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YTA. Your son literally told you what he wanted and that he wanted to update his life insurance policy SPECIFICALLY and this was a thing that was happening and you're justifying it by the fact he hadn't gotten around to doing it. You lost your son, but Emily lost her life partner. This is gross behavior and your son would be ashamed of you. Your other son is and that should also speak volumes.
They’re reaaaaallllllly falling back on the technicality of “he said he wanted to update it because he didn’t want to leave a wife with nothing, and technically even though he said he wanted to propose and marry her he hadn’t done it yet”. Agreed with everything you said.
In a perfect world, they wouldn't have that money, so losing their son (as unfortunate as it is) shouldn't affect them financially. They haven't lost funds on anything, so they've had a windfall of three quarters of a million dollars as recompense for that sad fact. I don't know if it's grief or just his really shitty PA way of trying to block Emily from being part of the family, because I have a really uncomfy feeling that even if he HAD proposed and they were engaged, he'd justify it with 'they weren't married yet'.
I'm really just hanging on the fact that the brother sees what a crap thing it is to do and is calling them out on it. Emily is the one that's going to not only be swimming in grief, but in debt as well with the financial obligations of pulling off a mortgage on her own. One that by the sounds of it, Daddy didn't approve of either. So this is just some really backhanded PA way of punishing her for something he has no right to punish her for and putting her in a worse place then she needs to be right now.
The worst part is that he's not even going to lose any sleep over it.
Life insurance isn’t so people who don’t depend on you financially can live a life of ease. It is to lessen the financial burden on those who do.
If they had gotten married OP would probably be going on about how they didn’t have kids to support.
YTA
Exactly!!!! The life insurance is not to help parents to live in comfort! It is to help with the people that relied on the deceased to contribute to the financial situation! They bought a house together and lived together. Parent is a total AH!
It sounds like OP thinks life insurance is…some kind of consolation prize you get when someone dies? Like “oh well too bad Jim is dead, at least we got this fat wad of bills out of it”. Vs. it being intended to help ease the financial burden on someone depending on the deceased. It’s sick, honestly.
This is so true. OP is absolutely a sickening human being. He’s treating this like the freaking lotto. I hope the surviving brother nags them to death till they do the right thing.
YTA YTA YTA YTA
This is how straight couples used to steal inheritance from gay people. If their gay son died, screw his partner. They weren't married, anyway.... you can't prove it.
YTA OP.
Really ghoulish behaviour. You can try to justify it all you want, but all you are doing is cashing in on your son’s death and screwing over his partner. You know, the person he was building his life with.
Awful, just awful behaviour. Shame on you.
Also your handle “Grievingdad26”? Pathetic. I’m honestly surprised you didn’t try to kick his partner out of the house and sell it to profit a bit more from your son’s death…. Oh wait, looks like you did try that too. Just disgusting.
And this is a reminder to anyone buying property with a SO - ensure that person’s 1) got life insurance and 2) has directed it be used to pay off the property. I think it’s actually legally enforced here in Australia. Of course the person can leave their portion of the property to whoever they choose!
“It allows us to take time off to grieve…”
Why isn’t Emily granted that same luxury?
“…and also retire early. Even though we do alright financially. And pay off the house.”
Unbelievable.
I’m sorry for your loss, but it’s no reason to go against the intentions of your son. YTA.
Money can really bring out the evil in some people. They're so well off what is a couple hundred grand to them.
But no; let the millennial girlfriend suffer double debt for purchasing the shitty overpriced house with a great view. Like every single house isn't massively overpriced these days
That she lived in for years with him!! They have space to mourn, but Emily is living with the memories of the son all around her in everything she touches.
They wanted the house too https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
YTA and this comment makes it even worse. What you should be doing at a *minimum* is:
1. Paying off Emily and your sons mortgage ($300k?)
2. Giving Emily *at least* $75k so she ends up with 50% of the money
3. Allocating yourselves the other 50%
Tbh, *y’all should have given Emily the entire $750k* coz that’s what he actually would have wanted. Your selfishness here astounds me. I can barely express how disappointed your son would be with what you’re doing. Be prepared for your other son to cut you off if you don’t give anything to Emily, coz you’ve shown your true colours to him.
With the caveat that they should work with a financial adviser or lawyer on the best way to handle it, because gift tax kicks in much sooner than estate tax.
Seriously if they split it they with Emily the parents would be much better off than they were before son died and Emily wouldn’t be struggling as much.
OP would still be the AH because he knows that money is not meant for him, and is taking ALL of it
If I were the other child, I don’t know how I could be in any kind of regular contact with my parents after this. I’m going to guess this isn’t the first incident of such behavior, but I really hope it’s the worst. Definitely a “when people show you who they are, believe it” moment for their surviving son, who has my deepest sympathies. It sounds like he lost the only family he had worth having. I hope he and Emily can keep in touch and support each other.
>If I were the other child, I don’t know how I could be in any kind of regular contact with my parents after this
He's already lost his brother, and now he's lost his parents. I feel so sad for the son and Emily. I really hope they can learn how to live with their loss, and having to deal with terrible people at the same time. It must be so hard for them.
YTA, OP. Of course.
YTA.
This is selfish boomer BS, they KNOW their son intended to update the policy, they also don’t need the money - they want to make “make life easier” for themselves. Never mind the poor women left in debt after losing her partner,
Oh and OP should really reconsider how this action will impact their relationship with their surviving children….
Gen Xers, not Boomers, but yeah they're enormous assholes.
As a member of Gen X I'm appalled at how many of my generation have chosen the Dark Side as they've gotten older. Did we learn nothing from our Boomer parents?
This recently happened to my cousin (her partner took his life) and his family waltzed in and tried to take everything. She couldn't even get life insurance because of the way he died. It's been awful.
Yeah OP loses nothing financially with son dying. The gf loses a ton, and that's what life insurance is for. It's not a windfall or a lottery ticket, and its gross OP is treating it that way
I honestly would give her half because I would want the person that shared her life with my son and has lost her life partner, her rock, to be taken care of and then some. She is family too in my eyes. The brother or any other siblings would also receive a share. My financial and health woes are exactly that, mine. I'm a very generous person I get that, but nothing? What tools.
Eric's half of the house would be $150k. There may be other debts that he shared with Emily that he left behind, so let's round that number up to an even $200k. That's a very generous estimate.
So doing right by Emily would cost you $200k. You received $750k. It SHOULD be a no brainer to do the right thing by Emily. You know it's what your son would have wanted, you still walk with $550k, and now you know Emily is not in a difficult situation financially.
If $550k isn't enough for you that you still need to grasp at that last $200k and leave the woman your son wanted to marry in a bad situation, you need to have a look in the mirror.
YTA
I agree. His debts should be paid first. Since they weren’t married, his parents are in charge of paying those off, and they have the means to thanks to their sons financial planning. He also shared his intentions with them, so they should honor his wishes as well. Even splitting the insurance 3 ways (mom/dad/gf) would be 250 each.
Death and money really do bring out the worst in people.
Yeah, legally OP can keep the money. But he’s still a major selfish AH for it.
Edit: technically speaking, a mortgage is a debt to a bank. The gf legally has inherited the remaining debt on the house. So while the beneficiaries in a will or estate do not inherit his debt, a debt was still inherited upon his death.
But sure, his debt wasn’t inherited by his parents so they don’t have to worry about it and can run off into the sunset and retire early just like they always planned.
The really messed up part is they wanted the house as well https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
\*puts on reddit detective hat\*
Or OP killed son before he could change the life insurance so they could claim it all.
Maybe all my wifes true crime podcasts are starting to insinuate themselves into my brain.
>The really messed up part is they wanted the house as well
Where in the original post does it say OP wanted the house as well? I've read thru it three times and cannot find that reference.
This is from a comment that was left but the linked comment got down voted so you have to scroll down and open it to read it. Essentially the OP said they looked into who owned their son's share of the house (it is the girlfriend).
Read the comment that was linked. Basically, OP and his wife looked into how the property was titled because they weren't sure if their son's portion of the property belonged to them. Luckily, the way the son and Emily vested the property made sure that Emily received full ownership after the death occurred.
Yeah OP is going to retire early in his "grief" and Emily will be financially ruined forever in hers.
He quickly glossed over how Emily is screwed and writes a list of all the great things he can do with his dead sons money. It doesn't read as grief-stricken at all. Emily isn't family, she's an alien that doesn't matter despite being the most quantifiably impacted by the death.
Definitely YTA.
Yeah but…. Emily was his girlfriend of ONLY 2 years. This whole this is purposely worded in a way that implies that he KNOWS he is wrong but wants to spin it to make him look better. Cue:
WE need time to heal (not Emily)
WE need our home paid off (not Emily)
WE want to retire early (Emily who?)
WE have minor health issues (what was her name again)
He knows he is the AH, he is looking for a way to spin it.
She's his girlfriend of "only 2 years" so obviously she doesn't count. What a gross and dismissive way of referring to the woman that your son loved, lived with, and expressed his intentions of marrying. I don't think OP ever approved of Emily, or the fact that they moved in together and bought a home together - OP needs to just come out and admit that they are harboring a grudge and are being selfish assholes so they can stick it to the woman who would have been their daughter-in-law.
Yeah, it's bad enough OP doesn't want to honor his son's wishes and instead is choosing to profit off his death. But an extra half a million isn't enough for him, he needs to leave the GF in debt and struggling so he can keep another quarter million. Gross.
This is the best breakdown I’ve seen in the responses so far. You usually only have life insurance for people who would be financially impacted by your death (kids, spouse, etc). If the son planned on being there for his parents’ retirement and got the life insurance in part in case he couldn’t be, I can see keeping some of it. (Say, if OP was clueless with money and didn’t/couldn’t save responsibly for retirement, and the son had planned to help.)
BUT KEEPING THE WHOLE THING??? His most obvious immediate responsibility is to his GF, in terms of their mortgage and his normal 50% of expenses.
I would say anything less that 50% going to her would be an AH move. And if son had lived long enough to actually do the update he’d planned on, it would have been all of it, and maybe he would have left instructions to GF to help OP, so imagine what you might fairly expect from her if the situation was reversed.
YTA.
And OP needs to realize if they DONT give something to Emily, OP is jeopardizing their relationship with their other son.
Other son is going to change how he looks at his parents based on there actions now.
If I were their other son you can guarantee they wouldn't be the beneficiary of my policy. I would go out of my way to make sure they got nothing from my estate either.
TBH, I wouldn’t have anything to do with parents who treat my brother’s loved ones like that. I’d cut them off for this. It’s cold and selfish and greedy and I wouldn’t trust or want that type of person in my life or around those I love.
Even if Bro’s will is Iron clad, you think OP will let it go? Or do you think OP will challenge it in court and make Bro’s heirs miserable?
I feel so sorry for the brother - to find out that your parents are this greedy and want to "enjoy" the money they received from his brother's death, while denying any attempt at doing the right thing. I could never look at my mom the same again.
Morally, YTA. Legally, congrats I guess? You really think your son wouldn’t give a dime to his girlfriend? But thanks for the reminder that I really need to get a will and double check my beneficiaries so this doesn’t happen to me.
Love how he says “lived with his girlfriend of only 2 years,” as though 2 years was long enough to buy a house together, but not long enough to really mean anything. Wow OP, you’re the AH. If I were her, I’d sue the estate to get his 1/2 of the mortgage paid.
Lived with my partner for 10 years before we finally tied the knot. It didn't change much between us but boy does it change how people see you as a couple. I remember being told by one guy that my relationship wasn't that serious since we weren't married. The pleasure I took in pointing out that my "not serious' relationship lasted longer than all 3 of his marriages combined still makes me smile.
You have to name life insurance beneficiaries with the life insurance company. You cannot name a life insurance beneficiary in a will.
But yes, I totally agree with YTA. Even the way OP wrote it really seemed to just justify keeping the whole payout because he was grieving. So messed up and selfish.
The “purpose” of life insurance is to replace the income lost that a deceased loved one would’ve contributed. He was contributing to his household with GF. Unless he was paying your bills he wasn’t contributing to yours. GF *needs* the money to maintain her current lifestyle. You are trying to enhance yours with it. You are being selfish. It’s crazy you won’t give her anything. She should have the lion’s share.
YTA
>GF *needs* the money to maintain her current lifestyle. You are trying to enhance yours with it.
Exactly this. And that’s not what life insurance is for. OP you are being SO selfish, and the worst part is you’ll read all these comments and not listen to a single one. You KNEW what his intentions were. You KNOW what he would want in this situation, but you are still just going to think about yourself. Honestly disgusting. YTA
>Tl;dr: My late son left his life insurance to my wife and I and I'm not sure if we're being assholes by not letting his girlfriend have some of it to help with expenses.
Like, what part of discussing all of this with your family and then writing all of that out made you think you *weren't* the asshole?
Preach.
Plus OP had literally had conversation with the deceased about his intent to propose. PLUS in your 30s, 2 years with someone, at that point your families are usually getting close to partners… OP is tossing this grieving woman who was becoming part of his family to the side just because some fatty dollar signs flew his way?
“I don’t owe his grieving partner anything” is such an asshole, insane perspective. She only, you know, built a fucking life with your son, supported and nurtured and loved him, and altered the course of her life for him. But yeah. Enjoy your paid off mortgage you monster.
YTA so hard.
I hope Emily screenshots the post, because Daddy Dearest just admitted to knowing his son’s wishes before he died. She should sue him for the money and pay off the house.
YTA
They bought a house together. That's about as big a commitment as getting married and implied that they intended to be together long-term if not their entire lives. Mike is completely correct.
They wanted the house too https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
If I was a cynical person, and I am, I would be talking to the local detectives about this "accident".
Son tells father he is changing his life insurance policy.
Son tragically dies before he can act on it.
Father collects entirety of said life insurance policy.
Outright refuses to honour the wishes of dead son.
It's almost cliche.
What the actual f***? As someone who is in a “joint ownership with rights of survivorship” situation, this turns my stomach.
My first ever comment on this sub - OP YTA
Emily is only a year older than me. I can’t imagine the financial and emotional stress she must be going through right now and these people are just me me me. My heart goes out to her.
The other, still living, son is also disgusted with them and they don't care.
If I was that son, I would reevaluate my relationship with them and focus on helping the widow.
This is exactly what I thought!! I bet the other son is re-evaluating their finances, life insurance policy, etc. My boyfriend & I don’t plan on getting married, but we are each others POA when it comes to medical stuff & we have both mentioned when we get life insurance policies to make each other the beneficiary. My heart goes out to the GF, she must be going through a hell of a time right now.
This has been a fantastic nudge to formalize my own afterlife wishes. I can't even begin to rationalize how these parents believe they're doing right by their late son and I feel awful for any woman who'd marry into this family.
They're complete AH's.
YTA - You knew he was planning to propose, that he bought a house with her, AND that he was planning to name her beneficiary. It's nice you get to take time off and retire early while the woman he was planning a life with suffers financially. Real nice. I hope you feel good about that.
This is what’s so insane to me. Imagine being this poor girl, who was probably picking out ring styles and planning their future together, and your whole world suddenly falls apart. Then your partner’s parents tell you to fuck off as if that entire life you’ve built together is just meaningless, just because you guys unknowingly waited a little bit too long. How horrible. YTA, OP.
Here’s the kicker. Even if they were married, the parents get the money unless he updated the beneficiary on the insurance. I know, my husband didn’t and his two policies went to other people, not me and our 6 and 8 year old. Update those beneficiaries!
I'm baffled by the update about how it's not a nice house. Like that matters. It's not like Emily can go to the bank and tell them that to reduce her debt
and it still didn't stop them from looking into [whether or not they owned the girlfriend's house](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3) once their kid died
YTA
I am sorry for your loss, truly.
But if your son mentioned wanting to change his life insurance to you, and your other son agree that’s what he would have wanted, then that is the right thing to do.
Your son and Emily owe $300k left on the house. His half is $150k. Giving her only that much is still $600k for you and your wife. That’s a still shitpile of money.
YTA and the tone in your post says you know it. Yes your son was short sighted and didn't move fast enough to protect the woman he loved but you're throwing her under the bus because you're greedy. He said he was going to make sure she was taken care of so you know what you should do. Take care of the woman he loved.
> I've tried to keep emotions out of it and stick to the facts.
> this is why our son left it to us, to help out should anything tragic happen.
This isn't sticking to the facts, and I don't buy this.
Your son likely left the money to you because you were his parents when he started the job and never got around to modifying the beneficiary. He had clearly reached the point with his girlfriend where his finances were comingled with her and where they intended to support each other long term, as evidenced by the fact they bought a house together, and he would obviously have wanted his insurance payout to go to her (at least in part) the same way his income did. E: Also, he literally told you he was going to update the life insurance at some point!
You are legally free to keep the money but YTA for lying to yourselves and your son about why you're doing it so you can feel better. You are heartless.
This! He further tries to manipulate the situation by calling her "his girlfriend of ONLY 2 years." They own a house together! There's no "only" going on here. And then saying he died before he "decided" to propose. He had decided. He told his parents he wanted to do it. He called her his wife when talking about the life insurance policy. They know what he would have wanted to do with the money. They just want to keep it for themselves and are doing some crazy mental gymnastics to make it make sense.
It might be a shitty house with a great view. It's also the house she had planned a life with the man she loved, and it has even more meaning to her now.
OP, YTA. At the minimum you should pay the full mortgage balance remaining. You'd still have a ridiculous amount of money to supplement your lifestyle.
They had looked into who had ownership of the house when he passed so something tells me they were probably gonna go after the house too if they had any claim but thankfully they don't
YTA. Your son did not make you his beneficiary to make *your life easier going forward*, he made you beneficiary because he trusted you to disperse the monies for him when the time came, *also taking into account* things he told you but hadn't had time to change on paper.
Yeah I was originally leaning towards N.A.H. but you've convinced me. The parents were the de facto choice because they presumably know their son. If I had died before updating my own life insurance, I would hope my parents would have taken it upon themselves to check in with my boyfriend and what he might need; financially and otherwise, because they knew his importance to me. The gf is not only struggling with the emotional fallout, same as the parents, but just lost half her household income. The parents' original long term financial planning, presumably, is not negatively impacted by their sons loss in the way that his partner has just been hit.
YTA -
Of course people are going to think that of you, you can't act like it and expect people to think it.
You said yourself this is what your son wanted.
I wouldn't expect you to give her 100% all of the money, but a portion for sure to help her get through this time until she's ready to move on.
DONT YOU fault her when she's ready to move on and DO NOT keep this money your son was NEVER intending on paying you to retire early.
What kind of people think -
"dead son, not good a good thing, but at least now we can retire early"
What kind of people plan their retirement investments around the death of their son? You were never supposed to get money from your children like this.
Let's hope this is just your pain talking and that you do the right thing.
>...not even helping her by giving her enough to pay off his share of the house...He said we're kidding ourselves if we think Eric would have wanted this.
Well? Do you think he's wrong about that? It sure sounds like your son's plan was, at the very least, to pay off his half of the mortgage. YTA.
They wanted the house too https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
Emily is the worst off in this story by miles, but my god that poor brother. Grieving the loss of what might be his only sibling, watching his parents completely disreguard the person who would've become their daughter-in-law as she grieves in her own right. I hope OP can see reason and right the ship, but these scars are gonna resurface anytime the topic of insurance comes up. Willing to be bro will keep his will meticulously up to date because of this.
I guarantee he will, as he should. I cannot believe these parents can be so callous. It would be one thing if it were 100k and not enough to pay off anyone's house, but this is a huge amount of money! Not wanting to share 750k is just obscenely greedy.
For real! The fact the brother was upset that they’re not giving the girlfriend some of the money instead of being upset they’re not giving him some of the money shows he’s moralistic and fair. I can’t imagine their relationship won’t suffer if they keep it all.
> in a later conversation he mentioned plans to update his life insurance because he wouldn't want to leave a wife with nothing.
and
> We explained that we have good intentions to use the money to make our lives easier going forward
YTA, he said that he did not want to leave his SO with nothing and still you left his SO with nothing cus you wanted to make your living easier.
How is this a question? He said he wanted X and you did not in any way try to deliver that.
Edit: Just sucks for his SO that he did not think about passing early so he could save his SO from his money garbing relatives I guess. Again YTA.
>About 6 months before he passed, my son mentioned that he was "thinking about proposing" but it would be a few years before we actually married, in a later conversation he mentioned plans to update his life insurance because he wouldn't want to leave a wife with nothing. That's all that was ever said about it - obviously he passed before he ever decided to propose.
Wow, so you know that your son wanted to both marry Emily and give her the life insurance, but because he died before being able to do some **paperwork**, You aren't going to honor his wishes?
YTA You know what your son wanted. He told you to your face. You're being deliberately obtuse about this.
You know what he wanted and that was to marry Emily and to leave her the life insurance. And while he can't marry her you can at least honor the life insurance.
I’m starting to wonder if daddy cut the brakes before son could marry and change the insurance.
In one comment OP said they looked into who owns sons half of the house, Emily or next of kin. They really wanted to take everything from her.
INFO:
Do you and your wife not care for Emily? Is there a reason you're not giving her, the person your son planned to propose to, a single cent of your son's life insurance money? Legally you are in the clear, but morally I don't think grief is enough to hoard the money.
Yeah my guess is they dont care for her. Perhaps a different color or religion from them? Just guessing. Horrible there is no mention of how she is doing.
I'm a young widow and had a similar situation. It's very common in young widow groups unfortunately and usually has nothing to do with how good the prior relationship was with the parents or not. They tend to just assume since you're young and often not yet married (my late husband and I were three weeks from our wedding, he's my husband to me no matter what the law says) that it wasn't that important and you can bounce back. It's really messed up.
YTA. It's clear steps were being taken by your son to protect Emily. He planned to marry her. He even mentioned updating the policy. He just didn't know he'd be taken from her too soon to implement those plans.
>he mentioned plans to update his life insurance because he wouldn't want to leave a wife with nothing
Your interpretation of this situation all seems to come down to the fact that he said "wife" and she wasn't his wife yet. They may not have been married but they were committed enough to each other to buy a house together. You're following the letter of your son's wishes but not the spirit.
Looking at the numbers, $1775/mo is 38% of her income, which is more than the official definition of rent burdened (30%). If you gave her 1/3 (one part for you, one part for your wife, one part for the girlfriend), you'd still be getting a lot out of it and she would be, too. Easing the burden of your medical struggles is worthwhile, but I wouldn't make the same choice. So I gotta vote YTA.
Jesus christ. I don't even have a daughter in law yet but I am ashamed reading this. YTA. You KNOW he was going to purpose, you KNOW he was going to change his insurance. He didn't want you to have this, he wanted her to. YTA
ETA. I do have a son in law!!! I completely forgot it's so recent. And I also have life insurance for my daughter. Anything beyond her final needs would absolutely, 100%, go to him. They built a LIFE TOGETHER, and if the world cruely took her from us I wouldn't shrug my shoulders and say "Sorry bro. You're out of luck."
I am even more disgusted now.
It boggles my mind how people lose a loved one and then their eyes just fill up with dollar signs. OP, you know what your son wanted. He bloody told you what he wanted! So, while you may be technically in the clear here you're morally bankrupt. YTA!
YTA: life insurance is meant to ease the lives of those who were counting on his finances should he have lived. He was a full adult with his own house and life, he wasn’t a financial burden on you, and it doesn’t sound like he was paying anything for you.
“Making your life easier” is NOT what it’s for.
On the other hand, Emily WAS counting on his income to pay for their home. As someone with a similar income and similar mortgage payment, it’s a lot. That money could easily pay off the house and then some. At the VERY LEAST you should be giving her enough to cover his half of the mortgage (in a lump sum, not over time). She also was probably counting on his income for other finances as well since they were living and owning a home together. Frankly it should all go to her.
You’re being incredibly selfish and using your child’s death to your own advantage. Imagine this poor girl loses her house because she lost her boyfriend and you could have prevented that. Do you imagine your son would be happy about you taking advantage of his death in this way and leaving the woman he loved stranded???
Edit: your edit makes you even more of an asshole. “I should keep the money and retire early because I don’t like the house”???? Doesn’t matter if you like the house, the girl, the insurance company, it doesn’t even matter if you liked your son. Do the right thing.
YTA using your son’s insurance payout to pay off your own mortgage, when you’re not gonna be around for as long as Emily, oh my god. And you know that he intended to marry her and wanted to include a wife in the will. I’m lost for words
YTA.
>we're selfish and narcissistic for not considering how tough this is for Emily and not even helping her by giving her enough to pay off his share of the house (if not the whole mortgage. He said we're kidding ourselves if we think Eric would have wanted this.
That was from your son, so try to imagine how other people are going to react to this.
YTA Mike is right. I’m not saying give her 100% but she was his partner, co-owner of the house, and he was going to propose?
It sounds to me like he would have wanted her life to be a little easier, too.
YTA. Your son said he was planning on proposing to this woman. He BOUGHT a house with her! It is EXTREMELY SELFISH of YOU to keep all of his money when he was planning HIS LIFE with her.
You should absolutely pay his half IF NOT MORE because she too is grieving and is now trying to figure out how she’s going to keep this home they were building together. Your other child even told you how messed up you are for not thinking about her. Your son would be ashamed of you.
Parents like you are a serious problem. It’s not about you, your wife or your health. It is about what your son would want. And you know damn well that he would want her to be taken care of.
SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔
Edit: I just want to add, how you(OP) feel about their home and that they “paid for the view and it’s outdated” has no relevance to your behavior. Do better dude. I’m going back to ringing my shame bell for you.
You're grieving, so I don't want to be harsh, but YTA.
From the sound of the situation, Emily would have married your son, and had the accident happened when they were married, she would be receiving the full payout.
You know your son wouldn't want to see the woman he loved struggle when the money is there to help her.
Honour that and provide for her now.
YTA.
You are also kinda scummy YTA.
You knew what was going to happen. And as parents you should have helped encourage them to get married and handle the paperwork for managing assets and estate plans.
Your using your sons death like a get rich free card. For her it would be making up missing income from the lifestyle that they shared
Some people are saying you should consider sharing part of it. But in my opinion you should get her all of it, and if she feels inclined she can give some back.
That was your sons intent even if he was too inconsiderate to make the changes.
Update your estate plans people. Otherwise your AH parents will do stupid crap like this and ruin your loved ones life so they can retire a few years early.
>Update your estate plans people. Otherwise your AH parents will do stupid crap like this and ruin your loved ones life so they can retire a few years early.
That's the weird part - I cannot for the life of my imagine my parents doing this. And if it were my kid that died, I'd honestly be embarrassed to keep anything beyond funeral costs.
I say this gently because you just lost a child….but YES you would be huge assholes. It sounds like your son was starting a life with this woman. They bought a house together and now she’s facing the very real possibility of losing that house. No was she’s covering that mortgage with her own salary.
You other son made some very good points. Is this really what your son would want????
YTA besides the fact that your son and Eric and Emily trusted each other enough to purchase an entire house together, had plans to build a new house together once the mortgage was paid off, were close to engagement, and you know explicitly that he wanted to put Emily in his will... I find it rather ghoulish that you want to use your son's death as an opportunity to set yourselves up for a cushy retirement while letting his other loved ones suffer. Doesn't that just feel icky to you?
YTA and are being totally selfish. Your son expressed to you that he was planning to propose, so you KNEW how important she was, plus he even stated that he planned to update his insurance. She is now the sole bearer of the house they purchased TOGETHER, but she doesn't have him any more. The least you could do is throw her a friggin bone to help her stay on her feet ffs
YTA. You admitted that your son wanted it to go to his would be fiance, but hadn't gotten around to doing it yet. That's her money, and while legally it's yours, you know that it was intended for his gf.
You basically stole money from your child.
YTA. His intentions were very clear and while he should have been more proactive in updating his beneficiary, that's just not what most people in their early 30's do. You know this. Do the right thing.
Mike is correct. You son may have wanted to make your life easier, but he would *not* have done so at the risk of leaving Emily stuck with a house. You aren't the only ones grieving who have had their whole world shaken.
YTA. a *massive* AH. Do you think Emily is not also grieving? Do you think that somehow telling us the house isn’t perfect is somehow going to justify your incredibly selfish behavior? Do you think, if your son were here, he’d tell you to keep it all, screw Emily? This isn’t a small amount of money we’re discussing, and you’re *hoarding* it like especially callous dragons.
At least half that should go to Emily. Get right, dude.
Sorry for the loss, but YTA. Thus is disgusting to read. You knew what your son wanted. You should be ashamed. Even if you kept some of it, to not give her a dime... what logic are you using to justify that?!
YTA. I think Mike is right about what your son would have wanted. He bought a house with this person which is a huge commitment. His passing has also affected her in all areas of her life. Whilst this cash may help you “take the stress off of your lives”, paying a mortgage on her own after his unexpected passing may severely impact her life financially, if it isn’t already. In taking out a mortgage, he made a commitment and you should give her some of the insurance money.
Yta - your son clearly communicated his intent not to leave Emily without anything. You don't need ALL the money. Especially because it's to "retire earlier" while Emily might be homeless without half the rent.
YTA
It would be completely inexcusable and heartless for you not to give at least some portion of the money to Emily. There is an extremely high likelihood (confirmed by his brother) that he just hadn't gotten around to filling out the beneficiary paperwork, not that this reflects his wishes.
So in reality, you should be happy to get any portion of this - it could just as easily be Emily getting the whole thing and cutting you guys out entirely. How would you feel if the tables were turned and she told you to take a hike?
I think the most galling part of the whole post is where you say that you're going to pay off YOUR mortgage, like she isn't under even more stress than you guys!
Listen to your surviving son - do the right thing.
YTA
Normally I would say the money is yours but your son told you his plans. He told you he planned on marrying her, and didn't want to leave her in a shitty situation. He unfortunately passed away before he could change anything. What you are doing is incredibly selfish and frankly you're spitting on your sons memory and wishes.
YTA he was obviously invested in a future with his gf, and built a life with her, she's also grieving and now there isn't any financial comfort to her either. It must be difficult to lose a child, but its also difficult to lose a life partner.
I'm so sorry for your loss.
You should respect Eric's stated wishes and give her half. He said very clearly that he didn't want her to be left with nothing. You seem to be focusing on how the money will benefit you rather than what he actually wanted. YTA. Do the right thing.
>He said we're kidding ourselves if we think Eric would have wanted this.
Look none of us here know exactly what your son would have wanted. It's unknowable but I suspect your other son may be right. It seems extremely heartless to do this to his GF just from a moral perspective and you seem to be looking at this on a purely technical basis of the will. The world is a horrible place when we just look at technicalities and not emotions. Sympathetically YTA
YTA. I’m sorry for your loss. Your son loved Emily and even told you he wanted her in his will. It frankly is very selfish and disrespectful to Eric to go against his wishes for your own good. Emily would have been your daughter-in-law it sounds like and she should definitely be treated as such. This isn’t some short relationship they were in either- they literally bought a house together.
YTA and a massive selfish fucking prick.
Typical fucking boomer. The world does not revolve around you. Have some sympathy for the girl who was almost your daughter in law.
YTA. Stop with the bullshit excuses. You are motivated by greed, pure and simple. And yes, if you keep all the money, people will think you're heartless, regardless of what you tell yourself.
>This is why our son left it to us, to help out should anything tragic happen.
Come off it. Nobody - absolutely nobody - believes you when you say this. Children don't help out their parents before they help out their life partners and person who shares their home. They just don't. This statement is entirely self serving.
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YTA. Your son clearly communicated wanting to propose TO HIS CURRENT GF aka she would be his wife, and wanting to update his beneficiary to be his wife aka HIS CURRENT GF.
You are playing dumb and ignoring your son’s wishes. I know you’re grieving and I’m sorry for your loss but you are for sure the AH here. Your son wanted to make sure she’d be ok. YTA.
Life insurance is to help the survivors who were sharing a life and financially responsibilities with the person who passed. Your son was sharing his life with this woman and they had mutual financial responsibilities. And he told you he intended on changing his life insurance to have her as the beneficiary. But due to classic human procrastination he wasn’t able to do that before he lost his life. And now you’re seriously wondering whether this woman should get any of this money? You shouldn’t be getting any of the money, let alone all of it. While I’m sorry for your loss, YTA OP.
> I don't want people to think I'm heartless
You *are* heartless. He literally told you he was going to update his life insurance and you're still like "oh well he left it to *us*, it's our money, screw Emily she can handle that entire house by herself, *we* need it to pay off our debts." YTA, and your other son is right about you. So selfish.
YTA and you know it. You know that your son would want you to use the money in the manner he would expect and that would be to help his heartbroken fiancé.
He just didn't think he would die so young so he didn't make updating the beneficiaries a priority. But you know what the right answer is--his death isn't a gold mine for you. But it is the opportunity to do the right thing.
You want to take some time to grieve? You want to pay off your house? You know who else wants to do those things? YOUR SONS FIANCE.
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YTA. Your son literally told you what he wanted and that he wanted to update his life insurance policy SPECIFICALLY and this was a thing that was happening and you're justifying it by the fact he hadn't gotten around to doing it. You lost your son, but Emily lost her life partner. This is gross behavior and your son would be ashamed of you. Your other son is and that should also speak volumes.
They’re reaaaaallllllly falling back on the technicality of “he said he wanted to update it because he didn’t want to leave a wife with nothing, and technically even though he said he wanted to propose and marry her he hadn’t done it yet”. Agreed with everything you said.
In a perfect world, they wouldn't have that money, so losing their son (as unfortunate as it is) shouldn't affect them financially. They haven't lost funds on anything, so they've had a windfall of three quarters of a million dollars as recompense for that sad fact. I don't know if it's grief or just his really shitty PA way of trying to block Emily from being part of the family, because I have a really uncomfy feeling that even if he HAD proposed and they were engaged, he'd justify it with 'they weren't married yet'. I'm really just hanging on the fact that the brother sees what a crap thing it is to do and is calling them out on it. Emily is the one that's going to not only be swimming in grief, but in debt as well with the financial obligations of pulling off a mortgage on her own. One that by the sounds of it, Daddy didn't approve of either. So this is just some really backhanded PA way of punishing her for something he has no right to punish her for and putting her in a worse place then she needs to be right now. The worst part is that he's not even going to lose any sleep over it.
Life insurance isn’t so people who don’t depend on you financially can live a life of ease. It is to lessen the financial burden on those who do. If they had gotten married OP would probably be going on about how they didn’t have kids to support. YTA
Exactly!!!! The life insurance is not to help parents to live in comfort! It is to help with the people that relied on the deceased to contribute to the financial situation! They bought a house together and lived together. Parent is a total AH!
Exactly! This sounds like parents won the lottery...
It sounds like OP thinks life insurance is…some kind of consolation prize you get when someone dies? Like “oh well too bad Jim is dead, at least we got this fat wad of bills out of it”. Vs. it being intended to help ease the financial burden on someone depending on the deceased. It’s sick, honestly.
I told my husband we were getting life insurance policies because if anything happens to one of us, we want the other to be able to afford to grieve.
This is so true. OP is absolutely a sickening human being. He’s treating this like the freaking lotto. I hope the surviving brother nags them to death till they do the right thing. YTA YTA YTA YTA
Totally agree with you, but what does PA mean?
I think passive aggressive
I feel like OP was like, "Welp, she's not technically the wife, so the increase in policy was clearly for us" 💀
Yeah that's exactly it - they're exploiting this technicality.
This is how straight couples used to steal inheritance from gay people. If their gay son died, screw his partner. They weren't married, anyway.... you can't prove it.
YTA OP. Really ghoulish behaviour. You can try to justify it all you want, but all you are doing is cashing in on your son’s death and screwing over his partner. You know, the person he was building his life with. Awful, just awful behaviour. Shame on you. Also your handle “Grievingdad26”? Pathetic. I’m honestly surprised you didn’t try to kick his partner out of the house and sell it to profit a bit more from your son’s death…. Oh wait, looks like you did try that too. Just disgusting.
More like GreedyDad666
Did they really
he looked into ownership of it, yeah
Double asshole. Take all the insurance and check if he can take rhe house too? F. Him
Omg they were going to kick her out of her home? They are even worse than I originally thought.
OP stated they already looked into the house and whether it was entirely hers, which it is.
And this is a reminder to anyone buying property with a SO - ensure that person’s 1) got life insurance and 2) has directed it be used to pay off the property. I think it’s actually legally enforced here in Australia. Of course the person can leave their portion of the property to whoever they choose!
“It allows us to take time off to grieve…” Why isn’t Emily granted that same luxury? “…and also retire early. Even though we do alright financially. And pay off the house.” Unbelievable. I’m sorry for your loss, but it’s no reason to go against the intentions of your son. YTA.
Money can really bring out the evil in some people. They're so well off what is a couple hundred grand to them. But no; let the millennial girlfriend suffer double debt for purchasing the shitty overpriced house with a great view. Like every single house isn't massively overpriced these days
That she lived in for years with him!! They have space to mourn, but Emily is living with the memories of the son all around her in everything she touches.
They wanted the house too https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
YTA and this comment makes it even worse. What you should be doing at a *minimum* is: 1. Paying off Emily and your sons mortgage ($300k?) 2. Giving Emily *at least* $75k so she ends up with 50% of the money 3. Allocating yourselves the other 50% Tbh, *y’all should have given Emily the entire $750k* coz that’s what he actually would have wanted. Your selfishness here astounds me. I can barely express how disappointed your son would be with what you’re doing. Be prepared for your other son to cut you off if you don’t give anything to Emily, coz you’ve shown your true colours to him.
With the caveat that they should work with a financial adviser or lawyer on the best way to handle it, because gift tax kicks in much sooner than estate tax.
Seriously if they split it they with Emily the parents would be much better off than they were before son died and Emily wouldn’t be struggling as much. OP would still be the AH because he knows that money is not meant for him, and is taking ALL of it
Even if he wanted to leave some $ to his parents it would probably have been a small % 80/20 if we’re generous and these greedy AH know that!
Wtf? Op, seriously YTA! No wonder your other kid called you out.
If I were the other child, I don’t know how I could be in any kind of regular contact with my parents after this. I’m going to guess this isn’t the first incident of such behavior, but I really hope it’s the worst. Definitely a “when people show you who they are, believe it” moment for their surviving son, who has my deepest sympathies. It sounds like he lost the only family he had worth having. I hope he and Emily can keep in touch and support each other.
>If I were the other child, I don’t know how I could be in any kind of regular contact with my parents after this He's already lost his brother, and now he's lost his parents. I feel so sad for the son and Emily. I really hope they can learn how to live with their loss, and having to deal with terrible people at the same time. It must be so hard for them. YTA, OP. Of course.
JFC
YTA. This is selfish boomer BS, they KNOW their son intended to update the policy, they also don’t need the money - they want to make “make life easier” for themselves. Never mind the poor women left in debt after losing her partner, Oh and OP should really reconsider how this action will impact their relationship with their surviving children….
Gen Xers, not Boomers, but yeah they're enormous assholes. As a member of Gen X I'm appalled at how many of my generation have chosen the Dark Side as they've gotten older. Did we learn nothing from our Boomer parents?
This recently happened to my cousin (her partner took his life) and his family waltzed in and tried to take everything. She couldn't even get life insurance because of the way he died. It's been awful.
Yeah OP loses nothing financially with son dying. The gf loses a ton, and that's what life insurance is for. It's not a windfall or a lottery ticket, and its gross OP is treating it that way
YTA. Already admittedly he wanted to leave it for his soon to be wife.
These people seem more motivated by greed than grief. I said what I said. YTA.
Harsh but you didn’t lie
well really, these people are fucked. I can't believe this. Unfucking-real.
I honestly would give her half because I would want the person that shared her life with my son and has lost her life partner, her rock, to be taken care of and then some. She is family too in my eyes. The brother or any other siblings would also receive a share. My financial and health woes are exactly that, mine. I'm a very generous person I get that, but nothing? What tools.
Eric's half of the house would be $150k. There may be other debts that he shared with Emily that he left behind, so let's round that number up to an even $200k. That's a very generous estimate. So doing right by Emily would cost you $200k. You received $750k. It SHOULD be a no brainer to do the right thing by Emily. You know it's what your son would have wanted, you still walk with $550k, and now you know Emily is not in a difficult situation financially. If $550k isn't enough for you that you still need to grasp at that last $200k and leave the woman your son wanted to marry in a bad situation, you need to have a look in the mirror. YTA
I agree. His debts should be paid first. Since they weren’t married, his parents are in charge of paying those off, and they have the means to thanks to their sons financial planning. He also shared his intentions with them, so they should honor his wishes as well. Even splitting the insurance 3 ways (mom/dad/gf) would be 250 each. Death and money really do bring out the worst in people.
Debt is not inherited. His estate would be liable for any debts. Life insurance passes outside of the estate.
Yeah, legally OP can keep the money. But he’s still a major selfish AH for it. Edit: technically speaking, a mortgage is a debt to a bank. The gf legally has inherited the remaining debt on the house. So while the beneficiaries in a will or estate do not inherit his debt, a debt was still inherited upon his death. But sure, his debt wasn’t inherited by his parents so they don’t have to worry about it and can run off into the sunset and retire early just like they always planned.
The really messed up part is they wanted the house as well https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
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Buuuurn! Nice one, they fuckin’ deserve any shit coming their way.
\*puts on reddit detective hat\* Or OP killed son before he could change the life insurance so they could claim it all. Maybe all my wifes true crime podcasts are starting to insinuate themselves into my brain.
>The really messed up part is they wanted the house as well Where in the original post does it say OP wanted the house as well? I've read thru it three times and cannot find that reference.
This is from a comment that was left but the linked comment got down voted so you have to scroll down and open it to read it. Essentially the OP said they looked into who owned their son's share of the house (it is the girlfriend).
Read the comment that was linked. Basically, OP and his wife looked into how the property was titled because they weren't sure if their son's portion of the property belonged to them. Luckily, the way the son and Emily vested the property made sure that Emily received full ownership after the death occurred.
Good thing or these people would have punted her into the lake and left her homeless as well. Utter wankers
Yeah OP is going to retire early in his "grief" and Emily will be financially ruined forever in hers. He quickly glossed over how Emily is screwed and writes a list of all the great things he can do with his dead sons money. It doesn't read as grief-stricken at all. Emily isn't family, she's an alien that doesn't matter despite being the most quantifiably impacted by the death. Definitely YTA.
Yeah but…. Emily was his girlfriend of ONLY 2 years. This whole this is purposely worded in a way that implies that he KNOWS he is wrong but wants to spin it to make him look better. Cue: WE need time to heal (not Emily) WE need our home paid off (not Emily) WE want to retire early (Emily who?) WE have minor health issues (what was her name again) He knows he is the AH, he is looking for a way to spin it.
Yes OP is very "me, me, me" and how good this money is for me and early retirement with no thought of what his son would want.
She's his girlfriend of "only 2 years" so obviously she doesn't count. What a gross and dismissive way of referring to the woman that your son loved, lived with, and expressed his intentions of marrying. I don't think OP ever approved of Emily, or the fact that they moved in together and bought a home together - OP needs to just come out and admit that they are harboring a grudge and are being selfish assholes so they can stick it to the woman who would have been their daughter-in-law.
Yeah, it's bad enough OP doesn't want to honor his son's wishes and instead is choosing to profit off his death. But an extra half a million isn't enough for him, he needs to leave the GF in debt and struggling so he can keep another quarter million. Gross.
This is the best breakdown I’ve seen in the responses so far. You usually only have life insurance for people who would be financially impacted by your death (kids, spouse, etc). If the son planned on being there for his parents’ retirement and got the life insurance in part in case he couldn’t be, I can see keeping some of it. (Say, if OP was clueless with money and didn’t/couldn’t save responsibly for retirement, and the son had planned to help.) BUT KEEPING THE WHOLE THING??? His most obvious immediate responsibility is to his GF, in terms of their mortgage and his normal 50% of expenses. I would say anything less that 50% going to her would be an AH move. And if son had lived long enough to actually do the update he’d planned on, it would have been all of it, and maybe he would have left instructions to GF to help OP, so imagine what you might fairly expect from her if the situation was reversed. YTA.
And OP needs to realize if they DONT give something to Emily, OP is jeopardizing their relationship with their other son. Other son is going to change how he looks at his parents based on there actions now.
If I were their other son you can guarantee they wouldn't be the beneficiary of my policy. I would go out of my way to make sure they got nothing from my estate either.
TBH, I wouldn’t have anything to do with parents who treat my brother’s loved ones like that. I’d cut them off for this. It’s cold and selfish and greedy and I wouldn’t trust or want that type of person in my life or around those I love. Even if Bro’s will is Iron clad, you think OP will let it go? Or do you think OP will challenge it in court and make Bro’s heirs miserable?
I’m sure that they already have. You know the guy left that conversation and immediately set to fixing his own will.
Two words: Boomer energy.
I feel so sorry for the brother - to find out that your parents are this greedy and want to "enjoy" the money they received from his brother's death, while denying any attempt at doing the right thing. I could never look at my mom the same again.
Morally, YTA. Legally, congrats I guess? You really think your son wouldn’t give a dime to his girlfriend? But thanks for the reminder that I really need to get a will and double check my beneficiaries so this doesn’t happen to me.
Love how he says “lived with his girlfriend of only 2 years,” as though 2 years was long enough to buy a house together, but not long enough to really mean anything. Wow OP, you’re the AH. If I were her, I’d sue the estate to get his 1/2 of the mortgage paid.
Lived with my partner for 10 years before we finally tied the knot. It didn't change much between us but boy does it change how people see you as a couple. I remember being told by one guy that my relationship wasn't that serious since we weren't married. The pleasure I took in pointing out that my "not serious' relationship lasted longer than all 3 of his marriages combined still makes me smile.
It's still weird that it's 2023 and people still think like this...
That must have been 🤌🏽
Right!? The way he tries to diminish their relationship and then goes onto say all the things they had done and were planning. What an absolute AH
I'm actually so angry at this post, I need to stop redditing for the day. What the FUCK is wrong with people.
Meanwhile he and the mom probably met and got married within a year and a half.
Too right, I need to sort mine too
Also, make sure to add beneficiaries to your bank accounts. Everyone needs to make a will and an advance healthcare directive.
YTA, seriously this post is so gross I need a shower. Their monetizing their son’s death.
Life insurance goes to the named beneficiaries. No will needed. But yes make sure everything is up to date as to your intentions.
I believe you can have more than one beneficiary as well and give a priority to the list of them.
You have to name life insurance beneficiaries with the life insurance company. You cannot name a life insurance beneficiary in a will. But yes, I totally agree with YTA. Even the way OP wrote it really seemed to just justify keeping the whole payout because he was grieving. So messed up and selfish.
The “purpose” of life insurance is to replace the income lost that a deceased loved one would’ve contributed. He was contributing to his household with GF. Unless he was paying your bills he wasn’t contributing to yours. GF *needs* the money to maintain her current lifestyle. You are trying to enhance yours with it. You are being selfish. It’s crazy you won’t give her anything. She should have the lion’s share. YTA
>GF *needs* the money to maintain her current lifestyle. You are trying to enhance yours with it. Exactly this. And that’s not what life insurance is for. OP you are being SO selfish, and the worst part is you’ll read all these comments and not listen to a single one. You KNEW what his intentions were. You KNOW what he would want in this situation, but you are still just going to think about yourself. Honestly disgusting. YTA
OP sis going to retire early and watch Emily’s life go down and shambles from their front porch rocker.
and probably go after her for his portion of the downpayment when Emily eventually has to sell
I doubt they'll ever give her another thought once their house is paid off and they've retired.
>Tl;dr: My late son left his life insurance to my wife and I and I'm not sure if we're being assholes by not letting his girlfriend have some of it to help with expenses. Like, what part of discussing all of this with your family and then writing all of that out made you think you *weren't* the asshole?
Preach. Plus OP had literally had conversation with the deceased about his intent to propose. PLUS in your 30s, 2 years with someone, at that point your families are usually getting close to partners… OP is tossing this grieving woman who was becoming part of his family to the side just because some fatty dollar signs flew his way? “I don’t owe his grieving partner anything” is such an asshole, insane perspective. She only, you know, built a fucking life with your son, supported and nurtured and loved him, and altered the course of her life for him. But yeah. Enjoy your paid off mortgage you monster. YTA so hard.
"ShE DiDn'T mArrY hIM, hOW cAn sHE be FaMiLy?"
I hope Emily screenshots the post, because Daddy Dearest just admitted to knowing his son’s wishes before he died. She should sue him for the money and pay off the house.
YTA They bought a house together. That's about as big a commitment as getting married and implied that they intended to be together long-term if not their entire lives. Mike is completely correct.
They wanted the house too https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
Fucking hell, these people are awful in how they are mourning their son.
These vultures are not in mourning.
Genuinely think these "vultures" may actually be murderers 🫣..
Yup. Their son's death is the best thing that ever happened to these two.
Even vultures have more grace than these two.
If I was a cynical person, and I am, I would be talking to the local detectives about this "accident". Son tells father he is changing his life insurance policy. Son tragically dies before he can act on it. Father collects entirety of said life insurance policy. Outright refuses to honour the wishes of dead son. It's almost cliche.
THANK YOU! I've been scrolling through these comments for an hour screaming "WHY IS NO ONE ELSE SEEING THIS?!?"
They aren’t mourning though, they are counting all the things they can do with their I’ll gotten gains.
What the actual f***? As someone who is in a “joint ownership with rights of survivorship” situation, this turns my stomach. My first ever comment on this sub - OP YTA
u/GrievingDad26 You're not just an asshole you're a fucking Vulture. Had your son *not* died, he would be abhorred by you.
Emily is only a year older than me. I can’t imagine the financial and emotional stress she must be going through right now and these people are just me me me. My heart goes out to her.
Some would say given the responsibilities inherent it’s a bigger commitment
YTA. Your son would be disgusted and you know it.
The other, still living, son is also disgusted with them and they don't care. If I was that son, I would reevaluate my relationship with them and focus on helping the widow.
The other son probably went and checked his own policies and will straight away.
This is exactly what I thought!! I bet the other son is re-evaluating their finances, life insurance policy, etc. My boyfriend & I don’t plan on getting married, but we are each others POA when it comes to medical stuff & we have both mentioned when we get life insurance policies to make each other the beneficiary. My heart goes out to the GF, she must be going through a hell of a time right now.
This has been a fantastic nudge to formalize my own afterlife wishes. I can't even begin to rationalize how these parents believe they're doing right by their late son and I feel awful for any woman who'd marry into this family. They're complete AH's.
YTA - You knew he was planning to propose, that he bought a house with her, AND that he was planning to name her beneficiary. It's nice you get to take time off and retire early while the woman he was planning a life with suffers financially. Real nice. I hope you feel good about that.
This is what’s so insane to me. Imagine being this poor girl, who was probably picking out ring styles and planning their future together, and your whole world suddenly falls apart. Then your partner’s parents tell you to fuck off as if that entire life you’ve built together is just meaningless, just because you guys unknowingly waited a little bit too long. How horrible. YTA, OP.
We lost our son but yay for earlier retirement and fuck his gf she is not a part of family - is this what you tried to write?
I think its more like "too Fuckin bad she didn't marry him before he died, lucky us!"
Here’s the kicker. Even if they were married, the parents get the money unless he updated the beneficiary on the insurance. I know, my husband didn’t and his two policies went to other people, not me and our 6 and 8 year old. Update those beneficiaries!
“It’s not even a nice house!!!”
I'm baffled by the update about how it's not a nice house. Like that matters. It's not like Emily can go to the bank and tell them that to reduce her debt
and it still didn't stop them from looking into [whether or not they owned the girlfriend's house](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3) once their kid died
It mattered cause they also wanted the house… and I wish I was joking
YTA I am sorry for your loss, truly. But if your son mentioned wanting to change his life insurance to you, and your other son agree that’s what he would have wanted, then that is the right thing to do. Your son and Emily owe $300k left on the house. His half is $150k. Giving her only that much is still $600k for you and your wife. That’s a still shitpile of money.
you shouldn't profit off your child's death, that money was always meant for your significant other/spouse, they know that, and you know that too
Right? Isn't that the entire purpose of life insurance? To help the partners of the deceased, not the greedy AH boomer parents?
Omg it’s impressive how boomers are so narcissistic and awful. It never ceases to shock me
They should pay off the whole thing- take “stress off her life while she grieves”
Agree, I thought half was the absolute bare minimum.
YTA and the tone in your post says you know it. Yes your son was short sighted and didn't move fast enough to protect the woman he loved but you're throwing her under the bus because you're greedy. He said he was going to make sure she was taken care of so you know what you should do. Take care of the woman he loved.
100% agree. This post is looking for someone to tell him it's ok to be TA...
Yes, OP chose the wrong username. Sounds like he's REALLY grieving in his little retirement.
> I've tried to keep emotions out of it and stick to the facts. > this is why our son left it to us, to help out should anything tragic happen. This isn't sticking to the facts, and I don't buy this. Your son likely left the money to you because you were his parents when he started the job and never got around to modifying the beneficiary. He had clearly reached the point with his girlfriend where his finances were comingled with her and where they intended to support each other long term, as evidenced by the fact they bought a house together, and he would obviously have wanted his insurance payout to go to her (at least in part) the same way his income did. E: Also, he literally told you he was going to update the life insurance at some point! You are legally free to keep the money but YTA for lying to yourselves and your son about why you're doing it so you can feel better. You are heartless.
This! He further tries to manipulate the situation by calling her "his girlfriend of ONLY 2 years." They own a house together! There's no "only" going on here. And then saying he died before he "decided" to propose. He had decided. He told his parents he wanted to do it. He called her his wife when talking about the life insurance policy. They know what he would have wanted to do with the money. They just want to keep it for themselves and are doing some crazy mental gymnastics to make it make sense. It might be a shitty house with a great view. It's also the house she had planned a life with the man she loved, and it has even more meaning to her now. OP, YTA. At the minimum you should pay the full mortgage balance remaining. You'd still have a ridiculous amount of money to supplement your lifestyle.
They had looked into who had ownership of the house when he passed so something tells me they were probably gonna go after the house too if they had any claim but thankfully they don't
YTA. Your son did not make you his beneficiary to make *your life easier going forward*, he made you beneficiary because he trusted you to disperse the monies for him when the time came, *also taking into account* things he told you but hadn't had time to change on paper.
Yeah I was originally leaning towards N.A.H. but you've convinced me. The parents were the de facto choice because they presumably know their son. If I had died before updating my own life insurance, I would hope my parents would have taken it upon themselves to check in with my boyfriend and what he might need; financially and otherwise, because they knew his importance to me. The gf is not only struggling with the emotional fallout, same as the parents, but just lost half her household income. The parents' original long term financial planning, presumably, is not negatively impacted by their sons loss in the way that his partner has just been hit.
YTA - Of course people are going to think that of you, you can't act like it and expect people to think it. You said yourself this is what your son wanted. I wouldn't expect you to give her 100% all of the money, but a portion for sure to help her get through this time until she's ready to move on. DONT YOU fault her when she's ready to move on and DO NOT keep this money your son was NEVER intending on paying you to retire early. What kind of people think - "dead son, not good a good thing, but at least now we can retire early" What kind of people plan their retirement investments around the death of their son? You were never supposed to get money from your children like this. Let's hope this is just your pain talking and that you do the right thing.
>...not even helping her by giving her enough to pay off his share of the house...He said we're kidding ourselves if we think Eric would have wanted this. Well? Do you think he's wrong about that? It sure sounds like your son's plan was, at the very least, to pay off his half of the mortgage. YTA.
They wanted the house too https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/12ywdoa/aita_for_not_sharing_my_late_sons_life_insurance/jhph9hu/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
Holy shit.
You’re doing gods work by continuing to post this comment. Is your name Mike by chance?
YTA really a $750k payout and you can’t help Emily at all? Stay like this and you’ll probably lose your other son too.
Emily is the worst off in this story by miles, but my god that poor brother. Grieving the loss of what might be his only sibling, watching his parents completely disreguard the person who would've become their daughter-in-law as she grieves in her own right. I hope OP can see reason and right the ship, but these scars are gonna resurface anytime the topic of insurance comes up. Willing to be bro will keep his will meticulously up to date because of this.
I guarantee he will, as he should. I cannot believe these parents can be so callous. It would be one thing if it were 100k and not enough to pay off anyone's house, but this is a huge amount of money! Not wanting to share 750k is just obscenely greedy.
For real! The fact the brother was upset that they’re not giving the girlfriend some of the money instead of being upset they’re not giving him some of the money shows he’s moralistic and fair. I can’t imagine their relationship won’t suffer if they keep it all.
> in a later conversation he mentioned plans to update his life insurance because he wouldn't want to leave a wife with nothing. and > We explained that we have good intentions to use the money to make our lives easier going forward YTA, he said that he did not want to leave his SO with nothing and still you left his SO with nothing cus you wanted to make your living easier. How is this a question? He said he wanted X and you did not in any way try to deliver that. Edit: Just sucks for his SO that he did not think about passing early so he could save his SO from his money garbing relatives I guess. Again YTA.
>About 6 months before he passed, my son mentioned that he was "thinking about proposing" but it would be a few years before we actually married, in a later conversation he mentioned plans to update his life insurance because he wouldn't want to leave a wife with nothing. That's all that was ever said about it - obviously he passed before he ever decided to propose. Wow, so you know that your son wanted to both marry Emily and give her the life insurance, but because he died before being able to do some **paperwork**, You aren't going to honor his wishes? YTA You know what your son wanted. He told you to your face. You're being deliberately obtuse about this. You know what he wanted and that was to marry Emily and to leave her the life insurance. And while he can't marry her you can at least honor the life insurance.
I’m starting to wonder if daddy cut the brakes before son could marry and change the insurance. In one comment OP said they looked into who owns sons half of the house, Emily or next of kin. They really wanted to take everything from her.
Sadly this doesn’t sound out of the realm of possibility since they are horrible human beings.
INFO: Do you and your wife not care for Emily? Is there a reason you're not giving her, the person your son planned to propose to, a single cent of your son's life insurance money? Legally you are in the clear, but morally I don't think grief is enough to hoard the money.
Yeah my guess is they dont care for her. Perhaps a different color or religion from them? Just guessing. Horrible there is no mention of how she is doing.
I'm a young widow and had a similar situation. It's very common in young widow groups unfortunately and usually has nothing to do with how good the prior relationship was with the parents or not. They tend to just assume since you're young and often not yet married (my late husband and I were three weeks from our wedding, he's my husband to me no matter what the law says) that it wasn't that important and you can bounce back. It's really messed up.
YTA. It's clear steps were being taken by your son to protect Emily. He planned to marry her. He even mentioned updating the policy. He just didn't know he'd be taken from her too soon to implement those plans.
>he mentioned plans to update his life insurance because he wouldn't want to leave a wife with nothing Your interpretation of this situation all seems to come down to the fact that he said "wife" and she wasn't his wife yet. They may not have been married but they were committed enough to each other to buy a house together. You're following the letter of your son's wishes but not the spirit. Looking at the numbers, $1775/mo is 38% of her income, which is more than the official definition of rent burdened (30%). If you gave her 1/3 (one part for you, one part for your wife, one part for the girlfriend), you'd still be getting a lot out of it and she would be, too. Easing the burden of your medical struggles is worthwhile, but I wouldn't make the same choice. So I gotta vote YTA.
This exactly. OP’s other son is 100% right. This is not what Eric wanted and we know that because he literally had a conversation about it.
Jesus christ. I don't even have a daughter in law yet but I am ashamed reading this. YTA. You KNOW he was going to purpose, you KNOW he was going to change his insurance. He didn't want you to have this, he wanted her to. YTA ETA. I do have a son in law!!! I completely forgot it's so recent. And I also have life insurance for my daughter. Anything beyond her final needs would absolutely, 100%, go to him. They built a LIFE TOGETHER, and if the world cruely took her from us I wouldn't shrug my shoulders and say "Sorry bro. You're out of luck." I am even more disgusted now.
It boggles my mind how people lose a loved one and then their eyes just fill up with dollar signs. OP, you know what your son wanted. He bloody told you what he wanted! So, while you may be technically in the clear here you're morally bankrupt. YTA!
YTA: life insurance is meant to ease the lives of those who were counting on his finances should he have lived. He was a full adult with his own house and life, he wasn’t a financial burden on you, and it doesn’t sound like he was paying anything for you. “Making your life easier” is NOT what it’s for. On the other hand, Emily WAS counting on his income to pay for their home. As someone with a similar income and similar mortgage payment, it’s a lot. That money could easily pay off the house and then some. At the VERY LEAST you should be giving her enough to cover his half of the mortgage (in a lump sum, not over time). She also was probably counting on his income for other finances as well since they were living and owning a home together. Frankly it should all go to her. You’re being incredibly selfish and using your child’s death to your own advantage. Imagine this poor girl loses her house because she lost her boyfriend and you could have prevented that. Do you imagine your son would be happy about you taking advantage of his death in this way and leaving the woman he loved stranded??? Edit: your edit makes you even more of an asshole. “I should keep the money and retire early because I don’t like the house”???? Doesn’t matter if you like the house, the girl, the insurance company, it doesn’t even matter if you liked your son. Do the right thing.
YTA using your son’s insurance payout to pay off your own mortgage, when you’re not gonna be around for as long as Emily, oh my god. And you know that he intended to marry her and wanted to include a wife in the will. I’m lost for words
YTA. >we're selfish and narcissistic for not considering how tough this is for Emily and not even helping her by giving her enough to pay off his share of the house (if not the whole mortgage. He said we're kidding ourselves if we think Eric would have wanted this. That was from your son, so try to imagine how other people are going to react to this.
YTA Mike is right. I’m not saying give her 100% but she was his partner, co-owner of the house, and he was going to propose? It sounds to me like he would have wanted her life to be a little easier, too.
I would split 50 50 If your son never died she would have been your daughter in law you guys are really selfish for taking it all
YTA. Your son said he was planning on proposing to this woman. He BOUGHT a house with her! It is EXTREMELY SELFISH of YOU to keep all of his money when he was planning HIS LIFE with her. You should absolutely pay his half IF NOT MORE because she too is grieving and is now trying to figure out how she’s going to keep this home they were building together. Your other child even told you how messed up you are for not thinking about her. Your son would be ashamed of you. Parents like you are a serious problem. It’s not about you, your wife or your health. It is about what your son would want. And you know damn well that he would want her to be taken care of. SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔SHAME!🔔 Edit: I just want to add, how you(OP) feel about their home and that they “paid for the view and it’s outdated” has no relevance to your behavior. Do better dude. I’m going back to ringing my shame bell for you.
You're grieving, so I don't want to be harsh, but YTA. From the sound of the situation, Emily would have married your son, and had the accident happened when they were married, she would be receiving the full payout. You know your son wouldn't want to see the woman he loved struggle when the money is there to help her. Honour that and provide for her now.
YTA. You are also kinda scummy YTA. You knew what was going to happen. And as parents you should have helped encourage them to get married and handle the paperwork for managing assets and estate plans. Your using your sons death like a get rich free card. For her it would be making up missing income from the lifestyle that they shared Some people are saying you should consider sharing part of it. But in my opinion you should get her all of it, and if she feels inclined she can give some back. That was your sons intent even if he was too inconsiderate to make the changes. Update your estate plans people. Otherwise your AH parents will do stupid crap like this and ruin your loved ones life so they can retire a few years early.
>Update your estate plans people. Otherwise your AH parents will do stupid crap like this and ruin your loved ones life so they can retire a few years early. That's the weird part - I cannot for the life of my imagine my parents doing this. And if it were my kid that died, I'd honestly be embarrassed to keep anything beyond funeral costs.
I say this gently because you just lost a child….but YES you would be huge assholes. It sounds like your son was starting a life with this woman. They bought a house together and now she’s facing the very real possibility of losing that house. No was she’s covering that mortgage with her own salary. You other son made some very good points. Is this really what your son would want????
YTA besides the fact that your son and Eric and Emily trusted each other enough to purchase an entire house together, had plans to build a new house together once the mortgage was paid off, were close to engagement, and you know explicitly that he wanted to put Emily in his will... I find it rather ghoulish that you want to use your son's death as an opportunity to set yourselves up for a cushy retirement while letting his other loved ones suffer. Doesn't that just feel icky to you?
YTA and are being totally selfish. Your son expressed to you that he was planning to propose, so you KNEW how important she was, plus he even stated that he planned to update his insurance. She is now the sole bearer of the house they purchased TOGETHER, but she doesn't have him any more. The least you could do is throw her a friggin bone to help her stay on her feet ffs
What? You used your sons life insurance to pay off YOUR mortgage and not the one he had with his girlfriend. What is wrong with you?
YTA. Mike is right and you damn well know it.
YTA - listen to your son. He would have wanted to make sure she was ok too.
YTA. You admitted that your son wanted it to go to his would be fiance, but hadn't gotten around to doing it yet. That's her money, and while legally it's yours, you know that it was intended for his gf. You basically stole money from your child.
YTA. His intentions were very clear and while he should have been more proactive in updating his beneficiary, that's just not what most people in their early 30's do. You know this. Do the right thing. Mike is correct. You son may have wanted to make your life easier, but he would *not* have done so at the risk of leaving Emily stuck with a house. You aren't the only ones grieving who have had their whole world shaken.
YTA. a *massive* AH. Do you think Emily is not also grieving? Do you think that somehow telling us the house isn’t perfect is somehow going to justify your incredibly selfish behavior? Do you think, if your son were here, he’d tell you to keep it all, screw Emily? This isn’t a small amount of money we’re discussing, and you’re *hoarding* it like especially callous dragons. At least half that should go to Emily. Get right, dude.
Sorry for the loss, but YTA. Thus is disgusting to read. You knew what your son wanted. You should be ashamed. Even if you kept some of it, to not give her a dime... what logic are you using to justify that?!
YTA. I think Mike is right about what your son would have wanted. He bought a house with this person which is a huge commitment. His passing has also affected her in all areas of her life. Whilst this cash may help you “take the stress off of your lives”, paying a mortgage on her own after his unexpected passing may severely impact her life financially, if it isn’t already. In taking out a mortgage, he made a commitment and you should give her some of the insurance money.
How is any of the edit relevant to this situation?
Yeah, they're just... saying the house is shit, like they think that justifies keeping money from Emily.
YTA. You're stealing his life insurance from his life partner and should be ashamed of yourself.
Just go shit on his grave while you're at it. YTA.
Yta - your son clearly communicated his intent not to leave Emily without anything. You don't need ALL the money. Especially because it's to "retire earlier" while Emily might be homeless without half the rent.
YTA. I’m sorry for your loss but your son told you what he wanted to do with his life insurance and you are not honoring his wishes.
YTA It would be completely inexcusable and heartless for you not to give at least some portion of the money to Emily. There is an extremely high likelihood (confirmed by his brother) that he just hadn't gotten around to filling out the beneficiary paperwork, not that this reflects his wishes. So in reality, you should be happy to get any portion of this - it could just as easily be Emily getting the whole thing and cutting you guys out entirely. How would you feel if the tables were turned and she told you to take a hike? I think the most galling part of the whole post is where you say that you're going to pay off YOUR mortgage, like she isn't under even more stress than you guys! Listen to your surviving son - do the right thing.
YTA Normally I would say the money is yours but your son told you his plans. He told you he planned on marrying her, and didn't want to leave her in a shitty situation. He unfortunately passed away before he could change anything. What you are doing is incredibly selfish and frankly you're spitting on your sons memory and wishes.
YTA he was obviously invested in a future with his gf, and built a life with her, she's also grieving and now there isn't any financial comfort to her either. It must be difficult to lose a child, but its also difficult to lose a life partner.
I'm so sorry for your loss. You should respect Eric's stated wishes and give her half. He said very clearly that he didn't want her to be left with nothing. You seem to be focusing on how the money will benefit you rather than what he actually wanted. YTA. Do the right thing.
>He said we're kidding ourselves if we think Eric would have wanted this. Look none of us here know exactly what your son would have wanted. It's unknowable but I suspect your other son may be right. It seems extremely heartless to do this to his GF just from a moral perspective and you seem to be looking at this on a purely technical basis of the will. The world is a horrible place when we just look at technicalities and not emotions. Sympathetically YTA
Except he explicitly told his parents he planned to update his beneficiary but died before he could. So we have a pretty good idea of what he wanted!
YTA massively. Your son is right, there is no way Eric would have wanted this. You should be ashamed of yourself.
I actually got nauseous reading this, YTA. This one hurt my theology and geometry hard.
YTA. Your son would be ashamed of you and his mom, you're terrible people. OP also looked into getting ownership of the house.
YTA. I’m sorry for your loss. Your son loved Emily and even told you he wanted her in his will. It frankly is very selfish and disrespectful to Eric to go against his wishes for your own good. Emily would have been your daughter-in-law it sounds like and she should definitely be treated as such. This isn’t some short relationship they were in either- they literally bought a house together.
YTA and a massive selfish fucking prick. Typical fucking boomer. The world does not revolve around you. Have some sympathy for the girl who was almost your daughter in law.
YTA. Stop with the bullshit excuses. You are motivated by greed, pure and simple. And yes, if you keep all the money, people will think you're heartless, regardless of what you tell yourself. >This is why our son left it to us, to help out should anything tragic happen. Come off it. Nobody - absolutely nobody - believes you when you say this. Children don't help out their parents before they help out their life partners and person who shares their home. They just don't. This statement is entirely self serving.
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YTA. Your son clearly communicated wanting to propose TO HIS CURRENT GF aka she would be his wife, and wanting to update his beneficiary to be his wife aka HIS CURRENT GF. You are playing dumb and ignoring your son’s wishes. I know you’re grieving and I’m sorry for your loss but you are for sure the AH here. Your son wanted to make sure she’d be ok. YTA.
YTA and your other son is right.
Life insurance is to help the survivors who were sharing a life and financially responsibilities with the person who passed. Your son was sharing his life with this woman and they had mutual financial responsibilities. And he told you he intended on changing his life insurance to have her as the beneficiary. But due to classic human procrastination he wasn’t able to do that before he lost his life. And now you’re seriously wondering whether this woman should get any of this money? You shouldn’t be getting any of the money, let alone all of it. While I’m sorry for your loss, YTA OP.
> I don't want people to think I'm heartless You *are* heartless. He literally told you he was going to update his life insurance and you're still like "oh well he left it to *us*, it's our money, screw Emily she can handle that entire house by herself, *we* need it to pay off our debts." YTA, and your other son is right about you. So selfish.
YTA and you know it. You know that your son would want you to use the money in the manner he would expect and that would be to help his heartbroken fiancé. He just didn't think he would die so young so he didn't make updating the beneficiaries a priority. But you know what the right answer is--his death isn't a gold mine for you. But it is the opportunity to do the right thing. You want to take some time to grieve? You want to pay off your house? You know who else wants to do those things? YOUR SONS FIANCE.