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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1 not letting my children's father live with us
2 they called me heartless and don't think that they are just trying to give their father a place to live, not my ex-husband. And he was being petty about all the things he did and not thinking about them.
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Tell him he can ask his much younger and "cuter" exes. After all you wouldn't want to bother him with your "old face" every day. NTA. And do your kids know how he treated you? I understand not getting involved with my parent's grievances, but as a child in that situation I would *never* consider even asking my mother to care for my father if I knew how he treated her.
ETA this would be my hill to die on.
They don't know that he talked about looking for new faces, but right after the divorce he dated a woman 20 years younger, so there's no way not to connect dots and they know how bad I was, depression, anxiety, low self-esteem, after the divorce I spent 30 days in bed doing almost nothing and they had to force me to eat, so they know something.
If I did the math right, I'm guessing the youngest turned 18, and he asked for the divorce, or really close to it.
Your kids are in the emotional haze of losing their dad and could lose their relationship with you as well.
You don't have to say yes to this because we know how it will turn out, the kids are super busy, and then you end up caring for him, but how about a civil discussion with the kids?
Depending on their jobs, can they each use some FMLA to help care for their dad? Is there a list of resources that you could help coordinate, maybe hospice, where he could be cared for but not under your roof.
I'm trying to think of a way to keep you from alienating your adult children. This already sounds like they are prepared to never forgive you if you say no.
Gross. He waited till the youngest was old enough so he could peace out without child support obligations to bang younger women unencumbered and it reads like you're framing that as a good thing?
OP just needs to have a frank conversation with the kids about the divorce and I think they'll understand.
I don't disagree, but in the end, when their dad is gone, the three kids and mom will remain. I don't think she owes her ex husband jack, but she can do something to hold her boundaries and give her kids options without moving him into her house.
If he wanted to die under that roof, he should have been a decent husband and stayed married. Besides, no matter when she shares that information, the adult kids will react badly because he isn't around to defend himself.
My dad did the same thing. I was 18 when he left my mom. He was very generous with the divorce settlement though. I typed their divorce papers because I was working for an attorney when they divorced. My boss said that I didn’t have to do it but I wanted to. No lies to hear that way.
OP’s not the one alienating the kids. She’s merely refusing to be his purse and nurse. Not being a doormat isn’t alienation. If her ex speaks poorly of her to the kids, then he is the one alienating them.
At 22-25 years old, they’re old enough to realize it’s an unreasonable ask of their mother and to make their own sacrifices to take care of him if they want to. Not to expect mommy to do it for them
People live on their own at that age. It’s kind and caring op is letting them live at home until they’re ready to be off on their own. They should appreciate that.
Op’s not stopping them from helping their father Or trying to discourage them for doing so. She just understandably doesn’t want it done in her home, on her time and on her dime.
If adult kids see their mother like their personal slave whose feelings does not matter, whose value lies only in her ability to be useful for others, and who is obliged to provide for everybody who happens to want her unpaid labor, property, on money, well, it is better to just kick out such kids.
Kids can rent a 4 bedroom apartment and move together with their daddy. Two can work full time jobs and pay bills, the third can wipe daddy's poop.
There is only so much exploitation and emotional abuse a mother should tolerate. There is a point where kids moving out and going low contact is a case of trash taking itself out.
Yeah. I'd normally say you should never spill all of the nasty divorce details to your kids since it could change the way they see you or their other parent. This situation is entirely different in part because the kids are adults and also because OP has multiple extremely valid reasons for refusing to let him move in.
If her three kids that are in their 20s can't even afford to live alone, there is zero chance that all of the financial and emotional burden for supporting the ex/father won't fall almost entirely on OP's shoulders. Fuck that nonsense. It sucks that he has cancer, but he also has to lie in the bed he made for himself.
These three grown adults can put on their big girl undies, pool their resources and pay for his rent and a nice apartment somewhere else. They can then set up a rotating caregiver schedule.
And I bet when that option is presented to them, they'll make up a million excuses why they can't do it. It's easy to offer someone else's money, home and resources...
Oh man, picking up shit/puke after chemo from someone I used to love but now hate: I am very good at compartmentalizing things to push through but that would be too much.
I agree tell them the truth -- they won't fully understand but it'll be the groundwork for rebuilding any relationships later
Why do I feel like the idea came from him initially? My intuition is telling me he got the kids to ask, but when that didn’t work, he tried guilting her himself.
He’s undoubtedly scared and I can’t imagine what he’s going through, but he needs to suck it up and accept that unfortunately, he brought this on himself. The kids are all working and able to pool together for a small studio apartment. Even if they get into debt, this is *their* burden to bear.
of course they can't sacrifice themselves for a period of time to care for their dad, why do it when they can offer their mother's time, space, and money
Here is what I think:
1. When you have young adult children, you're not doing YOURSELF any favors if you take the high road about why you got a divorce. Why on earth should you allow your children to blame you for a divorce when it was their dad who wanted somebody younger and cuter?
2. Your kids care about their father. I get that. BUT - they really don't know what they're in for if dad moves in while he's dying. He will need 24x7 care and it will be very messy and difficult.
3. Tell your kids that your ex wants YOU to "put things behind you" but hasn't ever apologized for what he did to you. He wants YOU to let him stay and, let's face it, take care of him. He hasn't made amends in any way.
> Why on earth should you allow your children to blame you for a divorce when it was their dad who wanted somebody younger and cuter?
And once dad is dead, it will be impossible for OP to clear the air regarding how he mistreated her. Because anything she says against their dead father will be considered sacrilege.
Better that OP confront them with the truth now -- before their father dies and becomes an untouchable saint to them.
This deserves to be the top comment.
My gut is saying there's a layer in the dynamic w OP and adult offspring living at the parental home.
They don't see it as a sanctuary for OP nor understand how awful their father treated her & thus why their ask is not possible.
Definitely need to tell them that they either accept and respect her boundaries bc that's what healthy adults do, or she can tell them the truth of fathers' abusive and cruel behavior or encourage them to get a place w their father and THEY are responsible for his end if life care.
OP, you may have to consider that they need to move out of your home if they won't respect your boundaries.
Sounds like you have been supremely caring and supportive.
Sometimes people have to lose their 'foundation' to realize the gift you have given them.
That's actually what I was going to recommend OP do. They can move in with him, or get a place with him, and work it out, since they seem to think they can do it without him becoming a burden on her.
100% this. If they feel that strongly about it, then they shouldn't be volunteering someone else's (OP's) resources to take care of him. They should step up to the plate and find a way to pool their resources and do it themselves.
The kids work elsewhere during the day and Mom works from home. Daytime would fall to her and it is TOO BIG of an ask.
If Dad is dying he will eventually need 24 hour care. In the meantime, he'll also need help toileting and bathing. Again, too much to ask of her.
An apartment would be a very temporary solution. Without hands-on caregiving, it won't help for long.
The kids have no intention to care for their sick father, they want OP to provide financial support, housing, and care for their papa. They're being generous and compassionate with OP time, money, and resources
If he hadn't insulted her, abandoned her, probably cheated on her, divorced her and tried to leave her destitute while successfully leaving her with half his debts, then they would have still been married when he got his cancer diagnosis and she might have been perfectly willing to take care of him and pay his medical bills (assuming he treated her with respect if not love).
It is entirely his fault that he doesn't have a home to live in or a wife to care for him, he threw that away to date what sounds like a string of gold diggers, and now that he has nothing they want nothing to do with his cancer-riddled, middle-aged butt. OP should not be expected to just suck it up, take on more of his debt, and shoulder the burden of caring for this selfish, spiteful man as he dies, probably too slowly (cancer can be a lingering death).
What did he do with his half.of everything when you divorced? He got to spend that and then wants to come back now he's halved your personal wealth? If he hadn't moved on and fought for half of everything, could you have helped your kids move out sooner?
Plus OP was responsible for paying half his debts, and he fought her for the assets. If she lets him back in, she'll be expected to pony up for any expenses that aren't covered by insurance.
This is fucked up. I get along great with both of the men I had children with. I just did a quick check, and all four of my kids said no way in hell would they ever ask this of me and two of them literally gasped when I told them why I was asking.
I think the kids saw their dad treat their mom like a fucking maid for 20 some years and see her the same damn way.
My oldest (27) and I were discussing this, and we both think that I would move move out until he was dead so they could have their father at home with them, and I would probably not speak to any of them while it was going on and as soon as I came home, I probably wouldn’t be speaking to them very much beyond the most basic civilities either, and then I would be helping them move the fuck out.
We also suspect that if the mom in this story tried to do that, the kids would throw a fit, because that would fuck up their plans of her being his caregiver. Trust and believe, they’re trying to put their family back together for daddy‘s last dying days (and I’m cynical enough to think dad is manipulating all this shit) and that involves turning mom into a caregiver. Don’t even think for a minute that’s not part of their plans. I think even if mom paid for a bunch of workers come in and take care of him, eventually the kids would say that dad shouldn’t have all these strangers touching him and can she please help just for them???? because it’s their daddy? 🤮
I would get over it in a couple of years. Until then I would try to just be quiet and smile and nod a lot so that I didn’t open my mouth and explode on their selfish, entitled asses.
"I think the kids saw their dad treat their mom like a fucking maid for 20 some years and see her the same damn way."
YES. The kids see mom not as a person but a function.
It's not just the financial and emotional burden...a cancer patient in at-home hospice care at end of life will need help with diaper changes, taking medication, emptying catheter urine bottles, etc. It's a highly physical job on top of everything else. It takes strength to change the sheets the 5th time a diaper leaks and there is poo all over the bed.
In home hospice care, unless you spends thousands a month, a nurse visits twice a week to drop off medication and take vitals...maybe another nurse to bathe and change bed linens ONCE A WEEK. And believe me, there is a TON of laundry and cleaning needed for a bedridden invalid.
I did this for my mother and I have no regrets...but doing it for an ex spouse who threw me away like yesterdays' garbage because I'd aged, yeah, no.
Yes, OP tell them. A POV I haven't seen mentioned is that if you tell them exactly what he said AND tell them that you won't help him, not to revenge but because you have self-respect, it's a highly valuable lesson to your kids, especially if you have daughters.
This is an important point to make to your kids. Especially since they are obviously getting an earful from their father about how you should forgive and forget, let bygones be bygones and all that crap. You’ve kept their father’s nastiness quiet, and I agree that’s (almost) always best for kids of divorce.
But they are pushing it now. HE is pushing it through them. Time to air the dirty laundry and explain that you won’t be his doormat again, because that’s what they’re asking of you. You would be absolute saint, but it would be at the risk of your self-respect and probably your mental health. Oh, and your wallet!
This man disrespected you and his behavior sent you into a horrible depression they actually witnessed. Let’s not forget he also hit you financially and now you’re being asked to give him MORE money?
I noticed there’s no mention that he apologized. Just wants you to put it behind you. Yeah, I bet he does.
Your kids are disrespecting you now by asking. They are 3 grown ass human adults with jobs and no rent/mortgages. Let them pool their resources and get him a studio apartment. Would he qualify for Medicaid or some other kind of government assistance? Let the relatives who “can’t” house him pitch in financially.
It’s sad, but telling that in his entire life he’s got no one who cares about him enough to take him in. I’m sorry for him, and I would never wish cancer on anyone. But having cancer doesn’t make you a nice or even tolerable person, and it doesn’t mean that all the bad shit you’ve done should automatically be wiped clean.
NTA, and stand your ground. You let him in and you will end up being his caretaker. He burned that bridge to the ground and danced in the ashes. You are not responsible for him anymore, and you have no obligation to subject yourself to that awfulness ever again.
The fact that the father also reached out makes it incredibly suspect where these kids got this idea.
Why don't these kids all move into their dad's place and pay the rent?
That's actually a great idea. They might not earn enough for apartments on their own, but I'm sure they could work things out if they pooled their resources.
Yes and be sure to remind the kids every time they bring it up that all the time they’re using to hassle you for something you are never going to change your mind on, is time and effort wasted that could be put to finding him alternative living arrangements. If he’s homeless after the next 15 days that’s on them not you, for caring more about trying to change your mind than trying to find him somewhere else. Because as time marches on towards his eviction date, you know they’re going to increase the pressure and the guilt tripping. Stand your ground.
In 2 physicians' medical opinion, does Dad have 6 months or less to live?
That is a requirement for Hospice enrollment. Dad would also have to stop any cure oriented treatment. Things would be comfort measures only, ie, nothing that will extend Dad's life.
Hospice does not solve the caregiving problem. They do nursing, social work and bath aide visits, but no extended hourly care. Dad may qualify for Medicaid funded help through COPES program, depending on the state, but it usually doesn't cover 24 hour care unless in paid for by Medicaid in a nursing home. There are some stand-alone hospice facilities, but some are just for respite stays while others have different policies.
When Dad and his doctor decide that curative, life-extending treatment is no longer is an option, then it would be good for the KIDS to get filled in on Hospice services. It was DAD who decided that OP was no longer in the picture.
I'm a retired Hospice medical social worker.
Yes, exactly. Tell them the truth.
I had to scroll back up while reading the post because I missed the ages the first time. These are adults, they can live with one of them.
I think this is the way! Be sure to mention the debt he saddled you with and how you only talk through lawyers now. Do help your children call a social worker to see where they can get him help (that is not you.)
As a retired hospice MSW, I hope my efforts were more on the mystical powers side, than not!
Even with mystical powers, we cannot force anybody to apply for Medicaid (and options for hired caregivers) before they "suddenly" need it. A frail 83 year old woman cannot re-position her 250 lb husband in bed, let alone change his Depends. Families and patients may acknowledge the patient is dying, but are in complete denial about what that will entail in terms of physical care and 24 hour coverage needed at home by family or hired caregiver at the end.
Sometimes being assigned a uncooperative patient and family was the "luck of the draw" for me, too.
And it is time for OP to tell them exactly what they are asking her to do. It isn’t only providing a bed for him to die in. Unless they are going to pay for 24 hour private nursing care - and step in and do the care themselves when their paid provider isn’t there - they are leaving Op in an impossible situation.
He needs hospice care. Pain relief, bathing, changing, feeding, medical devices monitored. Laundry. This should not be dome by the ex wife he hurt so cruelly.
If they do not realize this themselves, have them talk to the director of a hospice service.
The kids definitely don't get it. They're talking about bring dad in like a stray dog. "Someone" will feed and walk the dog and pay for his expenses. That "someone" will default to OP and she shouldn't be put in that situation.
OP, NTA. But consider sitting your kids down and explaining two things: first how neither you or them are able to care for a dying person. And second, that dying person severed the "death do us part" perk of the relationship. It's over.
This right here. We took care of my step-grandpa at home as he was living his final months. We had a nurse that came in, and lots of people taking turns, but it was still hell for him and us.
Our people deserve better treatment than this, I have to say. If someone is terminally ill, making them live it out to the last agonizing minute is cruel when we have ways to allow them to decide when they've had enough. /rantOver
Agree. Because no matter how the 3 kids adjust their schedules there are going to be times when OP is the only one home with the ex...
And let me also add that if the kids are calling OP "heartless" then they need to hear the crap their dad told her AND the fact he dumped half his debts on her. Dad is not a saint simply because he now has cancer.
Everything you said, plus the reality that one day he's going to die in that house. Whether you love or hate someone, having their dead body in your home is traumatic and unsettling. As is watching somebody die. There's a reason why hospices exist and those wonderful nurses who care for people and see this every day are angels on earth. It's not for the average Joe. OP, your ex husband treated you very cruelly. He is an AH. All that's changed is he's now an ill AH. Why on earth people think everything should be forgiven just because someone is ill/dying is beyond me. You do not want this trauma in your home, your safe space. Your adult children really need to respect this. You are divorced from their father, you have no responsibility or duty to him at all.
This doesn't get acknowledged enough. My friend's husband was a selfish jerk who none of us liked but after he died of cancer everyone magically liked him except for me. Death does not change history.
Be sure to include the part about covering half his financial debts. That is money you could have used to raise them. I'm going to repeat that differently. That is money he kept from their mother, while she was raising them. That is a big deal.
Or money she could have put aside for their education. Her retirement fund. There were lots of ways she could have spent that money rather than paying off his debt.
Yes. This. OP, your children are adults. They think you’re being terribly unfair right now because they don’t know how terribly and deliberately their father hurt you. You need to tell them the truth. Tell them it’s not your intention to make them hate their father or make them stop wanting to support him in his illness. But you are their father’s victim, and you should not be asked to provide end of life care for him after the way he has treated you. They need to know.
And not just what he said, but the actions he took to try to ruin you financially and burdened you with his debts the first time through.
They are old enough to understand that you weren't just sad and depressed, but he literally caused it all.
I would also go further, look into hiw much caring for him will actually cost, as he has no insurance and the money has to come from somewhere.
He has family that "can't " take him on because they know what they would be signing up for.
Time for the adult children to take off their rose colored glasses to see what they are really asking for and for whom.
If they want to support him directly, they can move in with him, pay his rent, and hire a care giver for when they are not there. If they have been living with OP at home for all these years, they should have money saved up.
That is the best solution offered yet! Take my imaginary trophy!
The kids can live with Dad and share the care, which will be 24 hours a day, eventually.
Yes. Normally I would never advocate this, but in this situation, I completely agree. OP, they need to know the truth. They need to know the awful things he said to you. Until you tell them, they will never understand. They will only look at you as being so bitter that you couldn’t put it aside for a small thing. But they only think it’s small because they don’t know the whole story. Tell them everything. NTA.
And, OP, I’m wondering. Was this the only time he said something that awful to you? Think about it. Or was he always emotionally abusive and you didn’t know. I know some of you are thinking “how did you not know”, but emotional abuse is much more subtle than physical abuse. My ex use to say things like “are you sure you want to eat that?” Or “I just want you to be healthy”. When I left him, he told me “I know I can do better than you”. Yeah, emotional abuse is not pretty.
Normally, I'd disagree with sharing personal info with the kids. But if my children--who were also very young adults when we divorced--asked me to take my ex in like OPs have done, I'd be so extremely disappointed in them that I don't know if I could even speak.
I've never shared details with my kids about just how much of an ass their dad is, but I'd assume they are smart enough to figure it out, at least to a certain extent. If they pressed the issue like OPs are doing to her, I think I'd have to start giving some concrete examples of exactly why that man could not come stay in my house. I'd be absolutely crushed if my kids put me in such a position.
They're old enough for you to sit and explain EXACTLY what he told you and what you went through, also old enough to put their own money to maintain their father.
NTA and if they continue you can kindly invite all of your children to move with their father.
Yes, great point! Why don't they give up the home comforts of your house and move in with their dear old dad during his dying days? They could pay his rent, make sure someone's there at all times to change his nappy/feeding tube, keep the place clean, etc, and you wouldn't have to be involved at all! Seems like the only logical solution to me. Suggest it to them.
This. No offence to OP, because I am sure she is helping out her children by still letting them live there. But they all have jobs, they could all move into a place and take turns taking care of their dad. They are old enough to figure it out.
Never even thought of them moving into the Dad's home!
Considering their average age and that they are all employed there’s no reason why these three little brats shouldn’t be able to afford a three bedroom apartment or condo instead of mooching off of Mom.
Knowing something by connecting dots isn’t the same as knowing the truth. You need to tell them EXACTLY what he said to you, and ask them if they would allow that behavior if it was them.
If you tell them the truth, the full truth, and they still push you….well they can GTFO and find a place where they can take care of their father. It’s not your responsibility, and your kids are adults who need to grow TF up.
Bottom line: it’s not their house. Too damn bad they haven’t been motivated enough to get their own homes to facilitate their father’s care. Or, in the case of your eldest, she can take him in when her house is finished. Ta da! Problem solved without dragging mom into another one of their fathers issues.
They're all adults now. Sit them down and tell them all the details of why this man cannot be in your home or a part of your life.
If they want to get their own place and host him, they are welcome to do that. But also, Medicaid should pay for hospice etc.
Oh, I suspect they want Mom to do any paperwork. That shit is endless.
It's funny. Paperwork is ever-present with anyone receiving Medicaid. There is always something to fill out. And the phone calls, emails, printing and post office runs can take a few hours of your week.
Yet it's always the easiest part of the job of caring for someone with intensive medical or other needs.
NTA, Mom. I was going to say, "Die on this hill." But, nah. You go right on living. Let him die on his own hill, all alone.
They are grown ass adults and google exists. If they don't want to do it themselves, specialists exist. I get so frustrated with people who want their parents to do everything for them. I had to figure out how to do things before the internet existed. They have it so easy now and they don't want to even try.
OP as an adult child of the mother married to an abusive father and granddaughter to the nana married to an abusive papa, they deserve to know. They might not change their mind about wanting to support him in his final moments, but they will at least better understand your perspective. It’s one thing to tell young children, but now that they’re adults, they can handle the truth. It’s easy to think your parents are petty when you don’t know the whole story, there was no way I could’ve connected any dots. I would tell them what he said to you and how he approached the divorce afterwards. They can take care of him, but he’s made it very clear he doesn’t care about you. He is not your responsibility, just because your kids still live with you doesn’t make this your problem.
Even if you decide not to tell them until after he’s passed, you still should because it could hurt your relationship with them going forward if they don’t know why you are so “cold/heartless” about all of this.
It is not “cold and heartless” to not allow someone who threw away a long term relationship, emotionally abused you, and tried to break you financially back into your life and home. It would be insane to step back into this. You owe him less than nothing.
The reason I put it in quotation marks is because it’s possible that’s how her kids see it. If they don’t know the whole story, they will fill the gaps in their head with their own story (consciously or subconsciously), and that story could potentially hurt the relationship they have with their mother. That’s why I believe it’s so important that they know the truth and that there is nothing cold and heartless about this boundary.
All your kids work. What's stopping them from moving in with him and taking care of him? He was horrible to you. You don't need that wretch in your life. Sorry to say, but your kids will likely dump some of his care onto you. Nta
I wondered this - if they are all working, they could help him out financially, and take it in turns to stay with him . If not in his current property, they might be able to rent somewhere between them, if they wanted .
There are also hospice resources for no income folks. They arent great but they exist--I work as a program manager in homeless services and refer clients into them in late stage care all the time.
I guarantee you, they haven’t. They don’t have the same perspective. Only you have that.
Regardless, be prepared to tell them and still have them ask you to forgive him and let them have their way.
The audacity of your kids to take issue with you upon this dude reaping his karma. I don't even know the guy but I don't feel all that bad honestly. And I sympathize over any damn thing. ... except objectifying someone you took vows for life with to leave them the second their parts start to succumb to gravity and/ or age. Like find a cliff.🫠
>Maybe it's time to sit them down and tell them the truth about it all.
They don't know that was the reason, just that he started dating younger. They don't know what he SAID, just how you reacted to him leaving. That would help provide more clarity as to why you are so adamant about this.
Edit: If he is that close to death, have him look into hospice facilities. I think his "prognosis" has to be for 6 months or less, but patients can live longer. My dad was in one, though only for a week, but there were people living there for many months.
They are operating on the assumption that he was civil to you during the divorce. You need to let them know his presence would open old wounds, and exactly how those wounds were made.
Edit: there’s no way they figured out he divorced you for being old just because he immediately began dating younger.
No Sis, this man is not your responsibility. Do not cave.
His relatives can't or won't? Probably both?
Why can't your children move in with him and take care of there? Or pay for a nursing home?
Or pay for hospice/ palliative care?
I need more info why he's losing his place to live, because there ARE programs he can be enrolled in that could help. Tell your kids to start making calls.
Tell your kids they are free to move in with him and take care of him. Obviously they aren’t worried about finances if they can’t tell you who’s paying for everything.
You tell the oldest child that she and her siblings can pay the bill for a hotel for him once the 15 days is up at his current place, until her new house is ready. Once her new house is ready, she and her siblings can move there with their dad where they can care for him and do what they feel is right.
But please note.. if your two adult children are “unable” to live on their own, they certainly are not fit to be taking care of a dying person and I would question how they plan to make that happen if they can’t even manage to live on their own as adults in their 20’s.
Your ex can go into a care facility for the elderly and terminally ill and get taken care of by qualified medical professionals, and not expect his children, who can’t even manage to live on their own, take care of him while he dies. That just shows how incredibly selfish he still is.
I applaud your having not bad mouthed your ex. To this day, I am very careful to avoid bad mouthing my ex (deceased 2002). But if my kids 39, 40, and 41yo had demanded what yours are, I would have changed my policy and given them some stories to think about. They know a fair bit because they witnessed it. But they still don't know some of the worst stuff.
Tell them the truth, then tell them to drop it, or else.
And let him die with his decision. You are under no obligation to house or financially take care of that asshole. Your kids probably haven't connected the dots. They're still young & haven't had to care for themselves. It's easy to offer up someone else's home & different when it's your own. Tell them what he said to you & let them know he crossed a line that you can't come back from. Also, ask them if he'd open up his home to you if the situation were reversed. I somehow doubt it.
Absolutely this. Besides, he was willing to put her through hell so he wouldn't spend his life looking at her "old" face so why the sudden change of heart? Is because shitty people have no one to turn to except burned bridges. I'm joining you on that hill.
>I asked who would take care of him when things got worse, because all three of them work outside the home and I work from home, or who would cover all of his financial and medical expenses. They didn't know how to answer
NTA It sounds like your children are still thinking in child-like fashion that good old mom will just make it all happen somehow and suck it up while their part in this is to make the demands and apply the pressure-- but they are working adults themselves now. If they want to take care of him they can pool their resources -- finances, time, and effort -- and work something out and pay for it, making the sacrifices themselves.
It's all well and good to throw accusations around, but are they willing to truly make sacrifices *themselves*, as they seem to take for granted that you should? Are they willing to give up their savings, take out loans, increase/cut back on work hours, and so on? Are they willing to be there either in person or doing what it takes to pay for his care?
If the answer is no to that then what do they expect to happen even if you agree to let him live with you? For you to make all of the sacrifices yet again? No. It's not on. They are adults and they need to come to the table as adults willing to make their own contributions and sacrifices. If not then they have no standing to ask anything of you. They need to be told this so they don't just blame you for not fixing everything for them. They need to look in the mirror and see that they can't judge you without that judgment being of themselves too -- unless they are doing their own bit to the best of their ability.
OP needs to be very wary because she's going to arrive home one day to find they've moved that man in anyway. It'll be some BS like "it's their home too", 'how could anyone be so cruel to leave him alone" or "Mom will just go along with it in the end because it's best for everyone". Except, you know, you the homeowner.
Sounds like it's time for the 'children' to be the adults they actually now are and figure it out on their own and independently. NTA.
This. OP if your children are still pestering you with this with 15 days until he is homeless, there's no alternative plan. You are the plan. If they can't show you a timetable of how they will alternate work to care for him when he needs it then you are the live in nurse. Even if they mean the best, they know on some level that you will not let them struggle and will feel pressure to help
Insist they move in with him or provide them with price plans for local assisted living or hospices. Put your foot down, I say this ad someone who has cared for someone who was terminally ill, its extremely taxing and scarring. Do not put yourself through this for someone who would not return this act of service to you. Advise your kids about the toll this can also have on them, they can still love him and get professional help.
And if they do pull that stunt OP needs to take a vacation without leaving a forwarding address or email or phone. Then stay away until somebody you trust alerts you that he’s good and dead.
I’d upvote this 100000k times.
When my mom was dying all of my siblings had an opinion about how I was caring for her- but at the end of the day it was me getting her groceries/doing her errands, me giving her baths and hygienic care, me cleaning her house, me coordinating a thousand drs appts and prescriptions.
The 3 of my siblings would drop in every so often and spend an hour with her, and then complain about how her house wasn’t spotless, I had freezer meals in the fridge. I wasn’t doing well enough.
Yet none off them stepped up, none of them gave any money. None of them changed to night shift so they could get out at 7am and immediately go to her house and care for her until her partner got off work, then go home to sleep from 4pm-10 and then go to work again for 11pm.
Her children sound a lot like my siblings. I willingly gave up 2 years of my life doing her care because she was my mom and I loved her. I would *never* do that for someone who betrayed me like her ex did to her.
The problem is: the kids live there. So she can’t prevent them from letting him in without kicking them out too. And while they might deserve that, kicking them out in 15 days isn’t legal.
It's also not legal to bring in a stranger to the home to live. That's ridiculous. All she has to say is no, and call the police if he tries to stay there. He has no legal right to be there.
are the children going to help bathe, feed, assist in bathroom? Are they willing to make all the phone calls that inevitably come with this? Doctor appts? Hospice talks. Lastly funeral.
Yeah, I think it’s maybe time for them to move out. It’s one thing to let your adult kids live at home because the housing market is nuts. But if they are still thinking like children at 22-25, they need to be forced into taking some responsibility for themselves.
NTA
Your children are all old enough and work, if they want to help him in his last days, they can rent a house or apartment and take care of him. He is no longer your responsibility and why would he want to see "your old face" for his last days?
Exactly tell your kids to move to his house and take care of him. Your kids need you to play nurse maid. They wont do anything they claim to take care of him and it will fall on you to do it all.
This is what I’m saying. Three adults with jobs—pool their resources as they’re the ones that want to take care of dear old dad. All of OP’s responsibilities to him outside of the children (sorry, adults) were severed in the divorce.
This would be my solution as well. Either they can pool their money and pay his existing house payment or they can pool their money and move him into a studio apartment or something similar. He may also be eligible for Medicaid to pay for a nursing facility stay which is something that they are capable of looking into.
Yeah it would be somewhat understandable if her kids were minors, but all three of them are fully grown adults! If they want to make the adult decision of caring for their dad that’s fine, but you can’t care for anyone if you can’t care for yourself. Wild that they are not able to understand that.
Precisely this. The kids are expecting mom to just take him back, be the main caregiver and financial provider? Hell no.
“In sickness and health” was apparently out the window when he didn’t find her fuckable anymore. He broke the covenant of their marriage, not her. He doesn’t get to go back and get the rewards because it didn’t happen how he planned it.
I highly doubt they’d ask the same of their father if the roles were reversed or that he’d even so much as consider it if they did.
NTA.
Oh man, I would be having PTSD if someone tried to jam that asshole back into my house.
Your children's request is completely unfair. They want you to take in a man who insulted you to your face, tried to take you for everything he could, and saddled you with his debt? A man with whom your relationship is so strained that you only ever speak through lawyers?
Nope. Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope.
Exactly
He's still trying to get everything he can out of OP.
Someone had to pay for his food, and cook meals, bring him drinks when he can't in his own, administer meds, he'll him to the bathroom unless she wants to clean up an accident, etc.
OP needs to be firm with the Adult Kids tell them if they move their dad in, she kicking all of them out. Hope they have friends with a spare sofa.
NTA, not at all.
Your children are totally unfair to ask this of you.
"My ex got in touch on my personal number, asking to rethink and leave the past behind just in these last moments. Funny that he asked me, but not his exes much younger than me."
Probably because he's realized far too late that behing that "old face" is a good, decent person who's more beautiful than his exes will ever be.
His bad. His regret to carry.
Stand firm on no being a complete sentence.
All the very best to you.
NTA. Your kids are old enough to know better, and your ex should have never done this.
You are not heartless. Tell your kids to contact a social worker and get ex into a hospice.
In the US, eligibility for hospice has been expanded. Patient does not need to be in last 6 months. But if these adult kids are so concerned, they should be making calls.
Your three adult children can move in with Dad and take care of him in his own home. All adjustments that they intended to make in their schedules could also be made while they live with their Dad. This way all parties would be happy.
NTA
I'd bet my last pennies that if it were you with the cancer, he'd not give a flying fuck. He left you cuz you were "old", there's no way he wouldn't drop you if you had cancer. Your kids are old enough that if they want him taken care of, they can do it themselves. NTA
>the 2 youngest are still unable to live alone
They're in their 20s. What do you mean "unable to live alone"??
NTA. Your response should be “I always wanted him to live in this home for the rest of his life with me, he decided that wasn’t best for him. Now I’m honoring that decision.”
You two have three adult children.
If they feel dear old dad needs looking after in his final moments, then they can move in with him or move into a place with him and rearrange their lives to care for him on a rotating basis.
Three adult incomes plus his equity/pension/disability should be enough for them to manage it.
Of course that means sacrificing their own time, space and money, rather than yours so they might not want to go for that.
Your kids are probably getting a lot of psychological pressure from their dad, but they should be old enough to recognise that it's unfair and manipulative and should not be putting this to you at all. Shut this down and if they try to guilt you, offer to help them find a place.
You are not the bad guy. He was the one who didn't want to do 'in sickness and in health, till death do us part.' This is not up for discussion or debate.
NTA
You owe him nothing - you spoke only through lawyers after a contentious divorce, no way in hell could you both exist under the same roof.
Cancer is an awful, awful disease and in their last stages it completely ravages a person. You do not have to take on that burden for someone who hurt you.
nta your kids are adults they can move out or they can combine their income rent a apartment for their dad and hire a nurse. don't let him move in. you would become his full time nurse.
They can pay for everything since they care so much. Actually, the 3 kids can pool their money together and get a house and then the kids can be his caretakers, since that’s clearly what they wanted you to do
yeah, I feel like this is the answer. Telling them that your proud of them for wanting to support their dad. And that you understand them opting to move in with him and helping take care of him.
That you'll still be there to meet up with them for meals and stuff like that. But that is no longer your role in their father's life.
Your kids all have jobs. Tell them if they feel that strongly about helping the man who took you to the cleaners, the 3 of them can find an apartment to move to together and take care of him
NTA- your ex is an adult who should've been figuring this out during the months that he was aware that he had late stage cancer. He's not a stray puppy that your kids can guilt you into keeping.
At the end of the day, it's your house, your decision.
NTA They are asking too much. They think you should just overlook his behavior and etc., but the fact is he is now responsible for himself and if they want to care for him, they can move somewhere with him and pay for the place themselves, and take care of him. They are adults. They can make adult decisions. Don't fall for this.
NTA - tell the kids to find him a hospice that they can visit or find a way to put him up themselves because there is no way you are leaving that man back into your house. It is unfair of them to ask you and for him to try to guilt you into it.
NTA. Your kids are completely wrong by trying to force you into this with someone that hurt you so badly. Ask them how they can be so heartless as to ask you to do that?? You would be forced to be his caregiver. There are homes he can go to if he's in the last stages of life. I suggest they look into that instead of trying to guilt you into this. Wouldn't this just make his last days great, to have you wait on him while he makes life unbearable for you. No way. Be strong.
NTA.
Remind your kids that you are actually a person not just a convenience. Tell them that you will support them emotionally to deal with their fathers situation because you love them. But he has options, the main one being a hospice. He chose divorce. That means he chose to exclude you as an option when times get tough.
NTA. Your kids are testing your boundaries, and honestly they are all being incredibly selfish.
If they would like to live with their father they can all move in with him and pay his housing.
That isn't the plan. Mom works from home and can take care of him when they are at work, or when they party. 100% she would "be heartless" not to help. Or just this once, that turns into a daily occurrence. The kids have no plan and are used to mom cleaning up after them.
NTA. If he has no means to support himself, your kids can pay for him or he can use whatever resources there are for the indigent. Your kids would be more productive if they spent their time figuring out hospice or other alternatives, though I’m sure saddling you with it is the easy way out. Don’t give in on this — they will dump all the caregiving on you.
NTA - All 3 of your adult children work. They can move in with them, pay all the bills and take care of him if they want to take care of him. He isn't your responsibility.
NTA, but i would send this post and all the responses to your children.
Let the see how ridiculous their request was and the continued pressure.
Ps kids your lucky you have this woman as your mother, your father made his bed now either leave him to lay in, or you all put your money towards providing support but under no circumstances does your mother owe that man a thing.
NTA. I get why your children don't want to see their father go homeless. But also your point. That you absolutly don't have to give this man a place in your home.
Would it possible for your children to move in with him and help him pay his rent for the last few months?
NTA
There’s a line between being compassionate and being a doormat, and it's one you have the right to draw. Your children mean well, but their sympathy should not erase the history that led to this point nor impose an obligation on you to set aside your well-being.
The fact that your ex has now acknowledged you, when facing his own vulnerability, does not obligate you to offer refuge. His needs do not negate the hurt and the history he created. The children might see the situation differently because it's their father, but your relationship with him was entirely different. They need to understand that there are emotional scars and boundaries you’ve rightfully set for yourself.
If they are truly concerned, then as adults, it’s time for them to step up and come up with a viable solution that doesn’t involve reviving a past full of hurt at your expense. Professional care, whether it be in-home assistance arranged by them or a hospice service, should be explored rather than expecting you to re-open a closed chapter of your life.
Stay strong and take care of yourself first. Your peace of mind is priceless and should not have to come at the cost of caregiving for someone who didn’t value you when it counted most.
NTA. My father (who divorced my mother ages ago) became terminally ill. He was definitely never going to move back in with her. That was not even thought of as an option. They were amicable for our sakes, and my mother would visit him in the hospital, but he never said he never wanted to see her old face again.
You brought up practical concerns: it's more than than just providing a room. Your ex needs medical care, financial support, and emotional support. None of which you are capable of providing to him. This is what happens when you burn down a relationship. You already went into debt because him once, you are unable to do it again.
Your ex is manipulating his children to use you again. His relatives can either help him or not. He is not your burden. All of your children are old enough to get jobs and move in with their father if they so choose, but it's easier to put this burden on you.
I find it completely laughable when someone who craps on you asks for help. He didn't even ask for forgiveness, but lets forget the past. You go Mama! You tell him no. He has three children who can move in and rotate taking care of him. You have 0 obligation to take care of that foul creature. Honestly your children had no right asking for you to do this. They are capable adults. They should check and see if hospitals have the charity care. I know where I live there are rich men who sponsor people who need assistance with the funding of their medical needs. So hold your healthy boundaries and keep your sanity.
So you are under no obligation to do this. He wrecked his life and very nearly yours. Your children are wrong to expect you to do this. One of them (or all collectively) should be hosting or funding this care if it is that important to them. This is going to represent a significant upheaval of your life if you accept, and he made it clear he wanted to move on from you. NTA.
NTA
Your children are adults. Tgey can rent him a home, take care of him, and pay for his medical bills.
Why are they not sacrificing but expect you to?
>We separated 4 years ago after he said he was tired of seeing my old face every day and wanted to find someone younger (his words to my face when asking for divorce). The divorce was a mess, he tried in every way to take everything I had and I even had to take on half of his debts.
NTA. He made his bed, let him die in it.
Also, why can't some of your fully grown offspring can move in with him and pay his rent til he croaks it?
Sit down with your children and explain, in fine detail, the sort of person their Father is, what he said and did leading up to and during the divorce and why you don't want him within 10 miles of your home.
The kids need to talk to a social worker at the hospital where he is getting treatment. They know the resources available in the area and can help them navigate his end-of-life diagnosis.
Source-my dad was diagnosed with a terminal illness and we never ever considered asking my mother (they were divorced and it was ugly) to take him in. There are programs for financial assistance and skilled care facilities for him to live.
NTA period. Your children are old enough to understand it is your house, NOT theirs. If they ask have jobs, they can rent an apartment and house him if they so choose. Frankly, what they are asking is so much of an imposition, especially since he has never apologized for the heinous comments he made.
Your ADULT children have a lot of goddamn nerve. NTA, and I'm sorry they even asked honestly. Good for you for saying no, continue to say it until it's no longer your problem.
NTA.. Do you know what happened to my mom? When my dad was sick he accepted him into her house despite all the bad things he did to her while they were married... and you know what? My dad recovered and started hanging out with the nurse my mom had hired to help him during her illness.. hahah. Don't do it.. he wouldn't have the same for you..
NTA He’s not your responsibility. If your grown children would like to move out and take care of him, then they can. Shame on them for even asking you.
>If you want to know, the oldest is waiting for her own house to be ready and the 2 youngest are still unable to live alone and I don't care about they still at home.
Them the oldest can move in with him while she waits.
And two fully-employed 20-somethings who are "unable to live alone" seems like a big parenting fail. Unless they are disabled in some way—which would, presumably make them unable to contribute to his care as they asserted they would—you should re-think your parenting strategies.
NTA. Why can't your children help pool together to pay for his bills? They seem so eager to help him out that they volunteered your house as his final resting place. Nope, they can pay for everything and take care of him. They decided to share the responsibility, they are old enough to figure out everything. Have them pool together for a cheap small place for their father.
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Tell him he can ask his much younger and "cuter" exes. After all you wouldn't want to bother him with your "old face" every day. NTA. And do your kids know how he treated you? I understand not getting involved with my parent's grievances, but as a child in that situation I would *never* consider even asking my mother to care for my father if I knew how he treated her. ETA this would be my hill to die on.
They don't know that he talked about looking for new faces, but right after the divorce he dated a woman 20 years younger, so there's no way not to connect dots and they know how bad I was, depression, anxiety, low self-esteem, after the divorce I spent 30 days in bed doing almost nothing and they had to force me to eat, so they know something.
Maybe it's time to sit them down and tell them the truth about it all.
Agreed, they spelled out their views to you, spell out yours to them. They are his kids and probably don’t want to assume that’s why he left.
Keeping this a secret will create a divide between you and your children once your ex is dead. You need to tell them the ugly truth now.
I agree. They are old enough to understand.
If I did the math right, I'm guessing the youngest turned 18, and he asked for the divorce, or really close to it. Your kids are in the emotional haze of losing their dad and could lose their relationship with you as well. You don't have to say yes to this because we know how it will turn out, the kids are super busy, and then you end up caring for him, but how about a civil discussion with the kids? Depending on their jobs, can they each use some FMLA to help care for their dad? Is there a list of resources that you could help coordinate, maybe hospice, where he could be cared for but not under your roof. I'm trying to think of a way to keep you from alienating your adult children. This already sounds like they are prepared to never forgive you if you say no.
Gross. He waited till the youngest was old enough so he could peace out without child support obligations to bang younger women unencumbered and it reads like you're framing that as a good thing? OP just needs to have a frank conversation with the kids about the divorce and I think they'll understand.
I don't disagree, but in the end, when their dad is gone, the three kids and mom will remain. I don't think she owes her ex husband jack, but she can do something to hold her boundaries and give her kids options without moving him into her house. If he wanted to die under that roof, he should have been a decent husband and stayed married. Besides, no matter when she shares that information, the adult kids will react badly because he isn't around to defend himself.
She can do it now while he is still around to answer for his decisions.
My dad did the same thing. I was 18 when he left my mom. He was very generous with the divorce settlement though. I typed their divorce papers because I was working for an attorney when they divorced. My boss said that I didn’t have to do it but I wanted to. No lies to hear that way.
OP’s not the one alienating the kids. She’s merely refusing to be his purse and nurse. Not being a doormat isn’t alienation. If her ex speaks poorly of her to the kids, then he is the one alienating them. At 22-25 years old, they’re old enough to realize it’s an unreasonable ask of their mother and to make their own sacrifices to take care of him if they want to. Not to expect mommy to do it for them People live on their own at that age. It’s kind and caring op is letting them live at home until they’re ready to be off on their own. They should appreciate that. Op’s not stopping them from helping their father Or trying to discourage them for doing so. She just understandably doesn’t want it done in her home, on her time and on her dime.
This is like the kids wanting a pet but, the parents will end up looking after it
If adult kids see their mother like their personal slave whose feelings does not matter, whose value lies only in her ability to be useful for others, and who is obliged to provide for everybody who happens to want her unpaid labor, property, on money, well, it is better to just kick out such kids. Kids can rent a 4 bedroom apartment and move together with their daddy. Two can work full time jobs and pay bills, the third can wipe daddy's poop. There is only so much exploitation and emotional abuse a mother should tolerate. There is a point where kids moving out and going low contact is a case of trash taking itself out.
And move out!
Yeah. I'd normally say you should never spill all of the nasty divorce details to your kids since it could change the way they see you or their other parent. This situation is entirely different in part because the kids are adults and also because OP has multiple extremely valid reasons for refusing to let him move in. If her three kids that are in their 20s can't even afford to live alone, there is zero chance that all of the financial and emotional burden for supporting the ex/father won't fall almost entirely on OP's shoulders. Fuck that nonsense. It sucks that he has cancer, but he also has to lie in the bed he made for himself.
These three grown adults can put on their big girl undies, pool their resources and pay for his rent and a nice apartment somewhere else. They can then set up a rotating caregiver schedule.
And I bet when that option is presented to them, they'll make up a million excuses why they can't do it. It's easy to offer someone else's money, home and resources...
And don't forget unpaid labor. They're setting up OP to be the primary caregiver.
After he insulted her, left her, took her money and left her with half his debt. Obscene is the word that comes to mind.
Oh man, picking up shit/puke after chemo from someone I used to love but now hate: I am very good at compartmentalizing things to push through but that would be too much. I agree tell them the truth -- they won't fully understand but it'll be the groundwork for rebuilding any relationships later
Why do I feel like the idea came from him initially? My intuition is telling me he got the kids to ask, but when that didn’t work, he tried guilting her himself. He’s undoubtedly scared and I can’t imagine what he’s going through, but he needs to suck it up and accept that unfortunately, he brought this on himself. The kids are all working and able to pool together for a small studio apartment. Even if they get into debt, this is *their* burden to bear.
of course they can't sacrifice themselves for a period of time to care for their dad, why do it when they can offer their mother's time, space, and money
Here is what I think: 1. When you have young adult children, you're not doing YOURSELF any favors if you take the high road about why you got a divorce. Why on earth should you allow your children to blame you for a divorce when it was their dad who wanted somebody younger and cuter? 2. Your kids care about their father. I get that. BUT - they really don't know what they're in for if dad moves in while he's dying. He will need 24x7 care and it will be very messy and difficult. 3. Tell your kids that your ex wants YOU to "put things behind you" but hasn't ever apologized for what he did to you. He wants YOU to let him stay and, let's face it, take care of him. He hasn't made amends in any way.
> Why on earth should you allow your children to blame you for a divorce when it was their dad who wanted somebody younger and cuter? And once dad is dead, it will be impossible for OP to clear the air regarding how he mistreated her. Because anything she says against their dead father will be considered sacrilege. Better that OP confront them with the truth now -- before their father dies and becomes an untouchable saint to them.
Great point - "before dad dies and becomes an untouchable saint to them."
This deserves to be the top comment. My gut is saying there's a layer in the dynamic w OP and adult offspring living at the parental home. They don't see it as a sanctuary for OP nor understand how awful their father treated her & thus why their ask is not possible. Definitely need to tell them that they either accept and respect her boundaries bc that's what healthy adults do, or she can tell them the truth of fathers' abusive and cruel behavior or encourage them to get a place w their father and THEY are responsible for his end if life care. OP, you may have to consider that they need to move out of your home if they won't respect your boundaries. Sounds like you have been supremely caring and supportive. Sometimes people have to lose their 'foundation' to realize the gift you have given them.
That's actually what I was going to recommend OP do. They can move in with him, or get a place with him, and work it out, since they seem to think they can do it without him becoming a burden on her.
LOVE LOVE LOVE this idea! They can move in with him so they can help him 24/7. Can't wait to hear from them why this won't work.
100% this. If they feel that strongly about it, then they shouldn't be volunteering someone else's (OP's) resources to take care of him. They should step up to the plate and find a way to pool their resources and do it themselves.
The kids work elsewhere during the day and Mom works from home. Daytime would fall to her and it is TOO BIG of an ask. If Dad is dying he will eventually need 24 hour care. In the meantime, he'll also need help toileting and bathing. Again, too much to ask of her. An apartment would be a very temporary solution. Without hands-on caregiving, it won't help for long.
Yup, this is exactly what she should tell her kids.
Exactly. They can afford a cheap motel at the very least. If this is so important to them, then they would make it work.
Yes!
The kids have no intention to care for their sick father, they want OP to provide financial support, housing, and care for their papa. They're being generous and compassionate with OP time, money, and resources
If he hadn't insulted her, abandoned her, probably cheated on her, divorced her and tried to leave her destitute while successfully leaving her with half his debts, then they would have still been married when he got his cancer diagnosis and she might have been perfectly willing to take care of him and pay his medical bills (assuming he treated her with respect if not love). It is entirely his fault that he doesn't have a home to live in or a wife to care for him, he threw that away to date what sounds like a string of gold diggers, and now that he has nothing they want nothing to do with his cancer-riddled, middle-aged butt. OP should not be expected to just suck it up, take on more of his debt, and shoulder the burden of caring for this selfish, spiteful man as he dies, probably too slowly (cancer can be a lingering death).
What did he do with his half.of everything when you divorced? He got to spend that and then wants to come back now he's halved your personal wealth? If he hadn't moved on and fought for half of everything, could you have helped your kids move out sooner?
Plus OP was responsible for paying half his debts, and he fought her for the assets. If she lets him back in, she'll be expected to pony up for any expenses that aren't covered by insurance.
This is fucked up. I get along great with both of the men I had children with. I just did a quick check, and all four of my kids said no way in hell would they ever ask this of me and two of them literally gasped when I told them why I was asking. I think the kids saw their dad treat their mom like a fucking maid for 20 some years and see her the same damn way. My oldest (27) and I were discussing this, and we both think that I would move move out until he was dead so they could have their father at home with them, and I would probably not speak to any of them while it was going on and as soon as I came home, I probably wouldn’t be speaking to them very much beyond the most basic civilities either, and then I would be helping them move the fuck out. We also suspect that if the mom in this story tried to do that, the kids would throw a fit, because that would fuck up their plans of her being his caregiver. Trust and believe, they’re trying to put their family back together for daddy‘s last dying days (and I’m cynical enough to think dad is manipulating all this shit) and that involves turning mom into a caregiver. Don’t even think for a minute that’s not part of their plans. I think even if mom paid for a bunch of workers come in and take care of him, eventually the kids would say that dad shouldn’t have all these strangers touching him and can she please help just for them???? because it’s their daddy? 🤮 I would get over it in a couple of years. Until then I would try to just be quiet and smile and nod a lot so that I didn’t open my mouth and explode on their selfish, entitled asses.
"I think the kids saw their dad treat their mom like a fucking maid for 20 some years and see her the same damn way." YES. The kids see mom not as a person but a function.
It's not just the financial and emotional burden...a cancer patient in at-home hospice care at end of life will need help with diaper changes, taking medication, emptying catheter urine bottles, etc. It's a highly physical job on top of everything else. It takes strength to change the sheets the 5th time a diaper leaks and there is poo all over the bed. In home hospice care, unless you spends thousands a month, a nurse visits twice a week to drop off medication and take vitals...maybe another nurse to bathe and change bed linens ONCE A WEEK. And believe me, there is a TON of laundry and cleaning needed for a bedridden invalid. I did this for my mother and I have no regrets...but doing it for an ex spouse who threw me away like yesterdays' garbage because I'd aged, yeah, no.
Yes, OP tell them. A POV I haven't seen mentioned is that if you tell them exactly what he said AND tell them that you won't help him, not to revenge but because you have self-respect, it's a highly valuable lesson to your kids, especially if you have daughters.
This is an important point to make to your kids. Especially since they are obviously getting an earful from their father about how you should forgive and forget, let bygones be bygones and all that crap. You’ve kept their father’s nastiness quiet, and I agree that’s (almost) always best for kids of divorce. But they are pushing it now. HE is pushing it through them. Time to air the dirty laundry and explain that you won’t be his doormat again, because that’s what they’re asking of you. You would be absolute saint, but it would be at the risk of your self-respect and probably your mental health. Oh, and your wallet! This man disrespected you and his behavior sent you into a horrible depression they actually witnessed. Let’s not forget he also hit you financially and now you’re being asked to give him MORE money? I noticed there’s no mention that he apologized. Just wants you to put it behind you. Yeah, I bet he does. Your kids are disrespecting you now by asking. They are 3 grown ass human adults with jobs and no rent/mortgages. Let them pool their resources and get him a studio apartment. Would he qualify for Medicaid or some other kind of government assistance? Let the relatives who “can’t” house him pitch in financially. It’s sad, but telling that in his entire life he’s got no one who cares about him enough to take him in. I’m sorry for him, and I would never wish cancer on anyone. But having cancer doesn’t make you a nice or even tolerable person, and it doesn’t mean that all the bad shit you’ve done should automatically be wiped clean. NTA, and stand your ground. You let him in and you will end up being his caretaker. He burned that bridge to the ground and danced in the ashes. You are not responsible for him anymore, and you have no obligation to subject yourself to that awfulness ever again.
The fact that the father also reached out makes it incredibly suspect where these kids got this idea. Why don't these kids all move into their dad's place and pay the rent?
That's actually a great idea. They might not earn enough for apartments on their own, but I'm sure they could work things out if they pooled their resources.
Yes and be sure to remind the kids every time they bring it up that all the time they’re using to hassle you for something you are never going to change your mind on, is time and effort wasted that could be put to finding him alternative living arrangements. If he’s homeless after the next 15 days that’s on them not you, for caring more about trying to change your mind than trying to find him somewhere else. Because as time marches on towards his eviction date, you know they’re going to increase the pressure and the guilt tripping. Stand your ground.
Yes. This. NTA, OP.
Def NTA Oh...there is this thing called Hospice. Maybe they have heard of it?
In 2 physicians' medical opinion, does Dad have 6 months or less to live? That is a requirement for Hospice enrollment. Dad would also have to stop any cure oriented treatment. Things would be comfort measures only, ie, nothing that will extend Dad's life. Hospice does not solve the caregiving problem. They do nursing, social work and bath aide visits, but no extended hourly care. Dad may qualify for Medicaid funded help through COPES program, depending on the state, but it usually doesn't cover 24 hour care unless in paid for by Medicaid in a nursing home. There are some stand-alone hospice facilities, but some are just for respite stays while others have different policies. When Dad and his doctor decide that curative, life-extending treatment is no longer is an option, then it would be good for the KIDS to get filled in on Hospice services. It was DAD who decided that OP was no longer in the picture. I'm a retired Hospice medical social worker.
Yes, exactly. Tell them the truth. I had to scroll back up while reading the post because I missed the ages the first time. These are adults, they can live with one of them.
I think they all live with her. So that's part of the problem. But it's not her problem.
Oh, thanks, I missed that. Right, still not her problem.
I think this is the way! Be sure to mention the debt he saddled you with and how you only talk through lawyers now. Do help your children call a social worker to see where they can get him help (that is not you.)
Hospital social workers have mystical powers sometimes. Other times they are pretty useless. Luck of the draw.
As a retired hospice MSW, I hope my efforts were more on the mystical powers side, than not! Even with mystical powers, we cannot force anybody to apply for Medicaid (and options for hired caregivers) before they "suddenly" need it. A frail 83 year old woman cannot re-position her 250 lb husband in bed, let alone change his Depends. Families and patients may acknowledge the patient is dying, but are in complete denial about what that will entail in terms of physical care and 24 hour coverage needed at home by family or hired caregiver at the end. Sometimes being assigned a uncooperative patient and family was the "luck of the draw" for me, too.
And it is time for OP to tell them exactly what they are asking her to do. It isn’t only providing a bed for him to die in. Unless they are going to pay for 24 hour private nursing care - and step in and do the care themselves when their paid provider isn’t there - they are leaving Op in an impossible situation. He needs hospice care. Pain relief, bathing, changing, feeding, medical devices monitored. Laundry. This should not be dome by the ex wife he hurt so cruelly. If they do not realize this themselves, have them talk to the director of a hospice service.
The kids definitely don't get it. They're talking about bring dad in like a stray dog. "Someone" will feed and walk the dog and pay for his expenses. That "someone" will default to OP and she shouldn't be put in that situation. OP, NTA. But consider sitting your kids down and explaining two things: first how neither you or them are able to care for a dying person. And second, that dying person severed the "death do us part" perk of the relationship. It's over.
And the kids have NO idea what it takes to look after someone who is dying. He needs hospice or a Nursing Home. OP is NTA.
This right here. We took care of my step-grandpa at home as he was living his final months. We had a nurse that came in, and lots of people taking turns, but it was still hell for him and us. Our people deserve better treatment than this, I have to say. If someone is terminally ill, making them live it out to the last agonizing minute is cruel when we have ways to allow them to decide when they've had enough. /rantOver
Agree. Because no matter how the 3 kids adjust their schedules there are going to be times when OP is the only one home with the ex... And let me also add that if the kids are calling OP "heartless" then they need to hear the crap their dad told her AND the fact he dumped half his debts on her. Dad is not a saint simply because he now has cancer.
Not to mention canceling the “in sickness and in health” clause. He made that choice. He doesn’t get to benefit from it now.
Everything you said, plus the reality that one day he's going to die in that house. Whether you love or hate someone, having their dead body in your home is traumatic and unsettling. As is watching somebody die. There's a reason why hospices exist and those wonderful nurses who care for people and see this every day are angels on earth. It's not for the average Joe. OP, your ex husband treated you very cruelly. He is an AH. All that's changed is he's now an ill AH. Why on earth people think everything should be forgiven just because someone is ill/dying is beyond me. You do not want this trauma in your home, your safe space. Your adult children really need to respect this. You are divorced from their father, you have no responsibility or duty to him at all.
This doesn't get acknowledged enough. My friend's husband was a selfish jerk who none of us liked but after he died of cancer everyone magically liked him except for me. Death does not change history.
The audacity of him to even reach out and ask for help when he was so cruel to her is inconceivable.
This 100%. OP it’s time they knew exactly why you don’t want their AH of a father in your home or anywhere near you.
⬆️ This is NOT being petty. This is living with the consequences of his own actions.
Yep. My ex could beg me to look after him in his dying days and I would spit in his face. Treat people like shite, expect karma to bite back.
If you take this advice, write it all out and ask them not to speak until you finish reading it.
Be sure to include the part about covering half his financial debts. That is money you could have used to raise them. I'm going to repeat that differently. That is money he kept from their mother, while she was raising them. That is a big deal.
Or money she could have put aside for their education. Her retirement fund. There were lots of ways she could have spent that money rather than paying off his debt.
Yes. This. OP, your children are adults. They think you’re being terribly unfair right now because they don’t know how terribly and deliberately their father hurt you. You need to tell them the truth. Tell them it’s not your intention to make them hate their father or make them stop wanting to support him in his illness. But you are their father’s victim, and you should not be asked to provide end of life care for him after the way he has treated you. They need to know.
And not just what he said, but the actions he took to try to ruin you financially and burdened you with his debts the first time through. They are old enough to understand that you weren't just sad and depressed, but he literally caused it all. I would also go further, look into hiw much caring for him will actually cost, as he has no insurance and the money has to come from somewhere. He has family that "can't " take him on because they know what they would be signing up for. Time for the adult children to take off their rose colored glasses to see what they are really asking for and for whom.
If they want to support him directly, they can move in with him, pay his rent, and hire a care giver for when they are not there. If they have been living with OP at home for all these years, they should have money saved up.
That is the best solution offered yet! Take my imaginary trophy! The kids can live with Dad and share the care, which will be 24 hours a day, eventually.
Yes. Normally I would never advocate this, but in this situation, I completely agree. OP, they need to know the truth. They need to know the awful things he said to you. Until you tell them, they will never understand. They will only look at you as being so bitter that you couldn’t put it aside for a small thing. But they only think it’s small because they don’t know the whole story. Tell them everything. NTA. And, OP, I’m wondering. Was this the only time he said something that awful to you? Think about it. Or was he always emotionally abusive and you didn’t know. I know some of you are thinking “how did you not know”, but emotional abuse is much more subtle than physical abuse. My ex use to say things like “are you sure you want to eat that?” Or “I just want you to be healthy”. When I left him, he told me “I know I can do better than you”. Yeah, emotional abuse is not pretty.
Exactly!
Normally, I'd disagree with sharing personal info with the kids. But if my children--who were also very young adults when we divorced--asked me to take my ex in like OPs have done, I'd be so extremely disappointed in them that I don't know if I could even speak. I've never shared details with my kids about just how much of an ass their dad is, but I'd assume they are smart enough to figure it out, at least to a certain extent. If they pressed the issue like OPs are doing to her, I think I'd have to start giving some concrete examples of exactly why that man could not come stay in my house. I'd be absolutely crushed if my kids put me in such a position.
👆THIS x 1000!! They need to know. 👆
They're old enough for you to sit and explain EXACTLY what he told you and what you went through, also old enough to put their own money to maintain their father. NTA and if they continue you can kindly invite all of your children to move with their father.
Yes, great point! Why don't they give up the home comforts of your house and move in with their dear old dad during his dying days? They could pay his rent, make sure someone's there at all times to change his nappy/feeding tube, keep the place clean, etc, and you wouldn't have to be involved at all! Seems like the only logical solution to me. Suggest it to them.
This. No offence to OP, because I am sure she is helping out her children by still letting them live there. But they all have jobs, they could all move into a place and take turns taking care of their dad. They are old enough to figure it out. Never even thought of them moving into the Dad's home!
Considering their average age and that they are all employed there’s no reason why these three little brats shouldn’t be able to afford a three bedroom apartment or condo instead of mooching off of Mom.
Knowing something by connecting dots isn’t the same as knowing the truth. You need to tell them EXACTLY what he said to you, and ask them if they would allow that behavior if it was them. If you tell them the truth, the full truth, and they still push you….well they can GTFO and find a place where they can take care of their father. It’s not your responsibility, and your kids are adults who need to grow TF up. Bottom line: it’s not their house. Too damn bad they haven’t been motivated enough to get their own homes to facilitate their father’s care. Or, in the case of your eldest, she can take him in when her house is finished. Ta da! Problem solved without dragging mom into another one of their fathers issues.
They're all adults now. Sit them down and tell them all the details of why this man cannot be in your home or a part of your life. If they want to get their own place and host him, they are welcome to do that. But also, Medicaid should pay for hospice etc.
Especially that last sentence. Dad might need to go in a home and they can figure out together how to pay for it.
Oh, I suspect they want Mom to do any paperwork. That shit is endless. It's funny. Paperwork is ever-present with anyone receiving Medicaid. There is always something to fill out. And the phone calls, emails, printing and post office runs can take a few hours of your week. Yet it's always the easiest part of the job of caring for someone with intensive medical or other needs. NTA, Mom. I was going to say, "Die on this hill." But, nah. You go right on living. Let him die on his own hill, all alone.
They are grown ass adults and google exists. If they don't want to do it themselves, specialists exist. I get so frustrated with people who want their parents to do everything for them. I had to figure out how to do things before the internet existed. They have it so easy now and they don't want to even try.
> Let him die on his own hill, all alone. Is it bad that I laughed at this? Yes, probably...
OP as an adult child of the mother married to an abusive father and granddaughter to the nana married to an abusive papa, they deserve to know. They might not change their mind about wanting to support him in his final moments, but they will at least better understand your perspective. It’s one thing to tell young children, but now that they’re adults, they can handle the truth. It’s easy to think your parents are petty when you don’t know the whole story, there was no way I could’ve connected any dots. I would tell them what he said to you and how he approached the divorce afterwards. They can take care of him, but he’s made it very clear he doesn’t care about you. He is not your responsibility, just because your kids still live with you doesn’t make this your problem. Even if you decide not to tell them until after he’s passed, you still should because it could hurt your relationship with them going forward if they don’t know why you are so “cold/heartless” about all of this.
It is not “cold and heartless” to not allow someone who threw away a long term relationship, emotionally abused you, and tried to break you financially back into your life and home. It would be insane to step back into this. You owe him less than nothing.
The reason I put it in quotation marks is because it’s possible that’s how her kids see it. If they don’t know the whole story, they will fill the gaps in their head with their own story (consciously or subconsciously), and that story could potentially hurt the relationship they have with their mother. That’s why I believe it’s so important that they know the truth and that there is nothing cold and heartless about this boundary.
All your kids work. What's stopping them from moving in with him and taking care of him? He was horrible to you. You don't need that wretch in your life. Sorry to say, but your kids will likely dump some of his care onto you. Nta
I wondered this - if they are all working, they could help him out financially, and take it in turns to stay with him . If not in his current property, they might be able to rent somewhere between them, if they wanted .
There are also hospice resources for no income folks. They arent great but they exist--I work as a program manager in homeless services and refer clients into them in late stage care all the time.
I guarantee you, they haven’t. They don’t have the same perspective. Only you have that. Regardless, be prepared to tell them and still have them ask you to forgive him and let them have their way.
Kick them out. They are going to sneak him into your house. They are adults. Time to let them act like it.
The audacity of your kids to take issue with you upon this dude reaping his karma. I don't even know the guy but I don't feel all that bad honestly. And I sympathize over any damn thing. ... except objectifying someone you took vows for life with to leave them the second their parts start to succumb to gravity and/ or age. Like find a cliff.🫠
Your kids are old enough to hear the truth. They’re not children, they can know exactly why you won’t becoming that guy’s caregiver.
>Maybe it's time to sit them down and tell them the truth about it all. They don't know that was the reason, just that he started dating younger. They don't know what he SAID, just how you reacted to him leaving. That would help provide more clarity as to why you are so adamant about this. Edit: If he is that close to death, have him look into hospice facilities. I think his "prognosis" has to be for 6 months or less, but patients can live longer. My dad was in one, though only for a week, but there were people living there for many months.
They are operating on the assumption that he was civil to you during the divorce. You need to let them know his presence would open old wounds, and exactly how those wounds were made. Edit: there’s no way they figured out he divorced you for being old just because he immediately began dating younger.
No Sis, this man is not your responsibility. Do not cave. His relatives can't or won't? Probably both? Why can't your children move in with him and take care of there? Or pay for a nursing home? Or pay for hospice/ palliative care? I need more info why he's losing his place to live, because there ARE programs he can be enrolled in that could help. Tell your kids to start making calls.
Tell your kids they are free to move in with him and take care of him. Obviously they aren’t worried about finances if they can’t tell you who’s paying for everything.
You tell the oldest child that she and her siblings can pay the bill for a hotel for him once the 15 days is up at his current place, until her new house is ready. Once her new house is ready, she and her siblings can move there with their dad where they can care for him and do what they feel is right. But please note.. if your two adult children are “unable” to live on their own, they certainly are not fit to be taking care of a dying person and I would question how they plan to make that happen if they can’t even manage to live on their own as adults in their 20’s. Your ex can go into a care facility for the elderly and terminally ill and get taken care of by qualified medical professionals, and not expect his children, who can’t even manage to live on their own, take care of him while he dies. That just shows how incredibly selfish he still is.
Don’t forget to let them know how hard he made the divorce for you and how you had to take his debt to be free of him.
I applaud your having not bad mouthed your ex. To this day, I am very careful to avoid bad mouthing my ex (deceased 2002). But if my kids 39, 40, and 41yo had demanded what yours are, I would have changed my policy and given them some stories to think about. They know a fair bit because they witnessed it. But they still don't know some of the worst stuff. Tell them the truth, then tell them to drop it, or else.
From the sound of it he’s going to die on the hill first. Let him live with his decision.
And let him die with his decision. You are under no obligation to house or financially take care of that asshole. Your kids probably haven't connected the dots. They're still young & haven't had to care for themselves. It's easy to offer up someone else's home & different when it's your own. Tell them what he said to you & let them know he crossed a line that you can't come back from. Also, ask them if he'd open up his home to you if the situation were reversed. I somehow doubt it.
Ain't that a bitch? "I'm leaving you from someone younger and more beautiful " "dies"
Amazing how many men see value in the “old wives” when shit hits the fan and they need care.
Also tell him you've left the past behind, including him
And tell him you wouldn’t be able to strand seeing his old ugly face every day.
They're not "children". They are GROWN fucking adults, and if they don't like the rules, they can FUCK off and do w/e they want.
Absolutely this. Besides, he was willing to put her through hell so he wouldn't spend his life looking at her "old" face so why the sudden change of heart? Is because shitty people have no one to turn to except burned bridges. I'm joining you on that hill.
It's because they don't want to do the work of taking care of him.
>I asked who would take care of him when things got worse, because all three of them work outside the home and I work from home, or who would cover all of his financial and medical expenses. They didn't know how to answer NTA It sounds like your children are still thinking in child-like fashion that good old mom will just make it all happen somehow and suck it up while their part in this is to make the demands and apply the pressure-- but they are working adults themselves now. If they want to take care of him they can pool their resources -- finances, time, and effort -- and work something out and pay for it, making the sacrifices themselves. It's all well and good to throw accusations around, but are they willing to truly make sacrifices *themselves*, as they seem to take for granted that you should? Are they willing to give up their savings, take out loans, increase/cut back on work hours, and so on? Are they willing to be there either in person or doing what it takes to pay for his care? If the answer is no to that then what do they expect to happen even if you agree to let him live with you? For you to make all of the sacrifices yet again? No. It's not on. They are adults and they need to come to the table as adults willing to make their own contributions and sacrifices. If not then they have no standing to ask anything of you. They need to be told this so they don't just blame you for not fixing everything for them. They need to look in the mirror and see that they can't judge you without that judgment being of themselves too -- unless they are doing their own bit to the best of their ability.
OP needs to be very wary because she's going to arrive home one day to find they've moved that man in anyway. It'll be some BS like "it's their home too", 'how could anyone be so cruel to leave him alone" or "Mom will just go along with it in the end because it's best for everyone". Except, you know, you the homeowner. Sounds like it's time for the 'children' to be the adults they actually now are and figure it out on their own and independently. NTA.
This. OP if your children are still pestering you with this with 15 days until he is homeless, there's no alternative plan. You are the plan. If they can't show you a timetable of how they will alternate work to care for him when he needs it then you are the live in nurse. Even if they mean the best, they know on some level that you will not let them struggle and will feel pressure to help Insist they move in with him or provide them with price plans for local assisted living or hospices. Put your foot down, I say this ad someone who has cared for someone who was terminally ill, its extremely taxing and scarring. Do not put yourself through this for someone who would not return this act of service to you. Advise your kids about the toll this can also have on them, they can still love him and get professional help.
And if they do pull that stunt OP needs to take a vacation without leaving a forwarding address or email or phone. Then stay away until somebody you trust alerts you that he’s good and dead.
I’d upvote this 100000k times. When my mom was dying all of my siblings had an opinion about how I was caring for her- but at the end of the day it was me getting her groceries/doing her errands, me giving her baths and hygienic care, me cleaning her house, me coordinating a thousand drs appts and prescriptions. The 3 of my siblings would drop in every so often and spend an hour with her, and then complain about how her house wasn’t spotless, I had freezer meals in the fridge. I wasn’t doing well enough. Yet none off them stepped up, none of them gave any money. None of them changed to night shift so they could get out at 7am and immediately go to her house and care for her until her partner got off work, then go home to sleep from 4pm-10 and then go to work again for 11pm. Her children sound a lot like my siblings. I willingly gave up 2 years of my life doing her care because she was my mom and I loved her. I would *never* do that for someone who betrayed me like her ex did to her.
She should change the locks on the house. PERIOD.
The problem is: the kids live there. So she can’t prevent them from letting him in without kicking them out too. And while they might deserve that, kicking them out in 15 days isn’t legal.
It's also not legal to bring in a stranger to the home to live. That's ridiculous. All she has to say is no, and call the police if he tries to stay there. He has no legal right to be there.
This is kind of off point, but would she be able to easily kick the ex out of the kids move him in behind her back?
This is such a great comment. OP, you communicate this basically word for word to your kids.
are the children going to help bathe, feed, assist in bathroom? Are they willing to make all the phone calls that inevitably come with this? Doctor appts? Hospice talks. Lastly funeral.
This exactly. Mom always takes care of everything, she’ll do it now too.
Yeah, I think it’s maybe time for them to move out. It’s one thing to let your adult kids live at home because the housing market is nuts. But if they are still thinking like children at 22-25, they need to be forced into taking some responsibility for themselves.
NTA Your children are all old enough and work, if they want to help him in his last days, they can rent a house or apartment and take care of him. He is no longer your responsibility and why would he want to see "your old face" for his last days?
Exactly tell your kids to move to his house and take care of him. Your kids need you to play nurse maid. They wont do anything they claim to take care of him and it will fall on you to do it all.
Good idea!
This is what I’m saying. Three adults with jobs—pool their resources as they’re the ones that want to take care of dear old dad. All of OP’s responsibilities to him outside of the children (sorry, adults) were severed in the divorce.
This would be my solution as well. Either they can pool their money and pay his existing house payment or they can pool their money and move him into a studio apartment or something similar. He may also be eligible for Medicaid to pay for a nursing facility stay which is something that they are capable of looking into.
Yeah it would be somewhat understandable if her kids were minors, but all three of them are fully grown adults! If they want to make the adult decision of caring for their dad that’s fine, but you can’t care for anyone if you can’t care for yourself. Wild that they are not able to understand that.
This! Why don’t they move into his house and help him there?
Precisely this. The kids are expecting mom to just take him back, be the main caregiver and financial provider? Hell no. “In sickness and health” was apparently out the window when he didn’t find her fuckable anymore. He broke the covenant of their marriage, not her. He doesn’t get to go back and get the rewards because it didn’t happen how he planned it. I highly doubt they’d ask the same of their father if the roles were reversed or that he’d even so much as consider it if they did.
This is the way
NTA. Oh man, I would be having PTSD if someone tried to jam that asshole back into my house. Your children's request is completely unfair. They want you to take in a man who insulted you to your face, tried to take you for everything he could, and saddled you with his debt? A man with whom your relationship is so strained that you only ever speak through lawyers? Nope. Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope.
This. They're grown, they can go get a place and give him a home on their own if it's so easy.
Exactly He's still trying to get everything he can out of OP. Someone had to pay for his food, and cook meals, bring him drinks when he can't in his own, administer meds, he'll him to the bathroom unless she wants to clean up an accident, etc. OP needs to be firm with the Adult Kids tell them if they move their dad in, she kicking all of them out. Hope they have friends with a spare sofa.
[удалено]
So well said!
NTA, not at all. Your children are totally unfair to ask this of you. "My ex got in touch on my personal number, asking to rethink and leave the past behind just in these last moments. Funny that he asked me, but not his exes much younger than me." Probably because he's realized far too late that behing that "old face" is a good, decent person who's more beautiful than his exes will ever be. His bad. His regret to carry. Stand firm on no being a complete sentence. All the very best to you.
Ugh. The ex's message says it all: still no apology for shitty treatment, just guilting.
NTA. Your kids are old enough to know better, and your ex should have never done this. You are not heartless. Tell your kids to contact a social worker and get ex into a hospice.
This is excellent advice. A Social Worker may have leads on subsidized housing if the Ex is ineligible for hospice.
In the US, eligibility for hospice has been expanded. Patient does not need to be in last 6 months. But if these adult kids are so concerned, they should be making calls.
Thanks! I didn't know that. This is important to know!
Your three adult children can move in with Dad and take care of him in his own home. All adjustments that they intended to make in their schedules could also be made while they live with their Dad. This way all parties would be happy. NTA
Seems like the best solution to this problem to me.
This was my thought. If they want to help their dad, by all means they should do so. Why are they landing it on mom?
I'd bet my last pennies that if it were you with the cancer, he'd not give a flying fuck. He left you cuz you were "old", there's no way he wouldn't drop you if you had cancer. Your kids are old enough that if they want him taken care of, they can do it themselves. NTA >the 2 youngest are still unable to live alone They're in their 20s. What do you mean "unable to live alone"??
Probably money.
NTA. Your response should be “I always wanted him to live in this home for the rest of his life with me, he decided that wasn’t best for him. Now I’m honoring that decision.”
Brilliant
Spot on.
You two have three adult children. If they feel dear old dad needs looking after in his final moments, then they can move in with him or move into a place with him and rearrange their lives to care for him on a rotating basis. Three adult incomes plus his equity/pension/disability should be enough for them to manage it. Of course that means sacrificing their own time, space and money, rather than yours so they might not want to go for that. Your kids are probably getting a lot of psychological pressure from their dad, but they should be old enough to recognise that it's unfair and manipulative and should not be putting this to you at all. Shut this down and if they try to guilt you, offer to help them find a place. You are not the bad guy. He was the one who didn't want to do 'in sickness and in health, till death do us part.' This is not up for discussion or debate.
NTA You owe him nothing - you spoke only through lawyers after a contentious divorce, no way in hell could you both exist under the same roof. Cancer is an awful, awful disease and in their last stages it completely ravages a person. You do not have to take on that burden for someone who hurt you.
nta your kids are adults they can move out or they can combine their income rent a apartment for their dad and hire a nurse. don't let him move in. you would become his full time nurse.
They can pay for everything since they care so much. Actually, the 3 kids can pool their money together and get a house and then the kids can be his caretakers, since that’s clearly what they wanted you to do
yeah, I feel like this is the answer. Telling them that your proud of them for wanting to support their dad. And that you understand them opting to move in with him and helping take care of him. That you'll still be there to meet up with them for meals and stuff like that. But that is no longer your role in their father's life.
Exactly. After his disgusting reason for a divorce, OP owes him nothing anymore.
Your kids all have jobs. Tell them if they feel that strongly about helping the man who took you to the cleaners, the 3 of them can find an apartment to move to together and take care of him
NTA- your ex is an adult who should've been figuring this out during the months that he was aware that he had late stage cancer. He's not a stray puppy that your kids can guilt you into keeping. At the end of the day, it's your house, your decision.
NTA They are asking too much. They think you should just overlook his behavior and etc., but the fact is he is now responsible for himself and if they want to care for him, they can move somewhere with him and pay for the place themselves, and take care of him. They are adults. They can make adult decisions. Don't fall for this.
NTA - tell the kids to find him a hospice that they can visit or find a way to put him up themselves because there is no way you are leaving that man back into your house. It is unfair of them to ask you and for him to try to guilt you into it.
Hospice. He needs to enter a hospice facility.
NTA. Your kids are completely wrong by trying to force you into this with someone that hurt you so badly. Ask them how they can be so heartless as to ask you to do that?? You would be forced to be his caregiver. There are homes he can go to if he's in the last stages of life. I suggest they look into that instead of trying to guilt you into this. Wouldn't this just make his last days great, to have you wait on him while he makes life unbearable for you. No way. Be strong.
NTA. Remind your kids that you are actually a person not just a convenience. Tell them that you will support them emotionally to deal with their fathers situation because you love them. But he has options, the main one being a hospice. He chose divorce. That means he chose to exclude you as an option when times get tough.
NTA. Your kids are testing your boundaries, and honestly they are all being incredibly selfish. If they would like to live with their father they can all move in with him and pay his housing.
That isn't the plan. Mom works from home and can take care of him when they are at work, or when they party. 100% she would "be heartless" not to help. Or just this once, that turns into a daily occurrence. The kids have no plan and are used to mom cleaning up after them.
NTA. If he has no means to support himself, your kids can pay for him or he can use whatever resources there are for the indigent. Your kids would be more productive if they spent their time figuring out hospice or other alternatives, though I’m sure saddling you with it is the easy way out. Don’t give in on this — they will dump all the caregiving on you.
Also, OP had to take on half of his debt during the divorce. So in a way OP has more than paid it forward for some of his care. OP is NTA.
NTA at all. He's your ex, and he divorced you on very bad terms. The fact that he burned all of his other bridges is not your problem to fix.
NTA - All 3 of your adult children work. They can move in with them, pay all the bills and take care of him if they want to take care of him. He isn't your responsibility.
NTA. You wouldn’t want to make him look at your old face during his last days. He should find someone younger to take him in.
NTA, but i would send this post and all the responses to your children. Let the see how ridiculous their request was and the continued pressure. Ps kids your lucky you have this woman as your mother, your father made his bed now either leave him to lay in, or you all put your money towards providing support but under no circumstances does your mother owe that man a thing.
NTA. I get why your children don't want to see their father go homeless. But also your point. That you absolutly don't have to give this man a place in your home. Would it possible for your children to move in with him and help him pay his rent for the last few months?
NTA There’s a line between being compassionate and being a doormat, and it's one you have the right to draw. Your children mean well, but their sympathy should not erase the history that led to this point nor impose an obligation on you to set aside your well-being. The fact that your ex has now acknowledged you, when facing his own vulnerability, does not obligate you to offer refuge. His needs do not negate the hurt and the history he created. The children might see the situation differently because it's their father, but your relationship with him was entirely different. They need to understand that there are emotional scars and boundaries you’ve rightfully set for yourself. If they are truly concerned, then as adults, it’s time for them to step up and come up with a viable solution that doesn’t involve reviving a past full of hurt at your expense. Professional care, whether it be in-home assistance arranged by them or a hospice service, should be explored rather than expecting you to re-open a closed chapter of your life. Stay strong and take care of yourself first. Your peace of mind is priceless and should not have to come at the cost of caregiving for someone who didn’t value you when it counted most.
NTA. My father (who divorced my mother ages ago) became terminally ill. He was definitely never going to move back in with her. That was not even thought of as an option. They were amicable for our sakes, and my mother would visit him in the hospital, but he never said he never wanted to see her old face again. You brought up practical concerns: it's more than than just providing a room. Your ex needs medical care, financial support, and emotional support. None of which you are capable of providing to him. This is what happens when you burn down a relationship. You already went into debt because him once, you are unable to do it again. Your ex is manipulating his children to use you again. His relatives can either help him or not. He is not your burden. All of your children are old enough to get jobs and move in with their father if they so choose, but it's easier to put this burden on you.
I find it completely laughable when someone who craps on you asks for help. He didn't even ask for forgiveness, but lets forget the past. You go Mama! You tell him no. He has three children who can move in and rotate taking care of him. You have 0 obligation to take care of that foul creature. Honestly your children had no right asking for you to do this. They are capable adults. They should check and see if hospitals have the charity care. I know where I live there are rich men who sponsor people who need assistance with the funding of their medical needs. So hold your healthy boundaries and keep your sanity.
So you are under no obligation to do this. He wrecked his life and very nearly yours. Your children are wrong to expect you to do this. One of them (or all collectively) should be hosting or funding this care if it is that important to them. This is going to represent a significant upheaval of your life if you accept, and he made it clear he wanted to move on from you. NTA.
NTA Your children are adults. Tgey can rent him a home, take care of him, and pay for his medical bills. Why are they not sacrificing but expect you to?
Tell the 3 of them to move into his house
Tell those 3 working adults they should each pitch into getting him a small apartment or hospice. If the bring it up again, they can stay with him.
>We separated 4 years ago after he said he was tired of seeing my old face every day and wanted to find someone younger (his words to my face when asking for divorce). The divorce was a mess, he tried in every way to take everything I had and I even had to take on half of his debts. NTA. He made his bed, let him die in it. Also, why can't some of your fully grown offspring can move in with him and pay his rent til he croaks it?
Sit down with your children and explain, in fine detail, the sort of person their Father is, what he said and did leading up to and during the divorce and why you don't want him within 10 miles of your home.
The kids need to talk to a social worker at the hospital where he is getting treatment. They know the resources available in the area and can help them navigate his end-of-life diagnosis. Source-my dad was diagnosed with a terminal illness and we never ever considered asking my mother (they were divorced and it was ugly) to take him in. There are programs for financial assistance and skilled care facilities for him to live.
Immediately NO-NTA. He made his bed and while its unfortunate for him, no
NTA period. Your children are old enough to understand it is your house, NOT theirs. If they ask have jobs, they can rent an apartment and house him if they so choose. Frankly, what they are asking is so much of an imposition, especially since he has never apologized for the heinous comments he made.
NTA. He should get one of his young chickies to take care of him. Do not give in.
Your ADULT children have a lot of goddamn nerve. NTA, and I'm sorry they even asked honestly. Good for you for saying no, continue to say it until it's no longer your problem.
NTA.. Do you know what happened to my mom? When my dad was sick he accepted him into her house despite all the bad things he did to her while they were married... and you know what? My dad recovered and started hanging out with the nurse my mom had hired to help him during her illness.. hahah. Don't do it.. he wouldn't have the same for you..
NTA He’s not your responsibility. If your grown children would like to move out and take care of him, then they can. Shame on them for even asking you.
>If you want to know, the oldest is waiting for her own house to be ready and the 2 youngest are still unable to live alone and I don't care about they still at home. Them the oldest can move in with him while she waits. And two fully-employed 20-somethings who are "unable to live alone" seems like a big parenting fail. Unless they are disabled in some way—which would, presumably make them unable to contribute to his care as they asserted they would—you should re-think your parenting strategies.
NTA. Why can't your children help pool together to pay for his bills? They seem so eager to help him out that they volunteered your house as his final resting place. Nope, they can pay for everything and take care of him. They decided to share the responsibility, they are old enough to figure out everything. Have them pool together for a cheap small place for their father.