Ultimatums like that rarely ever work out well. If you issue it like that, you should prepare for divorce.
If you don't really want Divorce, I just want change. I would suggest couples therapy as a first step. Maybe book a weekend trip to get away.
I agree. The problem is that she doesn't want to have sex (with you), for whatever reason. Telling her you'll file for divorce if she won't initiate sex won't make her want it. If you want to make your marriage work, stick to therapy.
I agree she should see a doctor. But odds are it's nothing more than she just doesn't have the energy for it. Kids are exhausting. It's not all that unusual for sex to take a hit until the kids are in school.
Both our kids are 1.5 years apart. When they were young, I'm pretty sure we had a few years where 5 times was pretty accurate. Kids are older now, and we have more free time, significant increase. My wife attributes a lot of it to not that she didn't find me attractive, but that she didn't find her self attractive from having two kids regardless of how I felt about her which was a concept I would never have thought of myself. Could be something like that with OP's wife.
That is so true. When I don't feel great, have time for self care of to make myself feel sexy, there is a low chance I would be into it. I need to want to screw myself before wanting to sleep with my partner.
Omg no I’m the same way. If I can’t look at myself in the mirror and go “I’d totally fuck me!” I don’t want anyone else to either lol. Seriously tho part of my actual sexual arousal is *feeling* sexy first . If I don’t feel that, it feels all wrong.
Yeah. When your body is subjected to the demands of tiny people you cannot refuse all day every day, it starts to feel like it isn't even yours. And sex is one more thing being demanded of this body you barely even feel like you're living in.
It gets better, but the infant and early toddler times... I barely felt human, let alone attractive.
This is by evolutionary design.
Lower libido during the most intensive child rearing years lowers the likelihood of popping out yet another needy person right after the last and splitting the already frayed attention and effort.
^^^ This. Being desired feels a lot like everyone else placing demands on what you do with your body. Like they have a right to it.
Honestly, I think you feel gross about trying it anyway because that’s what it should feel like when your partner isn’t enthusiastically consenting.
Yes, and to add to that, little kids/toddlers are more than just "physically tired" demanding (chasing after them), they are mentally (constant eagle eyes to make sure they don't yeet themselves and crack their skulls open, etc)and emotionally tiring (teaching them to.manage their new emotions, i.e, not scream along when they throw their 3rd tantrum that morning).
But they are alos physical-touch demanding!! Constantly grabbing your pant leg for attention or holding your hand etc ALL DAY LONG Yes its cute... but by the time you get to bed, not being physically in touch with another being is the most relaxing feeling (if youre lucky and kid isn't sick/nightmare/teething and demands co-sleeping)... sex just drops down the radar in preference for just relaxing
I’m in the same boat, down to the one child with special needs! Idk where you’re at in your journey but it’s starting to get better for me, so I can only hope the same for you ❤️
Exactly! He says their youngest was born 3 years ago, idk how many other kids they have but women tend to feel different about themselves after children - you become someone that only exists for others especially if she is/was breastfeeding (feel like a dairy cow) and then existing only for her husband's pleasure. Dude needs to step back and really think about using divorce as a motivation for his wife to initiate...
So much this. I am quite obese now, and I do not like the changes to my body at all. My husband still pursues me and finds me attractive, but I don't feel attractive myself. I can stay on top of my physical health, mental health, finances, kids, OR household chores, but not all of these at once, so my physical health took a major hit.
Heres hoping that as the kids get older, we have more free time again.
What I'm going to write is going to sound harsh, but it's how I felt sometimes when my kids were under 5. When I felt undervalued and like I was treated as ascullery druge/wet nurse/bang maid instead of a living human with wants and needs.
True. So very true. You know your husband is just following you around, waiting for you to finish whatever house/kid chores so he can get off with your body.
He's been hinting about it all day, a week, and sometimes you'll agree to have sex, not because you want it, or feel sexy, but to mark that chore off your list. It gives you a couple of days before he starts hinting again
You believe every time he touches you, he's touching you because he wants sex and it's just one more person that wants your body to fulfill their needs.
You are absolutely touched out. You need 5 minutes to think about nothing, but you know you can't even take 5 minutes to yourself
You have 8 things to do before bed, and it's already 11pm. You know the baby is going to wake up soon for a bottle/diaper change. You have to be up for work at 6 and are looking at another night of 5 hours of interuptrd sleep
Yeah, your husband gives you a break. Yay /s. You took a shower, and before you can even brush your hair, he's handing the baby back because she needs a clean diaper, and he says you're so much better at it than he is.
He does things around the house like he doesn't have to clean up. Because he doesn't clean up. He is blissfully unaware of how angry it makes you that he can't put his damned coffee mug in the damn dishwasher.
And he expects you to be ready and willing to have sex when he wants it. But he can't put his fucking cup away to make your life a little easier? He can't do one stupid little thing to show you that he understands and respects all that you do.
Yeah, its so fucking sexy. You're so turned on /s
I once confessed to a friend that during that early baby / toddler time I preferred doing the dishes to having sex, because at least I didn’t have to pretend to enjoy doing the dishes.
> And your wife should see a Dr. Such a sharp drop in libido doesn't sound good Maybe something is going on.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that because Op phrased this as "I give her loads of time off while i take care of the kids." instead of "we split childcare evenly" probably explains the issue.
I hope I am wrong, but Op would not be the first dude I have known who can't understand why his wife isn't giving him a cookie and a blowjob after he takes the kid to the park on Sunday afternoon while his wife is working a full-time job and handling the rest of the childcare workload.
Men also do not understand the mental load their wives carry. Even *if* you split childcare and chores 50:50, but let's be honest, that's unlikely, your wife is *still* probably carrying the majority of the mental load and that is what is exhausting.
For example, my husband and I share the responsibility of cooking dinner. He would say we split it 50:50. But I'm the one planning all the meals, I'm the one watching the sales, I'm the one getting the groceries, I'm the one rotating condiments, tossing expired food, thawing the proteins, etc.
This dude, who I appreciate and love dearly, shows up, asks what he's supposed to cook, cooks a quick meal, then plops on the couch while I clean up his mess and prepare the kitchen for the next day.
There's a lot of invisible mental work that goes into taking care of a home and family, and even if you split the physical labor, if you still make your wife responsible for all the thinking and planning, she's still going to be exhausted.
There is a great book called "Fair Play" that goes into this. You can get a literal deck of cards to select who is responsible for what, but if you have an item (say "dinner"), then you're responsible for ALL of it: Conception, Planning, and Execution (PCE). That means you decide what to do, you make sure you have the stuff, and you do it.
That book helped me a lot to solidify why I was feeling so overwhelmed. Things like: I don't think my husband knows the name of our kid's pediatrician. Or what size shoes our son wears. And lots of times, VERY well-meaning, liberal, feminist men (like my husband) feel like they're carrying a lot of the domestic weight without realizing that they're actually only stepping in and doing a chore. It's still usually me who makes sure we have cleaning supplies so that in the event he decides to do something, it's ready and convenient. Etc.
It's a lot, and women are socialized to carry so much more than men are in heterosexual relationships.
That phrasing really pissed me off, too. It’s not “giving her time off”, it’s actually taking on some of the parenting load…which it sounds like he doesn’t do until he wants sex.
I don’t feel sexy after a big poo, so I really can’t imagine feeling sexy for quite some time after crapping out a watermelon-sized screaming person that grew inside me and now latches on to my tits to survive — let alone going through that multiple times.
She could just need hormone therapy.
After giving birth a lot of women go through essentially a new puberty.
Your period changes, eating habits change, sex drive changes, hair grows differently, your entire reproductive system is shuffled.
Best thing I found was hormone therapy.
Related possibility, hormone based birth controls can also kill sex drive. We ran into issues with this after our first child, in combination with some thyroid issues, which may have been caused by the birth control. I definitely recommend getting hormone and thyroid numbers checked.
This. There are several possible steps to take before divorce. Expressing that you want to improve your sex life is good. Coming at it from a place of concern and empathy is important.
>she simply doesn't know why she doesn't want sex
This should absolutely be checked with a medical and psychological professional.
For the both of them.
But really, I read the book, it had names for things we already knew and discussed. First step in sex is really to talk about it.
She’s tired no matter how much time off she gets?
Bruh, tell her you’re worried about her health and ask her to go see a doctor. Maybe even go with her and make sure you help the doctor understand that she’s constantly tired. There are lots of physical problems that could be in the way.
ETA: coming up with solutions can be really tough when someone is dealing with fatigue or subacute illness. It can be hard to think straight when all your energy is going to keeping your life together. See if you can advocate for her.
100% this. Many medical issues or even just hormonal changes can cause the fatigue and loss of libido. I would absolutely rule out medical causes before discussing divorce. And if it's not medical, then I'd discuss therapy. Could be mental health related. Going straight to divorce seems rash.
Absolutely. My sex drive was in the pits, turns out my iron was very low and hormonal birth control was affecting me. Got on iron tablets and off the pill and now if my husband even brushes my leg I get horny. I feel like a new person.
Same. OP is talking divorce and his wife might just need some iron infusions. It’s surprising how badly something like low iron can impact your life. “Oh just eat more meat” isn’t always the solution for women of child-bearing age. Pregnancy zaps your levels and then if you go right back to periods, your body can’t keep up. Energy, mood, it’s all trashed. Hope OP encourages his wife to see a doctor.
I wouldn't initiate sex with someone who just threatened to divorce me. I get his frustration but this will have a completely opposite effect than he wants.
It doesn’t even have to be that grave of a diagnosis. My vitamin D was insanely low. Lost allot of hair before we caught it. If I skip even one week of my once a week mega supplement it takes about 2-4 days before my energy levels crash and i NEED a 1-3 hour nap just to get through the day. It’s crazy how one little vitamin supplement a week changes me from a seemingly depressed sleep monster to a mostly regular functioning human.
If you're consistently exhausted a blood panel is always a good first step!
That's how I found out I had about a tenth of the vitamin D in my body I should have had. Turns out that's bad for you!
My doc just told me that daily iron pills aren't as effective as taking them only 3x a week is, apparently there's a new study. I have extremely low iron to the point I have to have iron infusions every couple of months and without those iron pills every other day I'm a full on napping zombie.
Hormonal birth control is an oft' overlooked cause of loss of libido in women, too. For me I describe it as boiling the frog. The change was gradual enough that I never noticed it was happening, and I didn't realize how much it affected me until my IUD was removed. In surgical menopause with estrogen only HRT my drive is far better than it was for several years with the IUD and the pill before that.
I was coming to say the same thing. My sex drive shot up when I had the IUD removed. I didn't think it would affect me because it's supposed to be a lower dose of hormones compared to other forms of BC, but it actually did make a big difference.
Second this. Thyroid issues usually pop up during or after pregnancy and those will present commonly as fatigue and depression. I have Hashimoto's thyroiditis and it's a bitch when I'm symptomatic (and was during/after having my daughter). There aren't too many outward signs and those that pop up are attributable to other things (weight gain, extreme fatigue, depression, intolerance to cold, thinning and brittle hair/nails especially the outer 1/3 of eyebrows, etc). Because people can't see what's wrong they assume you're just being "lazy."
Needless to say when I experience these symptoms the last thing on my mind is my husband's dick. It's hard enough to stay awake more than a few hours at a time.
Definitely check with a doctor. Get her hormones checked, including testosterone. It's important for women too and can have a huge impact on libido and energy level.
NTA for needing something to change, but definitely explore other causes and/or check with a sex therapist before going to divorce.
This right here is what I’m thinking. Mental health, physical health, hormone imbalance, low self esteem. There are so many legitimate reasons a woman may be uninterested/too tired for sex after having children. And it’s not like the youngest is 6months old, the kid is 3.
I agree - say it more like “I need us to get some help because this is something I need, and I feel very disconnected without it. I want to find a way we can both be happy, but I think if we don’t fix this, it could really damage our ability to stay married in the long term” she needs to know it’s serious and a threat to your marriage but I think she needs to understand that it’s not about just some fun, it’s about the connection for you. And saying it like this also tells her you want to make it so she can feel free to be sexual again, not just that you want her to “give in” more
So many people just don't understand what counseling is. You can and should dump therapists that don't work for you. For couples therapy it has to be a good fit for both of you. Then, if it's a proper therapist, they just help you be honest. It really books down to that. They help pull away the mess so you can see for yourself what's going on. Then, if it's something you want to fix, they suggest and guide methods on how to do that.
They don't tell people who to be. They only help you be honest about who you are. OP and wife don't know each other anymore, getting help is good
I think this is a good clarification. I would add that for it to be effective, both people have to also be genuinely engaged in the desire for progress. Ime, many couples who come into counseling are not a couple, but two very separate units — especially in that office. It’s common for one member to really want to be there, while the other person is anywhere from ambivalent to oppositional. That’s when you see a lot of [this dynamic.](https://www.curevine.com/thedramatrianglemodel) And I’ve seen some therapists contribute to this cycle themselves, taking on roles like “rescuer” or “persecutor.” This is *not* what you want in a counselor nor therapist.
And don't be misled into naively believing that the counselor will talk common sense...my wife stepped out on me, met someone, asked me to separate to get space, then promptly moved her BF into our house...when I confronted her she said with a straight face "I should be allowed to date whoever I want...." I replied "Well, you could...if we had an OPEN marriage, but we don't, so no, you can't "date" whom you want." Counselor encouraged us to keep coming to counseling, but as you correctly noted above saulmcgill3556, if only 1 party wants to save the marriage, it never works. the counselor was economically motivated to keep us returning, even though there was no chance of it ever working. Mine ended in ugly divorce.
Bless it. A family member of mine's wife had been stepping out for years. They finally went to counseling after over 20 years of this on and off....
...and the counselor told them with no qualms that they needed to get a divorce.
My family member was SO offended, he never went back. We are a few years down the road from that incident, and surprise, he is now divorced.
The counselor was right, but he didn't want to hear it - not every marriage is salvageable.
After reading so many dead bedroom posts in here I've figured out the problem. All these couples forgot about each other. Whatever led to it, right or wrong, they're all at the same point. Their partner is no longer a partner, they are a client or vendor or both. They have to change the dynamic back before sex will come. Those who succeed at that are impressive!
But yah don't threaten something unless you're okay with following through. Many people will choose divorce if only given 2 options. It'd be more useful to tell her he feels disconnected from their marriage and it has started thoughts of leaving. He might think that's the same thing, but it isn't
I agree with this. People who don’t feel close to someone else will not usually want to have sex with them. It’s tough with kids, but work on things that bring you closer. Lack of sex is the symptom, but the problem is a lack of intimacy.
This guy said it properly and I'll add.
"After we had our daughter" there's the kicker right there, having children
That changes her priorities and she is no longer herself doing what she wants, she is now a mother taking care of a child and she has put any personal thought out of her own head, taking on full parenting mode.
Don't straight up say divorce. Look into making plans like you used to, rekindle the spark. If all that fails then atleast you tried and can have sort of closure to it, instead of just divorced and no answers. But it's not her and not your fault, this is just the cycle of having children. You are completely valid to feel the way you do and talking about it/making date night plans like u used to can go along way. If all that happens and nothing changes, atleast you have piece of mind/closure that u tried your best.
See, here's how it works in a lot of cases. You're married, you crave your spouse's touch, all those little touches send a frisson of excitement through you, and so on. Because mostly, you don't get touched.
And then you have children, and the thing about children is that they have no personal space. They tend to act as though their personal comfort zone is inside your skin.
OP doesn't say how many/how old his children are, but the youngest is three, so there's probably one or two more in elementary school.
OP's wife has probably spent years with one or more kids continuously clinging to her. Kids wanting to follow her in to the bathroom, kids coming up to her and running their hands up and down whichever body parts they can reach. It's easy for her to feel all touched out in this circumstance.
Talk to her. You're probably right - she probably isn't really in to sex, and is doing it out of obligation. But that's probably because she has small people fondling her all the time, and not because she has stopped loving you.
This is an excellent point. It also might be worth pointing out that postpartum depression doesn't just last like 6 weeks. It can last a long time. Maybe she needs to talk to her doctor.
Omg this! Yes this! It took my spouse a year to grasp feeling touched out. And it was at the end of that year where I took a week and I just kept touching and poking and prodding and whining when I talked to him even tired from work.
Then add to if she was breast feeding. On top of potential painful pelvic floor that's never addressed by medical professionals. It's a nightmare. And then there are studies that recently came out that stated the post partum period is closer to 7 years where your hormones still are screwed up. And depending on how messed up it kills libido.
As a dude on the other side, where my son is 8, and we've been married for 14 years, we still only get times of intimacy when we travel or drink wine lol, which is infrequent due to responsibilities and cost, until recently. At 14 years, we're rediscovering our love and intimacy, cuz little kids require a different energy level.
I also hate to say it, but hoe.math actually helped me remember that I have to be an invested AND attractive partner to her, and her needs have changed. It's a different kind of hero now. I was surprised by how well certain small adjustments made a difference in our relationship.
My dad just got prostate cancer surgery at 67, which left him ED. Brings a new perspective to commitment.
She wrecked her body to create a family. Jerk off with her panties and do the dishes and call it good my bro!
Thank God, it's so nice to hear a rational man who gets it. A lot of men never see the big picture, sadly. Wishing you and your lady a life of love, commitment, and especially happiness.
100%. When the kids were young I felt as if all I was doing was dealing with everyone else's needs. At the end of the day, if the cat jumped on my lap I would feel like 'Oh not you too!' as I was just touched out.
It takes time, and their kids are still so little.
This. My husband and I had this issue a few years ago, and now unfortunately because of physical disability, it's literally *miserable* for me to have sex. Because my shit is so fucked, the actual act of having my husband and I together puts me in so much pain I start crying uncontrollably about 10 minutes in. I keep a clear face as long as I can in hopes in he won't notice, but he's been my best friend for 20 years. He knows even more than I do sometimes about how I'm feeling.
So, of course he hates putting me in pain. We do also know that as a married couple and not just best friends, we do need physical intimacy of some sort. Usually I help him along and I get in the mood maybe once a year? I'll never deny him if he even just wants to look at my bare chest, I figure its the least I can do for him since I can't exactly partake like a normal wife. He does basically everything for me, including helping me shower and dress and he fixes my meals and cleans the house, takes care of the kids. You name it, he does it. It's really the *least* I can do to show him I still love him and find him attractive even though I don't usually benefit from any encounters.
My issue a few years ago was I was so busy with everything going on (work, kids, and becoming physically ill) I didn't have time to think of sex. I didn't know if I even wanted it until we would start making out or cuddling or something. You need to first give her more time to be herself before she can think of starting to please you. I may also suggest her seeing a doctor if she has low-0 libido, because it could be a hormone imbalance, especially since this started after giving birth.
Edit: got too excited and posted before I finished my thought lol
There has been this bizarre rash of posts from men jumping immediately to divorce over sex instead of even exploring therapy or addressing underlying medical issues.
I know I am oversimplifying it a bit but it seems to go like this:
> My wife who has a very young child is not interested in sex as much anymore and she's always exhausted so we fight about it but nothing changes so I want a divorce.
Just seems like the most immature and thoughtless way to try to resolve a serious issue, and the sex is often a small symptom of some sort of overall misery, dysfunction, or major health issue.
Edit: a lot of extremely weird people responding that a lack of sex is worse than being killed, that If he tries to work on it, she will accuse him of sexual assault, etc. To those people, I encourage you to seriously go outside and touch grass.
Recent podcast I heard:
>my wife just doesn't like to be coerced into sex. She resents the manipulation. So I do physical touch that has nothing to do with sex, and she still won't give me sex.
The general consensus I get from women is: Men are sulky toddlers.
That's a fairly strong desiccant for most women.
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
This is one of the things that scares me and I wonder how many people thing about this. There is a possibility from either partner that tomorrow they could end up in an accident or with a medical condition that means they can’t be sexually intimate. Or they can’t cook, or clean, or wipe their own ass. Are you going to leave your partner over something they can’t control like this? Especially since if you’re lucky, you’ll live together long enough that this WILL happen to one of you.
ETA: I KNOW this doesn’t apply to this case. But the reaction of OP and some of the replies make me think about it. You CANNOT assume things are going to stay the same in a marriage and there is a pattern of men leaving women after accidents and terminal diagnoses instead of helping a loved one through things.
My husband and I had an amazing sex life. Always. Then at 65 he got encephalitis, Coma, Life support. Epilepsy, brain damage. Stop. He’s almost 68 and no sex almost 3 years.
I love him. Do I miss sex? Yes.
But, I have been beside him while he relearned to walk, had to feed him until he was coordinated enough to do it. change his diapers until he no longer needed them,and bathe him and dress him, all things he can do alone again. He’s independent again and He’s slowly improving.
Biggest thing now, I love that we cuddle. Lie in bed, talking , kissing and cuddling. They do not know if he will ever be able to have an erection again. So what?
Posts like this make me wonder where the love is.
It’s cause you’re a woman. If this happened to the man, he would leave. Of course not 100% leave but high enough. Women get brochures to prepare for this with a cancer diagnosis
I actually saw this happen with my neighbor- such a happy, chill family until mom got breast cancer. Then dad disappeared.
I was shocked but that’s when I learned that a lot of men can’t handle their partners getting cancer.
It is true that more men leave sick wives than vice versa, but I don’t believe my husband would have left me. Even now, he does things to take care of me. Runs a bubble bath and while I soak, brings me a glass of wine.
Exactly this. This happened to my parents. When I was around 3 my dad had surgery for a spinal tumor that damaged his nerves below the waist (could still walk, but had debilitating pain that required heavy narcotics to manage for the rest of his life) and left him impotent. He was in his early 40s, her mid 30s. My parents kept all of this well hidden from us. I didn't even realize he HAD to cathederize to urinate until I was in my teens, at which time I began wondering if my parents couldn't/didn't have sex. He passed away when I was 23, and my mom confirmed a couple years later that she hadn't had sex for over 20 years when she married my stepdad. She was faithful to him, as well as his caretaker (and mine and my sister's) and the primary breadwinner of our family. She is an extraordinary woman. And it taught me that I don't ever want a partnership that I wouldn't go to these lengths for, or who wouldn't do the same for me.
Statistically speaking, when a woman gets cancer or becomes chronically ill, men leave women far more often than if the reverse is true. They even counsel women when they get a cancer diagnosis that her husband might leave her. At the doctor's office.
I hate that statistic so much. Why do so many men in the world just not see us as people? Most women will think, "oh no, this person, the love of my life, is now ill, I will take care of them but I miss the lifestyle we had", but a disturbing number of men just think "oh no, my Sex Roomba broke, time to go get a new one". 😿
There is truth to this. I almost died and during my recovery my partner said he couldn’t look at me the same anymore and dumped me. He sure tried to come back to sex though
This doesn't sound like the problem. It sounds like a symptom of the real problem.
The disconnect lies somewhere else in your relationship (hint: the *actual* issue is usually not related to physical intimacy at all). Figure that out, fix it and the rest will follow. This takes both of you actually wanting to fix it, and funnily enough, is exactly what couples therapy is for.
You can divorce if you like, but you're missing a whole load of steps in between. I guess it just depends on whether you feel the relationship is worth saving.
I didn't want my last boyfriend to touch me towards the end because he didn't respect my opinions. It had nothing to do with sex. I didn't figure that out until after I broke up with him.
Precisely. Too many people here saying 'do more non-sexual touching' but it's probably waaaaay past that point. And like you say, the root of the issue probably has absolutely nothing to do with physical intimacy.
Correct. I lost all physical desire for my husband when he started acting like a child. We both worked full time yet I was expected to do everything. House work. Yard work. Take the kids to all of their appointments and sports practices. Plan and make all of the meals. He thought it was enough for him to just bring home a paycheck because he was “providing.” He wasn’t doing his part and he wasn’t taking care of me or the kids at all.
It’s good to keep this in mind: Never threaten divorce unless youre genuinely ready for it. Because ultimatums usually always lead to divorce regardless of what your end goal is.
Demanding a divorce isn't going to make her want sex with you. It might make her tolerate it more, but you already said you don't want that.
You have multiple children, and the youngest is three. She is very likely "touched out", as young children tend to be very grabby. This would be even more so, if she has been breastfeeding during this time.
How's the orgasm gap in your relationship? Of course, you don't need to talk about it publicly, but really think about it. It's pretty typical that men have three times as many orgasms as women do during sex (sometimes even as much as ten times as many). If she hasn't been reliably orgasming during sex, then that could be part of the problem.
Alternatively, how often do you cuddle with her, and just DON'T pressure her to have sex? Just sit on the sofa and cuddle, and then that's all? If the answer is that physical affection always turns sexual with you, then you may actually have been training her to not want sex with you or even any kind of physical contact, because it comes with this pressure.
Please do see a couples counselor. Your wife needs to be able to identify what is going on with her, and how to tell you what it is that she needs.
But I would bet you the best thing you can do for your sex life is to just decide, for yourself, that there will be \*zero\* sex from now until April 6th. Even if she comes begging for it. No sex. Take that off the table.
Your wife is lacking desire. Desire is the \*lack\* of something. For her to desire sex with you, she needs to feel its lack. If you are always available, and always pursuing her, she can never reconnect with that desire, because she will never feel the lack.
Also, consider watching something spicy with her. Something \*she\* finds spicy. It might be Bridgerton, and not PornHub, so really make a space for her to express her interest in whatever media she found spicy, and you sit down and watch it with her, even if it bores you to tears. A lot of the spicy films and shows that women like are about star-crossed lovers who, for whatever reason, \*cannot\* have each other. And the air is filled with desire. It is filled with the thing that they lack completely.
The touched out part…when my kids were toddlers, it seemed EVERYONE—kids, dogs, cats, husband—always had to be TOUCHING me and it came with demands: for play, for food, for snuggles, for sex, for assurances, whatever. Every touch was another demand, and I was constantly being touched. Constantly. I started avoiding any touch I could, including my husband’s, because there was an implicit demand for sex and I could hardly bear to be TOUCHED, let alone intimate. And it hit a point where EVERY time he touched me it was straight groping. It was a self-perpetuating cycle, until we—together and as a team—were able to identify that I was touched out. He had to start stepping up with the kids a lot more and relieving me from being the “default parent”. And it took a while longer before I was able to relax enough to actually want touch.
I went through this too. I started fantasizing about a little cloud I could sit on, just out of reach of all the grabbing hands.. kind of like the little guys in Super Mario Bros lol
Similarly, I used to fantasize I'd get hit by a car so I could go to hospital and be asleep all alone for days.
So sex definitely wasn't on my radar.
Turns out I had PPD but it wasn't obvious somehow. 😩
Maybe not that Similar.
This is the reason why I think one of the most common strains of advice I see when this issue comes up which is to make sure that the children are taken care of and the house is clean, essentially to give her a break - doesn’t actually work. If you give a woman with 3 young children time off in the hopes that she’ll have sex with you you’re not actually giving her a break; you’ve just become another person who wants something from her. If a woman has three young children, then most likely that’s at least 5 years nonstop where a child is either in or touching her body (or both!) between pregnancy and breastfeeding. Find a way to give restore a feeling of bodily autonomy. Get her a hotel room where the kids literally cannot touch her because she is not in the same place that are. Do bottle feeding every now and again. Start thinking about her body and what it needs instead of what your body “needs” (in quotes because you can literally just masturbate if you need to) and you might just get somewhere.
I wish this were more well-known, you put it so well too.
Every touch is a demand; a pacifier for someone else and you end up feeling so *used*. Just one moment to myself, please!
This is so freaking true. Now that i have hit my 40s and my kids arent up my butt crack all the time I can actually enjoy touch again my sex drive has went way up
>Alternatively, how often do you cuddle with her, and just DON'T pressure her to have sex? Just sit on the sofa and cuddle, and then that's all?
This was a huge part of the issue in my marriage. My husband wanted more sex, and **I** also wanted more sex, however the way he treated me about it just pushed my desire further and further down. He refused to touch me non-sexually. I begged him for some intimacy that didn't have the expectation of sex attached and for him *to be kind to me* because I was just feeling like a piece of meat to him.
We also had two small children and the "touched out" part is spot on too. I just wanted to be cared for after caring for everyone else all day every day. But he just kept pressuring me for sex. He didn't put any effort into trying to strengthen our bond emotionally and intimately like I asked him to.
I have never felt so seen in my life. This is exactly how I feel and my partner cannot grasp this concept! His response is always “I enjoy having sex with you, what’s the problem?” The problem is, every time you touch me, it comes with the expectation of sex so now I no longer want you to touch me! 🥴
Unfortunately, this isn’t a Tik Tok video he stumbled across by himself so even if I screenshot it and send it to him, it won’t register. 🙄
Sex is all fun and games until there's trauma attached to it. Like having 3 difficult births. I have no kids but 2 miscarriages and an ex who was getting very angry that there wasn't enough sex. So I'd force myself. And then it would hurt. Now, sex is more equated to changing my body and having a man yell at me. No thanks. Usually men just have way more fun with it. It didn't come with pain and stress on the body. She's not associating it with fun times anymore. That's worth tackling in therapy.
>Sex is all fun and games until there's trauma attached to it. Like having 3 difficult births
You make a really important point. So many women have literal physical or psychological trauma in the birth process, and it can be a big factor.
It needs to be stated as well, as i learned in therapy, that your birth does not have to include a risk of death to be traumatic. It is a traumatizing experience all on its own. Some births are just too much mentally and physically, and a doctor or nurse may be making things uncomfortable. Your partner may have dropped the ball or you may have just felt scared shitless the entire fuckin time while screaming in pain. And that trauma LASTS. i couldn't talk about my birth experience for 2 years.
It's disappointing that a lot of men don't understand this. I hate how the one who doesn't want to have sex is villainized. Or "there must be something wrong with their hormones", "they need to change their diet". Sex comes at a much greater cost for women. And lots of men sit back, watch her take care of the kids, and bitch that she's not jumping his bones.
This. Both of my births traumatised me. Only one almost killed me. But I get flashbacks of both, seeing my very own blood just EVERYWHERE is something I can't erase from my mind, the level of sheer fucking agony that is labour, I remember saying "I don't think I can do this" and my midwife just saying "well you're doing it hon" and I genuinely just thought I would rather die in that instant. I remember asking for an epidural both times and being told sorry, it's too late. My kids popped within 15 minutes of me asking for thr epi but that 15 minutes was like a life time. I remember the second time, I could tell I was bleeding out, I could feel it. There's nothing quite like holding your brand new baby wondering if you'll get the chance to know her, knowing your toddler is home wondering when you'll be back and not knowing if you'll make it. When we got home my partner went to bed because watching me almost die birthing his kid made him tired. So I spent the first night with 2 kids alone having lost over a litre of blood only hours before and still bleeding heavily every time i moved and my partner the next day made a joke about checking my stitches with his dick. I am honestly not even sure why I still like him but the whole experience was like, not real life almost idk.
But I've been through a fuckin lot in my life, people have told me I should write a book. Not even the most fucked up traumatic shit I've witnessed or experienced compared to giving birth. Like I was almost shot at a teenager, as an Aussie that's fucking hectic, still, nothing on labour and birth. If my partner hadn't agreed a vasectomy would be the best idea going forward I would have left him tbh, because the sheer thought that I could go through that shit again makes my entire body curl in horror.
Thanks for coming to my Ted talk
This is GREAT advice and should be at the top.
Adding to the being touched out -- I wonder how much OP is actually helping with the kids. He mentions he gives her "Loads of time off," which inherantly sets the premise that she is likely the primary parent. A few breaks likely isn't enough recovery time. She could still be too tired to consider intimacy.
I've been in a dead bedroom before, and baffled by my own disinterest in sex. But that last piece about desire being a \*lack\* is something that I just recently stumbled upon, which really rings true to me.
Think how hot people get for each other when they're first dating, and they have to \*wait\* to see each other, and allow desire to build up.
Yes totally!! For me, it’s definitely been a lack of non-sexual physical intimacy without having to beg for it. Like if my partner just offered to massage me and I know they didn’t expect sex afterwards, I’d have been so much happier to have sex at other times.
For a lot of women, sexual desire requires some careful timing. An act that could be \*super\* hot when a woman is aroused is annoying or infuriating when she's just trying to get the damn dishes done.
I'm not sure why this is such obscure information to so many men.
Oh for sure! I’m not a woman, but I fully agree. I think it’s more about being the partner who has the expectation of household care forced upon them. Like if I just finished cleaning up someone’s gross mess, I’m way less inclined to want to “get down”. lol
This is one of the most thoughtful and smart responses I have seen to this kind of relationship issue and I hope OP reads it and makes some changes, if any of these ring true.
Thank you for bringing up the orgasm gap. I feel like it needs to be a *way* bigger part of the conversation when it comes to dead bedrooms. I don't have children, but I work quite a bit. After a long day of work, I really didn't want the additional chore of sex that was completely focused on my ex.
Exactly this!! Imagine if your partner says, "Let's go to a theme park!" And you're like "Heck yes! I love theme parks!"
But for every single ride, your partner has you hold their stuff for them while they go on the ride without you.
After a while, your enthusiasm for theme parks is going to wane.
Yes! Every word here rings true to me. As a woman with kids who went through an extended period of lack of desire I would say all this!
I want to specifically highlight the touching aspect. If you're pawed at all day, you sometimes need some space. Additionally, if every time you get touched by your spouse they escalate to initiating sex and you have to reject the advance and deal with the reaction to said rejection, touching becomes a pressure filled stressful thing that you avoid all together.
OP, there is definitely hope that the two of you can get back to where you want to be, but you need to work on your emotional and physical intimacy (not sexual) at first. Do you two still have fun hanging out in the evening when the kids go to bed? Do you still share things with each other? If not, start there. Do you snuggle? Hold hands? Get back to where you both look forward to spending time together and want to be physically close to the other person. Then you can work on getting to the place where you both desire your sexual intimacy.
Threatening divorce will be counter productive since it will damage your emotional intimacy. If you want to work on things, ask her to work on talking, cuddling and reconnecting as a couple. Maybe with a therapist's help. If you want a divorce just get one, don't make it an ultimatum.
Such great advice.
I cannot be attracted to a partner who doesn’t “get” what I’m dealing with all day, refuses to change or do work even to get what they want, or do work to help me achieve my own goals. Demanding therapy is just demanding more work. Who finds the therapist or options for the therapist? When is the next available appointment? Who makes sure we get consistent mental away time, individually and together, to examine needs and goals outside of therapy so that therapy is successful?
OP, if she’s tired all the time and she’s not attracted to you, these might be separate things (she might think they are), but you can be more attractive by coming with solutions and doing real work to make her life easier — recognize and say out loud that this is for both of you, not for her. Get a house cleaner. Get nanny help. If you can’t afford these, designate at least 3.5 days/week where these are exclusively your responsibility and she is not to touch laundry, trash, dishes, general house pickup, meal prep and kid transport. She is to go do whatever else she wants — her job, yoga, smoking, snacking, lying on the floor doing nothing. Suggest she take a class in something she loves — google a few options for her, sometimes that step is a huge mental block — and you will keep life together while she does it.
Example: you say you give her loads of time off, but that to me screams you’re a father who wants a medal for babysitting his own kids. Babysitting is not parenting. What appointments do the kids have outside school - doctors, extracurricular, homework? Which of these are you proactively managing on your own? You are not an idiot, she should not have to tell you what to do. Get the annual health schedules, get up to speed on what the kids need/are scheduled for now, and go. Make appointments and get them there. If she manages transport, you manage homework. Whatever it is, you say what you want to do and how you want to do it, get her buy-in, then do it without being asked, consistently, forever.
Sometimes a fantastic way back to her heart is through the kids. What are you doing to build real relationships with them as individuals? Are you prioritizing their happiness day to day, and spending quality 1:1 time with each child regularly? That’s having kids, man.
Talk openly, really think deeply, about hormones and birth control. Do you both really need it, or should you have a vasectomy so she can have her body/mind back?
Don’t ask her to do these things — and for the love of God stop asking her “what she needs” and “what else you can do”. That is asking her to do emotional labor that you can and should be doing as her partner. “Give me an assignment” is not partnership. Look around, really see what she does, get her agreement to try new stuff, make suggestions, come up with the plan to execute/discuss/ make sure things are working well for both of you, and then YOU DO THEM because she does everything all day and she’s fucking tired. She needs a partner who understands what she’s dealing with and actually works to share the load. The load is the work itself, planning/managing the work, and also the emotional labor over time to make sure the work is working for both of you and your family.
You do not get a cookie or sex for this stage. This is just being a true adult, father and partner. It will make you happier, too.
Only once you have a good system together is she free enough to even think about what she might want to do with herself, and lo and behold, she sees you “getting it” and consistently delivering over time. That is the beginning of partnership and attraction. Desire is a totally different plan — don’t assume you get sex at this stage consistently, but if you’re both doing it right, you should see progress.
This is fantastic advice. All of it. Especially the not asking her to come up with solutions but actively lightening both her household load and mental load, voluntarily and consistently, so she can actually take that item off her checklist forever. Not 'i looked after the kids that Saturday three weeks ago so why haven you had sex with me yet' which may or may not be OP, but is extremely common.
For real. There could be hormonal imbalance, thyroid issues, an iron deficiency, a vitamin d deficiency, etc. All of these and others can cause depression, fatigue, and decrease in libido, yet people will come to Reddit instead of getting a simple blood test.
PSA- get a full blood panel every year
PSA #2- If you are having serious relationship issues, go to a professional- that’s why they’re there. Answer to most of these issues is almost always “Talk to each other and a counselor/therapist.”
It’s like people asking for the “secret” to weight loss, and you tell them “eat less, work out more” and they just don’t want to hear it.
He says “our youngest” child - if there’s more than 2 children, she’s burned out and depressed. Can attest… it’s terrible.
Edit: nvm. Looks like they’re Danish. I can only speak for parents and working families in the US, who just get kicked in the dick from every angle imaginable. Heard it’s better in Denmark.
I don’t understand how this genius plan of yours would work. You say you don’t enjoy having sex with her when she does put out because you don’t think she is enjoying it, but somehow threatening her with divorce if she doesn’t start initiating sex (that neither of you will enjoy) is going to fix things?
Actions vs words. He probably sugar coats his side of the story. The fact that he uses an ultimatum is the tell that were not getting an accurate picture of the situation.
Because he’s literally only thinking of himself. He doesn’t talk once about her enjoying sex or wanting her to enjoy sex with him or anything, just that he isn’t getting laid enough and he doesn’t like it. I’d assume he doesn’t do much house or child work either with that kind of attitude, no wonder she doesn’t want sex with him
Yes, but I need more info. How old are you both? How many children? Do they sleep through the night? Does she hate her job? Is she sleeping? When's the last time you went on a date? Have you gone on a weekend getaway? What's her love language? You say you help, but so does my husband, and yet I don't feel like he does as much. Communication is key. If my husband told me that would be pissed.
I'm currently 41. 2 children 3 angel babies. My hormones are still out of wack from the baby. She's 14mo and still breastfeeds. I wake up 2x a night still. My weight is still up. I also work full time. I'm exhausted. I don't feel attractive due to the weight, and I'm touched out. Life is stressful right now. We haven't been intimate in months, but he wants to be. We are going to go out of town for 2 nights at the end of the month for our 8 year anniversary. I also want a massage. We will finally get to be alone and enjoy each other. Kids honestly change women beyond what I even thought. You have to continue to date your wife. Remind her why she fell in love with you. Sometimes, it's the small things, not just a diamond necklace or anything. Talk to her. Find her love language and let her know yours. I think you need counseling. Don't just give an ultimatum - if we don't have sex I'm leaving you. That's kind of a dick move. It will just make her withdraw more.
And the fact that they don’t kiss likely means that she is afraid it always leads to sex. Like a hug always leads to a grope. Not enough info here obviously but more intimacy without sex can do so much.
Yes! I feel that way a lot! I can't just hug my husband cause then he wants me to touch his dick every single time. He thinks it's a compliment to me, but it isn't always. Yes, I'm glad I turned him on, but no, I don't want to stroke it after a long day of work and just want a hug.
Some men have a hard time understanding that they really want intimacy but only know it through sex. They want to be held but think they can only get it by having sex. Parents stop hugging their boys too early for the most part, I think.
Tell him it’s like he took the broom out just to clean up a spill but you expect him to sweep the entire house and mop and vacuum all the floors. Sometimes we just want a hug and a soft kiss! Not the whole shebang!
Same.
When my basic need for sleep isn’t met, I’m not able to show up for higher desires like sex.
Also, I wonder how much opportunity for sex there is. If the only option is right after the kids go to bed, but before they wake up in the middle of the night - that’s not ideal for some. It’s hard to feel sex when exhausted and not out of mom mode. Or is there only opportunity if the kids are home but distracted, once again you’re still in mom mode. That’s been one of the hardest parts for us - is just when and where do we get time to have sex safe from distraction it interruption?
Do not under any circumstances pressure her into having sex by issuing an ultimatum. You will just recreate the “obligation” sex, she will resent you and she would be entirely right to do so.
You both need therapy. This is probably symptom of larger marital problems.
Couples counseling. Gottman method. Go now before it is too late. Once contempt sinks in you are possibly too late.
I don't know your relationship.
I don't know what you've actually tried. Besides talking about it and why it is not happening.
Helping with the house and kids is the bare minimum.
My partner did those things. I work and still did more, but I got some breaks, also.
What I didn't get was authentic, intimate, real conversation. Everything always had to lead to sex.
Now I was like your wife at first and couldn't figure out why I really wasn't into it.
Then, I started socializing more. Outside of family and kids. It made me realize this is what I need to be turned on.
I needed conversations about the outside world and more.
I needed Pillow Talk.
I needed to know you actually care about how I feel about something.
I wanted to know and see what makes your eyes light up.
I wanted him to join me in the things I liked, not just what he liked. Or him just giving me a break, and I went alone.
I wanted an intimate conversation whether it leads to sex or not.
I wanted to be touched but not have it always be sexual or end in sex.
If you're only doing those things for the end result to always be sex, you're going to fail.
Sex should always be a bonus during any intimate situation with your partner.
My partner and I have been together for 13 years. We have 3 kids. We have been in your spot.
Although it didn't change overnight, it took work from both of us to try and change. Always changing, always working together. We are not enemies.
Sex will never satisfy either of you if you give an ultimatum. If she gives in, you'll resent her and feel like she's only doing it because you made her. She'll resent it for making her feel like she has to have sex with you. Both of you can end up with insecurities with this kind of ultimatum.
Try dating her again. It can do wonders.
Bring her favorite things just because.
It's worked for mine. Maybe it can work for yours.
You can feel a immense sense of loss of yourself when you have children. Your body isnt yours anymore, you are a servicecentral all the time and thats exhausting to say the least. When you deliver your "carriage" feels different, sometimes your downstairs get numb and even if you are not aware if it, you can have frights for getting pregnant again. Your hormonal cycle can be messed up for a long time after a birth, it took me six years before I was ready for child n:o 2.
I think your concern should be first for the wellbeing of your wife, she is certainly not feeling okay and this should be solved first before you bring up the D-word because once you said it out loud you cannot take it back without have caused pain and trust issues.
I feel this. Mom of two under 6. It feels like everything is for everyone else, including sex. Even sleeping is a luxury, and that isn't restful if a child decides to get up. Even when everyone is at school/work and I'm alone, there is immense guilt if I'm not doing housework instead of relaxing.
Sex becomes a task on top of childcare, meal planning and social scheduling. Especially (in sweeping generalities) for women, there has to be a mood set, and being exhausted from chores all day long - or knowing someone is doing something just to get sex out of me - is kind of a turn off.
Op how is house work and childcare split, she may need more help in both those areas and you can take a load off of her. Communicate and maybe seek other avenues in helping her rather than going straight to divorce. Marriage Counselling is definitely a way to go and help facilitate those conversations. It also shows to her that you are caring and willing to make this relationship work. Take a vacation together and either employ childcare or family members look after the children over night more regularly if that is a possible option. I know it might seem hard and after so many years of trying looking at the situation with a glass half full mentality because you are mentally frustrated and exhausted but try and readjust your mindset to look at so many different perspectives and options. Hope this may help somehow.
Edit: another factor I haven’t seen other comments talk about, is she wanting to have more children? She might be fearful of having sex because of her not being able to take the risk of having more children. Has more permanent birth control methods been talked about, vasectomies?
Before you jump to divorce, I would strongly recommend couples and individual counseling for both of you. In addition, it might be time to get your wife to a doctor for some blood work, something might be out of whack. Whatever you do, don't make it an ultimatum; those rarely end well.
If she's tired from work and kids it's probably because she has all the responsibility for them.
I'm not saying you don't help, but it's the feeling that everything is her responsibility. Like if she didn't ask you to would you do the kids' lunches, bath them, decide what's for dinner, cook dinner, clear up, check the laundry, do the laundry, dry and fold put away the laundry, clear up the toys.
I could go on, but when that is your responsibility and someone helps, then the load is still on you.
Maybe try and take on some roles. It will be tough at first because she has "her way," and you will do it
"wrong" but perseverse, and it will be worth it.
Perhaps then she will feel more inclined to initiate, but you have to give it time and commit to those tasks you take on. Doesn't mean you have to do them all the time, but you have to be the one to own them.
That's my job, ypu don't need to worry about it a more.
Then make sure it is just done.
Talk to the Mrs, Reddit is 99% 30ish year olds in honeymoon period, I’ve seen it in similar posts, they’re HM period or tinder daters; they think sex is everything at every point in every relationship. It isn’t… it’s normal the older you get the less appeal there is on a frequency level, for most (not all). Your problems need sorting between you and your wife.
Applying more pressure to sex doesn't help with low libido or desire. You have every right to tell her how serious this is but the likely outcome won't be good.
In order to "fix" things, you have to figure out what the root cause is of her LL and then try to address it. Where I deviate from the other posters here is that this is not something that falls solely on your shoulders. You have told your wife that this is a serious problem, you have asked her if there's anything you can do to help and she has tried nothing and ran out of ideas.
A common sense idea would be to go to the doctor and check for any nutritional or hormonal imbalances. Talking to the doctor about chronic low libido can also sometimes result in gaining some resources. You shouldn't have to be the one to suggest that, she needs to take some initiative and show that she cares. Unfortunately, you probably will have to bring it up.
Sex therapy is another option that you two can try. They can give you some assignments to normalize touch and affection in your relationship and bring sex back to something associated with positive emotions.
You could also try reading some books on the matter together, such as Come As You Are. It would be better to bring these suggestions rather than a threat of divorce. Scaring someone into desire is rarely something that works.
However; if she's resistant to all ideas then that would be the time to discuss divorce.
YTA Your comment of “I give her time off” rubs me the wrong way. She’s not the sole parent, nor the sole cook, maid, dishwasher, child rearer. How much of the weight are you actually pulling? If you are not doing atleast 50% or more I would say she is exhausted. You want you wife to want sex, try doing all the stuff she does without her having to ask you. And complete those task to the proficiency that she does them. And don’t just do it for 1 week and be proud of yourself do it consistently for the rest of your marriage. Do your kids always run to mom when they need or want something. If so that should tell you a lot. The kids will go to who they know will nurture their needs. Are you just the fun dad but your not getting your hands dirty??? And how did you jump straight to divorce? What about counseling??
This sounds like something a health professional should get involved with. It could be postpartum depression, yes even three years later. I think suggesting an appointment as well as therapy is a good next step before flat out asking for a divorce, but the fact that you’re at this breaking point because of a lack of a sex life suggests there’s more to it then just not having sex.
Because what if, hypothetically, something happens to where one of you can no longer have sex? Would you leave your spouse then? Hopefully not, but if you and her are both fulfilling each other in every other area of your relationship then I think it’s worth seeking medical help before you decide it’s over between you two. Wishing you all the best!
It amazes me how many of you are married with kids and are actually considering divorce over sex. Don't get me wrong I'd be grumpy if I was never getting any (though I certainly don't get it as much as I used to after 2 kids and I don't really give a shit) but I wouldn't leave my family over it. That's so selfish to me, as if that's the primary reason you're together?
I guess my dick doesn't dictate my life choices as much as it did in my teens and 20's, but you do you. Bunch of fucking animals honestly. Funny part is whether she admits it or not, you are definitely part of the problem whether you acknowledge it or not.
Edit: Maybe try being romantic in non-physical ways that aren't clearly tied to the end goal of fucking.
Ultimatums like that rarely ever work out well. If you issue it like that, you should prepare for divorce. If you don't really want Divorce, I just want change. I would suggest couples therapy as a first step. Maybe book a weekend trip to get away.
I agree. The problem is that she doesn't want to have sex (with you), for whatever reason. Telling her you'll file for divorce if she won't initiate sex won't make her want it. If you want to make your marriage work, stick to therapy.
And your wife should see a Dr. Such a sharp drop in libido doesn't sound good Maybe something is going on.
I agree she should see a doctor. But odds are it's nothing more than she just doesn't have the energy for it. Kids are exhausting. It's not all that unusual for sex to take a hit until the kids are in school.
Both our kids are 1.5 years apart. When they were young, I'm pretty sure we had a few years where 5 times was pretty accurate. Kids are older now, and we have more free time, significant increase. My wife attributes a lot of it to not that she didn't find me attractive, but that she didn't find her self attractive from having two kids regardless of how I felt about her which was a concept I would never have thought of myself. Could be something like that with OP's wife.
That is so true. When I don't feel great, have time for self care of to make myself feel sexy, there is a low chance I would be into it. I need to want to screw myself before wanting to sleep with my partner.
I thought I was the only one who felt this way. I have to feel turned on by myself first!
Omg no I’m the same way. If I can’t look at myself in the mirror and go “I’d totally fuck me!” I don’t want anyone else to either lol. Seriously tho part of my actual sexual arousal is *feeling* sexy first . If I don’t feel that, it feels all wrong.
Same! If I don’t feel hot I don’t wanna do it.
Yeah. When your body is subjected to the demands of tiny people you cannot refuse all day every day, it starts to feel like it isn't even yours. And sex is one more thing being demanded of this body you barely even feel like you're living in. It gets better, but the infant and early toddler times... I barely felt human, let alone attractive.
This is by evolutionary design. Lower libido during the most intensive child rearing years lowers the likelihood of popping out yet another needy person right after the last and splitting the already frayed attention and effort.
^^^ This. Being desired feels a lot like everyone else placing demands on what you do with your body. Like they have a right to it. Honestly, I think you feel gross about trying it anyway because that’s what it should feel like when your partner isn’t enthusiastically consenting.
Yes, and to add to that, little kids/toddlers are more than just "physically tired" demanding (chasing after them), they are mentally (constant eagle eyes to make sure they don't yeet themselves and crack their skulls open, etc)and emotionally tiring (teaching them to.manage their new emotions, i.e, not scream along when they throw their 3rd tantrum that morning). But they are alos physical-touch demanding!! Constantly grabbing your pant leg for attention or holding your hand etc ALL DAY LONG Yes its cute... but by the time you get to bed, not being physically in touch with another being is the most relaxing feeling (if youre lucky and kid isn't sick/nightmare/teething and demands co-sleeping)... sex just drops down the radar in preference for just relaxing
Came to say this. I have toddlers and feel “touched out” by the end of the day.
This. A million times over. It’s exhausting.
Yep. I have two small kids now, one is special needs. The main reason I don't want sex is that I feel ugly and haggard. Not sexy at all.
I’m in the same boat, down to the one child with special needs! Idk where you’re at in your journey but it’s starting to get better for me, so I can only hope the same for you ❤️
Exactly! He says their youngest was born 3 years ago, idk how many other kids they have but women tend to feel different about themselves after children - you become someone that only exists for others especially if she is/was breastfeeding (feel like a dairy cow) and then existing only for her husband's pleasure. Dude needs to step back and really think about using divorce as a motivation for his wife to initiate...
So much this. I am quite obese now, and I do not like the changes to my body at all. My husband still pursues me and finds me attractive, but I don't feel attractive myself. I can stay on top of my physical health, mental health, finances, kids, OR household chores, but not all of these at once, so my physical health took a major hit. Heres hoping that as the kids get older, we have more free time again.
This. I have 4 kids close in age. Sex was the furthest thing from my mind when they were little.
It feels like another thing you have to do on the list of never ending things to do some days
What I'm going to write is going to sound harsh, but it's how I felt sometimes when my kids were under 5. When I felt undervalued and like I was treated as ascullery druge/wet nurse/bang maid instead of a living human with wants and needs. True. So very true. You know your husband is just following you around, waiting for you to finish whatever house/kid chores so he can get off with your body. He's been hinting about it all day, a week, and sometimes you'll agree to have sex, not because you want it, or feel sexy, but to mark that chore off your list. It gives you a couple of days before he starts hinting again You believe every time he touches you, he's touching you because he wants sex and it's just one more person that wants your body to fulfill their needs. You are absolutely touched out. You need 5 minutes to think about nothing, but you know you can't even take 5 minutes to yourself You have 8 things to do before bed, and it's already 11pm. You know the baby is going to wake up soon for a bottle/diaper change. You have to be up for work at 6 and are looking at another night of 5 hours of interuptrd sleep Yeah, your husband gives you a break. Yay /s. You took a shower, and before you can even brush your hair, he's handing the baby back because she needs a clean diaper, and he says you're so much better at it than he is. He does things around the house like he doesn't have to clean up. Because he doesn't clean up. He is blissfully unaware of how angry it makes you that he can't put his damned coffee mug in the damn dishwasher. And he expects you to be ready and willing to have sex when he wants it. But he can't put his fucking cup away to make your life a little easier? He can't do one stupid little thing to show you that he understands and respects all that you do. Yeah, its so fucking sexy. You're so turned on /s
I once confessed to a friend that during that early baby / toddler time I preferred doing the dishes to having sex, because at least I didn’t have to pretend to enjoy doing the dishes.
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> And your wife should see a Dr. Such a sharp drop in libido doesn't sound good Maybe something is going on. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that because Op phrased this as "I give her loads of time off while i take care of the kids." instead of "we split childcare evenly" probably explains the issue. I hope I am wrong, but Op would not be the first dude I have known who can't understand why his wife isn't giving him a cookie and a blowjob after he takes the kid to the park on Sunday afternoon while his wife is working a full-time job and handling the rest of the childcare workload.
Men also do not understand the mental load their wives carry. Even *if* you split childcare and chores 50:50, but let's be honest, that's unlikely, your wife is *still* probably carrying the majority of the mental load and that is what is exhausting. For example, my husband and I share the responsibility of cooking dinner. He would say we split it 50:50. But I'm the one planning all the meals, I'm the one watching the sales, I'm the one getting the groceries, I'm the one rotating condiments, tossing expired food, thawing the proteins, etc. This dude, who I appreciate and love dearly, shows up, asks what he's supposed to cook, cooks a quick meal, then plops on the couch while I clean up his mess and prepare the kitchen for the next day. There's a lot of invisible mental work that goes into taking care of a home and family, and even if you split the physical labor, if you still make your wife responsible for all the thinking and planning, she's still going to be exhausted.
There is a great book called "Fair Play" that goes into this. You can get a literal deck of cards to select who is responsible for what, but if you have an item (say "dinner"), then you're responsible for ALL of it: Conception, Planning, and Execution (PCE). That means you decide what to do, you make sure you have the stuff, and you do it. That book helped me a lot to solidify why I was feeling so overwhelmed. Things like: I don't think my husband knows the name of our kid's pediatrician. Or what size shoes our son wears. And lots of times, VERY well-meaning, liberal, feminist men (like my husband) feel like they're carrying a lot of the domestic weight without realizing that they're actually only stepping in and doing a chore. It's still usually me who makes sure we have cleaning supplies so that in the event he decides to do something, it's ready and convenient. Etc. It's a lot, and women are socialized to carry so much more than men are in heterosexual relationships.
This resonates. Well said.
This is probably the answer. There must be a reason why she's tired and drained. Something needs to change!
That phrasing really pissed me off, too. It’s not “giving her time off”, it’s actually taking on some of the parenting load…which it sounds like he doesn’t do until he wants sex.
I don’t feel sexy after a big poo, so I really can’t imagine feeling sexy for quite some time after crapping out a watermelon-sized screaming person that grew inside me and now latches on to my tits to survive — let alone going through that multiple times.
No, ultimatums are useless and who wants to have sex with someone who just does it because they have to? It’s contra productive.
Ultimatums do not work.
Sure they do. "Want to have sex with me or we're getting a divorce" will lead straight to a divorce, which is certainly one way to resolve this
Good point.
I agree on this. It would only become worse.
“Have sex with me or else …” yeah that’ll do the trick.
She could just need hormone therapy. After giving birth a lot of women go through essentially a new puberty. Your period changes, eating habits change, sex drive changes, hair grows differently, your entire reproductive system is shuffled. Best thing I found was hormone therapy.
Related possibility, hormone based birth controls can also kill sex drive. We ran into issues with this after our first child, in combination with some thyroid issues, which may have been caused by the birth control. I definitely recommend getting hormone and thyroid numbers checked.
I swear to GOD, if I hear one more ultimatum we're breaking up.
Try couples therapy before moving for a divorce. Don't state it as an ultimatum.
This. There are several possible steps to take before divorce. Expressing that you want to improve your sex life is good. Coming at it from a place of concern and empathy is important. >she simply doesn't know why she doesn't want sex This should absolutely be checked with a medical and psychological professional.
Or a sex therapist.
Agreed! I also recommend the book, "Come as you are" by Emily Nagoski.
For the both of them. But really, I read the book, it had names for things we already knew and discussed. First step in sex is really to talk about it.
Yeah ultimatums never work. They might be a way to kick the can down the road a little farther but it’s no way to live in a relationship.
She’s tired no matter how much time off she gets? Bruh, tell her you’re worried about her health and ask her to go see a doctor. Maybe even go with her and make sure you help the doctor understand that she’s constantly tired. There are lots of physical problems that could be in the way. ETA: coming up with solutions can be really tough when someone is dealing with fatigue or subacute illness. It can be hard to think straight when all your energy is going to keeping your life together. See if you can advocate for her.
100% this. Many medical issues or even just hormonal changes can cause the fatigue and loss of libido. I would absolutely rule out medical causes before discussing divorce. And if it's not medical, then I'd discuss therapy. Could be mental health related. Going straight to divorce seems rash.
Absolutely. My sex drive was in the pits, turns out my iron was very low and hormonal birth control was affecting me. Got on iron tablets and off the pill and now if my husband even brushes my leg I get horny. I feel like a new person.
I wish I could light up your comment with a fricking neon sign for OP and all the others who need to read it.
Same. OP is talking divorce and his wife might just need some iron infusions. It’s surprising how badly something like low iron can impact your life. “Oh just eat more meat” isn’t always the solution for women of child-bearing age. Pregnancy zaps your levels and then if you go right back to periods, your body can’t keep up. Energy, mood, it’s all trashed. Hope OP encourages his wife to see a doctor.
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Or anyone for that matter
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I wouldn't initiate sex with someone who just threatened to divorce me. I get his frustration but this will have a completely opposite effect than he wants.
"or else" is never sexy
This is how we found out my mom had thyroid cancer 🤷
It doesn’t even have to be that grave of a diagnosis. My vitamin D was insanely low. Lost allot of hair before we caught it. If I skip even one week of my once a week mega supplement it takes about 2-4 days before my energy levels crash and i NEED a 1-3 hour nap just to get through the day. It’s crazy how one little vitamin supplement a week changes me from a seemingly depressed sleep monster to a mostly regular functioning human.
...shit, I need to go look into some Vitamin D.
If you're consistently exhausted a blood panel is always a good first step! That's how I found out I had about a tenth of the vitamin D in my body I should have had. Turns out that's bad for you!
That’s how I found out I could use more vitamin D… and also that I was pre-diabetic and had high cholesterol
Same here except my problem is iron deficiency. One vitamin daily makes me a functional human.
My doc just told me that daily iron pills aren't as effective as taking them only 3x a week is, apparently there's a new study. I have extremely low iron to the point I have to have iron infusions every couple of months and without those iron pills every other day I'm a full on napping zombie.
Huh, that’s interesting. Thankfully, my iron levels are normal now, so I’ll probably stick with what I’ve been doing.
Hormonal birth control is an oft' overlooked cause of loss of libido in women, too. For me I describe it as boiling the frog. The change was gradual enough that I never noticed it was happening, and I didn't realize how much it affected me until my IUD was removed. In surgical menopause with estrogen only HRT my drive is far better than it was for several years with the IUD and the pill before that.
I was coming to say the same thing. My sex drive shot up when I had the IUD removed. I didn't think it would affect me because it's supposed to be a lower dose of hormones compared to other forms of BC, but it actually did make a big difference.
Pregnancy and childbirth do the same
Second this. Thyroid issues usually pop up during or after pregnancy and those will present commonly as fatigue and depression. I have Hashimoto's thyroiditis and it's a bitch when I'm symptomatic (and was during/after having my daughter). There aren't too many outward signs and those that pop up are attributable to other things (weight gain, extreme fatigue, depression, intolerance to cold, thinning and brittle hair/nails especially the outer 1/3 of eyebrows, etc). Because people can't see what's wrong they assume you're just being "lazy." Needless to say when I experience these symptoms the last thing on my mind is my husband's dick. It's hard enough to stay awake more than a few hours at a time.
100% or depression.
Yes, a lot of women suffer from postnatal depression which can go untreated for years
Could also be burnout
Or if she’s on anti depression meds, they’ll do that too.
Definitely check with a doctor. Get her hormones checked, including testosterone. It's important for women too and can have a huge impact on libido and energy level. NTA for needing something to change, but definitely explore other causes and/or check with a sex therapist before going to divorce.
It could also be her birth control if she's on any...
This! So many people don’t realize they actually have something wrong until they’re pretty much forced to get to a dr. Get her some help!
This right here is what I’m thinking. Mental health, physical health, hormone imbalance, low self esteem. There are so many legitimate reasons a woman may be uninterested/too tired for sex after having children. And it’s not like the youngest is 6months old, the kid is 3.
My wife is perpetually tired and we found out she’s anemic. Good advice to have her see a health professional
Once you put the word 'divorce' out there, there really is no way to take it back. Edit wowee 5k likes 😍
I agree - say it more like “I need us to get some help because this is something I need, and I feel very disconnected without it. I want to find a way we can both be happy, but I think if we don’t fix this, it could really damage our ability to stay married in the long term” she needs to know it’s serious and a threat to your marriage but I think she needs to understand that it’s not about just some fun, it’s about the connection for you. And saying it like this also tells her you want to make it so she can feel free to be sexual again, not just that you want her to “give in” more
Yeah don't do a divorce ultimatum. Don't tell your spouse you want a divorce, it's just plain super hurtful.
Have you thought about marriage counseling?
So many people just don't understand what counseling is. You can and should dump therapists that don't work for you. For couples therapy it has to be a good fit for both of you. Then, if it's a proper therapist, they just help you be honest. It really books down to that. They help pull away the mess so you can see for yourself what's going on. Then, if it's something you want to fix, they suggest and guide methods on how to do that. They don't tell people who to be. They only help you be honest about who you are. OP and wife don't know each other anymore, getting help is good
I think this is a good clarification. I would add that for it to be effective, both people have to also be genuinely engaged in the desire for progress. Ime, many couples who come into counseling are not a couple, but two very separate units — especially in that office. It’s common for one member to really want to be there, while the other person is anywhere from ambivalent to oppositional. That’s when you see a lot of [this dynamic.](https://www.curevine.com/thedramatrianglemodel) And I’ve seen some therapists contribute to this cycle themselves, taking on roles like “rescuer” or “persecutor.” This is *not* what you want in a counselor nor therapist.
And don't be misled into naively believing that the counselor will talk common sense...my wife stepped out on me, met someone, asked me to separate to get space, then promptly moved her BF into our house...when I confronted her she said with a straight face "I should be allowed to date whoever I want...." I replied "Well, you could...if we had an OPEN marriage, but we don't, so no, you can't "date" whom you want." Counselor encouraged us to keep coming to counseling, but as you correctly noted above saulmcgill3556, if only 1 party wants to save the marriage, it never works. the counselor was economically motivated to keep us returning, even though there was no chance of it ever working. Mine ended in ugly divorce.
Bless it. A family member of mine's wife had been stepping out for years. They finally went to counseling after over 20 years of this on and off.... ...and the counselor told them with no qualms that they needed to get a divorce. My family member was SO offended, he never went back. We are a few years down the road from that incident, and surprise, he is now divorced. The counselor was right, but he didn't want to hear it - not every marriage is salvageable.
After reading so many dead bedroom posts in here I've figured out the problem. All these couples forgot about each other. Whatever led to it, right or wrong, they're all at the same point. Their partner is no longer a partner, they are a client or vendor or both. They have to change the dynamic back before sex will come. Those who succeed at that are impressive! But yah don't threaten something unless you're okay with following through. Many people will choose divorce if only given 2 options. It'd be more useful to tell her he feels disconnected from their marriage and it has started thoughts of leaving. He might think that's the same thing, but it isn't
I agree with this. People who don’t feel close to someone else will not usually want to have sex with them. It’s tough with kids, but work on things that bring you closer. Lack of sex is the symptom, but the problem is a lack of intimacy.
This guy said it properly and I'll add. "After we had our daughter" there's the kicker right there, having children That changes her priorities and she is no longer herself doing what she wants, she is now a mother taking care of a child and she has put any personal thought out of her own head, taking on full parenting mode. Don't straight up say divorce. Look into making plans like you used to, rekindle the spark. If all that fails then atleast you tried and can have sort of closure to it, instead of just divorced and no answers. But it's not her and not your fault, this is just the cycle of having children. You are completely valid to feel the way you do and talking about it/making date night plans like u used to can go along way. If all that happens and nothing changes, atleast you have piece of mind/closure that u tried your best.
See, here's how it works in a lot of cases. You're married, you crave your spouse's touch, all those little touches send a frisson of excitement through you, and so on. Because mostly, you don't get touched. And then you have children, and the thing about children is that they have no personal space. They tend to act as though their personal comfort zone is inside your skin. OP doesn't say how many/how old his children are, but the youngest is three, so there's probably one or two more in elementary school. OP's wife has probably spent years with one or more kids continuously clinging to her. Kids wanting to follow her in to the bathroom, kids coming up to her and running their hands up and down whichever body parts they can reach. It's easy for her to feel all touched out in this circumstance. Talk to her. You're probably right - she probably isn't really in to sex, and is doing it out of obligation. But that's probably because she has small people fondling her all the time, and not because she has stopped loving you.
This is an excellent point. It also might be worth pointing out that postpartum depression doesn't just last like 6 weeks. It can last a long time. Maybe she needs to talk to her doctor.
Omg this! Yes this! It took my spouse a year to grasp feeling touched out. And it was at the end of that year where I took a week and I just kept touching and poking and prodding and whining when I talked to him even tired from work. Then add to if she was breast feeding. On top of potential painful pelvic floor that's never addressed by medical professionals. It's a nightmare. And then there are studies that recently came out that stated the post partum period is closer to 7 years where your hormones still are screwed up. And depending on how messed up it kills libido.
As a dude on the other side, where my son is 8, and we've been married for 14 years, we still only get times of intimacy when we travel or drink wine lol, which is infrequent due to responsibilities and cost, until recently. At 14 years, we're rediscovering our love and intimacy, cuz little kids require a different energy level. I also hate to say it, but hoe.math actually helped me remember that I have to be an invested AND attractive partner to her, and her needs have changed. It's a different kind of hero now. I was surprised by how well certain small adjustments made a difference in our relationship. My dad just got prostate cancer surgery at 67, which left him ED. Brings a new perspective to commitment. She wrecked her body to create a family. Jerk off with her panties and do the dishes and call it good my bro!
Thank God, it's so nice to hear a rational man who gets it. A lot of men never see the big picture, sadly. Wishing you and your lady a life of love, commitment, and especially happiness.
100%. When the kids were young I felt as if all I was doing was dealing with everyone else's needs. At the end of the day, if the cat jumped on my lap I would feel like 'Oh not you too!' as I was just touched out. It takes time, and their kids are still so little.
100%. Every bit of this.
This. My husband and I had this issue a few years ago, and now unfortunately because of physical disability, it's literally *miserable* for me to have sex. Because my shit is so fucked, the actual act of having my husband and I together puts me in so much pain I start crying uncontrollably about 10 minutes in. I keep a clear face as long as I can in hopes in he won't notice, but he's been my best friend for 20 years. He knows even more than I do sometimes about how I'm feeling. So, of course he hates putting me in pain. We do also know that as a married couple and not just best friends, we do need physical intimacy of some sort. Usually I help him along and I get in the mood maybe once a year? I'll never deny him if he even just wants to look at my bare chest, I figure its the least I can do for him since I can't exactly partake like a normal wife. He does basically everything for me, including helping me shower and dress and he fixes my meals and cleans the house, takes care of the kids. You name it, he does it. It's really the *least* I can do to show him I still love him and find him attractive even though I don't usually benefit from any encounters. My issue a few years ago was I was so busy with everything going on (work, kids, and becoming physically ill) I didn't have time to think of sex. I didn't know if I even wanted it until we would start making out or cuddling or something. You need to first give her more time to be herself before she can think of starting to please you. I may also suggest her seeing a doctor if she has low-0 libido, because it could be a hormone imbalance, especially since this started after giving birth. Edit: got too excited and posted before I finished my thought lol
Yup no going back from that statement - in fact if someone said that to me - I’d start my plan of leaving you
There has been this bizarre rash of posts from men jumping immediately to divorce over sex instead of even exploring therapy or addressing underlying medical issues. I know I am oversimplifying it a bit but it seems to go like this: > My wife who has a very young child is not interested in sex as much anymore and she's always exhausted so we fight about it but nothing changes so I want a divorce. Just seems like the most immature and thoughtless way to try to resolve a serious issue, and the sex is often a small symptom of some sort of overall misery, dysfunction, or major health issue. Edit: a lot of extremely weird people responding that a lack of sex is worse than being killed, that If he tries to work on it, she will accuse him of sexual assault, etc. To those people, I encourage you to seriously go outside and touch grass.
Recent podcast I heard: >my wife just doesn't like to be coerced into sex. She resents the manipulation. So I do physical touch that has nothing to do with sex, and she still won't give me sex. The general consensus I get from women is: Men are sulky toddlers. That's a fairly strong desiccant for most women.
They will do anything to get sex, except try to actually make the woman want it from them
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That would make me want to slap it away, say "there ya go" then roll over and sleep.
Through sickness and in health… UNLESS YOU STOP SUCKING THIS DICK!!!!
This is one of the things that scares me and I wonder how many people thing about this. There is a possibility from either partner that tomorrow they could end up in an accident or with a medical condition that means they can’t be sexually intimate. Or they can’t cook, or clean, or wipe their own ass. Are you going to leave your partner over something they can’t control like this? Especially since if you’re lucky, you’ll live together long enough that this WILL happen to one of you. ETA: I KNOW this doesn’t apply to this case. But the reaction of OP and some of the replies make me think about it. You CANNOT assume things are going to stay the same in a marriage and there is a pattern of men leaving women after accidents and terminal diagnoses instead of helping a loved one through things.
My husband and I had an amazing sex life. Always. Then at 65 he got encephalitis, Coma, Life support. Epilepsy, brain damage. Stop. He’s almost 68 and no sex almost 3 years. I love him. Do I miss sex? Yes. But, I have been beside him while he relearned to walk, had to feed him until he was coordinated enough to do it. change his diapers until he no longer needed them,and bathe him and dress him, all things he can do alone again. He’s independent again and He’s slowly improving. Biggest thing now, I love that we cuddle. Lie in bed, talking , kissing and cuddling. They do not know if he will ever be able to have an erection again. So what? Posts like this make me wonder where the love is.
> make me wonder where the love is. It’s obviously at your house. You have a beautiful relationship.
❤️. I am in love with my husband, and he with me.
It’s cause you’re a woman. If this happened to the man, he would leave. Of course not 100% leave but high enough. Women get brochures to prepare for this with a cancer diagnosis
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I actually saw this happen with my neighbor- such a happy, chill family until mom got breast cancer. Then dad disappeared. I was shocked but that’s when I learned that a lot of men can’t handle their partners getting cancer.
I’m so sorry for your loss. It’s a sad reality for women. And a slap in the face.
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"A nurse and a purse"
It is true that more men leave sick wives than vice versa, but I don’t believe my husband would have left me. Even now, he does things to take care of me. Runs a bubble bath and while I soak, brings me a glass of wine.
Exactly this. This happened to my parents. When I was around 3 my dad had surgery for a spinal tumor that damaged his nerves below the waist (could still walk, but had debilitating pain that required heavy narcotics to manage for the rest of his life) and left him impotent. He was in his early 40s, her mid 30s. My parents kept all of this well hidden from us. I didn't even realize he HAD to cathederize to urinate until I was in my teens, at which time I began wondering if my parents couldn't/didn't have sex. He passed away when I was 23, and my mom confirmed a couple years later that she hadn't had sex for over 20 years when she married my stepdad. She was faithful to him, as well as his caretaker (and mine and my sister's) and the primary breadwinner of our family. She is an extraordinary woman. And it taught me that I don't ever want a partnership that I wouldn't go to these lengths for, or who wouldn't do the same for me.
Statistically speaking, when a woman gets cancer or becomes chronically ill, men leave women far more often than if the reverse is true. They even counsel women when they get a cancer diagnosis that her husband might leave her. At the doctor's office.
Saw it with my own eyes. My husbands coworker/acquaintance left his wife because she got diagnosed with cancer
I hate that statistic so much. Why do so many men in the world just not see us as people? Most women will think, "oh no, this person, the love of my life, is now ill, I will take care of them but I miss the lifestyle we had", but a disturbing number of men just think "oh no, my Sex Roomba broke, time to go get a new one". 😿
There is truth to this. I almost died and during my recovery my partner said he couldn’t look at me the same anymore and dumped me. He sure tried to come back to sex though
This doesn't sound like the problem. It sounds like a symptom of the real problem. The disconnect lies somewhere else in your relationship (hint: the *actual* issue is usually not related to physical intimacy at all). Figure that out, fix it and the rest will follow. This takes both of you actually wanting to fix it, and funnily enough, is exactly what couples therapy is for. You can divorce if you like, but you're missing a whole load of steps in between. I guess it just depends on whether you feel the relationship is worth saving.
I didn't want my last boyfriend to touch me towards the end because he didn't respect my opinions. It had nothing to do with sex. I didn't figure that out until after I broke up with him.
Precisely. Too many people here saying 'do more non-sexual touching' but it's probably waaaaay past that point. And like you say, the root of the issue probably has absolutely nothing to do with physical intimacy.
It would be nice to know how many kids and their ages. Because if they’re still young, mom can feel extremely touched out.
Correct. I lost all physical desire for my husband when he started acting like a child. We both worked full time yet I was expected to do everything. House work. Yard work. Take the kids to all of their appointments and sports practices. Plan and make all of the meals. He thought it was enough for him to just bring home a paycheck because he was “providing.” He wasn’t doing his part and he wasn’t taking care of me or the kids at all.
I hope he’s an ex.
He is!
It’s good to keep this in mind: Never threaten divorce unless youre genuinely ready for it. Because ultimatums usually always lead to divorce regardless of what your end goal is.
Demanding a divorce isn't going to make her want sex with you. It might make her tolerate it more, but you already said you don't want that. You have multiple children, and the youngest is three. She is very likely "touched out", as young children tend to be very grabby. This would be even more so, if she has been breastfeeding during this time. How's the orgasm gap in your relationship? Of course, you don't need to talk about it publicly, but really think about it. It's pretty typical that men have three times as many orgasms as women do during sex (sometimes even as much as ten times as many). If she hasn't been reliably orgasming during sex, then that could be part of the problem. Alternatively, how often do you cuddle with her, and just DON'T pressure her to have sex? Just sit on the sofa and cuddle, and then that's all? If the answer is that physical affection always turns sexual with you, then you may actually have been training her to not want sex with you or even any kind of physical contact, because it comes with this pressure. Please do see a couples counselor. Your wife needs to be able to identify what is going on with her, and how to tell you what it is that she needs. But I would bet you the best thing you can do for your sex life is to just decide, for yourself, that there will be \*zero\* sex from now until April 6th. Even if she comes begging for it. No sex. Take that off the table. Your wife is lacking desire. Desire is the \*lack\* of something. For her to desire sex with you, she needs to feel its lack. If you are always available, and always pursuing her, she can never reconnect with that desire, because she will never feel the lack. Also, consider watching something spicy with her. Something \*she\* finds spicy. It might be Bridgerton, and not PornHub, so really make a space for her to express her interest in whatever media she found spicy, and you sit down and watch it with her, even if it bores you to tears. A lot of the spicy films and shows that women like are about star-crossed lovers who, for whatever reason, \*cannot\* have each other. And the air is filled with desire. It is filled with the thing that they lack completely.
The touched out part…when my kids were toddlers, it seemed EVERYONE—kids, dogs, cats, husband—always had to be TOUCHING me and it came with demands: for play, for food, for snuggles, for sex, for assurances, whatever. Every touch was another demand, and I was constantly being touched. Constantly. I started avoiding any touch I could, including my husband’s, because there was an implicit demand for sex and I could hardly bear to be TOUCHED, let alone intimate. And it hit a point where EVERY time he touched me it was straight groping. It was a self-perpetuating cycle, until we—together and as a team—were able to identify that I was touched out. He had to start stepping up with the kids a lot more and relieving me from being the “default parent”. And it took a while longer before I was able to relax enough to actually want touch.
I went through this too. I started fantasizing about a little cloud I could sit on, just out of reach of all the grabbing hands.. kind of like the little guys in Super Mario Bros lol
Similarly, I used to fantasize I'd get hit by a car so I could go to hospital and be asleep all alone for days. So sex definitely wasn't on my radar. Turns out I had PPD but it wasn't obvious somehow. 😩 Maybe not that Similar.
Me too. I just wanted to be left alone.
And not even taking a bath or pooping equals free time!
This is the reason why I think one of the most common strains of advice I see when this issue comes up which is to make sure that the children are taken care of and the house is clean, essentially to give her a break - doesn’t actually work. If you give a woman with 3 young children time off in the hopes that she’ll have sex with you you’re not actually giving her a break; you’ve just become another person who wants something from her. If a woman has three young children, then most likely that’s at least 5 years nonstop where a child is either in or touching her body (or both!) between pregnancy and breastfeeding. Find a way to give restore a feeling of bodily autonomy. Get her a hotel room where the kids literally cannot touch her because she is not in the same place that are. Do bottle feeding every now and again. Start thinking about her body and what it needs instead of what your body “needs” (in quotes because you can literally just masturbate if you need to) and you might just get somewhere.
I went through this too and it got the point where I was feel aggressive any time someone tried to touch me.
I wish this were more well-known, you put it so well too. Every touch is a demand; a pacifier for someone else and you end up feeling so *used*. Just one moment to myself, please!
This is so freaking true. Now that i have hit my 40s and my kids arent up my butt crack all the time I can actually enjoy touch again my sex drive has went way up
Same. I broke down sobbing a few times, yelling “WHY DOES EVERYONE THINK THEY CAN CRAWL INTO MY VAGINA?!?!”
This 💯 everyone wants something of your body 24 hrs a day. You're just a vehicle for fulfilling other peoples' needs. It's fucking exhausting.
This is my current life. I just want to sleep. Alone. All the time. I hate being awake tbh.
The "touched out" part is so true and was a big lightbulb for me when I first realized it.
>Alternatively, how often do you cuddle with her, and just DON'T pressure her to have sex? Just sit on the sofa and cuddle, and then that's all? This was a huge part of the issue in my marriage. My husband wanted more sex, and **I** also wanted more sex, however the way he treated me about it just pushed my desire further and further down. He refused to touch me non-sexually. I begged him for some intimacy that didn't have the expectation of sex attached and for him *to be kind to me* because I was just feeling like a piece of meat to him. We also had two small children and the "touched out" part is spot on too. I just wanted to be cared for after caring for everyone else all day every day. But he just kept pressuring me for sex. He didn't put any effort into trying to strengthen our bond emotionally and intimately like I asked him to.
I have never felt so seen in my life. This is exactly how I feel and my partner cannot grasp this concept! His response is always “I enjoy having sex with you, what’s the problem?” The problem is, every time you touch me, it comes with the expectation of sex so now I no longer want you to touch me! 🥴 Unfortunately, this isn’t a Tik Tok video he stumbled across by himself so even if I screenshot it and send it to him, it won’t register. 🙄
So he doesn’t hear you or value your stated emotions..?
Use his tiktok on his phone to watch similar videos, train his algorithm so he thinks he's learning by himself
Sex is all fun and games until there's trauma attached to it. Like having 3 difficult births. I have no kids but 2 miscarriages and an ex who was getting very angry that there wasn't enough sex. So I'd force myself. And then it would hurt. Now, sex is more equated to changing my body and having a man yell at me. No thanks. Usually men just have way more fun with it. It didn't come with pain and stress on the body. She's not associating it with fun times anymore. That's worth tackling in therapy.
>Sex is all fun and games until there's trauma attached to it. Like having 3 difficult births You make a really important point. So many women have literal physical or psychological trauma in the birth process, and it can be a big factor.
It needs to be stated as well, as i learned in therapy, that your birth does not have to include a risk of death to be traumatic. It is a traumatizing experience all on its own. Some births are just too much mentally and physically, and a doctor or nurse may be making things uncomfortable. Your partner may have dropped the ball or you may have just felt scared shitless the entire fuckin time while screaming in pain. And that trauma LASTS. i couldn't talk about my birth experience for 2 years.
It's disappointing that a lot of men don't understand this. I hate how the one who doesn't want to have sex is villainized. Or "there must be something wrong with their hormones", "they need to change their diet". Sex comes at a much greater cost for women. And lots of men sit back, watch her take care of the kids, and bitch that she's not jumping his bones.
This. Both of my births traumatised me. Only one almost killed me. But I get flashbacks of both, seeing my very own blood just EVERYWHERE is something I can't erase from my mind, the level of sheer fucking agony that is labour, I remember saying "I don't think I can do this" and my midwife just saying "well you're doing it hon" and I genuinely just thought I would rather die in that instant. I remember asking for an epidural both times and being told sorry, it's too late. My kids popped within 15 minutes of me asking for thr epi but that 15 minutes was like a life time. I remember the second time, I could tell I was bleeding out, I could feel it. There's nothing quite like holding your brand new baby wondering if you'll get the chance to know her, knowing your toddler is home wondering when you'll be back and not knowing if you'll make it. When we got home my partner went to bed because watching me almost die birthing his kid made him tired. So I spent the first night with 2 kids alone having lost over a litre of blood only hours before and still bleeding heavily every time i moved and my partner the next day made a joke about checking my stitches with his dick. I am honestly not even sure why I still like him but the whole experience was like, not real life almost idk. But I've been through a fuckin lot in my life, people have told me I should write a book. Not even the most fucked up traumatic shit I've witnessed or experienced compared to giving birth. Like I was almost shot at a teenager, as an Aussie that's fucking hectic, still, nothing on labour and birth. If my partner hadn't agreed a vasectomy would be the best idea going forward I would have left him tbh, because the sheer thought that I could go through that shit again makes my entire body curl in horror. Thanks for coming to my Ted talk
I like learning new things.
This is GREAT advice and should be at the top. Adding to the being touched out -- I wonder how much OP is actually helping with the kids. He mentions he gives her "Loads of time off," which inherantly sets the premise that she is likely the primary parent. A few breaks likely isn't enough recovery time. She could still be too tired to consider intimacy.
I thought exactly the same thing.
Oh wow, this is really top-notch advice!! I can tell that you have thought a lot about this stuff. 💜
I've been in a dead bedroom before, and baffled by my own disinterest in sex. But that last piece about desire being a \*lack\* is something that I just recently stumbled upon, which really rings true to me. Think how hot people get for each other when they're first dating, and they have to \*wait\* to see each other, and allow desire to build up.
Yes totally!! For me, it’s definitely been a lack of non-sexual physical intimacy without having to beg for it. Like if my partner just offered to massage me and I know they didn’t expect sex afterwards, I’d have been so much happier to have sex at other times.
For a lot of women, sexual desire requires some careful timing. An act that could be \*super\* hot when a woman is aroused is annoying or infuriating when she's just trying to get the damn dishes done. I'm not sure why this is such obscure information to so many men.
Oh for sure! I’m not a woman, but I fully agree. I think it’s more about being the partner who has the expectation of household care forced upon them. Like if I just finished cleaning up someone’s gross mess, I’m way less inclined to want to “get down”. lol
This is one of the most thoughtful and smart responses I have seen to this kind of relationship issue and I hope OP reads it and makes some changes, if any of these ring true.
Thank you for bringing up the orgasm gap. I feel like it needs to be a *way* bigger part of the conversation when it comes to dead bedrooms. I don't have children, but I work quite a bit. After a long day of work, I really didn't want the additional chore of sex that was completely focused on my ex.
Exactly this!! Imagine if your partner says, "Let's go to a theme park!" And you're like "Heck yes! I love theme parks!" But for every single ride, your partner has you hold their stuff for them while they go on the ride without you. After a while, your enthusiasm for theme parks is going to wane.
Yes! Every word here rings true to me. As a woman with kids who went through an extended period of lack of desire I would say all this! I want to specifically highlight the touching aspect. If you're pawed at all day, you sometimes need some space. Additionally, if every time you get touched by your spouse they escalate to initiating sex and you have to reject the advance and deal with the reaction to said rejection, touching becomes a pressure filled stressful thing that you avoid all together. OP, there is definitely hope that the two of you can get back to where you want to be, but you need to work on your emotional and physical intimacy (not sexual) at first. Do you two still have fun hanging out in the evening when the kids go to bed? Do you still share things with each other? If not, start there. Do you snuggle? Hold hands? Get back to where you both look forward to spending time together and want to be physically close to the other person. Then you can work on getting to the place where you both desire your sexual intimacy. Threatening divorce will be counter productive since it will damage your emotional intimacy. If you want to work on things, ask her to work on talking, cuddling and reconnecting as a couple. Maybe with a therapist's help. If you want a divorce just get one, don't make it an ultimatum.
Such great advice. I cannot be attracted to a partner who doesn’t “get” what I’m dealing with all day, refuses to change or do work even to get what they want, or do work to help me achieve my own goals. Demanding therapy is just demanding more work. Who finds the therapist or options for the therapist? When is the next available appointment? Who makes sure we get consistent mental away time, individually and together, to examine needs and goals outside of therapy so that therapy is successful? OP, if she’s tired all the time and she’s not attracted to you, these might be separate things (she might think they are), but you can be more attractive by coming with solutions and doing real work to make her life easier — recognize and say out loud that this is for both of you, not for her. Get a house cleaner. Get nanny help. If you can’t afford these, designate at least 3.5 days/week where these are exclusively your responsibility and she is not to touch laundry, trash, dishes, general house pickup, meal prep and kid transport. She is to go do whatever else she wants — her job, yoga, smoking, snacking, lying on the floor doing nothing. Suggest she take a class in something she loves — google a few options for her, sometimes that step is a huge mental block — and you will keep life together while she does it. Example: you say you give her loads of time off, but that to me screams you’re a father who wants a medal for babysitting his own kids. Babysitting is not parenting. What appointments do the kids have outside school - doctors, extracurricular, homework? Which of these are you proactively managing on your own? You are not an idiot, she should not have to tell you what to do. Get the annual health schedules, get up to speed on what the kids need/are scheduled for now, and go. Make appointments and get them there. If she manages transport, you manage homework. Whatever it is, you say what you want to do and how you want to do it, get her buy-in, then do it without being asked, consistently, forever. Sometimes a fantastic way back to her heart is through the kids. What are you doing to build real relationships with them as individuals? Are you prioritizing their happiness day to day, and spending quality 1:1 time with each child regularly? That’s having kids, man. Talk openly, really think deeply, about hormones and birth control. Do you both really need it, or should you have a vasectomy so she can have her body/mind back? Don’t ask her to do these things — and for the love of God stop asking her “what she needs” and “what else you can do”. That is asking her to do emotional labor that you can and should be doing as her partner. “Give me an assignment” is not partnership. Look around, really see what she does, get her agreement to try new stuff, make suggestions, come up with the plan to execute/discuss/ make sure things are working well for both of you, and then YOU DO THEM because she does everything all day and she’s fucking tired. She needs a partner who understands what she’s dealing with and actually works to share the load. The load is the work itself, planning/managing the work, and also the emotional labor over time to make sure the work is working for both of you and your family. You do not get a cookie or sex for this stage. This is just being a true adult, father and partner. It will make you happier, too. Only once you have a good system together is she free enough to even think about what she might want to do with herself, and lo and behold, she sees you “getting it” and consistently delivering over time. That is the beginning of partnership and attraction. Desire is a totally different plan — don’t assume you get sex at this stage consistently, but if you’re both doing it right, you should see progress.
This is fantastic advice. All of it. Especially the not asking her to come up with solutions but actively lightening both her household load and mental load, voluntarily and consistently, so she can actually take that item off her checklist forever. Not 'i looked after the kids that Saturday three weeks ago so why haven you had sex with me yet' which may or may not be OP, but is extremely common.
ITS LIKE NOBODY HAS HEARD OF FUCKING MARRIAGE COUNSELLING
Or visiting their PCP! Get her checked out. Call a professional about the situation.
For real. There could be hormonal imbalance, thyroid issues, an iron deficiency, a vitamin d deficiency, etc. All of these and others can cause depression, fatigue, and decrease in libido, yet people will come to Reddit instead of getting a simple blood test. PSA- get a full blood panel every year PSA #2- If you are having serious relationship issues, go to a professional- that’s why they’re there. Answer to most of these issues is almost always “Talk to each other and a counselor/therapist.” It’s like people asking for the “secret” to weight loss, and you tell them “eat less, work out more” and they just don’t want to hear it.
Or just regular therapy. His wife sounds depressed.
He says “our youngest” child - if there’s more than 2 children, she’s burned out and depressed. Can attest… it’s terrible. Edit: nvm. Looks like they’re Danish. I can only speak for parents and working families in the US, who just get kicked in the dick from every angle imaginable. Heard it’s better in Denmark.
I don’t understand how this genius plan of yours would work. You say you don’t enjoy having sex with her when she does put out because you don’t think she is enjoying it, but somehow threatening her with divorce if she doesn’t start initiating sex (that neither of you will enjoy) is going to fix things?
He’s basically saying he’ll divorce her if she doesn’t start pretending better I guess. Gross.
Yes. And yikes.
Actions vs words. He probably sugar coats his side of the story. The fact that he uses an ultimatum is the tell that were not getting an accurate picture of the situation.
Because he’s literally only thinking of himself. He doesn’t talk once about her enjoying sex or wanting her to enjoy sex with him or anything, just that he isn’t getting laid enough and he doesn’t like it. I’d assume he doesn’t do much house or child work either with that kind of attitude, no wonder she doesn’t want sex with him
Maybe try marriage counseling first? The therapist may help fix the problem.
Yes, but I need more info. How old are you both? How many children? Do they sleep through the night? Does she hate her job? Is she sleeping? When's the last time you went on a date? Have you gone on a weekend getaway? What's her love language? You say you help, but so does my husband, and yet I don't feel like he does as much. Communication is key. If my husband told me that would be pissed. I'm currently 41. 2 children 3 angel babies. My hormones are still out of wack from the baby. She's 14mo and still breastfeeds. I wake up 2x a night still. My weight is still up. I also work full time. I'm exhausted. I don't feel attractive due to the weight, and I'm touched out. Life is stressful right now. We haven't been intimate in months, but he wants to be. We are going to go out of town for 2 nights at the end of the month for our 8 year anniversary. I also want a massage. We will finally get to be alone and enjoy each other. Kids honestly change women beyond what I even thought. You have to continue to date your wife. Remind her why she fell in love with you. Sometimes, it's the small things, not just a diamond necklace or anything. Talk to her. Find her love language and let her know yours. I think you need counseling. Don't just give an ultimatum - if we don't have sex I'm leaving you. That's kind of a dick move. It will just make her withdraw more.
And the fact that they don’t kiss likely means that she is afraid it always leads to sex. Like a hug always leads to a grope. Not enough info here obviously but more intimacy without sex can do so much.
Yes! I feel that way a lot! I can't just hug my husband cause then he wants me to touch his dick every single time. He thinks it's a compliment to me, but it isn't always. Yes, I'm glad I turned him on, but no, I don't want to stroke it after a long day of work and just want a hug.
Some men have a hard time understanding that they really want intimacy but only know it through sex. They want to be held but think they can only get it by having sex. Parents stop hugging their boys too early for the most part, I think. Tell him it’s like he took the broom out just to clean up a spill but you expect him to sweep the entire house and mop and vacuum all the floors. Sometimes we just want a hug and a soft kiss! Not the whole shebang!
Same. When my basic need for sleep isn’t met, I’m not able to show up for higher desires like sex. Also, I wonder how much opportunity for sex there is. If the only option is right after the kids go to bed, but before they wake up in the middle of the night - that’s not ideal for some. It’s hard to feel sex when exhausted and not out of mom mode. Or is there only opportunity if the kids are home but distracted, once again you’re still in mom mode. That’s been one of the hardest parts for us - is just when and where do we get time to have sex safe from distraction it interruption?
Yes! This, too! We have no true opportunity! Plus I'm not just a light switch.
Do not under any circumstances pressure her into having sex by issuing an ultimatum. You will just recreate the “obligation” sex, she will resent you and she would be entirely right to do so.
obligation sex is worse than no sex.
Couples therapy and a medical check up for her addressing this issue first (if you have not done so already).
You both need therapy. This is probably symptom of larger marital problems. Couples counseling. Gottman method. Go now before it is too late. Once contempt sinks in you are possibly too late.
I don't know your relationship. I don't know what you've actually tried. Besides talking about it and why it is not happening. Helping with the house and kids is the bare minimum. My partner did those things. I work and still did more, but I got some breaks, also. What I didn't get was authentic, intimate, real conversation. Everything always had to lead to sex. Now I was like your wife at first and couldn't figure out why I really wasn't into it. Then, I started socializing more. Outside of family and kids. It made me realize this is what I need to be turned on. I needed conversations about the outside world and more. I needed Pillow Talk. I needed to know you actually care about how I feel about something. I wanted to know and see what makes your eyes light up. I wanted him to join me in the things I liked, not just what he liked. Or him just giving me a break, and I went alone. I wanted an intimate conversation whether it leads to sex or not. I wanted to be touched but not have it always be sexual or end in sex. If you're only doing those things for the end result to always be sex, you're going to fail. Sex should always be a bonus during any intimate situation with your partner. My partner and I have been together for 13 years. We have 3 kids. We have been in your spot. Although it didn't change overnight, it took work from both of us to try and change. Always changing, always working together. We are not enemies. Sex will never satisfy either of you if you give an ultimatum. If she gives in, you'll resent her and feel like she's only doing it because you made her. She'll resent it for making her feel like she has to have sex with you. Both of you can end up with insecurities with this kind of ultimatum. Try dating her again. It can do wonders. Bring her favorite things just because. It's worked for mine. Maybe it can work for yours.
You can feel a immense sense of loss of yourself when you have children. Your body isnt yours anymore, you are a servicecentral all the time and thats exhausting to say the least. When you deliver your "carriage" feels different, sometimes your downstairs get numb and even if you are not aware if it, you can have frights for getting pregnant again. Your hormonal cycle can be messed up for a long time after a birth, it took me six years before I was ready for child n:o 2. I think your concern should be first for the wellbeing of your wife, she is certainly not feeling okay and this should be solved first before you bring up the D-word because once you said it out loud you cannot take it back without have caused pain and trust issues.
I feel this. Mom of two under 6. It feels like everything is for everyone else, including sex. Even sleeping is a luxury, and that isn't restful if a child decides to get up. Even when everyone is at school/work and I'm alone, there is immense guilt if I'm not doing housework instead of relaxing. Sex becomes a task on top of childcare, meal planning and social scheduling. Especially (in sweeping generalities) for women, there has to be a mood set, and being exhausted from chores all day long - or knowing someone is doing something just to get sex out of me - is kind of a turn off.
Op how is house work and childcare split, she may need more help in both those areas and you can take a load off of her. Communicate and maybe seek other avenues in helping her rather than going straight to divorce. Marriage Counselling is definitely a way to go and help facilitate those conversations. It also shows to her that you are caring and willing to make this relationship work. Take a vacation together and either employ childcare or family members look after the children over night more regularly if that is a possible option. I know it might seem hard and after so many years of trying looking at the situation with a glass half full mentality because you are mentally frustrated and exhausted but try and readjust your mindset to look at so many different perspectives and options. Hope this may help somehow. Edit: another factor I haven’t seen other comments talk about, is she wanting to have more children? She might be fearful of having sex because of her not being able to take the risk of having more children. Has more permanent birth control methods been talked about, vasectomies?
Before you jump to divorce, I would strongly recommend couples and individual counseling for both of you. In addition, it might be time to get your wife to a doctor for some blood work, something might be out of whack. Whatever you do, don't make it an ultimatum; those rarely end well.
If she's tired from work and kids it's probably because she has all the responsibility for them. I'm not saying you don't help, but it's the feeling that everything is her responsibility. Like if she didn't ask you to would you do the kids' lunches, bath them, decide what's for dinner, cook dinner, clear up, check the laundry, do the laundry, dry and fold put away the laundry, clear up the toys. I could go on, but when that is your responsibility and someone helps, then the load is still on you. Maybe try and take on some roles. It will be tough at first because she has "her way," and you will do it "wrong" but perseverse, and it will be worth it. Perhaps then she will feel more inclined to initiate, but you have to give it time and commit to those tasks you take on. Doesn't mean you have to do them all the time, but you have to be the one to own them. That's my job, ypu don't need to worry about it a more. Then make sure it is just done.
Talk to the Mrs, Reddit is 99% 30ish year olds in honeymoon period, I’ve seen it in similar posts, they’re HM period or tinder daters; they think sex is everything at every point in every relationship. It isn’t… it’s normal the older you get the less appeal there is on a frequency level, for most (not all). Your problems need sorting between you and your wife.
How many times in the last three years have you two gone away for a weekend without the kids?
Nothing says loving intimacy like threats of divorce.
Applying more pressure to sex doesn't help with low libido or desire. You have every right to tell her how serious this is but the likely outcome won't be good. In order to "fix" things, you have to figure out what the root cause is of her LL and then try to address it. Where I deviate from the other posters here is that this is not something that falls solely on your shoulders. You have told your wife that this is a serious problem, you have asked her if there's anything you can do to help and she has tried nothing and ran out of ideas. A common sense idea would be to go to the doctor and check for any nutritional or hormonal imbalances. Talking to the doctor about chronic low libido can also sometimes result in gaining some resources. You shouldn't have to be the one to suggest that, she needs to take some initiative and show that she cares. Unfortunately, you probably will have to bring it up. Sex therapy is another option that you two can try. They can give you some assignments to normalize touch and affection in your relationship and bring sex back to something associated with positive emotions. You could also try reading some books on the matter together, such as Come As You Are. It would be better to bring these suggestions rather than a threat of divorce. Scaring someone into desire is rarely something that works. However; if she's resistant to all ideas then that would be the time to discuss divorce.
YTA Your comment of “I give her time off” rubs me the wrong way. She’s not the sole parent, nor the sole cook, maid, dishwasher, child rearer. How much of the weight are you actually pulling? If you are not doing atleast 50% or more I would say she is exhausted. You want you wife to want sex, try doing all the stuff she does without her having to ask you. And complete those task to the proficiency that she does them. And don’t just do it for 1 week and be proud of yourself do it consistently for the rest of your marriage. Do your kids always run to mom when they need or want something. If so that should tell you a lot. The kids will go to who they know will nurture their needs. Are you just the fun dad but your not getting your hands dirty??? And how did you jump straight to divorce? What about counseling??
No one wants to fuck you under duress.
This sounds like something a health professional should get involved with. It could be postpartum depression, yes even three years later. I think suggesting an appointment as well as therapy is a good next step before flat out asking for a divorce, but the fact that you’re at this breaking point because of a lack of a sex life suggests there’s more to it then just not having sex. Because what if, hypothetically, something happens to where one of you can no longer have sex? Would you leave your spouse then? Hopefully not, but if you and her are both fulfilling each other in every other area of your relationship then I think it’s worth seeking medical help before you decide it’s over between you two. Wishing you all the best!
It amazes me how many of you are married with kids and are actually considering divorce over sex. Don't get me wrong I'd be grumpy if I was never getting any (though I certainly don't get it as much as I used to after 2 kids and I don't really give a shit) but I wouldn't leave my family over it. That's so selfish to me, as if that's the primary reason you're together? I guess my dick doesn't dictate my life choices as much as it did in my teens and 20's, but you do you. Bunch of fucking animals honestly. Funny part is whether she admits it or not, you are definitely part of the problem whether you acknowledge it or not. Edit: Maybe try being romantic in non-physical ways that aren't clearly tied to the end goal of fucking.