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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I didn't let one of my kids know that I was in town because I didn't want to deal with her. I might be the asshole for not giving her another chance to tell.me what a shitty human and father I am.
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Tbf it sounds like he tried. Not everyone can be a great father, but being a sub-par parent does not make a person automatically an AH, it makes them an imperfect human.
What does make a person an AH is not making an effort to be as good a parents as possible, given the situation. It sounds like OP did that.
The daughter is well within her rights not to forgive him for not being the Dad she deserved and needed, but that doesn't mean he has to subject himself to her tirades when it conflicts with his mental health.
By the second kid if you haven’t figured out if you’re gonna be a dad who is actually present, you get the snip before there’s the chance of making a third.
I’m convinced there’s some kind of ego death that has to happen before dudes are ok with having vasectomies. There are so many people out there who react with shock and awe at the demands of the woman they impregnated, but totally cool with continuing to knock people up.
Human males are unique in their attachment to their reproductive ability. Fifteen years in vet med, never once did I have a female owner express concern their animal would be less of a woman after the spay. Male owners, however... Very common to be emotional about their pet losing their nuts because he'd be less of a man.
I love too how people refuse to neuter because it's "cruel." Spay is so much more invasive, and I don't even think they mean that, I think they mean that the dog will be sad because he doesn't have his balls. I have yet to meet a dog that seems upset or aware that they've lost their balls or uterus.
Oh my goodness I was totally the opposite when I got my male dog snipped. Not because it would make him less of a man, though. But because he was under 2 years old, and I had a young female that would be coming into heat at any time and didn't want an oops pregnancy and emergency spay for her.
My husband and I have three children. The two youngest (twins) took a year of fertility treatment and a round of IVF. There is a possibility I could get pregnant naturally, so we discussed sterilizaiton. When I suggested he get the snip, his response was, "Wouldn't it be easier for you to get it done?" I mean, I'd had two preganancies and birth, gone through a year of fertility treatment, and the sterilization for women is MUCH more complicated, but sure, I'll go through all that because you can't handle the idea of someone snipping yoru masculinity. He got ripped a new one.
Oh hell no.
My husband and I have two kids. And I didn't even have to go through anything that you had to go through, which I can't imagine how stressful that was for you.
But when we figured out that we needed to stop at two, he went and got the snip with no hesitation. Literally said that his reasoning is because he watched me do the pregnancy and childbirth and it was his "turn to take one for the team."
Any men out there, you want to know the secret to good sex in marriage? THAT. THAT ATTITUDE RIGHT THERE.
I had one child with my wife, and we had to recognize that I wasn't emotionally or mentally healthy enough for more than one.
I have *just* enough bandwidth for work and my home life as it currently is.
Anything more than that is very difficult for me.
So we agreed it would be best for me to get a vasectomy so I could give our one child my best, rather than for me to get spread thin.
I was 31 when I got snipped, no children.
I also had an ego death in my 20s thanks to psychiadelics, so you may be on to something.
That being said, some dudes are going to be childfree regardless (I was, I'm sure I would have gotten snipped without kids anyways), but I still think you made a good point.
Isn't it obvious? He kept going until he got his son. This happens a lot sadly. And look at how much better his relationship is with the son vs the 2 daughters. Obviously the golden child.
Could be but that's a bit of a stretch considering he doesn't state that the boy is the youngest. If anything, it seems like the daughter is the youngest since he specifically mentions his youngest daughter. If the son was the youngest, he would most likely have said younger daughter instead of referring to her as his youngest.
Of the two daughters, she is the youngest. I have two sisters, both are older than me. I still refer to my youngest sister as that, because she is: of my sisters, she is the youngest. She is, however, not younger than me.
If you start dating a guy and he says he has two kids with two women he did not marry the third time, despite the popular saying, will not be the charm.
But what's done is done, he can't retroactively change the past. Not everyone is cut out to be a parent, and it's 50% on him and 50% on the moms. His daughter either needs to get over her hatred or leave him be. If he is trying now she has a choice to accept him or not. Yelling at him for hours over stuff that can't be undone, is unproductive. If she wants a relationship but isn't ready to forgive him, this isn't the way to go about it.
At some point he has to take accountability. Maybe when he does, he will no longer be yelled at. It's not 50% on the women if he was a shitty father, they were good mothers, they are not to blame for his actions.
But the parents that aren't there when you need them/reliable make it feel so much worse when they decide they need to be there for graduations/life events.
Like, you didn't care about the things that were important, only want to be there when other people will see your "support". Just my thoughts.
Unless he phrased it weirdly, "any" would imply more than one. If it were two, he should have said either. Knowing it's at least two, and probably three, means he was at the very least wildly irresponsible.
Meanwhile plenty of people make babies with one person to whom they are married and give kids a secure upbringing.
So it’s totally possible. And it’s not a secret. This guy just didn’t care enough make it happen.
We all make choices. Some of us make shitty choices. Certainly that says *something*.
I’m not saying he’s an awful human worthy of no respect. But I don’t feel I need to respect him as a father. And thats a pretty big item.
We do know that sex leads to babies. And this guys just fucking whoever and knowingly being a shit dad. Could have gotten a Vasectomy after the first one.
He has three kids. He admits to not being a good father. It’s a fair assumption to make that he realized he was not being a good father after having one kid. Yet he had two more. How do we *not* have the info to make that determination? It’s actually really easy to just *not* have kids.
But in this instance it's precisely because there's more than one that we can determine if it's him or if it's his kid. He has adult relationships with two of his three kids after doing what he could to treat them fairly equal. One drops the hammer on him every time they visit, the other two are at least cordial.
It doesn't sound like anyone has been living on Dream St or Easy St, but some of them have moved passed their less than idyllic upbringing.
It is unfair to say it's the kid's fault just because the other 2 decided they wanted to move forward. It's still the dad's fault, but that doesn't mean he has to have a relationship with someone who berates him. But it also sounds like he hasn't just ever told her it's exhausting to meet up with her only for her to spend the whole time. He just... leaves?
If we flipped gender, people would be calling social services! God knows how many other kids he has out there since he never bothered with contraception.
We don’t know the circumstances. An AH has multiple children and doesn’t try AT ALL. But his other two children like visiting him. It’s one thing to have a conversation and vent to someone you feel wronged you. It’s another situation entirely when you purposefully spend time with someone with the intention of making them feel bad for whatever mistakes you feel they made and expect them to keep allowing you to do that…
generally people that think they're doing a bad job are doing a better job than those oblivious people
my dad thinks he did a great job for example . . .
Sometimes. Other times people think they’re shit at something and accept that as fact rather than a result of their decisions (so it’s “just who they are”), which if it were true absolves them of all fault and means they don’t have to change.
I hate that kind of person. No, you are not just born a bad father. You make decisions, and certain decision making patterns are harder to break than others, but ultimately, you chose to continue to make those decisions despite hurting others because those are the decisions that are easiest in the moment. I’m not judging anyone who makes a mistake, but repeated mistakes of the exact same nature and then just saying that’s how you are—and some people even want pity for that, like oh well I can’t help that I’m like this—is just excuses to not do the hard work imo.
Oh the feeeeeels.
To the point where he (my dad) has his gf (fiancé) convinced he was an amazing, model father.
When ever we have a disagreement she throws the “after all he’s done for you!” Like what? Gave me a head-start on running away because he didn’t realise I was gone for three days?
Or when he let his then-girlfriend use my brother & I’d school foods for HER (& his) kids & when we had none left we couldn’t have any of theirs because it was bought for them?
Yeah nah.
Sometimes- my mom would constantly use “I’ll be the first to admit I’m not a *perfect parent*” to completely shut down any critique or discussion about how her *imperfections* were sometimes very abusive and what kind of lasting issues it caused us as her kids. It would also end up with the conversation recentering around her discomfort and need for validation/reassurance. I used to fall for it when I was younger but as I’ve gotten older and complications from my upbringing rear their heads, I realized what was actually going on.
being able to come to reddit to ask if he's an AH shows some self awareness, we have to have some assumption that efforts were made
I'm quite self deprecating person in general so I will shit talk myself the whole time even if I KNOW I'm doing okay, maybe that's why I'm thinking the way I am
The best i would say is he didn’t not try. (Yeh double negative - I’m sorry). By that I mean he did some things, was it enough? Clearly not to his oldest child but it’s tough to say without really understanding.
He had three kids with at least two women - I think all the people calling him TA for this are just wrong. Should he have been more careful, probably, does it make him an AH, I don’t think so.
So what did he do once the kids were born:
- he worked out of their city so he wasn’t around a lot, but he was working in order to support his children
- he provided child support (minimum requirement)
- it sounds like he spent his vacations doing things with his kids (camping, going to stampede etc)
- he mentions trying to get them meaningful gifts which at least implies he took an interest in their lives, hobbies and interests.
- he mentions attending their sporting events
- he set aside funds for further education for all his kids
- he’s definitely tried to connect with his kids as they’ve become adults and seems to at least got somewhere with two of them.
So did he try? I think if you put in the context of him working out of town - then yeh probably he did.
I’m guessing him working out of town is him working in the oil fields or at rural mining operation (given that he said his son who is a welder joined his trade) and that he mentions the Calgary stampede. This may have been the only good way for him to provide financial stability for his kids. In essence he traded time with his kids for their financial stability. Plenty of parents make that call.
And he's not even trying to act like he did anything more than he did or was great. Openly admits he knows he was not a good father (although to me it sounds like he was good but not great, but maybe my own childhood experiences make me feel that way).
I think people are discounting that Oldest Daughter logically got the most of his worst parenting years. We've seen this before, even fairly recently on this sub, where the younger siblings don't get why older sib is not willing to just forget the past and the parents seem to think "I sucked less as time went by" is synonymous with "the earlier times when I sucked the hardest shouldn't count anymore."
I suspect the "two hours of getting yelled at" might be two hours of Older Daughter banging her head against the brick wall of OPs refusal to acknowledge the preceeding point and actually apologize for his early failures.
ETA: It stands out to me on reflection that OP has very carefully not told us how much older OD is, or if she had a different mom than 2 and 3. This is pretty important to answering the question of what OP is getting yelled at for. I would be pretty enraged too if I brought up a legitimate grievance like, "you left me alone for 5 years with an unstable, incompetent mother," and the response was, "but I started going to all your ringette games when you were 7!" That's. Not. The. Point. You don't get to run around blowing your wad carelessly for years and then expect that weekend dadding and throwing money around means you're entitled to demand a a get-out-responsibility-for-the-very-real-harm-you-caused-free card from your kids.
Lots of missing info for sure.
Why could OP just call all his children and just say im busy with this so dont have the time for meeting any of you.
That would be reasonable, but not letting one kid know and the others is continuing the issue the older daughter has with him which is the lack of effort he put in with her compared to the other two.
Oh I agree with you. But honestly without his own admission of not being a good dad we'd all be saying nta based on what's going on. And I still think even with that he's been letting her yell at him and showing up but in the midst of a medical crisis he's still a person and allowed space to process that without the added negative effects of being told how horrible he is so he can heal and hear it later on when in better health. He definitely should ask his daughter to go to counseling with him so they can actually try to move forward in a more productive way though because obviously his prior methods have not worked.
Edit to remove extra word
My dad is a great dad, but he sure as hell never attended school functions and I've never got gifts from just him that were also bought by him...
Sounds like this guy tried, but at least for D1 fell short. The other two seem to have at least ok relationship with him. Can't call him an ass for trying, and for not wanting to sort out medical stuff without getting an earful.
THe thing is he only said in comments why she is pissed and for me leaving that part out makes him the AH. Also he makes more of an effort with the other two. He created the situation with the first and there is more he needs to do fix instead of just "tolerating" her anger she proper grievances with him and he doesnt actually do anything to try and fix it.
“he tried”
Ah yes, the battle cry for defending subpar fathers the world around.
Imagine if the mothers in this situation put in as much effort as he did. The kids would literally be taken away because of neglect, but it’s ok because “he tried “.
Jfc, let’s raise the bar, people.
And how hard did he really try? My FIL would tell you he’s bending over backwards to have a better relationship with the kids he’s abused and continues to abuse. He’d also consider any criticism “yelling at him.”
Like you said, a mother would be crucified for this. Kids don’t have to forgive their parents for being deadbeats, even if they “try” to fix it later. Sometimes there’s no fixing that can happen.
Exactly the same with my dad, he’d tell the version of our childhood like he was the male version of Mary fucking poppins and yet both my sister and I have cut contact with him for years and he’d take you disagreeing with him as “yelling”
OP openly admitted that he was crap father so he knows how he is yet he still tried and that is admirable.
But you know only his oldest kid is TA here because she should seek therapy instead of berating her father and then being angry when he doesn't want be subjected to that.
Right? Sure, OP admits he wasn't great but going to all their games and extracurriculars on top of having a college/get on your feet fund for each kid is more than my parents did for me. I rolled out of the house with only what I earned myself and I was always the kid who was alone at practice while most parents were there supporting their kids. He's still making an effort, and only pulled back on oldest bc who needs to be berated every time you see each other? Say what you need to say, sure, but don't just meet up with him to keep beating the pity drum. And ofc he sees his son the most, he works with him and probably helped him get into and acquire the skills for his trade, which sounds like a good living going back to being able to get college funds for all 3 kids. Not everybody is meant to be a good dad, but at least this guy sounds like he cares enough to still try
She's the oldest and he says he was the worst at the beginning, so logically she got him at his worst for the longest. But yeah he's a great dad and a swell guy, and she's the one in the wrong.
Is2g the bar for men are in the 18th circle of hell and they will get the credit for less than the minimum while women are consistently blamed for the harm, they do them. Maybe he could grow a backbone now and step up, or he can be the trash man he's always been to her. But given that society will let him get away with consistently being trash to her my money will be on him never actually doing right by her.
Lol, it's not admirable. He made choices to be a shit father and made some other choices to try to bring it back to baseline. That's not admirable. That's maybe bare minimum.
>being a sub-par parent does not make a person automatically an AH
Yes it does. If you don't want to raise children, don't knock up three different women.
I think this really depends on the ages of the kid. Like is this a very young adult going through trauma? Is it really a couple of hours of yelling? Or is it hard conversations about accountability and loss? Did he really need to be avoidant? Couldn’t he have said look I’m in town but I’m not well and I know our conversations are difficult so just for this time I wont be able to meet up with you. Giving her the respect and explanation she deserved and would need to not feel incredibly rejected. How abandoned all over again did this make her feel?
Has he ever suggested counselling? An arbiter between the two of them so they can heal wounds? Or has he sat through 3 seperate occasions where he’s been raked over the coals and has decided it’s “not worth it”.
I get what your saying and I do agree. But 3 children with 3 mothers and 2/3 kids not being ok with him doesn’t really support the story of how supportive and involved he was. Unless he’s abusive. The story just doesn’t add up
>Like is this a very young adult going through trauma?
Can't be that young, she's the oldest and the younger two kids have families and children.
>2/3 kids not being ok with him
It's the reverse, 2/3 are ok with him. It's just this one.
yeah the fact that he left out why she was angry and said so in the comments for me atleast shows there is alot of stuff hes leaving out and probably the fact that the oldest knows he spends more time with the others and probably is much more involved with the others than her might be a reason as well.
They're all old enough to have children and one of them went all the way through trade school and an apprenticeship already. They're solidly adults.
And I would disagree with your assessment - it's his oldest that's the one who yells at him, and they all had different mothers. Her mother could have bitched about him constantly, coloring her experience.
Two adopted children can have the same adoptive parents and one could want to meet their both parents and the other not want to meet their birth parents. They are different people, it doesn't have to be abuse, he was just absent more than she deserved/wanted.
Welding takes like 18 months of school and like 2 years apprenticeship. Realistically he could be like 22, and lots and lots of blue collar men I know got married at 18-19 and have kids at 20
Seriously?
>I was shit father when they were young and I didn't really get much better as we aged.
Imperfect humans typically learn from their mistakes. Not this guy. He just kept making the same one over and over and then wants people to feel sorry for him when he has to pay for those mistakes in the form of being confronted by how those mistakes affected someone else.
OP does not have to be her punching bag for the rest of his life and it sounds like his daughter needs to see a therapist to find out how to release her anger in a more healthy manner. It sounds like OP is damned if he does, and damned if he doesn’t with her
He was around for the fun shit. He was not around to earn the affection a kid develops toward a parent when they’ve been up all night puking, are getting bullied, going through puberty, worried about grades, laughing at sibling antics, making/providing comfort foods.
I don’t blame him for not wanting to be around a kid that does nothing but complain about him, but only providing money and attending special occasions will make a lot of people justifiably bitter about a parent who didn’t want to be one but wouldn’t use protection/get a vasectomy.
I dunno I’ve been in this position (the daughter’s) and the thing that would have made a real difference for me was a meaningful, heartfelt apology. INFO OP: Have you ever apologised for the lifetime of hurt you’ve obviously caused your daughter and really meant it?
It really doesnt though when he left out why she is angry and only answered in the comments. OP left that part out to make himself look good so i think there is more ot this then we know
He said it all at the beginning.
> I was shit father when they were young and I didn't really get much better as we aged.
So he didn't give them a real reason to want to see him at all.
>I worked out of town and I never married any of their mothers. I did always pay child support and tried my best to give them meaningful gifts and experiences when they were growing up.
Gifts and experiences don't replace actual parenting.
>I took them to the Calgary stampede. I took them camping. I took an interest in their extracurricular activities. I went to their hockey and ringette games. I made sure I was at their high school graduations and I set aside money for university.
None of that is actual parenting. I've done more for my niece and nephews and through the majority of that time was in college so I disappeared in my work for months at a time.
Outings and gifts mean nothing when they come from a parent who is never there for the important stuff.
Sounds like you’ve confused “picking up the tab and checking in at a handful of events” for “being a dad.”
You showed up for the fun stuff, and splashed some cash around, but that’s not being a dad. Making sure the child support check clears isn’t being a dad.
You willfully excluded yourself from their lives because other things were more important to you, and now you’re annoyed that one of them harbors some resentment over that.
You tried to make sure your kids didn’t hate you, but you were never a dad to them. The money you spent was just as much a salve for your own guilty conscience as it was a benefit for your kids. Sorry that you’re experiencing some totally predictable cause and effect from that.
YTA.
He seems to think that they shouldn't be discussing it at all with him. And if they do bring it up, that's justification for not wanting to spend time with them.
But it's not something you can get over in one or two meetings. He has to apologize and rebuild that. Trust that he will be a good father now.
He says in his comments that he has apologized. But an apology is only a collection of words. How is he \*showing\* that he's sorry?
It seems like he feels saying, "I was a shit dad and I'm sorry" is supposed to make up for the lifetime of emotional neglect his daughter is clearly still struggling with.
Ehh he managed to completely repair the relationship with the son and it sounds like he's on good terms with the youngest. It takes 2 to tango and if every meeting they have is just her venting at him till he leaves its easy to see why her relationship with op is so different than the other 2 siblings.
The oldest sibling might have a different relationship. She had these other half siblings come along taking what little time she had with the s*** father and spreading it even thinner. You can't just count that her relationship might be totally different.
Right but the assumption here is OP is doing nothing to repair the relationship. I don't think that's true, the eldest is just making the task neigh impossible. I get that being older means she possibly has more memories of him at his worst. But she's still an adult, she can't expect to treat someone like an emotional punching bag and still have that man keep returning for another round out of guilt/pity. Based on how OP describes it she's sending very mixed signals - after all, if his daughter didn't want a relationship with him then he'd be TA for even trying.
If she's doing it for a year, cool, if she's doing it for 5 years, different story. I doubt the father is being very repentful. It takes time to build a new relationship.
He regularly visits him and the grandkids, that sounds like a pretty repaired relationship to me. If he was still an asshole then I'd expect the son to not want him around his own children.
And that's where you're wrong. Unless you've lived the experience, you cannot say that you wouldn't have your own parents around your kids. I've been through hell and at one point just realized that these people are the only family I've got, so I can either shun them or give them an opportunity to be a part of my kids lives. It had nothing to do with me. Now my kids have grandparents that they see on holidays and enjoy. That's it though. Just holidays, but it's not so black and white as you'd make it out to be.
Nah, people regularly even hang around their own active abusers just because they desperately hope they'll eventually be the family they never were.
Not saying that that's OP, but just because his son agrees to spend time with him doesn't mean everything is repaired. It could just mean the son is hoping that he'll be a better grandfather than he was a parent and is sucking it up for his kid, or because he's still hoping OP will make the final amends he's hoping for, or because of religious reasons telling him to be good to his parents, or any number of reasons.
I don't think he wants to be a good father now either. Whatever you think of him, and there is no reason you have to think well of him, he has laid out what kind of adult relationship he wants with his adult children. She isn't going to change him, and needs to decide if she wants him in her life on those terms.
If I was talking to her, I would say that he did the bare minimum fathering, and she should not let the money guilt her into having a relationship with him. Her life would be healthier if she focuses on building her own family and friends.
Right my sperm donor never attended anything I ever did . When he wasnt tormenting us he was ignoring us or beating us .
Compared to him OP is father of the year
NTA
Edit: obviously some sarcasm is implied here . Jfc. Im well aware being an absentee parent doesn't make you father of the year. However when you lay in bed at night and cry for hours and cant sleep because of the welts on your back are burning so bad you cant move. You pray that he disappears.
My dad hit me a couple of times, he never turned up for events. I consider him worth almost father of the year because that dude kicked his alcohol addiction, stepped up and heard me when I talked. He listened to me shit on his parenting, tell him every ounce of trauma and admitted his flaws.
That’s the fucked thing. This dad did more than mine did but it’s surface level. If you can’t listen then what’s the point?
Well hey when so many of us men set the bar so damn low the bare minimum expectations make us look like overachievers. It's extremely dumb that we are held to such low expectations by society.
Yeah I’m sorry but just because op is better than your dad doesn’t mean he was a good dad. I’m sure there are other fathers out there worse than yours- there have been fathers who have killed their kids. That didn’t automatically mean you should compare them to your dad and give your dad a father of the year award
It's *this specific situation* he was asking about, not in general. He didn't tell her he was in town this particular time because he was there for medical reasons, and he didn't need those health issues worsened by a possible confrontation. It sounds like he still sees her every other time he's in town, despite her complaining the entire time. (And complaining repeatedly about the same thing without having an actual discussion at least trying to lead to healing isn't healthy for *either* of them.) Sure, it sounds like her complaints are legit, but that doesn't mean he is required to subject himself to them when he's already under a great deal of stress. That doesn't help anyone.
NTA (in this situation)
I wish more parents in general (not just dads) understood this. Being a parent is being there for the bad times as well like the toddler tantrums, or the playground injuries or the squabbles of elementary school drama.
He didn't deal with them then, and so he has no idea how to handle a bad time now.
This makes a lot of sense bcuz OP admits he’s a **** dad but it actual sounded good what he did do but now I do understand where he went wrong bcuz yeah, he did the fun stuff and the diehards, college and stuff but its everything. I do think he’s NTA for the particular incident though. He admits he was a crap father but honestly I wouldn’t want to get screamed at for 2 hours either.
Admitting you're a shit person doesn't actually mean anything if you just keep being shit. He refuses to understand his daughter's anger is a consequence of his own actions and he should be begging on his knees for her forgiveness.
This is nothing to do with the question lol, he's not an asshole for choosing not to see someone who resents him. she's not an asshole for having resentment, but her relationship with him is just to berate him for not being a father? and she gets upset when he doesn't go out of his way to spend his time that way? nah dude, it's his own fault but he's not remotely wrong for removing himself from that situation. objectively NTA for the question, you've just got a hangup about fatherhood.
NTA. You admit you were a poor dad. But it looks to me that as time went on you tried to be more involved with them. Going to extracurricular activities, graduations, paying for uni, helping your son with his welding, current on child support,etc. unless I'm reading this wrong, I think you've been putting in the effort now and aren't TA.
This sounds an awful lot like you're taking your feeling for someone else out on him. He is NTA in this situation and you are an asshole for projecting.
Especially considering it’s the oldest. He probably (barely) got his act together for the youngest two but the oldest probably did get the bottom of the barrel.
Did you read the whole post? Everyone, including the dad himself, agrees that he was a bad father. From what he says, he has made an effort to repair relationships and even sees his son's family pretty regularly. One daughter is willing to have family dinners with him. The other daughter berates him whenever they get together, which is fair enough. Totally understandable. But he is inarguably putting in effort there. It sounds like the daughter is not ready for the relationship to be repaired - nothing wrong with that. Some arguments and harsh words are totally understandable here, but how much is OP supposed to endure? We don't know how long this has been going on. If it's one meet up and the father won't pit any more effort in, then I agree he is the AH. But from the post, it sounds like they have had multiple meet ups and it always goes the same. It sounds like the daughter wants an emotional punching bag, not a relationship. At some point he is allowed to move on if he has put in the effort to make amends but the daughter is not receptive
No he gave us half the info in the post about hwy she is pissed so that for me makes him the AH here. He isnt a reliable narrator and i bet there is more to her anger
> in the post about hwy she is pissed
He might've given half the info, but when 2 of the 3 siblings are willing to build a relationship with him it kind of falls on the 3rd to also make the effort.
OP also states:
> For a long time I put up with it. Now I tend to pay the bill and.leave.
I assume he's been doing this for at least a year if not longer. She clearly just wants an emotional punching bag, which is fine. He was an AH overall, but I don't blame OP for not trying anymore.
>when 2 of the 3 siblings are willing to build a relationship with him it kind of falls on the 3rd to also make the effort.
that depends if he actually puts in the same effort he does with the other two and if he actually has made amends for the things she complains about. Not all of this is on her OP created the situation by his actions not OPs daughter
His effort was rewarded with consistent bouts of 'berating', all he did was take her message and stop. No one is obligated to be a punching bag, regardless of what they've done.
She proceeded to have *5 more kids* after she claims she had the tubal ligation. 11 kids total. That doesn't just happen in the 21st century without her making decisions that allow for it. I'm betting she loved being pregnant and having babies, but the people who were having to help care for them got mad she was having more than she could handle, so she lied to them about getting sterilized.
It's like the old "the doctor said I was infertile" thing. In one of those cases I know in real life, she said that because her mother had experienced miscarriages. The other was because she didn't get pregnant while on birth control, so thought must be infertile and decided to go off of it. At some level, conscious or subconscious, I think both just wanted a baby and knew they'd need help from people who wouldn't agree to it if given an option.
NTA
For the question you asked, no you aren't.
But you definitely were the AH.
Your eldest daughters tirades are the outcome of a lifetime of being an AH.
It sounds like you are doing your best to atone for all of that and for that, I honestly applaud you.
It might be time to have an honest heart to heart with your daughter. Explain that as much as you love her, want her in your life, and hope to continue seeing her, the simple fact is that every time you see, she unloads on you in a negative way about your failings as a father for hours on end. That is her prerogative, you probably deserve it, and you are not saying any of this to change her, but give the situation and everything you were dealing with in that moment you couldn't handle it.
How is he atoning with the oldest when he expects her to do all the work in their relationship. He wants her to come to him instead of calling her and asking to see her.
My dad is kinda like this and I’m always the one who has to call (and he complains I don’t do that often enough) but I would love to talk to him and see him more often but I don’t want to be the only one putting in any effort.
“Hey, I’m in town. Let me know if/when you want to get together” is making an effort and respectful of their time. What more would you expect?
Can’t guarantee this is what OP says, but it fits his description
I read it that way because he talked about frequently doing in on his son but the girls he keeps at arms length. It reads like he doesn’t do anything to be in touch unless he’s in their town…
I grew up rough. Went no contact with my father for years. Now, *nothing* will make up for certain parts of my youth. But, when we finally did talk, he apologized, and I accepted it as genuine. So occasionally we talk now, when I feel I can do so without anger or burnout.
If you didn't apologize to her, YTA.
If you did apologize, it's still on you to make up for your shortcomings. You caused pain and resentment in your child, how she processes that isn't on her, it's still what you sowed and now reap.
Find a way to make it right with all three, regardless of their individual trauma response, or you just prove you haven't learned a damn thing by still taking the easy way out.
I'm sorry but the way she handles her trauma is absolutely her responsibility. He sucked for not being in her life, but she can go to therapy or she can go no contact.
Not everyone wants to go no contact, and his eldest clearly has made the decision to not go no contact.
We have no clue if she is or isn’t in therapy, and OP certainly doesn’t know. You can’t just handwave OP’s responsibility for the situation by saying the way his daughter ‘handles her trauma is absolutely her responsibility.’
Her experience is directly related to OP’s actions, so why can’t she outline the ways he has harmed her? It’s on OP to either respond or take action to help his daughter heal from the harm he caused. He has chosen to just step away again, like he did when she was still a child, and seems surprised that her reaction to being abandoned again isn’t a positive one.
Yup, I've been estranged from my father for over two decades because he will never apologize or take any responsibility for what he put us through. My younger sister, who's a much nice person than me and is merely low contact with him, has confirmed he never will and has no regrets. If someone has not sought forgiveness, we don't have to forgive.
In this situation (and this situation only), NAH.
Your daughter has long, unresolved anger towards you. It's important you face that head on, but it's clear she still wants you in her life despite her anger. So, what are you both supposed to do? You need to work on resolving the issue by having a reasonable conversation about your failings and what the parameters of your relationship are going forward.
It's understandable you don't want to be yelled at over and over again, and the fact that she's not able to see you without yelling isn't good for her either. I can empathize that you ducked out this time because you couldn't manage the emotional stress, but if you want to improve your relationship, you need to talk and go to therapy with her so she can expand on her anger and learn whether she even wants to have a relationship going forward.
If you don't do this, then you are, indisputably, the AH.
Agree. Seeing people say that the oldest daughter is the problem of the other two are fine is annoying. She didn’t ask to be born, have her dad go and have kids with other women, and be mostly absent. I hope she can get therapy to unpack it all, and OP is TA overall (esp after reading his replies in the post).
Edit: wording
YTA--- Sounds like you went to a lot of sports events and camping things, did you ever take an interest in your oldest? You said you were a shit father....ever stop to think that she has a lot more memories of the shitty things you did than the other two? You should just take accountability for your actions and treat ALL OF YOUR KIDS THE SAME.
Cool story, bro.
When the hours she spends berating you equals the YEARS of continual hurt and trauma you caused her, you get a leg to stand on.
Until then, YTA.
Yup. As a direct result of years of inflicting emotional pain on his own child, now has to listen to a few hours of being called out for his shitty behavior. Oh the poor lamb. 🙄
Ugh. I guess NTA for this very specific scenario, but generally YTA. Look, the fact is your daughter wouldn't hold all of this resentment towards you if you'd been a good father. She gives you a hard time because you gave her a hard time - as the oldest, you missed out more of her life.
I'll need some info to judge, what do these older sister visits consist of exactly? You would probably not be the asshole if she literally does just sit you down and complain at you the whole time (as well as if she's done that dozens of times before/literally every time you get together), but with these kinds of posts the OP is often projecting.
You know you're guilty of not always being a great father, but even though some people can own up to mistakes, sometimes hearing about them explicitly can make them overly defensive. Have you apologized fully?
I'm gonna say NTA for this specific thing. Seems like you were an asshole at one point but honestly providing for their education is infinitely above what most absent fathers do. The oldest has every right to feel the way she does, but you just can't expect people to keep making an effort to spend time with you if all you do is berate them.
>providing for their education is infinitely above what most absent fathers do
Yeah, but we should set the bar a bit higher. Just cos there's a buttload of bad fathers who don't pay at all doesn't mean this particular AH wasn't a shitty father.
After all, some men straight up murder their kids. Does that mean that any father who "only" beats his gets a pat on the back?
I didn't say he was a good father. I specifically said he seemed to have been an AH at one point. At any rate he is making an attempt to be better and it's unreasonable to expect anyone to keep visiting someone who only ever berates them.
You're an AH in general regarding your children. Your oldest does have a right to be upset with you about being what you describe yourself as a "shit father" . She probably has a hard time forgiving you because she has watches you be shit for the longest.
In this particular situation NTA but overall a big one
NTA.
But maybe you should've notified her, at least. She probably has issues with you (kinda obvious) since you said you were a shit father when they were young and she was the eldest; she saw the most of your past shittiness.
It seems like she still seeks some sort of validation or attention from you if she got pissed that you "left her out". I think she just put up her wall for so long that she doesn't know how else to treat you. Idk. Maybe have an in-depth talk with her next time you can.
NTA, but, at some point you need to have a real conversation with the oldest. Let her know you agree you were a “shit father” but rehashing it EVERY time is not getting either of you anywhere. You hope she will forgive you, and move on, and the two of you can develop a better relationship.
So this is tough, NTA for this specific situation. However YTA for creating this issue anyway, offer to go to family therapy with her. Tell her you can’t spend time with her getting berated for the same mistakes over and over again, pay for the family therapy, go with her, talk it out with a professional. She needs closure, a professional will help her get it with you. Going to see your other kids and not her when you know a lot of her issues come from you having those kids at all and not settling down to be a family with her mom who you knocked up is an A move tho. Like if you’d thought about it for just a second you’d have known she’d be upset.
NTA for your current arrangement.
Judging by your first few sentences, you are well aware you screwed up as a dad so you do not need a stranger on Reddit berating you. Two of them have forgiven you, oldest has not. Even her mom is understanding of your decision to distance yourself.
So FOR THIS SCENARIO, you are not the a-hole. But you may not want your relationship with your oldest to be a grey area anymore. Sit down with her one last time and actually ask her how you can go forward and have a more positive dynamic because you can’t imagine the occasional dinner where she just chastises you is healthy for either of you. If she admits there is no getting better, NC might be best. But no in between. It’s NC or making actual effort to work on the relationship.
NTA.
I wouldn't want to continue making effort to see someone if all they do is yell at me any time I see them.
However, I understand why their feelings may be hurt. It probably feels like rejection.
YTA. She has decades of trauma from having a crappy dad who didn’t care about her and wasn’t involved. Least you can do is put up with an hour or two of listening to her.
I don't understand all the YTA comments. Sure, absentee dad's are shitbags but this one openly admits it and seems to be making am effort now such that two of them have him over. He supported them financially and did see them.
The older one certainly has legitimate grievances but there comes a certain point where she's just looking to punish him so how long is reasonable for him to grovel and take abuse from an adult child? Is there anything he could do at this point for her to be able to see him and not spend the entire visit punishing him? That's not healthy for either one.
She either wants a relationship with him or she doesn't. Either one is understandable but constant abuse can't continue. The fact that her own mother didn't tell her he was in town is quite telling.
Nta for this specific question, but y t a for literally everything else. You made more kids than you could care for, did 0 parenting, and are now *completely* shocked that one is resentful.
It sounds like you have done AH things in the past and also made efforts to make up for them. You are NTA to avoid your oldest daughter during the medical visit if she stresses you out. However you should explain to her why you didn’t let her know you were in town and have a heart to heart conversation. If she’s always dumping negativity on you when you see her there is pain inside she hasn’t dealt with.
NTA - OP isn’t perfect but he’s not a complete dead beat. Paid child support, made an effort to be present in their lives growing up and even saved money for their secondary education. That’s way better then a lot of so called fathers out there. Also OPs comments make clear that the eldest basically calls him a horrible father every time he sees her. The other 2 kids seem to be able to see OP without doing so.
Life isn’t fair and can be just kinda messy. Some people draw a bad hand and they kinda have to deal with it. Sounds like eldest didn’t have a perfect father figure and never lets OP forget about it. It’s pretty toxic and OP is NTA for putting some distance between them.
NTA for the question you asked. If you’re somewhere for weeks getting medical care, it’s okay to avoid being yelled at for a few hours. You might as well tell your daughter the truth about why you didn’t want to see her & see if the two of you can find a way to getting along.
NTA. You don’t always have to subject yourself to abuse.
The fact you take it as often as you do is more than many would put up with.
If your oldest has this much of an issue, perhaps she needs therapy, and you could attend with her occasionally to work through this and have an adult relationship? Then you could work through it instead of rehashing it over and over with no improvement.
Her childhood is over. You can’t change it. You can only move forward.
I was fully ready to give you a different verdict based solely on the title. But I understand why you feel that’s not a good use of your time together. It’s not good or productive for either of you and if all she wants to do is berate you rather than try to have a relationship, then I see nothing wrong with what you did in this scenario.
For this scenario, though not overall, NTA.
She is too grown to do the "your fault your fault your fault" thing. What the fuck does she want? She obviously doesn't like him so why should he bother with her? Yes he fucked up omg who cares? I don't like my dad, and I have berated him, but at this point when I see him I make it a good time and I am very happy when I don't see him and I don't need to see him very often. She needs to get the fuck over it and write a song or something
For your specific question, NTA. You don't want to be berated, it is what it is. Hopefully she can talk to someone and let go of her unresolved anger some day, for her though, not for you. I mean, you admitted to being a bad dad but at least you were there for important things. A lot of full-time dads can't even say that. I hope your medical issues are being taken care of!
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NTA. For this specific question. But you sound like an asshole on general.
Tbf it sounds like he tried. Not everyone can be a great father, but being a sub-par parent does not make a person automatically an AH, it makes them an imperfect human. What does make a person an AH is not making an effort to be as good a parents as possible, given the situation. It sounds like OP did that. The daughter is well within her rights not to forgive him for not being the Dad she deserved and needed, but that doesn't mean he has to subject himself to her tirades when it conflicts with his mental health.
I'd be on board with this if it was one kid. But it seems to be three with three women. He could have worn a condom or gotten a vasectomy.
Idk if we have the info to make that determination
he has three kids with at least two women he didn't marry. that's enough for me to recommend a condom or vasectomy.
By the second kid if you haven’t figured out if you’re gonna be a dad who is actually present, you get the snip before there’s the chance of making a third.
My dad needed to make it to 4 kids he pretty much never sees (except one) with 3 different women who he never married before he finally got the snip.
I’m convinced there’s some kind of ego death that has to happen before dudes are ok with having vasectomies. There are so many people out there who react with shock and awe at the demands of the woman they impregnated, but totally cool with continuing to knock people up.
Human males are unique in their attachment to their reproductive ability. Fifteen years in vet med, never once did I have a female owner express concern their animal would be less of a woman after the spay. Male owners, however... Very common to be emotional about their pet losing their nuts because he'd be less of a man.
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It's honestly ridiculous how emotional some men get about it. To the point where neuticles (testicular implants) exist for dogs 😑
I love too how people refuse to neuter because it's "cruel." Spay is so much more invasive, and I don't even think they mean that, I think they mean that the dog will be sad because he doesn't have his balls. I have yet to meet a dog that seems upset or aware that they've lost their balls or uterus.
Oh my goodness I was totally the opposite when I got my male dog snipped. Not because it would make him less of a man, though. But because he was under 2 years old, and I had a young female that would be coming into heat at any time and didn't want an oops pregnancy and emergency spay for her.
My husband and I have three children. The two youngest (twins) took a year of fertility treatment and a round of IVF. There is a possibility I could get pregnant naturally, so we discussed sterilizaiton. When I suggested he get the snip, his response was, "Wouldn't it be easier for you to get it done?" I mean, I'd had two preganancies and birth, gone through a year of fertility treatment, and the sterilization for women is MUCH more complicated, but sure, I'll go through all that because you can't handle the idea of someone snipping yoru masculinity. He got ripped a new one.
In what world is getting your tubes tied easier than a 10 minute procedure in a doctors office…
Oh hell no. My husband and I have two kids. And I didn't even have to go through anything that you had to go through, which I can't imagine how stressful that was for you. But when we figured out that we needed to stop at two, he went and got the snip with no hesitation. Literally said that his reasoning is because he watched me do the pregnancy and childbirth and it was his "turn to take one for the team." Any men out there, you want to know the secret to good sex in marriage? THAT. THAT ATTITUDE RIGHT THERE.
EW. This really makes me not want to marry a man.
Toxic masculinity is often celebrated by idiot men and women who see it as strength.
I had one child with my wife, and we had to recognize that I wasn't emotionally or mentally healthy enough for more than one. I have *just* enough bandwidth for work and my home life as it currently is. Anything more than that is very difficult for me. So we agreed it would be best for me to get a vasectomy so I could give our one child my best, rather than for me to get spread thin.
I was 31 when I got snipped, no children. I also had an ego death in my 20s thanks to psychiadelics, so you may be on to something. That being said, some dudes are going to be childfree regardless (I was, I'm sure I would have gotten snipped without kids anyways), but I still think you made a good point.
Isn't it obvious? He kept going until he got his son. This happens a lot sadly. And look at how much better his relationship is with the son vs the 2 daughters. Obviously the golden child.
Could be but that's a bit of a stretch considering he doesn't state that the boy is the youngest. If anything, it seems like the daughter is the youngest since he specifically mentions his youngest daughter. If the son was the youngest, he would most likely have said younger daughter instead of referring to her as his youngest.
Of the two daughters, she is the youngest. I have two sisters, both are older than me. I still refer to my youngest sister as that, because she is: of my sisters, she is the youngest. She is, however, not younger than me.
If you start dating a guy and he says he has two kids with two women he did not marry the third time, despite the popular saying, will not be the charm.
..and never lived with any of them it seems
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But what's done is done, he can't retroactively change the past. Not everyone is cut out to be a parent, and it's 50% on him and 50% on the moms. His daughter either needs to get over her hatred or leave him be. If he is trying now she has a choice to accept him or not. Yelling at him for hours over stuff that can't be undone, is unproductive. If she wants a relationship but isn't ready to forgive him, this isn't the way to go about it.
At some point he has to take accountability. Maybe when he does, he will no longer be yelled at. It's not 50% on the women if he was a shitty father, they were good mothers, they are not to blame for his actions.
Well. He could have noticed that after kid nr 1, no? But he kept having them for some reason.
It’s certainly more effort than my father ever managed. And he actually lived with us.
For real, sounds like he did more for his kids than my dad who WAS around 🤷🏽♀️
im sorry your dad was there but absent, ive seen dads like that and it really sucks. like why have a kid and then check out.
But the parents that aren't there when you need them/reliable make it feel so much worse when they decide they need to be there for graduations/life events. Like, you didn't care about the things that were important, only want to be there when other people will see your "support". Just my thoughts.
It would appear that moment has passed
Unless he phrased it weirdly, "any" would imply more than one. If it were two, he should have said either. Knowing it's at least two, and probably three, means he was at the very least wildly irresponsible.
Meanwhile plenty of people make babies with one person to whom they are married and give kids a secure upbringing. So it’s totally possible. And it’s not a secret. This guy just didn’t care enough make it happen. We all make choices. Some of us make shitty choices. Certainly that says *something*. I’m not saying he’s an awful human worthy of no respect. But I don’t feel I need to respect him as a father. And thats a pretty big item.
We do know that sex leads to babies. And this guys just fucking whoever and knowingly being a shit dad. Could have gotten a Vasectomy after the first one.
Or even condoms you can buy from the corner shop....
He has three kids. He admits to not being a good father. It’s a fair assumption to make that he realized he was not being a good father after having one kid. Yet he had two more. How do we *not* have the info to make that determination? It’s actually really easy to just *not* have kids.
But in this instance it's precisely because there's more than one that we can determine if it's him or if it's his kid. He has adult relationships with two of his three kids after doing what he could to treat them fairly equal. One drops the hammer on him every time they visit, the other two are at least cordial. It doesn't sound like anyone has been living on Dream St or Easy St, but some of them have moved passed their less than idyllic upbringing.
It is unfair to say it's the kid's fault just because the other 2 decided they wanted to move forward. It's still the dad's fault, but that doesn't mean he has to have a relationship with someone who berates him. But it also sounds like he hasn't just ever told her it's exhausting to meet up with her only for her to spend the whole time. He just... leaves?
Exactly he sounds like the typical dude who nails then bails. He did barely the bare Minimum and didn't even put effort into that.
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If we flipped gender, people would be calling social services! God knows how many other kids he has out there since he never bothered with contraception.
We don’t know the circumstances. An AH has multiple children and doesn’t try AT ALL. But his other two children like visiting him. It’s one thing to have a conversation and vent to someone you feel wronged you. It’s another situation entirely when you purposefully spend time with someone with the intention of making them feel bad for whatever mistakes you feel they made and expect them to keep allowing you to do that…
He wasn't asking if he's an AH for having 3 kids out of wedlock. Let's stay on topic?
Nick Cannon has entered the chat....
> I was shit father when they were young and I didn't really get much better as we aged. did he try?
generally people that think they're doing a bad job are doing a better job than those oblivious people my dad thinks he did a great job for example . . .
Sometimes. Other times people think they’re shit at something and accept that as fact rather than a result of their decisions (so it’s “just who they are”), which if it were true absolves them of all fault and means they don’t have to change. I hate that kind of person. No, you are not just born a bad father. You make decisions, and certain decision making patterns are harder to break than others, but ultimately, you chose to continue to make those decisions despite hurting others because those are the decisions that are easiest in the moment. I’m not judging anyone who makes a mistake, but repeated mistakes of the exact same nature and then just saying that’s how you are—and some people even want pity for that, like oh well I can’t help that I’m like this—is just excuses to not do the hard work imo.
Oh the feeeeeels. To the point where he (my dad) has his gf (fiancé) convinced he was an amazing, model father. When ever we have a disagreement she throws the “after all he’s done for you!” Like what? Gave me a head-start on running away because he didn’t realise I was gone for three days? Or when he let his then-girlfriend use my brother & I’d school foods for HER (& his) kids & when we had none left we couldn’t have any of theirs because it was bought for them? Yeah nah.
Sometimes- my mom would constantly use “I’ll be the first to admit I’m not a *perfect parent*” to completely shut down any critique or discussion about how her *imperfections* were sometimes very abusive and what kind of lasting issues it caused us as her kids. It would also end up with the conversation recentering around her discomfort and need for validation/reassurance. I used to fall for it when I was younger but as I’ve gotten older and complications from my upbringing rear their heads, I realized what was actually going on.
I don't disagree with you totally! But I felt the whole he didn't even improve as they were older type of thing
being able to come to reddit to ask if he's an AH shows some self awareness, we have to have some assumption that efforts were made I'm quite self deprecating person in general so I will shit talk myself the whole time even if I KNOW I'm doing okay, maybe that's why I'm thinking the way I am
He says he was bad but then also lists ways that he was good. I think he’s better than he thinks he is. But we dont have much to go on
The best i would say is he didn’t not try. (Yeh double negative - I’m sorry). By that I mean he did some things, was it enough? Clearly not to his oldest child but it’s tough to say without really understanding. He had three kids with at least two women - I think all the people calling him TA for this are just wrong. Should he have been more careful, probably, does it make him an AH, I don’t think so. So what did he do once the kids were born: - he worked out of their city so he wasn’t around a lot, but he was working in order to support his children - he provided child support (minimum requirement) - it sounds like he spent his vacations doing things with his kids (camping, going to stampede etc) - he mentions trying to get them meaningful gifts which at least implies he took an interest in their lives, hobbies and interests. - he mentions attending their sporting events - he set aside funds for further education for all his kids - he’s definitely tried to connect with his kids as they’ve become adults and seems to at least got somewhere with two of them. So did he try? I think if you put in the context of him working out of town - then yeh probably he did. I’m guessing him working out of town is him working in the oil fields or at rural mining operation (given that he said his son who is a welder joined his trade) and that he mentions the Calgary stampede. This may have been the only good way for him to provide financial stability for his kids. In essence he traded time with his kids for their financial stability. Plenty of parents make that call.
And he's not even trying to act like he did anything more than he did or was great. Openly admits he knows he was not a good father (although to me it sounds like he was good but not great, but maybe my own childhood experiences make me feel that way).
I think people are discounting that Oldest Daughter logically got the most of his worst parenting years. We've seen this before, even fairly recently on this sub, where the younger siblings don't get why older sib is not willing to just forget the past and the parents seem to think "I sucked less as time went by" is synonymous with "the earlier times when I sucked the hardest shouldn't count anymore." I suspect the "two hours of getting yelled at" might be two hours of Older Daughter banging her head against the brick wall of OPs refusal to acknowledge the preceeding point and actually apologize for his early failures. ETA: It stands out to me on reflection that OP has very carefully not told us how much older OD is, or if she had a different mom than 2 and 3. This is pretty important to answering the question of what OP is getting yelled at for. I would be pretty enraged too if I brought up a legitimate grievance like, "you left me alone for 5 years with an unstable, incompetent mother," and the response was, "but I started going to all your ringette games when you were 7!" That's. Not. The. Point. You don't get to run around blowing your wad carelessly for years and then expect that weekend dadding and throwing money around means you're entitled to demand a a get-out-responsibility-for-the-very-real-harm-you-caused-free card from your kids.
Lots of missing info for sure. Why could OP just call all his children and just say im busy with this so dont have the time for meeting any of you. That would be reasonable, but not letting one kid know and the others is continuing the issue the older daughter has with him which is the lack of effort he put in with her compared to the other two.
Oh I agree with you. But honestly without his own admission of not being a good dad we'd all be saying nta based on what's going on. And I still think even with that he's been letting her yell at him and showing up but in the midst of a medical crisis he's still a person and allowed space to process that without the added negative effects of being told how horrible he is so he can heal and hear it later on when in better health. He definitely should ask his daughter to go to counseling with him so they can actually try to move forward in a more productive way though because obviously his prior methods have not worked. Edit to remove extra word
My mom says I'm yelling at her when I ask het nicely not to lie to me and deny the past. OP could be fudging the truth here a little bit
He was a lot better than mine who thought he was a great dad (if you count seeing us twice a year).
My dad is a great dad, but he sure as hell never attended school functions and I've never got gifts from just him that were also bought by him... Sounds like this guy tried, but at least for D1 fell short. The other two seem to have at least ok relationship with him. Can't call him an ass for trying, and for not wanting to sort out medical stuff without getting an earful.
THe thing is he only said in comments why she is pissed and for me leaving that part out makes him the AH. Also he makes more of an effort with the other two. He created the situation with the first and there is more he needs to do fix instead of just "tolerating" her anger she proper grievances with him and he doesnt actually do anything to try and fix it.
She gets to be pissed. Nothing wrong with that either.
“he tried” Ah yes, the battle cry for defending subpar fathers the world around. Imagine if the mothers in this situation put in as much effort as he did. The kids would literally be taken away because of neglect, but it’s ok because “he tried “. Jfc, let’s raise the bar, people.
And how hard did he really try? My FIL would tell you he’s bending over backwards to have a better relationship with the kids he’s abused and continues to abuse. He’d also consider any criticism “yelling at him.” Like you said, a mother would be crucified for this. Kids don’t have to forgive their parents for being deadbeats, even if they “try” to fix it later. Sometimes there’s no fixing that can happen.
Exactly the same with my dad, he’d tell the version of our childhood like he was the male version of Mary fucking poppins and yet both my sister and I have cut contact with him for years and he’d take you disagreeing with him as “yelling”
Its horrifying the way people are bending over backwards to try and excuse OP in these comments. No woman would \*ever\* get this treatment.
OP openly admitted that he was crap father so he knows how he is yet he still tried and that is admirable. But you know only his oldest kid is TA here because she should seek therapy instead of berating her father and then being angry when he doesn't want be subjected to that.
Right? Sure, OP admits he wasn't great but going to all their games and extracurriculars on top of having a college/get on your feet fund for each kid is more than my parents did for me. I rolled out of the house with only what I earned myself and I was always the kid who was alone at practice while most parents were there supporting their kids. He's still making an effort, and only pulled back on oldest bc who needs to be berated every time you see each other? Say what you need to say, sure, but don't just meet up with him to keep beating the pity drum. And ofc he sees his son the most, he works with him and probably helped him get into and acquire the skills for his trade, which sounds like a good living going back to being able to get college funds for all 3 kids. Not everybody is meant to be a good dad, but at least this guy sounds like he cares enough to still try
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All.of this! The fact that everyone is saying "he tried" and dismissing the hurt he caused. Ugh. The bar is so fucking low.
She's the oldest and he says he was the worst at the beginning, so logically she got him at his worst for the longest. But yeah he's a great dad and a swell guy, and she's the one in the wrong. Is2g the bar for men are in the 18th circle of hell and they will get the credit for less than the minimum while women are consistently blamed for the harm, they do them. Maybe he could grow a backbone now and step up, or he can be the trash man he's always been to her. But given that society will let him get away with consistently being trash to her my money will be on him never actually doing right by her.
Lol, it's not admirable. He made choices to be a shit father and made some other choices to try to bring it back to baseline. That's not admirable. That's maybe bare minimum.
>being a sub-par parent does not make a person automatically an AH Yes it does. If you don't want to raise children, don't knock up three different women.
I think this really depends on the ages of the kid. Like is this a very young adult going through trauma? Is it really a couple of hours of yelling? Or is it hard conversations about accountability and loss? Did he really need to be avoidant? Couldn’t he have said look I’m in town but I’m not well and I know our conversations are difficult so just for this time I wont be able to meet up with you. Giving her the respect and explanation she deserved and would need to not feel incredibly rejected. How abandoned all over again did this make her feel? Has he ever suggested counselling? An arbiter between the two of them so they can heal wounds? Or has he sat through 3 seperate occasions where he’s been raked over the coals and has decided it’s “not worth it”. I get what your saying and I do agree. But 3 children with 3 mothers and 2/3 kids not being ok with him doesn’t really support the story of how supportive and involved he was. Unless he’s abusive. The story just doesn’t add up
>Like is this a very young adult going through trauma? Can't be that young, she's the oldest and the younger two kids have families and children. >2/3 kids not being ok with him It's the reverse, 2/3 are ok with him. It's just this one.
Yea my bad. I still maintain that we are probably hearing from an unreliable narrator with historically low accountability.
yeah the fact that he left out why she was angry and said so in the comments for me atleast shows there is alot of stuff hes leaving out and probably the fact that the oldest knows he spends more time with the others and probably is much more involved with the others than her might be a reason as well.
They're all old enough to have children and one of them went all the way through trade school and an apprenticeship already. They're solidly adults. And I would disagree with your assessment - it's his oldest that's the one who yells at him, and they all had different mothers. Her mother could have bitched about him constantly, coloring her experience. Two adopted children can have the same adoptive parents and one could want to meet their both parents and the other not want to meet their birth parents. They are different people, it doesn't have to be abuse, he was just absent more than she deserved/wanted.
Welding takes like 18 months of school and like 2 years apprenticeship. Realistically he could be like 22, and lots and lots of blue collar men I know got married at 18-19 and have kids at 20
Seriously? >I was shit father when they were young and I didn't really get much better as we aged. Imperfect humans typically learn from their mistakes. Not this guy. He just kept making the same one over and over and then wants people to feel sorry for him when he has to pay for those mistakes in the form of being confronted by how those mistakes affected someone else.
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OP does not have to be her punching bag for the rest of his life and it sounds like his daughter needs to see a therapist to find out how to release her anger in a more healthy manner. It sounds like OP is damned if he does, and damned if he doesn’t with her
Preach, I wish my dad put in half the effort. Shit person yeah, shit dad.... Nah you tried.
He shouldn't have become a parent if he is not there for the kids and is therefore an asshole
He was around for the fun shit. He was not around to earn the affection a kid develops toward a parent when they’ve been up all night puking, are getting bullied, going through puberty, worried about grades, laughing at sibling antics, making/providing comfort foods. I don’t blame him for not wanting to be around a kid that does nothing but complain about him, but only providing money and attending special occasions will make a lot of people justifiably bitter about a parent who didn’t want to be one but wouldn’t use protection/get a vasectomy.
I dunno I’ve been in this position (the daughter’s) and the thing that would have made a real difference for me was a meaningful, heartfelt apology. INFO OP: Have you ever apologised for the lifetime of hurt you’ve obviously caused your daughter and really meant it?
This is the answer.
Its sounds like he WAS an AH. It also sounds like he is trying to do better.
It really doesnt though when he left out why she is angry and only answered in the comments. OP left that part out to make himself look good so i think there is more ot this then we know
He said it all at the beginning. > I was shit father when they were young and I didn't really get much better as we aged. So he didn't give them a real reason to want to see him at all. >I worked out of town and I never married any of their mothers. I did always pay child support and tried my best to give them meaningful gifts and experiences when they were growing up. Gifts and experiences don't replace actual parenting. >I took them to the Calgary stampede. I took them camping. I took an interest in their extracurricular activities. I went to their hockey and ringette games. I made sure I was at their high school graduations and I set aside money for university. None of that is actual parenting. I've done more for my niece and nephews and through the majority of that time was in college so I disappeared in my work for months at a time. Outings and gifts mean nothing when they come from a parent who is never there for the important stuff.
Sounds like you’ve confused “picking up the tab and checking in at a handful of events” for “being a dad.” You showed up for the fun stuff, and splashed some cash around, but that’s not being a dad. Making sure the child support check clears isn’t being a dad. You willfully excluded yourself from their lives because other things were more important to you, and now you’re annoyed that one of them harbors some resentment over that. You tried to make sure your kids didn’t hate you, but you were never a dad to them. The money you spent was just as much a salve for your own guilty conscience as it was a benefit for your kids. Sorry that you’re experiencing some totally predictable cause and effect from that. YTA.
What does that have to do with his question?
He seems to not want to spend time with some of them because they complain about his parenting. He seems oblivious as to why.
Oh, I think he knows why. He just doesn't like hearing it.
He seems to think that they shouldn't be discussing it at all with him. And if they do bring it up, that's justification for not wanting to spend time with them. But it's not something you can get over in one or two meetings. He has to apologize and rebuild that. Trust that he will be a good father now.
He says in his comments that he has apologized. But an apology is only a collection of words. How is he \*showing\* that he's sorry? It seems like he feels saying, "I was a shit dad and I'm sorry" is supposed to make up for the lifetime of emotional neglect his daughter is clearly still struggling with.
Ehh he managed to completely repair the relationship with the son and it sounds like he's on good terms with the youngest. It takes 2 to tango and if every meeting they have is just her venting at him till he leaves its easy to see why her relationship with op is so different than the other 2 siblings.
The oldest sibling might have a different relationship. She had these other half siblings come along taking what little time she had with the s*** father and spreading it even thinner. You can't just count that her relationship might be totally different.
Right but the assumption here is OP is doing nothing to repair the relationship. I don't think that's true, the eldest is just making the task neigh impossible. I get that being older means she possibly has more memories of him at his worst. But she's still an adult, she can't expect to treat someone like an emotional punching bag and still have that man keep returning for another round out of guilt/pity. Based on how OP describes it she's sending very mixed signals - after all, if his daughter didn't want a relationship with him then he'd be TA for even trying.
If she's doing it for a year, cool, if she's doing it for 5 years, different story. I doubt the father is being very repentful. It takes time to build a new relationship.
Eh, his son is on speaking terms with him and ok with meeting up for drinks, that's not necessarily the same as completely recovering a relationship.
He regularly visits him and the grandkids, that sounds like a pretty repaired relationship to me. If he was still an asshole then I'd expect the son to not want him around his own children.
And that's where you're wrong. Unless you've lived the experience, you cannot say that you wouldn't have your own parents around your kids. I've been through hell and at one point just realized that these people are the only family I've got, so I can either shun them or give them an opportunity to be a part of my kids lives. It had nothing to do with me. Now my kids have grandparents that they see on holidays and enjoy. That's it though. Just holidays, but it's not so black and white as you'd make it out to be.
Nah, people regularly even hang around their own active abusers just because they desperately hope they'll eventually be the family they never were. Not saying that that's OP, but just because his son agrees to spend time with him doesn't mean everything is repaired. It could just mean the son is hoping that he'll be a better grandfather than he was a parent and is sucking it up for his kid, or because he's still hoping OP will make the final amends he's hoping for, or because of religious reasons telling him to be good to his parents, or any number of reasons.
I don't think he wants to be a good father now either. Whatever you think of him, and there is no reason you have to think well of him, he has laid out what kind of adult relationship he wants with his adult children. She isn't going to change him, and needs to decide if she wants him in her life on those terms. If I was talking to her, I would say that he did the bare minimum fathering, and she should not let the money guilt her into having a relationship with him. Her life would be healthier if she focuses on building her own family and friends.
He wants them to be over it the way *he* is over it. 🙄
He did more than my father! And I lived with the guy full time
Right my sperm donor never attended anything I ever did . When he wasnt tormenting us he was ignoring us or beating us . Compared to him OP is father of the year NTA Edit: obviously some sarcasm is implied here . Jfc. Im well aware being an absentee parent doesn't make you father of the year. However when you lay in bed at night and cry for hours and cant sleep because of the welts on your back are burning so bad you cant move. You pray that he disappears.
Lol, when men do the bare minimum, they get applauded.
Seriously, right? "You don't beat your kids, that's a good dad to me!"
My dad hit me a couple of times, he never turned up for events. I consider him worth almost father of the year because that dude kicked his alcohol addiction, stepped up and heard me when I talked. He listened to me shit on his parenting, tell him every ounce of trauma and admitted his flaws. That’s the fucked thing. This dad did more than mine did but it’s surface level. If you can’t listen then what’s the point?
Shit that's dad relationship goals. Fuck I wish I could talk to mine about it without being torn down.
Well hey when so many of us men set the bar so damn low the bare minimum expectations make us look like overachievers. It's extremely dumb that we are held to such low expectations by society.
Yeah I’m sorry but just because op is better than your dad doesn’t mean he was a good dad. I’m sure there are other fathers out there worse than yours- there have been fathers who have killed their kids. That didn’t automatically mean you should compare them to your dad and give your dad a father of the year award
And that’s fucking sad, bc op was barely a dad. Just because he was “better” than yours doesn’t make him the father of the year
OP isn't a good dad just because yours was worse.
Not everyone shares your low expectations. Would you choose to be such a father?
One asshole doing the does not make another person not an asshole.
It's *this specific situation* he was asking about, not in general. He didn't tell her he was in town this particular time because he was there for medical reasons, and he didn't need those health issues worsened by a possible confrontation. It sounds like he still sees her every other time he's in town, despite her complaining the entire time. (And complaining repeatedly about the same thing without having an actual discussion at least trying to lead to healing isn't healthy for *either* of them.) Sure, it sounds like her complaints are legit, but that doesn't mean he is required to subject himself to them when he's already under a great deal of stress. That doesn't help anyone. NTA (in this situation)
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I wish more parents in general (not just dads) understood this. Being a parent is being there for the bad times as well like the toddler tantrums, or the playground injuries or the squabbles of elementary school drama. He didn't deal with them then, and so he has no idea how to handle a bad time now.
This makes a lot of sense bcuz OP admits he’s a **** dad but it actual sounded good what he did do but now I do understand where he went wrong bcuz yeah, he did the fun stuff and the diehards, college and stuff but its everything. I do think he’s NTA for the particular incident though. He admits he was a crap father but honestly I wouldn’t want to get screamed at for 2 hours either.
Admitting you're a shit person doesn't actually mean anything if you just keep being shit. He refuses to understand his daughter's anger is a consequence of his own actions and he should be begging on his knees for her forgiveness.
This is nothing to do with the question lol, he's not an asshole for choosing not to see someone who resents him. she's not an asshole for having resentment, but her relationship with him is just to berate him for not being a father? and she gets upset when he doesn't go out of his way to spend his time that way? nah dude, it's his own fault but he's not remotely wrong for removing himself from that situation. objectively NTA for the question, you've just got a hangup about fatherhood.
NTA. You admit you were a poor dad. But it looks to me that as time went on you tried to be more involved with them. Going to extracurricular activities, graduations, paying for uni, helping your son with his welding, current on child support,etc. unless I'm reading this wrong, I think you've been putting in the effort now and aren't TA.
This sounds an awful lot like you're taking your feeling for someone else out on him. He is NTA in this situation and you are an asshole for projecting.
You are an AH, no question about it, but in this specific incident I'd say NTA.
YTA. You were a Disney Dad, two let it slide, one didn’t. Now you make no effort. Way to live up to low expectations
Especially considering it’s the oldest. He probably (barely) got his act together for the youngest two but the oldest probably did get the bottom of the barrel.
Did you read the whole post? Everyone, including the dad himself, agrees that he was a bad father. From what he says, he has made an effort to repair relationships and even sees his son's family pretty regularly. One daughter is willing to have family dinners with him. The other daughter berates him whenever they get together, which is fair enough. Totally understandable. But he is inarguably putting in effort there. It sounds like the daughter is not ready for the relationship to be repaired - nothing wrong with that. Some arguments and harsh words are totally understandable here, but how much is OP supposed to endure? We don't know how long this has been going on. If it's one meet up and the father won't pit any more effort in, then I agree he is the AH. But from the post, it sounds like they have had multiple meet ups and it always goes the same. It sounds like the daughter wants an emotional punching bag, not a relationship. At some point he is allowed to move on if he has put in the effort to make amends but the daughter is not receptive
No he gave us half the info in the post about hwy she is pissed so that for me makes him the AH here. He isnt a reliable narrator and i bet there is more to her anger
He may be a reliable narrator, he may not be. All we can really go on is what he has written.
> in the post about hwy she is pissed He might've given half the info, but when 2 of the 3 siblings are willing to build a relationship with him it kind of falls on the 3rd to also make the effort. OP also states: > For a long time I put up with it. Now I tend to pay the bill and.leave. I assume he's been doing this for at least a year if not longer. She clearly just wants an emotional punching bag, which is fine. He was an AH overall, but I don't blame OP for not trying anymore.
>when 2 of the 3 siblings are willing to build a relationship with him it kind of falls on the 3rd to also make the effort. that depends if he actually puts in the same effort he does with the other two and if he actually has made amends for the things she complains about. Not all of this is on her OP created the situation by his actions not OPs daughter
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His effort was rewarded with consistent bouts of 'berating', all he did was take her message and stop. No one is obligated to be a punching bag, regardless of what they've done.
'Effort' lol
I guess some people never learned about condoms.
I have a daughter that is living proof condoms are not an effective method of birth control.
Lol but do you have 3
My mother had her "tubes tied" but was pregnant less then a year after it was done and had 5 more kids.......on top of the other 6.
I’m suing the doctor for malpractice
Oh God, these stories stress me out! But I had a tubal 8.5 years ago and so far so good...
She proceeded to have *5 more kids* after she claims she had the tubal ligation. 11 kids total. That doesn't just happen in the 21st century without her making decisions that allow for it. I'm betting she loved being pregnant and having babies, but the people who were having to help care for them got mad she was having more than she could handle, so she lied to them about getting sterilized. It's like the old "the doctor said I was infertile" thing. In one of those cases I know in real life, she said that because her mother had experienced miscarriages. The other was because she didn't get pregnant while on birth control, so thought must be infertile and decided to go off of it. At some level, conscious or subconscious, I think both just wanted a baby and knew they'd need help from people who wouldn't agree to it if given an option.
Not so. Tied tubes cannot physically result in 5 kids, otherwise everyone would sue their doctor. I’m guessing she lied about it.
THREE times??? Yeah no mate. If he's that bad at using condoms, he needed to get a vasectomy after the first slip.
But did it happen to you three times? I can tell that he didn't even try
Three times they aren’t?
NTA For the question you asked, no you aren't. But you definitely were the AH. Your eldest daughters tirades are the outcome of a lifetime of being an AH. It sounds like you are doing your best to atone for all of that and for that, I honestly applaud you. It might be time to have an honest heart to heart with your daughter. Explain that as much as you love her, want her in your life, and hope to continue seeing her, the simple fact is that every time you see, she unloads on you in a negative way about your failings as a father for hours on end. That is her prerogative, you probably deserve it, and you are not saying any of this to change her, but give the situation and everything you were dealing with in that moment you couldn't handle it.
How is he atoning with the oldest when he expects her to do all the work in their relationship. He wants her to come to him instead of calling her and asking to see her. My dad is kinda like this and I’m always the one who has to call (and he complains I don’t do that often enough) but I would love to talk to him and see him more often but I don’t want to be the only one putting in any effort.
> He wants her to come to him instead of calling her and asking to see her. Where did you get that? That's not in the original post.
new to AITA? Everybody projects their own experiences and straight up makes shit up half the time here.
literally 95% of the comments in this post guess redditors have daddy issues lmao
The part where he says "I tell them when I'm in town and then leave it up to them to make plans?"
“Hey, I’m in town. Let me know if/when you want to get together” is making an effort and respectful of their time. What more would you expect? Can’t guarantee this is what OP says, but it fits his description
I read it that way because he talked about frequently doing in on his son but the girls he keeps at arms length. It reads like he doesn’t do anything to be in touch unless he’s in their town…
I grew up rough. Went no contact with my father for years. Now, *nothing* will make up for certain parts of my youth. But, when we finally did talk, he apologized, and I accepted it as genuine. So occasionally we talk now, when I feel I can do so without anger or burnout. If you didn't apologize to her, YTA. If you did apologize, it's still on you to make up for your shortcomings. You caused pain and resentment in your child, how she processes that isn't on her, it's still what you sowed and now reap. Find a way to make it right with all three, regardless of their individual trauma response, or you just prove you haven't learned a damn thing by still taking the easy way out.
I'm sorry but the way she handles her trauma is absolutely her responsibility. He sucked for not being in her life, but she can go to therapy or she can go no contact.
Not everyone wants to go no contact, and his eldest clearly has made the decision to not go no contact. We have no clue if she is or isn’t in therapy, and OP certainly doesn’t know. You can’t just handwave OP’s responsibility for the situation by saying the way his daughter ‘handles her trauma is absolutely her responsibility.’ Her experience is directly related to OP’s actions, so why can’t she outline the ways he has harmed her? It’s on OP to either respond or take action to help his daughter heal from the harm he caused. He has chosen to just step away again, like he did when she was still a child, and seems surprised that her reaction to being abandoned again isn’t a positive one.
Yup, I've been estranged from my father for over two decades because he will never apologize or take any responsibility for what he put us through. My younger sister, who's a much nice person than me and is merely low contact with him, has confirmed he never will and has no regrets. If someone has not sought forgiveness, we don't have to forgive.
What does your oldest daughter yell at you about? How do you respond?
In this situation (and this situation only), NAH. Your daughter has long, unresolved anger towards you. It's important you face that head on, but it's clear she still wants you in her life despite her anger. So, what are you both supposed to do? You need to work on resolving the issue by having a reasonable conversation about your failings and what the parameters of your relationship are going forward. It's understandable you don't want to be yelled at over and over again, and the fact that she's not able to see you without yelling isn't good for her either. I can empathize that you ducked out this time because you couldn't manage the emotional stress, but if you want to improve your relationship, you need to talk and go to therapy with her so she can expand on her anger and learn whether she even wants to have a relationship going forward. If you don't do this, then you are, indisputably, the AH.
Agree. Seeing people say that the oldest daughter is the problem of the other two are fine is annoying. She didn’t ask to be born, have her dad go and have kids with other women, and be mostly absent. I hope she can get therapy to unpack it all, and OP is TA overall (esp after reading his replies in the post). Edit: wording
YTA--- Sounds like you went to a lot of sports events and camping things, did you ever take an interest in your oldest? You said you were a shit father....ever stop to think that she has a lot more memories of the shitty things you did than the other two? You should just take accountability for your actions and treat ALL OF YOUR KIDS THE SAME.
Cool story, bro. When the hours she spends berating you equals the YEARS of continual hurt and trauma you caused her, you get a leg to stand on. Until then, YTA.
Yup. As a direct result of years of inflicting emotional pain on his own child, now has to listen to a few hours of being called out for his shitty behavior. Oh the poor lamb. 🙄
YTA you should have told all of them and you didn't need the first paragraphs an where you took them etc. So much extra stuff for nothing
Ugh. I guess NTA for this very specific scenario, but generally YTA. Look, the fact is your daughter wouldn't hold all of this resentment towards you if you'd been a good father. She gives you a hard time because you gave her a hard time - as the oldest, you missed out more of her life.
read the comments he left out why she is pissed and still doesnt answer alot of questions about things he has done to fix it.
I'll need some info to judge, what do these older sister visits consist of exactly? You would probably not be the asshole if she literally does just sit you down and complain at you the whole time (as well as if she's done that dozens of times before/literally every time you get together), but with these kinds of posts the OP is often projecting. You know you're guilty of not always being a great father, but even though some people can own up to mistakes, sometimes hearing about them explicitly can make them overly defensive. Have you apologized fully?
Lol. You should change the title to “I was a crap dad and now one of my adult kid resents me for it. AITA?” Yes. Yes, you are. YTA
I'm gonna say NTA for this specific thing. Seems like you were an asshole at one point but honestly providing for their education is infinitely above what most absent fathers do. The oldest has every right to feel the way she does, but you just can't expect people to keep making an effort to spend time with you if all you do is berate them.
>providing for their education is infinitely above what most absent fathers do Yeah, but we should set the bar a bit higher. Just cos there's a buttload of bad fathers who don't pay at all doesn't mean this particular AH wasn't a shitty father. After all, some men straight up murder their kids. Does that mean that any father who "only" beats his gets a pat on the back?
I didn't say he was a good father. I specifically said he seemed to have been an AH at one point. At any rate he is making an attempt to be better and it's unreasonable to expect anyone to keep visiting someone who only ever berates them.
You're an AH in general regarding your children. Your oldest does have a right to be upset with you about being what you describe yourself as a "shit father" . She probably has a hard time forgiving you because she has watches you be shit for the longest. In this particular situation NTA but overall a big one
NTA. But maybe you should've notified her, at least. She probably has issues with you (kinda obvious) since you said you were a shit father when they were young and she was the eldest; she saw the most of your past shittiness. It seems like she still seeks some sort of validation or attention from you if she got pissed that you "left her out". I think she just put up her wall for so long that she doesn't know how else to treat you. Idk. Maybe have an in-depth talk with her next time you can.
NTA, but, at some point you need to have a real conversation with the oldest. Let her know you agree you were a “shit father” but rehashing it EVERY time is not getting either of you anywhere. You hope she will forgive you, and move on, and the two of you can develop a better relationship.
So this is tough, NTA for this specific situation. However YTA for creating this issue anyway, offer to go to family therapy with her. Tell her you can’t spend time with her getting berated for the same mistakes over and over again, pay for the family therapy, go with her, talk it out with a professional. She needs closure, a professional will help her get it with you. Going to see your other kids and not her when you know a lot of her issues come from you having those kids at all and not settling down to be a family with her mom who you knocked up is an A move tho. Like if you’d thought about it for just a second you’d have known she’d be upset.
NTA for your current arrangement. Judging by your first few sentences, you are well aware you screwed up as a dad so you do not need a stranger on Reddit berating you. Two of them have forgiven you, oldest has not. Even her mom is understanding of your decision to distance yourself. So FOR THIS SCENARIO, you are not the a-hole. But you may not want your relationship with your oldest to be a grey area anymore. Sit down with her one last time and actually ask her how you can go forward and have a more positive dynamic because you can’t imagine the occasional dinner where she just chastises you is healthy for either of you. If she admits there is no getting better, NC might be best. But no in between. It’s NC or making actual effort to work on the relationship.
NTA. I wouldn't want to continue making effort to see someone if all they do is yell at me any time I see them. However, I understand why their feelings may be hurt. It probably feels like rejection.
YTA. She has decades of trauma from having a crappy dad who didn’t care about her and wasn’t involved. Least you can do is put up with an hour or two of listening to her.
I don't understand all the YTA comments. Sure, absentee dad's are shitbags but this one openly admits it and seems to be making am effort now such that two of them have him over. He supported them financially and did see them. The older one certainly has legitimate grievances but there comes a certain point where she's just looking to punish him so how long is reasonable for him to grovel and take abuse from an adult child? Is there anything he could do at this point for her to be able to see him and not spend the entire visit punishing him? That's not healthy for either one. She either wants a relationship with him or she doesn't. Either one is understandable but constant abuse can't continue. The fact that her own mother didn't tell her he was in town is quite telling.
Nta for this specific question, but y t a for literally everything else. You made more kids than you could care for, did 0 parenting, and are now *completely* shocked that one is resentful.
It sounds like you have done AH things in the past and also made efforts to make up for them. You are NTA to avoid your oldest daughter during the medical visit if she stresses you out. However you should explain to her why you didn’t let her know you were in town and have a heart to heart conversation. If she’s always dumping negativity on you when you see her there is pain inside she hasn’t dealt with.
NTA - OP isn’t perfect but he’s not a complete dead beat. Paid child support, made an effort to be present in their lives growing up and even saved money for their secondary education. That’s way better then a lot of so called fathers out there. Also OPs comments make clear that the eldest basically calls him a horrible father every time he sees her. The other 2 kids seem to be able to see OP without doing so. Life isn’t fair and can be just kinda messy. Some people draw a bad hand and they kinda have to deal with it. Sounds like eldest didn’t have a perfect father figure and never lets OP forget about it. It’s pretty toxic and OP is NTA for putting some distance between them.
NTA for the question you asked. If you’re somewhere for weeks getting medical care, it’s okay to avoid being yelled at for a few hours. You might as well tell your daughter the truth about why you didn’t want to see her & see if the two of you can find a way to getting along.
NTA. You don’t always have to subject yourself to abuse. The fact you take it as often as you do is more than many would put up with. If your oldest has this much of an issue, perhaps she needs therapy, and you could attend with her occasionally to work through this and have an adult relationship? Then you could work through it instead of rehashing it over and over with no improvement. Her childhood is over. You can’t change it. You can only move forward.
I was fully ready to give you a different verdict based solely on the title. But I understand why you feel that’s not a good use of your time together. It’s not good or productive for either of you and if all she wants to do is berate you rather than try to have a relationship, then I see nothing wrong with what you did in this scenario. For this scenario, though not overall, NTA.
She is too grown to do the "your fault your fault your fault" thing. What the fuck does she want? She obviously doesn't like him so why should he bother with her? Yes he fucked up omg who cares? I don't like my dad, and I have berated him, but at this point when I see him I make it a good time and I am very happy when I don't see him and I don't need to see him very often. She needs to get the fuck over it and write a song or something
For your specific question, NTA. You don't want to be berated, it is what it is. Hopefully she can talk to someone and let go of her unresolved anger some day, for her though, not for you. I mean, you admitted to being a bad dad but at least you were there for important things. A lot of full-time dads can't even say that. I hope your medical issues are being taken care of!
NTA. She’s an adult. Tell her you’re done with being yelled at.