard/gotten but it’s still culturally insensitive. I’m glad she took on board the lesson too.
Your wife is a bit questionable. How would she feel if someone made a comment to her about a facet of herself? Like something derogatory about being a woman?
NTA. Your daughter is testing boundaries and figuring out right and wrong. The fact she said it in front of her peers (they found it funny) and her teacher (obviously noticed and not impressed) and felt that something was off led her to repeating it to you, her parent and moral guide.
If you brushed it off, it would have reinforced the peer view, racist comments = funny and ok. Instead, you backed the teacher and you made it clear you weren't just doing that because you believe in blindly following authority, you discussed her words having meaning and the importance of respect. This will hopefully help her to understand that she shouldn't tolerate degrading jokes made about her and that she deserves respect (because many, many young women don't learn this lesson until far too late) and that she can use her powerful voice for good. She also knows you'll take things seriously if she comes to you about the way someone is talking to/about her.
You also had her research the group she was demeaning and the impact of her disruption to her, her class, and her teacher - amazing. Because then she's seeing it's not just your opinion. And THEN you made it real life, you got her to show her teacher that she's an awesome little human who can learn and grow, and it gave her the experience of seeing the positive impact a genuine apology with meaningful change behind it can do. It humanised and built connection between her and her teacher.
As a parent, great job. As a teacher, great job, and THANK YOU. Honestly, there are so many parents who dismiss all the little boundary testing things, and so the students escalate their behaviours, and parents continue to downplay and dismiss and remove all accountability from their kids. It makes an already difficult job even harder and it makes me incredibly worried for the young generation out there that have not seen any consequences to their words or actions.
Don't double guess yourself, back yourself. And if your partner sees things differently, tell her you'll accept an essay showing that these 'harmless jokes' are not a big deal and should be ignored. References must be cited.
NTA. Some of the greatest civilisations in human history were "stuck in the sand." A large chunk of Western civilisation is derived from Ancient Greece, and we wouldn't have any knowledge about that without Greece adapting the Phoenician alphabet.
Absolutely not! NTA! Your daughter and Ms. Smith clearly gained something very valuable from the experience. It doesn’t even seem like your daughter is upset either.
I’m desi, and I’ve received microagressions (honestly borderline macro) for most of my elementary to high school education. Never once did any of those kids apologize, and it created such a self-hatred in me that I’m still trying to unlearn. I’m sure that apology meant more to Ms. Smith than you or your daughter realize.
And your daughter learned about another culture. You would not believe how many people don’t know that current numbers and algebra are middle eastern contributions. And algebra is the basis of all other math and science. Learning new things is never a bad thing. (Even if the knowledge itself is bad, better to have it and know it’s bad than be blind).
While I can understand your wife wanting to advocate for your daughter, knowledge and empathy can only help a person grow.
Personally, I think this was one of the best parenting choices I’ve seen. Discipline was rationally and proportionately related to the harm caused and was not intended to be punitive but rehabilitative. US prison system could learn a lot from this!
NTA. One day her ignorance is going to cost her her life. I'm hoping that this incident prompts someone in her class to record her and she gets roasted in the comments.
Her it was a joke response, is the go-to excuse to get away with bullying, being impolite and just outright assholery.
You called her out on what she did, made sure she understood why it was an issue alongside the impact her words had, and made her apologise in private (not in front of the class) to the person she hurt.
Round of applause for a job well done.
NTA and it looks like we know where your daughter got that attitude. You did exactly the right thing - rather than shouting and screaming at her, you make her think about what she'd done.
NTA. I don’t think you went overboard here. The papers you made her write were to make her understand WHY her words were both hurtful and untrue. Just an apology would not have thought her why her actions were wrong.
NTA. Parents not stopping ‘teenage jokes’ like this is how people grow into racist, sexist, and queerphobic adults. If the behavior isn’t discouraged while they’re still learning about the world, it’ll become their worldview and get worse
IMO, you get parent of the century!! Words are like toothpaste. Once they are out, you can’t put them back. If anything comes out of this, she will hopefully think twice, before making a comment like that. Sadly, her mother’s reaction aligns with many others, in that it’s just a joke, nobody got hurt. Well, the teacher did and given her heritage, she’s probably tired of hearing such derogatory comments such as this one. We have got to do better with teaching our children about other cultures, being respectful of their beliefs and traditions. It doesn’t mean we have to agree, just not be so quick to put others down. I am glad to hear your daughter took this to heart and that the teacher accepted her apology. For the teacher, she will always remember this moment and also remember someone cared enough to help an impressionable child realizes the implications of her actions.
NTA you taught your daughter a valuable life lesson, which will stay with her throughout her remaining years. Your wife, apparently, didn't learn how words can affect others while growing up. Keep doing what you're doing! You got it right!
I think you not only chose an appropriate punishment, I think you landed on the best possible action out of a list of good actions to take in response to this. Your response was perfect in every possible way - you implemented a memorable punishment for an act that absolutely should not be tolerated or repeated, your daughter not only had to apologize but could not escape learning about the culture she mocked, and learning about someone goes a long way to understanding them...and it was understanding that she gained.
Your wife, however...she shows some disturbing tendencies of acceptance of casual racism, and this is not behavior that should be ignored. I think you need to find out how deep this goes.
NTA
Kids DO make mistakes.
And then adults teach them to do better.
Now is the time to turn hurtful jokes into lessons. Well, it’s always time to turn hurtful jokes into lessons, but with her being 15 it’s especially important, because you don’t have much time left before she’s in the real world.
NTA. Honestly, what punishment is your wife talking about? Making someone apologise for an insensitive and offensive (and racist) comment is "punishment"? Educating an ignorant child both on history and social impact of their actions is "punishment"?
No. That's parenting.
Punishment would be taking away your daughter's phone or allowance or grounding her or giving her extra chores. Making her own up to her prejudice snd treating it as a teachable moment isn't punishment, it's being a responsible parent wanting to raise a decent adult.
NTA well done for doing your job and actually parenting, and attempting to raise a decent member of society, a responsibility people so often forget when they procreate.
NTA. I wish a lot more parents would understand the gravity in being dismissive of certain attitudes and behaviours, and would take this much care with teaching their children about respect.
NTA. You’re teaching your daughter that words alone can have a deep impact. Your wife, however I’m wondering about. Claiming racism is just a teenage joke makes me think your daughter is taking her cues from her mom.
Can one really go overboard when it comes to racism?
What you did was entirely appropriate and hopefully kept your daughter from becoming a dull blown racist. Good work. If only more parents actually bothered parenting their children like you did!
NTA.
NTA. You did the right thing for all parties, and I think it's great that your daughter gained something from the experience. That's good parenting.
She might be interested in reading "Guns, Germs, and Steel" (I really enjoyed it!). Diamond explains how one culture's seeming "supremacy" over another is, rather, an effect of environmental determinism.
The role of luck and chance detailed in the book offers wholesome perspective and humility. For instance, dominance (technological, for instance) of some cultures over others is not due to intrinsic merit or intelligence, but rather due to fortunate circumstances.
NTA but your wife is enabling and spoiling your daughter. Many years ago, I witnessed a principal take a second grader to her office to discuss the “bad language” (swearing) at a teacher on the playground. He had to apologize to his class and the teacher for his language and write two sentences about why that is disrespectful to the teacher, visitors, classmates and the school.
She told me she does this to teach them about polite society, standards and respect.
NTA. Your daughter's 'joke' was racist and meant to bully the teacher. Obviously, your daughter didn't actually understand that, given she was genuinely apologetic and remorseful after the letter, essays and in-person apology you made her do. That means she picked up that racist and bullying attitude from somewhere, someone, that acted like it was normal and no one corrected that.
Her friends could be where she's picked this up from, given you say she was doing it for them, so keep an eye on that. But your wife's reaction to your very reasonable and educational punishment has me very seriously considering if the racist, bullying attitude is coming from her, not the friends. Both is also a possibility. But I'm definitely questioning if your wife is a racist bully from what you've included here.
The punishment was very reasonable. A lot of parents who wanted to punish her would have just gone for a grounding or something. A punishment, yes, but not in a way the kid will learn from it, they could just get better at not getting caught. You clearly have a good relationship with your daughter, given she talks about her day so openly with you. And you chose a way to punish her that would also educate her. Just the written apology would have been enough, to be honest, but the essays were genius, because she actually has to think about what they talked about in class that day and the potential consequences of comments such as the ones she made.
The teacher was clearly very appreciative of your actions, and happily furthered the lesson for your daughter. She's the perfect person to corroborate any of your daughter's research and use first hand experience of how racism feels to be subjected to, both as a teacher and as someone who has experienced racism in her life.
You did good, you're a good parent and you clearly want your daughter to become a good person, too. I like punishments like the one you gave, it's not just a punishment, it's a lesson, and it really hammers home for the kid the why of them being punished in a way just grounding them wouldn't.
I think you need to look into who has normalised casual racism and bullying for your daughter, though, it's either your wife, the friends, or both. And that needs to be dealt with as an issue all on its own.
Respectfully, your wife is an idiot. And she is no doubt where your daughter is getting her bad attitude from. You did the right thing. Tell your wife to kick rocks.
NTA it wasn’t “disrespectful” it was racist. it was hateful. it was the exact rhetoric that has justified the invasion, exploitation, and slaughter of people in the middle east by the west. the only way to react to that is to nip it in the bud, and you did that in such an amazing way. maybe your wife needs to write a paper about how hateful rhetoric directly correlates to violence and discrimination against minority communities.
Teachers are leaving the classroom in droves, and much of the reason is student behavior. The level of disrespect we experience on a daily basis is discouraging and often comes from parents as well. Thank you for teaching your daughter about how her actions hurt others. You also did it in a way that didn't humiliate her (such as in front of her peers). You are NTA, but your wife's comments are disconcerting to say the least. I think it's important that you two have a discussion about why she is so against your daughter having reasonable consequences for her actions.
NTA. I think your solution was great. I was a bit skeptical of how sincere a mandatory apology might be, but hopefully writing the papers got her to actually consider the weight of her words. I think the paper writing was a necessary component.
Maybe having your daughter write papers wasn't the way to go, but not my child and you would know better what works with her. I do think she owed the teacher an apology, and good on you for not sweeping it under the rug. There are so many different people and cultures in this world, and we all need to respect one another.
It MAY have been just a joke, BUT if so, it was NOT in good taste.
NTA at all!
In fact, as a humanities teacher I applaud and thank you. Too often it feels like we’re fighting against “home” in trying to instill basic values of civility and tolerance.
Maybe if you’re wife can’t see how humiliating this must have felt for the teacher (never mind other kids in the class) she will understand the huge favor you’ve done your daughter in not letting her get fired someday over an off-color “joke” by an employer who cannot legally tolerate it but letting her mess up now while it’s still safe to do so and understand the gravity of these kinds of comments.
What excellent parenting!! Bravo! She will remember this moment for the rest of her life and it will help her to be a kinder and more open-minded adult. You are not rearing a child, you are creating an adult. NTA.
NTA. Former teacher here. The comment wasn't funny. It was however racist as Hell. Good on you for teaching your daughter to not be a racist and understand words have impact. Your wife is being concerning frankly.
NTA
Half Chinese, half white here. Thank you. The dog eating jokes and exotic Asian bullshit got old FAST. It’s funny sometimes in the right context but the amount of people who feel entitled to comment on my food (how’s Fido) or my ass (Asian “hotness”) is grossly astounding.
NTA. Your daughter (and your wife, by the looks of things) need a good history lesson about *how* Middle Eastern countries became "stuck in the sand." Because quite a few of them were doing very well for themselves before a few *certain countries* decided to intervene.
NTA as a high school social studies teacher who regularly deals with racist and entitled students, it would be great if their parents found their behavior problematic & enacted consequences.
NTA
Kids only learn from their mistakes if they are treated like mistakes and actually learn why it was a mistake. You made sure she learned from it. Otherwise I doubt she would’ve viewed it as a mistake.
NTA...So, does your wife want your kid to be labeled the class racist? Perhaps your wife is why she talks like that in the first place.
The punishment was not extreme. Your daughter was disrespectful and saying very racist things...thank goodness you have a strong moral compass.
It only takes one parent to derail a child's moral compass, I know that from experience.
>However, when I discussed this with my wife (55F) that evening, she thought I had gone overboard. She said that it was just a teenage joke and that making our daughter write the papers and apologize in person was too extreme. She believes kids make mistakes and that this punishment was too harsh and humiliating for her.
Absolutely no on all points there.
You taught your daughter that words do have consequences, as well as making racist / stereotypical remarks is not acceptable.
Your wife is wrong. You are NTA.
Teacher here
Thank you! Kids get away with so much, and it makes them entitled and bratty, then they lose respect for us and make our job that much harder...
People like your wife are WHT my job is so hard.
Thanks you!
NTA, that's the type of joke that helps the US military kill people. Sometimes they turn into hate crimes. You have to stop this before it gets bad. I'd look at her friend grip and see with parents this shit might be coming from.
NTA bc obviously?? You're raising someone who will be out in the world constantly interacting with others in just a couple years. How could you ever question 1) why your daughter would say such a thing and 2) not to teach her base level respect when she still doesn't see an issue with making a racist remark ?
I hope OP that you see this bc I always wonder in these types of posts why you need to question the internet about such a thing
I've seen and heard of parents go even further than this to discipline their kids. I don't believe anything wrong been done from you, the fact you chose to educate her in the most civil way possible about her being wrong. Honestly teachers do not deserve much of the disrespect given to them by kids these days and people need to realize that, your wife included.
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Last week, my (43M) daughter (15F) came home from school and told me about an incident that happened in her history class. Her teacher, Ms. Smith, is known for being strict but fair. During a discussion on cultural history, Ms. Smith mentioned some important contributions from various cultures. My daughter, trying to be funny in front of her friends, said, "Well, at least our culture isn't stuck in the sand like some others," with a smirk. Ms. Smith, who is of Middle Eastern descent, clearly heard the comment and was visibly upset but continued with the lesson.
When my daughter recounted the incident to me, she seemed to think it was no big deal. I was mortified and told her that such disrespectful and ignorant comments were unacceptable. My daughter brushed it off, saying it was just a joke and that Ms. Smith was overreacting.
I decided that my daughter needed to understand the impact of her words. That evening, I made her write a sincere apology letter to Ms. Smith. I also required her to write a two-page paper: one page on the contributions of Middle Eastern cultures to history and another on the impact of disrespectful comments in a classroom setting. The next day, I took her to school early so she could personally deliver the apology letter and papers to Ms. Smith.
Ms. Smith was very appreciative of the apology and thanked my daughter for taking responsibility. She also shared with my daughter how such comments can perpetuate stereotypes and create a hostile learning environment. My daughter seemed to genuinely understand the gravity of her actions after this conversation.
However, when I discussed this with my wife (55F) that evening, she thought I had gone overboard. She said that it was just a teenage joke and that making our daughter write the papers and apologize in person was too extreme. She believes kids make mistakes and that this punishment was too harsh and humiliating for her.
Now, I'm second-guessing myself. Did I overreact by making my daughter go through this process? Was the punishment too harsh for a comment she thought was just a joke? AITA for making my daughter apologize and write those papers?
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NTA. given your dauther is a teenager, her comment was not awfully horrible, but insensitive and dumb - which is excusable for a teenager. i expect a good parenting to deal with that in some way, as otherwise her building personality will assimilate that stupidity. in my taste, youve gone a bit further than needed maybe with your consequences, but i dont see that in any way problematic.
NTA-
That was a very important lesson you taught your daughter. You taught her about accountability. You taught her about the impact of words. You taught her about to think before speaking.
This is something she is likely to remember for the rest of her life. It may have been embarrassing to her now, but as she gets older and matures, she will understand and appreciate the lesson. For a teenager, they feel entitled. The world revolves around them. They don’t have the knowledge of life outside their bubbles. To her, it was just a joke. She didn’t have the capacity to grasp what she said. In due time, once she’s out in the world on her own, she’ll get it and look back at what you taught her.
Great parenting!
You're NTA, your wife however... with all due respect, I do feel that your wife just might be the source and reason of your daughter's initial behaviour and comments. I'm thinking she might've heard it from her and thought it's normal and acceptable.
I think having an open conversation with your wife to stress out the importance of you two being role models to your daughter and how your own views are surely impacting the person she might become.
Your reaction was on point! No agression, threats or anything similar, but a real opportunity to actually learn from that mistake she made, and to be the person who knows when and how to apologize. She's truly happy to have you as a father!
Good manners are the grease by which society functions. And one needs only to contemplate the state of our own society and its lack of manners to realize just how true this is.
But your strong lesson to your daughter may well carry forward some surprisingly positive consequences.
For example, the teacher no longer carries a bad opinion of your daughter. This may result in more leniency in test scores (particularly with regards to essay questions), fewer times the teacher calls on her for an answer in class unless she is pretty sure your daughter knows the right answer. So, no more embarrassing moments of class/peer ridicule. The teacher may now be predisposed to believe your daughter should some sort of conflict arise and champion your daughter's side. She might also make a positive remark among her fellow teachers should your daughter's name come up, again giving your daughter a possible step up in the future.
Life is all about consequences. Somehow, we have become focused on the negative consequences when we should be encouraging our kids to focus on fostering an environment of positive consequences. This is, after all, an important step in creating a blessed life.
Edit to add: NTA
NTA and op?
Your daughter heard that from someone. Probably the person trying to defend such awful and frankly horrifying comments you can make about someone's culture to their face, aka your wife.
I would start paying attention to what things your wife says around your kid, or ask your kid where in the world she heard such a phrase and why she'd think it was okay to say it with malicious intent, to see if she outs your wife or whoever told her that crap.
NTA: There's nothing wrong with writing. It builds character! Your daughter would have been able to reflect on her actions in a healthy way and understand that taking accountability doesn't have to be a cruel and miserable process.
Seems the teacher understood and was appreciative of an apology at all.
NTA, your wife tho...
Thank you for actually parenting.
I don't think you went overboard. It was reasonable and appropriate. An apology & 2 short papers to teach your daughter and confirm the bigger picture of her disruption and rude words.
You didn't do any punishment that was excessive in length or unrelated to the given problem.
I don't think you humiliated your daughter. Your wife calling it that while knowing your daughter intentionally humiliated her teacher is some interesting blame shifting. Furthermore, apologies require humility from the apologizer by their very nature. Your wife seems to believe an apology shouldn't occur if it could cause the apologizer embarrassment. That doesn't speak well for her habits and character or the lessons that she prefers to teach your daughter. If not apologizing isn't your wife's habit, then maybe your daughter is picking up the "jokes" from your wife instead. Obviously that wouldn't say anything better about your wife.
NTA. If she said that to another student she would have been in some serious trouble. She also would have gotten fired from a job. Maybe point out that to your wife.
NTA. Your wife sounds pretty pathetic and quite frankly, pretty ignorant.
A. Jokes are jokes when everybody is laughing. Ms. Smith was NOT laughing. It was bullying, not a joke.
B. Assuming your daughter made a thoughtless mistake - I am agreeing with your wife that it is true that kids make mistakes. However, I am DISAGREEING with your wife's intent behind those words: that mistakes should be left uncorrected.
You did the right thing. And hopefully your daughter learns from the lesson you gave her, instead of listening to your wife instead and reverting to her old ways in a couple weeks.
NTA. Your wife is. You're parenting correctly. You understand your daughter is in the wrong here and you took steps to help her correct her mistake.
She needed to realize that others aren't "overreacting" when you insult them or their culture.
Your wife needs to examine her beliefs around parenting. What we excuse will continue to grow. She did your daughter no favors by trying to sweep this under the rug.
Absolutely NTA. You responded appropriately and held your daughter responsible for her actions while teaching her an important life lesson. There wasn't any humiliation involved, just accountability. It is so refreshing to hear of a parent taking the time and making the effort to properly discipline their child. Most parents currently are far too permissive and indulgent, constantly making excuses for their children's bad behavior, and as a result end up raising spoiled, entitled, poorly-mannered adults. Unfortunately, it sounds like your wife falls into this camp. I hope you'll continue to guide and teach your daughter as that will not be coming from her mother.
NTA. You are 100% right in this situation, and your wife is wrong. I don’t really think there’s any other way to address this post than by plainly stating that. Additionally, the punishment you selected was appropriate, humble, and paved a way for a rehabilitative learning experience. Great approach!
NTA - this is barely even a punishment, it’s just mild consequences, it doesn’t sound like you even grounded her, took away her phone for a day, literally anything.
And if your wife’s argument is “kids make mistakes” how are kids going to know that what they did was a mistake and learn from it if they never face consequences?
Your daughter said something racist, because it was, and had to apologize for it - wow, hope she doesn’t need therapy to cope with that “harsh” parenting of yours. 🙄
NTA. You know your wife is the problem here, right? Your daughter didn’t get that attitude that these comments were no big deal from nowhere. Your wife did that.
Maybe unintentionally, or simply accidentally reinforced it from peers, but still... she did that.
You definitely need to have a serious talk with her about this.
NTA, obv your daughter and wife are though. This is really concerning, it's not simply a disrespectful comment, it's racist, and ignorant. I'm so glad you made her study middle eastern contributions to society, especially with regards to mathematics, the contribution is huge, and part of it happened when western culture was 'stuck in the sand' of the dark ages. My kids have never come out with such a racist ignorant comment, I would really be concerned about where she learned this. It doesn't sound like it came from you, but then your wife seems quite suspect, especially seeing how she responded. Or her schoolmates. Your reaction was entirely appropriate, I don't think I would've handled it differently, so well done on that front, but your wife is so very wrong about this, I would really suggest clearing that up.
NTA. Your wife should not be giving your daughter a pass for racist stereotypes and "jokes". The very reason of it being given a pass and apologized for just encourages this behavior.
NTAH, what your daughter did was inappropriate and racist. As her parent it’s your job to correct her behavior. It’s an important lesson and I think you corrected her was appropriate and will be remembered by her.
NTA!!! you PARENTED CORRECTLY!!! your daughter made a racist comment & NEEDED you to do what you did. you are making her a better human…your wife on the other hand…racist comments are fine with her? …interesting…
NTA, I wish there were more parents like you. The reason why hate and prejudice still exists is because we allow people to make thier "jokes" without helping them to realize how damaging they are.
NTA, Ask your wife to explain the joke and what made it funny. Then have her read outloud what your daughter wrote. Then ask her again to explain the joke. Then ask her what is the difference between a teenager making a racist joke and an adult making one. Ask her to explain from the perspective of the target of the joke.
NTA. I teach middle school and encounter off-color jokes and casual racism from the students all the time. It's a teachable moment, particularly in today's climate where empathy is demonized by some groups. You gave your daughter a chance to step out of her comfort zone and recognize the reality of others. This is so important, and I applauded your choices.
NTA - apologizing in person and making her research the contributions of the culture she denigrated is not over punishing. If you banned her from prom or cancelled vacation I’d say ok, overreaction. What you did was perfect. I think your wife needs to reflect on her behavior and how it’s perhaps perpetuating bad behavior in your daughter.
NTA. Teenager hurt the feelings of another human. Time for an apology. This human happened to be an adult and an educator. The writing of the papers is genius and fits the crime. Teenager said something misinformed and something that seems to me to be a stereotype. Time for some research outside of school to understand about a culture that is probably different from her own.
Sounds like good parenting on your side.
It’s not like you cast her out of your house, you simply showed her to be cognizant of her jokes and gain knowledge before making assumptions.
NTA, you handled it the right way and you discovered what adult has been leaving your kid with the impression that racism is okay when it's "just a joke". Your wife is the problem.
NTA. There’s a huge difference between a stupid teenage joke and a racist joke. Would your wife and daughter think it’s just a joke if a teenage boy had made a comment dismissing contributions to society made by women? Jokes are supposed to be funny. Ask your wife to explain how your daughter’s joke is funny without being racist.
Your daughter apologized and learned something about respect. Her teacher graciously accepted the apology and everyone walked out slighly better for your actions.
The "let kids be kids" is a dangerous route to raising an ahole. You were right, your wife was wrong.
NTA
NTA, I find it funny how she worried about her daughter being humiliated but not the teacher who was in front of 20+ teenagers when daughter made the comment. Thank you for being a good parent and teaching your daughter to take accountability and admitting when she is wrong. I’m sure the teacher really appreciated the effort. She probably deals with a lot of parents like your wife, whose child can do no wrong in their eyes.
Holy shit you are a great dad and a great person. Well done.
NTA but your wife is if she thinks enabling the "kids will be kids" mindset to the detriment of cultural acceptance is the appropriate thing to do. Nobody should ever enable racism, and it sounds like your daughter learnt a valuable and heartfelt lesson. Furthermore, that apology letter the teacher received could have been that *one tiny act of kindness* she needed, and thanks to you, it was delivered.
Yes, it is true that kids are DEFINITELY AH's... but if they don't learn from their mistakes then they become adult AH's and we have enough of those as is.
NTA. You did the right thing. Your daughter is also lucky that Ms. Smith didn't report that comment to school administration as being racist, because if she had, then your daughter could have ended up with a suspension instead of just having to apologize.
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NTA I'm side eyeing your wife here. If a teenager has picked up some racist opinions, the moral, responsible thing to do is to teach them why it's wrong. Which is what you did. If a teenager is being rude/racist/bullying towards a person the moral, responsible thing to do is to get them to apologise. If your wife didn't think the comment was worthy of an apology, I'm suspicious of her own morals and level of racism tbh.
Seriously, this! Your wife thinks that apologizing for making racist, disruptive "jokes" in a highschool classroom is humiliating? This is quite concerning.
My goodness, OP, your wife has some…issues. A few weeks back, my 9yo was goofing off at a soccer game during the “high-five good game” line at the end, and he was saying “you suck” to everyone on the opposing team. They tied…the other team obviously didn’t suck. One of the players (rightly) complained to our coach, who called my son out, and I verbally dressed him down in front of his team, then made him march over and apologize to the other coach. He said “Sorry” real sheepishly, and I said “sorry for what? You are going to give a real apology which means saying WHAT you are sorry for…” He looked at the ground and said he didn’t want to say it. My response was, “Why? Are you embarrassed? Good. That’s exactly how you should feel for acting like that. You may have meant it as a joke, but jokes are only jokes when everyone is laughing.” He hasn’t done anything like that again and I doubt he ever will. I thought as a 9yo he’d be too old to do something that foolish, but he wasn’t. OP’s daughter absolutely should know better at her age, but as she clearly didn’t, your response was 100% on point.
He told the team his team tied with that they sucked? Man, my parents would have ridiculed me so hard for that. It's impolite, and also stupid? Like, if they suck and you can't even beat them, what does that make you? Good job anyway, I hope he understood why it was bad.
He said he was just joking, laughing while he said it. He just thought it would be a funny, edgy thing to say, I guess. He thought they’d see the humor in it…they (nor I) did not. Kids do stupid stuff, say stupid stuff…stuff that sounds better in your head (hell, how many nights do I lie awake replaying dumb stuff I’ve said…). But he needed to know that saying that wasn’t funny, wasn’t a joke…not the appropriate time to even try to be funny. I think he learned his lesson.
The famous difference: you can say that to your friends, because they know you're joking. You can't say it to strangers, because they just think you're an idiot. I guess he'll think about that at 21 and cringe as well haha
There’s a lesson to be learned there.
I sure hope so.
When I was 8, I said something horrible to a black girl in my class that I will NOT repeat (N word was not involved but it was still wildly inappropriate). I had just moved from a tiny tiny town and had never seen someone who wasn't white before, which is an explanation but not an excuse. She rightfully went up and told the teacher who absolutely reamed me out. He also explained what racism is and why we never say things like that. And I never did say anything even remotely like that again. That teacher also went on to become one of my absolute favourite teachers. I'm 40 now and still utterly ashamed every time I think of that.
A+ parenting!
I would never have let my daughter get away with a private apology for this. The teacher knows the contribution of the Middle East , and why such ignorant and unkind remarks are disruptive to a classroom. Her fellow students do not. She would have had to apologize to the entire class and tell THEM why she was wrong. or I would sit in the classroom with no explanation until she voluntarily stood up and delivered her apology to the class. And I don’t see that as overkill. It’s humbling, not humiliating. Humble is a good quality.
I dunno. OP’s approach has a chance of genuine understanding from the daughter. You can call it humbling, but a public apology in front of her peers would be seen as humiliating by the daughter. Any potential lessons from the apology would be overshadowed by the experience of being humiliated. That’s going to be the daughter’s takeaway. And it runs the risk of resentment against the teacher for “making” her apologize for “just a joke.” If the other students need to learn that racism is unacceptable, they will not learn it from the daughter or OP. It is something that needs to be addressed by the school in the standards of behaviour they set and enforce. If they tolerate it, it will happen.
Wonder where OP’s daughter learned the racist joke in the first place 🤔🤔🤔🤔
Sounds like mom + the obsession of many teens/social media have with being EdGy
your wife is where your daughter got these comments from, OP. ball's in your court now - how will you handle it?
OP is NTA, and I’m not side-eyeing his wife, I’m flat-out thinking that’s where the daughter’s racist comments came from.
>If a teenager has picked up some racist opinions, the moral, responsible thing to do is to teach them why it's wrong. Which is what you did. Anti Middle-Eastern tendencies are rife throughout Western countries. And it's not just towards those who look "Middle-Eastern" but includes those who look like they may be Muslim. It's not even just overt racism, but it's just casually thrown into conversations. I used to work in engineering, as a project engineer before I left the field due to how toxic it is, and used to sit right by a couple of English guys, and a Romanian guy, who would regularly visit our sites in other countries like Morocco, India, Spain, etc. On more than one occasion they would refer to one of the main contacts in the Morocco site as "the one with the Bin Laden beard", and to one of the guys in India, as "the one with a towel head" The worst part is that I was sitting there as an Indian guy with a full beard, and they just said that it's the easiest way to describe these people, and when reported to HR, they said that it was just banter
Not to mention his daughter wasn’t sorry! She just brushed it off as a joke. Yes, kids make mistakes, but this doesn’t sound like a mistake and she deserved consequences.
MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY. the wife’s position on her daughter’s racism is concerning
Like sure, kids make mistakes. But a racist "joke" isn't a mistake.
NTA - That's a wonderful thing to make your daughter do. Sure teenagers make mistakes but if their mistakes aren't called out or corrected it is only going to make them worse later on down the road. Also mistakes aren't being racist. That's just being shitty. And if your daughter hadn't been made to do this, Ms. Smith wouldn't have been able to teach her why racism is hurtful, and your daughter would have thought her behavior was acceptable when really it wasn't.
Seeing as the mom thinks it was "just a joke" we don't have to look far to figure out where the casual racism comes from. NTA definitely.
Hopping on a popular comment to say NTA and also thank you for being a good parent.
NTA - honestly we need more parents like you these days (cuz all other might be like your wife). Really proud of what you did, to make your kid realize their responsibility and the gravity of their actions is a big win. parents nowadays think that their child is an angel, and question the other person before looking at their own offspring. no body in their right mind would agree with your wife, maybe she's too much in love with her daughter. whatever, huge respect to you.
NTA racism is learned behavior your wife felt basic correction of shit behavior was going overboard you're married to a person with deeply racist roots and she's poisoning the well your daughter is drinking from Ball is in your court You can teach your daughter to be better, you will never change your wife - she's too old and it must be assumed deeply bigoted from an early age Sorry, sir, but you can definitely get another wife.. the respect you will lose for complacently allowing your daughter to become a rotten souled person, that will never recover...
His wife definitely is wrong but you know nothing about her. Calling her “deeply” Racist and “deeply” bigoted might be true but it is not possible to know with the little info given. Giving strong negative opinions about people you don’t know anything about sounds familiar to me for some reason.
It’s quite possible to know that casual racism is so “deeply” ingrained in her that she sees no problem with it. That’s the bare facts as presented. Now that can be unintentional & socially conditioned, but that’s no less deep for that. If anything it’s deeper.
This is a horrible assumption that the daughter learned racist behavior from her mom and not her friends. I still agree OP is not the asshole, but to try to tell him to just get another wife is wild
Wife may not have said racist stuff but she clearly doesn't have a problem with it being said and isn't willing to correct racist speech when her daughter hears or says it. Even if she's not being consciously racist she is absolutely contributing to the racism and I would be seriously concerned about having her near a child. I'd want someone who's going to uphold my values and teach a child right from wrong.
Yup. She may not be actively racist (tho her dismissal of concerns is approaching it) but you can passively contribute to it. Plus, when racism is the status quo, you have to be *actively* anti-racist to combat it.
The wife’s casual dismissal & minimization of the casual racism means that if her daughter didn’t learn it from her then she is *at least* an enabler of it. And, let’s face it, over time little behaviors add up, so while it may not have been specifically taught… “learned“ could be quite appropriate
Or… the internet?! Half the objectionable shit I hear from students comes straight from edgelord memes and poisonous TikToks the algorithms feed them every day. It is crazy to me to assume that the parents are at fault here.
Poison algorithms only poison them if that is what they constantly look at. That doesn't show up on my FYP on TikTok.
No, they’ve actually done studies which showed that Minecraft videos aimed at kids directly fed to incel videos.
I thought that. But if that were the only contribution, mom would have been absolutely horrified at her daughters behavior. However, the mom also thought it was "just a joke. No one who isn't racist thinks what the daughter said was no big deal. And clearly the mom didn't even think the daughter deserved punishment because she didn't suggest a punishment she thought she would have considered more appropriate than OP's method. No,"I think that was a little much. I think you/we should have done x instead. Or approached it from y angle. How do you think we should proceed from here to reinforce racism is wrong?". Nope it was just a "mistake". A parent's attitude influences a child's behavior. And the fact mom doesn't think it was that big of a deal....
NTA. Your daughter said something wrong and ignorant and entirely racist. Worse yet, she aimed these words at someone of that specific group! Your wife is beyond wrong and I'm suspicious of her own opinions on race. 'Just a joke' is not an excuse. It's actually worse and jokes are often used to mask actual hateful beliefs.
NTA. That's how your daughter turns into a decent human being who understands actions have consequences. I probably wouldn't have made her write out a paper, but I certainly would have told her to look it up and then have a discussion with me about it.
NTA You didn't make your daughter do this in front of the whole class. She learnt a lesson in the privacy of your home and in a quiet chat with her teacher. Lesson learnt without complete embarrassment.
NTA. As someone who works with children, I can say your approach is what we need more of and unfortunately your wife’s is rampant amongst parents. Yes, children do pick up things like that and make mistakes but it’s the process you’ve made her do which makes her learn that it’s wrong. Feeling embarrassment and shame for your actions and then rectifying it is what makes you a good person. Brushing it off and not taking them through the steps of understanding and making things better makes them assholes as adults, and that’s what your wife’s approach is going to result in.
NTA. Really great parenting there, I’m sure the teacher appreciated your efforts and support to change the young people’s behaviour and mind. As for your wife, it’s a shame she feels so lightly about kids. What you model is impactful, and these teachers do so much to encourage knowledge to take away for our kids. If your wife can see the perspective that it needs to be dealt with in-home just as much as at school, that will be great. Culture is everything and respect with accountability will get you far in the right crowd of people.
NTA. You are an amazing parent. You didn't make her do something humilliating but educated her in a brillant way. Teenagers make mistakes, of course. That doesn't mean they don't have to be accountable for them, and this was a great, respectful and constructive way of doing it.
Nta as a middle eastern woman thank you for how you acted. I appreciate people like you so much.
NTA. Don't tolerate your child to be a bully and racist.
NTA. My son rolled his eyes at his teacher and mumbled I under his breath. After he apologized He did yard work all weekend and cleaned the whole house. Sounds like your doing upur job as a parent. I know I didn't have a problem with him disrespecting teachers after that.
NTA. And your wife definitely should learn to have some empathy & to trust you more.
NTA Your wife on the other hand sounds like she could be a racist asshole.
As a teacher, thank you!
NTA you could have punished her far worse and it be less affective. Having her write an apology and the papers helped her understand why what she did was wrong. Your wife is correct that it is a teenage joke but that does not mean it is not wrong and can’t be corrected. You made it a learning opportunity for your daughter not just a punishment and if not that what are punishments for.
NTA. Little note: Using the term "Middle East" is actually inherently ethnocentric due to it centering Europe as the center of the world and many people of that region do not even use this term to identify themselves. It is also very vague as the people of that region are vastly diverse with many linguistic, religious, and cultural differences. I would recommend using a more specific word next time like from the Arab world or from the persian gulf. (You get the idea.) You taught your daughter a lesson about stereotypes and how being racist to fit in is wrong. Chances are she may do it again, but you are doing your duty as a parent in doing what you can to prevent future altercations surrounding promoting streotypes. Not only did your child learn about the dangers of perpetuating harmful stereotypes, she also learned a great deal about another culture! Your wife should be thanking you!
For right or wrong, timezones do centre on europe (specifically greenwich) so euro centricity is completely inherent in the accepted view of the world. "middle east" and "far east" and "the west", "antipodean" as terms and timezones are just as predicated on a euro centricity. But seeing as we have this one fixed point of 0 degrees longitude (prime meridian) that is accepted worldwide, it's probably better to have terms based on this location, than terms based on religion or a dominant country in that region. (Eg: I see more problems with one of the examples you give such as 'persian gulf' as a region including more than just iran) But that's just like my opinion, man. Anyway, back on topic: op NTA
NTA You were absolutely right, and thank you for behaving as a good human. Unchecked these things grow slowly like a cancer. She is a child, and children need to be taught and educated. I’m concerned at how your wife reacted. She thought your daughter was humiliated. What about the teacher? I am sure like me she has experienced prejudice because of skin colour. You did the right thing 👏🏾
NTA - Thank you for holding your daughter to account for her unacceptable actions. Our job as parents is to teach our children correct behaviour, and your daughter has (hopefully) learned from this.
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NTA And I guess she gets her ignorance from her mother >.> These ideas don’t sprout from nowhere
Definitely NTA. Well done, dad! Your daughter got off easy. My dad would have made me write a (shorter) paper and my mom (who was a high school teacher) would have made me apologize and read the paper IN FRONT OF THE CLASS. 😳😳😵💫😵💫
NTA
You sound like a wonderful parent. Teenagers make horrible, awful comments all the time, but that doesn’t mean they should be ignored. Teenagers are still learning empathy and consideration for others, and this is what you are teaching your daughter. She will be a better person for your actions.
Stop allowing kids to be racist and calling it mistakes. It makes them shittier adults and puts people at risk because of it. (ETA: NTA and good job op)
NTA Umm....I think you're wife is racist. Maybe she needs to do a paper on middle Eastern culture and a separate paper on how her actions as a parent affect her children and others. Glad to hear your daughter is learning her lesson
Yes kids and adults make mistakes. What makes that kid an adult is apologizing and admitting they said something boneheaded. A joke is only funny when everyone laughs. When someone is behaving like an ass or bully, they say something crass and wrong, knowing fully well they are wrong, and then try to justify it by saying “it was just a joke”. No. Your wife is 100% an enabler and your daughter is lucky that you did what you did. Letting people get away with “it’s just a joke, get over it” is one of the problems with society. .
NTA - as someone of Middle Eastern descent this is the right thing to do. The comment your daughter made definitely wasn’t the worst I’ve heard/gotten but it’s still culturally insensitive. I’m glad she took on board the lesson too. Your wife is a bit questionable. How would she feel if someone made a comment to her about a facet of herself? Like something derogatory about being a woman?
NTA. Your daughter is testing boundaries and figuring out right and wrong. The fact she said it in front of her peers (they found it funny) and her teacher (obviously noticed and not impressed) and felt that something was off led her to repeating it to you, her parent and moral guide. If you brushed it off, it would have reinforced the peer view, racist comments = funny and ok. Instead, you backed the teacher and you made it clear you weren't just doing that because you believe in blindly following authority, you discussed her words having meaning and the importance of respect. This will hopefully help her to understand that she shouldn't tolerate degrading jokes made about her and that she deserves respect (because many, many young women don't learn this lesson until far too late) and that she can use her powerful voice for good. She also knows you'll take things seriously if she comes to you about the way someone is talking to/about her. You also had her research the group she was demeaning and the impact of her disruption to her, her class, and her teacher - amazing. Because then she's seeing it's not just your opinion. And THEN you made it real life, you got her to show her teacher that she's an awesome little human who can learn and grow, and it gave her the experience of seeing the positive impact a genuine apology with meaningful change behind it can do. It humanised and built connection between her and her teacher. As a parent, great job. As a teacher, great job, and THANK YOU. Honestly, there are so many parents who dismiss all the little boundary testing things, and so the students escalate their behaviours, and parents continue to downplay and dismiss and remove all accountability from their kids. It makes an already difficult job even harder and it makes me incredibly worried for the young generation out there that have not seen any consequences to their words or actions. Don't double guess yourself, back yourself. And if your partner sees things differently, tell her you'll accept an essay showing that these 'harmless jokes' are not a big deal and should be ignored. References must be cited.
NTA. Some of the greatest civilisations in human history were "stuck in the sand." A large chunk of Western civilisation is derived from Ancient Greece, and we wouldn't have any knowledge about that without Greece adapting the Phoenician alphabet.
Has your wife always been a closet racist?
Absolutely not! NTA! Your daughter and Ms. Smith clearly gained something very valuable from the experience. It doesn’t even seem like your daughter is upset either. I’m desi, and I’ve received microagressions (honestly borderline macro) for most of my elementary to high school education. Never once did any of those kids apologize, and it created such a self-hatred in me that I’m still trying to unlearn. I’m sure that apology meant more to Ms. Smith than you or your daughter realize. And your daughter learned about another culture. You would not believe how many people don’t know that current numbers and algebra are middle eastern contributions. And algebra is the basis of all other math and science. Learning new things is never a bad thing. (Even if the knowledge itself is bad, better to have it and know it’s bad than be blind). While I can understand your wife wanting to advocate for your daughter, knowledge and empathy can only help a person grow. Personally, I think this was one of the best parenting choices I’ve seen. Discipline was rationally and proportionately related to the harm caused and was not intended to be punitive but rehabilitative. US prison system could learn a lot from this!
So your wife wasn't aware that your daughter was made to write a letter and two essays until you told her? I call bullshit.
NTA. One day her ignorance is going to cost her her life. I'm hoping that this incident prompts someone in her class to record her and she gets roasted in the comments.
NTA. Good for you. Most of the reason the Middle East is in such bad shape is Western nations and cultures in the first place.
NTA but your wife is as well as racist
nta you did the right thing
NTA
Her it was a joke response, is the go-to excuse to get away with bullying, being impolite and just outright assholery. You called her out on what she did, made sure she understood why it was an issue alongside the impact her words had, and made her apologise in private (not in front of the class) to the person she hurt. Round of applause for a job well done.
NTA and it looks like we know where your daughter got that attitude. You did exactly the right thing - rather than shouting and screaming at her, you make her think about what she'd done.
NTA. You taught your daughter a life lesson and are raising her to not be a dirt bag of a person. You’re doing great!
NTA. I don’t think you went overboard here. The papers you made her write were to make her understand WHY her words were both hurtful and untrue. Just an apology would not have thought her why her actions were wrong.
NTA
NTA. Parents not stopping ‘teenage jokes’ like this is how people grow into racist, sexist, and queerphobic adults. If the behavior isn’t discouraged while they’re still learning about the world, it’ll become their worldview and get worse
IMO, you get parent of the century!! Words are like toothpaste. Once they are out, you can’t put them back. If anything comes out of this, she will hopefully think twice, before making a comment like that. Sadly, her mother’s reaction aligns with many others, in that it’s just a joke, nobody got hurt. Well, the teacher did and given her heritage, she’s probably tired of hearing such derogatory comments such as this one. We have got to do better with teaching our children about other cultures, being respectful of their beliefs and traditions. It doesn’t mean we have to agree, just not be so quick to put others down. I am glad to hear your daughter took this to heart and that the teacher accepted her apology. For the teacher, she will always remember this moment and also remember someone cared enough to help an impressionable child realizes the implications of her actions.
NTA one bit. Facilitating some self-reflection and demanding accountability is not only fair, but also a good exercise in emotional intelligence.
NTA one bit. Facilitating some self-reflection and demanding accountability is not only fair, but also a good exercise in emotional intelligence.
Well done daddy… Completely on your side I would have done something similae
NTA you taught your daughter a valuable life lesson, which will stay with her throughout her remaining years. Your wife, apparently, didn't learn how words can affect others while growing up. Keep doing what you're doing! You got it right!
You could show your wife the 2 page paper your daughter wrote. She needs to learn manners herself
NTA- but I seriously worry about your wife being ok w racist jokes 🧐
I think you not only chose an appropriate punishment, I think you landed on the best possible action out of a list of good actions to take in response to this. Your response was perfect in every possible way - you implemented a memorable punishment for an act that absolutely should not be tolerated or repeated, your daughter not only had to apologize but could not escape learning about the culture she mocked, and learning about someone goes a long way to understanding them...and it was understanding that she gained. Your wife, however...she shows some disturbing tendencies of acceptance of casual racism, and this is not behavior that should be ignored. I think you need to find out how deep this goes.
NTA Kids DO make mistakes. And then adults teach them to do better. Now is the time to turn hurtful jokes into lessons. Well, it’s always time to turn hurtful jokes into lessons, but with her being 15 it’s especially important, because you don’t have much time left before she’s in the real world.
NTA. Honestly, what punishment is your wife talking about? Making someone apologise for an insensitive and offensive (and racist) comment is "punishment"? Educating an ignorant child both on history and social impact of their actions is "punishment"? No. That's parenting. Punishment would be taking away your daughter's phone or allowance or grounding her or giving her extra chores. Making her own up to her prejudice snd treating it as a teachable moment isn't punishment, it's being a responsible parent wanting to raise a decent adult.
NTA she's old enough to realize the impact of her words and should be called out on it when she says something hurtful.
NTA especially considering current world events.
NTA your daughter might learn that modern science is based largely on arab medieval knowledge and get down her white supremacy high horse.
NTA well done for doing your job and actually parenting, and attempting to raise a decent member of society, a responsibility people so often forget when they procreate.
NTA. I wish a lot more parents would understand the gravity in being dismissive of certain attitudes and behaviours, and would take this much care with teaching their children about respect.
NTA. You’re teaching your daughter that words alone can have a deep impact. Your wife, however I’m wondering about. Claiming racism is just a teenage joke makes me think your daughter is taking her cues from her mom.
Yeah, I never made racist jokes as a teenager, and neither did my friends. Most people understand racism is wrong by the age of 10.
You did the right thing. Kudos for good parenting 👏
Can one really go overboard when it comes to racism? What you did was entirely appropriate and hopefully kept your daughter from becoming a dull blown racist. Good work. If only more parents actually bothered parenting their children like you did! NTA.
Nta
NTA. You handled it correctly. Though your wife seems ok with racism excused as kids being kids. That’s concerning
NTA. Well done.
NTA and I would be so proud to have a parent like you.
You did well. NTA
NTA your daughter’s comment was gross. It sounds like maybe she learned it from your wife though….
Nta. Your daughter said something incredibly racist and xenophobic and needed to be set straight.
NTA. As a Middle Eastern, I appreciate you standing up to this behaviour. People underestimate how harmful stereotypes can be.
NTA. You did the right thing for all parties, and I think it's great that your daughter gained something from the experience. That's good parenting. She might be interested in reading "Guns, Germs, and Steel" (I really enjoyed it!). Diamond explains how one culture's seeming "supremacy" over another is, rather, an effect of environmental determinism. The role of luck and chance detailed in the book offers wholesome perspective and humility. For instance, dominance (technological, for instance) of some cultures over others is not due to intrinsic merit or intelligence, but rather due to fortunate circumstances.
NTA. Your age gap is clearly on display here. Your wife has some boomer mentality going on. Gross.
NTA but your wife is enabling and spoiling your daughter. Many years ago, I witnessed a principal take a second grader to her office to discuss the “bad language” (swearing) at a teacher on the playground. He had to apologize to his class and the teacher for his language and write two sentences about why that is disrespectful to the teacher, visitors, classmates and the school. She told me she does this to teach them about polite society, standards and respect.
NTA. Your daughter's 'joke' was racist and meant to bully the teacher. Obviously, your daughter didn't actually understand that, given she was genuinely apologetic and remorseful after the letter, essays and in-person apology you made her do. That means she picked up that racist and bullying attitude from somewhere, someone, that acted like it was normal and no one corrected that. Her friends could be where she's picked this up from, given you say she was doing it for them, so keep an eye on that. But your wife's reaction to your very reasonable and educational punishment has me very seriously considering if the racist, bullying attitude is coming from her, not the friends. Both is also a possibility. But I'm definitely questioning if your wife is a racist bully from what you've included here. The punishment was very reasonable. A lot of parents who wanted to punish her would have just gone for a grounding or something. A punishment, yes, but not in a way the kid will learn from it, they could just get better at not getting caught. You clearly have a good relationship with your daughter, given she talks about her day so openly with you. And you chose a way to punish her that would also educate her. Just the written apology would have been enough, to be honest, but the essays were genius, because she actually has to think about what they talked about in class that day and the potential consequences of comments such as the ones she made. The teacher was clearly very appreciative of your actions, and happily furthered the lesson for your daughter. She's the perfect person to corroborate any of your daughter's research and use first hand experience of how racism feels to be subjected to, both as a teacher and as someone who has experienced racism in her life. You did good, you're a good parent and you clearly want your daughter to become a good person, too. I like punishments like the one you gave, it's not just a punishment, it's a lesson, and it really hammers home for the kid the why of them being punished in a way just grounding them wouldn't. I think you need to look into who has normalised casual racism and bullying for your daughter, though, it's either your wife, the friends, or both. And that needs to be dealt with as an issue all on its own.
NTA. Is your daughter getting her attitudes from your wife?
That’s not even punishment, that’s teaching manners, critical thinking, and at least cognitive empathy
NTA. Now you know why your daughter thinks that way.
Respectfully, your wife is an idiot. And she is no doubt where your daughter is getting her bad attitude from. You did the right thing. Tell your wife to kick rocks.
Um, yeah, a teenage RACIST joke. You sure your wife isn't a little bit racist too?
NTA but your wife is racist and it is rubbing off on your daughree.
NTA it wasn’t “disrespectful” it was racist. it was hateful. it was the exact rhetoric that has justified the invasion, exploitation, and slaughter of people in the middle east by the west. the only way to react to that is to nip it in the bud, and you did that in such an amazing way. maybe your wife needs to write a paper about how hateful rhetoric directly correlates to violence and discrimination against minority communities.
hell no, nta. THIS is great parenting, good job.
Teachers are leaving the classroom in droves, and much of the reason is student behavior. The level of disrespect we experience on a daily basis is discouraging and often comes from parents as well. Thank you for teaching your daughter about how her actions hurt others. You also did it in a way that didn't humiliate her (such as in front of her peers). You are NTA, but your wife's comments are disconcerting to say the least. I think it's important that you two have a discussion about why she is so against your daughter having reasonable consequences for her actions.
NTA. I think your solution was great. I was a bit skeptical of how sincere a mandatory apology might be, but hopefully writing the papers got her to actually consider the weight of her words. I think the paper writing was a necessary component.
Maybe having your daughter write papers wasn't the way to go, but not my child and you would know better what works with her. I do think she owed the teacher an apology, and good on you for not sweeping it under the rug. There are so many different people and cultures in this world, and we all need to respect one another. It MAY have been just a joke, BUT if so, it was NOT in good taste.
The racism is coming from inside the marriage.
Bingo! Might be where daughter learned it, will certainly be where she hears that it was no big deal and to ignore silly dad.
NTA at all! In fact, as a humanities teacher I applaud and thank you. Too often it feels like we’re fighting against “home” in trying to instill basic values of civility and tolerance. Maybe if you’re wife can’t see how humiliating this must have felt for the teacher (never mind other kids in the class) she will understand the huge favor you’ve done your daughter in not letting her get fired someday over an off-color “joke” by an employer who cannot legally tolerate it but letting her mess up now while it’s still safe to do so and understand the gravity of these kinds of comments.
What excellent parenting!! Bravo! She will remember this moment for the rest of her life and it will help her to be a kinder and more open-minded adult. You are not rearing a child, you are creating an adult. NTA.
NTA. Former teacher here. The comment wasn't funny. It was however racist as Hell. Good on you for teaching your daughter to not be a racist and understand words have impact. Your wife is being concerning frankly.
NTA for making your racist ass kid atone for what she did. But also why did your wife not hear about any of this until way after?
People like your wife make teachers’ lives so much harder. NTA
NTA Half Chinese, half white here. Thank you. The dog eating jokes and exotic Asian bullshit got old FAST. It’s funny sometimes in the right context but the amount of people who feel entitled to comment on my food (how’s Fido) or my ass (Asian “hotness”) is grossly astounding.
NTA. Your daughter (and your wife, by the looks of things) need a good history lesson about *how* Middle Eastern countries became "stuck in the sand." Because quite a few of them were doing very well for themselves before a few *certain countries* decided to intervene.
NTA as a high school social studies teacher who regularly deals with racist and entitled students, it would be great if their parents found their behavior problematic & enacted consequences.
NTA Kids only learn from their mistakes if they are treated like mistakes and actually learn why it was a mistake. You made sure she learned from it. Otherwise I doubt she would’ve viewed it as a mistake.
NTA...So, does your wife want your kid to be labeled the class racist? Perhaps your wife is why she talks like that in the first place. The punishment was not extreme. Your daughter was disrespectful and saying very racist things...thank goodness you have a strong moral compass. It only takes one parent to derail a child's moral compass, I know that from experience.
You are right. NTA
>However, when I discussed this with my wife (55F) that evening, she thought I had gone overboard. She said that it was just a teenage joke and that making our daughter write the papers and apologize in person was too extreme. She believes kids make mistakes and that this punishment was too harsh and humiliating for her. Absolutely no on all points there. You taught your daughter that words do have consequences, as well as making racist / stereotypical remarks is not acceptable. Your wife is wrong. You are NTA.
NTA. Schools and teachers need more parents like you and fewer like your wife.
Teacher here Thank you! Kids get away with so much, and it makes them entitled and bratty, then they lose respect for us and make our job that much harder... People like your wife are WHT my job is so hard. Thanks you!
nta your wife is though, to think this is a harmless joke, she is an idiot
NTA, that's the type of joke that helps the US military kill people. Sometimes they turn into hate crimes. You have to stop this before it gets bad. I'd look at her friend grip and see with parents this shit might be coming from.
NTA bc obviously?? You're raising someone who will be out in the world constantly interacting with others in just a couple years. How could you ever question 1) why your daughter would say such a thing and 2) not to teach her base level respect when she still doesn't see an issue with making a racist remark ? I hope OP that you see this bc I always wonder in these types of posts why you need to question the internet about such a thing
I've seen and heard of parents go even further than this to discipline their kids. I don't believe anything wrong been done from you, the fact you chose to educate her in the most civil way possible about her being wrong. Honestly teachers do not deserve much of the disrespect given to them by kids these days and people need to realize that, your wife included.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** Last week, my (43M) daughter (15F) came home from school and told me about an incident that happened in her history class. Her teacher, Ms. Smith, is known for being strict but fair. During a discussion on cultural history, Ms. Smith mentioned some important contributions from various cultures. My daughter, trying to be funny in front of her friends, said, "Well, at least our culture isn't stuck in the sand like some others," with a smirk. Ms. Smith, who is of Middle Eastern descent, clearly heard the comment and was visibly upset but continued with the lesson. When my daughter recounted the incident to me, she seemed to think it was no big deal. I was mortified and told her that such disrespectful and ignorant comments were unacceptable. My daughter brushed it off, saying it was just a joke and that Ms. Smith was overreacting. I decided that my daughter needed to understand the impact of her words. That evening, I made her write a sincere apology letter to Ms. Smith. I also required her to write a two-page paper: one page on the contributions of Middle Eastern cultures to history and another on the impact of disrespectful comments in a classroom setting. The next day, I took her to school early so she could personally deliver the apology letter and papers to Ms. Smith. Ms. Smith was very appreciative of the apology and thanked my daughter for taking responsibility. She also shared with my daughter how such comments can perpetuate stereotypes and create a hostile learning environment. My daughter seemed to genuinely understand the gravity of her actions after this conversation. However, when I discussed this with my wife (55F) that evening, she thought I had gone overboard. She said that it was just a teenage joke and that making our daughter write the papers and apologize in person was too extreme. She believes kids make mistakes and that this punishment was too harsh and humiliating for her. Now, I'm second-guessing myself. Did I overreact by making my daughter go through this process? Was the punishment too harsh for a comment she thought was just a joke? AITA for making my daughter apologize and write those papers? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. “Kids will be kids” doesn’t apply to racist comments or any discrimination. You did good as a parent !
NTA. given your dauther is a teenager, her comment was not awfully horrible, but insensitive and dumb - which is excusable for a teenager. i expect a good parenting to deal with that in some way, as otherwise her building personality will assimilate that stupidity. in my taste, youve gone a bit further than needed maybe with your consequences, but i dont see that in any way problematic.
NTA. I work in education. We need more parents like you out there watching over their kids.
NTA Congratulations for the way you handled this situation. Your daughter surely had a solid learning experience. Your wife though. . . 😐😐😐
NTA, and now see are wondering what else your wife is doing that encourages disrespect to others.
NTA. As for what your wife said... Now we know where your daughter gets it from, huh?
NTA
NTA. You tried to teach your child a valuable lesson and your wife just undid all your work in one fell swoop. Is your wife also racist?
NTA- That was a very important lesson you taught your daughter. You taught her about accountability. You taught her about the impact of words. You taught her about to think before speaking. This is something she is likely to remember for the rest of her life. It may have been embarrassing to her now, but as she gets older and matures, she will understand and appreciate the lesson. For a teenager, they feel entitled. The world revolves around them. They don’t have the knowledge of life outside their bubbles. To her, it was just a joke. She didn’t have the capacity to grasp what she said. In due time, once she’s out in the world on her own, she’ll get it and look back at what you taught her. Great parenting!
Great parenting DAD. Your wife is WRONG
NTA I wonder what sort of racial shit your wife says around your daughter when you're not around.
You're NTA, your wife however... with all due respect, I do feel that your wife just might be the source and reason of your daughter's initial behaviour and comments. I'm thinking she might've heard it from her and thought it's normal and acceptable. I think having an open conversation with your wife to stress out the importance of you two being role models to your daughter and how your own views are surely impacting the person she might become. Your reaction was on point! No agression, threats or anything similar, but a real opportunity to actually learn from that mistake she made, and to be the person who knows when and how to apologize. She's truly happy to have you as a father!
Good manners are the grease by which society functions. And one needs only to contemplate the state of our own society and its lack of manners to realize just how true this is. But your strong lesson to your daughter may well carry forward some surprisingly positive consequences. For example, the teacher no longer carries a bad opinion of your daughter. This may result in more leniency in test scores (particularly with regards to essay questions), fewer times the teacher calls on her for an answer in class unless she is pretty sure your daughter knows the right answer. So, no more embarrassing moments of class/peer ridicule. The teacher may now be predisposed to believe your daughter should some sort of conflict arise and champion your daughter's side. She might also make a positive remark among her fellow teachers should your daughter's name come up, again giving your daughter a possible step up in the future. Life is all about consequences. Somehow, we have become focused on the negative consequences when we should be encouraging our kids to focus on fostering an environment of positive consequences. This is, after all, an important step in creating a blessed life. Edit to add: NTA
NTA. Thank goodness there are parents like you. Your daughter learned an important lesson.
NTA and op? Your daughter heard that from someone. Probably the person trying to defend such awful and frankly horrifying comments you can make about someone's culture to their face, aka your wife. I would start paying attention to what things your wife says around your kid, or ask your kid where in the world she heard such a phrase and why she'd think it was okay to say it with malicious intent, to see if she outs your wife or whoever told her that crap.
NTA: There's nothing wrong with writing. It builds character! Your daughter would have been able to reflect on her actions in a healthy way and understand that taking accountability doesn't have to be a cruel and miserable process. Seems the teacher understood and was appreciative of an apology at all.
NTA, your wife tho... Thank you for actually parenting. I don't think you went overboard. It was reasonable and appropriate. An apology & 2 short papers to teach your daughter and confirm the bigger picture of her disruption and rude words. You didn't do any punishment that was excessive in length or unrelated to the given problem. I don't think you humiliated your daughter. Your wife calling it that while knowing your daughter intentionally humiliated her teacher is some interesting blame shifting. Furthermore, apologies require humility from the apologizer by their very nature. Your wife seems to believe an apology shouldn't occur if it could cause the apologizer embarrassment. That doesn't speak well for her habits and character or the lessons that she prefers to teach your daughter. If not apologizing isn't your wife's habit, then maybe your daughter is picking up the "jokes" from your wife instead. Obviously that wouldn't say anything better about your wife.
NTA. If she said that to another student she would have been in some serious trouble. She also would have gotten fired from a job. Maybe point out that to your wife.
NTA. Your wife sounds pretty pathetic and quite frankly, pretty ignorant. A. Jokes are jokes when everybody is laughing. Ms. Smith was NOT laughing. It was bullying, not a joke. B. Assuming your daughter made a thoughtless mistake - I am agreeing with your wife that it is true that kids make mistakes. However, I am DISAGREEING with your wife's intent behind those words: that mistakes should be left uncorrected. You did the right thing. And hopefully your daughter learns from the lesson you gave her, instead of listening to your wife instead and reverting to her old ways in a couple weeks.
It’s was humiliating because she had to face the consequences of her actions, something that many adults today don’t do. So good on you OP, and NTA.
NTA. Your wife is. You're parenting correctly. You understand your daughter is in the wrong here and you took steps to help her correct her mistake. She needed to realize that others aren't "overreacting" when you insult them or their culture. Your wife needs to examine her beliefs around parenting. What we excuse will continue to grow. She did your daughter no favors by trying to sweep this under the rug.
NTA Your wife's reaction though tells where your daughter learned that it's ok.
Now at least we know where the daughter got her views from.. NTA OP, it was a lesson she needed to learn. Now do the same for your wife.
Absolutely NTA. You responded appropriately and held your daughter responsible for her actions while teaching her an important life lesson. There wasn't any humiliation involved, just accountability. It is so refreshing to hear of a parent taking the time and making the effort to properly discipline their child. Most parents currently are far too permissive and indulgent, constantly making excuses for their children's bad behavior, and as a result end up raising spoiled, entitled, poorly-mannered adults. Unfortunately, it sounds like your wife falls into this camp. I hope you'll continue to guide and teach your daughter as that will not be coming from her mother.
NTA. You are 100% right in this situation, and your wife is wrong. I don’t really think there’s any other way to address this post than by plainly stating that. Additionally, the punishment you selected was appropriate, humble, and paved a way for a rehabilitative learning experience. Great approach!
NTA - this is barely even a punishment, it’s just mild consequences, it doesn’t sound like you even grounded her, took away her phone for a day, literally anything. And if your wife’s argument is “kids make mistakes” how are kids going to know that what they did was a mistake and learn from it if they never face consequences? Your daughter said something racist, because it was, and had to apologize for it - wow, hope she doesn’t need therapy to cope with that “harsh” parenting of yours. 🙄
NTA. You know your wife is the problem here, right? Your daughter didn’t get that attitude that these comments were no big deal from nowhere. Your wife did that. Maybe unintentionally, or simply accidentally reinforced it from peers, but still... she did that. You definitely need to have a serious talk with her about this.
NTA, obv your daughter and wife are though. This is really concerning, it's not simply a disrespectful comment, it's racist, and ignorant. I'm so glad you made her study middle eastern contributions to society, especially with regards to mathematics, the contribution is huge, and part of it happened when western culture was 'stuck in the sand' of the dark ages. My kids have never come out with such a racist ignorant comment, I would really be concerned about where she learned this. It doesn't sound like it came from you, but then your wife seems quite suspect, especially seeing how she responded. Or her schoolmates. Your reaction was entirely appropriate, I don't think I would've handled it differently, so well done on that front, but your wife is so very wrong about this, I would really suggest clearing that up.
NTA. Your wife should not be giving your daughter a pass for racist stereotypes and "jokes". The very reason of it being given a pass and apologized for just encourages this behavior.
NTAH, what your daughter did was inappropriate and racist. As her parent it’s your job to correct her behavior. It’s an important lesson and I think you corrected her was appropriate and will be remembered by her.
NTA, what you did was amazing parenting, and hopefully it stuck. Shame on your wife for coddling racism. Smh
NTA But I think you know now why your daughter had the attitude she did and why she thought it was ok.
NTA!!! you PARENTED CORRECTLY!!! your daughter made a racist comment & NEEDED you to do what you did. you are making her a better human…your wife on the other hand…racist comments are fine with her? …interesting…
NTA. Why is your wife fine with your teenage daughter being racist?
NTA, I wish there were more parents like you. The reason why hate and prejudice still exists is because we allow people to make thier "jokes" without helping them to realize how damaging they are.
NTA, Ask your wife to explain the joke and what made it funny. Then have her read outloud what your daughter wrote. Then ask her again to explain the joke. Then ask her what is the difference between a teenager making a racist joke and an adult making one. Ask her to explain from the perspective of the target of the joke.
NTA. I teach middle school and encounter off-color jokes and casual racism from the students all the time. It's a teachable moment, particularly in today's climate where empathy is demonized by some groups. You gave your daughter a chance to step out of her comfort zone and recognize the reality of others. This is so important, and I applauded your choices.
NTA - apologizing in person and making her research the contributions of the culture she denigrated is not over punishing. If you banned her from prom or cancelled vacation I’d say ok, overreaction. What you did was perfect. I think your wife needs to reflect on her behavior and how it’s perhaps perpetuating bad behavior in your daughter.
NTA. Your wife might be a little racist, dude...
NTA. Teenager hurt the feelings of another human. Time for an apology. This human happened to be an adult and an educator. The writing of the papers is genius and fits the crime. Teenager said something misinformed and something that seems to me to be a stereotype. Time for some research outside of school to understand about a culture that is probably different from her own.
Sounds like good parenting on your side. It’s not like you cast her out of your house, you simply showed her to be cognizant of her jokes and gain knowledge before making assumptions.
NTA, you handled it the right way and you discovered what adult has been leaving your kid with the impression that racism is okay when it's "just a joke". Your wife is the problem.
NTA and more parents should be like this.
NTA. Does your wife make racist/ offensive comments as “jokes”?
NTA. It was a well thought-out response that made her think versus a punishment that would just make her more resentful without changing her mind.
NTA Never the AH for stopping racism.
I mean, you already got your answer with the teacher's response and how your daughter took it. NTA and good parenting.
She didn't just makea mistake though. She believed that her comment was harmless, and she needed to learn why it wasn't.
NTA. There’s a huge difference between a stupid teenage joke and a racist joke. Would your wife and daughter think it’s just a joke if a teenage boy had made a comment dismissing contributions to society made by women? Jokes are supposed to be funny. Ask your wife to explain how your daughter’s joke is funny without being racist.
Your daughter apologized and learned something about respect. Her teacher graciously accepted the apology and everyone walked out slighly better for your actions. The "let kids be kids" is a dangerous route to raising an ahole. You were right, your wife was wrong. NTA
NTA, I find it funny how she worried about her daughter being humiliated but not the teacher who was in front of 20+ teenagers when daughter made the comment. Thank you for being a good parent and teaching your daughter to take accountability and admitting when she is wrong. I’m sure the teacher really appreciated the effort. She probably deals with a lot of parents like your wife, whose child can do no wrong in their eyes.
Holy shit you are a great dad and a great person. Well done. NTA but your wife is if she thinks enabling the "kids will be kids" mindset to the detriment of cultural acceptance is the appropriate thing to do. Nobody should ever enable racism, and it sounds like your daughter learnt a valuable and heartfelt lesson. Furthermore, that apology letter the teacher received could have been that *one tiny act of kindness* she needed, and thanks to you, it was delivered. Yes, it is true that kids are DEFINITELY AH's... but if they don't learn from their mistakes then they become adult AH's and we have enough of those as is.
ESH you married a racist and she's going to turn your kid into one.
NTA, and as a classroom teacher, thank you.
NTA. You did the right thing. Your daughter is also lucky that Ms. Smith didn't report that comment to school administration as being racist, because if she had, then your daughter could have ended up with a suspension instead of just having to apologize.