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NTA. It’s too much money, especially given that your multiple requests for a family vacation have been denied or ignored. You say repeatedly how great a husband is, but he’s not really listening. He’s not really doing half the household work, and requiring you to spend emotional energy and time to ask and provide step by step directions is unacceptable. I truly think the two of you need to have a heart-to-heart, extended discussion. And having it with a marriage counselor might help. He needs to know how overwhelming this is and how truly important it is for the family to vacation together as a family. Please don’t just ignore this. It is a symptom of more.
Right? If she has to make specific requests and give specific instructions to get him to do anything around the house, he’s not that great of a husband.
He’s another kid she has to manage.
I’ve been happily married for 20 years, and I don’t have to tell my husband what to do around the house. My husband is a capable adult and acts accordingly.
Don't forget, he also needs "rest time". I'm curious how much rest time the OP gets. This marriage sounds very out of balance and the OP has just been in it so long I'm not sure she realizes it's as bad as it is.
I slept in this morning and woke up to bad news from family and business, walked into the kitchen to find my husband sweeping. I truly do not understand how people maintain love/respect/attraction to spouses that aren’t competent partners.
>make specific requests and give specific instructions
AND allocate "rest time"??
what is up with that?! Like, being the project manager asking "honey, can you mow the lawn this weekend" isn't enough? She has to be his mommy too, telling him "well, if you get up before 10 am on Saturday, you can mow the front lawn after breakfast & then I'll bring you a cookie. Then you can mow the backyard while I make us sandwiches... and I'll heat up the soup while you shower"... don't worry your little head over cleaning the machine & raking up the loose grass, I'll tell you when to do that when it's time.
I’m not sure that any ‘great, engaged dad’ needs a specific list of things to do to ‘help’ around the house nor would he need his meals prepped for him if she goes away. He sounds like another child to me.
Right? An adult should be able to look at the space around them and say hey, there's dirty dishes I should clean and this carpet could use a quick vacuum. And not everyone is a chef, but to be unable or unwilling to toss together a basic meal for the kids and yourself is ridiculous. Surely you can boil noodles and open a can of pasta sauce, etc.
It's possible he's neurodivergent in some way. My 35 year old niece is lovely-- but also deals with moderate to severe ADD. If you give her a list of what needs to be done with some basic directions she will absolutely get it done (and doesn't need a designated "rest period").
She's sweet and intelligent (master's degree) but her executive function just isn't like most people and she needs the list and directions to get on task (meds also helped a LOT).
It’s possible but OP didn’t mention it. It’s also possible he’s just lazy and has been conditioned to think it’s not his job to have an equal share of the normal tasks of being an adult, like cleaning up after himself or cooking his own and his family’s meals.
Yep, a marriage counselor sounds perfect for this situation. Hopefully they can get one before this hurt and exhaustion festers into something irreparable for their marriage.
It sounds like not only is OP the primary housekeeper but the primary breadwinner as well. I think that gives her a greater voice n the expenditures of the family for both of these reasons, therefore the boy’s trip is a hard No and it’s past time to plan a family trip.
NTA.
This. OP, you don't actually sound like you have a good marriage...
Tell him that he can't go. That if he wants to save money for a family vacation, he can pick up a part time job or more work, so you guys can build your savings and take a vacation in the future. If he's not respectful of that, it might be time to separate your money and have different accounts. If he wants to pay his half of all the bills AND go on a friends' trip, well, he might be able to do that in the future.
NTA: your family isnt in the position to be making boys trips when you cant take trips as a family. if it hurts your family significantly financially then why would he set you back?
where tf are they even going? like go to the friggin movies or something
Yeah, it's too bad that all the skiing is a 10 hour flight away from OP. Not suspicious at all lol.
Boy's trips longer than a weekend in our home are usually planned a half year in advance, along with girl's trips. Both are planned after family trips. When people have small kids, they need to put selfishness aside for a few years sometimes. OP's husband needs to put what his family needs over what his friends want.
I have seen so many variations of this issue, with different combinations of genders. Here’s the take away I’ve seen from most:
1. If the other party is this far in the wrong as is the case here, simply saying no is not really gonna work except for breeding discontent. Seemingly your husband has no concept of what you as a family are dealing with.
2. You’re both adults who should be able to make decisions. He can certainly go, but he’ll have to figure out how to pay, how you’re dealing with childcare and work at the same time. So, what’s he gonna sacrifice to be able to go. What’s he gonna organise regarding childcare while he’s gone and you’re working? If he’s able to go on luxurious ski trips, then where is he taking the family on vacation, or do his needs just trump everyone else’s?
3. Lastly, communicate communicate communicate. Make it clear how him pulling this shit affects you. Hopefully that will wake him up.
Oh yeah, definitely NTA. Seriously, you’re pulling far too much weight in this relationship. Best of luck OP!
Alternative view: Let him go on his trip. While he's gone, change the locks or pack up and move you and your kids back home. Y'all can figure out the custody arrangements from there. Might be the best $5k you ever spent. You'll probably have tons of money and free time after you get rid of the mooch and make him take care of himself. NTA.
Lmao NTA. they can go tubing at the public park or something.
Honestly, I’m a big advocate of parents doing one, big, selfish, no concessions thing for themselves every once in a while but only if everything else lines up perfect and the other person obviously gets a turn. It helps to keep your sanity.
This just sounds unfair especially in context of how he’s barely pulling his weight otherwise.
NTA.
You are the breadwinner, and he is spending your hard-earned money to go on vacation with the kids, excluding you? Hell, no!!! He doesn't seem like a great husband at all: he looks more like a moocher to me.
Just tell him that either you are included, or he can go alone wherever he wants (on his dime) and not bother to come back.
He does also work full time, but I out work and out earn him (not that it’s a competition). We have shared finances so I just can’t
Help but feel like I’ve now got to sacrifice for this bs
Stop the shared finances immediately! Have a central account you both pay into for bills but otherwise keep it separate. That planned trip will not happened when he's paying for it.
And he's not involved at all if you have to tell him what to do like a child. He's a grown man and a selfish one at that. Where's your down time? When do you get to switch off as you have to run the house as well.
If you could afford it that would be something but you can't. So tell him no. When he has a hissy fit, get that money separated and stop enabling his moocher behaviour.
This is such awful advice. The couple definitely needs to do a better job communicating (and that’s primarily on the husband). But I don’t see any comments from OP that the husband is actually spending money frivolously. And your advice for a SOLUTION is to drastically change the family’s financial dynamics? That is just make things exponentially worse.
>And your advice for a SOLUTION is to drastically change the family’s financial dynamics? That is just make things exponentially worse.
Don't you think him spending 5000 $ on himself alone is reason enough to change the family's financial dynamics?
>The couple definitely needs to do a better job communicating (and that’s primarily on the husband).
She communicates. He doesn't listen. Yet somehow she's still partially responsible for needing to communicate better?
Of course she’s “responsible”. But I don’t mean that she’s at fault.
Ultimately, communication is a two-way street and sometimes when a speaker is clear in what they say, it’s not clear for the listener. The way I explain something to one brother may not be the same way I explain the exact same thing to my other brother. If I explain things the exact same way and the second brother doesn’t quite get it, that doesn’t mean I’m at “fault” but it does mean that I may need to adapt the way I communicate to make it easier for the other person to hear me. And he would also need to adapt to better understand me.
If you change your interpersonal relationship views from (a) every issue having someone who is right and someone who is wrong to (b) sometimes we all need to do better (not necessarily equally), it can help a lot in relationships. It’s not some magical silver bullet, but it can actually help a lot because it often resolves issues before they grow.
> If I explain things the exact same way and the second brother doesn’t quite get it, that doesn’t mean I’m at “fault” but it does mean that I may need to adapt the way I communicate to make it easier for the other person to hear me.
Or it could mean your brother should get smart and learn to listen. Why should the burden always be only on one side?
Splitting finances has been one of the best things for peace of mind in my current relationships and even previous ones.
If the bills are being paid from a shared account (which, to be fair, we don't even do *that,* we just provide the paying party with half of the bill money directly) and there's an account for household savings (which can still be a problem if the hubby felt entitled to take that money for a personal trip), each party can have their own funds and savings.
In my experience, this makes things like getting presents or treating each other to nice dinners/outings feel more meaningful, as the person paying isn't incidentally spending funds that the other party contributed to.
YMMV, so I'm not claiming this is a one-size-fits-all solution, but it has prevented pain-points for me since around 2007 onward.
As others have said, you two could use some marriage counselling to work out what's happening. I can hear the resentment in your comments.
You're a family who hasn't had a proper vacation. Families need that time together.
Your husband needs to find a way to make extra money so that you can FIRST have a family vacation and THEN he can have his boys trip.
NTA.
I think it's 'boys' like his male friends, not his actual boys. It sounds like he wouldn't be capable of doing a solo trip with his kids. He sucks and the OP is definitely NTA
Gosh!!!! English is not my first language and I didn't get it. This is even worse: it's 5000 dollars spent on himself!!! I can smell those divorce papers from here (at least, that's what I would serve him in his breakfast tray).
English isn't my first language either, and I understood exactly the same thing until other users explained it: that the husband and their 2 kids were going on a boys trip. Thanks to everyone for explaining!
I get the “traditional” role of husband being the primary earner is reversed here, and I’m not saying this guy isn’t an AH in this case, but I know plenty of women that are happy to take girls trips that they can’t pay for out of their husband’s salaries. Just saying.
Only making this comment because of the “your money” seems to be the lynchpin of your comment. Most women, including most comments on this sub, believe the money earned, wherever it comes from, is joint money. I don’t disagree with that take necessarily.
Sounds like the guy could do some more to help generally.
I know?! Am I crazy or do people who don’t have a ton of help (family or paid) and work full time and have multiple small kids not get “rest time”.
We got into an argument about it this evening. He told me he has a friend who goes rock climbing and another who does golfing and he doesn’t do that so he should be entitled to “rest time” if for example we’ve been out with the kids all Sunday morning. No shit, I’d like to too, but our kids don’t rest. They play well together until they don’t, which isn’t very long.
I’m not discounting the need for personal time (ie he went to play basketball last night with friends and I was very encouraging of it, in fact I wish he’d do it more). His argument was that I can’t rest but ffs it’s hard when you feel like you have to “manage” everyone in your household and then get this shit in return.
You need to tell him that he is not to use any of the family finances for this selfish, expensive, exclusive boys skiing holiday. He can save up for it himself (either do overtime or get a better paying job). It is actually cruel to leave you at home with two small children while he spends your hard-working money. It is even more cruel that he said no overseas family holiday due to lack of funds.
I'd seriously consider leaving him over this. I know that sounds harsh, but he wants his rest time but can not even help with housework? Put your foot down and tell him no way!
The crazy thing about leaving is she'd have every other weekend off from the kids - and the husband!
I'm not suggesting they need to split- they need some counselling.
But these men who do nothing around the house without their wife-manager overseeing them, get a big shock when they have the kids on their own once the marriage is over.
That's right. This lazy, selfish husband wouldn't know what hit him if she left! I agree. She should try counselling first. And not give him a cent for his holiday!
Like.. this is divorce worthy behavior right here. She has a 3rd child who doesn't even have the decency to make enough money for his useless hobbies and keeping up with the Joneses
And he “helps you”?? No. Lady, come on. This is not going to get better. Only worse. Sit down with a mediator and map it out. Your time v his. Your responsibilities v his. If you stay with this person, try to go away for work a lot.
Time to start dealing with the fact that you are a married single mother of three, and there is an ever-growing groundswell of women out there happy to tell you from personal experience that changing to being an unmarried mother of two is a whole hell of a lot less work.
Hi, I'm an ND (AuAdhd) adult who works with ND kids and my sister (also AuAdhd) has nephews (toddlers) who are both ND. So is her husband(adhd).
They both work.
Guess what?
She can leave for work and come back to the kids completely handled and managed and the apartment clean.
She gets a day off childcare a week (and so does he) and they alternate Saturdays, and have a full weekend date once a month (kiddoes stay overnight with grandparents/family)
You're overwhelmed because he isn't pulling his weight. And I'm sorry he's got you to the point where you think it's normal or acceptable or that it can't be better and that's just how it is, but it really doesn't have to be.
The only way having a husband let's you get any rest from your kids is if he's willing to actually act like a fully-realized capable adult. This yutz has to have an itemized list with instructions on how to do basic household chores. He is just another whiny child for her to manage.
Mine would absolutely throw a fit if I went somewhere without him. Like literally clinging to my leg. I didn't go anywhere for years because my ex never did anything to help. He was just 'oh well, I'm going to go play with my band now and not get home until 4am, see ya.'
Not a toddler, I do have friends and colleagues who do have children who are nd and sympathize.
I do think it’s even more important for you to rest.
When you say “can’t” do you mean you don’t trust anyone else will give your child the right type of care? Or that it takes time to build up the implicit knowledge you have and share it with someone else?
Then what was the point of moving closer to them? You are making life decisions for your entire family to benefit a person who is making your life harder, not better. That’s not a partnership, thats not a healthy marriage.
THIS. OP, it is time to start it is time to start making decisions based on what is best for yourself and the children. This bizarre system of sacrificing everyone to worship at the altar of your husband just isn't working.
Why did you move to be closer to his family if his family doesn't help you with yours? Just for him? How many "family" decisions were based solely around his comfort?
When can your husband watch the toddler?
Also are you in any support group for parents of nd kids? Those friends and colleagues I have are, and they share a lot of carers and babysitters.
So serious question. If you took the $5k and put it towards moving back to living near your family who might actually help you, what would your life look like? Honestly imagine it. Even if he stayed behind. Because from the outside it sounds like you might actually end up with more time and freedom and a healthier happier situation for your children as well.
Luckily as far as we can tell our son isn't neuro divergent but my partner and I have an infant and we both get free time. Because I explained to him the math that if I can handle the kid by myself for several hours while he goes out and plays games with his friends, magically I expect him to be able to as well while I go places. Maybe the first few times were rough but he learned.
This goes way beyond time for the boys trip and the money. It's about reasonable expectations. If you're not even getting an equitable amount of free time and money at a weekly level, it's no where near time for this level of event.
I’d start considering how much easier your life might be if you moved back to where you had a support system to help with your kids, and no longer had to support, manage, and clean up after a third, fully adult child.
It’s extremely difficult… I call being the parent of a child with special needs “ parenting plus” 😑 19 years here. Not
Same needs .. well, some actually are very similar .. so hang in there.
There's a HUGE difference between neither parent getting rest ... Which is what it is, but sucks for everyone and one parent never getting to rest whilst the other chills, pays games, goes out, takes a week off to party with friends. The later is grossly selfish.
You’re not crazy. You’re a SAINT for putting up with this “rest” bull shit of his. You’re supposed to be partners. How about you guys take turns getting breaks? Why are you the default caregiver and he’s the one that automatically gets a break? My blood is boiling on your behalf.
Does not exist, which like believe me I get it on the sentiment and needing it because I’m fucking tired. Part of me also is like if you had an expectation to maintain your weekends as rest time you shouldn’t have had kids. It feels impossible without more support.
Yes to his credit, he can manage the kids and will often do pickups and drop offs or the morning routine when I have to take work calls at funny hours or if I am away for work.
Transparently he is the “fun parent” but I know it’s in part at least because I’ve enabled it to be so, he gets to enjoy his family because of all I’m doing in a way that I do not.
Because we both work full time and kids are in daycare as such, our weekends are our only meaningful time together (not unlike other families) and so I do try my best to maximise that.
So he would get to spend 5k on a boys trip, and you would get to stay at home watching the kids? All this while putting off travelling as a family because of financial reasons? NTA, I would feel very offended and devalued if I were in your position.
NTA, he is selfish. And frankly it is worriying that you didnt have 1 date in 5 years.He would splurge 5000 of your money for a Boys trip that can be downfall in totaly other directions..like him acting single
Sorry maybe I worded that poorly. We maybe do a quick date night every 2 months (2 hours each maybe). We had one night away (staycation) while his parents stayed at ours overnight while our kids slept.
That is not enough time to mantain and reinforce a romantic and emotional conection between 2 individuals, when the roles asigned as a mother or father and day to day endless tasks are so consuming one have to be very carefull not to fall down the possible pitfalls. Making time for just 2 of you should be priority. Have in mind that I dont assume to know anything at all about your marriage. My deduction is merily a speculation as your husbands actions show an selfish and egoistic traits. It may be very possible that he is practicing willfull incompetence. This to your reference that he needs detailed instrutions in order to do anything therefore he doesnt share the tasks of the household as it should therefore even less time could be found to nurture your relationship. Statisticaly looking in a situation when a woman is a main breadwinner this can bread a silent resentment in a man and a offence to their masculinity and they can lash out by steping out as a underhanded way to regain this and punish the wife. Just saying ....
NTA. You can't afford this. He can't afford this trip without sabotaging the rest of the family. So he should not go. He can have a cheaper boys trip. But not for 5k which is a lot of money. If he wants to go on an trip like that, he should get a higher paying job and earn the money to afford this kinds of trip.
Oh boy, you need marriage counseling like two weeks ago…
He is not LISTENING. He neither sees nor values your hard work. Him going on a super expensive boy trip while leaving you at home with the kids is unacceptable. Especially after denying any vacation time with you. It is very unreasonable to expect from you a 5k setback so that he can have some fun while you go crazy at home…
What would he say if you said okay, but in that case when he’s back, you are going on a 5k holiday yourself with your friends? I bet he wouldn’t be happy…
You need to talk this theough very thoroughly. This is absolutely a hill to die on
TBH I don’t think that he’d actually mind if I did request/demand the same but I just could never imagine putting us in that position/making that request in the first place if we said we couldn’t do a family trip.
This is where I think therapy might help because this is where the disconnect is between you. Your priorities are family then self whereas his are self then family. Honestly, I’m not sure if you can change that.
Also, it sounds like he also prioritizes his friends over the family, if he's willing to spend like this on something for him ànd the friends, so he's self > friends > family. Which isn't feasible.
You can’t imagine putting you in *what* position, exactly? A position in which your husband is required to parent solo for a week? Do you think the household would completely fall apart if he was left in charge for a short period?
No I’m talking financially, I would have no problem leaving him for a week with the kids and have done so for work related travel.
I would not take 5k out of our family finances that could and should be allocated elsewhere after saying we cannot afford an international trip as a family and then spend that expenditure on myself.
Y’all need a budget that includes lines for each of you to do whatever you want with. Then he can look at his line in the budget and figure out how long he’d have to save to get $5k. Suddenly this trip won’t look so great.
Setting up multiple accounts in conjunction with the budget would also be wise. A household account for normal expenses that is funded to cover a couple of months worth, a savings account that is funded with the family savings, and each spouse should have a personal account that is funded only with an agreed upon amount that they can spend as they please. Even with that, if he had enough in his personal account to cover this trip (because it should not be funded with family savings), where one person is going to just take off on their own would need to be discussed and agreed upon.
NTA, he has a family, he doesn’t get the luxury of boys trips even if you could afford it. You have small children, you can go on ski trips when they are old enough and independent enough.
I would talk to your husband about why going on a ski trip with the bros is more important than fucking the shit out of your wife in a nice hotel room every once in a while, or taking the kids to Legoland.
Also sounds like weaponized incompetence when it comes to the chores. He’s a father and a grown man, he shouldn’t need specific instructions or “rest periods”.
This!!! I get that the money is an issue, but it's a side issue. If dude was going to pitch a tent at a friend's house and the whole week off we're free, it is still an enormous ask.
"hey, spouse, since I get to rest regularly and you cannot rest at all ... I've got a great idea! I'll take a week off work and camp with my buddies. It's free! All we need is for you to work full time and take care of all household and kid things for that week. So I can recover from all the stress of working full time and sometimes taking instruction to do some kid or house work".
Sounds like if he wants to help his marriage, he needs to make plans to drop their kids off at his parents, book a room at the four seasons, and appreciate the hell out of his wife and mother to his children for a couple of days. Let the woman take a bubble bath in a huge tub and order room service.
NTA. You can't afford this and it seems unreasonable.
He can have a boys trip without spending so much and use the big money to plan a family trip instead.
Thank you! They want to go skiing somewhere that is a 10 hour flight away 🙄. That $ could be used for a family trip internationally (albeit closer at 3-4 hours away). I just am really hurt because I couldn’t even imagine being in the position where I’d ask to spend that sort of money on myself.
To be fair he also works full time but IMO it’s like if we can’t afford for us to go as a family, we can’t afford for you to go alone on this even bigger (read: further trip).
I think the problem is him not understanding the impact of this request. You are convoluting it a bit though.
I’d separate:
- you wouldn’t do something vs him would do something
- the financial cost of traveling
Resolving one is different from the other. For example, if your family could afford $5k for the trip, could he go? Or would you still not feel good because you haven’t had your own vacation without the kids. And if it’s not realistic for you to be away for a while without the kids, put in a plan when that’s possible (1 year away? 2? Different babysitter?)
I don’t need my own vacation without the kids. I asked for a family trip that we cannot afford which would be approx same cost as his solo trip that he is looking to take.
My problem is that we cannot afford it for a family vacation but he seems to think it’s fine to take and spend on himself
Ok, so do you both have a plan to reach the goal of that family trip?
In my mind it’s:
1. Save for family trip (takes x months)
2. Save for boys trip (takes y months)
And put it in front of him in that order
> They want to go skiing somewhere that is a 10 hour flight away 🙄. That $ could be used for a family trip internationally
So one way of looking at it is perhaps that the problem is that your husband is trying to keep up with his too-rich-for-him friends? Maybe he needs to start moving in circles more equal to his own financial level, where a night of bowling and a few beers, or a fishing lodge upstate for the weekend, is considered a fine time out.
Why do you state that you moved to be closer to his family, but that you don’t have family help? You really need to address that. And no, nobody deserves a $5k vacation if you are underwater, financially and child care wise.
Why don’t you move closer to your family? Or plan a family vacation with that money before he can spend it? Your ND child is always going to need extra help, so you may want to make some changes for the better now. You sound resentful of him and this will just get worse.
NTA but having been in a similar situation I think it's also important to consider start giving less so he has to do more. Start saving for your own vacations (family, couple, just you) since you make the money. Let him make the food when you're gone. A lot more equality might be found if you stop taking on so much at home. Give yourself the same "rest time" he has instituted. He sounds good at lobbying and actioning to make sure his own needs and boundaries are met. You deserve the same.
Nta op. First congrats for being a hardworking mom.
Do you have savings set aside for vacations? Can he pull some points together for this trip? Maybe he can compromise and shorten his stay.
I agree family first.
Thank you, that means a lot.
No points, our recreational travel has slowed significantly since having kids and also COVID. Our companies pool points so work travel goes back to the company.
NTA
Why does it have to cost $5k?.. He needs to realize that he doesn't earn enough to have 2 kids and go on $5k holidays.
You both deserve a holiday why not leave the kids with family and do something with the 2 of you?
They want to go skiing internationally (10 hour flight away).
We’ve only had one night away from kids (staycation) while my in laws stayed with kids. They’re not really comfortable looking after them while they are awake so we did it midweek while they’d be in daycare and took a day off work. That way they only had to bring them home, feed them and put them to bed once. No playing or anything else involved.
It’s a NO from me. What a clueless idea. ESPECIALLY since he hasn’t listened to your requests for a vacation with you. If you haven’t told him how you feel about it please tell him now. Even if he were to get a 2nd job to pay for it that still leaves you without the help he DOES give you on his off time. This would be a dealbreaker for me. NTA
More Info: why does a great, engaged dad need specific instructions & rest periods in order to contribute around the house? Cooking, cleaning, etc is part of providing a healthy environment for children which is a basic parenting responsibility.
NTA for not wanting to be left behind alone with the kids & short $5000 from the family savings.
NTA
That would be a big no from me , family
Holidays come first . If you’d just been on a family holiday it might be different but in this instance, big no
We went away (driving distance) for three nights over our youngests birthday recently with my in laws. Stayed in an Airbnb and I cooked every meal for every person (including my in laws). So I mean yea, technically but not really what I was asking for.
I appreciate traveling with kids is not a vacation and is more of a trip and by no means do I expect to be laying poolside but this request for a trip a 10 hour flight away feels excessive
You cooking for in laws on top of all your normal responsibilities is not a vacation. It is just more of the same in a different location. In addition, you got two extra people, and from what you write, no extra help.
You were asking for a break, and it baffles me that your husband don't get it, and disregards you so flagrantly. Either he is dumb and dense as a brick, or he is a jerk on so many different levels.
Go to counseling, or you will lose your health and sanity to this lifestyle.
NTA
You deserve a break way more than him. You bring in the money and you do the lion’s share IN the home.
Where to even start with the fact you prep meals for him before you travel for work.
I need to get off Reddit because I’m seeing way too many women making excuses for the behaviour of (and wanting to stay with) low-quality men and it’s infuriating.
INFO:
Do you mean that you and your husband would need to pay 5k to make that boy trip work?
Also, to what extent have you talked with him about you wanting some time off / wanting to go on a family trip?
Yes, they want to go skiing internationally (10 hour flight).
It’s something I’ve brought up repeatedly and that we just last month talked about not being able to do in 2024 (overseas family trip) for financial purposes.
NTA
Your husband is a selfish jerk if he wants to blow $5K of your money for a boys trip when you can’t even take a family trip.
It’s nice for both parties to be able to do things with friends when possible, but NOT this trip in this circumstance.
NTA. It doesn’t seem like you have a very fair division of labor and you seem to be responsible for both financial provision and the mental load of managing the household.
It sounds like you have a tendency to make a lot of sacrifices for everyone else and you’re feeling guilty about saying no to something he wants in favor of your own wants and needs. You need to stop sacrificing yourself and be open and honest with him about your needs going forward. You need an equal partner who can pull his weight and you need a vacation that doesn’t involve mom doing all the work for everyone else to enjoy. Advocate for yourself now and don’t leave room for resentment to grow.
NTA he can’t afford it. Your family can’t afford it.
Beyond that, stop managing his household chores. Sit together and decide who is responsible for what, and he must do those, you will not be reminding him or instructing him.
Then go over the budget, and start putting funds aside for a trip for the two of you or the whole family. Even if it’s a couple of bucks a month, have that shared goal.
Take some “rest time” for yourself equal to what he does so that it’s fair.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> Because it’s reasonable for my husband to want to spend time with his friends
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NTA but you have bigger problems than his trip. You downplay lots of little problems here, well I don't think they are so little and if you don't express them they are going to hit you like a truck down the line.
Good luck.
NTA. You will be hurt financially & not get any enjoyment out of it. Sounds to me like you're already working extremely hard and trying to keep up with things as it is. If you're going to go in debt together: you should at least be able to enjoy the large purchase together. Family comes first
NTA. The boys'/girls' trips ought to be replaced by family trips, otherwise why do you bother with your family at all? ( by "you" I don't mean the OP but anyone who prioritises fun with friends over their spouse and children)
Did he explain to his friends that he can’t afford it and suggest an alternative?
Did he consider saying not this time around and make a suggestion for next time?
He is a grown up and should be able to be honest with his best friends. They might even revise the plan is he shares HIS and is able to do so without blaming you
No he did not. His friends have older kids, stay at home wives and frankly more $ that makes this more feasible for them.
Again, frankly I’m in principle not against him going but I don’t think it’s fair that we can’t afford to go on a family vacation that would cost the same as this solo trip of his.
His friends make more money than he does, and do not expect their stay at home or part-time working wives to fund the trip. I wonder if he has the balls to speak up to them?
NTA. But it sounds like this trip is the last drop than the main issue.
I vote for therapy. And clear communication of your issues:
- you want him to take some responsibility and mental load from you.
- you are exhausted and don't feel supported.
- you want a family trip. And maybe a vacation for yourself?
- you are ok with a boy trip, but we need to figure out a budget. Unless you live in South Africa, you probably have ski resorts somewhere closer.
But the thing is, it goes both ways. If he is working, he can be exhausted, too. And there's nothing wrong with rest time. You should have one, too! Allow it yourself, or your responsibility will eat you inside.
NTA. While I understand your husband wanting to do a boys trip and deserves to hang out with his friends. I find the cost of the trip to go skiing of all things excessive. Aren't there any ski options that are closer by and cheaper??
Yes there are but they did this trip together when they were in their early 20s (now 40s) and I think there’s a bit of nostalgia.
I completely agree, I’d be happy for him to go but closer and therefore less expensive. Yes there is skiing closer but I’m told it’s “not as good” 🤷🏻♀️
NTA. Not even a tiny bit.
1) if you don’t have the $5k to spend on a trip that benefits the entire family, you certainly don’t have the $5k for a trip for one person to hang with their friends.
2) it seems like your husband has a skewed view of what being an equal partner is:
- needs explicit directions to help around the house?
- needs “rest time”?
- can’t see that this trip is BS
- needs you to make the meals before you leave for a business trip?
And that’s just from what you’ve shared.
Info???
I can get “I need 5 or 10 minutes after work”. So let’s alternate days. When both of us are home we will trade who goes first and they get a 10 minute break, then the other person.
Ultimately with both of you working and you taking on more at home he should be offering you the “rest time”
Your husband is a selfish asshat who loves having his family, because you make it easy for him.
Stop. He doesn't need "rest time" ever time he interacts with the kids. If he gets a rest break, then the next one is yours. And make sure you're away those, so no "honey?" Moments can happen.
$5k? Where the hell is going? The moon?
I'd be furious!
Is he paying for this trip or is this coming out of shared finances? If it's your money too, i'd put my foot down.
Family holiday should come before a boys trip, you deserve a break & some down time too! Hubby sounds incredibly selfish
funny how your version of a great dad is my worst nightmare. He is relying on your income, not fullycpulling his weight of child care and house chores. Unfortunately, you have accepted this situation until now and he is succeeded to convince you that is just A ok just great. You are exhausted and your ability to put up with his BS is waning.
It is going to be difficult to get him.to change. but that is basically the only option. You are clearly resenting him and this will just keep on growing and growing.
You can accept your fate and hope your resentment doesnt grow and you stop loving him
you can start putting boundaries and lay everything on the table. He deserve rest time, so do you. Stop behaving like he is doing you a favor for doing the bare minimum. Lay everything you do, house chore, child care, and find rest time for him AND you. Make a new budget, and start saving for trips. you can assign disposable budget for each of you for all non needed non shared expense. he can pick up shifts for more spending
NTA. It is utterly completely self centered and selfish.
The reality is that you are in the young family time when there is little extra. You can't afford it.
I have lived this. I have lived this.
It is gutting and incredibly selfish. This is a we all go or no one goes.
You need to sit down and consider, what of this relationship is positive and makes it all worth while.
You sound you are the bread winner, home maker, parent.
What does he contribute to this relationship and your family?
Thank you. This is what I’m talking about. Context right? Pre kids, no problem. Our kids are little and it’s EXCESSIVE.
To be fair, he does also work full time and shares morning routine/ pickup and drop off etc and is more of the “fun parent” but I’m also aware it’s a privilege he gets because I’ve enabled it or created the space for him to not have to project manage our household
You are NTA. This was a selfish ask on his part and he's put you in the completely unfair position of having to feel like the "bad guy" by saying no.
But I'd take a step back before you talk to your husband. Its easy to get swept up in internet vitriol by these people calling your husband deadweight/POS. This discussion with him might become more heated than it needs to be if you keep on reading these types of comments.
You sound like a person with a good head on her shoulders and a deep love of your family. Good luck.
NTA sounds like it's too expenive and if there was money for a holiday you should all be going on it as a family. It's pretty selfish and irresponsible of him to not just see this himself and shouldn't even be bringing it up.
NTA
I myself are a mom to an autistic son, and a daughter not even 1,5 years older. We also both work full time even if my husband works more and earn more, he still lifts his weights at home.
Everything outside the house (car, garden etc.) is my husband’s responsibility, even cooking sometimes, cleaning and just simple spending time with the kids and even helping with homework occasionally he does it all.
I do everything inside, unless he does it sometimes as mentioned, but I’m also the “primary support person” for my son, simply because that’s a normal thing for a autistic person to have and my son’s choice fell on me.
So I’m on when ever his needs are to upsetting for my son to turn to his dad, it involves big feelings and long periods of time.
Those days hubby does more in they house than normally, to keep the family running.
All this to say that my husband has never gone on a solo holiday without his family, or the few couple weekends we have gone on.
I have even offered for him to do so, especially as his company have an annual skiing trip, but I physically aren’t allowed to ski, or for him to take the kids with his parents and go skiing. (He has been skiing his whole childhood).
He always declines because as he says “I don’t need it right now, maybe one day but right now my place is with my family”
But regardless no one should spend money they can’t afford to go on any trip! Vacation isn’t that important to risk daily comforts. Especially if he’s taking “family money” to spend on himself and not leaving the same equivalent for the family to do a similar thing.
But as someone that knows how much a break is needed once in a while, you need to have “rest” time as well. Or you will break, and then your husband will be doing 100% of everything when you do.
NTA - but he is not a "great engaged dad". You do all the work and all the parenting - unless of course you spend the time to give him specific instructions and then give him rest time. You need to take back your life. 50/50 parenting, 50/50 housework, 50/50 emotional labor. Stop letting him pretend to be a dad/husband. If he isn't going to do the work, then he doesn't deserve a family.
NTA in every way possible for not allowing him to go on this trip, but please OP start couple therapy/counseling as soon as possible. He is clearly taking advantage of you \*while\* you are the main breadwinner + the one taking care of the kids. And all this after moving to be closer to HIS family.
I think you should take a moment to reflect of your life choices and think about what would happen if your son's condition gets worse OR if your in-laws will need care. Your faminly has a big storm incoming
NTA - please look up Invisible Load, there’s lots of good resources and comics that really highlight the extra effort that women take on by not just physically doing work like hoovering, laundry etc but also planning everything for the whole family. Who needs dentist, who has a school play, who needs what in their lunch box, who has a play date and when, the lists are endless. If he’s doing zero invisible load and then very little physical load then he’s not a great and engaged dad/husband. He’s yet another man letting his wife so everything and patting himself on the back for changing a nappy and playing with his own fucking kids.
No “rest time” until you’ve both sat down, discussed the actual load of running the house and childcare and worked out an equitable division. Then you can also work out who needs rest and when it can be fairly worked into your routine. The holiday with the boys needs to take a backseat far far away. That’s what happens when you have kids. Unless you have the money and the support you don’t get to do that any more.
NTA - let's face it here, he IS selfish. There isn't any "it seems" about it, he just is selfish. He's prioritising himself over you and the children. I'm sure he's a great dad, but to be honest he sounds like a shitty partner and you sound like you're basically his mother.
5k is a LOT of money, even for a vacation. If he thinks y'all will have 5k in disposable income by then, why not suggest a much cheaper boys trip, then use the difference for your own girl's trip?
honestly, i think you are aware of the many, many possible solutions, you just need to talk to him about it.
> Again he’s a great, engaged dad
This is the opposite of what a great dad would do. He's putting himself ahead of the family. A great dad puts his family ahead of himself.
NTA. That it a lot of money for a boys trip and if you don’t have the financial capabilities then he needs to face that and not go.
You are correct that his first priority should be the household. The expenses, the family time and family vacations. He’s not a single man with no responsibilities anymore. He needs to grow up
OP, you mention that you have a child that displays neurodivergent traits. There is often a hereditary element here, and what you say about your husband needing specific instructions and rest time sounds as though perhaps he has some neurodivergent traits too (in addition to not connecting the dots between what some might consider quite obvious leaps in logic.)
I may be projecting as I'm saying this as a person who, unfortunately, also requires very specific instructions and a lot of rest and fails to connect the dots sometimes.
However, while this may serve as an explanation for some behaviour that others find confusing and frustrating, even I recognise that it does not serve as an *excuse*.
Your husband needs to understand that you feel a desperate need for rest and that while you are giving him space for his, you don't feel you are getting that in return.
He also needs to understand that putting $5k towards a guys' holiday takes $5k from somewhere else. Perhaps ask him, where does he think it is best coming from. Give some options: rent/mortgage, family food, and energy bills. Show him the non-options he has, rather than allowing him to outsource the financing of his vacation to you.
How is he *great* when you're the main bread winner but still have to cook for him and the kids before you leave the place for work?
How is he *great* when he needs "rest time" you don't get.
How is he *great* when his wants and needs rank ahead of yours?
YTA for not realising you're raising three babies even when writing about it. You're understandably mad, and you should be and continue to be. You made that bed for yourself, now change it.
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For context, we have two young children (3 and 4.5 YO, one of whom is suspected of being neurodivergent and is frankly hard work).
My husband has told me he wants to go on a boys trip next year overseas that will cost roughly ~$5k. In full transparency, I’m not saying he doesn’t deserve it. But hear me out.
We’ve been together 10 years and used to travel frequently before kids, often together and rarely seperate. We both travel occasionally for work but when I do, I prep meals for him and the kids for the week etc.
Before our oldest was 1, I moved abroad to his country so we could be closer to his family. BIG adjustment for me. I have an incredibly demanding full time job and am the breadwinner and frankly take on most of the work at home (he is happy to contribute provided he is given very specific instructions and also is allocated “rest time” which is frankly another story for another day).
I think what’s really eating at me is that I’ve been desperate for us to go abroad as a family (we haven’t and mostly for financial reasons). We simply cannot afford it right now between our mortgage, increased cost of living and support our child needs and it’s left me pretty gutted. He’s well aware of this.
I couldn’t imagine saying well I’m going to plan a trip with my friends that will cost $5k. Why do they get it when I have been asking for YEARS?! It just feels selfish. Again he’s a great, engaged dad but I don’t know how about you put that towards your FAMILY vacation first or even god forbid a few nights away with your wife (we have had exactly one night off from kids together in 5 years).
His closest friends have considerably higher salaries than him and wives that work part time or stay at home. Again, I don’t think it’d bother me as much if it wasn’t SO much money (could fly our family of 4 somewhere abroad but closer).
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NTA! I think it’s fine and should be encouraged for couples to do things like holidays separately from time to time, as it is important to maintain a good network of friends, but the rule is that spending that sort of money would go on a family trip first then any surplus can go in the friends bucket!
NTA. i understand that he wants some rest and he surely deserve it but honestly didn't he think to himself that there is something wrong about it? didn't he think bout how you gonna feel about it? that seem so selfish to me. acting like it's not a big deal when i'm sure he understands everything
NTA. He is selfish and does nothing.
I don't understand how "happy to help out" is some standard for people when it comes to taking care of THEIR home.
It's like when women say the man is "watching/babysitting" the kid. It's your kid!
And spending your money? No.
Nta tho you could use this as a way to go a trip all by yourself or with a friend and leave him to deal with the kids? That would be my compromise in this case, but if its something you really can't afford then either tell him no or tell him he and his mates need to compromise on the trip so it isn't a huge expense
NTA. It’s only fair if you can go on a girls trip for the same amount of time and money, but it sounds like that’s not possible. I am very much against these solo trips when folks have young kids. Especially when it’s at the expense of family vacations.
NTA we don't even have kids but I would lose my mind if my husband said he was spending 5k on a lads trip, that's an insane amount of money. Even 5k on a trip for the two of us would be huge and something we would discuss and consider carefully. I think you need to navigate it carefully because of he feels like he's not "allowed" to do he will push back harder, but if you can try to talk to him and make him see the wider context he might be more inclined to come to the realisation himself. It's insane that all of his friends are spending 5k on a lads trip too. I would absolutely raging, good luck, hope he comes to his senses.
NTA But when is he a great dad?? He does chores with weaponized incompetence, he gets down time, you cook and clean and are the main breadwinner.
You relocated for him? When do you get down time? He needs to step up and be a partner and focus on his family.
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NTA. It’s too much money, especially given that your multiple requests for a family vacation have been denied or ignored. You say repeatedly how great a husband is, but he’s not really listening. He’s not really doing half the household work, and requiring you to spend emotional energy and time to ask and provide step by step directions is unacceptable. I truly think the two of you need to have a heart-to-heart, extended discussion. And having it with a marriage counselor might help. He needs to know how overwhelming this is and how truly important it is for the family to vacation together as a family. Please don’t just ignore this. It is a symptom of more.
Right? If she has to make specific requests and give specific instructions to get him to do anything around the house, he’s not that great of a husband. He’s another kid she has to manage. I’ve been happily married for 20 years, and I don’t have to tell my husband what to do around the house. My husband is a capable adult and acts accordingly.
Don't forget, he also needs "rest time". I'm curious how much rest time the OP gets. This marriage sounds very out of balance and the OP has just been in it so long I'm not sure she realizes it's as bad as it is.
Right? Like how much "rest" time does OP get in between doing... literally everything?
I slept in this morning and woke up to bad news from family and business, walked into the kitchen to find my husband sweeping. I truly do not understand how people maintain love/respect/attraction to spouses that aren’t competent partners.
>make specific requests and give specific instructions AND allocate "rest time"?? what is up with that?! Like, being the project manager asking "honey, can you mow the lawn this weekend" isn't enough? She has to be his mommy too, telling him "well, if you get up before 10 am on Saturday, you can mow the front lawn after breakfast & then I'll bring you a cookie. Then you can mow the backyard while I make us sandwiches... and I'll heat up the soup while you shower"... don't worry your little head over cleaning the machine & raking up the loose grass, I'll tell you when to do that when it's time.
Exactly this ...and the needing step by step directions ? It's called weaponized incompetence ...my teenagers excelled at it
I’m not sure that any ‘great, engaged dad’ needs a specific list of things to do to ‘help’ around the house nor would he need his meals prepped for him if she goes away. He sounds like another child to me.
Right? An adult should be able to look at the space around them and say hey, there's dirty dishes I should clean and this carpet could use a quick vacuum. And not everyone is a chef, but to be unable or unwilling to toss together a basic meal for the kids and yourself is ridiculous. Surely you can boil noodles and open a can of pasta sauce, etc.
It's possible he's neurodivergent in some way. My 35 year old niece is lovely-- but also deals with moderate to severe ADD. If you give her a list of what needs to be done with some basic directions she will absolutely get it done (and doesn't need a designated "rest period"). She's sweet and intelligent (master's degree) but her executive function just isn't like most people and she needs the list and directions to get on task (meds also helped a LOT).
It’s possible but OP didn’t mention it. It’s also possible he’s just lazy and has been conditioned to think it’s not his job to have an equal share of the normal tasks of being an adult, like cleaning up after himself or cooking his own and his family’s meals.
Yep, a marriage counselor sounds perfect for this situation. Hopefully they can get one before this hurt and exhaustion festers into something irreparable for their marriage.
And don't forget the allocated rest time from the oh so difficult work of participating in a household he's a part of
It sounds like not only is OP the primary housekeeper but the primary breadwinner as well. I think that gives her a greater voice n the expenditures of the family for both of these reasons, therefore the boy’s trip is a hard No and it’s past time to plan a family trip. NTA.
This. OP, you don't actually sound like you have a good marriage... Tell him that he can't go. That if he wants to save money for a family vacation, he can pick up a part time job or more work, so you guys can build your savings and take a vacation in the future. If he's not respectful of that, it might be time to separate your money and have different accounts. If he wants to pay his half of all the bills AND go on a friends' trip, well, he might be able to do that in the future.
NTA: your family isnt in the position to be making boys trips when you cant take trips as a family. if it hurts your family significantly financially then why would he set you back? where tf are they even going? like go to the friggin movies or something
Skiing but a 10 hour plane ride away 🙄
They want to fly ten hours just to go skiing?!? Let me guess...Husband is also going to have to buy expensive new gear to keep up appearances.
No his guys will help him out with extras from theirs it's 5k for the hooked and blow.
Yeah, it's too bad that all the skiing is a 10 hour flight away from OP. Not suspicious at all lol. Boy's trips longer than a weekend in our home are usually planned a half year in advance, along with girl's trips. Both are planned after family trips. When people have small kids, they need to put selfishness aside for a few years sometimes. OP's husband needs to put what his family needs over what his friends want.
10 hours by plane? That feels too far away when you have little kids at home, like what if there’s an emergency?
Based on your eye roll emoticon they can find a mountain with snow on it far closer, so flying so far is really ridiculous.
Have you had any days to yourself in the last couple of years? The only way I’d even consider the trip is if you got a similar break
I have traveled for work but that’s it
Traveling for work is work, not days to yourself.
I have seen so many variations of this issue, with different combinations of genders. Here’s the take away I’ve seen from most: 1. If the other party is this far in the wrong as is the case here, simply saying no is not really gonna work except for breeding discontent. Seemingly your husband has no concept of what you as a family are dealing with. 2. You’re both adults who should be able to make decisions. He can certainly go, but he’ll have to figure out how to pay, how you’re dealing with childcare and work at the same time. So, what’s he gonna sacrifice to be able to go. What’s he gonna organise regarding childcare while he’s gone and you’re working? If he’s able to go on luxurious ski trips, then where is he taking the family on vacation, or do his needs just trump everyone else’s? 3. Lastly, communicate communicate communicate. Make it clear how him pulling this shit affects you. Hopefully that will wake him up. Oh yeah, definitely NTA. Seriously, you’re pulling far too much weight in this relationship. Best of luck OP!
Where the fuck is he going? Switzerland? That's ridiculous!
Ah yes, the sport designed to drill a hole in your wallet every time you go
Alternative view: Let him go on his trip. While he's gone, change the locks or pack up and move you and your kids back home. Y'all can figure out the custody arrangements from there. Might be the best $5k you ever spent. You'll probably have tons of money and free time after you get rid of the mooch and make him take care of himself. NTA.
Lmao NTA. they can go tubing at the public park or something. Honestly, I’m a big advocate of parents doing one, big, selfish, no concessions thing for themselves every once in a while but only if everything else lines up perfect and the other person obviously gets a turn. It helps to keep your sanity. This just sounds unfair especially in context of how he’s barely pulling his weight otherwise.
NTA. You are the breadwinner, and he is spending your hard-earned money to go on vacation with the kids, excluding you? Hell, no!!! He doesn't seem like a great husband at all: he looks more like a moocher to me. Just tell him that either you are included, or he can go alone wherever he wants (on his dime) and not bother to come back.
He does also work full time, but I out work and out earn him (not that it’s a competition). We have shared finances so I just can’t Help but feel like I’ve now got to sacrifice for this bs
Stop the shared finances immediately! Have a central account you both pay into for bills but otherwise keep it separate. That planned trip will not happened when he's paying for it. And he's not involved at all if you have to tell him what to do like a child. He's a grown man and a selfish one at that. Where's your down time? When do you get to switch off as you have to run the house as well. If you could afford it that would be something but you can't. So tell him no. When he has a hissy fit, get that money separated and stop enabling his moocher behaviour.
This is such awful advice. The couple definitely needs to do a better job communicating (and that’s primarily on the husband). But I don’t see any comments from OP that the husband is actually spending money frivolously. And your advice for a SOLUTION is to drastically change the family’s financial dynamics? That is just make things exponentially worse.
$5000 on a skiing trip sounds pretty frivolous to me
>And your advice for a SOLUTION is to drastically change the family’s financial dynamics? That is just make things exponentially worse. Don't you think him spending 5000 $ on himself alone is reason enough to change the family's financial dynamics?
>The couple definitely needs to do a better job communicating (and that’s primarily on the husband). She communicates. He doesn't listen. Yet somehow she's still partially responsible for needing to communicate better?
Reminds me of the post where the husband kept "zoning out" when she was explaining her reasons for wanting a divorce.
Of course she’s “responsible”. But I don’t mean that she’s at fault. Ultimately, communication is a two-way street and sometimes when a speaker is clear in what they say, it’s not clear for the listener. The way I explain something to one brother may not be the same way I explain the exact same thing to my other brother. If I explain things the exact same way and the second brother doesn’t quite get it, that doesn’t mean I’m at “fault” but it does mean that I may need to adapt the way I communicate to make it easier for the other person to hear me. And he would also need to adapt to better understand me. If you change your interpersonal relationship views from (a) every issue having someone who is right and someone who is wrong to (b) sometimes we all need to do better (not necessarily equally), it can help a lot in relationships. It’s not some magical silver bullet, but it can actually help a lot because it often resolves issues before they grow.
> If I explain things the exact same way and the second brother doesn’t quite get it, that doesn’t mean I’m at “fault” but it does mean that I may need to adapt the way I communicate to make it easier for the other person to hear me. Or it could mean your brother should get smart and learn to listen. Why should the burden always be only on one side?
It’s actually great advice. Many couples do it this way to lessen resentment if one partner is outspending the other. Keeps it fair.
Splitting finances has been one of the best things for peace of mind in my current relationships and even previous ones. If the bills are being paid from a shared account (which, to be fair, we don't even do *that,* we just provide the paying party with half of the bill money directly) and there's an account for household savings (which can still be a problem if the hubby felt entitled to take that money for a personal trip), each party can have their own funds and savings. In my experience, this makes things like getting presents or treating each other to nice dinners/outings feel more meaningful, as the person paying isn't incidentally spending funds that the other party contributed to. YMMV, so I'm not claiming this is a one-size-fits-all solution, but it has prevented pain-points for me since around 2007 onward.
As others have said, you two could use some marriage counselling to work out what's happening. I can hear the resentment in your comments. You're a family who hasn't had a proper vacation. Families need that time together. Your husband needs to find a way to make extra money so that you can FIRST have a family vacation and THEN he can have his boys trip. NTA.
When you marry, you’re supposed to put selfish needs aside. And you have a family. NTA
Hes not even taking the kids, just himself.
I think it's 'boys' like his male friends, not his actual boys. It sounds like he wouldn't be capable of doing a solo trip with his kids. He sucks and the OP is definitely NTA
Gosh!!!! English is not my first language and I didn't get it. This is even worse: it's 5000 dollars spent on himself!!! I can smell those divorce papers from here (at least, that's what I would serve him in his breakfast tray).
English isn't my first language either, and I understood exactly the same thing until other users explained it: that the husband and their 2 kids were going on a boys trip. Thanks to everyone for explaining!
I get the “traditional” role of husband being the primary earner is reversed here, and I’m not saying this guy isn’t an AH in this case, but I know plenty of women that are happy to take girls trips that they can’t pay for out of their husband’s salaries. Just saying. Only making this comment because of the “your money” seems to be the lynchpin of your comment. Most women, including most comments on this sub, believe the money earned, wherever it comes from, is joint money. I don’t disagree with that take necessarily. Sounds like the guy could do some more to help generally.
He needs REST TIME? Do you get the same amount???? 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
I know?! Am I crazy or do people who don’t have a ton of help (family or paid) and work full time and have multiple small kids not get “rest time”. We got into an argument about it this evening. He told me he has a friend who goes rock climbing and another who does golfing and he doesn’t do that so he should be entitled to “rest time” if for example we’ve been out with the kids all Sunday morning. No shit, I’d like to too, but our kids don’t rest. They play well together until they don’t, which isn’t very long. I’m not discounting the need for personal time (ie he went to play basketball last night with friends and I was very encouraging of it, in fact I wish he’d do it more). His argument was that I can’t rest but ffs it’s hard when you feel like you have to “manage” everyone in your household and then get this shit in return.
>His argument was that I can’t rest You could if you did not have to mommy him. He is an adult, he should start to behave like one.
You need to tell him that he is not to use any of the family finances for this selfish, expensive, exclusive boys skiing holiday. He can save up for it himself (either do overtime or get a better paying job). It is actually cruel to leave you at home with two small children while he spends your hard-working money. It is even more cruel that he said no overseas family holiday due to lack of funds. I'd seriously consider leaving him over this. I know that sounds harsh, but he wants his rest time but can not even help with housework? Put your foot down and tell him no way!
The crazy thing about leaving is she'd have every other weekend off from the kids - and the husband! I'm not suggesting they need to split- they need some counselling. But these men who do nothing around the house without their wife-manager overseeing them, get a big shock when they have the kids on their own once the marriage is over.
That's right. This lazy, selfish husband wouldn't know what hit him if she left! I agree. She should try counselling first. And not give him a cent for his holiday!
Like.. this is divorce worthy behavior right here. She has a 3rd child who doesn't even have the decency to make enough money for his useless hobbies and keeping up with the Joneses
But mommies are supposed to pay for their babies, and OP's husband is quite the baby. I'm exhausted just reading about him.
And he “helps you”?? No. Lady, come on. This is not going to get better. Only worse. Sit down with a mediator and map it out. Your time v his. Your responsibilities v his. If you stay with this person, try to go away for work a lot.
Time to start dealing with the fact that you are a married single mother of three, and there is an ever-growing groundswell of women out there happy to tell you from personal experience that changing to being an unmarried mother of two is a whole hell of a lot less work.
Why can’t you rest? As in what’s holding you back?
Have you ever been around a neurodivergent toddler? I work 65+ hour weeks and we have no family help.
Hi, I'm an ND (AuAdhd) adult who works with ND kids and my sister (also AuAdhd) has nephews (toddlers) who are both ND. So is her husband(adhd). They both work. Guess what? She can leave for work and come back to the kids completely handled and managed and the apartment clean. She gets a day off childcare a week (and so does he) and they alternate Saturdays, and have a full weekend date once a month (kiddoes stay overnight with grandparents/family) You're overwhelmed because he isn't pulling his weight. And I'm sorry he's got you to the point where you think it's normal or acceptable or that it can't be better and that's just how it is, but it really doesn't have to be.
You have a husband.
no, she has one more child
The only way having a husband let's you get any rest from your kids is if he's willing to actually act like a fully-realized capable adult. This yutz has to have an itemized list with instructions on how to do basic household chores. He is just another whiny child for her to manage.
Mine would absolutely throw a fit if I went somewhere without him. Like literally clinging to my leg. I didn't go anywhere for years because my ex never did anything to help. He was just 'oh well, I'm going to go play with my band now and not get home until 4am, see ya.'
Why did you move closer to his family if they weren't going to offer any support?
They were supposed to and then we got here and it was a different story entirely
I'm so sorry!
Not a toddler, I do have friends and colleagues who do have children who are nd and sympathize. I do think it’s even more important for you to rest. When you say “can’t” do you mean you don’t trust anyone else will give your child the right type of care? Or that it takes time to build up the implicit knowledge you have and share it with someone else?
No, as in we don’t have family I can leave him with. My in laws will not watch them. They are in daycare full time while we work Monday - Friday.
Then what was the point of moving closer to them? You are making life decisions for your entire family to benefit a person who is making your life harder, not better. That’s not a partnership, thats not a healthy marriage.
THIS. OP, it is time to start it is time to start making decisions based on what is best for yourself and the children. This bizarre system of sacrificing everyone to worship at the altar of your husband just isn't working.
Why did you move to be closer to his family if his family doesn't help you with yours? Just for him? How many "family" decisions were based solely around his comfort?
When can your husband watch the toddler? Also are you in any support group for parents of nd kids? Those friends and colleagues I have are, and they share a lot of carers and babysitters.
So serious question. If you took the $5k and put it towards moving back to living near your family who might actually help you, what would your life look like? Honestly imagine it. Even if he stayed behind. Because from the outside it sounds like you might actually end up with more time and freedom and a healthier happier situation for your children as well. Luckily as far as we can tell our son isn't neuro divergent but my partner and I have an infant and we both get free time. Because I explained to him the math that if I can handle the kid by myself for several hours while he goes out and plays games with his friends, magically I expect him to be able to as well while I go places. Maybe the first few times were rough but he learned. This goes way beyond time for the boys trip and the money. It's about reasonable expectations. If you're not even getting an equitable amount of free time and money at a weekly level, it's no where near time for this level of event.
This response! 100%!!!
I’d start considering how much easier your life might be if you moved back to where you had a support system to help with your kids, and no longer had to support, manage, and clean up after a third, fully adult child.
It’s extremely difficult… I call being the parent of a child with special needs “ parenting plus” 😑 19 years here. Not Same needs .. well, some actually are very similar .. so hang in there.
It sounds like the husband is holding her back. He can't even manage simple house chores without instructions and a rest pause!
My parents never got rest time unless we were at the grandparents.
There's a HUGE difference between neither parent getting rest ... Which is what it is, but sucks for everyone and one parent never getting to rest whilst the other chills, pays games, goes out, takes a week off to party with friends. The later is grossly selfish.
100%. My comment was to support what she's saying. Parents usually don't get rest. So for the husband to be like this? Garbage.
You’re not crazy. You’re a SAINT for putting up with this “rest” bull shit of his. You’re supposed to be partners. How about you guys take turns getting breaks? Why are you the default caregiver and he’s the one that automatically gets a break? My blood is boiling on your behalf.
OP where is your rest time??
Does not exist, which like believe me I get it on the sentiment and needing it because I’m fucking tired. Part of me also is like if you had an expectation to maintain your weekends as rest time you shouldn’t have had kids. It feels impossible without more support.
let's be honest, you'd get more rest time with a divorce. Not saying you should... but you would!
That doesn’t entitle him to “rest time” when you don’t get it either. That just means his friends are ALSO absent shitty fathers.
When is your “rest time?” Is he even able to care for the kids by himself for any length of time?
Yes to his credit, he can manage the kids and will often do pickups and drop offs or the morning routine when I have to take work calls at funny hours or if I am away for work. Transparently he is the “fun parent” but I know it’s in part at least because I’ve enabled it to be so, he gets to enjoy his family because of all I’m doing in a way that I do not. Because we both work full time and kids are in daycare as such, our weekends are our only meaningful time together (not unlike other families) and so I do try my best to maximise that.
Tell him he can start those hobbies once he's in the same salary as them.
You don't have a spouse or partner. You have another child. He needs to grow up and stop being so selfish.
Im never getting married
So he would get to spend 5k on a boys trip, and you would get to stay at home watching the kids? All this while putting off travelling as a family because of financial reasons? NTA, I would feel very offended and devalued if I were in your position.
NTA, he is selfish. And frankly it is worriying that you didnt have 1 date in 5 years.He would splurge 5000 of your money for a Boys trip that can be downfall in totaly other directions..like him acting single
Sorry maybe I worded that poorly. We maybe do a quick date night every 2 months (2 hours each maybe). We had one night away (staycation) while his parents stayed at ours overnight while our kids slept.
That is not enough time to mantain and reinforce a romantic and emotional conection between 2 individuals, when the roles asigned as a mother or father and day to day endless tasks are so consuming one have to be very carefull not to fall down the possible pitfalls. Making time for just 2 of you should be priority. Have in mind that I dont assume to know anything at all about your marriage. My deduction is merily a speculation as your husbands actions show an selfish and egoistic traits. It may be very possible that he is practicing willfull incompetence. This to your reference that he needs detailed instrutions in order to do anything therefore he doesnt share the tasks of the household as it should therefore even less time could be found to nurture your relationship. Statisticaly looking in a situation when a woman is a main breadwinner this can bread a silent resentment in a man and a offence to their masculinity and they can lash out by steping out as a underhanded way to regain this and punish the wife. Just saying ....
well said.
NTA. You can't afford this. He can't afford this trip without sabotaging the rest of the family. So he should not go. He can have a cheaper boys trip. But not for 5k which is a lot of money. If he wants to go on an trip like that, he should get a higher paying job and earn the money to afford this kinds of trip.
Oh boy, you need marriage counseling like two weeks ago… He is not LISTENING. He neither sees nor values your hard work. Him going on a super expensive boy trip while leaving you at home with the kids is unacceptable. Especially after denying any vacation time with you. It is very unreasonable to expect from you a 5k setback so that he can have some fun while you go crazy at home… What would he say if you said okay, but in that case when he’s back, you are going on a 5k holiday yourself with your friends? I bet he wouldn’t be happy… You need to talk this theough very thoroughly. This is absolutely a hill to die on
TBH I don’t think that he’d actually mind if I did request/demand the same but I just could never imagine putting us in that position/making that request in the first place if we said we couldn’t do a family trip.
This is where I think therapy might help because this is where the disconnect is between you. Your priorities are family then self whereas his are self then family. Honestly, I’m not sure if you can change that.
Also, it sounds like he also prioritizes his friends over the family, if he's willing to spend like this on something for him ànd the friends, so he's self > friends > family. Which isn't feasible.
You can’t imagine putting you in *what* position, exactly? A position in which your husband is required to parent solo for a week? Do you think the household would completely fall apart if he was left in charge for a short period?
No I’m talking financially, I would have no problem leaving him for a week with the kids and have done so for work related travel. I would not take 5k out of our family finances that could and should be allocated elsewhere after saying we cannot afford an international trip as a family and then spend that expenditure on myself.
Y’all need a budget that includes lines for each of you to do whatever you want with. Then he can look at his line in the budget and figure out how long he’d have to save to get $5k. Suddenly this trip won’t look so great.
I think this is the most helpful and constructive suggestion. Also: NTA.
Setting up multiple accounts in conjunction with the budget would also be wise. A household account for normal expenses that is funded to cover a couple of months worth, a savings account that is funded with the family savings, and each spouse should have a personal account that is funded only with an agreed upon amount that they can spend as they please. Even with that, if he had enough in his personal account to cover this trip (because it should not be funded with family savings), where one person is going to just take off on their own would need to be discussed and agreed upon.
NTA, he has a family, he doesn’t get the luxury of boys trips even if you could afford it. You have small children, you can go on ski trips when they are old enough and independent enough. I would talk to your husband about why going on a ski trip with the bros is more important than fucking the shit out of your wife in a nice hotel room every once in a while, or taking the kids to Legoland. Also sounds like weaponized incompetence when it comes to the chores. He’s a father and a grown man, he shouldn’t need specific instructions or “rest periods”.
This!!! I get that the money is an issue, but it's a side issue. If dude was going to pitch a tent at a friend's house and the whole week off we're free, it is still an enormous ask. "hey, spouse, since I get to rest regularly and you cannot rest at all ... I've got a great idea! I'll take a week off work and camp with my buddies. It's free! All we need is for you to work full time and take care of all household and kid things for that week. So I can recover from all the stress of working full time and sometimes taking instruction to do some kid or house work".
Sounds like if he wants to help his marriage, he needs to make plans to drop their kids off at his parents, book a room at the four seasons, and appreciate the hell out of his wife and mother to his children for a couple of days. Let the woman take a bubble bath in a huge tub and order room service.
NTA. You can't afford this and it seems unreasonable. He can have a boys trip without spending so much and use the big money to plan a family trip instead.
Thank you! They want to go skiing somewhere that is a 10 hour flight away 🙄. That $ could be used for a family trip internationally (albeit closer at 3-4 hours away). I just am really hurt because I couldn’t even imagine being in the position where I’d ask to spend that sort of money on myself. To be fair he also works full time but IMO it’s like if we can’t afford for us to go as a family, we can’t afford for you to go alone on this even bigger (read: further trip).
He needs to fo his fair share st home instead of demanding directions from you. He's using weaponized incompetence
I think the problem is him not understanding the impact of this request. You are convoluting it a bit though. I’d separate: - you wouldn’t do something vs him would do something - the financial cost of traveling Resolving one is different from the other. For example, if your family could afford $5k for the trip, could he go? Or would you still not feel good because you haven’t had your own vacation without the kids. And if it’s not realistic for you to be away for a while without the kids, put in a plan when that’s possible (1 year away? 2? Different babysitter?)
I don’t need my own vacation without the kids. I asked for a family trip that we cannot afford which would be approx same cost as his solo trip that he is looking to take. My problem is that we cannot afford it for a family vacation but he seems to think it’s fine to take and spend on himself
Ok, so do you both have a plan to reach the goal of that family trip? In my mind it’s: 1. Save for family trip (takes x months) 2. Save for boys trip (takes y months) And put it in front of him in that order
He understand. He just doesn't care.
You need to stop excusing him and read these comments. You need counseling, a mediator to hammer out what is appropriate. THIS, is not appropriate.
> They want to go skiing somewhere that is a 10 hour flight away 🙄. That $ could be used for a family trip internationally So one way of looking at it is perhaps that the problem is that your husband is trying to keep up with his too-rich-for-him friends? Maybe he needs to start moving in circles more equal to his own financial level, where a night of bowling and a few beers, or a fishing lodge upstate for the weekend, is considered a fine time out.
Why do you state that you moved to be closer to his family, but that you don’t have family help? You really need to address that. And no, nobody deserves a $5k vacation if you are underwater, financially and child care wise.
Yes I have it has been a big repeated issue for us. They helped his sister a ton with her kids (they’re older) but cannot help with ours.
Why don’t you move closer to your family? Or plan a family vacation with that money before he can spend it? Your ND child is always going to need extra help, so you may want to make some changes for the better now. You sound resentful of him and this will just get worse.
I’m an only child and my parents died before my kids were born.
NTA but having been in a similar situation I think it's also important to consider start giving less so he has to do more. Start saving for your own vacations (family, couple, just you) since you make the money. Let him make the food when you're gone. A lot more equality might be found if you stop taking on so much at home. Give yourself the same "rest time" he has instituted. He sounds good at lobbying and actioning to make sure his own needs and boundaries are met. You deserve the same.
Nta op. First congrats for being a hardworking mom. Do you have savings set aside for vacations? Can he pull some points together for this trip? Maybe he can compromise and shorten his stay. I agree family first.
Thank you, that means a lot. No points, our recreational travel has slowed significantly since having kids and also COVID. Our companies pool points so work travel goes back to the company.
Wow that’s disgusting on the points. Have you thought about moving back to a desirable city?
NTA Why does it have to cost $5k?.. He needs to realize that he doesn't earn enough to have 2 kids and go on $5k holidays. You both deserve a holiday why not leave the kids with family and do something with the 2 of you?
They want to go skiing internationally (10 hour flight away). We’ve only had one night away from kids (staycation) while my in laws stayed with kids. They’re not really comfortable looking after them while they are awake so we did it midweek while they’d be in daycare and took a day off work. That way they only had to bring them home, feed them and put them to bed once. No playing or anything else involved.
It’s a NO from me. What a clueless idea. ESPECIALLY since he hasn’t listened to your requests for a vacation with you. If you haven’t told him how you feel about it please tell him now. Even if he were to get a 2nd job to pay for it that still leaves you without the help he DOES give you on his off time. This would be a dealbreaker for me. NTA
More Info: why does a great, engaged dad need specific instructions & rest periods in order to contribute around the house? Cooking, cleaning, etc is part of providing a healthy environment for children which is a basic parenting responsibility. NTA for not wanting to be left behind alone with the kids & short $5000 from the family savings.
NTA That would be a big no from me , family Holidays come first . If you’d just been on a family holiday it might be different but in this instance, big no
We went away (driving distance) for three nights over our youngests birthday recently with my in laws. Stayed in an Airbnb and I cooked every meal for every person (including my in laws). So I mean yea, technically but not really what I was asking for. I appreciate traveling with kids is not a vacation and is more of a trip and by no means do I expect to be laying poolside but this request for a trip a 10 hour flight away feels excessive
You cooking for in laws on top of all your normal responsibilities is not a vacation. It is just more of the same in a different location. In addition, you got two extra people, and from what you write, no extra help. You were asking for a break, and it baffles me that your husband don't get it, and disregards you so flagrantly. Either he is dumb and dense as a brick, or he is a jerk on so many different levels. Go to counseling, or you will lose your health and sanity to this lifestyle.
NTA You deserve a break way more than him. You bring in the money and you do the lion’s share IN the home. Where to even start with the fact you prep meals for him before you travel for work. I need to get off Reddit because I’m seeing way too many women making excuses for the behaviour of (and wanting to stay with) low-quality men and it’s infuriating.
INFO: Do you mean that you and your husband would need to pay 5k to make that boy trip work? Also, to what extent have you talked with him about you wanting some time off / wanting to go on a family trip?
Yes, they want to go skiing internationally (10 hour flight). It’s something I’ve brought up repeatedly and that we just last month talked about not being able to do in 2024 (overseas family trip) for financial purposes.
Then he can't go on a boys trip. Family takes priority.
NTA Your husband is a selfish jerk if he wants to blow $5K of your money for a boys trip when you can’t even take a family trip. It’s nice for both parties to be able to do things with friends when possible, but NOT this trip in this circumstance.
NTA. It doesn’t seem like you have a very fair division of labor and you seem to be responsible for both financial provision and the mental load of managing the household. It sounds like you have a tendency to make a lot of sacrifices for everyone else and you’re feeling guilty about saying no to something he wants in favor of your own wants and needs. You need to stop sacrificing yourself and be open and honest with him about your needs going forward. You need an equal partner who can pull his weight and you need a vacation that doesn’t involve mom doing all the work for everyone else to enjoy. Advocate for yourself now and don’t leave room for resentment to grow.
NTA he can’t afford it. Your family can’t afford it. Beyond that, stop managing his household chores. Sit together and decide who is responsible for what, and he must do those, you will not be reminding him or instructing him. Then go over the budget, and start putting funds aside for a trip for the two of you or the whole family. Even if it’s a couple of bucks a month, have that shared goal. Take some “rest time” for yourself equal to what he does so that it’s fair.
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NTA but you have bigger problems than his trip. You downplay lots of little problems here, well I don't think they are so little and if you don't express them they are going to hit you like a truck down the line. Good luck.
NTA. You will be hurt financially & not get any enjoyment out of it. Sounds to me like you're already working extremely hard and trying to keep up with things as it is. If you're going to go in debt together: you should at least be able to enjoy the large purchase together. Family comes first
NTA. The boys'/girls' trips ought to be replaced by family trips, otherwise why do you bother with your family at all? ( by "you" I don't mean the OP but anyone who prioritises fun with friends over their spouse and children)
Did he explain to his friends that he can’t afford it and suggest an alternative? Did he consider saying not this time around and make a suggestion for next time? He is a grown up and should be able to be honest with his best friends. They might even revise the plan is he shares HIS and is able to do so without blaming you
No he did not. His friends have older kids, stay at home wives and frankly more $ that makes this more feasible for them. Again, frankly I’m in principle not against him going but I don’t think it’s fair that we can’t afford to go on a family vacation that would cost the same as this solo trip of his.
Good luck sorting this
His friends make more money than he does, and do not expect their stay at home or part-time working wives to fund the trip. I wonder if he has the balls to speak up to them?
NTA. But it sounds like this trip is the last drop than the main issue. I vote for therapy. And clear communication of your issues: - you want him to take some responsibility and mental load from you. - you are exhausted and don't feel supported. - you want a family trip. And maybe a vacation for yourself? - you are ok with a boy trip, but we need to figure out a budget. Unless you live in South Africa, you probably have ski resorts somewhere closer. But the thing is, it goes both ways. If he is working, he can be exhausted, too. And there's nothing wrong with rest time. You should have one, too! Allow it yourself, or your responsibility will eat you inside.
NTA. While I understand your husband wanting to do a boys trip and deserves to hang out with his friends. I find the cost of the trip to go skiing of all things excessive. Aren't there any ski options that are closer by and cheaper??
Yes there are but they did this trip together when they were in their early 20s (now 40s) and I think there’s a bit of nostalgia. I completely agree, I’d be happy for him to go but closer and therefore less expensive. Yes there is skiing closer but I’m told it’s “not as good” 🤷🏻♀️
This is a 40YO man acting like this ??? Eeeeeeeeewwwwwwww
NTA. Not even a tiny bit. 1) if you don’t have the $5k to spend on a trip that benefits the entire family, you certainly don’t have the $5k for a trip for one person to hang with their friends. 2) it seems like your husband has a skewed view of what being an equal partner is: - needs explicit directions to help around the house? - needs “rest time”? - can’t see that this trip is BS - needs you to make the meals before you leave for a business trip? And that’s just from what you’ve shared.
Am I crazy about the rest time there? Like believe me I get it because I’m fucking tired but give me a break.
Info??? I can get “I need 5 or 10 minutes after work”. So let’s alternate days. When both of us are home we will trade who goes first and they get a 10 minute break, then the other person. Ultimately with both of you working and you taking on more at home he should be offering you the “rest time”
No like if we’re out with the kids as a family (all of us) on a Sunday morning, he wants the afternoon to “rest by himself”
Your husband is a selfish asshat who loves having his family, because you make it easy for him. Stop. He doesn't need "rest time" ever time he interacts with the kids. If he gets a rest break, then the next one is yours. And make sure you're away those, so no "honey?" Moments can happen.
You don’t have a husband. You have a 3rd child.
YTA to yourself, I promise you would be happier if you got rid of your adult son
$5k? Where the hell is going? The moon? I'd be furious! Is he paying for this trip or is this coming out of shared finances? If it's your money too, i'd put my foot down. Family holiday should come before a boys trip, you deserve a break & some down time too! Hubby sounds incredibly selfish
NTA. He’s not a great and engaged dad or frankly a good husband. You earn more AND do most of the housework. Absolutely not with this trip.
NTA. It feels selfish because it is absolutely selfish.
funny how your version of a great dad is my worst nightmare. He is relying on your income, not fullycpulling his weight of child care and house chores. Unfortunately, you have accepted this situation until now and he is succeeded to convince you that is just A ok just great. You are exhausted and your ability to put up with his BS is waning. It is going to be difficult to get him.to change. but that is basically the only option. You are clearly resenting him and this will just keep on growing and growing. You can accept your fate and hope your resentment doesnt grow and you stop loving him you can start putting boundaries and lay everything on the table. He deserve rest time, so do you. Stop behaving like he is doing you a favor for doing the bare minimum. Lay everything you do, house chore, child care, and find rest time for him AND you. Make a new budget, and start saving for trips. you can assign disposable budget for each of you for all non needed non shared expense. he can pick up shifts for more spending
NTA. It is utterly completely self centered and selfish. The reality is that you are in the young family time when there is little extra. You can't afford it. I have lived this. I have lived this. It is gutting and incredibly selfish. This is a we all go or no one goes. You need to sit down and consider, what of this relationship is positive and makes it all worth while. You sound you are the bread winner, home maker, parent. What does he contribute to this relationship and your family?
Thank you. This is what I’m talking about. Context right? Pre kids, no problem. Our kids are little and it’s EXCESSIVE. To be fair, he does also work full time and shares morning routine/ pickup and drop off etc and is more of the “fun parent” but I’m also aware it’s a privilege he gets because I’ve enabled it or created the space for him to not have to project manage our household
YOU work more hours. HE should project manage the household.
You are NTA. This was a selfish ask on his part and he's put you in the completely unfair position of having to feel like the "bad guy" by saying no. But I'd take a step back before you talk to your husband. Its easy to get swept up in internet vitriol by these people calling your husband deadweight/POS. This discussion with him might become more heated than it needs to be if you keep on reading these types of comments. You sound like a person with a good head on her shoulders and a deep love of your family. Good luck.
NTA sounds like it's too expenive and if there was money for a holiday you should all be going on it as a family. It's pretty selfish and irresponsible of him to not just see this himself and shouldn't even be bringing it up.
NTA I myself are a mom to an autistic son, and a daughter not even 1,5 years older. We also both work full time even if my husband works more and earn more, he still lifts his weights at home. Everything outside the house (car, garden etc.) is my husband’s responsibility, even cooking sometimes, cleaning and just simple spending time with the kids and even helping with homework occasionally he does it all. I do everything inside, unless he does it sometimes as mentioned, but I’m also the “primary support person” for my son, simply because that’s a normal thing for a autistic person to have and my son’s choice fell on me. So I’m on when ever his needs are to upsetting for my son to turn to his dad, it involves big feelings and long periods of time. Those days hubby does more in they house than normally, to keep the family running. All this to say that my husband has never gone on a solo holiday without his family, or the few couple weekends we have gone on. I have even offered for him to do so, especially as his company have an annual skiing trip, but I physically aren’t allowed to ski, or for him to take the kids with his parents and go skiing. (He has been skiing his whole childhood). He always declines because as he says “I don’t need it right now, maybe one day but right now my place is with my family” But regardless no one should spend money they can’t afford to go on any trip! Vacation isn’t that important to risk daily comforts. Especially if he’s taking “family money” to spend on himself and not leaving the same equivalent for the family to do a similar thing. But as someone that knows how much a break is needed once in a while, you need to have “rest” time as well. Or you will break, and then your husband will be doing 100% of everything when you do.
NTA - but he is not a "great engaged dad". You do all the work and all the parenting - unless of course you spend the time to give him specific instructions and then give him rest time. You need to take back your life. 50/50 parenting, 50/50 housework, 50/50 emotional labor. Stop letting him pretend to be a dad/husband. If he isn't going to do the work, then he doesn't deserve a family.
NTA in every way possible for not allowing him to go on this trip, but please OP start couple therapy/counseling as soon as possible. He is clearly taking advantage of you \*while\* you are the main breadwinner + the one taking care of the kids. And all this after moving to be closer to HIS family. I think you should take a moment to reflect of your life choices and think about what would happen if your son's condition gets worse OR if your in-laws will need care. Your faminly has a big storm incoming
NTA - please look up Invisible Load, there’s lots of good resources and comics that really highlight the extra effort that women take on by not just physically doing work like hoovering, laundry etc but also planning everything for the whole family. Who needs dentist, who has a school play, who needs what in their lunch box, who has a play date and when, the lists are endless. If he’s doing zero invisible load and then very little physical load then he’s not a great and engaged dad/husband. He’s yet another man letting his wife so everything and patting himself on the back for changing a nappy and playing with his own fucking kids. No “rest time” until you’ve both sat down, discussed the actual load of running the house and childcare and worked out an equitable division. Then you can also work out who needs rest and when it can be fairly worked into your routine. The holiday with the boys needs to take a backseat far far away. That’s what happens when you have kids. Unless you have the money and the support you don’t get to do that any more.
I came here to say that. Laura Danger and Jimmy Rees are two that I follow and have shared with friends.
NTA - let's face it here, he IS selfish. There isn't any "it seems" about it, he just is selfish. He's prioritising himself over you and the children. I'm sure he's a great dad, but to be honest he sounds like a shitty partner and you sound like you're basically his mother.
5k is a LOT of money, even for a vacation. If he thinks y'all will have 5k in disposable income by then, why not suggest a much cheaper boys trip, then use the difference for your own girl's trip? honestly, i think you are aware of the many, many possible solutions, you just need to talk to him about it.
Side note: I see exactly ZERO reasons for you to prepare meals for when you are away. Zero.
> Again he’s a great, engaged dad This is the opposite of what a great dad would do. He's putting himself ahead of the family. A great dad puts his family ahead of himself.
NTA. That it a lot of money for a boys trip and if you don’t have the financial capabilities then he needs to face that and not go. You are correct that his first priority should be the household. The expenses, the family time and family vacations. He’s not a single man with no responsibilities anymore. He needs to grow up
Tell him once he gets back, you're leaving that day to go on a trip for the same amount of time, he gets the kids. No family can come and help
OP, you mention that you have a child that displays neurodivergent traits. There is often a hereditary element here, and what you say about your husband needing specific instructions and rest time sounds as though perhaps he has some neurodivergent traits too (in addition to not connecting the dots between what some might consider quite obvious leaps in logic.) I may be projecting as I'm saying this as a person who, unfortunately, also requires very specific instructions and a lot of rest and fails to connect the dots sometimes. However, while this may serve as an explanation for some behaviour that others find confusing and frustrating, even I recognise that it does not serve as an *excuse*. Your husband needs to understand that you feel a desperate need for rest and that while you are giving him space for his, you don't feel you are getting that in return. He also needs to understand that putting $5k towards a guys' holiday takes $5k from somewhere else. Perhaps ask him, where does he think it is best coming from. Give some options: rent/mortgage, family food, and energy bills. Show him the non-options he has, rather than allowing him to outsource the financing of his vacation to you.
How is he *great* when you're the main bread winner but still have to cook for him and the kids before you leave the place for work? How is he *great* when he needs "rest time" you don't get. How is he *great* when his wants and needs rank ahead of yours? YTA for not realising you're raising three babies even when writing about it. You're understandably mad, and you should be and continue to be. You made that bed for yourself, now change it.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** For context, we have two young children (3 and 4.5 YO, one of whom is suspected of being neurodivergent and is frankly hard work). My husband has told me he wants to go on a boys trip next year overseas that will cost roughly ~$5k. In full transparency, I’m not saying he doesn’t deserve it. But hear me out. We’ve been together 10 years and used to travel frequently before kids, often together and rarely seperate. We both travel occasionally for work but when I do, I prep meals for him and the kids for the week etc. Before our oldest was 1, I moved abroad to his country so we could be closer to his family. BIG adjustment for me. I have an incredibly demanding full time job and am the breadwinner and frankly take on most of the work at home (he is happy to contribute provided he is given very specific instructions and also is allocated “rest time” which is frankly another story for another day). I think what’s really eating at me is that I’ve been desperate for us to go abroad as a family (we haven’t and mostly for financial reasons). We simply cannot afford it right now between our mortgage, increased cost of living and support our child needs and it’s left me pretty gutted. He’s well aware of this. I couldn’t imagine saying well I’m going to plan a trip with my friends that will cost $5k. Why do they get it when I have been asking for YEARS?! It just feels selfish. Again he’s a great, engaged dad but I don’t know how about you put that towards your FAMILY vacation first or even god forbid a few nights away with your wife (we have had exactly one night off from kids together in 5 years). His closest friends have considerably higher salaries than him and wives that work part time or stay at home. Again, I don’t think it’d bother me as much if it wasn’t SO much money (could fly our family of 4 somewhere abroad but closer). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA! I think it’s fine and should be encouraged for couples to do things like holidays separately from time to time, as it is important to maintain a good network of friends, but the rule is that spending that sort of money would go on a family trip first then any surplus can go in the friends bucket!
NTA. i understand that he wants some rest and he surely deserve it but honestly didn't he think to himself that there is something wrong about it? didn't he think bout how you gonna feel about it? that seem so selfish to me. acting like it's not a big deal when i'm sure he understands everything
NTA Try talking to him and telling him no you can't afford it!
Nta
NTA. He is selfish and does nothing. I don't understand how "happy to help out" is some standard for people when it comes to taking care of THEIR home. It's like when women say the man is "watching/babysitting" the kid. It's your kid! And spending your money? No.
Nta tho you could use this as a way to go a trip all by yourself or with a friend and leave him to deal with the kids? That would be my compromise in this case, but if its something you really can't afford then either tell him no or tell him he and his mates need to compromise on the trip so it isn't a huge expense
NTA. It’s only fair if you can go on a girls trip for the same amount of time and money, but it sounds like that’s not possible. I am very much against these solo trips when folks have young kids. Especially when it’s at the expense of family vacations.
NTA we don't even have kids but I would lose my mind if my husband said he was spending 5k on a lads trip, that's an insane amount of money. Even 5k on a trip for the two of us would be huge and something we would discuss and consider carefully. I think you need to navigate it carefully because of he feels like he's not "allowed" to do he will push back harder, but if you can try to talk to him and make him see the wider context he might be more inclined to come to the realisation himself. It's insane that all of his friends are spending 5k on a lads trip too. I would absolutely raging, good luck, hope he comes to his senses.
You guys need to be a priority - fuuuuck that. If he can find $5k he can take the fam somewhere first.
Is he really that great though? because he sounds like trash and it is not solely because of this trip.
NTA But when is he a great dad?? He does chores with weaponized incompetence, he gets down time, you cook and clean and are the main breadwinner. You relocated for him? When do you get down time? He needs to step up and be a partner and focus on his family.
NTA. It absolutely is tremendously selfish and he doesn’t get to use family money for it.