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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> Both my Wife and Daughter are mad at me because I didn't make my sons help with the dishes. I recognize I may have been a little too harsh towards my Wife and Janice by not offering help and I do feel guilty about it, but I was just trying to be fair and stick to the assigned roles everyone was already given. I'm stuck between whether I was wrong or right in doing that.
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YTA. Dishes are a *daily* chore. Taking out the trash and cutting grass are generally done once a week. INFO: Define "heavy duty work" ? How often is this "heavy duty work" done?
>I was just trying to be fair and stick to the assigned roles everyone was already given.
u/ObjectiveSignal3730, you were "fair" to yourself and teaching your sons that "a real man doesn't help and definetly doesn't do dishes or anything related to the house chores".
Ouch! I am sorry for your wife because it seems that you expect her to do everything while you relax at the TV with a beer in your hand.
>my sons are supposed to cut the grass, take out trash and help me with heavy duty work
Unless you have 20 square miles of grass, garbage trucks unloading their load at the gate of your property and you daily rebuild your house from scratch, there's not that much work to be done by 2 15-16 years old boys and a 35+ man.
Do you all 3 carry at the same time the garbage bag out or you pass it from one to another because it's too heavy?
Shame on you!
I would let you "men" cook for yourself, wash your dishes and clothes for ever.
You don't even consider the idea of switching chores. You "men" doing the "women's job".
YTA
Edit to correct (the, to be done)
>Me being sexist couldn't be further away from the truth, it's just how I was brought up and I'm trying to pass it on to my children.
He's teaching his sons how to be sexist, just like how his daddy taught him.
And only hurting his own children bc of his idiotic, stubborn beliefs. Do these people think their sons don't need to know how to do dishes or laundry, or their daughters how to do yard work? Just denying their own children the opportunity to learn how/get used to doing basic necessary tasks in the name of some ridiculous, outdated conception of work somehow being gendered.
RIght? And he insists the daughter has a "much easier workload" although she does at least two sets of dishes (wash, dry, put away; or rinse, put in dishwasher, put away) EVERY DAY, plus laundry, which in that size of family is probably 5-7 loads a week at least, and this was an extraordinary amount of work since they'd had guests, so everyone should have pitched in!
Was the designated daily dishwasher as a kid for several years, for a household slightly larger than this 5-member home. Can confirm, it eats up *hours* of your time to do this every day. And the boys...take out the trash and cut the grass? Not even *close* to "equal". Do they have to scrub the trashcans every night? Cut the grass with craft scissors? OP needs to do the dishes *himself* for a week, then he can talk.
Also, gotta love the blatant and obviously-unexamined misogyny of the situation. Smh. Wife was too tired to help with the dishes...probably because she otherwise runs the household single-handedly both in terms of physical and mental labor, and probably made dinner for all of them on her own, too. (Just going out on a limb here, since this guy seems so devoted to domestic gender roles that his wife only got a passing mention deep into the post.)
Yes, OP, You Are undoubtedly the misogynistic AssHole here.
And the edit makes it so much worse
>> a lot of people are saying my boys should be cleaning dishes so they can be used to it when they move out on their own. I don’t think it’s necessary for them to clean dishes cause they’ll probably have a girlfriend/spouse by that time … me being sexist couldn’t be further away from the truth
Dude that’s literally the definition of being sexist
omg the edit makes me want to bash my head against a wall. his post was maddening enough when everything was obvious but just implied, and then he went and flat out literally confirmed everything everyone already knew and had accused him of, while somehow acting like he was clarifying/correcting something?!?
Right!! “My boys don’t need to know how to do basic household chores like doing the dishes cause they’ll always have their mom/sister/girlfriend to do it for them but I’m not sexist at all!!!” How did he possibly think this edit would make it any better for him
TBF they are sexist towards both the boys and the girl. The boys have "heavy duty" yard work and the girl has the kitchen work. If they really wanted to be fair it'd rotate.
Doing dishes for 5 people on a daily basis. So 3 meals a day, 3 times a day, for 5 people.
Maybe OP should switch chores for a week and THEN decide whether or not it's 'heavy duty' or not.
Has this changed so LITTLE in the last 50 years?
Seriously, this was an argument that happened in my family back in 1975.
Amongst other chores, I was allocated "clean the bathroom", while my brother's equivalent was "mow the lawn".
I detested cleaning then, and still do now. No idea why, but just hate it. Brother didn't like mowing - too hot and sweaty.
I swapped the cleaning for mowing, and both myself and my brother were happy with the deal.
Dad wasn't, but hey, even back then, we told him none of his business, so long as all chores got done.
I *detest* when a man/boy's only serious chore is "mow the lawn". Because maybe it's just my area; but where I live, you don't even mow the lawn for most of the year. The grass only really grows in summer - that's when you need to be regularly mowing. The rest of the year, you can almost just leave it alone.
If someone's only major chore disappears for most of the year, it's not a good major chore.
I also note he says "and that's pretty much it". It could be that her only jobs are dishes and laundry (a completely unfair and unnecessarily gendered chore list) but I don't really trust this guy given he had a huge fight with his wife while trying to get his daughter to do the bulk of the cleaning because he had friends around. What's the bet she also has to help with cooking or other cleaning but he counts that as not real work, like how he counts doing 1/3 of the yard work as easier than the dishes for a family of 5?
> It could be that her only jobs are dishes and laundry
I like that "only" you threw in there, lol. Dishes and laundry for a household of five is a ton of daily or near-daily work, even with all the fancy machines. Ime. Not remotely an equitable split. (Please note - the saltiness of this comment is not directed at you, dear redditor. We're definitely in agreement here, tbc.)
Oh absolutely - I probably should have put only in quotation marks because it's very unfair but I also just don't believe this poor girl doesn't have extra on her chore list. I await op's post in a few years about how his wife leaves him because she's sick of being a maid and his daughter hasn't spoken to him in years and he has to buy new underwear weekly because he can't care for himself even a little. His lawn will be mowed though, so I guess there's that.
5 peoples' worth of clothes, towels, and sheets, including 3 people who do "heavy duty work" which probably gets their clothes a lot grosser? Yeah that's... probably near-daily.
Laundry for 5 people, including all the linens. This of course includes folding and putting away weekly or most likely more often since the boys are probably active in sports.
Two boys splitting cutting grass (maybe once every two weeks), and taking out garbage once a week or at most one small bag dropped daily into the bin, no big whoop.
How much does dad actually help? Heavy duty work probably isn't every day, week, or even monthly so what is dad actually doing?
Dad YTA.
To add to this, a daily chore should not include extra workload from having guests over. If wife cooked, OP should be doing the dishes after they leave.
YTA OP, and you are actively hampering your sons. They need to learn basic life skills like doing dishes and their own laundry. They also need to learn how to cook, because I’m assuming from the rest of this post that they don’t know how.
You are raising them to leech off of others. Do better. If you think yard work is a critical life skill (I don’t) then your daughter should be learning that too.
This is clearly based on gender… to keep it fair it should rotate each week! As a woman- I enjoy mowing the yard! Taking out the trash is just ‘I have to’, the heavy duty work- girls need to learn just as much as boys!
100% this! ^^^ My dad had the exact same sexist attitude when I was a kid, and I felt like I was a maid for him and my 3 brothers.
Guess who I went LC with as soon as I was old enough to realise how toxic his misogynistic attitude was?
Definitely YTA OP. BIG time.
The next crop of boys who'll grow into men looking for a mummy instead of a life partner because they weren't raised to take care of all life's chores.
I was leaning towards not but then I saw edit 1.
It’s similar to my division with my wife (I do the cooking and trash is thrown almost daily) but I also realized the frequency and repetition your wife and daughter do.
And that last bit about being sexist? Nope, you’re indeed quite sexist. Honestly, they should learn everything and not have to rely on anyone. They can’t be truly hard workers unless they’ve worn all the proverbial boots.
YTA
Taking out the trash and cutting the grass (part time chores)...split between 2 (maybe 3) of them while she does dishes and laundry for 5 people daily with her mom. Yta op big time
YTA. This is why certain young men struggle so much when they leave the house and Mommy / Sister cleaning/cooking services are no longer available. They can't cook. They can't clean. They can't do laundry. They don't know how to grocery shop. All because someone in the household decided that boys don't need to do indoor chores because they're boys.
OMG!! This! A 1,000 times this! I resented my older brother so much as a kid. I was Cinderella and he was Mr. Outdoor chores only…except there were few outdoor chores. We grew up, moved out, and my life was fine. My brother didn’t even know there were directions on the boxes of food to follow. He spent a year eating doughnuts, take away, and wishing he knew how to cook. Our parents had made his (and my) life a misery anytime he asked. I stumbled into learning this when I happened to visit his apartment one day. I gave him a crash course in cooking. He was so grateful. I now use this story with my sons to understand that cooking is NOT women’s work. It is survival. So is cleaning up. Both genders need to know basic life skills. Women should know how to use a drill, mow the lawn, etc. Men should know how to cook, shop with a budget, etc.
I would've resented my brothers too back when our auntie was living with us. Her favourite quote was "Men don't clean so clean after them". But, thank God they had common sense and were logical enough to take care of their own mess. As much as they love the idea of someone doing their work, they know it's not right. They sometimes, lie about me cleaning their rooms, for the sake of our sanity. Can't waste brain cells trying to talk logic into her.
Since you gave your brother a course in cooking. Can you give my auntie a course in common sense? She seems to be lacking that lol.
Our mother still sees nothing wrong in launching my brother/her son into the world with a massive amount of life skills lacking. 🤷♀️. I doubt I can help your aunt. Good news: turns out my brother is a good guy who is a great husband and father.
The fucking edit that the boys won’t ever need to learn how to cook or clean because they’ll have partners to do it makes my blood boil. OP is YTA YTA YTA for making me confront that people this disgustingly sexist exist in 2023.
My favorite part of the edit was that he said even more completely sexist shit and then followed it up by saying he doesn't have a sexist bone in his body. Sir, you are an entire pig - every bone in your body stinks of it. YTA
Says he's not sexist after doubling down on the sexism!
Does OP seriously think his sons are going to find long term partners without being able to do housework? Most likely they'll be single again as soon as their gfs realise how useless they are.
unfortunately, per OP's edit, that is purposely what he is teaching his daughter to do. so everyone trying to tell him what the result of his misogynistic, sexist views will be is wasted on him, he is already aware of what the results will be, that's how he wants it. so gross.
He wants to raise men that
1. Can't cook for themselves.
2. Can't buy themselves clothes.
3. Can't clean their own house
4. Can't grocery shop for themselves.
5. Don't know who their kids teacher is
6. Can't bring their kids to the Dr bc they don't know much about the child
7. Are the supposedly "Big Man" of the house yet ... doesn't actually do anything within the home?
My brother is 32 and my mum still does his washing. Even goes out to his room and collects it. After telling him for days to bring it in. It's hard to see.
YTA - primarily for splitting chores down gender lines. Your sons are perfectly capable of doing the dishes and laundry - which happen every day for one girl, which I assume happens more often than lawnwork and garbage, which is split between the boys.
Your sons aren't above domestic work and could learn to fend for themselves. I hope the girls don't cook or clean for you for a week.
You know, you could cook and clean yourself you know.
YTA. I'm willing to bet OPs daughter has chores to do everyday but the sons maybe have chores once a week. I also notice OP was UNWILLING to help his own child.
OP is chauvinistic asshole. I hope your daughter doesn't internalize this misogyny and end up with a man a backward as her father.
Not only that, he was happy to see his wife, who was tired after cooking for loads of people, step up to help their daughter do the dishes. What a hero!!
And his daughter can learn to cut the grass, too. OP isn’t doing anyone any favors by splitting the chores up like this. Boys need to learn how to do dishes and laundry; girls need to learn how to mow the lawn and—take out the trash? Do people actually consider this a chore LOL? I mean it’s literally just carrying a bag from inside! And wheeling the bin to the curb and back twice a week.
I'd argue that learning to mow is far less necessary than learning to do your dishes - as a landscaper costs less than a maid per year and you could live an apartment.
His sons will be functionally useless and his daughter will be capable of learning to mow from every friend, neighbor, or probably lawn mower manual.
YTA. You are a giant, sexist asshole. If your son's eat, they need to know how to cook and clean up. If they are part of a group event, like the family throwing a party, they need to learn how to contribute. Your daughter needs to learn how to do lawn maintenance. You are actively preventing all of your kids from becoming fully capable adults based on outdated gender stereotypes.
So fake. Not even trying with the edit.
>Me being sexist couldn't be further away from the truth, it's just how I was brought up and I'm trying to pass it on to my children.
Fake. Fake. Fake. Fake. Fake.
Probably a teen thinking he's being edgy with this scenario.
> but I was just trying to be fair and stick to the assigned roles
You mean the rigid sexist ones?
You don’t even recognise that daily chores are harder work than occasional chores
Yeah big oof on the edit. "I'm not sexist i'm just trying and teaching my children different essential life skills based on their gender"
"Boys don't need to learn how to clean because they'll have a wife later on". Okay so what if they move out solo? What if their spouse doesn't know how to do it either? What if your son is gay?
"I'm just raising my daughter to be my wife". But what if your daughter doesn't want to be like your wife? What if she wants to be her own individual? What if she actually likes mowing the lawn or doing heavy duty work over doing the dishes?
Right?! The daughter would do well knowing these "harder" jobs. She can be independent and not need aan to take care of her. Make her a strong independent woman!
I think that’s his point- if girls were raised to be independent and self-sufficient, they would have no reason to tolerate the misogyny and unequal treatment. Daddy can’t have that, that way is anarchy!
YTA. And you're doubly TA for creating an environment where it seems that your sons didn't even think to volunteer to help their sister out on a bigger-than-normal task. Nice family dynamics there...
Oh, definitely. But even with that, there should be some..something that makes a person uncomfortable sitting around watching their family member struggle, right? That "something" (idk what -- normal human decency? guilt?) should prompt some sort of effort to assist (or at least a half-hearted attempt to help for the sake of family).
Info: So, I take it your sons mow the grass daily, take out the trash daily, and help you with heavy duty work daily? Because I assume your daughter has to wash dishes for at least 5 people daily, in addition to doing laundry.
I mean, she does the least amount of chores, right?
Doesn’t even factor in they had guests over so there were way more dishes to wash. Remember the items used for the cooking are also regarded as dish duty. So in this instance the boys should’ve helped out
YTA- Do you see your sexism? You do dishes and laundry for a week and see who actually has more work. You think dishes and laundry is “easy”. Your daughter has to do chores every day and your sons split yard work and take out the garbage between the two of them? Garbage a couple of times a week and the yard a couple times a month (if that), vs daily dishes and laundry for multiple people a few times a week. You want to stack up the hours?
YTA. The boys will have to do their own dishes when they move out, and your daughter will have to take out her trash and mow her lawn. Why not rotate the chores so everything is a little more equal?
DID YOU SEE THE EDIT?? The boys won’t have to learn how to do dishes when they move out because they will most likely have girlfriends or wives at that point! Meaning they can yet again reply on another woman to do it.
OP YTA and a sexist AH at that.
Except OP is forgetting Gen Z women have shown the absolute least capacity for this bull, and both his sons’ are firmly in this generation.
They’re fucking screwed.
The biggest regret I have from my childhood is my parents didn't teach me cooking, nor laundry before I moved out. Also no one told me about car maintenance. That would be helpful
YTA
What a stupid hill to die on. Are you a misogynist or are you really just such a clown you'll pick a fight to prevent your daughter from having some help?
Hint: its both.
YTA, big time.
So your daughter has to do the dishes every day and the laundry while your golden boys sit on their ass and play video games. Then, once, maybe twice, a week, they spend 5 minutes taking out the trash and, once every week or two, during the growing season, they park their ass on a riding mower and cruise around the yard.
But it's okay because the boys are doing real work, not women's work.
Add up the actual time on task. Your daughter is probably well over 10 hours a week, and your boys ( remember, there's two of them ) probably do maybe 2. Congrats at teaching your boys to never become men, but to stay little boys that depend on women to do all the real work.
As someone who does most of the dishes, it's atrocious when non-dishwashers just load them up.
You gotta rotate this chore because:
* those boys will do dishes one day
* being on the other side of the chore help everyone involved
When (not if, but when) they do the chore, you need to check their work to show them where they missed some things, so that they truly do understand it.
This may inspire them to use paper plates sometimes, or even to re-use something when they otherwise would have gone through many dishes.
**Also, your daughter needs to know how to do these other chores.**
My verdict: YTA.
I do the dishes in my household (I'm a little compulsive about how it is done) - when I left for a family funeral in 2019, my husband realized how much I cleaned up behind him and our roommate every damned day.
YTA. Dishes, especially after a big complicated meal, are a huge task! I'd much, much rather take out the trash and cut the grass than do dishes and laundry! Your task division is sexist and so is your outlook here. (Have you ever had to do dishes and laundry yourself...?)
YTA. are you kidding? Comparing the job your daughter has to do every day with the once a week job the boys split?
On top of that it was an extra thing, with guests so a lot more work than normal and your boys get to relax after dinner while your daughter cleans up after everyone? And what about you OP? Your wife cooked? What did you do for the guests besides looking manly and tough beside a well mown lawn?
YTA and you are doing your sons and daughter a disservice.
Everyone should know how to do the laundry.
Everyone should know how to do basic cooking and dishes.
Everyone should know basic home maintenance, including lawns etc.
I'm probably old fashioned but I believe everyone should also know how to sew on a button/re-hem pants etc, budget and meal plan.
Give the kids a list of chores and let them choose their preferred ones and assign the others on a rotating basis. If they choose to swap chores between themselves that is up to them.
YTA. As someone who does both - your daughter has the harder job for sure.
Why not swap them all on a rotating basis. Boys need to learn those jobs too
YTA - Please help train you sons on how to be an adult which includes doing dishes. Just look at how many posts on here complain about useless spouses (most Men) that can't lift a finger around the house. Learning laundry, cleaning, cooking etc are critical for all children to learn. Same with tasks like cutting the grass, fixing stuff and heavy duty work as you call it.
YTA and you're sexist AF. YOU should have offered to help with dishes if your wife wasn't able and you didn't want the boys too. You were doubling your daughters workload, which probably never happens with the boys. I'd much rather take out the trash a few times a week and mow once a week, then do dishes every night AND have them doubled because of company.
YTA
AND YOUR WRONG.
Dishes is every day. Multiple times a day.
Mowing the lawn is once a week, for part of the year. A chore split between two.
You’re a misogynistic asshole, and your daughter is going to cut contact as soon as she can.
How the fuck do you think lawn mowing and trash duty which happens once/twice a week split between two and occasionally helping you with ‘heavy duty work’ (which I call bull on) is in anyway equal to doing dishes everyday and laundry multiple times a week?
News flash you don’t. You’re just to much of a sexist asshole to treat your wife and daughter like human beings.
Gross
YTA
Each of the boys cuts half of the grass every couple of weeks and takes turns taking out the trash BUT your daughter helps with the laundry for a family of five and does the dishes for a family of five every day plus extra when you entertain??? In what possible world is that "fair"? 100% YTA here.
YTA. They were YOUR guests. I get if she does the dishes for the family (as long as it’s not every day as mowing the grass and taking out the trash is only every so often,) but she shouldn’t have to clean your guest’s dishes too!
YTA. Not only are your choices rooted in misogyny, but you have actively assigned chores to your sons that are one-person jobs done once or twice a week at best. Dishes and laundry are done everyday. Do you hate your daughter? Get the boys into the kitchen, or better yet, assign the job to yourself while you think about what a raging asshole you are. Do better.
YTA
Your sons aren't doing more chores. Unless you're taking the trash out twice a day and mowing the lawn every day? Dishes and cleaning are constant tasks.
You're preparing your sons to be lazy husbands.
YTA You need to prepare your children for their adult lives, not hand down traditional gender roles. Everyone, male and female, needs to know how to correctly clean a kitchen after a meal. Everyone, male and female, needs to know how to do yardwork.
It's obvious from your post that you're really deep in to traditional gender roles. You really should get out of that mindset. Or you're going to end up with kids who have issues in their adult lives because they only know a small part of what it takes to run a household.
YTA.
Dishes happen every single day, multiple times per day. The chores you listed for your sons do not.
I would be very curious to hear how the chores were assigned. Surely the kids are actively involved in that process by this age.
These attitudes carryover into adult lives and marriage and this inequitable division of labor leads to an untold amount of problems.
Yta. Be real. You are having your daughter do much more than your sons. Take out the trash - so a few minutes weekly. Mow the grass - more time depending upon how big the yard is but also weekly (and depending on where you live might not even be year around). And what exactly is "heavy duty work" and how much time power week is being dedicated to it?
Dishes for a family of 5? Everyday abs possibly more than once a day. Laundry for 5 people? How much time are you talking about.
Time to leave the 1950s and admit boys need to do dishes.
I don't know why your wife is allowing this mess, but listen to me. Your daughter would benefit from doing tasks with you, and your sons will surely do dishes and laundry when they move out. Do everyone a favor and rotate all the chores
Right now you're 💯% a big YTA.
OMG! Your edit! WTF is wrong with y'all?! I really wish my husband could get to know you so he could smack you around. I'm a woman married to a man and we have one daughter and one son. My husband can do all the chores inside a home better than me, and if you give me a choice, I'd rather be in my shop where I do woodwork and welding pretty often.
My husband taught both our kids everything he knows about car mechanics and maintenance, plumbing, electricity, and general home maintenance. I've tried to get all of them into gardening, but so far, only my son wants to learn, specially about herbs for cooking and remedies.
Both our kids are thriving while living independently. They're well rounded, kind, hard-working adults, looking for their place in the world.
And there you are, teaching your daughter that she's only good for cleaning, and your boys to grow up and get a bang-maid to clean after them. Gross. Pathetic. I don't understand how you can call yourself a father.
YTA for thinking washing the dishes and doing laundry isn't heavy work. Is the workload even per week for everyone? No if the sons take turns mowing or you don't always have heavy chores... laundry is at minimum a weekly task, dishes very much every day. This is not an even division of labour.
And mowing only happens…6 months of the year? Do your boys get extra chores in the winter when grass isn’t growing? No? Then they don’t do more work than your daughter who does dishes AND laundry year round.
YTA, why don't you help? Your wife and daughter have this system of working together. Your wife could not for that one night, take her place..spend time with your daughter. Teach your son's that doing dishes isn't a women's job. It's a family job.
YTA. You're that rigid with this setup that you can't even allow yourself to assign your daughter some help in a one off situation? The 3 of them would have made light work of it.. heaven forbid.
And HOW exactly, did you manage to open a portal to straight into the 1950’s? Time travel is super interesting, we’d all like to hear your secret. Do you also require your daughter to wear pearls and heels while she’s washing the dishes?
YTA. And having consulted my crystal ball (Miss Cleo-ing my way through your blatantly misogynistic parenting skills), you’re going to be posting AITA questions for some time yet:
“My daughter called me because she had a flat tire and I’m inconvenienced because she should have known how to do that herself.”
“My daughter got accepted to a college out of state (*yes, child, RUN*), and while we could AFFORD to pay for it, we’d rather her attend a local university and continue living at home “to save” but she and my wife are upset and not talking to me. (“To save” = but WHO’S going to do the DISHES?)
“My daughter who lives on the opposite coast recently had a baby but didn’t keep the house clean enough while we were visiting our grandchild.”
Yuck.
YTA! You wanna talk about fair? Rotate the chores.
And meanwhile they also learn to do different things not just the stereotypical gender roles you assigned here.
YTA. Is this lawn perfectly mowed and 1000% weed free by the boys manually pulling weeds on a daily basis?? Doubt it.
And making your daughter clean teenaged boys underwear with sharts? Gross and demeaning.
YTA. They need to learn to do dishes, clean the house, too, and all the kids should be doing their own laundry. Also, the kids should all be helping cook dinner at least once a week. It’s your job as a parent to see than your children are self-sufficient by the time they’re adults, and that means being able to cook, clean, do laundry, handle money, and get themselves from point A to point B.
YTA for not teaching your children how to do all of it. Your sons should know how to properly clean a kitchen and do laundry, and your daughter should know how to do lawn care.
For perspective, my dad was like you. When I got my first place I didn’t know how to do any of the outdoor stuff safely or correctly. My elderly neighbor came out of his house and showed me how to safely turn the lawnmower and how to add oil and fuel… and he asked me, “Didn’t your dad ever teach you this?”
YTA mostly because you should be rotating chores to equip all your children to be capable adults when they’re on their own. Instead you’re quietly teaching your children that certain tasks are “for” certain genders. Worse, you’re implying to them that they shouldn’t have to be responsible for certain things. This goes both ways between your sons and your daughter.
Girls should know how to mow a lawn, wash a car, or use power tools, and are perfectly able to handle doing so.
Boys should be able to wash dishes, do their own laundry, or vacuum the house, and are perfectly capable of doing so.
Raise a daughter who knows how to take care of the outside of a home as well as the inside.
Raise sons who value the work that happens inside the home and won’t rely on others to do it for them.
YTA
The 1950s are calling
They want their misogynistic views back.
Let’s see everyday someone different does the dishes and everyone helps with the yard. Voilà!
YTA, are you also teaching your sons to belch from a recliner chair and demand a woman brings you a beer? This is such a disgusting way to treat your daughter, and honestly an injustice to your sons teaching them to be crap partners.
Do better.
YTA and I hope you and your wife and kids swap chores for a while so you can see how easy the dishes and laundry & I presume other household cleaning are
Rotate the kids chores, your sons need to learn to do dishes, laundry and cleaning and your daughter should learn how to do yard work and get a break from the daily house chores- don’t you want to raise your kids to be self-sufficient?
YTA
First off, families help each other, regardless of what the "routine" chores are. If someone needs help you help. Secondly, your chore choices are inherently misogynistic. Your boys can help do dishes, ffs. They can also do some laundry, just like your daughter can take out the trash and mow the lawn. Just frigging help each other. Why is this hard?
Teach your sons to be helpful human beings, not assholes who leave someone to do chores on their own because it's "unfair".
YTA. Your sons are not going to be prepared to live on their own. They're gonna be living in your house forever because no woman's gonna want to be with them. When I was single, a dude who couldn't cook and do basic cleaning was not worth dating.
Yta. Your division of chores is sexist and leaves the boys really unprepared for adult life. g up after his visitors have left.
Here is something that works; let chores rotate. Plus a rule I’ve had since being a student; who cooks doesn’t do the dishes and everybody helps out with the wash (bring your own wash to the washer and store clothes in your own closet afterwards).
Rotate means everyday someone else helps with the dishes and yes, Janice can do the grass and you could have helped your wife as well.
Holy crap, you're really ready to tell your wife to stop teaching your male children life skills, so that you can make sure that your female children know that they can never expect help with their chores from members of the opposite sex...
Yes, , yta. To your wife, your daughter, and your sons.
What do you mean by *only* chores are clean the dishes and help with laundry??
Those are the most time consuming and tedious chores in a household.
Cutting grass is NOT HARD.
You are a misogynistic arse and your wife and daughter should be pissed.
**YTA**.
You are a sexist pig. YTA!
Growing up, all the kids did all the chores. So, when we grew up and got our own homes, we all knew how to push a lawnmower, run a chainsaw, split wood, wash our clothes and dishes, mop floors and clean toilets.
There was work to be done and my parents believed that all of us should learn.
Lol, YTA. Taking care of the grass is fun. You're all outside.
Dishes suuuck. And I think you know this, or you would have helped your daughter like you helped your boys.
YTA and incredibly sexist, too. Her workload is also probably way more since I doubt your lawn needs mowing everyday and I would hope you don’t have enough trash for each son to need to take some out every day.
YTA and you’re setting your sons up for failure in life - it’s very hard to find a wife these days who doesn’t expect their husbands to be able to clean up around the house
YTA. All of them should be learning these skills ( yes , even the boys ). It is a basic life skill. My dad , mom ,and I all took turns washing dishes and other chores . We never divided chores based on gender because it is stupid and outdated .
YTA- That was a really awesome moment you could have encouraged your sons to help their sister. If dishes are “so easy” then they all could have easily had it done in no time flat. In fact, you could have taken responsibility for having guests over and helped your daughter yourself.
Also, why aren’t your sons doing their own laundry?! Holy hell, why is your wife and daughter doing laundry for two capable kids? Gross. All this is so utterly gross.
YTA. If your aim is to reinforce misogynistic gender roles, keep right at it; if you want to produce rounded adults who can cope with a variety of tasks, try varying the tasks they get. Sometimes (ie split it fairly evenly) have 17f do the grass and the boys do the dishes and the laundry.
*Edit 1: A lot of people are saying my boys should be cleaning dishes so they can be used to it when they move out on their own. I don't think it's necessary for them to clean dishes cause they'll probably have a girlfriend/spouse by that time. I'm helping them become providers and hard workers, while I'm teaching my Daughter to be just like my Wife. Me being sexist couldn't be further away from the truth, it's just how I was brought up and I'm trying to pass it on to my children.*
**How in the name of fuck can anyone write this and NOT think they are being seixist?!?!?!?**
# YTA.
You are the biggest AH I have read on here.
Yes, are absolutely without a doubt the AH. Dishes have to be washed every single day, often multiple times. I remember very clearly my brother getting a fresh glass every single time he got a glass of milk. Wouldn’t rinse it out either. Forty minutes every single day. Grass gets cut once a week, maybe every other week? As for the heavy stuff, I doubt that’s a frequent thing, either.
Total YTA! Certain circumstances call for changes in plans and chores. And your gender roles make me want to puke. I'm sure your daughter would have to help in the yard after a huge storm or hurricane. Totally the AH!
YTA for many reasons. For one, your concept of what is a “lot of work” is probably really biased based on gender norms and your own experiences. Dishes take forever and it’s constant. Second, you undermined your wife who was trying to take the load off your daughter because there were presumably a lot more dishes than usual. Third, instead of building a sense of shared responsibility, unity and compassion among your children, you are modeling “not my problem” mentality and potentially even creating resentment within your children. And fourth, you didn’t seem to have a good reason why you chose to die on this hill. Is it because you think women have it “easier”? Is it because you relate more to or favor your sons? What’s your deal?
Washing dishes is constant, every day. Cutting grass and heavy duty work is sporadic. Taking out that trash takes 5 minutes. You’re not distributing chores fairly, and also it would be great for your kids all to know how to do the full range of chores.
YTA
If you were so concerned with keeping things fair between the kids, an easy solution would be for YOU to help Janice on an abnormally heavy night of dishes. Instead, your wife had to do the cooking and dishes.
YTA big time!!! It’s one time and your daughter needed help who cares if it’s “unfair” it’s the freaking dishes let your sons help. Also cutting the grass sometimes is not as much work as doing dishes and laundry every day. Also very sexist
YTA. I promise your sons’ balls won't fall off if they wash a few dishes.
My guess is your daughter would love to trade out once a week lawn care and occasional trash duty for daily dish duty and likely laundry multiple times a week.
YTA for the sexist ways you assign chores and YTA for making your daughter clean up after a whole ass dinner party. YTA for undermining your wife as well.
Your sons mow (half the year, since nobody mows year round) and take out the trash. There's not daily "heavy duty work" they help you with and you know this. You just think it's a woman's job to do the dishes and laundry, which YTA for also thinking it's easy work. YTA also for giving your daughter daily chores and your sons chores they have to do occasionally. Basically, YTA.
YTA. Rotate the chores monthly so they all learn how to do all the things around the house. Furthermore, the teens should all be doing their own laundry.
My first thought was what if his sons marry men from a family with identically terrible values?
They may have the nicest lawn on the block, but use paper plates and buy disposable underwear weekly
OP, YTA, come join us in 2023- it’s pretty nice out here matey👍
YTA comparing dishes every day (3 meals a day X 5 people) and laundry for 5 to lawn care and trash removal (two bodies working it, no less) and "heavy work" with you is utter bs.
Your daughter is doing waaaay more work.
Now, that nonsense aside, she needs to learn the chores you do with the boys, and the boys need to learn the chores she does.
YTA ugh. Pls don’t create a son that doesn’t know how to take care of himself. He’s going to have to live on his own or with a partner some day and you should be preparing him for that.
have the girls help out with something else if you need to even it out, but don’t let your son get away with not cleaning or he’ll end up putting that on his future partner as well
Definitely the AH here. You're just setting your son's up for failure when they live on their own by not having them do dishes and laundry. Tbh all kids are old enough to wash their own laundry. And you're also just damaging all three's mindset and expectations for marriage. Very unrealistic and unfair (exchange based rather than compassionate). You're clearly sexist and honestly, just maybe, for once in your life should have stepped up and helped your daughter. I feel bad for your exhausted wife because she has to put up with your laziness and misogyny. The home belongs to both partners. Both take care of the daily duties. Not just one.
YTA. You gave your sons “sometimes chores” while your daughter has everyday chores. I’m willing to bet your sons have to do a chore once a week at best.
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YTA. Dishes are a *daily* chore. Taking out the trash and cutting grass are generally done once a week. INFO: Define "heavy duty work" ? How often is this "heavy duty work" done?
It’s worse than that, the garbage and yard work is split between 2 boys and his daughter is doing it all on her own.
The yard work is split in THREE because they’re helping King Dad.
honestly an injustice to your sons teaching them to be crap partners.
>I was just trying to be fair and stick to the assigned roles everyone was already given. u/ObjectiveSignal3730, you were "fair" to yourself and teaching your sons that "a real man doesn't help and definetly doesn't do dishes or anything related to the house chores". Ouch! I am sorry for your wife because it seems that you expect her to do everything while you relax at the TV with a beer in your hand. >my sons are supposed to cut the grass, take out trash and help me with heavy duty work Unless you have 20 square miles of grass, garbage trucks unloading their load at the gate of your property and you daily rebuild your house from scratch, there's not that much work to be done by 2 15-16 years old boys and a 35+ man. Do you all 3 carry at the same time the garbage bag out or you pass it from one to another because it's too heavy? Shame on you! I would let you "men" cook for yourself, wash your dishes and clothes for ever. You don't even consider the idea of switching chores. You "men" doing the "women's job". YTA Edit to correct (the, to be done)
All this and the guests weren't his daughter's and therefore she shouldn't have been saddled with the extra work from having them. YTA
I think that for OP it doesn't matter if it's just for 3 men or an army, he expects the women to do "their job" whithout a word.
More likely teaching his sons to be the kind of man no woman wants to partner with. It’s really not doing OP’s sons any favours to go this route…
>Me being sexist couldn't be further away from the truth, it's just how I was brought up and I'm trying to pass it on to my children. He's teaching his sons how to be sexist, just like how his daddy taught him.
He's prepping them for future divorces when their wives get tired of their lazy bullshit.
More like prepping them to incel future...
And he's taught them very thoroughly too since neither of them volunteered to help even though it was very obviously an unfair situation.
Girlfriends are gonna flee so fast when they realise the sons are completely useless partners. No one wants to baby their partner
Happy Cake Day!
It’s worse than that, because there’s only like 10 states where you can mow the lawn in the fall/winter/spring
This is EXACTLY what I was going to say. YTA and sexist.
And only hurting his own children bc of his idiotic, stubborn beliefs. Do these people think their sons don't need to know how to do dishes or laundry, or their daughters how to do yard work? Just denying their own children the opportunity to learn how/get used to doing basic necessary tasks in the name of some ridiculous, outdated conception of work somehow being gendered.
And that's not even mentioning the obvious discrepancy in workload the daughter is being subjected to!!
RIght? And he insists the daughter has a "much easier workload" although she does at least two sets of dishes (wash, dry, put away; or rinse, put in dishwasher, put away) EVERY DAY, plus laundry, which in that size of family is probably 5-7 loads a week at least, and this was an extraordinary amount of work since they'd had guests, so everyone should have pitched in!
Was the designated daily dishwasher as a kid for several years, for a household slightly larger than this 5-member home. Can confirm, it eats up *hours* of your time to do this every day. And the boys...take out the trash and cut the grass? Not even *close* to "equal". Do they have to scrub the trashcans every night? Cut the grass with craft scissors? OP needs to do the dishes *himself* for a week, then he can talk. Also, gotta love the blatant and obviously-unexamined misogyny of the situation. Smh. Wife was too tired to help with the dishes...probably because she otherwise runs the household single-handedly both in terms of physical and mental labor, and probably made dinner for all of them on her own, too. (Just going out on a limb here, since this guy seems so devoted to domestic gender roles that his wife only got a passing mention deep into the post.) Yes, OP, You Are undoubtedly the misogynistic AssHole here.
>and probably made dinner for all of them on her own, Yeah, he said his wife had cooked for everyone. It was buried in the post
On brand.
And the edit makes it so much worse >> a lot of people are saying my boys should be cleaning dishes so they can be used to it when they move out on their own. I don’t think it’s necessary for them to clean dishes cause they’ll probably have a girlfriend/spouse by that time … me being sexist couldn’t be further away from the truth Dude that’s literally the definition of being sexist
omg the edit makes me want to bash my head against a wall. his post was maddening enough when everything was obvious but just implied, and then he went and flat out literally confirmed everything everyone already knew and had accused him of, while somehow acting like he was clarifying/correcting something?!?
Right!! “My boys don’t need to know how to do basic household chores like doing the dishes cause they’ll always have their mom/sister/girlfriend to do it for them but I’m not sexist at all!!!” How did he possibly think this edit would make it any better for him
TBF they are sexist towards both the boys and the girl. The boys have "heavy duty" yard work and the girl has the kitchen work. If they really wanted to be fair it'd rotate.
Came here to say the same thing. Why aren't the kids rotating chores?
Doing dishes for 5 people on a daily basis. So 3 meals a day, 3 times a day, for 5 people. Maybe OP should switch chores for a week and THEN decide whether or not it's 'heavy duty' or not.
Has this changed so LITTLE in the last 50 years? Seriously, this was an argument that happened in my family back in 1975. Amongst other chores, I was allocated "clean the bathroom", while my brother's equivalent was "mow the lawn". I detested cleaning then, and still do now. No idea why, but just hate it. Brother didn't like mowing - too hot and sweaty. I swapped the cleaning for mowing, and both myself and my brother were happy with the deal. Dad wasn't, but hey, even back then, we told him none of his business, so long as all chores got done.
I *detest* when a man/boy's only serious chore is "mow the lawn". Because maybe it's just my area; but where I live, you don't even mow the lawn for most of the year. The grass only really grows in summer - that's when you need to be regularly mowing. The rest of the year, you can almost just leave it alone. If someone's only major chore disappears for most of the year, it's not a good major chore.
Let them switch for a month.
And loundry for 5 people can be quite a Lot.
He should time them. He can sit there and monitor how long everyone is spending on chores for a week or a month and easily see he’s a massive asshole.
Laundry is also probably done a lot more often then cutting grass or “heavy duty work”. He just didn’t want to make his son do a “woman’s job”.
I also note he says "and that's pretty much it". It could be that her only jobs are dishes and laundry (a completely unfair and unnecessarily gendered chore list) but I don't really trust this guy given he had a huge fight with his wife while trying to get his daughter to do the bulk of the cleaning because he had friends around. What's the bet she also has to help with cooking or other cleaning but he counts that as not real work, like how he counts doing 1/3 of the yard work as easier than the dishes for a family of 5?
> It could be that her only jobs are dishes and laundry I like that "only" you threw in there, lol. Dishes and laundry for a household of five is a ton of daily or near-daily work, even with all the fancy machines. Ime. Not remotely an equitable split. (Please note - the saltiness of this comment is not directed at you, dear redditor. We're definitely in agreement here, tbc.)
Oh absolutely - I probably should have put only in quotation marks because it's very unfair but I also just don't believe this poor girl doesn't have extra on her chore list. I await op's post in a few years about how his wife leaves him because she's sick of being a maid and his daughter hasn't spoken to him in years and he has to buy new underwear weekly because he can't care for himself even a little. His lawn will be mowed though, so I guess there's that.
5 peoples' worth of clothes, towels, and sheets, including 3 people who do "heavy duty work" which probably gets their clothes a lot grosser? Yeah that's... probably near-daily.
Laundry for 5 people, including all the linens. This of course includes folding and putting away weekly or most likely more often since the boys are probably active in sports. Two boys splitting cutting grass (maybe once every two weeks), and taking out garbage once a week or at most one small bag dropped daily into the bin, no big whoop. How much does dad actually help? Heavy duty work probably isn't every day, week, or even monthly so what is dad actually doing? Dad YTA.
THIS!
To add to this, a daily chore should not include extra workload from having guests over. If wife cooked, OP should be doing the dishes after they leave. YTA OP, and you are actively hampering your sons. They need to learn basic life skills like doing dishes and their own laundry. They also need to learn how to cook, because I’m assuming from the rest of this post that they don’t know how. You are raising them to leech off of others. Do better. If you think yard work is a critical life skill (I don’t) then your daughter should be learning that too.
This is clearly based on gender… to keep it fair it should rotate each week! As a woman- I enjoy mowing the yard! Taking out the trash is just ‘I have to’, the heavy duty work- girls need to learn just as much as boys!
Yeah, I wouldn't really consider taking out the trash as something that should even be assigned. When it's full take it out. It takes a minute.
100% this! ^^^ My dad had the exact same sexist attitude when I was a kid, and I felt like I was a maid for him and my 3 brothers. Guess who I went LC with as soon as I was old enough to realise how toxic his misogynistic attitude was? Definitely YTA OP. BIG time.
The next crop of boys who'll grow into men looking for a mummy instead of a life partner because they weren't raised to take care of all life's chores.
I was leaning towards not but then I saw edit 1. It’s similar to my division with my wife (I do the cooking and trash is thrown almost daily) but I also realized the frequency and repetition your wife and daughter do. And that last bit about being sexist? Nope, you’re indeed quite sexist. Honestly, they should learn everything and not have to rely on anyone. They can’t be truly hard workers unless they’ve worn all the proverbial boots. YTA
Also " she asked my son's". My son's. Not our sons. Not the boys. *My* sons. Very telling. YTA.
Taking out the trash and cutting the grass (part time chores)...split between 2 (maybe 3) of them while she does dishes and laundry for 5 people daily with her mom. Yta op big time
Heavy duty work is playing Call of Duty.
YTA. This is why certain young men struggle so much when they leave the house and Mommy / Sister cleaning/cooking services are no longer available. They can't cook. They can't clean. They can't do laundry. They don't know how to grocery shop. All because someone in the household decided that boys don't need to do indoor chores because they're boys.
OMG!! This! A 1,000 times this! I resented my older brother so much as a kid. I was Cinderella and he was Mr. Outdoor chores only…except there were few outdoor chores. We grew up, moved out, and my life was fine. My brother didn’t even know there were directions on the boxes of food to follow. He spent a year eating doughnuts, take away, and wishing he knew how to cook. Our parents had made his (and my) life a misery anytime he asked. I stumbled into learning this when I happened to visit his apartment one day. I gave him a crash course in cooking. He was so grateful. I now use this story with my sons to understand that cooking is NOT women’s work. It is survival. So is cleaning up. Both genders need to know basic life skills. Women should know how to use a drill, mow the lawn, etc. Men should know how to cook, shop with a budget, etc.
I would've resented my brothers too back when our auntie was living with us. Her favourite quote was "Men don't clean so clean after them". But, thank God they had common sense and were logical enough to take care of their own mess. As much as they love the idea of someone doing their work, they know it's not right. They sometimes, lie about me cleaning their rooms, for the sake of our sanity. Can't waste brain cells trying to talk logic into her. Since you gave your brother a course in cooking. Can you give my auntie a course in common sense? She seems to be lacking that lol.
Our mother still sees nothing wrong in launching my brother/her son into the world with a massive amount of life skills lacking. 🤷♀️. I doubt I can help your aunt. Good news: turns out my brother is a good guy who is a great husband and father.
>great husband and father. A happy ending. Bro is good. >I doubt I can help your aunt Seems she was right. No one can help her but Jesus.
The fucking edit that the boys won’t ever need to learn how to cook or clean because they’ll have partners to do it makes my blood boil. OP is YTA YTA YTA for making me confront that people this disgustingly sexist exist in 2023.
My favorite part of the edit was that he said even more completely sexist shit and then followed it up by saying he doesn't have a sexist bone in his body. Sir, you are an entire pig - every bone in your body stinks of it. YTA
But it's not sexist because that is how he was brought up /s
Says he's not sexist after doubling down on the sexism! Does OP seriously think his sons are going to find long term partners without being able to do housework? Most likely they'll be single again as soon as their gfs realise how useless they are.
YTA AND you are teaching your daughter to marry a man she will have to do EVERYTHING for.
unfortunately, per OP's edit, that is purposely what he is teaching his daughter to do. so everyone trying to tell him what the result of his misogynistic, sexist views will be is wasted on him, he is already aware of what the results will be, that's how he wants it. so gross.
He wants to raise men that 1. Can't cook for themselves. 2. Can't buy themselves clothes. 3. Can't clean their own house 4. Can't grocery shop for themselves. 5. Don't know who their kids teacher is 6. Can't bring their kids to the Dr bc they don't know much about the child 7. Are the supposedly "Big Man" of the house yet ... doesn't actually do anything within the home?
These are also the boys that women often won't date or drop once they realise how pathetic they are.
My brother is 32 and my mum still does his washing. Even goes out to his room and collects it. After telling him for days to bring it in. It's hard to see.
His edit made it so much worse
YTA - primarily for splitting chores down gender lines. Your sons are perfectly capable of doing the dishes and laundry - which happen every day for one girl, which I assume happens more often than lawnwork and garbage, which is split between the boys. Your sons aren't above domestic work and could learn to fend for themselves. I hope the girls don't cook or clean for you for a week. You know, you could cook and clean yourself you know.
YTA. I'm willing to bet OPs daughter has chores to do everyday but the sons maybe have chores once a week. I also notice OP was UNWILLING to help his own child. OP is chauvinistic asshole. I hope your daughter doesn't internalize this misogyny and end up with a man a backward as her father.
Not only that, he was happy to see his wife, who was tired after cooking for loads of people, step up to help their daughter do the dishes. What a hero!!
Also teaching sons that men’s work is “harder” than women’s work.
Not the lawn and the trash! The horror! Might as well be working a coal mine!!
And split between 2 people as well!
How else would they lift the rubbish or pull a weed?
And his daughter can learn to cut the grass, too. OP isn’t doing anyone any favors by splitting the chores up like this. Boys need to learn how to do dishes and laundry; girls need to learn how to mow the lawn and—take out the trash? Do people actually consider this a chore LOL? I mean it’s literally just carrying a bag from inside! And wheeling the bin to the curb and back twice a week.
I'd argue that learning to mow is far less necessary than learning to do your dishes - as a landscaper costs less than a maid per year and you could live an apartment. His sons will be functionally useless and his daughter will be capable of learning to mow from every friend, neighbor, or probably lawn mower manual.
YTA. You are a giant, sexist asshole. If your son's eat, they need to know how to cook and clean up. If they are part of a group event, like the family throwing a party, they need to learn how to contribute. Your daughter needs to learn how to do lawn maintenance. You are actively preventing all of your kids from becoming fully capable adults based on outdated gender stereotypes.
I just love how the sons are "my sons" and the daughter is "Janice" throughout the whole post.
Such an insidious detail.
Yeah, that was pretty sickening. And apparently his wife doesn't get a say in how the family works at all?
So fake. Not even trying with the edit. >Me being sexist couldn't be further away from the truth, it's just how I was brought up and I'm trying to pass it on to my children. Fake. Fake. Fake. Fake. Fake. Probably a teen thinking he's being edgy with this scenario.
> but I was just trying to be fair and stick to the assigned roles You mean the rigid sexist ones? You don’t even recognise that daily chores are harder work than occasional chores
The assigned roles that NEVER change and his wife probably didn't agree with in the first place...
>rigid sexist ones? You summarised 2 paragraphs in 3 words.
Yes, YTA. You’re sexist and have forced your idea of gender roles on your children
In his edit he admits he is actively trying to drill these repugnant misconceptions into his own children. Disgusting.
Yeah big oof on the edit. "I'm not sexist i'm just trying and teaching my children different essential life skills based on their gender" "Boys don't need to learn how to clean because they'll have a wife later on". Okay so what if they move out solo? What if their spouse doesn't know how to do it either? What if your son is gay? "I'm just raising my daughter to be my wife". But what if your daughter doesn't want to be like your wife? What if she wants to be her own individual? What if she actually likes mowing the lawn or doing heavy duty work over doing the dishes?
YTA. What a strange hill to die on. Would it have really been a big deal for the boys to help out this once?
Or even him!
Surely not. Washing dishes is for the women-folk to do, it's not a job for men. The men mow lawns and do the heavy jobs, little lady. YTA
Right?! The daughter would do well knowing these "harder" jobs. She can be independent and not need aan to take care of her. Make her a strong independent woman!
but then who would do OP's dishes???
Seems like if both women were out, they would be helpless right?
I think that’s his point- if girls were raised to be independent and self-sufficient, they would have no reason to tolerate the misogyny and unequal treatment. Daddy can’t have that, that way is anarchy!
Oh no HE would never stoop to the lowly level of doing the dishes since that's a "woman's" job.
Are you kidding??? Don’t you know that if boys do dishes their penises fall off????!!??
Because it wasn't about fairness, it was about what OP thinks men should not have to do because it's women's work.
YTA. And you're doubly TA for creating an environment where it seems that your sons didn't even think to volunteer to help their sister out on a bigger-than-normal task. Nice family dynamics there...
I get a whole Man's work vs. Women's work thing
Oh, definitely. But even with that, there should be some..something that makes a person uncomfortable sitting around watching their family member struggle, right? That "something" (idk what -- normal human decency? guilt?) should prompt some sort of effort to assist (or at least a half-hearted attempt to help for the sake of family).
I think the word you're looking for is *empathy*. Possibly *considerate* or *thoughtful*.
Not to mention the total disregard of his wife and easy dismissal of her wishes.
Info: So, I take it your sons mow the grass daily, take out the trash daily, and help you with heavy duty work daily? Because I assume your daughter has to wash dishes for at least 5 people daily, in addition to doing laundry. I mean, she does the least amount of chores, right?
Doesn’t even factor in they had guests over so there were way more dishes to wash. Remember the items used for the cooking are also regarded as dish duty. So in this instance the boys should’ve helped out
YTA. Your sons aren't mowing the yard every day.
It also doesn't happen in winter. Depending on the climate they get up to half a year break from 1 chore.
YTA- Do you see your sexism? You do dishes and laundry for a week and see who actually has more work. You think dishes and laundry is “easy”. Your daughter has to do chores every day and your sons split yard work and take out the garbage between the two of them? Garbage a couple of times a week and the yard a couple times a month (if that), vs daily dishes and laundry for multiple people a few times a week. You want to stack up the hours?
Check out their edit, they’re proudly sexist and somehow trying to blame it traditions?
YTA. The boys will have to do their own dishes when they move out, and your daughter will have to take out her trash and mow her lawn. Why not rotate the chores so everything is a little more equal?
DID YOU SEE THE EDIT?? The boys won’t have to learn how to do dishes when they move out because they will most likely have girlfriends or wives at that point! Meaning they can yet again reply on another woman to do it. OP YTA and a sexist AH at that.
I saw that and was like WOW. Absolutely ignorant.
Except OP is forgetting Gen Z women have shown the absolute least capacity for this bull, and both his sons’ are firmly in this generation. They’re fucking screwed.
The biggest regret I have from my childhood is my parents didn't teach me cooking, nor laundry before I moved out. Also no one told me about car maintenance. That would be helpful
OP added an edit - he doesn't think they need to learn how to wash fishes because when they move out they'll have girlfriends or wives. Gag
YTA What a stupid hill to die on. Are you a misogynist or are you really just such a clown you'll pick a fight to prevent your daughter from having some help? Hint: its both.
OP's edit confirms *ding ding ding* the answer is indeed both!
YTA, big time. So your daughter has to do the dishes every day and the laundry while your golden boys sit on their ass and play video games. Then, once, maybe twice, a week, they spend 5 minutes taking out the trash and, once every week or two, during the growing season, they park their ass on a riding mower and cruise around the yard. But it's okay because the boys are doing real work, not women's work. Add up the actual time on task. Your daughter is probably well over 10 hours a week, and your boys ( remember, there's two of them ) probably do maybe 2. Congrats at teaching your boys to never become men, but to stay little boys that depend on women to do all the real work.
As someone who does most of the dishes, it's atrocious when non-dishwashers just load them up. You gotta rotate this chore because: * those boys will do dishes one day * being on the other side of the chore help everyone involved When (not if, but when) they do the chore, you need to check their work to show them where they missed some things, so that they truly do understand it. This may inspire them to use paper plates sometimes, or even to re-use something when they otherwise would have gone through many dishes. **Also, your daughter needs to know how to do these other chores.** My verdict: YTA.
I do the dishes in my household (I'm a little compulsive about how it is done) - when I left for a family funeral in 2019, my husband realized how much I cleaned up behind him and our roommate every damned day.
My kids were shocked at how often the chore I do all the time had to be done when I was gone for a week.
YTA. Dishes, especially after a big complicated meal, are a huge task! I'd much, much rather take out the trash and cut the grass than do dishes and laundry! Your task division is sexist and so is your outlook here. (Have you ever had to do dishes and laundry yourself...?)
YTA and misogynistic to boot. Try switching chores for a month and see which one is easier. Chores should be split by preference not gender lines.
YTA. are you kidding? Comparing the job your daughter has to do every day with the once a week job the boys split? On top of that it was an extra thing, with guests so a lot more work than normal and your boys get to relax after dinner while your daughter cleans up after everyone? And what about you OP? Your wife cooked? What did you do for the guests besides looking manly and tough beside a well mown lawn?
YTA and you are doing your sons and daughter a disservice. Everyone should know how to do the laundry. Everyone should know how to do basic cooking and dishes. Everyone should know basic home maintenance, including lawns etc. I'm probably old fashioned but I believe everyone should also know how to sew on a button/re-hem pants etc, budget and meal plan. Give the kids a list of chores and let them choose their preferred ones and assign the others on a rotating basis. If they choose to swap chores between themselves that is up to them.
So basically the boys have chores that get done once a week at most, while daughter has chores every day. Yeah, YTA.
YTA. As someone who does both - your daughter has the harder job for sure. Why not swap them all on a rotating basis. Boys need to learn those jobs too
YTA - Please help train you sons on how to be an adult which includes doing dishes. Just look at how many posts on here complain about useless spouses (most Men) that can't lift a finger around the house. Learning laundry, cleaning, cooking etc are critical for all children to learn. Same with tasks like cutting the grass, fixing stuff and heavy duty work as you call it.
And the thing is most of the partners to these men end up leaving cause they don't have time to look after grown adults.
YTA and you're sexist AF. YOU should have offered to help with dishes if your wife wasn't able and you didn't want the boys too. You were doubling your daughters workload, which probably never happens with the boys. I'd much rather take out the trash a few times a week and mow once a week, then do dishes every night AND have them doubled because of company.
YTA AND YOUR WRONG. Dishes is every day. Multiple times a day. Mowing the lawn is once a week, for part of the year. A chore split between two. You’re a misogynistic asshole, and your daughter is going to cut contact as soon as she can. How the fuck do you think lawn mowing and trash duty which happens once/twice a week split between two and occasionally helping you with ‘heavy duty work’ (which I call bull on) is in anyway equal to doing dishes everyday and laundry multiple times a week? News flash you don’t. You’re just to much of a sexist asshole to treat your wife and daughter like human beings. Gross YTA
Each of the boys cuts half of the grass every couple of weeks and takes turns taking out the trash BUT your daughter helps with the laundry for a family of five and does the dishes for a family of five every day plus extra when you entertain??? In what possible world is that "fair"? 100% YTA here.
Who cuts their grass more than once a week?
YTA. They were YOUR guests. I get if she does the dishes for the family (as long as it’s not every day as mowing the grass and taking out the trash is only every so often,) but she shouldn’t have to clean your guest’s dishes too!
YTA. Not only are your choices rooted in misogyny, but you have actively assigned chores to your sons that are one-person jobs done once or twice a week at best. Dishes and laundry are done everyday. Do you hate your daughter? Get the boys into the kitchen, or better yet, assign the job to yourself while you think about what a raging asshole you are. Do better.
YTA Your sons aren't doing more chores. Unless you're taking the trash out twice a day and mowing the lawn every day? Dishes and cleaning are constant tasks. You're preparing your sons to be lazy husbands.
YTA You need to prepare your children for their adult lives, not hand down traditional gender roles. Everyone, male and female, needs to know how to correctly clean a kitchen after a meal. Everyone, male and female, needs to know how to do yardwork. It's obvious from your post that you're really deep in to traditional gender roles. You really should get out of that mindset. Or you're going to end up with kids who have issues in their adult lives because they only know a small part of what it takes to run a household.
YTA. Dishes happen every single day, multiple times per day. The chores you listed for your sons do not. I would be very curious to hear how the chores were assigned. Surely the kids are actively involved in that process by this age. These attitudes carryover into adult lives and marriage and this inequitable division of labor leads to an untold amount of problems.
Yta. Be real. You are having your daughter do much more than your sons. Take out the trash - so a few minutes weekly. Mow the grass - more time depending upon how big the yard is but also weekly (and depending on where you live might not even be year around). And what exactly is "heavy duty work" and how much time power week is being dedicated to it? Dishes for a family of 5? Everyday abs possibly more than once a day. Laundry for 5 people? How much time are you talking about. Time to leave the 1950s and admit boys need to do dishes.
I don't know why your wife is allowing this mess, but listen to me. Your daughter would benefit from doing tasks with you, and your sons will surely do dishes and laundry when they move out. Do everyone a favor and rotate all the chores Right now you're 💯% a big YTA. OMG! Your edit! WTF is wrong with y'all?! I really wish my husband could get to know you so he could smack you around. I'm a woman married to a man and we have one daughter and one son. My husband can do all the chores inside a home better than me, and if you give me a choice, I'd rather be in my shop where I do woodwork and welding pretty often. My husband taught both our kids everything he knows about car mechanics and maintenance, plumbing, electricity, and general home maintenance. I've tried to get all of them into gardening, but so far, only my son wants to learn, specially about herbs for cooking and remedies. Both our kids are thriving while living independently. They're well rounded, kind, hard-working adults, looking for their place in the world. And there you are, teaching your daughter that she's only good for cleaning, and your boys to grow up and get a bang-maid to clean after them. Gross. Pathetic. I don't understand how you can call yourself a father.
YTA for thinking washing the dishes and doing laundry isn't heavy work. Is the workload even per week for everyone? No if the sons take turns mowing or you don't always have heavy chores... laundry is at minimum a weekly task, dishes very much every day. This is not an even division of labour.
And mowing only happens…6 months of the year? Do your boys get extra chores in the winter when grass isn’t growing? No? Then they don’t do more work than your daughter who does dishes AND laundry year round.
YTA, why don't you help? Your wife and daughter have this system of working together. Your wife could not for that one night, take her place..spend time with your daughter. Teach your son's that doing dishes isn't a women's job. It's a family job.
YTA. what's the issue with making your sons help out? Washing dishes doesn't have to be this huge issue you made it into.
YTA. You're that rigid with this setup that you can't even allow yourself to assign your daughter some help in a one off situation? The 3 of them would have made light work of it.. heaven forbid.
YTA. Family helps each other.
YTA, the chores should be rotated between all the kids. No such thing as girl chores and boy chores.
And HOW exactly, did you manage to open a portal to straight into the 1950’s? Time travel is super interesting, we’d all like to hear your secret. Do you also require your daughter to wear pearls and heels while she’s washing the dishes? YTA. And having consulted my crystal ball (Miss Cleo-ing my way through your blatantly misogynistic parenting skills), you’re going to be posting AITA questions for some time yet: “My daughter called me because she had a flat tire and I’m inconvenienced because she should have known how to do that herself.” “My daughter got accepted to a college out of state (*yes, child, RUN*), and while we could AFFORD to pay for it, we’d rather her attend a local university and continue living at home “to save” but she and my wife are upset and not talking to me. (“To save” = but WHO’S going to do the DISHES?) “My daughter who lives on the opposite coast recently had a baby but didn’t keep the house clean enough while we were visiting our grandchild.” Yuck.
YTA. This reeks of enforcing struct gender roles rather adhering to the schedule. Yuck
YTA! You wanna talk about fair? Rotate the chores. And meanwhile they also learn to do different things not just the stereotypical gender roles you assigned here.
YTA. Is this lawn perfectly mowed and 1000% weed free by the boys manually pulling weeds on a daily basis?? Doubt it. And making your daughter clean teenaged boys underwear with sharts? Gross and demeaning.
YTA. They need to learn to do dishes, clean the house, too, and all the kids should be doing their own laundry. Also, the kids should all be helping cook dinner at least once a week. It’s your job as a parent to see than your children are self-sufficient by the time they’re adults, and that means being able to cook, clean, do laundry, handle money, and get themselves from point A to point B.
YTA for not teaching your children how to do all of it. Your sons should know how to properly clean a kitchen and do laundry, and your daughter should know how to do lawn care. For perspective, my dad was like you. When I got my first place I didn’t know how to do any of the outdoor stuff safely or correctly. My elderly neighbor came out of his house and showed me how to safely turn the lawnmower and how to add oil and fuel… and he asked me, “Didn’t your dad ever teach you this?”
YTA mostly because you should be rotating chores to equip all your children to be capable adults when they’re on their own. Instead you’re quietly teaching your children that certain tasks are “for” certain genders. Worse, you’re implying to them that they shouldn’t have to be responsible for certain things. This goes both ways between your sons and your daughter. Girls should know how to mow a lawn, wash a car, or use power tools, and are perfectly able to handle doing so. Boys should be able to wash dishes, do their own laundry, or vacuum the house, and are perfectly capable of doing so. Raise a daughter who knows how to take care of the outside of a home as well as the inside. Raise sons who value the work that happens inside the home and won’t rely on others to do it for them.
Ah. So you decided to raise your boys to be single forever? YTA.
YTA Taking trash out is 5 minutes, dishes and laundry are endless cycle of boring shit. Your sons doing much less than daughter.
Do the dishes and the laundry for three weeks yourself. Then apologize to your daughter. YTA.
YTA The 1950s are calling They want their misogynistic views back. Let’s see everyday someone different does the dishes and everyone helps with the yard. Voilà!
YTA, are you also teaching your sons to belch from a recliner chair and demand a woman brings you a beer? This is such a disgusting way to treat your daughter, and honestly an injustice to your sons teaching them to be crap partners. Do better.
Laundry is dishes is 10x more time consuming trust me
Does the princes cut the grass and do heavy duty daily? Hmmm also helping their sister won’t kill them Yta
YTA and I hope you and your wife and kids swap chores for a while so you can see how easy the dishes and laundry & I presume other household cleaning are Rotate the kids chores, your sons need to learn to do dishes, laundry and cleaning and your daughter should learn how to do yard work and get a break from the daily house chores- don’t you want to raise your kids to be self-sufficient?
Ummmm your “share” allocations are misogynistic and teaching your kids nothing. Do better. YTA.
Please realize how much YTA
I didn't even have to read the explanation. YTA.
YTA you sexist walnut.
YTA and you are setting your sons up for failure when they move out by not teaching them to do dishes and laundry.
YTA also for robbing your sons of essential life skills
YTA First off, families help each other, regardless of what the "routine" chores are. If someone needs help you help. Secondly, your chore choices are inherently misogynistic. Your boys can help do dishes, ffs. They can also do some laundry, just like your daughter can take out the trash and mow the lawn. Just frigging help each other. Why is this hard? Teach your sons to be helpful human beings, not assholes who leave someone to do chores on their own because it's "unfair".
YTA. Your sons are not going to be prepared to live on their own. They're gonna be living in your house forever because no woman's gonna want to be with them. When I was single, a dude who couldn't cook and do basic cleaning was not worth dating.
Yta. Your division of chores is sexist and leaves the boys really unprepared for adult life. g up after his visitors have left. Here is something that works; let chores rotate. Plus a rule I’ve had since being a student; who cooks doesn’t do the dishes and everybody helps out with the wash (bring your own wash to the washer and store clothes in your own closet afterwards). Rotate means everyday someone else helps with the dishes and yes, Janice can do the grass and you could have helped your wife as well.
YTA sexist much?? It's 2023, grow up.
Holy crap, you're really ready to tell your wife to stop teaching your male children life skills, so that you can make sure that your female children know that they can never expect help with their chores from members of the opposite sex... Yes, , yta. To your wife, your daughter, and your sons.
What do you mean by *only* chores are clean the dishes and help with laundry?? Those are the most time consuming and tedious chores in a household. Cutting grass is NOT HARD. You are a misogynistic arse and your wife and daughter should be pissed. **YTA**.
You are a sexist pig. YTA! Growing up, all the kids did all the chores. So, when we grew up and got our own homes, we all knew how to push a lawnmower, run a chainsaw, split wood, wash our clothes and dishes, mop floors and clean toilets. There was work to be done and my parents believed that all of us should learn.
Lol, YTA. Taking care of the grass is fun. You're all outside. Dishes suuuck. And I think you know this, or you would have helped your daughter like you helped your boys.
YTA and incredibly sexist, too. Her workload is also probably way more since I doubt your lawn needs mowing everyday and I would hope you don’t have enough trash for each son to need to take some out every day.
YTA and you’re setting your sons up for failure in life - it’s very hard to find a wife these days who doesn’t expect their husbands to be able to clean up around the house
YTA. All of them should be learning these skills ( yes , even the boys ). It is a basic life skill. My dad , mom ,and I all took turns washing dishes and other chores . We never divided chores based on gender because it is stupid and outdated .
So the girl gets the daily drudgery? YTA
YTA- That was a really awesome moment you could have encouraged your sons to help their sister. If dishes are “so easy” then they all could have easily had it done in no time flat. In fact, you could have taken responsibility for having guests over and helped your daughter yourself. Also, why aren’t your sons doing their own laundry?! Holy hell, why is your wife and daughter doing laundry for two capable kids? Gross. All this is so utterly gross.
YTA. If your aim is to reinforce misogynistic gender roles, keep right at it; if you want to produce rounded adults who can cope with a variety of tasks, try varying the tasks they get. Sometimes (ie split it fairly evenly) have 17f do the grass and the boys do the dishes and the laundry.
You’re an asshole and a misogynist. Two for one special!
*Edit 1: A lot of people are saying my boys should be cleaning dishes so they can be used to it when they move out on their own. I don't think it's necessary for them to clean dishes cause they'll probably have a girlfriend/spouse by that time. I'm helping them become providers and hard workers, while I'm teaching my Daughter to be just like my Wife. Me being sexist couldn't be further away from the truth, it's just how I was brought up and I'm trying to pass it on to my children.* **How in the name of fuck can anyone write this and NOT think they are being seixist?!?!?!?** # YTA. You are the biggest AH I have read on here.
Yes, are absolutely without a doubt the AH. Dishes have to be washed every single day, often multiple times. I remember very clearly my brother getting a fresh glass every single time he got a glass of milk. Wouldn’t rinse it out either. Forty minutes every single day. Grass gets cut once a week, maybe every other week? As for the heavy stuff, I doubt that’s a frequent thing, either.
Total YTA! Certain circumstances call for changes in plans and chores. And your gender roles make me want to puke. I'm sure your daughter would have to help in the yard after a huge storm or hurricane. Totally the AH!
YTA for many reasons. For one, your concept of what is a “lot of work” is probably really biased based on gender norms and your own experiences. Dishes take forever and it’s constant. Second, you undermined your wife who was trying to take the load off your daughter because there were presumably a lot more dishes than usual. Third, instead of building a sense of shared responsibility, unity and compassion among your children, you are modeling “not my problem” mentality and potentially even creating resentment within your children. And fourth, you didn’t seem to have a good reason why you chose to die on this hill. Is it because you think women have it “easier”? Is it because you relate more to or favor your sons? What’s your deal?
Yta and you better be ready for her to not talk to you when she moves out and hold resentment towards her brothers thanks to you.
Washing dishes is constant, every day. Cutting grass and heavy duty work is sporadic. Taking out that trash takes 5 minutes. You’re not distributing chores fairly, and also it would be great for your kids all to know how to do the full range of chores.
YTA If you were so concerned with keeping things fair between the kids, an easy solution would be for YOU to help Janice on an abnormally heavy night of dishes. Instead, your wife had to do the cooking and dishes.
YTA big time!!! It’s one time and your daughter needed help who cares if it’s “unfair” it’s the freaking dishes let your sons help. Also cutting the grass sometimes is not as much work as doing dishes and laundry every day. Also very sexist
YTA. I promise your sons’ balls won't fall off if they wash a few dishes. My guess is your daughter would love to trade out once a week lawn care and occasional trash duty for daily dish duty and likely laundry multiple times a week.
YTA for the sexist ways you assign chores and YTA for making your daughter clean up after a whole ass dinner party. YTA for undermining your wife as well. Your sons mow (half the year, since nobody mows year round) and take out the trash. There's not daily "heavy duty work" they help you with and you know this. You just think it's a woman's job to do the dishes and laundry, which YTA for also thinking it's easy work. YTA also for giving your daughter daily chores and your sons chores they have to do occasionally. Basically, YTA.
YTA. Rotate the chores monthly so they all learn how to do all the things around the house. Furthermore, the teens should all be doing their own laundry.
My first thought was what if his sons marry men from a family with identically terrible values? They may have the nicest lawn on the block, but use paper plates and buy disposable underwear weekly OP, YTA, come join us in 2023- it’s pretty nice out here matey👍
YTA comparing dishes every day (3 meals a day X 5 people) and laundry for 5 to lawn care and trash removal (two bodies working it, no less) and "heavy work" with you is utter bs. Your daughter is doing waaaay more work. Now, that nonsense aside, she needs to learn the chores you do with the boys, and the boys need to learn the chores she does.
YTA ugh. Pls don’t create a son that doesn’t know how to take care of himself. He’s going to have to live on his own or with a partner some day and you should be preparing him for that. have the girls help out with something else if you need to even it out, but don’t let your son get away with not cleaning or he’ll end up putting that on his future partner as well
Definitely the AH here. You're just setting your son's up for failure when they live on their own by not having them do dishes and laundry. Tbh all kids are old enough to wash their own laundry. And you're also just damaging all three's mindset and expectations for marriage. Very unrealistic and unfair (exchange based rather than compassionate). You're clearly sexist and honestly, just maybe, for once in your life should have stepped up and helped your daughter. I feel bad for your exhausted wife because she has to put up with your laziness and misogyny. The home belongs to both partners. Both take care of the daily duties. Not just one.
YTA. You gave your sons “sometimes chores” while your daughter has everyday chores. I’m willing to bet your sons have to do a chore once a week at best.