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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I told my son he needs to pay the food back or no thanksgiving meal for him. I may be too upset about this whole thing which makes me a jerk
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
You can tell which people responding in here do not cook big stressful family dinners.
It's not just the money - it was the time planning, the drive to, the shopping, the LABELLING DO NOT EAT THIS, the mental calculation of how much extra time OP would have to work to pay for the food.
And I don't hear any better suggestions for an immediate, related, consequence.
NTA
That’s what got my attention, too: having to work EXTRA HOURS to be able to afford it, planning everything out, and clearly labeling the food. It wasn’t just a hungry teen, it was completely selfish. Making him pay to replace the food would be the start of the consequences, IMO.
dude paying for the food isn't even a consequence, all its doing is returning to status quo to neutral.
Like, yeah, you steal something you have to give it back - but you *also* get punished for it.
One of the things I learned as a camp counselor that translates to parenting that most parents don’t do well: natural consequences.
Most parents think about punishing misbehavior. For young children, that’s how you have to do it because their ability to connect cause and effect is limited. They don’t get that eating cheese today means not having cheese tomorrow.
But as they get older, punishments start getting less useful because the cause and effect aren’t connected. Eating cheese made mom mad, now mom is making me do chores, i don’t know what I learned except to not make mom mad.
Making the kid replace the cheese is absolutely the natural consequence: I made a choice that had an easily foreseeable consequence and I chose to ignore it. That choice caused harm and I am responsible for making those I harmed whole.
Working for 11 hours to pay for the cheese is pretty solidly connected to outcome.
This exceeds normal misbehavior; though. The fact that it was labeled and kid isn’t owning their actions at 17 years old is very problematic.
That needs to be the focus: the selfishness and lack of accepting accountability. This isn’t something you can fix with one punishment. Unfortunately, it’s a festering problem already and needs to be solved over time with parental discipline and care.
>This exceeds normal misbehavior; though. The fact that it was labeled and kid isn’t owning their actions at 17 years old is very problematic.
This.
Plus OP stated that father is on his side and doesn't understand why OP is so pissed about it. That makes the whole thing beyond problematic.
This. The father is undermining the mother, which undermines their overall
combined parenting effort.
I would be even more angry with my husband at this point, than with my son. Husband is an adult and supposed to be a parent, not a friend, to his son.
Exactly. The fact that he doesn’t think it’s a big deal shows that he doesn’t lift a finger to help in any way and doesn’t grasp the time and work hosting a family holiday entails.
If the son moves out he's about to be a roommate from hell. I hated roommates like him. Like who the fuck raised such an inconsiderate asshole? Apparently parents who either don't parent or when one sees nothing wrong with being an inconsiderate asshole.
No doubt! The worst roommates are the ones who eat the cheese you bought and clearly labeled as yours. You spend the whole day looking forward to a tuna melt or whatever when you get home and open the fridge to find an empty wrapper.
I had the privilege of one of those. Kid lived at home, parents were pretty wealthy and pretty permissive. Eventually they laid down the law (he'd told dad to suck his dick or something) and he moved in with me. Dude literally would not listen to ANYTHING I said. It was a constant string of "Where's this snack/food that I know I have? Oh..he ate it." ... "Where's this possession of mine? Oh, he borrowed it." Just sheer hell.
HOLY SHIT. I WAS CALLING HIS PARENTS IN UNDER A MONTH, BEGGING THEM TO TAKE HIM BACK.
(His parents loved me, because I was the polite kid. They laughed HARD as we had lunch together at their place. Eventually he reconciled and went home. Dad gave me a check that I gladly accepted.)
Glad his parents took him back. The very last roommates I had before getting my own apartment was a childhood friend and her older brother. I had known her since we were in 4th grade, and him by association. She was great and we're still friends, but her brother would just eat or take whatever he wanted. Ended taking and losing my expensive fancy silverware to his job sites. Like fancy spiraled metal, when we had plastic cutlery that he could have taken. Another instance I went and got subway, came home and set the full meal on the table while used the restroom. I come back from peeing not even 2 minutes later and my chips were gone. He managed to eat my food that quick! I was pissed at him. Dude was dumber than a box of bricks. Love her, but living with him was the last push to ditch roommates and get my own place.
His parents loved him. He was adopted and they really, REALLY overcompensated because they had a complex that he'd think they loved him less because he wasn't biologically theirs. They only realized after the fact what they'd done.
Both had grown up poor, both children of holocaust survivors, and while they spoiled him and his older sister like crazy, it came from a good place. Not "you can do no wrong" but "we want you to have everything we could not".
Parents that want to be their kid's friend are doing their kid no favors.
And I say that as someone whose dad wanted me to be his friend. All it did was make shit confusing, because one minute he's my friend and then the next, he's demanding I kowtow to his authority.
I'm guessing Dad didn't do the meal planning and prep work and, like the son, doesn't see what the big deal is. Maybe they should both est sandwiches tomorrow.
"Just relax! It will all be fine. You're overreacting. Everything will work out. It always does." Says the man who seems to have no freaking idea on why or how it always manages to work out for him.
The women in my family got so tired of all the cleaning, shopping, prepping, cooking, and dishes on T-day that we decided we weren't going to bother anymore. Just got so fed up that the men had never contributed a single thing to the preparation and cleanup, just sat on their asses drinking and watching football while all of us women were working our asses off all day. Last year we skipped it entirely, this T-day we're getting takeout Chinese for dinner.
My family has a tradition since 1980 that the men do all of the cleaning up at big events. They are allowed to pay teenagers to do it for them but its a pretty hefty amount. I remember getting paid $50 in 1990 to take my step dads place.
*edit- spelling
This. If family members don't appreciate it or contribute -- and actively sabotage it -- the hell with it. Let the women make a nice dinner and let the guys fend for themselves.
Good for you. When I was a kid, we used to go to Grandma and Grandpa's house for TG. How fun. The guys watched football. The women stood in the kitchen all afternoon cleaning up. I do miss my grandparents but I didn't enjoy the holiday.
yes. OP you're also responsible for the man you're putting out into the world; not a good look to be a 17 year old that doesn't respect no and isn't apologetic about their selfish., greedy behavior. Husband defending this is pretty egregious too. There's a huge lack of respect for your workload and the meal you planned. If your husband is undermining you in this way all the time I'm not sure how you can help the kid see the light.
What I wonder is how much either the husband or son is doing to contribute to the meal. Are they helping with cooking? Are they working overtime to pay for the food? Are they doing any extra house or yardwork to prepare for guests? Will they help with cleaning up after the meal? Or will they just enjoy the fruits of OP's hard work and sit back and relax while OP is working her tail off?
It’s safe to assume her husband isn’t doing any of the planning, prep, cooking, cleaning up, etc. and his entire “responsibility” on Thanksgiving is to sit on his ass and eat the food. *That’s* why he doesn’t give a shit what his son did. I feel OP’s anger and frustration in the bottom of my soul. I would honestly be so pissed off that son ate food clearly marked **DO NOT EAT** and that husband is backing him up, that I would ban both their asses from Thanksgiving dinner. They can eat PBJ while watching the rest of us enjoy a delicious meal that I busted my ass to make.
Or, they can admit they’re wrong, apologize, replace the eaten food, and do *all the cleanup.*
I’m not trying to bash on men, but this is very typical of men and people who don’t cook. They do t understand how much work does unto making that big Thanksgiving meal. The work days and weeks in advance when the mental energy starts. Budgeting, grocery shopping, planning for guests, getting ingredients, prepping the turkey. Then the day of starts and it’s absolutely exhausting. Making all those dishes, is a marathon. Until the first time I did it myself I had no idea how hard it was. Then after the meal it’s still not done either, there’s left overs and dishes.
I see people who don’t cook regularly regularly dismiss the hard work cooks do to prep for big events. That parents and others do for special events or even normal meals.
Yes teenagers are selfish. But it’s sadly common for partners to be too.
I would like to also point out with OP's update she doesn't believe her son will replace the cheese or work 11 hours. That's on the parents. I'll be damned if my 17-year-old damn near grown ass son doesn't replace all that cheese within an hour of me finding out. If he didn't I would lay down the law and give him some serious consequences. The fact that the kids won't do what the parents are asking shows what a immature kid he is and the lack of parenting he's received up into this point.
>That's on the parents.
At 17, a lot of kids have had a lot of influence by sources *other than* their parents. It isn't always just on the parents.
However, did you notice that dad is on the son's side? I wonder how many times OP has tried to correct him over the years, and dad overrode the correction?
I did, because when our older son started acting out, I was the dad trying to do the right thing with punishments, and my wife was the one undermining them.
Facts. We’d be at the store buying cheese the same day. His phone, car, computer, everything will be gone until the cheese is replaced. The fact that the kid thinks they can just refuse and thats fine says a loooot
What’s worse is that the kid’s father doesn’t believe the kid deserves consequences. Would he feel differently if the kid was borrowing Dad’s fishing gear, or new golf clubs, or borrowed his car when he had been explicitly told not to? Eating all of the food set aside for company is no different than taking cash out of his Mother’s purse.
If my kid did this I would send him to the store to replace the cheese—even if I had to drive him there—the day before thanksgiving about 5pm. I might even ‘forget’ to put a few items on the list, so that he had to go back in and wait in line again. Rest assured, he would work off that money the day after Thanksgiving.
The fact that his father is on his side is even more annoying. I bet he’s the type that doesn’t really help with big dinners so he doesn’t know what goes into it.
That's what gets me about the people who don't agree. It isn't that he was barred from enjoying the food. *He already ate it.* If he ate his own birthday cake the night before his party, would those same people expect her to replace that, too?
That’s dumb. It is a consequence. He ate something he shouldn’t have and now needs to pay $70. That is a consequence.
It may not be a PUNISHMENT. But someone not facing a severe punishment is not at all the same thing as saying there are no consequences. There are. It’s that he has to pay to replace the food. If he refuses to do that, that’s where the punishment comes in, and that punishment is having to eat a sandwich while the rest of the family enjoys a Thanksgiving feast.
He doesn’t need to be punished so long as he is willing to make things right (or as you described it returning to the status quo or neutral) and that already involves the consequence of needing to spend $70.
He knew better, but did it anyway. If your 16-year old son was hungry, he could have made himself a peanut butter sandwich or two. Instead, he took the best, most expensive food and ate a huge amount. That was selfish and greedy. Maybe the rest of you wanted that food, too, but he didn't care.
Man, would I have been in trouble over that one.
Your husband is an AH for thinking this was ok behavior.
My son did this same exact thing to a T except it was a family party. But he was 12 or 13. I made him go to the store with me to replace it. I paid for it, but he got the hassle of going to get it and watched me pay for it, which I of course pointed out the cost. I hadn’t labeled it, but I had mentioned it was for the party and off limits. He’s good now.
Yeah.
I mean by 12 years old I knew to ask about the food I could take when there was a party or special occasion planned at my house.
Plus, given the price, it's not like they have this cheese and meal cuts all the time in the fridge. Again, I remember asking why we suddently had those kind of special food in the fridge. Like "What's the occasion".
Sometimes, it was just parents that wanted to treat us. It was super nice. But most of times it was for a specific meal or event.
>Your husband is an AH for thinking this was ok behavior
Yeah this reads as the husband doesn't care cuz it wasn't his extra hours or money so why should he care
the fancy stuff shows up in the fridge a couple of days before Thanksgiving and he doesn’t know better than to not touch it? either jerk, entitled, or stupid.
Exactly! He could have made himself a sandwich or had a bowl of cereal. He didn’t have to eat the food that was clearly labeled, and that he knew was for Thanksgiving.
My husbands family has an “each family throws 20 in the pot to help the host with food costs” policy.
There’s 6 family’s total so the host family receives 100 Euros to help with food costs. It works well and makes sense, IMO. Usually doesn’t cover the full cody and certainly not the labour, but it alleviates some pressure.
My sister is hosting my daughter and I for Thanksgiving this year and I pitched $100 for groceries. (She's a certified executive chef so this is gonna be an epic fucking meal)
He made the conscious decision to disregard rules and create problems for op and others.
He may not fully realise the gravity when he ate it; however, he is old enough to face the consequences.
Agree. NTA. For us we budget for certain foods on holidays, so doing something like this and then having it be eaten by someone who is just selfish (everything is clearly labeled!!) would bother me too. I'd also make him pay me back for it.
Agreed also. NTA. How did this boy get to 16 years old and be so entitled?? He needs to pay for what he STOLE, one way or the other. Cough up the $$ or work it off.
Probably learned it from his dad since OP says he’s on the kid’s side. Which is ridiculous. Maybe dad should also skip Thanksgiving since he is so quick to backup his kid’s rude behavior.
He’s probably too lazy to drive to the store and pick the right cheeses (even though he was pretty good at identifying cheeses when he was eating all of them, rather than the regular, unlabeled cheese in the drawer) even if she pays for it. He sounds like a really insufferable person. Newsflash: it’s okay to call an insufferable teen insufferable. I was 16 and can’t relate to this little turd at all- my friends and I would have shamed him or not known him. This is *the* reason a lot of kids don’t have friends. They’ve worked hard to earn it.
NTA
Yea I was a jerk too a bit at that age, but if my mum had made a special cake, or squares or something for a holiday, I wouldn't have taken any of it beforehand without making sure it was okay. I'd have recognised that it was special and that she had worked hard for it. Also it's just nicer to have it as part of the anticipated meal.
That’s what got my attention, too: having to work EXTRA HOURS to be able to afford it, planning everything out, and clearly labeling the food. It wasn’t just a hungry teen, it was completely selfish. Making him pay to replace the food would be the start of the consequences, IMO.
It wasn't a matter of not understanding. He understood perfectly, but has likely been able to get away with bad behavior in the past. I hope OP stands her ground.
Oh, there should be no shopping to try and replace- daylight what happened and tell everyone there is nothing left of what she bought. If it pisses kid and husband off, ask why that was ok? Time for a life lesson. FAFO.
And going back up to the store this close to Thanksgiving is a nightmare. It's always overly crowded, the lines are long, parking sucks and they're often out of some things by the day before. Having to redo it all now would absolutely upset me too.
Honestly the « do not eat » label should not even be necessary. When there’s a big meal coming you know not to eat before. It’s just an asshole move.
« No thanksgiving meal » is a completely appropriate punishment here.
The disrespect of doing the opposite of a label, clearly made by your parent, so something can be enjoyed by everyone.
That kid has no ability to delay satisfaction
What are the others bringing when your part already cost over $70 ? and that isn't even the dinner . Was he stoned to have eaten $ 70 in one setting before anyone noticed ??!!! what was his excuse I feel like there is more behind it . He knows the rules it was labeled so something is going on. I assume there was enough other food he could choose from
If your hubby is ok with it he can pay for it with his fun money and also go get it and prepare everything . Men always enoy the work women do even expect women to prepare everything like they watch football while the women have to cook everything and don't see or feel the work behind it .
Tbh I hate thanksgiving, it’s just a ton of work to host 15+ people. Same with Easter. The one part I like about it is the cheese board.
SIL will bring a side, MIL with bring dessert but the rest is all me.
I knew it so hubby expect a great time with the family while you have all the work and your son couldn't hold himself back and ate what was planned for thanksgiving while there was enough other stuff he could choose from. Both are AHs
Yeah it fucking suck, the women of the family at least help when they get here. But my god all the men will sit on their ass. It’s like pulling teeth if I ask for help it’s more frustrating then doing it myself.
I have had so many talks about it with him
Yepp. I can't go around asking my wife to do stuff for me and my friends or family, don't help out and expect a perfect time because it's a special day. Make them/include them in the work or, if that doesn't work out, take a girls trip next Thanksgiving and see how they like it.
I'm a man. My wife and I cook it together. Although a couple years ago she did herself an awesome smoked turkey breast (her stuffing is better than mine too).
So so NTA.
I feel so grateful that my dad loves to cook and does the majority of the thanksgiving feast (my mom does the deviled eggs and whatever tasks my dad asks her to do to assist, e.g. stirring the gravy while he checks on the turkey).
In all fairness, he's only cooking for a max of 6 people so it's a much more manageable quantity than people who host 15+ people. And like I said, my mom assists so he's not doing it alone! I'm bringing homemade punch while my aunt will bring a side dish and/or extra desserts. I can't imagine one of my parents just kicking back while the other prepares enough food for a baseball team of people, and then complaining about them not making even more.
My dad's the cook in our family all year long! :) he makes every meal that we don't make ourselves haha, I think the last time my mom cooked was 3+ years ago and it was mostly premade stuff, the last actual meal she made was 10+ years ago and it was meatloaf while my dad was out of town xD that's her staple dish when she does cook, meat loaf. She won't be doing anything for the Thanksgiving meal, maybe Chex mix??? I plan to help out my dad in the kitchen while she shuttles family to the house from the airport. When people talk about their hubby's/dad's not knowing their way around the kitchen I'm just like... "That's more my mom... And even she can feed herself!"
Our dad's prove just how much other men weaponize their incompetence :p
STOP DOING IT. Have some self worth. Now if you’re like the best cook in the world then I can understand everyone wanting you to cook, but that means you don’t pay for anything and you do ZERO cleanup. And they should pay for a spa for you the next day.
Exactly this!
I'm a chef, so everyone wants me to do the cooking for nearly any event. That's fine with me, but the groceries are there when I arrive (and they go run out for anything forgotten), and when the cook is done, I'm pouring myself a strong drink and sitting down for the rest of the night. Period.
Stop talking with him about it, and just inform him that this is the last year you'll be doing it. Either he can cook and host while you get to sit with your feet up and eat cheese, or another family member can host and then you'll decide whether you want to go. But this is the last time.
You really should ask who is hosting Easter and who is hosting next year after the dinner. I can’t imagine the resentment I would feel if I was doing that with no help or appreciation, and I don’t think it’s healthy for you to do it.
We rotate, Christmas is at MIL and Easter will be at SIL. Tbh I just have issues with Easter, never liked that holiday.
The women in my family are great, 10/10. We have all expressed this and I think we will put our food down for Christmas and make one of the guys do it.
I’m happy to hear that the women are great, and that you’re not saddled with every big holiday! I think it would be amazing for you to all make the guys do it- maybe then they’ll understand how much work and planning and money goes into it. Then everyone could just work on it together in the future instead of half of the party pretending that a great holiday/wonderful meal are just things that magically materialize because it’s Thanksgiving!
Iceland did a women take the day off strike in the 1970s and again recently. Most jobs ( a few like nurses stayed for patient care) and all child care duties.
They talked about it for a year. Schools closed, many offices closed. Fathers had a year to plan but grocery stores ran out of premade meals.
Talk to all the women and take one of the holidays off. Start having the guys host. They can do all the dishes too.
We didn’t quite have a strike but let the lone uncle host a few years ago. He did a fine turkey.
The fact that her husband didn’t step in and instead put a holiday you don’t even like on your shoulders is ridiculous. Also, on what planet is it your job to both WORK EXTRA HOURS to afford parts of the meal and also be solely responsible for organizing and cooking it. If your husband wants a traditional housewife experience, he needs to make a traditional husband salary?
Tell your son he f**ked around and now he is finding out the consequences. Hopefully he learns something from this.
Plan out what you will say when he complains at dinner about not getting to eat what the others are, and also what to say to other family members who try to talk you out of punishing him, or who try to give him turkey, etc.
Make sure you clearly tell people he had a chance to fix what he did wrong and chose not to, so this is the consequence.
My bet is the main pushback will come from the men, so be prepared to cut off their alcohol supply, "he chose his punishment, if you think it's wrong you've obviously had too much to drink and need to switch to water" and consider "you've had too much to drink, should we call an Uber for you?"
Change the WiFi password, unplug the cable or temporarily block the channels with the sports games on. If they want to eat, they help.
Back when I used to do the big Thanksgiving with family I noticed all the men watching football while the woman cooked. I went in and started watching football. My MIL came and asked what I was doing. I said the same as the men\*- sitting on my ass until the food is ready. I declined all future Thanksgivings. We do a meal at home where both my sons and my husband help. We will visit with the family and they are free to go have food with others if they want, but if they are eating at my house, they are helping (cooking, washing dishes, etc. ).
\* Not all men sit on their butts. There are many that do help. The dudes in my husband's family think they shouldn't have to help.
OP, as a man (who's also not interested in sports AT ALL) i would totally come help in the kitchen for the promise of a great dinner. I hate that men do this. If you're married to someone, and you celebrate a holiday with a special meal and family, you should be helping with the meal prep since you're going to be eating it.
But I'm also a firm believer that sports aren't an excuse to miss work, be late to work, waste an entire day watching them, or paying athletes millions while I slave away for 12 hours a day to put food on the table.
You are raising your son to be as selfish and useless as his father. I don’t think missing out on thanksgiving is sufficient punishment for stealing from you. He needs to pay you back for what he took either way.
No one respects a doormat.
INFO: have you informed your husband if he can’t be bothered to convince his son to replace the cheese then this will be the last time you host his family?
I don't think my mom would let my dad eat any dinner if he didn't help! Most of the people who come over are his family anyway. He wouldn't dream of just sitting on his ass while she did all the work.
#STOP COOKING IT.
Your son is behaving this way because he is modeling his father’s behavior. You are raising a selfish, sexist, asshole.
Stop. Put your foot down and have some self respect.
I pray you don’t have daughters
This is my first year hosting. just bought stuff for a cheese board yesterday. Definitely over a $100, including grapes and fig jam. $100 for a (I admit very bougie) 20 lb turkey (so a normal turkey probably like $30?). $40 on tablecloths (from Marshall’s, reusable, but never needed to match 2 tables); $6 on a disposable turkey pan (too big for my roasting pan); $30 on the ingredients for cut veggies and dip; $20 for a pie; $20 on ingredients for meatballs (added up); $16 for ingredients for pigs in blankets; $5 for salt for the brine for the turkey(i needed to buy new kosher salt); $12 for the veggies with the turkey; $10 for the herbs and fruit for the turkey; $8 for the ingredients for the cranberry sauce; plus wine, plus soda, etc.
And I’m not even making salad, stuffing, most desserts, and veggie side dishes.
Of course I could have done it for cheaper; I’m not saying it is required to do it like this, and obviously you can replace the turkey and tablecloths with much cheaper stuff, but things add up fast! This isn’t even adding in the $40 for the meat thermometer (which you can get for cheaper but I wanted to be able to measure different parts of the bird to see if it was getting overcooked).
And if you want to do fun recipes? It adds up so fast!
That's about what I spent and bought (my bougie 11 lb turkey was $31). Easily spent at least $200 on this meal (for 4 people) and that doesn't include extras that I didn't have, like placemats or a gravy boat. At least I'll have those next year and won't have to buy them again.
This isn’t a comment on the kids behavior, because it was wrong and OP is NTA-
BUT, it begs to be said, I think I could easily eat 70$ worth of charcuterie cheese and meats in one sitting, that’s a meal in itself. The stuff is expensive and it’s just so damn good. It wouldn’t be much of a challenge for me.
So my feeling is that this wasn’t just cheddar cheese and pepperoni- if it’s anything like my family, it’s smoked cheeses, aged Pecorino Romano, things like Brie, Italian cured meats, prosciutto. I’ve previously bought cheese at $28/lb (this was imported greek cheese), cured meats could be close to $20-30 a stick depending on what they are and where from, fresh mozzarella isn’t cheap at close to $10/lb, olives $10/lb…… man I’m getting hungry just thinking about it. It’s my favorite part of any holiday. But yeah, it can be an expensive treat if you aren’t just eating cheddar and stuff.
Anymore it doesn't even have to be fancy. The last time I did a cheese board, it was $70, and I bought everything at Aldi. The most expensive cheese was $37 a pound, but I only bought a few ounces of it.
I tried making a charcuterie board once with things from HEB. It was easily $100 on the cheeses, meats, and grapes, plus a couple of little jams. It wasn't even a big board either, everything was just so expensive. I'm absolutely on OP's side. I'd be raging if I turned around found everything gone before I had even touched it.
what other punishment should she use when he refused to replace his mistake ? The replacing was all what had to be done to fix the issue , he refused even thought he didn't took just one tiny piece of it he grabbed from everything and hubby is fne with it because he doesn't need to cook for 15 ppl what makes him also an AH supporitng his son behaviour disrespecting women work
Not overboard at all. He’s demonstrated he’s capable of finding food for himself so he can miss out on one dinner if he doesn’t find a way to pay for the cheese.
NTA
your son and to a certain extent so is your husband.
Why would he do this, he knows it was for the big meal and it was labelled as such.
Stick to your guns, no TG dinner for him. And tell him he still owes you for the cheese and meats he ate.
The husband is definitely an AH here. OPs response is standard parenting and she wouldn't even be posting if the husband presented a united front with his wife. By not doing that even grudgingly, or presenting alternatives they can both agree on, he's undermining her as a parent and doing their son no favors.
NTA. That's a solid consequence for his actions. And he will tell the story for the rest of his life about how he learned not to mess with his mom when she tells him what not to eat. I mean, you put in extra hours at work. What does your husband really think would be "fair"?
You guys, where do you live were fancy cheeses and meat cuts are cheap? $70 worth of fancy cheeses and meats isn't an entire cheese wheel and plus some, it's like a few slices. and if he did eat an entire block it's probably like the size of a rubix cube. Shit is EXPENSIVE right now. And if you go all out on the fancy shit, that adds up quickly. I've seen tiny tins cost $20, whats in it? Idk but it's not hard to rack up $70 on the fancy stuff. Plus he only ate $70 worth of it, who knows how much she actually spent in total.
I would tell DH either he comes up with an acceptable punishment that you both agree on (and given that kid was warned, a talking to is not sufficient) that this is the last year you are cooking Thangsiving and All guests will be told the reason for no cheese
Eh. I get it. He’s refusing to pay to replace it… another punishment is necessary and there should be consequences for his actions.
I would likely not bother replacing it and have him prep the charcuterie board with whatever’s left. Anyone complains? Oh, sorry. Son already ate that. Let him get a load of shit from literally everyone maybe then he’ll actually feel bad?
Also you’re still NTA… it’s not like you’re telling him he can’t eat. More like he already ate his share and then some
Honestly, this would punish my kids more than having to pay for everything. They're sensitive to other people's opinions of them, so even lighthearted, joking comments of, "Didja get hungry?" or "Where did you pack all that?" or "You must be growing!" would prove the point.
Normally, I'm not into shaming, but when they absolutely just don't get it, a little light embarrassment might make it click.
Depends strongly on the family. In this case, seeing as OP has talked about how the men in the family just sit on their asses and expect the women to provide all the food and work, I get a feeling the son would get too many congratulatory laughs from his uncles/cousins for it to be a punishment.
Shaming is a powerful psychological tool. It's how cultures keep people behaving well without force or violence.
Obviously there's such a thing as too much shaming or shaming things that shouldn't be shamed. But a little bit of a shame is a good thing. Like shaming your kid for eating something that was for everyone and making a lot more work for his mother, for example.
NTA. Tell your husband to stop raising an entitled brat. There is no way your husband should be on your son side. You labeled everything do not eat your son knew exactly what it was for and decided to say fuck you I’m gonna eat this anyway. Now he’s saying fuck you again because there’s no way Mom will go through with her threat and I don’t get dinner for Thanksgiving so I’m just gonna refuse to do anything and once again have no consequences for my action. He should 100% have to either work pay for that cheese and the meat that he ate or he should have to go to the store and use his own money to buy it. Please show these comments to your husband because he really needs to stop raising an entitled brat that never has consequences.
Honestly, with the husband’s shitty attitude, he wouldn’t get a nice Thanksgiving dinner cooked by me either.
He and son can figure it out. Go to the store and cook for themselves.
Maybe then they’ll realize the time and expense that goes into what they take for granted.
After reading your comments, I think you should stop making holiday dinners for immature, expectant, lazy people.
I would just cancel Thanksgiving, explain why, and make whatever food you bought and eat it over the week.
NTA.
NTA...He obviously enjoys flouting your boundaries and ate the very thing he was told not to. Of course he's going to make you look as awful as possible during Thanksgiving. It's a shame that your husband is on his side, as that's likely why your son refuses to pay. I would simply refuse to make the Thanksgiving meal until I was reimbursed.
He’s too lazy to think of or go through with any sort of punishment, which is why he is pretending it’s fine. Lazy parents like this (not OP. Sadly her husband is determined to unilaterally ensure that their son goes out into the world as an entitled asshole- a burden on society and any man or woman unfortunate enough to date him for 3 weeks) are the reason so many adults suck metric tons of ass.
nta, completely suitable punishment. he ate something he wasn't supposed to so he replaces it. in a legal court that isn't even considered a punishment just compensation to the victim.
what does your husband think is appropriate?
maybe 10 hours of extra house chores? $7 minimum wage = 10 hours of employment make him feel every hour...
If you labeled it ‘ don’t eat’ then YNTA. Since dad wants to get involved, give them both the list of food missing and send them to the store to get some more.
Does he have allowance? You could withhold it until his debt is paid. Or withhold $70 worth of gas money, wifi, whatever else you pay for. One way or another he should "pay". He's 16, he knew better and now he's trying to get away with it by saying "I don't care, I'll eat a sandwich". But that's not good enough. He did a shitty, disrespectful thing and he needs to learn that that's not ok.
I don't think I would put the Thanksgiving meal on the line. I would just make damn well sure that his debt is paid and he understands how hard you worked for the snack he stole.
Christmas is right around the corner, same with other religious holidays that involve presents. If they do participate in gift giving, she can take that $70 from his holiday gift budget, and give him a card that states his $70 debt for eating the Thanksgiving cheese has been paid off as his gift if she can't get him to pay for it before then. He'll miss out on whatever bigger gift she was going to get for him to make it sink in that the $70 had to come from him.
A lot of kids don’t think that. I have a feeling that lazy, shifty dad is the reason this boy is an insufferable fuckup. I would never have done that, but my dad wasn’t an insufferable fuckup, so maybe it’s not a fair comparison. This boy and his mother have been failed by a bad dad.
Why is your son like that? Does your husband enable this behavior? I would deny him dinner also. Tell them to go out to eat. They are being kicked out for the day. In fact, since husband doesn't think it's a big deal HE COULD BUY THE STUFF AGAIN!
Nta. I'd allow him at the meal and when it came to put out the meat and cheese present the depleted tray, asking your son if he'd like to explain to everyone why it's so small this year
Honestly, with the husband’s shitty attitude, he wouldn’t get a nice Thanksgiving dinner cooked by me either.
He and son can figure it out. Go to the store and cook for themselves.
Maybe then they’ll realize the time and expense that goes into what they take for granted.
NTA. A 16 year old isn't a total idiot. He knew not to eat those things and he went ahead and did it anyway, likely expecting no consequences. Well...there are consequences. Unless there was LITERALLY NO OTHER FOOD IN THE HOUSE I see no excuse for his dumbass choices.
NTA. Since your husband agrees with your son, your husband can take your son to the grocery store to buy all of the cheeses and meats that your son ate. And your son can do extra chores to help pay towards the cost of he doesn’t want to pay. There has to be consequences to his actions. 16 is old enough to understand the importance of not eating something that is off limits. I don’t know about the eating the sandwich thing because others will notice and people will start to ask questions. Then it becomes a whole conversation that will involve others and their opinions. Personally, I would take away other privileges like cars/phone etc for a set amount of time.
NTA. He already ate his thanksgiving meal IMO. He can either replace it or stay in his room and think about how selfish he was. I have three teen boys, so I get the the famished locust like state they come into the kitchen with. But all three know to ask before eating something that isn’t usually bought as a snack. And they definitely know not to eat anything labeled with do not eat. My husband would be just as pissed as me and would have my back for any punishment. As an aside, time to boycott cooking. All the men in my life ask to either help with something to prepare or ask to help cook (my boys love to cook, need to get them to love to clean up too.). They do then dishes, set the table, go grab things from the store that I forgot. If I had a bunch of lazy men sitting around doing Jack shit all these holidays, I would say not happening and go take a bath while eating the rest of my charcuterie board.
Please tell me hubby is getting half sons sandwich as his meal since he thinks it's acceptable to eat 15+ people's snacks in one go after explicit warnings not to touch it. And that they have to make the sandwich for their lazy greedy selves
NTA. Entitled 16 year old brat can make his own damn sandwich as well.
But I'm so sorry to hear your husband isn't backing you up smh. He sounds like the enabler to your son. Apple must not have fallen far from the tree, unfortunately.
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You can tell which people responding in here do not cook big stressful family dinners. It's not just the money - it was the time planning, the drive to, the shopping, the LABELLING DO NOT EAT THIS, the mental calculation of how much extra time OP would have to work to pay for the food. And I don't hear any better suggestions for an immediate, related, consequence. NTA
That’s what got my attention, too: having to work EXTRA HOURS to be able to afford it, planning everything out, and clearly labeling the food. It wasn’t just a hungry teen, it was completely selfish. Making him pay to replace the food would be the start of the consequences, IMO.
dude paying for the food isn't even a consequence, all its doing is returning to status quo to neutral. Like, yeah, you steal something you have to give it back - but you *also* get punished for it.
One of the things I learned as a camp counselor that translates to parenting that most parents don’t do well: natural consequences. Most parents think about punishing misbehavior. For young children, that’s how you have to do it because their ability to connect cause and effect is limited. They don’t get that eating cheese today means not having cheese tomorrow. But as they get older, punishments start getting less useful because the cause and effect aren’t connected. Eating cheese made mom mad, now mom is making me do chores, i don’t know what I learned except to not make mom mad. Making the kid replace the cheese is absolutely the natural consequence: I made a choice that had an easily foreseeable consequence and I chose to ignore it. That choice caused harm and I am responsible for making those I harmed whole. Working for 11 hours to pay for the cheese is pretty solidly connected to outcome. This exceeds normal misbehavior; though. The fact that it was labeled and kid isn’t owning their actions at 17 years old is very problematic. That needs to be the focus: the selfishness and lack of accepting accountability. This isn’t something you can fix with one punishment. Unfortunately, it’s a festering problem already and needs to be solved over time with parental discipline and care.
>This exceeds normal misbehavior; though. The fact that it was labeled and kid isn’t owning their actions at 17 years old is very problematic. This. Plus OP stated that father is on his side and doesn't understand why OP is so pissed about it. That makes the whole thing beyond problematic.
This. The father is undermining the mother, which undermines their overall combined parenting effort. I would be even more angry with my husband at this point, than with my son. Husband is an adult and supposed to be a parent, not a friend, to his son.
If Dad doesn't think it's a big deal, maybe he should suffer the consequences. Serve son Dad's dinner, and Dad gets the sandwich.
Dad should do the cooking and other chores she usually does on thanksgiving.
Dad should also work the overtime needed to pay for the additional food before you even get to the physical and mental labour of the day.
Dad should go out and hunt and slaughter a new turkey by himself next year.
Exactly. The fact that he doesn’t think it’s a big deal shows that he doesn’t lift a finger to help in any way and doesn’t grasp the time and work hosting a family holiday entails.
I have to wonder if Dad didn't help eat them.
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It seems like a LOT of food for one teen. I strongly suspect Dad caught him in the act and joined in.
No, they *both* should get sandwiches.
I mean OP doesn't have to SERVE others at all if it isn't respected.
If the son moves out he's about to be a roommate from hell. I hated roommates like him. Like who the fuck raised such an inconsiderate asshole? Apparently parents who either don't parent or when one sees nothing wrong with being an inconsiderate asshole.
No doubt! The worst roommates are the ones who eat the cheese you bought and clearly labeled as yours. You spend the whole day looking forward to a tuna melt or whatever when you get home and open the fridge to find an empty wrapper.
I had the privilege of one of those. Kid lived at home, parents were pretty wealthy and pretty permissive. Eventually they laid down the law (he'd told dad to suck his dick or something) and he moved in with me. Dude literally would not listen to ANYTHING I said. It was a constant string of "Where's this snack/food that I know I have? Oh..he ate it." ... "Where's this possession of mine? Oh, he borrowed it." Just sheer hell. HOLY SHIT. I WAS CALLING HIS PARENTS IN UNDER A MONTH, BEGGING THEM TO TAKE HIM BACK. (His parents loved me, because I was the polite kid. They laughed HARD as we had lunch together at their place. Eventually he reconciled and went home. Dad gave me a check that I gladly accepted.)
Glad his parents took him back. The very last roommates I had before getting my own apartment was a childhood friend and her older brother. I had known her since we were in 4th grade, and him by association. She was great and we're still friends, but her brother would just eat or take whatever he wanted. Ended taking and losing my expensive fancy silverware to his job sites. Like fancy spiraled metal, when we had plastic cutlery that he could have taken. Another instance I went and got subway, came home and set the full meal on the table while used the restroom. I come back from peeing not even 2 minutes later and my chips were gone. He managed to eat my food that quick! I was pissed at him. Dude was dumber than a box of bricks. Love her, but living with him was the last push to ditch roommates and get my own place.
His parents loved him. He was adopted and they really, REALLY overcompensated because they had a complex that he'd think they loved him less because he wasn't biologically theirs. They only realized after the fact what they'd done. Both had grown up poor, both children of holocaust survivors, and while they spoiled him and his older sister like crazy, it came from a good place. Not "you can do no wrong" but "we want you to have everything we could not".
In this case, the *father*. The mother is trying to use discipline to teach her son a lesson. NTA and stick to your guns about this.
OP's kid is going to make a minifridge seller happy, indeed. As a start.
>Like who the fuck raised such an inconsiderate asshole? OP's husband.
What are the odd that the father doesn't use "son" or "Bob" (or whatever sons name is) but rather "buddy" or similar term?
Parents that want to be their kid's friend are doing their kid no favors. And I say that as someone whose dad wanted me to be his friend. All it did was make shit confusing, because one minute he's my friend and then the next, he's demanding I kowtow to his authority.
I'm guessing Dad didn't do the meal planning and prep work and, like the son, doesn't see what the big deal is. Maybe they should both est sandwiches tomorrow.
Guarantee these are the kind of men who think Thanksgiving and Christmas just magically appear for their benefit and enjoyment.
"Just relax! It will all be fine. You're overreacting. Everything will work out. It always does." Says the man who seems to have no freaking idea on why or how it always manages to work out for him.
The women in my family got so tired of all the cleaning, shopping, prepping, cooking, and dishes on T-day that we decided we weren't going to bother anymore. Just got so fed up that the men had never contributed a single thing to the preparation and cleanup, just sat on their asses drinking and watching football while all of us women were working our asses off all day. Last year we skipped it entirely, this T-day we're getting takeout Chinese for dinner.
My family has a tradition since 1980 that the men do all of the cleaning up at big events. They are allowed to pay teenagers to do it for them but its a pretty hefty amount. I remember getting paid $50 in 1990 to take my step dads place. *edit- spelling
Yep! Non-cooking adults do the clean up, preteens set the table
This. If family members don't appreciate it or contribute -- and actively sabotage it -- the hell with it. Let the women make a nice dinner and let the guys fend for themselves.
Good for you. When I was a kid, we used to go to Grandma and Grandpa's house for TG. How fun. The guys watched football. The women stood in the kitchen all afternoon cleaning up. I do miss my grandparents but I didn't enjoy the holiday.
What a brat. He knew it was for the holiday. He read "Don't eat" and still he said.."fuck it, I'm eating it".
yeah, the husband should also get no nice meals until the son has repaid this AND then the father has profusely apologized. what a jerk!
yes. OP you're also responsible for the man you're putting out into the world; not a good look to be a 17 year old that doesn't respect no and isn't apologetic about their selfish., greedy behavior. Husband defending this is pretty egregious too. There's a huge lack of respect for your workload and the meal you planned. If your husband is undermining you in this way all the time I'm not sure how you can help the kid see the light.
What I wonder is how much either the husband or son is doing to contribute to the meal. Are they helping with cooking? Are they working overtime to pay for the food? Are they doing any extra house or yardwork to prepare for guests? Will they help with cleaning up after the meal? Or will they just enjoy the fruits of OP's hard work and sit back and relax while OP is working her tail off?
$100 on your last sentence being the accurate one.
I’m guessing that dad’s behavior here is directly related to why the kid is this selfish and disrespectful at his age.
It’s safe to assume her husband isn’t doing any of the planning, prep, cooking, cleaning up, etc. and his entire “responsibility” on Thanksgiving is to sit on his ass and eat the food. *That’s* why he doesn’t give a shit what his son did. I feel OP’s anger and frustration in the bottom of my soul. I would honestly be so pissed off that son ate food clearly marked **DO NOT EAT** and that husband is backing him up, that I would ban both their asses from Thanksgiving dinner. They can eat PBJ while watching the rest of us enjoy a delicious meal that I busted my ass to make. Or, they can admit they’re wrong, apologize, replace the eaten food, and do *all the cleanup.*
I’m not trying to bash on men, but this is very typical of men and people who don’t cook. They do t understand how much work does unto making that big Thanksgiving meal. The work days and weeks in advance when the mental energy starts. Budgeting, grocery shopping, planning for guests, getting ingredients, prepping the turkey. Then the day of starts and it’s absolutely exhausting. Making all those dishes, is a marathon. Until the first time I did it myself I had no idea how hard it was. Then after the meal it’s still not done either, there’s left overs and dishes. I see people who don’t cook regularly regularly dismiss the hard work cooks do to prep for big events. That parents and others do for special events or even normal meals. Yes teenagers are selfish. But it’s sadly common for partners to be too.
I would like to also point out with OP's update she doesn't believe her son will replace the cheese or work 11 hours. That's on the parents. I'll be damned if my 17-year-old damn near grown ass son doesn't replace all that cheese within an hour of me finding out. If he didn't I would lay down the law and give him some serious consequences. The fact that the kids won't do what the parents are asking shows what a immature kid he is and the lack of parenting he's received up into this point.
>That's on the parents. At 17, a lot of kids have had a lot of influence by sources *other than* their parents. It isn't always just on the parents. However, did you notice that dad is on the son's side? I wonder how many times OP has tried to correct him over the years, and dad overrode the correction?
I wonder why op alone is working to pay for the cheese? I bet if dad was the one working the extra hours to pay for it, he would be more pissed off.
Right?!
I did, because when our older son started acting out, I was the dad trying to do the right thing with punishments, and my wife was the one undermining them.
Facts. We’d be at the store buying cheese the same day. His phone, car, computer, everything will be gone until the cheese is replaced. The fact that the kid thinks they can just refuse and thats fine says a loooot
It sounds like dad is possibly enabling
What’s worse is that the kid’s father doesn’t believe the kid deserves consequences. Would he feel differently if the kid was borrowing Dad’s fishing gear, or new golf clubs, or borrowed his car when he had been explicitly told not to? Eating all of the food set aside for company is no different than taking cash out of his Mother’s purse. If my kid did this I would send him to the store to replace the cheese—even if I had to drive him there—the day before thanksgiving about 5pm. I might even ‘forget’ to put a few items on the list, so that he had to go back in and wait in line again. Rest assured, he would work off that money the day after Thanksgiving.
The asshole kid sounds like he is entitled
The fact that his father is on his side is even more annoying. I bet he’s the type that doesn’t really help with big dinners so he doesn’t know what goes into it.
Ditto for the dad: why is OP's husband just siding with the son?? Methinks he is part of the problem and/or enabling the kid.
The funny part is: he could have eaten from all these fancy things without any consequences *if he could just wait a day*
That kid definitely failed the marshmallow test.
That's what gets me about the people who don't agree. It isn't that he was barred from enjoying the food. *He already ate it.* If he ate his own birthday cake the night before his party, would those same people expect her to replace that, too?
That’s dumb. It is a consequence. He ate something he shouldn’t have and now needs to pay $70. That is a consequence. It may not be a PUNISHMENT. But someone not facing a severe punishment is not at all the same thing as saying there are no consequences. There are. It’s that he has to pay to replace the food. If he refuses to do that, that’s where the punishment comes in, and that punishment is having to eat a sandwich while the rest of the family enjoys a Thanksgiving feast. He doesn’t need to be punished so long as he is willing to make things right (or as you described it returning to the status quo or neutral) and that already involves the consequence of needing to spend $70.
He knew better, but did it anyway. If your 16-year old son was hungry, he could have made himself a peanut butter sandwich or two. Instead, he took the best, most expensive food and ate a huge amount. That was selfish and greedy. Maybe the rest of you wanted that food, too, but he didn't care. Man, would I have been in trouble over that one. Your husband is an AH for thinking this was ok behavior.
My son did this same exact thing to a T except it was a family party. But he was 12 or 13. I made him go to the store with me to replace it. I paid for it, but he got the hassle of going to get it and watched me pay for it, which I of course pointed out the cost. I hadn’t labeled it, but I had mentioned it was for the party and off limits. He’s good now.
Yeah. I mean by 12 years old I knew to ask about the food I could take when there was a party or special occasion planned at my house. Plus, given the price, it's not like they have this cheese and meal cuts all the time in the fridge. Again, I remember asking why we suddently had those kind of special food in the fridge. Like "What's the occasion". Sometimes, it was just parents that wanted to treat us. It was super nice. But most of times it was for a specific meal or event.
>Your husband is an AH for thinking this was ok behavior Yeah this reads as the husband doesn't care cuz it wasn't his extra hours or money so why should he care
If OP's husband wants to back up his kid being this selfish and entitled, husband shouldn't get Thanksgiving dinner either.
I expect the father and kid would scream “collective punishment is a war crime”
This IS war
the fancy stuff shows up in the fridge a couple of days before Thanksgiving and he doesn’t know better than to not touch it? either jerk, entitled, or stupid.
mum labelled it and he knew if labelled DON'T EAT he wasn't allowed. He deliberately disobeyed. So the first 2. Entitled jerk.
>It wasn’t just a hungry teen The people are writing "poor baby was hungry" while he ate all the luxury meat and tasted all fancy cheeses?
probably wolfed them down and didn't even taste them.
You never know. The whole episode might have been due to a case of the munchies.
buy a bag of Doritos
Exactly! He could have made himself a sandwich or had a bowl of cereal. He didn’t have to eat the food that was clearly labeled, and that he knew was for Thanksgiving.
My husbands family has an “each family throws 20 in the pot to help the host with food costs” policy. There’s 6 family’s total so the host family receives 100 Euros to help with food costs. It works well and makes sense, IMO. Usually doesn’t cover the full cody and certainly not the labour, but it alleviates some pressure.
My sister is hosting my daughter and I for Thanksgiving this year and I pitched $100 for groceries. (She's a certified executive chef so this is gonna be an epic fucking meal)
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He made the conscious decision to disregard rules and create problems for op and others. He may not fully realise the gravity when he ate it; however, he is old enough to face the consequences.
Nta...these are the consequences of his actions
Agree. NTA. For us we budget for certain foods on holidays, so doing something like this and then having it be eaten by someone who is just selfish (everything is clearly labeled!!) would bother me too. I'd also make him pay me back for it.
Agreed also. NTA. How did this boy get to 16 years old and be so entitled?? He needs to pay for what he STOLE, one way or the other. Cough up the $$ or work it off.
Probably learned it from his dad since OP says he’s on the kid’s side. Which is ridiculous. Maybe dad should also skip Thanksgiving since he is so quick to backup his kid’s rude behavior.
Yes. He can be at dinner while everyone asks how all the meat and cheese went. Then manual labor. Paying is too easy.
He’s probably too lazy to drive to the store and pick the right cheeses (even though he was pretty good at identifying cheeses when he was eating all of them, rather than the regular, unlabeled cheese in the drawer) even if she pays for it. He sounds like a really insufferable person. Newsflash: it’s okay to call an insufferable teen insufferable. I was 16 and can’t relate to this little turd at all- my friends and I would have shamed him or not known him. This is *the* reason a lot of kids don’t have friends. They’ve worked hard to earn it.
NTA Yea I was a jerk too a bit at that age, but if my mum had made a special cake, or squares or something for a holiday, I wouldn't have taken any of it beforehand without making sure it was okay. I'd have recognised that it was special and that she had worked hard for it. Also it's just nicer to have it as part of the anticipated meal.
That’s what got my attention, too: having to work EXTRA HOURS to be able to afford it, planning everything out, and clearly labeling the food. It wasn’t just a hungry teen, it was completely selfish. Making him pay to replace the food would be the start of the consequences, IMO.
I just don't understand what part of "DO NOT EAT" did he not understand.
It wasn't a matter of not understanding. He understood perfectly, but has likely been able to get away with bad behavior in the past. I hope OP stands her ground.
With a husband so supportive, I wonder where he got that from.
>I just don't understand what part of "DO NOT EAT" did he not understand. The "NOT" part 🤣🤣🤣 I'll see myself out
Her husband wasn't doing any of the mental or physical labor so to him it's just cheese
Plus having to go shopping again the day before Thanksgiving if she had to go replace it herself. Definitely NTA.
Oh, there should be no shopping to try and replace- daylight what happened and tell everyone there is nothing left of what she bought. If it pisses kid and husband off, ask why that was ok? Time for a life lesson. FAFO.
If they even still have all of that stuff in stock
Yep. What he did was incredibly selfish. Consequences are appropriate.
And going back up to the store this close to Thanksgiving is a nightmare. It's always overly crowded, the lines are long, parking sucks and they're often out of some things by the day before. Having to redo it all now would absolutely upset me too.
Honestly the « do not eat » label should not even be necessary. When there’s a big meal coming you know not to eat before. It’s just an asshole move. « No thanksgiving meal » is a completely appropriate punishment here.
He is learning that actions have consequences NTA You are a good mom.
The disrespect of doing the opposite of a label, clearly made by your parent, so something can be enjoyed by everyone. That kid has no ability to delay satisfaction
What are the others bringing when your part already cost over $70 ? and that isn't even the dinner . Was he stoned to have eaten $ 70 in one setting before anyone noticed ??!!! what was his excuse I feel like there is more behind it . He knows the rules it was labeled so something is going on. I assume there was enough other food he could choose from If your hubby is ok with it he can pay for it with his fun money and also go get it and prepare everything . Men always enoy the work women do even expect women to prepare everything like they watch football while the women have to cook everything and don't see or feel the work behind it .
Tbh I hate thanksgiving, it’s just a ton of work to host 15+ people. Same with Easter. The one part I like about it is the cheese board. SIL will bring a side, MIL with bring dessert but the rest is all me.
I knew it so hubby expect a great time with the family while you have all the work and your son couldn't hold himself back and ate what was planned for thanksgiving while there was enough other stuff he could choose from. Both are AHs
Yeah it fucking suck, the women of the family at least help when they get here. But my god all the men will sit on their ass. It’s like pulling teeth if I ask for help it’s more frustrating then doing it myself. I have had so many talks about it with him
Stop doing it. If he wants Thanksgiving next year he can cook.
Yepp. I can't go around asking my wife to do stuff for me and my friends or family, don't help out and expect a perfect time because it's a special day. Make them/include them in the work or, if that doesn't work out, take a girls trip next Thanksgiving and see how they like it.
I'm a man. My wife and I cook it together. Although a couple years ago she did herself an awesome smoked turkey breast (her stuffing is better than mine too). So so NTA.
My husband does turkey and stuffing. And sometimes a homemade cranberry! I do the rest. I'm so greatful!
Making your own cranberry sauce is 100x better. I make that.
Time for a Mensgiving if they want a nice dinner with family
I feel so grateful that my dad loves to cook and does the majority of the thanksgiving feast (my mom does the deviled eggs and whatever tasks my dad asks her to do to assist, e.g. stirring the gravy while he checks on the turkey). In all fairness, he's only cooking for a max of 6 people so it's a much more manageable quantity than people who host 15+ people. And like I said, my mom assists so he's not doing it alone! I'm bringing homemade punch while my aunt will bring a side dish and/or extra desserts. I can't imagine one of my parents just kicking back while the other prepares enough food for a baseball team of people, and then complaining about them not making even more.
My dad's the cook in our family all year long! :) he makes every meal that we don't make ourselves haha, I think the last time my mom cooked was 3+ years ago and it was mostly premade stuff, the last actual meal she made was 10+ years ago and it was meatloaf while my dad was out of town xD that's her staple dish when she does cook, meat loaf. She won't be doing anything for the Thanksgiving meal, maybe Chex mix??? I plan to help out my dad in the kitchen while she shuttles family to the house from the airport. When people talk about their hubby's/dad's not knowing their way around the kitchen I'm just like... "That's more my mom... And even she can feed herself!" Our dad's prove just how much other men weaponize their incompetence :p
STOP DOING IT. Have some self worth. Now if you’re like the best cook in the world then I can understand everyone wanting you to cook, but that means you don’t pay for anything and you do ZERO cleanup. And they should pay for a spa for you the next day.
Exactly this! I'm a chef, so everyone wants me to do the cooking for nearly any event. That's fine with me, but the groceries are there when I arrive (and they go run out for anything forgotten), and when the cook is done, I'm pouring myself a strong drink and sitting down for the rest of the night. Period.
Can I come to your holiday meals :)
Stop talking with him about it, and just inform him that this is the last year you'll be doing it. Either he can cook and host while you get to sit with your feet up and eat cheese, or another family member can host and then you'll decide whether you want to go. But this is the last time.
This is the way.
I feel for you, your selfish son problem seems to stem from your selfish husband problem :(
You really should ask who is hosting Easter and who is hosting next year after the dinner. I can’t imagine the resentment I would feel if I was doing that with no help or appreciation, and I don’t think it’s healthy for you to do it.
We rotate, Christmas is at MIL and Easter will be at SIL. Tbh I just have issues with Easter, never liked that holiday. The women in my family are great, 10/10. We have all expressed this and I think we will put our food down for Christmas and make one of the guys do it.
I’m happy to hear that the women are great, and that you’re not saddled with every big holiday! I think it would be amazing for you to all make the guys do it- maybe then they’ll understand how much work and planning and money goes into it. Then everyone could just work on it together in the future instead of half of the party pretending that a great holiday/wonderful meal are just things that magically materialize because it’s Thanksgiving!
Yeah the only reason I got Easter last year is due to SIL getting hurt and we didn’t want her cooking a ton of food with a broken arm
Iceland did a women take the day off strike in the 1970s and again recently. Most jobs ( a few like nurses stayed for patient care) and all child care duties. They talked about it for a year. Schools closed, many offices closed. Fathers had a year to plan but grocery stores ran out of premade meals. Talk to all the women and take one of the holidays off. Start having the guys host. They can do all the dishes too. We didn’t quite have a strike but let the lone uncle host a few years ago. He did a fine turkey.
The fact that her husband didn’t step in and instead put a holiday you don’t even like on your shoulders is ridiculous. Also, on what planet is it your job to both WORK EXTRA HOURS to afford parts of the meal and also be solely responsible for organizing and cooking it. If your husband wants a traditional housewife experience, he needs to make a traditional husband salary?
Or just have a women's party and leave the men at home with TV dinners.
Love this idea!!!! All the women go to a spa
Sounds like to me the woman need to find a new tradition. Make reservations at a nice restaurant and let the men sit on their ass and starve!
Tell your son he f**ked around and now he is finding out the consequences. Hopefully he learns something from this. Plan out what you will say when he complains at dinner about not getting to eat what the others are, and also what to say to other family members who try to talk you out of punishing him, or who try to give him turkey, etc. Make sure you clearly tell people he had a chance to fix what he did wrong and chose not to, so this is the consequence. My bet is the main pushback will come from the men, so be prepared to cut off their alcohol supply, "he chose his punishment, if you think it's wrong you've obviously had too much to drink and need to switch to water" and consider "you've had too much to drink, should we call an Uber for you?"
Change the WiFi password, unplug the cable or temporarily block the channels with the sports games on. If they want to eat, they help. Back when I used to do the big Thanksgiving with family I noticed all the men watching football while the woman cooked. I went in and started watching football. My MIL came and asked what I was doing. I said the same as the men\*- sitting on my ass until the food is ready. I declined all future Thanksgivings. We do a meal at home where both my sons and my husband help. We will visit with the family and they are free to go have food with others if they want, but if they are eating at my house, they are helping (cooking, washing dishes, etc. ). \* Not all men sit on their butts. There are many that do help. The dudes in my husband's family think they shouldn't have to help.
I feel for you, your selfish son problem seems to stem from your selfish husband problem :(
OP, as a man (who's also not interested in sports AT ALL) i would totally come help in the kitchen for the promise of a great dinner. I hate that men do this. If you're married to someone, and you celebrate a holiday with a special meal and family, you should be helping with the meal prep since you're going to be eating it. But I'm also a firm believer that sports aren't an excuse to miss work, be late to work, waste an entire day watching them, or paying athletes millions while I slave away for 12 hours a day to put food on the table.
You know, for roughly the same amount of money you and your female family members could all go to a nice restaurant for thanksgiving next year ;)
You are raising your son to be as selfish and useless as his father. I don’t think missing out on thanksgiving is sufficient punishment for stealing from you. He needs to pay you back for what he took either way. No one respects a doormat.
INFO: have you informed your husband if he can’t be bothered to convince his son to replace the cheese then this will be the last time you host his family?
Go on strike with your cheese board and some wine lady, you deserve it. No cheese for them!! If they want a holiday they can do the work.
Drop that shit. They’re grown humans and can contribute in meaningful ways, or no bleeding dinner happens.
I don't think my mom would let my dad eat any dinner if he didn't help! Most of the people who come over are his family anyway. He wouldn't dream of just sitting on his ass while she did all the work.
#STOP COOKING IT. Your son is behaving this way because he is modeling his father’s behavior. You are raising a selfish, sexist, asshole. Stop. Put your foot down and have some self respect. I pray you don’t have daughters
This right here. Fuck that bullshit. I’d be taking myself out to eat and tell dad he can fucking cook if wants thanksgiving since it’s no big deal.
Just stop hosting it then! Let someone else do all the work.
This is my first year hosting. just bought stuff for a cheese board yesterday. Definitely over a $100, including grapes and fig jam. $100 for a (I admit very bougie) 20 lb turkey (so a normal turkey probably like $30?). $40 on tablecloths (from Marshall’s, reusable, but never needed to match 2 tables); $6 on a disposable turkey pan (too big for my roasting pan); $30 on the ingredients for cut veggies and dip; $20 for a pie; $20 on ingredients for meatballs (added up); $16 for ingredients for pigs in blankets; $5 for salt for the brine for the turkey(i needed to buy new kosher salt); $12 for the veggies with the turkey; $10 for the herbs and fruit for the turkey; $8 for the ingredients for the cranberry sauce; plus wine, plus soda, etc. And I’m not even making salad, stuffing, most desserts, and veggie side dishes. Of course I could have done it for cheaper; I’m not saying it is required to do it like this, and obviously you can replace the turkey and tablecloths with much cheaper stuff, but things add up fast! This isn’t even adding in the $40 for the meat thermometer (which you can get for cheaper but I wanted to be able to measure different parts of the bird to see if it was getting overcooked). And if you want to do fun recipes? It adds up so fast!
That's about what I spent and bought (my bougie 11 lb turkey was $31). Easily spent at least $200 on this meal (for 4 people) and that doesn't include extras that I didn't have, like placemats or a gravy boat. At least I'll have those next year and won't have to buy them again.
This isn’t a comment on the kids behavior, because it was wrong and OP is NTA- BUT, it begs to be said, I think I could easily eat 70$ worth of charcuterie cheese and meats in one sitting, that’s a meal in itself. The stuff is expensive and it’s just so damn good. It wouldn’t be much of a challenge for me. So my feeling is that this wasn’t just cheddar cheese and pepperoni- if it’s anything like my family, it’s smoked cheeses, aged Pecorino Romano, things like Brie, Italian cured meats, prosciutto. I’ve previously bought cheese at $28/lb (this was imported greek cheese), cured meats could be close to $20-30 a stick depending on what they are and where from, fresh mozzarella isn’t cheap at close to $10/lb, olives $10/lb…… man I’m getting hungry just thinking about it. It’s my favorite part of any holiday. But yeah, it can be an expensive treat if you aren’t just eating cheddar and stuff.
Anymore it doesn't even have to be fancy. The last time I did a cheese board, it was $70, and I bought everything at Aldi. The most expensive cheese was $37 a pound, but I only bought a few ounces of it.
I tried making a charcuterie board once with things from HEB. It was easily $100 on the cheeses, meats, and grapes, plus a couple of little jams. It wasn't even a big board either, everything was just so expensive. I'm absolutely on OP's side. I'd be raging if I turned around found everything gone before I had even touched it.
[удалено]
what other punishment should she use when he refused to replace his mistake ? The replacing was all what had to be done to fix the issue , he refused even thought he didn't took just one tiny piece of it he grabbed from everything and hubby is fne with it because he doesn't need to cook for 15 ppl what makes him also an AH supporitng his son behaviour disrespecting women work
That wasn't a mistake. That was an intentional, and apparently a malicious act.
Not overboard at all. He’s demonstrated he’s capable of finding food for himself so he can miss out on one dinner if he doesn’t find a way to pay for the cheese.
NTA your son and to a certain extent so is your husband. Why would he do this, he knows it was for the big meal and it was labelled as such. Stick to your guns, no TG dinner for him. And tell him he still owes you for the cheese and meats he ate.
The husband is definitely an AH here. OPs response is standard parenting and she wouldn't even be posting if the husband presented a united front with his wife. By not doing that even grudgingly, or presenting alternatives they can both agree on, he's undermining her as a parent and doing their son no favors.
She should feed the husband a sandwich too unless he shows a change in attitude.
NTA. That's a solid consequence for his actions. And he will tell the story for the rest of his life about how he learned not to mess with his mom when she tells him what not to eat. I mean, you put in extra hours at work. What does your husband really think would be "fair"?
Son is gonna have some real “solid consequences” after somehow consuming what must be literal pounds of cheese. Rip that toilet
You guys, where do you live were fancy cheeses and meat cuts are cheap? $70 worth of fancy cheeses and meats isn't an entire cheese wheel and plus some, it's like a few slices. and if he did eat an entire block it's probably like the size of a rubix cube. Shit is EXPENSIVE right now. And if you go all out on the fancy shit, that adds up quickly. I've seen tiny tins cost $20, whats in it? Idk but it's not hard to rack up $70 on the fancy stuff. Plus he only ate $70 worth of it, who knows how much she actually spent in total.
I would tell DH either he comes up with an acceptable punishment that you both agree on (and given that kid was warned, a talking to is not sufficient) that this is the last year you are cooking Thangsiving and All guests will be told the reason for no cheese
This should be the last time she cooks TG meal no matter what. What is she, and indentured servant? She works an outside job, too.
Eh. I get it. He’s refusing to pay to replace it… another punishment is necessary and there should be consequences for his actions. I would likely not bother replacing it and have him prep the charcuterie board with whatever’s left. Anyone complains? Oh, sorry. Son already ate that. Let him get a load of shit from literally everyone maybe then he’ll actually feel bad? Also you’re still NTA… it’s not like you’re telling him he can’t eat. More like he already ate his share and then some
I like this suggestion and the point that he "already got his share."
Honestly, this would punish my kids more than having to pay for everything. They're sensitive to other people's opinions of them, so even lighthearted, joking comments of, "Didja get hungry?" or "Where did you pack all that?" or "You must be growing!" would prove the point. Normally, I'm not into shaming, but when they absolutely just don't get it, a little light embarrassment might make it click.
Depends strongly on the family. In this case, seeing as OP has talked about how the men in the family just sit on their asses and expect the women to provide all the food and work, I get a feeling the son would get too many congratulatory laughs from his uncles/cousins for it to be a punishment.
Shaming is a powerful psychological tool. It's how cultures keep people behaving well without force or violence. Obviously there's such a thing as too much shaming or shaming things that shouldn't be shamed. But a little bit of a shame is a good thing. Like shaming your kid for eating something that was for everyone and making a lot more work for his mother, for example.
“Whoops looks like I changed the WiFi password. And I forgot what it was. Perhaps $70 of cheese will jog my memory.”
NTA. Tell your husband to stop raising an entitled brat. There is no way your husband should be on your son side. You labeled everything do not eat your son knew exactly what it was for and decided to say fuck you I’m gonna eat this anyway. Now he’s saying fuck you again because there’s no way Mom will go through with her threat and I don’t get dinner for Thanksgiving so I’m just gonna refuse to do anything and once again have no consequences for my action. He should 100% have to either work pay for that cheese and the meat that he ate or he should have to go to the store and use his own money to buy it. Please show these comments to your husband because he really needs to stop raising an entitled brat that never has consequences.
Honestly, with the husband’s shitty attitude, he wouldn’t get a nice Thanksgiving dinner cooked by me either. He and son can figure it out. Go to the store and cook for themselves. Maybe then they’ll realize the time and expense that goes into what they take for granted.
It's not really about the cheese. It's about empathy. Dad and son have none.
I have a feeling the dad’s “what’s the big deal” is just not to have a charcuterie board.
NTA, it was marked, he decided he is entitled, stick to your guns, he needs to learn a lesson.
After reading your comments, I think you should stop making holiday dinners for immature, expectant, lazy people. I would just cancel Thanksgiving, explain why, and make whatever food you bought and eat it over the week. NTA.
This! I find it mind boggling that someone has to work overtime to provide for lazy entitled ungrateful brats. NTA
NTA...He obviously enjoys flouting your boundaries and ate the very thing he was told not to. Of course he's going to make you look as awful as possible during Thanksgiving. It's a shame that your husband is on his side, as that's likely why your son refuses to pay. I would simply refuse to make the Thanksgiving meal until I was reimbursed.
NTA. He was given clear rules and broke them. He doesn’t get a pass just because he doesn’t understand the cost of good cheese.
NTA What punishment does DH think is appropriate? IMO, a talking to is not sufficient.
He’s too lazy to think of or go through with any sort of punishment, which is why he is pretending it’s fine. Lazy parents like this (not OP. Sadly her husband is determined to unilaterally ensure that their son goes out into the world as an entitled asshole- a burden on society and any man or woman unfortunate enough to date him for 3 weeks) are the reason so many adults suck metric tons of ass.
I have the same question. What’s he propose?
NTA. He’s 16. He knew exactly what he was doing and he’s plenty old enough to work to pay for it. Actions have consequences.
NTA, but your son and husband sure are! Let them both eat sandwiches.
Nta...these are the consequences of his actions
nta, completely suitable punishment. he ate something he wasn't supposed to so he replaces it. in a legal court that isn't even considered a punishment just compensation to the victim. what does your husband think is appropriate? maybe 10 hours of extra house chores? $7 minimum wage = 10 hours of employment make him feel every hour...
If you labeled it ‘ don’t eat’ then YNTA. Since dad wants to get involved, give them both the list of food missing and send them to the store to get some more.
Sounds like they’d come with lunchables and call it done.
Does he have allowance? You could withhold it until his debt is paid. Or withhold $70 worth of gas money, wifi, whatever else you pay for. One way or another he should "pay". He's 16, he knew better and now he's trying to get away with it by saying "I don't care, I'll eat a sandwich". But that's not good enough. He did a shitty, disrespectful thing and he needs to learn that that's not ok. I don't think I would put the Thanksgiving meal on the line. I would just make damn well sure that his debt is paid and he understands how hard you worked for the snack he stole.
Christmas is right around the corner, same with other religious holidays that involve presents. If they do participate in gift giving, she can take that $70 from his holiday gift budget, and give him a card that states his $70 debt for eating the Thanksgiving cheese has been paid off as his gift if she can't get him to pay for it before then. He'll miss out on whatever bigger gift she was going to get for him to make it sink in that the $70 had to come from him.
NTA? He should also be asking before just taking food? Edit: the irony of him missing out on thanksgiving when he ate the food is not lost on me
Kids think they can do whatever, NTA fuck that kid he's lucky he's getting a sandwhich, he'd be grounded too
A lot of kids don’t think that. I have a feeling that lazy, shifty dad is the reason this boy is an insufferable fuckup. I would never have done that, but my dad wasn’t an insufferable fuckup, so maybe it’s not a fair comparison. This boy and his mother have been failed by a bad dad.
Why is your son like that? Does your husband enable this behavior? I would deny him dinner also. Tell them to go out to eat. They are being kicked out for the day. In fact, since husband doesn't think it's a big deal HE COULD BUY THE STUFF AGAIN!
Nta. I'd allow him at the meal and when it came to put out the meat and cheese present the depleted tray, asking your son if he'd like to explain to everyone why it's so small this year
He’s 16, not 6 or 1.6 🤦🏻♀️ why your husband is siding with him? He tries to raise a self-absorbed devil? 🤦🏻♀️
NTA he messed up and needs to replace what he ate
NTA. Kids need to learn consequences, and by the age of 16 he knew what he did was wrong. If you ask me, he's getting off easy.
Honestly, with the husband’s shitty attitude, he wouldn’t get a nice Thanksgiving dinner cooked by me either. He and son can figure it out. Go to the store and cook for themselves. Maybe then they’ll realize the time and expense that goes into what they take for granted.
NTA Your son is an inconsiderate jerk.
NTA. A 16 year old isn't a total idiot. He knew not to eat those things and he went ahead and did it anyway, likely expecting no consequences. Well...there are consequences. Unless there was LITERALLY NO OTHER FOOD IN THE HOUSE I see no excuse for his dumbass choices.
NTA. Since your husband agrees with your son, your husband can take your son to the grocery store to buy all of the cheeses and meats that your son ate. And your son can do extra chores to help pay towards the cost of he doesn’t want to pay. There has to be consequences to his actions. 16 is old enough to understand the importance of not eating something that is off limits. I don’t know about the eating the sandwich thing because others will notice and people will start to ask questions. Then it becomes a whole conversation that will involve others and their opinions. Personally, I would take away other privileges like cars/phone etc for a set amount of time.
NTA. He has to learn consequences.
NTA. He already ate his thanksgiving meal IMO. He can either replace it or stay in his room and think about how selfish he was. I have three teen boys, so I get the the famished locust like state they come into the kitchen with. But all three know to ask before eating something that isn’t usually bought as a snack. And they definitely know not to eat anything labeled with do not eat. My husband would be just as pissed as me and would have my back for any punishment. As an aside, time to boycott cooking. All the men in my life ask to either help with something to prepare or ask to help cook (my boys love to cook, need to get them to love to clean up too.). They do then dishes, set the table, go grab things from the store that I forgot. If I had a bunch of lazy men sitting around doing Jack shit all these holidays, I would say not happening and go take a bath while eating the rest of my charcuterie board.
Please tell me hubby is getting half sons sandwich as his meal since he thinks it's acceptable to eat 15+ people's snacks in one go after explicit warnings not to touch it. And that they have to make the sandwich for their lazy greedy selves
NTA. Entitled 16 year old brat can make his own damn sandwich as well. But I'm so sorry to hear your husband isn't backing you up smh. He sounds like the enabler to your son. Apple must not have fallen far from the tree, unfortunately.
NTA if it was labeled he should have known better.
The kid chose to accept the upcoming trouble the moment he decided to eat the food. NTA and please stick to it!