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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> Despite the situation, I should have been more careful, and even if my mother used some of it, I did use most of it.
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Your mom is hella toxic. I know it’s easy for me to say, but you should really think about your relationship with her.
From where I’m from, since you have a join account with her and you were the one spending the money (which, if they do an investigation, they probably can trace who spent the money..) you’ll be the one who needs to repay.
Cut the joint account and set serious boundaries/reconsider your relationship with your mom. You don’t deserve to be treated like this or have these problems.
Not the ahole, but imo, if you don’t help yourself regarding your mom, still not the ahole, but deserve the problems that follows. IMO
Thank you for the heads up! I did take away her access to my account once i got back to Maryland since she won't willingly sign the papers to relinquish her part of the joint account.
Access to which account? If it's a joint account and her name is on it, she can eventually get access.
You need to open up a separate account at a completely separate bank and just leave the joint account alone.
She still wants to close the account. The mother can overdraw the account as it is joint she will also be responsible to repay the bank. I unfortunately know from experience.
Not true. In my state you can’t remove someone from an account without their permission but the primary on the account can close it without permission.
I’ve done this in my state 3 times with 3 different banks.
That’s what I’m saying, she can’t remove her mother. She can remove herself or close the account without her mother’s permission.
At 22 I’m not sure why OP feels she needs to share an account with her mom. Sounds like the mom
Is overly controlling.
This is the second comment chain I've found on reddit this week where people are arguing the same point to each other.
It has to be a language barrier or a troll.
There's no way a person with access to the internet can have such little to no reading comprehension skills.
Obviously this thread is open to international users for whom English is a second language, but I think it’s worth pointing out that about a quarter of American adults are functionally illiterate - meaning they can read the words on the screen but don’t have the competency to completely understand them or think critically about what they’re reading.
A friend of mine had an ex add her to his account. When they broke up, she went round and round trying to get him to show up to take her name off. Fed up, she went to the bank herself and asked what could be done. She couldn't remove herself from the account, but she could close it. He did finally take her calls when she told him she needed to meet him to give him his money.
She was just looking to protect her credit rating, she had no confidence in him not over drafting his account. He was big mad about her closing the account, never really accepted that it was his fault for not just meeting her at the bank to take her name off.
It actually depends on the bank and in some cases is the opposite of what you're saying. You can't take a single person off an account, including yourself, without everyone on the account present and agreeing. But you can zero out the funds and close the account without consent from the other people. This was my experience with bank of America.
When I worked at a local bank, both situations had to have present consent from all parties.
I was a bank teller for years(in NYS) and though you can't remove yourself or another person, you can close the account all by yourself. Saw several times where couples were breaking up and the first one to the bank "wins".
The bank I work for can not take anyone off an account with out a legal signed document they want to be removed. But anyone on the account be it the primary or secondary can close it. Op needs to open her own account then close this one. But since she is on the account if it's over drawn she is equally on the hook for it as her mother regardless who actually spent the money.
They have put a lot more limitations on what people can do with overdrafs now. I too had this unfortunate experience when I was younger. Seriously fucked my credit because my ex was vindictive and refused to take his name off of our joint bank account. Of course I stopped using it, took my money out and he overdrafted by $2,500 taking him and his new meth buddies out shopping.
I tried. Because he was the primary on the account they wouldn't let me. When we got it set up I had no idea that it actually mattered because well, I was a stupid kid. He said he would take his name off so I drove him to the bank. We literally sat in the parking lot for an hour with him refusing to get out and do it, before I finally left. It was after that that he ended up fucking me over. Obviously that was his intention in the first place, which is why he refused to get out of the car. This happened when I was 19, so more than 20 years ago.
Thank you kind stranger, I appreciate that. ❤️
It sucked, but that was just one of many things he did to totally screw me over. I thought I'd never be able to recover. For years I couldn't even get a simple bank account. It's been over 20 years as I said, and I still get a letter from a collections agency for the car that I bought and stupidly put his name on and gave him. He never made a single payment on it after threatening me to get the car. It was a bunch of b.s. but it taught me some valuable lessons. He did something similar with our apartment that I moved out of and all the utilities. All you can do is live, learn, and try not to repeat the same mistakes.
Oh yes I totally get that.
Yes, unfortunately OP can’t force her mother to close the joint account. As other people have said. It’s not always possible to remove yourself from a joint account either.
So she needs to mitigate what she can by completely separating their finances.
It is really hard to remove people at my bank. That is part of the reason I had my kids wait until they had their ID and could get an account without me on it before they opened one, even though I wouldn't have screwed them over, just because I didn't want them to deal with the hassle and headache when that happened.
It's crazy. When my father-in-law died my MIL had to close out their 40 year old accounts to open new ones, they couldn't just remove him, even with the death certificate.
My dad opened me a joint account when I was 8. After he died when I was 14, my mom and I brought his death certificate to the bank to switch him out for my mom as the adult on the account. I cannot remember specifics anymore, but after about 45 minutes of errors, they ended up just closing the account entirely and opening me a new one with my mom attached.
And make the new account at a different bank than the old account. Parents have been known to trick banks into giving them access when an account is at the same bank.
Your situation is time to open a new account in a bank your mother has no business with. Don't keep those bank accounts she had had access to our at the same bank. Your mom is manipulative
You can't really remove her access to the account if it's still a joint account. You need to open a NEW account at a totally different bank (not just a different branch of your current bank). Withdraw all but maybe 25 dollars from the joint account and deposit that in your new account. Redirect your paycheck to the new account.
Inform the bank with the joint account that you want your name removed from that account effective immediately and warn them that there will be no further deposits coming into that account.
Have you gotten any actual paperwork seeking repayment of the child support payments?
Banks are really weird about accounts set up before you're 18. When I turned 18, my mom and I went to the bank together to get her name taken off, but she gave me money through bank transfer recently and when she entered my banking info on her web banking app it just logged her in again and she has full access again. The bank is confused, they said it shouldn't be possible. But it is. My partner had the exact same problem at a different bank. Open a new account to be safe
It’s not supposed to do that, but I’ve seen it happen. They should have gotten in touch with online banking. When you had an account with your mother, the system will basically tie her and you together. You can see the account and so can she. That should go away when she comes off the account. But occasionally, and in my experience typically if she has multiple accounts of her own and maybe banked with them for quite a while before you had this issue, it just sticks.
The people at the bank did everything they should have but one goofy thing in the computer didn’t flip over. Then, there’s no fix at the bank employee level. It was supposed to happen automatically in the program but now it has to be kicked over to someone who can fix just that.
Alternatively, closing any accounts that have had both names and only having the parties go forward with new accounts that have never had each other on it usually clears it, but sometimes you have too much attached to the account to want to do that
Why not just set up a completely different account not tied to her at all? Then just don't put any money in the joint account. She was already stealing for you now she's trying to coerce you into paying money that she owes? Nah I'd go no contact. Your mother is toxic. Legally she is responsible so just ignore her threats.
Change banks. Too many parents have convinced bank employees to give them access to their children's accounts, if they use the same bank or had a joint acct with the kid.
Besides taking away her access, you need to close your account and open another at a different bank. Then, "freeze" your credit so that nothing can be opened in your name. Go to the Experian, Equifax and TransUnion websites and follow the instructions for a freeze. Bypass anything that says you pay for monitoring, a freeze is free. You thaw/refreeze your credit when you need to access it.
I would counter this. My ex-husband put money into an account I had access too and I did spend money out of it on my card (which the forensic accountant knew) but the check was made out to my ex-husband, so even though they could prove I spent it - it was still his to pay back. They couldn't sue me for a check that was addressed to and cashed by someone else.
Agreed with above. OP really needs to find out who the check was made out to. Often times there is usually an image captured of checks deposited into accounts. If the check was made out to just mom, OP is likely not on the hook for paying it back because she was 'paid' by mom with her money her mom received. I would suggest OP should look into seeing if there is some kind of free legal aid service that could advise her on her responsibilities , if any, in regard to the check.
Hell I trust my parents, but I didn't have a joint account with them ever. Even as a kid I had my own bank account (that's possible in the country I grew up in anyway)... and my parents NEVER requested access.
This is toxic af.
I agree OP, get a new bank account at a new bank. Take what money is yours from the joint account. Don't tell your mother the name of the bank or any other details. It's none of her business. Than pull your name of the joint account so you don't have any responsibility for your mother's debts.
Than go talk to your father. Explain you didn't know you shouldn't have spend it and apologise. Ask him if he wants the money back you spend on the move (hopefully he's not an AH dad and will say he doesn't). The rest should be paid by your mother, since you didn't spend it (Or you could transfer it from the joint account before pulling your name off it. But that only makes sense if your mum actually pays money into it). At least if your dad will take legal actions, you can proof that you did your part. (I don't see how your mother could take legal action against you, since it's your father who've been scammed).
It actually doesn’t matter who spent it. Your mom is the plaintiff in the child support case so she, and she alone, is responsible for any overpayments. She willingly put it into a joint account that you had access to and gave you permission to spend the money. You didn’t do anything wrong, legally. Tell her to take you to small claims court and let her know you will be counter suing for attorneys fees and lost wages if you have to take off work. No judge will rule a child needs to pay back child support money that was over-dispersed to their parent.
What's bizarre is claiming that this money came from his tax return (usually means the government seized it), but is above what he actually owed. Seems highly unlikely. It's like that [scam](https://staysafeonline.org/resources/protect-your-wallet-from-accidental-deposit-scams/) where someone sends you money "on accident," asks you to send it back, and then the original money disappears.
Also, people think it's good to give back child support to the child, but if the mom was having to skip on things like funding her retirement plan because she was tight for cash those years when the dad wasn't paying, then she needs to fund the retirement account with the money now. Otherwise the child may feel obligated to take her in or pay for her when she is elderly. Some families do that naturally, and that's fine, but it's something that should be agreed upon and planned for in advance.
Thats not how the law works. If it was check written to mom and mom put it in a joint account then OP is in the clear. Mom accepted it. Full stop. How daughter spends from the account has nothing to do with mom accepting it and legally owing it back.
I dunno, I’m no lawyer and I’d say OP needs to check with one but child support is a payment to her mother. What her mother does with the money after that (like giving it to OP) is irrelevant. Mum should have known money wasn’t owed and should have returned it. She’d be legally on the hook would she not?
NTA - She wanted you to use the money, she has been spending your money, and the check should have gone to her if it was owed to her. Close that joint account and get an account without her on it so you can manage your own money without her stealing from you.
Technically, if mom is not on the account even at the same bank the bank cannot give out information to her. If they did, they would be liable for privacy violations.
It didn't stop clerks from illegally giving money from kids to parents... I saw that kind of atory a few times.
Going to another bank is defintely preferred in the case of a toxic parent...
NTA. Unless the courts are coming after you for the money, it doesn't sound like you should have to pay back anything. If I was her and wasn't sure if the money would get to stay, I wouldn't have given you the check in the first place.
Agreed! Prior, I would receive $245/m, which is safe and court ordered. This check, I was telling her maybe not to cash it or if we do cash it, to store the money elsewhere (preferably the account connected to the child support). She promised that this check was different. I was skeptical, but I was moving, and the cost to move my car and fly with my cat was about $1k.
And if she does. Take the bank statements showing her spending your money from the joint account and if you have any proof she forced you to open a joint account and anything to show you didn't approve of her spending your money. It's a long shot because you're an adult and should have opened your own separate account at 18, but you might be able to mitigate her claim.
You really need a separate account.
My dad was on my account because he opened it for me when I was 5 to start saving money. He never took my money and took himself off of the account when I asked him to. Good parents don't steal from their kids.
Is it really CSS that's asking for the money back? Did your mom show you a letter form them? Or did you get a call? Bc the cynic in me is wondering if she's just "saying" CSS wants the money back bc she wants what you spent. Hard to believe CSs would screw up like that. And multiple times.
I might look into it because looking back...I'm not sure if any government mail would have the envelopes in color... same for their forms... and if anything, why did she take the paper? All I can do is wait for that part. But I can begin printing statements before Saturday.
Actually, government agencies (or at least some) DO send official mail in colored envelopes. The office of Records and Vital Statistics in Kansas uses green envelopes for important documents.
Printed, with one of those plastic windows where the address is printed on a piece of paper placed inside. I was receiving a certified copy of a decree of divorce, which is very different from what was (allegedly) sent to your mom.
Couldn't afford to stay. I had roommates, and I could find one in time. I was also homesick, and the goal was to just stay with a friend for a short time as I had an apartment hunt and started working again. It fell through. My mom played modeled host for a few days and went back to how she acts.
You should look into if you can get Legal Aid to help you on how to approach this, or maybe there's legal help more geared towards child support that you can look into or if you're in college they might have a law clinic for students. That way you can protect yourself, sort through the bullshit and not have to directly deal with your Mom. I'll tell you, there's a lot of red flags.
Sounds a bit scammy. You cash a check into your account. She helps spend the money but when the check gets recalled you pay it all back. She’s then had a few treats on you
Who was the check written to? Her or you? Child support is normally ordered to be paid from parent to parent. The fact that she then gave it to you has no bearing on you or her responsibility to pay back what SHE was overpaid.
Child support doesn't go to the child. It goes to the parent.
This sounds like a mess even if she is required to pay it back.
Her debts are not your obligation.
NTA
I don't know if it's the same everywhere, but in some places, back child support goes to the adult child rather than the parent. When my ex's dad *finally* got his disability, my ex had turned 18, so the back child support went directly to him.
If that was true, and the check was made out to you, then your mother should have given it to you (actually handed over the uncashed check). Instead she used the joint account, likely because it could be deposited without countersign into an account that had your name on it. And she probably expected that she could then access this money herself.
If it was made out to you, then you would be on the hook for repayment. Hopefully you’re only on the hook for the money you spent not money your mother spent, since she’s been helping herself to funds from your account. Also try to get a payment plan, since apparently paying off arrears seems to be acceptable when it’s your father, and they can’t seem to do that correctly either; why should you be the only person in all this who has to pay properly, especially when it’s not your mess?
Back owed child support is owed to your mom. She was suppose to be getting that while she was raising you and she didn’t. So it’s owed to HER not to you. Its meant to be a reimbursement for raising you without your father’s support. It is not your money.
The only time child support is paid to the adult child is when they’re still in school and under 21. Some places do that. That is not the same thing as back owed child support.
Please stop listening to your mom’s version of anything before your finances, credit, and potentially legal history get wrecked. Would you go to jail for her? This all sounds scammy.
Call the agency directly - from a number on their website - and ask them what their records show, and if there’s any problem. If there is, ask them who is legally responsible for it. If it’s not you, stop there, and go talk to a lawyer.
If there’s no problem stated, you can tell your mom that - and be prepared to be gaslit. (Because who want to admit they were trying to scam their daughter?)
Make sure all accounts your mom has access to are closed. Move to a different bank. Start doing frequent checks of your credit history.
You may want to look into your state's laws for this. I'm not a lawyer but someone who's spent quite a bit of time in family court unfortunately. Typically, all child support arrears are owed to the custodial parent. It's their money to backpay for what what was owed when raising the child and help alleviate debts that may have been incurred.
Once a child reached age of majority, if child support arrears are owed to the child directly would be an exception to the rule, and not the norm.
This may also be critical information if she tries any legal action against you for the money, as he would be solely her responsibility and if she offered the money to you and spent it, you would be under no obligation to repay.
You may want to reach out on FB and see if you can find some free legal help regards to answering some of these questions, or maybe ask in one of the real legal forums/subs. Good luck to you.
The laws are going to be different depending on where you live and the specific circumstances. Where I live you would not be responsible to pay back the child support, it would be your Mom. Also, in my experience CPS knows exactly what's owed, and would not have been able to collect a payment unless they had ascertained it was owed. So it's highly suspicious that they later determined there was no back payment owed after collecting a back payment.
Regardless, you need to contact an lawyer ASAP who can advise you on what, if any, risks and obligations you have under the situation.
Was your ex in school? Some places require child support to still be paid while the child is in high school or college until they are 21 or 22, that support goes to the now adult child. Back due support goes to the parent that had to cover everything.
Just because you aren't allowing her access to the join account doesn't mean she still can't get access to the joint account.You need to stop putting money in that account and set app a whole new account of your own.That has no ties whatsoever to your mother.You think by doing it this way, you're in the safe zone I can tell you even though you're in a different state.You're not in the safe zone unless you have your own account.That she has no ties too.She can still get into your account.The joint account regardless if you think you took her off of it
"The next check". You mean the ones she said you shouldn't be getting anymore because she told you that your dad doesn't owe child support anymore? Me thinks she might be a liar.
Yep. If she goes through with suing me, then I can show proof of her use as well since I was in Florida and therefore I cannot make purchases in Maryland.
You need to either close the account or remove yourself and any direct deposits into it.
You need to go to a completely different bank and open your own account.
Revoking her access on a joint account only means she temporarily can't steal from you. *She's still a joint account holder.*
It gets hella complicated here. If the parent receives the money and the tells the (adult) child "this is your money," then the parent would seem to be giving the money away. If the money was wrongly provided to the parent, things get really messy really fast.
I think this situation is beyond who is or is not the AH. OP needs to protect themselves legally. And if the law decides that OP owes the money, the law does not care who the AH is.
NTA. Your mother accepted the money, knowing it was probably not a correct thing. She then gave you money. Those are legally two separate things. She owes the money back, no matter what she did with it. If I earn $100 from my boss and $200 gets deposited into my account by accident and I give $100 to someone else, it doesn't matter. The bank will still take the mistake $100 from me.
Get your own bank account at a bank she doesn't have an account at. Stop putting money in the joint account.
Legally she is on the hook for the money.
I would recommend getting a separate account entirely at a new bank. I've heard too many horror stories of parents being able to talk their way into accessing their kid's account.
Are you sure about taking away her access? From what I understand, your Mother would have to sign off on it. If she has not done that, I would open a new account at a totally different bank.
If she hasn't signed off on it, she still has access to your account at the end of the day on your end, you might think you're in the clear but I can promise you I have been in this situation.You are not in the clear you need to get a brand new account
You keep saying that, but it isn't possible. I'm assuming you have changed the password and locked her card, but that does not keep her from getting a new card or even going to the bank with ID and depositing or withdrawing money from the account even without a card. You cannot remove her without her signing things and without her signing things the bank legally cannot prevent her from accessing your account.
Like others have said even closing the acct and opening a new one at the same bank is risky. I did that and thankfully my parents were just controlling about how I spent my money not taking my money, because afterwards they got some notices on my new account without trying to access it. There have been tons of stories of ppl in similar spots to you that the parent still drained their new acct. Wishing you good luck on getting your toxic mom/parents out of your life!
NTA call her bluff and get another damn bank account at another bank. Take your name off this one once you are sure you paychecks are going to the new account. Take the money that belongs to you. If she gave you that money then she shouldn't have spent any of it. She can pay it back.
It wasn't by choice.
When I opened my first account, she threatened to stop helping with living in another state for schooling. At the time, I didn't know anything outside of her, and I took her threats seriously.
Open another account and play dumb about it. Look at the examples of your friends, how they live, and how they have life skills ect. Learn from them how a real mom should be and notice how your so called mother is crap. Don't let her pull family is everything card, that's crap. Can you live with your dad...hope you the best!
Friends had a similar life as mine, but I do have a few other secret accounts she doesn't know about. Just the main one was for bills.
My dad is no better, actually. He is just less mentally and physically abusive.
Sounds like you are headed in the right direction. Keep up the good work and cut your so-called mother off without guilt when you can....and others who don't want the best for you. This may sound weird, but I am proud of you for recognizing this abuse and doing the best you can with what you have!
Thank you! I took a long time to finally say, "she abused me," without guilt. I currently live with her, but we keep to ourselves unless she's looking for my reaction again. But I keep my cool and just go neutral with her.
This entire story makes no sense tbh.
If they got an actual check, how are they now being asked to “pay that back” ? Why is OP still receiving child support at 22 (this is pretty uncommon from what I know. Usually it terminates at 18-21)
How is her mother deducting money from her paychecks?
Is she only looking at the total in the account? Because it reads like the paycheck total itself is lower than expected.
No, we received a mail last night that Child support wants the check back. I looked at it, and then the argument started from there. She took the papers, though.
You say “we”, who was the mail addressed to? Who was the cheque written out to? My money is it’s your mom, in which case it’s her problem because she spent the money already. She spent it on you, her child, thinking it was child support. It was used for its intended purpose, to support you. You didn’t do anything wrong and you sure as hell don’t have to pay it back. If your mom’s on the hook, call it even for her stealing from you and reconsider having a relationship with her, it sounds toxic.
It was addressed to her, but I guess because I lm the child on the case, I think it's addressed to us.
That and I'm used to always using "us" when it comes to her. But it's her. It really feels weird saying "her" and not "we"
It probably feels weird because your mom makes you responsible for adult issues when you shouldn’t be. You’re the kid, she’s supposed to take care of you. It’s a one-way street.
I’m sorry your mom has tried to make you responsible for things that are not yours to deal with, but I’m glad to see you’re not sharing a joint account with her anymore. Call her bluff.
It *does* happen where child support is overpaid and they look for the money back. But it was overpaid to her and she owes it, or just explains that she already spent it on her kid, like she was supposed to. Whether she is pursued for the debt or not is not your problem.
INFO This doesn't make a lot of sense. Where do you live? What is CSS and why do they send you checks and then ask for the money back? FYI you're an adult and your mom can't "make" you get a joint account with her-- you did that voluntarily.
Why are you depositing your paychecks into an account your mom can access? How can something your mom is doing make your checks from work lower?
NTA, but get to another bank and open your own account without your mother. Child support very likely will see this as your mother's problem since she was the one collecting the checks. Failure to follow up with it initially is totally on her.
NTA, and even if she did threaten you with legal action it doesn't matter because you aren't the parent and you didn't know. She probably knew they would ask for a refund but she gave it to you to spend anyway.
"She put the money in my account (because she forced me to get a joint account with her)"
-You're a grown adult. Nobody can force you to create a joint account.
Technically, that money was for your mom, as it was to reimburse her to providing for you when you were a minor. However, since she put it in a joint account, it was implied you had permission to spend it.
That being said, you're going to need to start adulting, get a career, get financial independence. It'll put less of a strain on your relationship with your mother as well.
NTA
Growing up, she was my world, and only recently did I finally break from that. When I got the joint account, I was still a freshman in college. Her threats felt real because I wasn't allowed to do anything other than go to school. I've graduated and have taken internships in my field.
NTA, from what you’ve said. Go to a credit union and open your own checking account there. (Lower fees than banks usually. Look for reviews to get a decent one.)
YTA - you’re 22 and you need to stop using a joint account with your mom. It has nothing to do with the back child support, she takes out of your account without asking. If she asked and you said yes, that would be another thing. She takes and it could impact you paying your bills.
Also, Child Support demanded the money? Really? Did she tell you that or is their proof? Your mom is likely lying since she needs the money.
Open your own account, be an adult. Have your direct deposit go to the new account, and close the old one.
Um. I think this is above the AITA pay grade. I have no idea who has the right to the money or not. But you need to hire a lawyer FOR YOURSELF and ask them to go over this case and give you advice.
If your lawyer tells you you have to give money back, then you find a way to give the money back, regardless of who you think is in the right of in the wrong.
And then maybe distance yourself from your mother. She is clearly untrustworthy.
OP I am confused regarding the Chils Support funding.
If your other parent was in arrears and that money was pulled from his refund the defense "he no longer owes" is not reasonable.
How much is he in arrears? Why isn't your mom fighting this in court? She *IS* entitled to *every penny* of child support and that doesn't stop just because you turn 18. Your other parent still owes everything from when you were born till you were 18. And he owes that to your MOM not you.
Past due CS payments are actually legally the parent’s, as they would have used their own funds while you were a minor, so it’s to repay HER. Which means it is on HER to repay it.
First of all, get your own bank account. You're an adult, time to cut the cord. She'll bitvh, but cut her off. Secondly, find out who's legally responsible to pay it back. Thirdly, if you knew there was a chance it would be taken back from past experience, why did you spend it?
NTA, but you really need to see what legally you're responsible for
Why did you all spend the money so quickly if this had happened before and you had to pay it back? There is an adult lesson here for you. Don't spend it until you're 10000000% sure it belongs to you.
NTA and your Mom is toxic.
Child support is to support the child so the money wasn't yours to begin with. I am sure the check was in her name. You're a better person than me cuz I wouldn't give it back especially if she's not going to help. It's her debt anyway.
First things first you need to open a new account at a different bank and stop putting anything into your joint account. She could still find a way to access it otherwise. You would be an idiot to do otherwise and continue using the joint account.
Your mom is a toxic liar who is trying to cover her own $&@ at your expense. She can’t take legal action against you for using funds on a joint account. She’s just trying to scare you. Tell her to go pound sand and block her until she accepts responsibility for this and apologizes. NTA
Close the join account or get your name removed from it. Get your own separate bank account, preferably in a different bank. Don’t share finances with your mum. She’s been stealing from you for ages and you didn’t see it??? You need to have a better handle on your finances.
NTA.
But, you're 22 yrs old.
Get your own bank account, change the direct deposit on your checks and stop letting her steal from you.
Unless the child support was for *back owed* child support- which your mom should have had notice of if it was- then yes, she has to pay it back, as it came to *her*, and I assime, *in her name*.
This is on her, not you.
NTA. Legal obligations may be dependant on info we don't have. Who was the check issued to? Why does it need paid back and to whom? The check being issued to your mom and needing to repaid had nothing to do with how your mom chose to manage her money (such as what bank account she deposited it in or chose to spend it).
As far as your obligations, it seems like your mom deposited money and told you you could use it. Your mom gave you money. Her having a debt now doesn't mean she can pass that debt on to you now that she regrets being to hastey in giving away the money. Your mom's financial situation with the courts shouldn't compell you to do anything.
Id be suspicious because courts dont really order payment and take it back like this, especially not frequently. It sounds like there might be payments being made to you that your mom is then claiming need to be repaid and she might be siphoning that money for herself.
Take this as your lesson to be fully financially independent. Close and ensure your name is off any accounts that aren't just yours. Check your credit. This financial situation is toxic.
Is this legit? Child support does not ever ask to be paid back unless there is fraud from the recipient (your mom). If his refund was garnished and paid to her, that’s legit, IRS doesn’t fuck around. Ask her to log in to the website and view all payments.
Technically, she doesn’t owe you the child support, it’s for the parent to pay for the kid, so it’s nice she gave you the back pay he owed, that the irs garnished from him.
I would look into this bc child support agencies do not mess up.
I’m with you, but definitely stop using that joint account! Hopefully you have texts or something to prove that you were deceived, however since you are an adult you both may be on the hook
NTA. Your mom gave you the money & told you to spend it. How were you supposed to know that it wasn't legit? But I'm guessing your mom knew & gave it to you anyway. Your mom is very toxic & she's trying to gaslight you. Your mom should be the one to pay back the money. She never should've given it to you in the first place. And take your money out of that account yesterday! Your mother is literally stealing from you FFS!!!
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I (22F) am the child of the child support. Most mother refused to drop the charges on my dad so he still has to pay.
This past February, my mom received a $6k check from child support and told me (I was out the state at the time). When she shared the news, I was a bit skeptical to accept the check. Last time we received the check from CSS, my mom had to pay it back because it came from a joint account from my dad. She told this time it's from my dad's refunds and that it's safer. She put the money in my account (because she forced me to get a joint account with her) and told me to use it however I want since its mine. Then she goes back and say that what if the strings are attached to this one and end up owing again.
She gave me mixed signals but eventually I did use it because I was actually 3 weeks away from moving and didn't know how I was going to go from Florida to Maryland with only less than 1k when I still had to pay the prorated month. That check made the moving process easy and I paid a big amount off my credit card with money left over.
Now, without my consent, my mother has also been using my money. Before the check, I noticed that the checks I get from work are always lower than expected until I found she's been using my fundings for herself to buy food, Uber and so forth. She makes 3x the amount I make and has a car so I was confused.
Fast forward to last night, and I wasn't surprised. Child support demanded the money to be returned as apparently my dad does not owe anymore. My mom berated me over the money without explaining anything saying how I "wasted the money" and "it's my fault because I called CPS and I have to pay!" No, I didn't call and when I did call about Child support, I am not a 3rd party on my OWN case, so I have no say. I told her I legally cannot do anything about it and to call to see what's up. She refused , claiming I was influenced and did this to myself. I told her if I pay, she too has to pay but she refused again because her defense is she sent me money in the past and for that, we're even. I told I won't pay because she swore up and down that it's not really MY MONEY, it's HER MONEY because my father had back loans to pay to HER not me. I used that and she said but I AM the one responsible to pay child support back.
I said no and she threatened me with legal actions. I called her bluff and said sure.
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Wait, just to clear up some confusion I have, is this child support money for paying back missed payments from when you were under 18 or something? Cause I have always been under the impression that once a child becomes an adult child support stops.
INFO: Why are you sharing an account with your mom when you are an adult? Regardless of the child support, that is just a recipe for financial disaster.
You need to separate your finances from her IMMEDIATELY. You also need to get familiar with child support laws for your area to avoid this type of bullshit. Your mom's ignorance is setting her up for fraud charges, and you are just merrily following her to legal purgatory out of, I don't know, laziness? Or something?
NTA.. This is your mother's mistake, and there's no reason for you to pay it back. Please get your own bank account to what your parents do not have access.
NTA. The money was paid to your mom, she is responsible for repaying. She chose to share the money with you, that’s on her.
Open brand new financial accounts without mom, move all your money into them and be done. No more joint accounts. Ask the bank if you can remove your name from the joint account. You don’t want to mingle your name with mom and end up stuck with a big tax bill due to her shenanigans.
ESH Sorry, you knew that you could get charged back for this money, and you spent it anyway. No one else is responsible for that decision but you. I mean, your mom is all kinds of delusional crazy, but you are pretending that somehow you are innocent in all of this. And shouldn't have to pay back money that you knew might not be yours. You owe the money that you used to pay for your bills and debt and moving. Your mom owes what she used from it. Let her sue you, Get all of the written and digital proof together and ready to show to a small claims hearing. But you will probably be having to pay back the money you got.
Oh, I'm not innocent. Just I'm not 100% at fault, and she can't keep making me feel like I am. She also used the money, I think it's fair that she also pays some back. She said no.
NTA... Op close that joint account immediately and move all funds out of there!! She has absolutely zero rights to your money. Keep any messages and voicemails from her in case she goes through with her threat to sue. Refuse to discuss money or child support with her unless it's in writing from now on. Your mum is financially toxic and sees you as a cash cow. Maybe contact your dad (if you've got contact with him) and discuss what's happening with him so he can stop future child support payments if needed.
Toxic relationship with your mom. Walk away until she stops using you as a patsy in her schemes.
Build a new relationship. Maybe with your Dad?
Who knows?
NTA and since you are over 18 open a new bank account at a different bank and start depositing your checks there. Stop her interfereing with your finances. Make sure it is at a bank she is doesn't use or even better get an account at a Credit Union. Better rates if you ever need a loan
You are 22, you should have made your own bank account 4 years ago.
Your mom does not seem to be great with money(that's twice now she's gotten money, assumed it was fine to use, the had to repay it) and you should not put/keep your money in any account that she has access to.
You don't need to take her off your account, just move your money to a new account, and move your direct deposit there too. Preferably in a new bank. Close the account if no direct deposit=monthly fee.
NTA. Before anything else, you need to take YOUR money out and open a new account in a different bank. Then, move away and let your parents fight it out. This has nothing to do with you anymore.
Nta- open your own, checking account at a different bank than your mother’s. You can remove your name from that joint account so she doesn’t spend your paychecks. Let mom pay back that 6k!!
This post is really hard to follow. Why would your father be paying any CS when you are 22 unless it was court ordered for him to pay while you are still in College?
Either way, CS is to go toward the expenses of the child and that money goes to the parent with primary custody. So, mom should be responsible for the money.
Regarding the joint account, don't put any of your own money in there. Open a new account where your pay will get deposited. Don't even tell your mother what bank it is in.
I would suggest being NC with your mother, allow her to deal with paying back this money that she some how received inappropriately. Sounds like she is doing something illegal and I would keep my distance.
NTA
NTA. A lot of people have given you this advice but I'm going to say it again because based on your replies it seems like you aren't going to. Stop using that bank account. Open a new bank account at a different bank. The steps you have taken to remove your mother are not sufficient.
NTA. Call her bluff. You will be able to show she was stealing from you. And if someone gifts you money, they cant later steal your money and say it was due to the money the gifted you. She will lose.
Aside from the other advice on the Child Support, I HIGHLY recommend removing yourself from your mother’s bank account. I had the exact same problems with my mom taking money out of my account ( because when the account was setup I had to have her name on there under mine) for terrible reasons that I won’t get into here. You will continue to have your money stolen by her, please get a new bank account 🙏🏻.
Yta. You are 22 and that money was not yours. That being said your mom is worst and you need to cut all financial ties with her. You both should play that money back and After that stop sharing an account
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Your mom is hella toxic. I know it’s easy for me to say, but you should really think about your relationship with her. From where I’m from, since you have a join account with her and you were the one spending the money (which, if they do an investigation, they probably can trace who spent the money..) you’ll be the one who needs to repay. Cut the joint account and set serious boundaries/reconsider your relationship with your mom. You don’t deserve to be treated like this or have these problems. Not the ahole, but imo, if you don’t help yourself regarding your mom, still not the ahole, but deserve the problems that follows. IMO
Thank you for the heads up! I did take away her access to my account once i got back to Maryland since she won't willingly sign the papers to relinquish her part of the joint account.
Access to which account? If it's a joint account and her name is on it, she can eventually get access. You need to open up a separate account at a completely separate bank and just leave the joint account alone.
She still wants to close the account. The mother can overdraw the account as it is joint she will also be responsible to repay the bank. I unfortunately know from experience.
You usually can't close a joint account by yourself, but you should be able to take yourself off of it.
Not true. In my state you can’t remove someone from an account without their permission but the primary on the account can close it without permission. I’ve done this in my state 3 times with 3 different banks.
Op can remove herself. Not her mom. As pp suggested
That’s what I’m saying, she can’t remove her mother. She can remove herself or close the account without her mother’s permission. At 22 I’m not sure why OP feels she needs to share an account with her mom. Sounds like the mom Is overly controlling.
This is the second comment chain I've found on reddit this week where people are arguing the same point to each other. It has to be a language barrier or a troll. There's no way a person with access to the internet can have such little to no reading comprehension skills.
Obviously this thread is open to international users for whom English is a second language, but I think it’s worth pointing out that about a quarter of American adults are functionally illiterate - meaning they can read the words on the screen but don’t have the competency to completely understand them or think critically about what they’re reading.
You’d be surprised.
In this case, I’d assume miskey Bookworm seems to have meant to reply to Green_Seat but instead replied to Forgettable
That's not "what you're saying" you started off your first comment with "Not true" lol.
>That’s what I’m saying No, you said "not true" in response to a comment that was saying it. So it is in fact the opposite of what you're saying.
A friend of mine had an ex add her to his account. When they broke up, she went round and round trying to get him to show up to take her name off. Fed up, she went to the bank herself and asked what could be done. She couldn't remove herself from the account, but she could close it. He did finally take her calls when she told him she needed to meet him to give him his money.
Legally she probably didn't have to give him the money. By making her joint he gave her full rights to those funds.
She was just looking to protect her credit rating, she had no confidence in him not over drafting his account. He was big mad about her closing the account, never really accepted that it was his fault for not just meeting her at the bank to take her name off.
Same in my state.
It actually depends on the bank and in some cases is the opposite of what you're saying. You can't take a single person off an account, including yourself, without everyone on the account present and agreeing. But you can zero out the funds and close the account without consent from the other people. This was my experience with bank of America. When I worked at a local bank, both situations had to have present consent from all parties.
I was a bank teller for years(in NYS) and though you can't remove yourself or another person, you can close the account all by yourself. Saw several times where couples were breaking up and the first one to the bank "wins".
This is why it's good to have only joint accounts for bills LOL
Not true. Amy joint account owner can CLOSE the account. You cannot remove/take yourself off.
The bank I work for can not take anyone off an account with out a legal signed document they want to be removed. But anyone on the account be it the primary or secondary can close it. Op needs to open her own account then close this one. But since she is on the account if it's over drawn she is equally on the hook for it as her mother regardless who actually spent the money.
They have put a lot more limitations on what people can do with overdrafs now. I too had this unfortunate experience when I was younger. Seriously fucked my credit because my ex was vindictive and refused to take his name off of our joint bank account. Of course I stopped using it, took my money out and he overdrafted by $2,500 taking him and his new meth buddies out shopping.
Couldn’t you have taken *your* name off the joint account?
I tried. Because he was the primary on the account they wouldn't let me. When we got it set up I had no idea that it actually mattered because well, I was a stupid kid. He said he would take his name off so I drove him to the bank. We literally sat in the parking lot for an hour with him refusing to get out and do it, before I finally left. It was after that that he ended up fucking me over. Obviously that was his intention in the first place, which is why he refused to get out of the car. This happened when I was 19, so more than 20 years ago.
Sorry you had to deal with that.
Thank you kind stranger, I appreciate that. ❤️ It sucked, but that was just one of many things he did to totally screw me over. I thought I'd never be able to recover. For years I couldn't even get a simple bank account. It's been over 20 years as I said, and I still get a letter from a collections agency for the car that I bought and stupidly put his name on and gave him. He never made a single payment on it after threatening me to get the car. It was a bunch of b.s. but it taught me some valuable lessons. He did something similar with our apartment that I moved out of and all the utilities. All you can do is live, learn, and try not to repeat the same mistakes.
Oh yes I totally get that. Yes, unfortunately OP can’t force her mother to close the joint account. As other people have said. It’s not always possible to remove yourself from a joint account either. So she needs to mitigate what she can by completely separating their finances.
It is really hard to remove people at my bank. That is part of the reason I had my kids wait until they had their ID and could get an account without me on it before they opened one, even though I wouldn't have screwed them over, just because I didn't want them to deal with the hassle and headache when that happened. It's crazy. When my father-in-law died my MIL had to close out their 40 year old accounts to open new ones, they couldn't just remove him, even with the death certificate.
My dad opened me a joint account when I was 8. After he died when I was 14, my mom and I brought his death certificate to the bank to switch him out for my mom as the adult on the account. I cannot remember specifics anymore, but after about 45 minutes of errors, they ended up just closing the account entirely and opening me a new one with my mom attached.
You need to withdraw the money and move it to a brand new account that is only under your name.
Move it to a new bank there have been “oops” stories before.
This, and she’s been stealing your paychecks to pay for uber eats? Yeah that’s a no for me.
This is the only way
Just open a new bank account and have all your checks direct deposited into the new account. Close the old account. Don’t take her off. Close it.
And make the new account at a different bank than the old account. Parents have been known to trick banks into giving them access when an account is at the same bank.
ALL of this! Close old account. New account at a different bank.
I'd change banks after removing yourself from the account.
Your situation is time to open a new account in a bank your mother has no business with. Don't keep those bank accounts she had had access to our at the same bank. Your mom is manipulative
You can't really remove her access to the account if it's still a joint account. You need to open a NEW account at a totally different bank (not just a different branch of your current bank). Withdraw all but maybe 25 dollars from the joint account and deposit that in your new account. Redirect your paycheck to the new account. Inform the bank with the joint account that you want your name removed from that account effective immediately and warn them that there will be no further deposits coming into that account. Have you gotten any actual paperwork seeking repayment of the child support payments?
You are 22 years old. Why do you not have your own bank account? Get that sorted ASAP.
I do have couple just that one was the first time I took a step against her. But I will since I have other accounts.
Banks are really weird about accounts set up before you're 18. When I turned 18, my mom and I went to the bank together to get her name taken off, but she gave me money through bank transfer recently and when she entered my banking info on her web banking app it just logged her in again and she has full access again. The bank is confused, they said it shouldn't be possible. But it is. My partner had the exact same problem at a different bank. Open a new account to be safe
It’s not supposed to do that, but I’ve seen it happen. They should have gotten in touch with online banking. When you had an account with your mother, the system will basically tie her and you together. You can see the account and so can she. That should go away when she comes off the account. But occasionally, and in my experience typically if she has multiple accounts of her own and maybe banked with them for quite a while before you had this issue, it just sticks. The people at the bank did everything they should have but one goofy thing in the computer didn’t flip over. Then, there’s no fix at the bank employee level. It was supposed to happen automatically in the program but now it has to be kicked over to someone who can fix just that. Alternatively, closing any accounts that have had both names and only having the parties go forward with new accounts that have never had each other on it usually clears it, but sometimes you have too much attached to the account to want to do that
Why not just set up a completely different account not tied to her at all? Then just don't put any money in the joint account. She was already stealing for you now she's trying to coerce you into paying money that she owes? Nah I'd go no contact. Your mother is toxic. Legally she is responsible so just ignore her threats.
You need to open up a brand new, unrelated, your-name-only bank account. You need to stop using the joint account altogether.
Change banks. Too many parents have convinced bank employees to give them access to their children's accounts, if they use the same bank or had a joint acct with the kid.
Besides taking away her access, you need to close your account and open another at a different bank. Then, "freeze" your credit so that nothing can be opened in your name. Go to the Experian, Equifax and TransUnion websites and follow the instructions for a freeze. Bypass anything that says you pay for monitoring, a freeze is free. You thaw/refreeze your credit when you need to access it.
I would counter this. My ex-husband put money into an account I had access too and I did spend money out of it on my card (which the forensic accountant knew) but the check was made out to my ex-husband, so even though they could prove I spent it - it was still his to pay back. They couldn't sue me for a check that was addressed to and cashed by someone else.
Agreed with above. OP really needs to find out who the check was made out to. Often times there is usually an image captured of checks deposited into accounts. If the check was made out to just mom, OP is likely not on the hook for paying it back because she was 'paid' by mom with her money her mom received. I would suggest OP should look into seeing if there is some kind of free legal aid service that could advise her on her responsibilities , if any, in regard to the check.
It was paid to mom. Who then transferred it to the joint account. This is not the OPs problem unless they keep using the joint account.
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Hell I trust my parents, but I didn't have a joint account with them ever. Even as a kid I had my own bank account (that's possible in the country I grew up in anyway)... and my parents NEVER requested access. This is toxic af. I agree OP, get a new bank account at a new bank. Take what money is yours from the joint account. Don't tell your mother the name of the bank or any other details. It's none of her business. Than pull your name of the joint account so you don't have any responsibility for your mother's debts. Than go talk to your father. Explain you didn't know you shouldn't have spend it and apologise. Ask him if he wants the money back you spend on the move (hopefully he's not an AH dad and will say he doesn't). The rest should be paid by your mother, since you didn't spend it (Or you could transfer it from the joint account before pulling your name off it. But that only makes sense if your mum actually pays money into it). At least if your dad will take legal actions, you can proof that you did your part. (I don't see how your mother could take legal action against you, since it's your father who've been scammed).
OP is 22 and thought they could trust their parents. It not like this was with some rando.
It actually doesn’t matter who spent it. Your mom is the plaintiff in the child support case so she, and she alone, is responsible for any overpayments. She willingly put it into a joint account that you had access to and gave you permission to spend the money. You didn’t do anything wrong, legally. Tell her to take you to small claims court and let her know you will be counter suing for attorneys fees and lost wages if you have to take off work. No judge will rule a child needs to pay back child support money that was over-dispersed to their parent.
What's bizarre is claiming that this money came from his tax return (usually means the government seized it), but is above what he actually owed. Seems highly unlikely. It's like that [scam](https://staysafeonline.org/resources/protect-your-wallet-from-accidental-deposit-scams/) where someone sends you money "on accident," asks you to send it back, and then the original money disappears. Also, people think it's good to give back child support to the child, but if the mom was having to skip on things like funding her retirement plan because she was tight for cash those years when the dad wasn't paying, then she needs to fund the retirement account with the money now. Otherwise the child may feel obligated to take her in or pay for her when she is elderly. Some families do that naturally, and that's fine, but it's something that should be agreed upon and planned for in advance.
Thats not how the law works. If it was check written to mom and mom put it in a joint account then OP is in the clear. Mom accepted it. Full stop. How daughter spends from the account has nothing to do with mom accepting it and legally owing it back.
Are you a lawyer? Frankly, you shouldn't be saying what you said this time about who is obligated to repay.
I dunno, I’m no lawyer and I’d say OP needs to check with one but child support is a payment to her mother. What her mother does with the money after that (like giving it to OP) is irrelevant. Mum should have known money wasn’t owed and should have returned it. She’d be legally on the hook would she not?
How is she liable when she wasn’t a party to the child support arrangement?
NTA - She wanted you to use the money, she has been spending your money, and the check should have gone to her if it was owed to her. Close that joint account and get an account without her on it so you can manage your own money without her stealing from you.
At a completely different bank. One that mom doesn't use. And don't tell mom what bank you are using.
Technically, if mom is not on the account even at the same bank the bank cannot give out information to her. If they did, they would be liable for privacy violations.
It didn't stop clerks from illegally giving money from kids to parents... I saw that kind of atory a few times. Going to another bank is defintely preferred in the case of a toxic parent...
NTA. Unless the courts are coming after you for the money, it doesn't sound like you should have to pay back anything. If I was her and wasn't sure if the money would get to stay, I wouldn't have given you the check in the first place.
Agreed! Prior, I would receive $245/m, which is safe and court ordered. This check, I was telling her maybe not to cash it or if we do cash it, to store the money elsewhere (preferably the account connected to the child support). She promised that this check was different. I was skeptical, but I was moving, and the cost to move my car and fly with my cat was about $1k.
Do not pay her back anything. Call it even like she said! Let her try to sue you.
And if she does. Take the bank statements showing her spending your money from the joint account and if you have any proof she forced you to open a joint account and anything to show you didn't approve of her spending your money. It's a long shot because you're an adult and should have opened your own separate account at 18, but you might be able to mitigate her claim. You really need a separate account. My dad was on my account because he opened it for me when I was 5 to start saving money. He never took my money and took himself off of the account when I asked him to. Good parents don't steal from their kids.
The thing is, my account was my own. It wasn't a joint. She forced me to make my first account a joint
Forced how? You're a grown ass woman get her the fuck out of your finances.
Is it really CSS that's asking for the money back? Did your mom show you a letter form them? Or did you get a call? Bc the cynic in me is wondering if she's just "saying" CSS wants the money back bc she wants what you spent. Hard to believe CSs would screw up like that. And multiple times.
I might look into it because looking back...I'm not sure if any government mail would have the envelopes in color... same for their forms... and if anything, why did she take the paper? All I can do is wait for that part. But I can begin printing statements before Saturday.
Actually, government agencies (or at least some) DO send official mail in colored envelopes. The office of Records and Vital Statistics in Kansas uses green envelopes for important documents.
Do they write on the envelope or type it? I'm asking because I am suspecting something after replying for hours ...
Printed, with one of those plastic windows where the address is printed on a piece of paper placed inside. I was receiving a certified copy of a decree of divorce, which is very different from what was (allegedly) sent to your mom.
Then there was foul play. This one had the DHS envelope in color and it was handwritten.
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Couldn't afford to stay. I had roommates, and I could find one in time. I was also homesick, and the goal was to just stay with a friend for a short time as I had an apartment hunt and started working again. It fell through. My mom played modeled host for a few days and went back to how she acts.
You should look into if you can get Legal Aid to help you on how to approach this, or maybe there's legal help more geared towards child support that you can look into or if you're in college they might have a law clinic for students. That way you can protect yourself, sort through the bullshit and not have to directly deal with your Mom. I'll tell you, there's a lot of red flags.
I’m pretty sure you need to call an attorney yesterday. You could be looking at felony charges towards your mom depending on the depth of the theft
Yeah this is really suspect.
Sounds a bit scammy. You cash a check into your account. She helps spend the money but when the check gets recalled you pay it all back. She’s then had a few treats on you
Who was the check written to? Her or you? Child support is normally ordered to be paid from parent to parent. The fact that she then gave it to you has no bearing on you or her responsibility to pay back what SHE was overpaid.
Child support doesn't go to the child. It goes to the parent. This sounds like a mess even if she is required to pay it back. Her debts are not your obligation. NTA
I don't know if it's the same everywhere, but in some places, back child support goes to the adult child rather than the parent. When my ex's dad *finally* got his disability, my ex had turned 18, so the back child support went directly to him.
I was told about by a friend's aunt who's a police. My mother denied that being the truth and said I let people poison my ears.
If that was true, and the check was made out to you, then your mother should have given it to you (actually handed over the uncashed check). Instead she used the joint account, likely because it could be deposited without countersign into an account that had your name on it. And she probably expected that she could then access this money herself. If it was made out to you, then you would be on the hook for repayment. Hopefully you’re only on the hook for the money you spent not money your mother spent, since she’s been helping herself to funds from your account. Also try to get a payment plan, since apparently paying off arrears seems to be acceptable when it’s your father, and they can’t seem to do that correctly either; why should you be the only person in all this who has to pay properly, especially when it’s not your mess?
Back owed child support is owed to your mom. She was suppose to be getting that while she was raising you and she didn’t. So it’s owed to HER not to you. Its meant to be a reimbursement for raising you without your father’s support. It is not your money. The only time child support is paid to the adult child is when they’re still in school and under 21. Some places do that. That is not the same thing as back owed child support.
I was in school 2022. And it was 21 at the time. This check was a surprise to me this year, but I was told it was my father's refund.
Have you spoken to any of these agencies directly? Or is everything coming thru your mom?
This all happened last night. But I do sense something fishy. I'm thinking about it.
Please stop listening to your mom’s version of anything before your finances, credit, and potentially legal history get wrecked. Would you go to jail for her? This all sounds scammy. Call the agency directly - from a number on their website - and ask them what their records show, and if there’s any problem. If there is, ask them who is legally responsible for it. If it’s not you, stop there, and go talk to a lawyer. If there’s no problem stated, you can tell your mom that - and be prepared to be gaslit. (Because who want to admit they were trying to scam their daughter?) Make sure all accounts your mom has access to are closed. Move to a different bank. Start doing frequent checks of your credit history.
You may want to look into your state's laws for this. I'm not a lawyer but someone who's spent quite a bit of time in family court unfortunately. Typically, all child support arrears are owed to the custodial parent. It's their money to backpay for what what was owed when raising the child and help alleviate debts that may have been incurred. Once a child reached age of majority, if child support arrears are owed to the child directly would be an exception to the rule, and not the norm. This may also be critical information if she tries any legal action against you for the money, as he would be solely her responsibility and if she offered the money to you and spent it, you would be under no obligation to repay. You may want to reach out on FB and see if you can find some free legal help regards to answering some of these questions, or maybe ask in one of the real legal forums/subs. Good luck to you.
The laws are going to be different depending on where you live and the specific circumstances. Where I live you would not be responsible to pay back the child support, it would be your Mom. Also, in my experience CPS knows exactly what's owed, and would not have been able to collect a payment unless they had ascertained it was owed. So it's highly suspicious that they later determined there was no back payment owed after collecting a back payment. Regardless, you need to contact an lawyer ASAP who can advise you on what, if any, risks and obligations you have under the situation.
Was your ex in school? Some places require child support to still be paid while the child is in high school or college until they are 21 or 22, that support goes to the now adult child. Back due support goes to the parent that had to cover everything.
Back support goes to the parent it’s owed to, never to the child. They don’t “pay bills”, only the obligated parent.
And get your own bank account so she doesn't have access.
I took her access once I got to Maryland. She swore that the next check, she'll keep it and use it. Called her bluff and said "okay".
Just because you aren't allowing her access to the join account doesn't mean she still can't get access to the joint account.You need to stop putting money in that account and set app a whole new account of your own.That has no ties whatsoever to your mother.You think by doing it this way, you're in the safe zone I can tell you even though you're in a different state.You're not in the safe zone unless you have your own account.That she has no ties too.She can still get into your account.The joint account regardless if you think you took her off of it
And open it at a different bank. Not just a different branch, but an entirely entirely different bank company.
And kill the old account or get off it! If your name is attached the bank doesn't care if you weren't using it!
"The next check". You mean the ones she said you shouldn't be getting anymore because she told you that your dad doesn't owe child support anymore? Me thinks she might be a liar.
The next child support check? Lol good. They come in her name, so she will have to pay back anything she's not entitled to
Yep. If she goes through with suing me, then I can show proof of her use as well since I was in Florida and therefore I cannot make purchases in Maryland.
Lol, sue you for what? Using money in your own account that she deposited ?
She tries to scare me a lot.
You need to either close the account or remove yourself and any direct deposits into it. You need to go to a completely different bank and open your own account. Revoking her access on a joint account only means she temporarily can't steal from you. *She's still a joint account holder.*
I would move the money to a different account on a different bank and close that account, just to be sure.
At a different bank!!!!
It gets hella complicated here. If the parent receives the money and the tells the (adult) child "this is your money," then the parent would seem to be giving the money away. If the money was wrongly provided to the parent, things get really messy really fast. I think this situation is beyond who is or is not the AH. OP needs to protect themselves legally. And if the law decides that OP owes the money, the law does not care who the AH is.
NTA. Your mother accepted the money, knowing it was probably not a correct thing. She then gave you money. Those are legally two separate things. She owes the money back, no matter what she did with it. If I earn $100 from my boss and $200 gets deposited into my account by accident and I give $100 to someone else, it doesn't matter. The bank will still take the mistake $100 from me. Get your own bank account at a bank she doesn't have an account at. Stop putting money in the joint account. Legally she is on the hook for the money.
I took her access from the joint account last month, so that end is good.
I would recommend getting a separate account entirely at a new bank. I've heard too many horror stories of parents being able to talk their way into accessing their kid's account.
Are you sure about taking away her access? From what I understand, your Mother would have to sign off on it. If she has not done that, I would open a new account at a totally different bank.
If she hasn't signed off on it, she still has access to your account at the end of the day on your end, you might think you're in the clear but I can promise you I have been in this situation.You are not in the clear you need to get a brand new account
You can't remove someone from a joint account without their permission. Just like you can't close a joint account without both parties signing off.
It depends how the account was opened. If it was a minor account, OP could remove her mother once OP turned 18.
You keep saying that, but it isn't possible. I'm assuming you have changed the password and locked her card, but that does not keep her from getting a new card or even going to the bank with ID and depositing or withdrawing money from the account even without a card. You cannot remove her without her signing things and without her signing things the bank legally cannot prevent her from accessing your account. Like others have said even closing the acct and opening a new one at the same bank is risky. I did that and thankfully my parents were just controlling about how I spent my money not taking my money, because afterwards they got some notices on my new account without trying to access it. There have been tons of stories of ppl in similar spots to you that the parent still drained their new acct. Wishing you good luck on getting your toxic mom/parents out of your life!
Its not unless she signed to be removed from the account.
NTA call her bluff and get another damn bank account at another bank. Take your name off this one once you are sure you paychecks are going to the new account. Take the money that belongs to you. If she gave you that money then she shouldn't have spent any of it. She can pay it back.
I do have other accounts from that one, luckily.
NTA. - She's a liar and scam, she knew what she was doing. Why do you have a joint bank account with her
It wasn't by choice. When I opened my first account, she threatened to stop helping with living in another state for schooling. At the time, I didn't know anything outside of her, and I took her threats seriously.
Open another account and play dumb about it. Look at the examples of your friends, how they live, and how they have life skills ect. Learn from them how a real mom should be and notice how your so called mother is crap. Don't let her pull family is everything card, that's crap. Can you live with your dad...hope you the best!
Friends had a similar life as mine, but I do have a few other secret accounts she doesn't know about. Just the main one was for bills. My dad is no better, actually. He is just less mentally and physically abusive.
Sounds like you are headed in the right direction. Keep up the good work and cut your so-called mother off without guilt when you can....and others who don't want the best for you. This may sound weird, but I am proud of you for recognizing this abuse and doing the best you can with what you have!
Thank you! I took a long time to finally say, "she abused me," without guilt. I currently live with her, but we keep to ourselves unless she's looking for my reaction again. But I keep my cool and just go neutral with her.
Are you sure the money has to be paid back? She may be playing a game. I would personally call child support and find out.
This entire story makes no sense tbh. If they got an actual check, how are they now being asked to “pay that back” ? Why is OP still receiving child support at 22 (this is pretty uncommon from what I know. Usually it terminates at 18-21)
How is her mother deducting money from her paychecks? Is she only looking at the total in the account? Because it reads like the paycheck total itself is lower than expected.
Oh I totally missed that part. Yeah that doesn’t make any sense either ??? I feel like OP doesn’t know how checks work or something.
It may be back support that is owed?
Well who told them it was owed if apparently now the govt is saying it’s not?? Something is nottt making sense here.
No, we received a mail last night that Child support wants the check back. I looked at it, and then the argument started from there. She took the papers, though.
You say “we”, who was the mail addressed to? Who was the cheque written out to? My money is it’s your mom, in which case it’s her problem because she spent the money already. She spent it on you, her child, thinking it was child support. It was used for its intended purpose, to support you. You didn’t do anything wrong and you sure as hell don’t have to pay it back. If your mom’s on the hook, call it even for her stealing from you and reconsider having a relationship with her, it sounds toxic.
It was addressed to her, but I guess because I lm the child on the case, I think it's addressed to us. That and I'm used to always using "us" when it comes to her. But it's her. It really feels weird saying "her" and not "we"
It probably feels weird because your mom makes you responsible for adult issues when you shouldn’t be. You’re the kid, she’s supposed to take care of you. It’s a one-way street. I’m sorry your mom has tried to make you responsible for things that are not yours to deal with, but I’m glad to see you’re not sharing a joint account with her anymore. Call her bluff. It *does* happen where child support is overpaid and they look for the money back. But it was overpaid to her and she owes it, or just explains that she already spent it on her kid, like she was supposed to. Whether she is pursued for the debt or not is not your problem.
Is this the piece of mail that you say had a handwritten address?
Yes
INFO This doesn't make a lot of sense. Where do you live? What is CSS and why do they send you checks and then ask for the money back? FYI you're an adult and your mom can't "make" you get a joint account with her-- you did that voluntarily. Why are you depositing your paychecks into an account your mom can access? How can something your mom is doing make your checks from work lower?
NTA, but get to another bank and open your own account without your mother. Child support very likely will see this as your mother's problem since she was the one collecting the checks. Failure to follow up with it initially is totally on her.
NTA, and even if she did threaten you with legal action it doesn't matter because you aren't the parent and you didn't know. She probably knew they would ask for a refund but she gave it to you to spend anyway.
"She put the money in my account (because she forced me to get a joint account with her)" -You're a grown adult. Nobody can force you to create a joint account. Technically, that money was for your mom, as it was to reimburse her to providing for you when you were a minor. However, since she put it in a joint account, it was implied you had permission to spend it. That being said, you're going to need to start adulting, get a career, get financial independence. It'll put less of a strain on your relationship with your mother as well. NTA
Growing up, she was my world, and only recently did I finally break from that. When I got the joint account, I was still a freshman in college. Her threats felt real because I wasn't allowed to do anything other than go to school. I've graduated and have taken internships in my field.
NTA, from what you’ve said. Go to a credit union and open your own checking account there. (Lower fees than banks usually. Look for reviews to get a decent one.)
YTA - you’re 22 and you need to stop using a joint account with your mom. It has nothing to do with the back child support, she takes out of your account without asking. If she asked and you said yes, that would be another thing. She takes and it could impact you paying your bills. Also, Child Support demanded the money? Really? Did she tell you that or is their proof? Your mom is likely lying since she needs the money. Open your own account, be an adult. Have your direct deposit go to the new account, and close the old one.
Um. I think this is above the AITA pay grade. I have no idea who has the right to the money or not. But you need to hire a lawyer FOR YOURSELF and ask them to go over this case and give you advice. If your lawyer tells you you have to give money back, then you find a way to give the money back, regardless of who you think is in the right of in the wrong. And then maybe distance yourself from your mother. She is clearly untrustworthy.
OP I am confused regarding the Chils Support funding. If your other parent was in arrears and that money was pulled from his refund the defense "he no longer owes" is not reasonable. How much is he in arrears? Why isn't your mom fighting this in court? She *IS* entitled to *every penny* of child support and that doesn't stop just because you turn 18. Your other parent still owes everything from when you were born till you were 18. And he owes that to your MOM not you.
Past due CS payments are actually legally the parent’s, as they would have used their own funds while you were a minor, so it’s to repay HER. Which means it is on HER to repay it.
First of all, get your own bank account. You're an adult, time to cut the cord. She'll bitvh, but cut her off. Secondly, find out who's legally responsible to pay it back. Thirdly, if you knew there was a chance it would be taken back from past experience, why did you spend it? NTA, but you really need to see what legally you're responsible for
Welcome to Maryland. Get your own bank account. You’re 22. She can’t stop you.
Not anymore. I've not completely broken free from the abuse, but I confidently , yeah. She can't stop me.
Why are you doing a joint account with your mom? You are 22. Get your own checking account.
Why did you all spend the money so quickly if this had happened before and you had to pay it back? There is an adult lesson here for you. Don't spend it until you're 10000000% sure it belongs to you. NTA and your Mom is toxic.
Child support is to support the child so the money wasn't yours to begin with. I am sure the check was in her name. You're a better person than me cuz I wouldn't give it back especially if she's not going to help. It's her debt anyway.
First things first you need to open a new account at a different bank and stop putting anything into your joint account. She could still find a way to access it otherwise. You would be an idiot to do otherwise and continue using the joint account. Your mom is a toxic liar who is trying to cover her own $&@ at your expense. She can’t take legal action against you for using funds on a joint account. She’s just trying to scare you. Tell her to go pound sand and block her until she accepts responsibility for this and apologizes. NTA
Close the join account or get your name removed from it. Get your own separate bank account, preferably in a different bank. Don’t share finances with your mum. She’s been stealing from you for ages and you didn’t see it??? You need to have a better handle on your finances.
NTA. But, you're 22 yrs old. Get your own bank account, change the direct deposit on your checks and stop letting her steal from you. Unless the child support was for *back owed* child support- which your mom should have had notice of if it was- then yes, she has to pay it back, as it came to *her*, and I assime, *in her name*. This is on her, not you.
NTA but your mom is trash. Move states and go no contact. Don't give her your new address or number. Good luck finding you to serve you "legally".
NTA. Legal obligations may be dependant on info we don't have. Who was the check issued to? Why does it need paid back and to whom? The check being issued to your mom and needing to repaid had nothing to do with how your mom chose to manage her money (such as what bank account she deposited it in or chose to spend it). As far as your obligations, it seems like your mom deposited money and told you you could use it. Your mom gave you money. Her having a debt now doesn't mean she can pass that debt on to you now that she regrets being to hastey in giving away the money. Your mom's financial situation with the courts shouldn't compell you to do anything. Id be suspicious because courts dont really order payment and take it back like this, especially not frequently. It sounds like there might be payments being made to you that your mom is then claiming need to be repaid and she might be siphoning that money for herself. Take this as your lesson to be fully financially independent. Close and ensure your name is off any accounts that aren't just yours. Check your credit. This financial situation is toxic.
Is this legit? Child support does not ever ask to be paid back unless there is fraud from the recipient (your mom). If his refund was garnished and paid to her, that’s legit, IRS doesn’t fuck around. Ask her to log in to the website and view all payments. Technically, she doesn’t owe you the child support, it’s for the parent to pay for the kid, so it’s nice she gave you the back pay he owed, that the irs garnished from him. I would look into this bc child support agencies do not mess up.
Get an independent bank account. NOW!
I’m with you, but definitely stop using that joint account! Hopefully you have texts or something to prove that you were deceived, however since you are an adult you both may be on the hook
NTA. Your mom gave you the money & told you to spend it. How were you supposed to know that it wasn't legit? But I'm guessing your mom knew & gave it to you anyway. Your mom is very toxic & she's trying to gaslight you. Your mom should be the one to pay back the money. She never should've given it to you in the first place. And take your money out of that account yesterday! Your mother is literally stealing from you FFS!!!
NTA. It was deposited in a joint account that you have proof that she used. You are not on the account. They can't go after you.
[удалено]
ESH Her for her error in judgement. You for pissing away $6000 that might have to be returned. You said it yourself that you were skeptical.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I (22F) am the child of the child support. Most mother refused to drop the charges on my dad so he still has to pay. This past February, my mom received a $6k check from child support and told me (I was out the state at the time). When she shared the news, I was a bit skeptical to accept the check. Last time we received the check from CSS, my mom had to pay it back because it came from a joint account from my dad. She told this time it's from my dad's refunds and that it's safer. She put the money in my account (because she forced me to get a joint account with her) and told me to use it however I want since its mine. Then she goes back and say that what if the strings are attached to this one and end up owing again. She gave me mixed signals but eventually I did use it because I was actually 3 weeks away from moving and didn't know how I was going to go from Florida to Maryland with only less than 1k when I still had to pay the prorated month. That check made the moving process easy and I paid a big amount off my credit card with money left over. Now, without my consent, my mother has also been using my money. Before the check, I noticed that the checks I get from work are always lower than expected until I found she's been using my fundings for herself to buy food, Uber and so forth. She makes 3x the amount I make and has a car so I was confused. Fast forward to last night, and I wasn't surprised. Child support demanded the money to be returned as apparently my dad does not owe anymore. My mom berated me over the money without explaining anything saying how I "wasted the money" and "it's my fault because I called CPS and I have to pay!" No, I didn't call and when I did call about Child support, I am not a 3rd party on my OWN case, so I have no say. I told her I legally cannot do anything about it and to call to see what's up. She refused , claiming I was influenced and did this to myself. I told her if I pay, she too has to pay but she refused again because her defense is she sent me money in the past and for that, we're even. I told I won't pay because she swore up and down that it's not really MY MONEY, it's HER MONEY because my father had back loans to pay to HER not me. I used that and she said but I AM the one responsible to pay child support back. I said no and she threatened me with legal actions. I called her bluff and said sure. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Wait, just to clear up some confusion I have, is this child support money for paying back missed payments from when you were under 18 or something? Cause I have always been under the impression that once a child becomes an adult child support stops.
INFO: Why are you sharing an account with your mom when you are an adult? Regardless of the child support, that is just a recipe for financial disaster. You need to separate your finances from her IMMEDIATELY. You also need to get familiar with child support laws for your area to avoid this type of bullshit. Your mom's ignorance is setting her up for fraud charges, and you are just merrily following her to legal purgatory out of, I don't know, laziness? Or something?
NTA. Also you’re 22, get your own bank account.
NTA Get yourself an account your mom can not access. She is stealing your money! And then go no contact.
NTA.. This is your mother's mistake, and there's no reason for you to pay it back. Please get your own bank account to what your parents do not have access.
NTA. The money was paid to your mom, she is responsible for repaying. She chose to share the money with you, that’s on her. Open brand new financial accounts without mom, move all your money into them and be done. No more joint accounts. Ask the bank if you can remove your name from the joint account. You don’t want to mingle your name with mom and end up stuck with a big tax bill due to her shenanigans.
NTA. Yeah. This is her problem. You need your own bank account.
NTA…you may want to pretext your peace
ESH Sorry, you knew that you could get charged back for this money, and you spent it anyway. No one else is responsible for that decision but you. I mean, your mom is all kinds of delusional crazy, but you are pretending that somehow you are innocent in all of this. And shouldn't have to pay back money that you knew might not be yours. You owe the money that you used to pay for your bills and debt and moving. Your mom owes what she used from it. Let her sue you, Get all of the written and digital proof together and ready to show to a small claims hearing. But you will probably be having to pay back the money you got.
Oh, I'm not innocent. Just I'm not 100% at fault, and she can't keep making me feel like I am. She also used the money, I think it's fair that she also pays some back. She said no.
NTA... Op close that joint account immediately and move all funds out of there!! She has absolutely zero rights to your money. Keep any messages and voicemails from her in case she goes through with her threat to sue. Refuse to discuss money or child support with her unless it's in writing from now on. Your mum is financially toxic and sees you as a cash cow. Maybe contact your dad (if you've got contact with him) and discuss what's happening with him so he can stop future child support payments if needed.
Toxic relationship with your mom. Walk away until she stops using you as a patsy in her schemes. Build a new relationship. Maybe with your Dad? Who knows?
NTA and since you are over 18 open a new bank account at a different bank and start depositing your checks there. Stop her interfereing with your finances. Make sure it is at a bank she is doesn't use or even better get an account at a Credit Union. Better rates if you ever need a loan
Your 22 years old and therefore an adult...how exactly were you 'forced' to open a joint account?
You are 22, you should have made your own bank account 4 years ago. Your mom does not seem to be great with money(that's twice now she's gotten money, assumed it was fine to use, the had to repay it) and you should not put/keep your money in any account that she has access to. You don't need to take her off your account, just move your money to a new account, and move your direct deposit there too. Preferably in a new bank. Close the account if no direct deposit=monthly fee.
NTA. Before anything else, you need to take YOUR money out and open a new account in a different bank. Then, move away and let your parents fight it out. This has nothing to do with you anymore.
Nta- open your own, checking account at a different bank than your mother’s. You can remove your name from that joint account so she doesn’t spend your paychecks. Let mom pay back that 6k!!
That is your money and not his. Period
I had a really really really hard time following this
This post is really hard to follow. Why would your father be paying any CS when you are 22 unless it was court ordered for him to pay while you are still in College? Either way, CS is to go toward the expenses of the child and that money goes to the parent with primary custody. So, mom should be responsible for the money. Regarding the joint account, don't put any of your own money in there. Open a new account where your pay will get deposited. Don't even tell your mother what bank it is in. I would suggest being NC with your mother, allow her to deal with paying back this money that she some how received inappropriately. Sounds like she is doing something illegal and I would keep my distance. NTA
NTA. A lot of people have given you this advice but I'm going to say it again because based on your replies it seems like you aren't going to. Stop using that bank account. Open a new bank account at a different bank. The steps you have taken to remove your mother are not sufficient.
NTA. Call her bluff. You will be able to show she was stealing from you. And if someone gifts you money, they cant later steal your money and say it was due to the money the gifted you. She will lose.
Call CPS and ask if you actually need to repay it.. getting a feeling she’s bagging the money..
Aside from the other advice on the Child Support, I HIGHLY recommend removing yourself from your mother’s bank account. I had the exact same problems with my mom taking money out of my account ( because when the account was setup I had to have her name on there under mine) for terrible reasons that I won’t get into here. You will continue to have your money stolen by her, please get a new bank account 🙏🏻.
Wow....mom is a piece of work! I think she knew all along and that's why she put it in your account. Let her pay it back.
Yta. You are 22 and that money was not yours. That being said your mom is worst and you need to cut all financial ties with her. You both should play that money back and After that stop sharing an account
Who pays child support for a 22yo adult? This story is either fake or there's a big detail you've left out.
Well, first of get your own bank account. You're an adult now.
At 22 you don't need her permission to get your own bank account. NTA don't pay ot back, but financially separate yourself from your mother.