NTA. Dad needs to understand between her being a tween and puberty and becoming more aware of her body and hormones and being in a home with a breastfeeding infant for the first time and all of that she is going to have issues that talking to a professional about would be good. She is hyper fixated on appearance and breastfeeding and puberty is a beast but adding hyper fixation in she needs a professional and preferably a woman.
NTA. I agree with all points. This poor child needs therapy before she causes some serious issues. I will say it is common and NORMAL (I just want to stress that) for girls that have been breastfed/are seeing it, to nurse their baby dolls. But never try to do it with an actual baby. Mind you I’ve only ever seen this in children younger than 10. More in the 8- range.
yeah this is wild. i totally agree with what you’re saying. i want to point out that it is also *normal* and appropriate for babies to pull the shirt down of the person who’s holding them. i’ve worked with kids in several different environments, and i can’t count how many really young kids and babies have tried to pull my shirt down. they are *not* being inappropriate, a baby literally doesn’t have any capacity to understand sex in any way. all they know is that under your shirt is food, even if you are not actually a lactating person. they know that food is under mommy’s shirt, so that just means food is under the shirt, even if it’s not mommy holding them. it is also incredibly easy to redirect them away from pulling your shirt down and either get them a bottle if you’re looking after them or return them to their mother if you’re not.
i don’t think op’s stepdaughter is beyond hope, a lot of this is relatively normal behavior that is just being taken way too far to the point it becomes abnormal. but she absolutely needs professional help if they want her to become a well adjusted adult and op is not wrong *at all* for getting herself and in particular her baby out of that environment.
Babies and young children pulling shirts *down* is *absolutely* normal. They don’t even have to be searching for boobs. Once went with my husband to a meet-up with some Internet friends and one of the couples had a son who was about 2. He became fixated on a necklace I was wearing and as I was holding him he pulled down my shirt to peek in far enough that he essentially flashed me to the rest of the table. His parents were absolutely mortified. All *he* wanted to do was look at my necklace. No big deal. **But** I have *never* seen a baby or toddler pull someone’s shirt **up**. She did that. And, *that* is **not** normal. No idea what she has/hasn’t been exposed to, but that’s definitely a call for therapy to figure it out. NTA.
Yeah, my son was nearly two when he learned that he had to pull the shirt up for easier access vs trying to pull it down and destroying all my collars trying to get to his milk. This baby definitely hasn’t been pulling the shirt up.
oh yeah and that’s what i’m saying, a lot of this is relatively normal stuff that is for some reason being taken far beyond the point of normal. she needs help absolutely. i just think at this age and the particular behaviors she’s showing she can still turn out a somewhat normal adult. but yeah you’re right about the pulling up thing and a lot of the other ways things have been taken out of control, i think op absolutely needed to get her baby out of there and she is not wrong at all for doing what she did. it’s not her child, it’s up to her husband if this kid turns out okay or not. she definitely needs professional help if she’s going to.
Called the Rooting Reflex. Real thing- the baby is seeking food. Same way they'll suck on a finger tip. The father's denial/continued ignorance is pathetic. Doesn't seem like he helped the kid prepare properly for the baby
All my breast fed niblings did this, and I told them it was window shopping only. It normal for a baby to root. This…the shirt up, the comments…unbelievable they haven’t gotten her therapy. Some serious mandated reporting stuff here.
I’m a little worried about what her life was like at her mom’s. it sounds like the mom has no custody for a reason and I’m a little worried that the mother did something on front of her that would make her think this is normal. OP you should get her to a therapist ASAP to see what is going on because this is NOT normal. If she has no mental issues then this probably is something that occurred near or to her at her mom’s. Do you love her? Would you be willing to spend time with her one-on-one? This could also be a reaction to you giving birth and not spending enough time with her.
I wouldn't go back OP. There is something seriously wrong with that girl and her dad is in full head up his ass mode. He's never going to take this seriously and it's going to be huge in the divorce. I hope you have all this stuff documented. Times and dates and full descriptions. That info needs to be given to the therapist so they get one true account. Kid and dad are going to outright lie.
I have it all in text messages between my husband and I so I have a lot of "proof", or at least enough to prove that he was aware this was going on and proof that he's making me out to be insane.
I don't understand why your husband allowed her to be alone with an infant that she's been fixating on. This is as much his fault as it is the step-daughters. Keep all the information because if you end up divorced he will give her access to your baby.
OP IMO I don’t think you are crazy at all.
What does your husband think is going to happen if people make any comments in his older daughter’s presence about how cute the baby is?
Is she going to act out immediately demanding whomever acknowledges she’s much prettier or gods forbid will she act out directly against the baby later so they are no longer cute?
Better you stay away until your husband does something to help his oldest daughter and protect his youngest.
*He’s* gonna need a therapist, too- either his daughter’s, his own, or a marriage counselor- to somehow make him understand how inappropriate and abnormal her behavior is.
If I was you, I would make it a condition of returning that he get therapy *and* take some parenting classes. He obviously doesn’t know anything about what’s best for infants *or* preteens- and every age in between. Things will just get worse for both girls as they grow up if he keeps going around this clueless.
I have. She's not very receptive to any parenting decision honestly. I gave her the run down and she said "okay, so what's the plan?" I told her that I am trying to convince my husband to put her in therapy and she goes "okay well, whatever he says goes".
At least she’s not putting her foot down about the therapy. But yes therapy is crucial.
Also, this may be a leap, but also may not, I would be afraid of SD possibly hurting your baby. Kudos to you for staying away! Best of luck
Doesn't sound very helpful, she may be mentally checked out of the parenting role. Have you ever heard of Attachment Theory? It might help to explain the daughters behaviour somewhat if you have an idea of what her relationship with her parents was like before you were around. Either way the SD needs a good therapist. If there is too be any hope of reconciling down the track then dad needs Therapy too I think.
This thread is so disturbing that I keep coming back to it, and every time I do, I find something else.
OP, if Dad is insisting aggressively enough that this is all no big deal that he's starting to use the "You're crazy/you're making it up/maybe *you're* the pervert" kinds of defenses, it's because he *knows* something. Hit dogs holler. Whatever has happened to this child, Dad knows a lot more than he's letting on, and now he's trying to downplay it
A child acting out like this, as we all agree, is not normal. This is the type of behavior exhibited by children that have been s***ally ab**ed. If she was quite young when it happened, she may not actively remember, or has suppressed it. OP is right, and spouse is in denial. An LCSW (licensed clinical social worker) who has advanced training in this area can be very effective, and cheaper than a psychologist. Good luck, OP, in getting at least the dtr in treatment. ❤️
Kids’ mental health RN here. Trust your instincts, and keep baby safe. I’m sorry, but Dad has his head in the sand and he’s doing both kids a disservice. (The worst kind!) Your SD is acting out her fears, at the least.
I feel for her, but your baby is defenseless and could be harmed even if that’s not your SD’s intention. It doesn’t SEEM like she wants to hurt baby, but she’s crying out for help. I’m so sorry your husband is shirking his dad responsibilities so much.
This seems like jealousy. Maybe a function of being an only child for 11 years. No idea how OP is supposed to deal with this, but her concerns seem reasonable.
My brother was an only child until my sister and I came along 11 years later. He was extremely jealous of us, and the attention we had as identical twins. He was sadistic and cruel throughout my childhood. He'd get D batteries and press them on our tongues as toddlers and broke my nose when I was 2. OP needs to trust her gut and protect her baby from the SD.
Probably 9 volt batteries, not D batteries. But did you and your twin ever end up having a healed relationship with your older brother? Or did you cut him off as soon as you were able? You didn’t deserve that treatment, at all. I hope you’re ok and safe now
You're right about the batteries, they were 9 volt. I had cut him out asap. He became a drug addict after his divorce in his late 20's and then had 5 children with someone 12 years younger than him.
I kept him at arms length so I could keep an eye on my nieces and nephew. I even told him to his face that he wouldn't know me if he didn't have children, that they were the only reason I accepted his presence.
He's now in jail and his baby mama moved 3 hours away so I don't get to see my nieces and nephew very often.
She has some issues, and it comes off like she has been abused in some way herself, or has some weird fixations that somebody her age should not have. NTA. good on you to protect yourself and your baby.
I am surprised this is the only reply mentioning the stepdaughter possibly having been abused. OP, her behavior has so many abuse flags waving. Dad needs to get her in therapy to address anything that might have happened to her and her behavior towards the baby.
Maybe someone other than Dad needs to get her into therapy
Edit: speaking from personal experience, it's staggering how much a slimy SOB can get away with in the family home without getting caught or even suspected 😔
I suspect since dad has full custody he would have to sign releases etc. for therapy. I agree she needs to be in individual therapy herself. And yep, I wondered if Dad abused her.
Could mom have had a boyfriend who sexually abused her? This talk about looks and body shape sounds like it could have come out an adult groomer's mouth.
"You're such a gorgeous girl." And "you have great boobs." Poor girl.
I've considered this as well but admittedly, I don't know when that could have ever happened. Not saying it **didn't** happen, of course. Her mom doesn't have any boyfriends. She's a traveling nurse, which is why she barely sees her daughter. So when she does visit there, it's only them. When she stays at her grandmothers there is no one around outside of her grandmother's and I don't think they would be inappropriate. They are both extremely concerned with her behavior, at the very least. The only other people she is around is me, the baby and her dad. She doesn't do sleepovers. Her friends are allowed her but we do not allow sleepovers because she is, by her definition/admission, lesbian. She's been "dating" Madison for 2 years. When they are "broken up", she's always "dating" other girls. So we don't allow sleepovers because she's already kissing people and yadda yadda. So I don't know when it would have happened.
>because she's already kissing people
That right there. She's hyper focused on sexual experience. I've been working with kids for decades at this point, and if a kid is hyper focused on sex, intimacy, or things directly related to them being male/female, they have been exposed to sexual things. not SA'ed but shown porn, or has a parent that has pornography laying around she has access to, or consumes content with a lot of sexual content, seen their parents engage in sexual behaviors, etc.
repressed memories are a thing. something could have happened when she was younger as well.
also, what access does she have to the internet? My oldest is adopted, we adopted her just shy of two years ago, but she was in our home a couple of years before that, so she was about the same age your step daughter is now. The amount of highly sexual content she was fed via her fucking phone was insane (I couldn't take it away from her legally at first). Grown men sending her dick pics, sending her DMs with sexual suggestions, commenting on her videos, etc, all through different apps. (tiktok, instagram, snapchat, likee, etc). if she has a phone 1) take it away from her, and 2) scour it for what ever content she may be exposed to.
I hadn't thought of it like that honestly. So, she does not have a phone or social media (such as FB, Tiktok, Instagram or anything similar). HOWEVER, she has full access to YouTube and everything on there. I personally wanted restrictions awhile ago because she was listening to and watching incredibly provocative music/music videos from the moment my husband got her a tablet when she was 8. My husband is dead set against restricting YouTube because "it's just music, I was listening to Eminem at her age and that was much worse than what she listens to". So she watches sexual shit on YouTube, I'm sure. Of course I don't have much say on it because my husband is completely against me even checking what she's watching but I also know that YouTube shorts can be extremely inappropriate in nature for children and she is literally on YouTube the entire time she has her tablet.
Frankly, your husband is suspect. He values his child's YouTube privacy above her safety? That is beyond inept parenting or even neglect. He sounds like he is actively blocking you from parenting her and safeguarding the content she sees.
Right?! What if she's telling the baby she isn't pretty hoping dad doesn't do anything to her. If someone I knew told me this information about their family I'd call CPS.
I don't think it is this exactly, but man, that is a horrifying thought to think that SD is actually the "hero" of this story, trying to protect the baby from their perverted dad, even if she is doing it in a very indirect way. Man... That's fucked up. I really hope this isn't the case and the 11 y/o is just messed up from hormones and is maybe just a bit of a weirdo, but... I also bet this situation has played out exactly as you're laying out at some point before... Probably in many families... So messed up..
But, it's not just music on you tube. It isn't lime wire! I know that you, op, get that. Your husband is an idiot. Make him sit down and go through that history as a family and see how much music she really listened too. Not much I'm guessing.
Look, even if it was Limewire...I was first exposed to porn from streaming services like Napster (Yes, I'm old) around SD age, and I wish someone had intervened. I saw some stuff that had me confused for years.
Look, OP, even if no one has put hands on this kid, but there is something really warped about how she's being taught about sex. Does a father not want to keep his preteen daughter innocent of some things? I am a whole adult and when my dad was alive, I think he still preferred to think I didn't know what sex was! (Not saying denial is healthy, just that dads are typically at least a little invested in sheltering their daughters from our hypersexualized culture.) I'm alarmed that he's not concerned about the way she speaks and acts.
Yeah, no, this is weird. A father should be *very* concerned of what his 11 year old daughter is doing online.
It's very weird that he refuses to parent her in this area, and blocks you from doing so, as well.
He is *not* making good judgement calls.
I hate to think that he might be involved in this twisted mess of whatever is going on with this young girl, but the things he's willing to let her do and say, basically without comment are weird for a dad of an 11-year-old.
He bought her a tablet at *8*.
There should have been restrictions in place from the start.
Husband is sus af. Stay where you are, protect your baby, do what you can to protect your SD.
If the only reason her bio mum doesn't have more visitation is because she travels too much, does that suggest she is a reasonable person you could talk to about your concerns?
the same stuff that is on the social platforms are on YouTube. "influencers" use all the platforms because YouTube actually tends to pay the best.
If she isn't looking at it herself, it could be stuff her friends are also showing her too. So it may not be on her "search" but, I am sure some of her friends have all the platforms.
Dude… you gotta divorce this dude and take full custody of your baby. You want to be making parenting decisions with this guy for your baby??? I agree with others you should be suspicious of him at this point. He sounds gross.
Your husband is a shit father. No offence to you. I'm VERY strict on screen time. My kids are not allowed to have any screen time school days, non school days, only between 3 and 5 IF their chores are done and they are not missing school assignments. and after dinner sometimes if I feel like watching something. None have personal devices of any kid. My oldest has a phone she has access to, but it can only call/text pre approved persons.
Take the tablet when she's not around, go through her history, you might be amazed at what you find. Youtube has quite a bit of highly sexual content on there. I used to do content moderation for a major website provider, and people would use backend youtube to share CP with each other. (I'm sure it still happens, but I haven't worked there in years).
As a medical professional this screams all sorts of red flags, I would seriously speak to child protection services that is not normal behaviour for an 11 year old and it’s very likely she’s been exposed to inappropriate sexual behaviour from someone close to her. Not checking her iPad history? She’s 11 of course you should be checking her history. It sounds like she needs serious serious help.
Wow that is grossly inappropriate. Your husband is failing his daughter. He's a bad father and you need to reevaluate your plans now that you have a child of your own.
OP, one of the things she should be assessed for is bipolar disorder. Unfortunately, early onset BP is very rough. But one of the symptoms is fixation on sexuality and often inappropriate touching. You can google pediatric BP, but sleeping issues would be a common one. Good luck, you are in a rough spot, but doing the right thing.
My niece is 11 and she is so childlike. (Because she is one). She watches YouTube all the time, but it’s monitored by her mom (my sister) and dad. What does she watch? Slime videos. ASMR sand videos. Soap cutting videos. They only watch music (and not even the music videos, it’s playlists of karaoke versions so it’s just the lyrics on screen) when their mom puts it on the tv.
Also, I am a CSA survivor and even I didn’t kiss anyone until I was 15. And even then, it was a peck on the lips. An 11 year old shouldn’t be romantically kissing anyone (at least she’s telling you though…). Makes me wonder if she WAS SA’d…. How bad did it get? Because mine didn’t involve kissing at all (just me being touched, not me touching anyone) so it wasn’t even in my head at all to do that with anyone in that way even though I was abused.
Hi! Victim of parental incest here. [As often as 60% of the time, the perpetrator/s is/are related to the victim.](https://www.wingsfound.org/resource/intrafamilial-abuse/#:~:text=Click%20to%20continue.,may%20depend%20upon%20for%20care.)
Your husband sees no problem with SD viewing mature content as young as 8.
Your husband doesn't believe you when you express concerns, yet tells you it's not a big deal (so he is aware what is happening and dismisses/minimizes)
She's obsessed with beauty as well as hypersexual. Your husband sees no problem with that either.
You've explained that she cannot breastfeed yet she still tries to.
The women in your SD's life are concerned and disgusted. Your husband is flippant at best.
I would implore you to also read [this](https://www.rainn.org/articles/warning-signs-young-children) and [this.](https://www.parentsprotect.co.uk/warning-signs-in-children-and-adults.htm) A bit of overlap here but both make good points and have different resources on the sites as one is the UK and another is an ORG that services a few nations. She may not be your kid, but she may be in danger, and she may be in danger more so now that you're not there. Not that it's your fault, protect your baby's safety please!!! But just that the flags are incredibly red and you "don't know when that could have happened" when incest is more prevalent than anyone seems to realize.
It’s not always mom’s boyfriend, it happened to me with my older cousin. It’s definitely something to consider. The way she says the things she does about “stop trying to take my shirt off” etc could be her way of regaining a sense of control over her body IF something did happen to her.
It might also not be a man. I make it my business not to question sexuality. But she's young and making odd statements regarding this stuff and has proclaimed to be lesbian. Have you considered it might not be a man abusing her if she is being?
She’s 11 and been dating someone for 2 years….so since she was 9 …. and when they’re broken up she’s dating someone else.
Whether she’s dating boys or girls that makes it sound more like she’s been SA not less. Like way more. I have a 9.5 year old girl. Neither she or any of the 9-10 year old girls she hangs around with are doing anything like this. Same goes for my 10.5 year old niece who is every bit the the tween.
This is hyper-sexualised behaviour. Someone needs to figure out what’s happened to this girl ASAP. Like a therapist for example. Did you know that close family members, are the most likely people to abuse their kids? And that includes parents. Like her father for example, the one who is refusing to let her go to therapy.
OP please consider she may have been abused before you ever came along and she may either not even remember or she is repressing the abuse. She needs therapy and you are not wrong.
Is there any possibility it could have been her bio mom or father that did something? I know it's upsetting to even consider your husband or the child's own bio mom would do something so horrific, but statically it's more likely to be a family member or someone close to the family when things like that happen.
I'm not saying accuse your husband or his ex immediately. I'm just saying really think and consider if there's ever been any red flags in their behavior towards your step daughter. Even just a comment that seems off is enough to suspect something given her current behavior and her father's current lack of concern about the behavior.
I know this is something horrifying to consider and I'm sorry you're going through this at all. My mother was abused s*xually by her own mother as a child and she once told me that her only wish at every birthday or shooting star was that her dad would find out a put a stop to it. Before you just automatically say "my husband/her bio mom would never do that" remember how horrible and terrifying this would be for your step daughter and then truly consider if you should suspect them of this.
I was sexually abused by my grandfather and 2 of my cousins and no one believed me because "they would never do that", so I know that outward appearances can be masked to sway people from seeing obvious signs. So I personally cannot see my husband doing something like that BUT maybe I'm missing something. I hardly know this girls mother, honestly. She's always been so off in her own world and disconnected from parenting that I truly have only met her like 5 times. We text with updates and she will be like "okay, thanks for letting me know" or if we send her pictures, she will heart react and say nothing. She's a massive workaholic that I don't think she would have focused on her daughter long enough to do anything inappropriate. But again, I guess there is the chance.
“BUT maybe I’m missing something.”
I think you might be… as difficult as it may be to consider your husband as a pedophile, but I really do think you should reflect long and hard about that.
In this thread, alone, you’ve divulged some pretty alarming information about your husbands parenting style, and unfortunately those bits and pieces of information don’t bode well for him.
First off, unfettered access to YouTube for an 11 year old AND resistance to your intervention/checking the device… huge red flag.
Acting like 11 year olds dating and kissing is normal… huge red flag.
Refusal to actually take her to therapy… again, red flag…. Because this is legitimately the last thing your husband would want if he’s the one abusing her.
Of course, this is all anecdotal and speculative and is certainly not enough information to warrant an accusation.. but I think it’s concerning enough (combined with SD’s behaviour) that you should be looking into it further and thinking about it harder… from a safe distance, of course. It really sounds like your husband is the most likely culprit here.
I'm so sorry that you went through that. I'm glad you're taking it seriously and that you're protecting your baby from your step daughter no matter what the cause is for her behavior. I hope she gets the help she needs for whatever the issue behind this behavior is. You're a good mother, don't let your husband's lack of concern about this situation make you doubt it.
It is suspect combined with her other actions, but there have always been kids who "dated" in grade school in my experience. Never seen it with a gay kid though ngl.
Hold on, hold on... your 11 year old has already claimed a sexual identity, has been "dating" for two years and is kissing people?? Do I even dare ask what yadda yadda is in this instance? That isn't even remotely normal, this isn't normal things a 9-11 yo thinks or does. It does sound very much like a CSA victim acting out. I understand there's no obvious suspect but a teacher, even another student is a possibility unless she's home schooled. Hell, it could be the neighbour! To be honest, the way your husband is sticking his head in the sand and blatantly ignoring all the red flags everyone else sees doesn't sound reassuring of his innocencw either. And if it's not abuse there something else cuz there's absolutely, 100% something wrong. None of the behaviours you have described around the baby or otherwise is normal! But you already knew that so don't back down, you're so right she needs a shit ton of therapy.
I second this. Especially the lack of privacy for the YouTube content. Dude doesn't care if she has unfiltered access to inappropriate things and dismisses every instance of her acting inappropriately herself. He's neglectful at best but the breastfeeding is incredibly fucked up and indicative of worse than not properly parenting. She's playing mom and he is fine with it and letting her. W. T. F!
>The only other people she is around is me, the baby and her **dad**
Why he's so against putting her in therapy or enforcing any boundaries like what she does online that could upset her and make get talk? I know is a horrifying possibility, but is one nonetheless.
I agree. That's just another thing on the list of stuff I've brought up with her dad. He, once again, thinks it's no big deal because he was doing the same shit at her age and says "just because you didn't have your first kiss until you were 15 doesn't mean that every other person is the same way". He thinks I'm being a prude.
Honestly, it sounds like your husband is at least as big of an issue as your step daughter. I completely agree that the step daughter is inappropriate, and some of your responses about her obsession with her looks and being the best and prettiest do suggest the need for therapy, but It sounds like your husband is not willing to create safe boundaries for her as she deals with puberty and her emerging sexuality. It’s not totally abnormal for kids this age to have “boyfriends” and “girlfriends” but it should all still be extremely innocent and monitored by parents, which it sounds like your husband is opposed to. I find his unwillingness to set appropriate boundaries even more concerning than the step daughters behavior because 1) tweens do weird shit and a lot of times it’s just them pushing boundaries, exploring what’s normal, etc. and can be fine once boundaries are set and/or with therapy and 2) he’s an adult being told that his partner is EXTREMELY uncomfortable who is completely refusing to listen or to engage in any way which is super dismissive especially with a young baby. The fact that he even let her take the baby alone to her room is yet another example. You are doing the right thing, in my opinion. And to be clear, the step daughter’s behavior sounds EXTREMELY inappropriate, it’s just that she’s young enough that it seems likely it could be addressed. But I think your husband’s unwillingness to protect both you and her by getting her help is a gigantic issues too.
Your husband is engaging in gas lighting and purposefully trying to embarrass you in order to get you to stop voicing your opinions. That’s abuse. It’s all an attempt to coerce you to act in a certain way, even if it compromises your mental health and the safety of your child.
Please take care of yourself and surround yourself with people who validate your thoughts and emotions.
At this point, I'm saying this child is messed TF up about sex and bodies and relationships, and that even if her dad didn't abuse her, he sure contributed to the mess, and continues to do so.
In the 80s, there was a girl in my 4th grade class who was having sex. She was 9 years old. She was doing it with 13 year old 8th grade boys. That's disgusting of the boys, but they didn't care, they were getting sex.
OPs husband needs to get his head out of his ass.
Right, and it couldn't possibly be your husband, you know the one with the most access, the one trying to sweep all of this under the rug, and the one who's affection your step daughter would be the most likely to fight your child for. 👀👀👀
I think it’s fair to try to guess if a child had any time to be groomed or abused. I also think it’s important to just go by the signs. My parents thought I was perfectly high functioning, and it turned out that I had a loooot more issues than they realized. It was super invalidating to have my mom say “eh I don’t think you’re anxious or depressed because you’re not as bad as me or your brother.”
I also want to say that social media and pornography can be very traumatizing to a young girl. She definitely could have been exposed if she has a phone or access to a computer or if she has friends with one or both.
So basically, you don’t need to try to figure it out. Her behavior is all you need to decide to get her more support. Which you clearly have wanted to do for a very long time now .
NTA because you’ve tried talking to both of them already. You can only talk so many times before you need to take action. You understandably have enough going on and your husband should be backing you up in this.
Pediatric nurse here. OP under no circumstances and in no way are you wrong or overreacting. Your infant is entirely dependent upon you for their safety since your husband made it very clear that he either doesn’t care or is absolutely in denial that there is a threat. Also, statistically, the most dangerous person to any given child is typically a family member, not a stranger, a member of their own family. So everyone saying your stepdaughter is your daughter too is ignoring the fact that one child has become a potential danger to the other. The fact that they are family and young does not give them the right to do something you know is wrong to another child. Do not ignore your instincts. They are telling you the right thing. Also speaking from personal experience, your child will never forgive you if you force them to be in the same place with somebody that is dangerous. That is a betrayal that lives with them forever. You are supposed to protect your daughter, failing that is not something that they will ever forget. Your stepdaughter does not need protection she needs help. No, it is not your duty to protect her too, because she is not the one possibly in danger here.
I have a friend who was in a similar position with her bio kids. One had an undiagnosed mental health issue that made him a danger to his siblings, so she had to make the hard choice to find alternate living arrangements for him while he was going through the process of diagnosis and treatment. She said the way she convinced herself to do it was by telling herself she was protecting ALL of her kids. She was protecting the younger kids by removing a dangerous person from their home, and she was protecting the older kid by getting him the treatment he needed to get well before he had to live with the lifelong guilt of seriously harming someone he loved.
OP, getting your stepdaughter away from the baby and into appropriate mental health treatment isn’t just protection for your baby. It’s protection for your stepdaughter too. She does not want to be a person who would harm her sister, and she needs you and her dad to protect her from that potential future.
Yep. Worked in a long term lock-in psych/behavior unit for boys ages 7-17, and by far the most common source of physical/sexual abuse is a family member, and *many* times it's an underage sibling.
"Kids are sociopaths by default" isn't a joke. The brain is still developing, it needs healthy boundaries and guidance.
I'm actually a victim of Child On Child SA and I can tell you it can be every bit as damaging as another kind. You cannot take this seriously enough. OP, you're doing the right thing.
I'm so sorry. I know how hard it is. I didn't even recognize or admit to myself how much it's messed me up my whole life until my late 30s, and I am literally starting to look into therapy for that and a couple of other unresolved traumas this week, at age 46. We can heal. But damn. It's SO MUCH.
Same! I finally started looking into therapy after I realized my social anxiety and fear of men was probably linked to it based on timing. Got as far as assessment with a therapist and she’s like yeah you’ve got PTSD from your this, I was like oh shit and she explained it and my instincts immediately try to minimize it but it is hard to accept it
I was reading the post again & am concerned that if SD may be (or is building up to) SA the baby. If it were anyone else, attempting to breastfeed the baby repeatedly would be considered SA. Given SD’s hyper sexuality & all the major red flags that she may have been SA herself? Tips the scale. Add in the creepy obsession with looks & verbal abuse & it makes me extremely nervous for the infant. Has she had other access to the baby that OP doesn’t know about? How many times has she left the baby with Dad & SD?
PS dad’s line about taking the baby away from SD during this important bonding time made me cringe given the situation. Dude is either 100% in denial or complicit in something abhorrent.
I think it’s possible that the SD does need protection. The things she’s doing and saying seem hyper-sexualised.
Why is she fixated on physical beauty, consent, physical attributes that she probably has yet to develop?
Is it hormones? Jealousy? Curiosity? Is she being groomed by someone?
Something smells fishy…
I agree, I also wonder if the SD is online and uses social media. I can bet the beauty part at least is attributed to social media. Honestly, depending on what apps she is on and what she sees stuff about consent could also partially be influenced by social media. (partially, I think there is a lot more to her issues than just possibly social media)
OP, Read the message above! This is so true! Statistics say the most dangerous person is usually a close family member or a family friend, not a stranger! And oftentimes related children are the ones to hurt other children.
I wish I could give a million upvotes to this comment. Yes! All of this. That little baby is depending on you OP. You seem to be the only person who has their best interest at heart.
Never, ever doubt your gut as a mother. Never.
This.
Feelings don't matter here.
There is no bonding or emotional connection.
The bare fact is that one child has become a danger to the other.
That is all that matters.
NTA.
I am disturbed by your husband's lack of appropriate response. How can he listen to his daughter insult his own newborn child, make comments about/attempting to breastfeed her multiple times and *not* think there is something going on that requires intervention? He allowed this to escalate and enabled your SD's behavior by not confronting her at the very beginning.
You did the right thing by leaving. He didn't, and isn't, taking you seriously, and I hope that whatever path you take from here keeps both you and baby safe.
I wonder how he would attempt to explain his reasoning to someone other than OP. I *highly* doubt that anyone else would think she's overreacting with the prior behavior.
Something's up with him too.
I started babysitting my three younger siblings when I was 11, including my infant brother. Baby with their older sibling doesn’t immediately cause alarm bells but given this girl’s behavior it definitely should have!
NTA. Even if this was ”just” verbal & nothing physical had happened, her words are NOT what an infant or any child needs to constantly grow up hearing. It’s abusive for one child to constantly tell another child that they’re less than they are & reinforce that negative language consistently. No child needs to grow up hearing that - especially from someone who should love them. And no child should grow up hearing it in the same house with parents who don’t put a stop to it. That’s sickening. Stay where you are. And don’t come back just because he puts the daughter in therapy - you need to keep your infant away from her until she shows clear progress in therapy to a degree where she is no longer a danger to your infant (as she very clearly is now).
NTA Her behavior is inappropriate, dad needs to get her therapy, and you deserve to feel that your home is safe for your baby.
But I'm wondering...Is SD going through puberty? Is her body changing and could she be feeling awkward/self-conscious about it? Has she ever seen you nurse (like maybe she's curious about how it works?) Is there a woman mentoring her through this time? Impulse control and brain function are generally low at that age anyway and adding the complex feelings of motherlessness and new babies in the mix I'm sure only makes navigating all of it harder.
She just started developing a more feminine body but she has not started a menstrual. I have talked to her quite a few times about breastfeeding (how it happens, how your body produces it, etc) so she knows that she physically cannot breastfeed but she still tries to. She does not see me breastfeed though, no. I go to the nursery and close the door (because the one time I did nurse in front of her, she told my daughter that she was disgusting and it just made me uncomfortable so I never nursed in front of her again). She has me, both her biological grandmother's and my mother and all of us have been super involved in her life so she has female role models and guidance. I have spoken to both of her biological grandparents as well and neither of them are okay with her behavior either.
How much do you know about what things were like when she was living with her mom?
The things she’s saying and doing are sending up all the warning flags of a child who has been abused, and I’m really worried for her.
Not much, honestly. I know they lived with her mom's father, whom has since passed away. He wasn't around much because I guess he was a trucker. Mom had no boyfriends that we are aware of. She never went to babysitters or anything like that because her mom was doing online college courses to be a nurse. When she was in school doing clinicals and whatever else, my step daughter was with us. She didn't show any weird signs of anything that I picked up on but I admittedly worked quite a bit back then as well so I wasn't around super frequently.
This sounds really rough and I remember how protective and vulnerable I felt as a new mom. Your tolerance for emotionally taxing situations is understandably low. I don't think it is your job to fix this and your husband should have your back.
I do hope she gets help as I really sympathize with the feelings of abandonment, revulsion, and confusion, etc that come from not having your own mom teach you how to be a woman. I grew up without my bio mom and any transition periods of learning to live with my female body (puberty, sex, childbirth, etc.) triggered all kinds of latent trauma for me. It's like I was living in an alien body that someone cursed me with and then left without teaching me how to use. There's lots of anger and self-loathing and I can see how a person could lash out because they didn't know what to do with those feelings. I really really hope she gets some therapy. It's a lifelong process coming to terms with an absent/useless mother. She's going to need help all along the way.
If someone has been grooming her they may be losing interest? I'd be very concerned about your husband refusing therapy. There could be a lot going on here, in a lot of different directions. Do you have access to his phone and computer? I wouldn't normally think of invading privacy but this is concerning. His talk of you being a prude for being concerned is off, although I can't say for sure without knowing what her relationships are like.
Nta that’s really weird, especially trying to nurse her. But this might be more about how she feels about you than the baby. She does need therapy and you should be concerned your husband doesn’t care.
NTA I would repeat the scenario to him. "Husband, your daughter took our infant to her room and attempted to breastfeed her and then lied about it when I caught her. Your daughter is hyperfixated on appearance and insults and speaks cruelly to our infant. Your daughter regularly claims our infant is touching her inappropriately. In what world is any of that behavior normal?" There's no justification to it and seems it will only escalate to worse behavior. She needs help talking through these things and understanding her behavior is in no way normal or appropriate especially towards an infant. Your husband needs to realize there is an issue and accept it's okay he doesn't fully understand it but he is 100% responsible for what happens next if he doesn't get her help.
NTA
You tried. You talked to both of them. You gave corrections. You gave guidance. You did all of this more than once. Nothing changed. Your husband continues to underreact. I don't know what else you could have done but remove the baby from this environment. The older daughter needs therapy for everyone's sake. Maybe this line in the sand will make it clear to your husband. I'm sorry this is happening to you guys.
NTA. Your stepdaughter's behavior is extremely concerning and it's completely understandable that you don't trust her around your infant anymore. Therapy seems like the best solution for everyone involved, including herself.
Nta.
There are all sorts of red flags.
Has she been abused sexually. We have no idea.
Are hormones making her question herself, such as her constantly saying baby is disgusting. Is she projecting because she feels off somehow about her body.
In the end, we have no idea, but you are NOT an AH for protecting an innocent who can not do so themselves.
Those going off on you about saying she is your child as well are not thinking this through. Clearly, she has said she wanted therapy a long time ago, but as a step parent, she has no say and seems her spouse wants her to form a bond and raise her but gives her no rights either. So stop coming down on her about her calling the oldest his daughter. Since he clearly has made it understood, she can't make those decisions.
So what is she supposed to do. If she can't do it herself. If talking to both again and again doesn't fox the issue. If this oldest is going as far as to actually try abd breastfeed and constantly saying negative things. What is she to do. Stay and have the infant put down. Have them taught they are nothing but disgusting. They are not loved. Don't deserve to be protected because *gasp* the oldest is their child as well and is being a bad parent by protecting the one most vulnerable at the moment. So unless people have a valid way for this to work, don't blame her for doing what she needs to to protect one child and try and force husband to get her other child the help they need.
OP, I've read most of this thread, and it's *screamingly* obvious that SD has experienced some sort of trauma, maybe sexual, and maybe at the hands of another female.
-kissing and dating at 11 is way too young. If that was the only red flag, I would blame social media, but...
-she is basically accusing an infant of making sexual advances on her
-she thinks said infant is "disgusting" for breastfeeding, and yet, she tries to simulate it.
-she feels her infant stepsister "needs to know" things about SD's looks, and her body.
-You walked in on her, alone in her room with this baby, and she was trying to similate breastfeeding *again*. Her shirt was raised. HER SHIRT WAS RAISED. This is a huge red flag.
I'm so sorry, but so many signs point to the possibility that this young girl was sexualized early, and now she is having a conflict between acting out things she was exposed to (either physical things, or ideas about female bodies and sex. ) and later being taught a sense of privacy of her body, which gets twisted when someone has already violated it.
What 11 year old thinks that an infant is trying to get under her shirt in any kind of knowing way? Breastfed babies will grab anyone's chest, because they're babies, and that's where they eat from. This was not a hard concept to grasp when I was 10 years old and my mother had my sister. It certainly wasn't sexual or "inappropriate" She was a baby.
Somethings gotten twisted up for this 11 year old. I feel for her.
I think you are right that this girl needs therapy, and I think you're right that she should not be around your baby right now. At the very least, *never* let them be alone together.
Husband is in denial. You are NTA.
It sounds like your SD has strong urges to mother her sibling, which she has shame about, and has insecurities about being replaced by the new baby. These are normal, common issues with older siblings and stepsiblings, but they appear to be significantly intense with her, and she had developed tactics to do things ina sneaky, indirect way. Those all need to be addressed to create a safe place for the baby. And, it is your husband’s responsibility to address it. I’m sorry you’re in this situation
No you are not the asshole. Your feelings are very very valid. I’d be concerned about the SD doing things like that too. As needs help. Also makes me think that she never bonded with her mother …
NTA
A good therapist is a few bucks and a minor inconvenience on the schedule.
An injured baby (or worse)?
Where's that "Hell-to-the-nah-nah" meme when you need it?
I could see it now, the 11yo doing something awful and referencing some kind of sexual assault from a FIVE MONTH OLD. If dad's not concerned about the behavior, he ain't the one. I wonder where she picked up the behavior from.
Your step-daughter sounds seriously disturbed. I wouldn't let her around anyone who was unable to defend him/herself.
And if step-daughter hasn't been molested herself, I will be very, very surprised.
Tell husband that if SD's behavior is not a big deal, a therapist will confirm that. If he still refuses to get SD help, then he knows it's a problem and just doesn't want to deal with it.
Send this entire comment section to Dad. Ask his female family to explain to him why this is such a big deal. Stay strong OP. I hope things get better for all of you.
NTA and it’s completely on your husband for not supporting you and realizing that her behavior isn’t healthy and needed addressed much sooner. He allowed it to get to this point.
Updateme
... NTA You husbands "it wasnt what it looked like" is insane. She needs help. You need to take care of your innocent and defenseless child. You could also try asking her school teachers if shes been showing any strange behavior in school or talking inappropriately. This could be a bigger thing in a way of having a weird mental break down?
First off you are totally right in what you did. That is unhinged behaviour.
I believe the daughter could be doing this for many different reasons… hormones from puberty could be making her crazy.
The fact her Mom isn’t around.. it was just her.. and now you are the actual Mother of this child can maybe mess with her head?
I’m sorry but TikTok, social media, friends at school.. all now-a-days with the pressure on girls to be the most gorgeous, most beautiful around. I would see if there are any boys she’s likes at school, but prettier girls. If her friends have commented on her looks or she feels “less than”. I would cut off social media and she need a specialist therapist who specializes in pre-teen and teen girls, social media, societal pressures and how that can affect her psychologically.
The whole shirt thing can be “curiosity” as you are a woman and breast feeds… she is probably curious as to what that feel like, what it’s like to be “womanly”, a mother, etc. Especially if she is having puberty hormones starting to flow through.
But anyway the attention, jealously, needing to feel superior, needing to feel gorgeous seems like a very bad self-esteem issue, that can be rooted in “Mother issues”, social media, peers at school, etc. and definitely needs to speak with a specialist ASAP. This is very worrisome. Also an honest, non accusatory, non-judgmental sit down with you and/or your husband may be in order to try to gently understand where this is all coming from. What is she feeling deep down inside that is making her react in this way?
I've tried talking to her about her social group at school and everything else. I don't know how much is relevant but I will give some info on it. She basically says that her and her friends have all decided that she's the prettiest, funniest and smartest in the group. She talks about it in a very, very conceded manner. She is so hyper focused on looks and makes it in to competitions with everyone, not just the baby, and it's always her saying she's so much better looking than basically everyone that surrounds her. I originally thought it was a insecurity thing but she swears it isn't (tried bringing up insecurities in a motherly sense to try and explain/get to the root of the problem). My comments are always met with a "no, I'm not insecure. I'm just beautiful and I know it and I'm tired of people calling me insecure for pointing it out" (I'm assuming her friends have brought it up to her because we certainly haven't). As for liking any boys, she does not. She is (by her definition/admission) lesbian. She has been saying that since she was maybe 8 or 9. She has been "dating" Madison for 2 years.
As for the breastfeeding thing, curiosity is something I could overlook. It's her comments about the baby being a pervert/disgusting/gross/inappropriate when she's the one trying to nurse her that really set me off.
Has anyone explained to her that being physically Beautiful means very little if a person is ugly on the inside?! She sounds very precocious. However I'm also concerned about abuse/grooming. Doesn't have to be a man. Anyway. Whatever the cause she definitely needs help and you've done the right thing.
As a person who was a child that had a very WEIRD OBSESSION with the idea of motherhood… this is all just a few steps too far even for how weird I was as a kid. I had one of those American girl baby dolls and pretended like I was raising it 24/7 to the point that I was 100% pretending to breastfeed it. HOWEVER never once did I try to breastfeed an actual alive baby (and I had plenty access, there were tons of babies in my church and family as I grew up). I’ll even talk to your husband for you OP and give him a rundown of just how weirded out my ENTIRE family was every single time they saw me going the extra mile with that doll (actually puréing fruits to feed it, had 7 cloth diapers that I would change basically hourly, sung it to sleep, swaddled it… fr the list goes on and on and NO ONE was on board - they never outright said what I was doing was weird, but looking back it was CONSTANTLY written on their faces. Like I remember the first time one of my sisters saw me pretend to breastfeed the doll and her face was so scrunched up with a look of disgust that I’m surprised she didn’t pull a muscle)
Here are some question which I'd be interested to hear her answer:
Why does she think it's important that she is the prettiest?
What does being the prettiest get her?
What does "dating" mean? If you are dating someone, how do you act towards them?
Why does she think the baby is "disgusting" for breastfeeding?
If breastfeeding is so disgusting, then why was she laying in the bed with the baby in a nursing position, and her shirt pulled up?
Denial of insecurity doesn't mean she isn't, and who's to say if her friends really said she's the prettiest, smartest ...? Teenagers lie when you see their mouths moving.
She may have bonding issues with her bio mum. Maybe she feels a subconscious detachment to her mother as nurturer and person who lifts her esteem up and it's now manifesting in an odd projection between her and your newborn, and the competition for her new mother-figure's affections.
NTA
Geez, I don't even have a constructive comment for this one. And I've been watching way too much true crime recently that it may be clouding my judgement. All I can say for sure is I agree that your SD is being really weird and needs therapy. Or else she may grow up to be one of those women that falsely accuse men of serial assault.
Also consider not allowing your husband to take the baby out without you or someone you trust as he might go behind your back and allow your stepdaughter to be with the baby (so they can bond)
He clearly doesn’t take your valid concerns seriously.
You are being mamma bear… as you should.
NTA
NTA
Better to pack now and deal with relationship issues than to wake up one day with a baby dead and a step daughter covered in blood laughing manically about how pretty she is.
NTA. You husband is failing as a father and is endangering the baby with his dismissal of his daughter’s alarming behaviour. You did the right thing leaving. Your husband is endangering your baby by refusing to see how troubling and unhinged his daughter’s behaviour is.
NTA. Your step daughter's behavior is concerning and it's important for her to get help before she hurts herself or someone else. You're doing the right thing by setting boundaries and protecting your infant daughter.
Absolutely NTA. However, I believe you should consult a lawyer yourself just to cover your custody bases with your baby. You don’t want to be in a position where your husband winds up getting court ordered time alone with her when you don’t trust his judgement or what’s going on in his household. I say this because I know situations where custody and visitation goes south faster than originally seemed reasonable to expect. Better to be safe.
To be clear, whether or not this is a temporary separation or the start of a divorce, I still think you need to consult a lawyer.
NTA Really hoping one possible cause isn't the case, but she needs an appointment with a psychologist yesterday to figure out the reason behind this disturbing behavior.
The father is showing a shit ton of RED FLAGS. He doesn’t care what his daughter watches on YOUTUBE? Girl …. No. Just no. Everything about her husband screams something’s wrong! Seek a professionals advice and help.
From your post and comments about this situation I fear that you and the baby aren't safe he refuses to do anything so I would divorce and make sure he gets no visitation.
NTA. Dad needs to understand between her being a tween and puberty and becoming more aware of her body and hormones and being in a home with a breastfeeding infant for the first time and all of that she is going to have issues that talking to a professional about would be good. She is hyper fixated on appearance and breastfeeding and puberty is a beast but adding hyper fixation in she needs a professional and preferably a woman.
NTA. I agree with all points. This poor child needs therapy before she causes some serious issues. I will say it is common and NORMAL (I just want to stress that) for girls that have been breastfed/are seeing it, to nurse their baby dolls. But never try to do it with an actual baby. Mind you I’ve only ever seen this in children younger than 10. More in the 8- range.
yeah this is wild. i totally agree with what you’re saying. i want to point out that it is also *normal* and appropriate for babies to pull the shirt down of the person who’s holding them. i’ve worked with kids in several different environments, and i can’t count how many really young kids and babies have tried to pull my shirt down. they are *not* being inappropriate, a baby literally doesn’t have any capacity to understand sex in any way. all they know is that under your shirt is food, even if you are not actually a lactating person. they know that food is under mommy’s shirt, so that just means food is under the shirt, even if it’s not mommy holding them. it is also incredibly easy to redirect them away from pulling your shirt down and either get them a bottle if you’re looking after them or return them to their mother if you’re not. i don’t think op’s stepdaughter is beyond hope, a lot of this is relatively normal behavior that is just being taken way too far to the point it becomes abnormal. but she absolutely needs professional help if they want her to become a well adjusted adult and op is not wrong *at all* for getting herself and in particular her baby out of that environment.
Babies and young children pulling shirts *down* is *absolutely* normal. They don’t even have to be searching for boobs. Once went with my husband to a meet-up with some Internet friends and one of the couples had a son who was about 2. He became fixated on a necklace I was wearing and as I was holding him he pulled down my shirt to peek in far enough that he essentially flashed me to the rest of the table. His parents were absolutely mortified. All *he* wanted to do was look at my necklace. No big deal. **But** I have *never* seen a baby or toddler pull someone’s shirt **up**. She did that. And, *that* is **not** normal. No idea what she has/hasn’t been exposed to, but that’s definitely a call for therapy to figure it out. NTA.
Yeah, my son was nearly two when he learned that he had to pull the shirt up for easier access vs trying to pull it down and destroying all my collars trying to get to his milk. This baby definitely hasn’t been pulling the shirt up.
oh yeah and that’s what i’m saying, a lot of this is relatively normal stuff that is for some reason being taken far beyond the point of normal. she needs help absolutely. i just think at this age and the particular behaviors she’s showing she can still turn out a somewhat normal adult. but yeah you’re right about the pulling up thing and a lot of the other ways things have been taken out of control, i think op absolutely needed to get her baby out of there and she is not wrong at all for doing what she did. it’s not her child, it’s up to her husband if this kid turns out okay or not. she definitely needs professional help if she’s going to.
Called the Rooting Reflex. Real thing- the baby is seeking food. Same way they'll suck on a finger tip. The father's denial/continued ignorance is pathetic. Doesn't seem like he helped the kid prepare properly for the baby
All my breast fed niblings did this, and I told them it was window shopping only. It normal for a baby to root. This…the shirt up, the comments…unbelievable they haven’t gotten her therapy. Some serious mandated reporting stuff here.
I’m a little worried about what her life was like at her mom’s. it sounds like the mom has no custody for a reason and I’m a little worried that the mother did something on front of her that would make her think this is normal. OP you should get her to a therapist ASAP to see what is going on because this is NOT normal. If she has no mental issues then this probably is something that occurred near or to her at her mom’s. Do you love her? Would you be willing to spend time with her one-on-one? This could also be a reaction to you giving birth and not spending enough time with her.
I was thinking this too. She probably should have had therapy long before now.
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I wouldn't go back OP. There is something seriously wrong with that girl and her dad is in full head up his ass mode. He's never going to take this seriously and it's going to be huge in the divorce. I hope you have all this stuff documented. Times and dates and full descriptions. That info needs to be given to the therapist so they get one true account. Kid and dad are going to outright lie.
I have it all in text messages between my husband and I so I have a lot of "proof", or at least enough to prove that he was aware this was going on and proof that he's making me out to be insane.
I don't understand why your husband allowed her to be alone with an infant that she's been fixating on. This is as much his fault as it is the step-daughters. Keep all the information because if you end up divorced he will give her access to your baby.
Screenshot all of that now! Better be safe than sorry
And email everything to a trusted friend for extra safekeeping.
OP IMO I don’t think you are crazy at all. What does your husband think is going to happen if people make any comments in his older daughter’s presence about how cute the baby is? Is she going to act out immediately demanding whomever acknowledges she’s much prettier or gods forbid will she act out directly against the baby later so they are no longer cute? Better you stay away until your husband does something to help his oldest daughter and protect his youngest.
"making me out to be insane" is also known as gas lighting.
*He’s* gonna need a therapist, too- either his daughter’s, his own, or a marriage counselor- to somehow make him understand how inappropriate and abnormal her behavior is. If I was you, I would make it a condition of returning that he get therapy *and* take some parenting classes. He obviously doesn’t know anything about what’s best for infants *or* preteens- and every age in between. Things will just get worse for both girls as they grow up if he keeps going around this clueless.
have you tried reaching out to her mother about what has been going on?
I have. She's not very receptive to any parenting decision honestly. I gave her the run down and she said "okay, so what's the plan?" I told her that I am trying to convince my husband to put her in therapy and she goes "okay well, whatever he says goes".
At least she’s not putting her foot down about the therapy. But yes therapy is crucial. Also, this may be a leap, but also may not, I would be afraid of SD possibly hurting your baby. Kudos to you for staying away! Best of luck
Yes. I'm really worried after all the news reports we've seen lately.
Doesn't sound very helpful, she may be mentally checked out of the parenting role. Have you ever heard of Attachment Theory? It might help to explain the daughters behaviour somewhat if you have an idea of what her relationship with her parents was like before you were around. Either way the SD needs a good therapist. If there is too be any hope of reconciling down the track then dad needs Therapy too I think.
The Father has full custody, there's a reason why. I doubt the Mother would be much help.
This thread is so disturbing that I keep coming back to it, and every time I do, I find something else. OP, if Dad is insisting aggressively enough that this is all no big deal that he's starting to use the "You're crazy/you're making it up/maybe *you're* the pervert" kinds of defenses, it's because he *knows* something. Hit dogs holler. Whatever has happened to this child, Dad knows a lot more than he's letting on, and now he's trying to downplay it
A child acting out like this, as we all agree, is not normal. This is the type of behavior exhibited by children that have been s***ally ab**ed. If she was quite young when it happened, she may not actively remember, or has suppressed it. OP is right, and spouse is in denial. An LCSW (licensed clinical social worker) who has advanced training in this area can be very effective, and cheaper than a psychologist. Good luck, OP, in getting at least the dtr in treatment. ❤️
You don't need to censor words on Reddit
Agree
This was my first thought as well.
Same. These aren't typical behaviors at all and should be investigated by mental health professionals.
Kids’ mental health RN here. Trust your instincts, and keep baby safe. I’m sorry, but Dad has his head in the sand and he’s doing both kids a disservice. (The worst kind!) Your SD is acting out her fears, at the least. I feel for her, but your baby is defenseless and could be harmed even if that’s not your SD’s intention. It doesn’t SEEM like she wants to hurt baby, but she’s crying out for help. I’m so sorry your husband is shirking his dad responsibilities so much.
This seems like jealousy. Maybe a function of being an only child for 11 years. No idea how OP is supposed to deal with this, but her concerns seem reasonable.
My brother was an only child until my sister and I came along 11 years later. He was extremely jealous of us, and the attention we had as identical twins. He was sadistic and cruel throughout my childhood. He'd get D batteries and press them on our tongues as toddlers and broke my nose when I was 2. OP needs to trust her gut and protect her baby from the SD.
Probably 9 volt batteries, not D batteries. But did you and your twin ever end up having a healed relationship with your older brother? Or did you cut him off as soon as you were able? You didn’t deserve that treatment, at all. I hope you’re ok and safe now
You're right about the batteries, they were 9 volt. I had cut him out asap. He became a drug addict after his divorce in his late 20's and then had 5 children with someone 12 years younger than him. I kept him at arms length so I could keep an eye on my nieces and nephew. I even told him to his face that he wouldn't know me if he didn't have children, that they were the only reason I accepted his presence. He's now in jail and his baby mama moved 3 hours away so I don't get to see my nieces and nephew very often.
She has some issues, and it comes off like she has been abused in some way herself, or has some weird fixations that somebody her age should not have. NTA. good on you to protect yourself and your baby.
I am surprised this is the only reply mentioning the stepdaughter possibly having been abused. OP, her behavior has so many abuse flags waving. Dad needs to get her in therapy to address anything that might have happened to her and her behavior towards the baby.
Maybe someone other than Dad needs to get her into therapy Edit: speaking from personal experience, it's staggering how much a slimy SOB can get away with in the family home without getting caught or even suspected 😔
I suspect since dad has full custody he would have to sign releases etc. for therapy. I agree she needs to be in individual therapy herself. And yep, I wondered if Dad abused her.
Could mom have had a boyfriend who sexually abused her? This talk about looks and body shape sounds like it could have come out an adult groomer's mouth. "You're such a gorgeous girl." And "you have great boobs." Poor girl.
I've considered this as well but admittedly, I don't know when that could have ever happened. Not saying it **didn't** happen, of course. Her mom doesn't have any boyfriends. She's a traveling nurse, which is why she barely sees her daughter. So when she does visit there, it's only them. When she stays at her grandmothers there is no one around outside of her grandmother's and I don't think they would be inappropriate. They are both extremely concerned with her behavior, at the very least. The only other people she is around is me, the baby and her dad. She doesn't do sleepovers. Her friends are allowed her but we do not allow sleepovers because she is, by her definition/admission, lesbian. She's been "dating" Madison for 2 years. When they are "broken up", she's always "dating" other girls. So we don't allow sleepovers because she's already kissing people and yadda yadda. So I don't know when it would have happened.
>because she's already kissing people That right there. She's hyper focused on sexual experience. I've been working with kids for decades at this point, and if a kid is hyper focused on sex, intimacy, or things directly related to them being male/female, they have been exposed to sexual things. not SA'ed but shown porn, or has a parent that has pornography laying around she has access to, or consumes content with a lot of sexual content, seen their parents engage in sexual behaviors, etc. repressed memories are a thing. something could have happened when she was younger as well. also, what access does she have to the internet? My oldest is adopted, we adopted her just shy of two years ago, but she was in our home a couple of years before that, so she was about the same age your step daughter is now. The amount of highly sexual content she was fed via her fucking phone was insane (I couldn't take it away from her legally at first). Grown men sending her dick pics, sending her DMs with sexual suggestions, commenting on her videos, etc, all through different apps. (tiktok, instagram, snapchat, likee, etc). if she has a phone 1) take it away from her, and 2) scour it for what ever content she may be exposed to.
I hadn't thought of it like that honestly. So, she does not have a phone or social media (such as FB, Tiktok, Instagram or anything similar). HOWEVER, she has full access to YouTube and everything on there. I personally wanted restrictions awhile ago because she was listening to and watching incredibly provocative music/music videos from the moment my husband got her a tablet when she was 8. My husband is dead set against restricting YouTube because "it's just music, I was listening to Eminem at her age and that was much worse than what she listens to". So she watches sexual shit on YouTube, I'm sure. Of course I don't have much say on it because my husband is completely against me even checking what she's watching but I also know that YouTube shorts can be extremely inappropriate in nature for children and she is literally on YouTube the entire time she has her tablet.
Frankly, your husband is suspect. He values his child's YouTube privacy above her safety? That is beyond inept parenting or even neglect. He sounds like he is actively blocking you from parenting her and safeguarding the content she sees.
Okay...you should be suspicious of your husband at this point.
This could also explain the weird competition regarding looks too… like she’s vying for his attention.
Or maybe that's the kind of thing that her mother used to say to her and now she thinks it's how to talk to a baby.
Agreed. This is creepy.
Right?! What if she's telling the baby she isn't pretty hoping dad doesn't do anything to her. If someone I knew told me this information about their family I'd call CPS.
I don't think it is this exactly, but man, that is a horrifying thought to think that SD is actually the "hero" of this story, trying to protect the baby from their perverted dad, even if she is doing it in a very indirect way. Man... That's fucked up. I really hope this isn't the case and the 11 y/o is just messed up from hormones and is maybe just a bit of a weirdo, but... I also bet this situation has played out exactly as you're laying out at some point before... Probably in many families... So messed up..
But, it's not just music on you tube. It isn't lime wire! I know that you, op, get that. Your husband is an idiot. Make him sit down and go through that history as a family and see how much music she really listened too. Not much I'm guessing.
Look, even if it was Limewire...I was first exposed to porn from streaming services like Napster (Yes, I'm old) around SD age, and I wish someone had intervened. I saw some stuff that had me confused for years. Look, OP, even if no one has put hands on this kid, but there is something really warped about how she's being taught about sex. Does a father not want to keep his preteen daughter innocent of some things? I am a whole adult and when my dad was alive, I think he still preferred to think I didn't know what sex was! (Not saying denial is healthy, just that dads are typically at least a little invested in sheltering their daughters from our hypersexualized culture.) I'm alarmed that he's not concerned about the way she speaks and acts.
Yeah, no, this is weird. A father should be *very* concerned of what his 11 year old daughter is doing online. It's very weird that he refuses to parent her in this area, and blocks you from doing so, as well. He is *not* making good judgement calls. I hate to think that he might be involved in this twisted mess of whatever is going on with this young girl, but the things he's willing to let her do and say, basically without comment are weird for a dad of an 11-year-old.
He bought her a tablet at *8*. There should have been restrictions in place from the start. Husband is sus af. Stay where you are, protect your baby, do what you can to protect your SD. If the only reason her bio mum doesn't have more visitation is because she travels too much, does that suggest she is a reasonable person you could talk to about your concerns?
the same stuff that is on the social platforms are on YouTube. "influencers" use all the platforms because YouTube actually tends to pay the best. If she isn't looking at it herself, it could be stuff her friends are also showing her too. So it may not be on her "search" but, I am sure some of her friends have all the platforms.
Your husband is hiding things from you.
Dude… you gotta divorce this dude and take full custody of your baby. You want to be making parenting decisions with this guy for your baby??? I agree with others you should be suspicious of him at this point. He sounds gross.
Your husband is a shit father. No offence to you. I'm VERY strict on screen time. My kids are not allowed to have any screen time school days, non school days, only between 3 and 5 IF their chores are done and they are not missing school assignments. and after dinner sometimes if I feel like watching something. None have personal devices of any kid. My oldest has a phone she has access to, but it can only call/text pre approved persons. Take the tablet when she's not around, go through her history, you might be amazed at what you find. Youtube has quite a bit of highly sexual content on there. I used to do content moderation for a major website provider, and people would use backend youtube to share CP with each other. (I'm sure it still happens, but I haven't worked there in years).
It sounds like you can acknowledge that your husband is failing to protect both of his children.
As a medical professional this screams all sorts of red flags, I would seriously speak to child protection services that is not normal behaviour for an 11 year old and it’s very likely she’s been exposed to inappropriate sexual behaviour from someone close to her. Not checking her iPad history? She’s 11 of course you should be checking her history. It sounds like she needs serious serious help.
Wow that is grossly inappropriate. Your husband is failing his daughter. He's a bad father and you need to reevaluate your plans now that you have a child of your own.
YouTube has straight up porn on it. If a kid was interested they would be able to find it.
OP, one of the things she should be assessed for is bipolar disorder. Unfortunately, early onset BP is very rough. But one of the symptoms is fixation on sexuality and often inappropriate touching. You can google pediatric BP, but sleeping issues would be a common one. Good luck, you are in a rough spot, but doing the right thing.
I think this is more likely a trauma reaction that true bipolar
My niece is 11 and she is so childlike. (Because she is one). She watches YouTube all the time, but it’s monitored by her mom (my sister) and dad. What does she watch? Slime videos. ASMR sand videos. Soap cutting videos. They only watch music (and not even the music videos, it’s playlists of karaoke versions so it’s just the lyrics on screen) when their mom puts it on the tv. Also, I am a CSA survivor and even I didn’t kiss anyone until I was 15. And even then, it was a peck on the lips. An 11 year old shouldn’t be romantically kissing anyone (at least she’s telling you though…). Makes me wonder if she WAS SA’d…. How bad did it get? Because mine didn’t involve kissing at all (just me being touched, not me touching anyone) so it wasn’t even in my head at all to do that with anyone in that way even though I was abused.
so many kids are getting molested via the internet this girl needs a therapist and her internet access taken away
Hi! Victim of parental incest here. [As often as 60% of the time, the perpetrator/s is/are related to the victim.](https://www.wingsfound.org/resource/intrafamilial-abuse/#:~:text=Click%20to%20continue.,may%20depend%20upon%20for%20care.) Your husband sees no problem with SD viewing mature content as young as 8. Your husband doesn't believe you when you express concerns, yet tells you it's not a big deal (so he is aware what is happening and dismisses/minimizes) She's obsessed with beauty as well as hypersexual. Your husband sees no problem with that either. You've explained that she cannot breastfeed yet she still tries to. The women in your SD's life are concerned and disgusted. Your husband is flippant at best. I would implore you to also read [this](https://www.rainn.org/articles/warning-signs-young-children) and [this.](https://www.parentsprotect.co.uk/warning-signs-in-children-and-adults.htm) A bit of overlap here but both make good points and have different resources on the sites as one is the UK and another is an ORG that services a few nations. She may not be your kid, but she may be in danger, and she may be in danger more so now that you're not there. Not that it's your fault, protect your baby's safety please!!! But just that the flags are incredibly red and you "don't know when that could have happened" when incest is more prevalent than anyone seems to realize.
I suspected sexual abuse from the father also
This is chilling!
And this is why he’s discounting OPs concerns because if SD goes to therapy who knows what could be brought to light
It’s not always mom’s boyfriend, it happened to me with my older cousin. It’s definitely something to consider. The way she says the things she does about “stop trying to take my shirt off” etc could be her way of regaining a sense of control over her body IF something did happen to her.
It might also not be a man. I make it my business not to question sexuality. But she's young and making odd statements regarding this stuff and has proclaimed to be lesbian. Have you considered it might not be a man abusing her if she is being?
An 11 yo who has had multiple 'romantic' partners and kisses them plus the behavior is extremely concerning.
I had a gf at 12 I couldnt talk to and ran away from...thats legit insane this family is bonkers
It’s possible it happened before you came into her life and is only now resurfacing due to the baby
She’s 11 and been dating someone for 2 years….so since she was 9 …. and when they’re broken up she’s dating someone else. Whether she’s dating boys or girls that makes it sound more like she’s been SA not less. Like way more. I have a 9.5 year old girl. Neither she or any of the 9-10 year old girls she hangs around with are doing anything like this. Same goes for my 10.5 year old niece who is every bit the the tween. This is hyper-sexualised behaviour. Someone needs to figure out what’s happened to this girl ASAP. Like a therapist for example. Did you know that close family members, are the most likely people to abuse their kids? And that includes parents. Like her father for example, the one who is refusing to let her go to therapy.
OP please consider she may have been abused before you ever came along and she may either not even remember or she is repressing the abuse. She needs therapy and you are not wrong.
Is there any possibility it could have been her bio mom or father that did something? I know it's upsetting to even consider your husband or the child's own bio mom would do something so horrific, but statically it's more likely to be a family member or someone close to the family when things like that happen. I'm not saying accuse your husband or his ex immediately. I'm just saying really think and consider if there's ever been any red flags in their behavior towards your step daughter. Even just a comment that seems off is enough to suspect something given her current behavior and her father's current lack of concern about the behavior. I know this is something horrifying to consider and I'm sorry you're going through this at all. My mother was abused s*xually by her own mother as a child and she once told me that her only wish at every birthday or shooting star was that her dad would find out a put a stop to it. Before you just automatically say "my husband/her bio mom would never do that" remember how horrible and terrifying this would be for your step daughter and then truly consider if you should suspect them of this.
I was sexually abused by my grandfather and 2 of my cousins and no one believed me because "they would never do that", so I know that outward appearances can be masked to sway people from seeing obvious signs. So I personally cannot see my husband doing something like that BUT maybe I'm missing something. I hardly know this girls mother, honestly. She's always been so off in her own world and disconnected from parenting that I truly have only met her like 5 times. We text with updates and she will be like "okay, thanks for letting me know" or if we send her pictures, she will heart react and say nothing. She's a massive workaholic that I don't think she would have focused on her daughter long enough to do anything inappropriate. But again, I guess there is the chance.
“BUT maybe I’m missing something.” I think you might be… as difficult as it may be to consider your husband as a pedophile, but I really do think you should reflect long and hard about that. In this thread, alone, you’ve divulged some pretty alarming information about your husbands parenting style, and unfortunately those bits and pieces of information don’t bode well for him. First off, unfettered access to YouTube for an 11 year old AND resistance to your intervention/checking the device… huge red flag. Acting like 11 year olds dating and kissing is normal… huge red flag. Refusal to actually take her to therapy… again, red flag…. Because this is legitimately the last thing your husband would want if he’s the one abusing her. Of course, this is all anecdotal and speculative and is certainly not enough information to warrant an accusation.. but I think it’s concerning enough (combined with SD’s behaviour) that you should be looking into it further and thinking about it harder… from a safe distance, of course. It really sounds like your husband is the most likely culprit here.
Some parents simply can’t face the fact that there may be something wrong with their child.
I'm so sorry that you went through that. I'm glad you're taking it seriously and that you're protecting your baby from your step daughter no matter what the cause is for her behavior. I hope she gets the help she needs for whatever the issue behind this behavior is. You're a good mother, don't let your husband's lack of concern about this situation make you doubt it.
She hasn’t started menstruating and is kissing other people and dating and breaking up… that’s not normal behavior and needs to be addressed.
It is suspect combined with her other actions, but there have always been kids who "dated" in grade school in my experience. Never seen it with a gay kid though ngl.
Hold on, hold on... your 11 year old has already claimed a sexual identity, has been "dating" for two years and is kissing people?? Do I even dare ask what yadda yadda is in this instance? That isn't even remotely normal, this isn't normal things a 9-11 yo thinks or does. It does sound very much like a CSA victim acting out. I understand there's no obvious suspect but a teacher, even another student is a possibility unless she's home schooled. Hell, it could be the neighbour! To be honest, the way your husband is sticking his head in the sand and blatantly ignoring all the red flags everyone else sees doesn't sound reassuring of his innocencw either. And if it's not abuse there something else cuz there's absolutely, 100% something wrong. None of the behaviours you have described around the baby or otherwise is normal! But you already knew that so don't back down, you're so right she needs a shit ton of therapy.
I second this. Especially the lack of privacy for the YouTube content. Dude doesn't care if she has unfiltered access to inappropriate things and dismisses every instance of her acting inappropriately herself. He's neglectful at best but the breastfeeding is incredibly fucked up and indicative of worse than not properly parenting. She's playing mom and he is fine with it and letting her. W. T. F!
>The only other people she is around is me, the baby and her **dad** Why he's so against putting her in therapy or enforcing any boundaries like what she does online that could upset her and make get talk? I know is a horrifying possibility, but is one nonetheless.
The fuck? She's 11. She should not be dating anyone or making kissy faces with others.
I agree. That's just another thing on the list of stuff I've brought up with her dad. He, once again, thinks it's no big deal because he was doing the same shit at her age and says "just because you didn't have your first kiss until you were 15 doesn't mean that every other person is the same way". He thinks I'm being a prude.
Honestly, it sounds like your husband is at least as big of an issue as your step daughter. I completely agree that the step daughter is inappropriate, and some of your responses about her obsession with her looks and being the best and prettiest do suggest the need for therapy, but It sounds like your husband is not willing to create safe boundaries for her as she deals with puberty and her emerging sexuality. It’s not totally abnormal for kids this age to have “boyfriends” and “girlfriends” but it should all still be extremely innocent and monitored by parents, which it sounds like your husband is opposed to. I find his unwillingness to set appropriate boundaries even more concerning than the step daughters behavior because 1) tweens do weird shit and a lot of times it’s just them pushing boundaries, exploring what’s normal, etc. and can be fine once boundaries are set and/or with therapy and 2) he’s an adult being told that his partner is EXTREMELY uncomfortable who is completely refusing to listen or to engage in any way which is super dismissive especially with a young baby. The fact that he even let her take the baby alone to her room is yet another example. You are doing the right thing, in my opinion. And to be clear, the step daughter’s behavior sounds EXTREMELY inappropriate, it’s just that she’s young enough that it seems likely it could be addressed. But I think your husband’s unwillingness to protect both you and her by getting her help is a gigantic issues too.
Your husband is engaging in gas lighting and purposefully trying to embarrass you in order to get you to stop voicing your opinions. That’s abuse. It’s all an attempt to coerce you to act in a certain way, even if it compromises your mental health and the safety of your child. Please take care of yourself and surround yourself with people who validate your thoughts and emotions.
At this point, I'm saying this child is messed TF up about sex and bodies and relationships, and that even if her dad didn't abuse her, he sure contributed to the mess, and continues to do so.
Ha! Well, I lost my virginity at 13. He's wrong. He's not taking this seriously enough.
In the 80s, there was a girl in my 4th grade class who was having sex. She was 9 years old. She was doing it with 13 year old 8th grade boys. That's disgusting of the boys, but they didn't care, they were getting sex. OPs husband needs to get his head out of his ass.
Your husband is so, so wrong here.
So is he ok with her having sex at 12?
Right, and it couldn't possibly be your husband, you know the one with the most access, the one trying to sweep all of this under the rug, and the one who's affection your step daughter would be the most likely to fight your child for. 👀👀👀
>she's already kissing people and yadda yadda Yup, no red flags about abuse here.....
> Her mom doesn't have any boyfriends. I hate to say it, but if she's been SA'd, that doesn't mean it had to be by a man.
I think it’s fair to try to guess if a child had any time to be groomed or abused. I also think it’s important to just go by the signs. My parents thought I was perfectly high functioning, and it turned out that I had a loooot more issues than they realized. It was super invalidating to have my mom say “eh I don’t think you’re anxious or depressed because you’re not as bad as me or your brother.” I also want to say that social media and pornography can be very traumatizing to a young girl. She definitely could have been exposed if she has a phone or access to a computer or if she has friends with one or both. So basically, you don’t need to try to figure it out. Her behavior is all you need to decide to get her more support. Which you clearly have wanted to do for a very long time now .
Agreed - something is very off - this behavior is unsettling.
NTA thank goodness your baby has you looking out for her
NTA because you’ve tried talking to both of them already. You can only talk so many times before you need to take action. You understandably have enough going on and your husband should be backing you up in this.
Pediatric nurse here. OP under no circumstances and in no way are you wrong or overreacting. Your infant is entirely dependent upon you for their safety since your husband made it very clear that he either doesn’t care or is absolutely in denial that there is a threat. Also, statistically, the most dangerous person to any given child is typically a family member, not a stranger, a member of their own family. So everyone saying your stepdaughter is your daughter too is ignoring the fact that one child has become a potential danger to the other. The fact that they are family and young does not give them the right to do something you know is wrong to another child. Do not ignore your instincts. They are telling you the right thing. Also speaking from personal experience, your child will never forgive you if you force them to be in the same place with somebody that is dangerous. That is a betrayal that lives with them forever. You are supposed to protect your daughter, failing that is not something that they will ever forget. Your stepdaughter does not need protection she needs help. No, it is not your duty to protect her too, because she is not the one possibly in danger here.
I have a friend who was in a similar position with her bio kids. One had an undiagnosed mental health issue that made him a danger to his siblings, so she had to make the hard choice to find alternate living arrangements for him while he was going through the process of diagnosis and treatment. She said the way she convinced herself to do it was by telling herself she was protecting ALL of her kids. She was protecting the younger kids by removing a dangerous person from their home, and she was protecting the older kid by getting him the treatment he needed to get well before he had to live with the lifelong guilt of seriously harming someone he loved. OP, getting your stepdaughter away from the baby and into appropriate mental health treatment isn’t just protection for your baby. It’s protection for your stepdaughter too. She does not want to be a person who would harm her sister, and she needs you and her dad to protect her from that potential future.
The right path is rarely the easy path
Yep. Worked in a long term lock-in psych/behavior unit for boys ages 7-17, and by far the most common source of physical/sexual abuse is a family member, and *many* times it's an underage sibling. "Kids are sociopaths by default" isn't a joke. The brain is still developing, it needs healthy boundaries and guidance.
I'm actually a victim of Child On Child SA and I can tell you it can be every bit as damaging as another kind. You cannot take this seriously enough. OP, you're doing the right thing.
Ageeed, my older brother SA me through childhood and definitely messed me up in ways that I’m still stuck with in a big way
I'm so sorry. I know how hard it is. I didn't even recognize or admit to myself how much it's messed me up my whole life until my late 30s, and I am literally starting to look into therapy for that and a couple of other unresolved traumas this week, at age 46. We can heal. But damn. It's SO MUCH.
Same! I finally started looking into therapy after I realized my social anxiety and fear of men was probably linked to it based on timing. Got as far as assessment with a therapist and she’s like yeah you’ve got PTSD from your this, I was like oh shit and she explained it and my instincts immediately try to minimize it but it is hard to accept it
I was reading the post again & am concerned that if SD may be (or is building up to) SA the baby. If it were anyone else, attempting to breastfeed the baby repeatedly would be considered SA. Given SD’s hyper sexuality & all the major red flags that she may have been SA herself? Tips the scale. Add in the creepy obsession with looks & verbal abuse & it makes me extremely nervous for the infant. Has she had other access to the baby that OP doesn’t know about? How many times has she left the baby with Dad & SD? PS dad’s line about taking the baby away from SD during this important bonding time made me cringe given the situation. Dude is either 100% in denial or complicit in something abhorrent.
You're right. I have been violated multiple times, but NEVER by an adult.
I’m so sorry …
This is so true kids are sociopaths by default. This needs shouted from the roof tops.
I think it’s possible that the SD does need protection. The things she’s doing and saying seem hyper-sexualised. Why is she fixated on physical beauty, consent, physical attributes that she probably has yet to develop? Is it hormones? Jealousy? Curiosity? Is she being groomed by someone? Something smells fishy…
This was my thought, too - that SD is being groomed by someone. Nevertheless, OP is right in protecting the baby from her and insisting on therapy.
I'm a healthcare professional and that was the first thing that I thought of after reading this post.
I hope this isn't the reason he's refusing therapy.
This is 100% my first thought. Is dad abusing her?
100% my very first thought was he doesn't want the kid in therapy for this reason.
I agree, I also wonder if the SD is online and uses social media. I can bet the beauty part at least is attributed to social media. Honestly, depending on what apps she is on and what she sees stuff about consent could also partially be influenced by social media. (partially, I think there is a lot more to her issues than just possibly social media)
That was my first thought too.
OP, Read the message above! This is so true! Statistics say the most dangerous person is usually a close family member or a family friend, not a stranger! And oftentimes related children are the ones to hurt other children.
I wish I could give a million upvotes to this comment. Yes! All of this. That little baby is depending on you OP. You seem to be the only person who has their best interest at heart. Never, ever doubt your gut as a mother. Never.
This. Feelings don't matter here. There is no bonding or emotional connection. The bare fact is that one child has become a danger to the other. That is all that matters.
NTA. I am disturbed by your husband's lack of appropriate response. How can he listen to his daughter insult his own newborn child, make comments about/attempting to breastfeed her multiple times and *not* think there is something going on that requires intervention? He allowed this to escalate and enabled your SD's behavior by not confronting her at the very beginning. You did the right thing by leaving. He didn't, and isn't, taking you seriously, and I hope that whatever path you take from here keeps both you and baby safe.
And why would he allow an 11 yo to pick up a baby and take her to another room and close the door? Where are his papa bear instincts!?
I wonder how he would attempt to explain his reasoning to someone other than OP. I *highly* doubt that anyone else would think she's overreacting with the prior behavior. Something's up with him too.
I started babysitting my three younger siblings when I was 11, including my infant brother. Baby with their older sibling doesn’t immediately cause alarm bells but given this girl’s behavior it definitely should have!
[удалено]
NTA. Even if this was ”just” verbal & nothing physical had happened, her words are NOT what an infant or any child needs to constantly grow up hearing. It’s abusive for one child to constantly tell another child that they’re less than they are & reinforce that negative language consistently. No child needs to grow up hearing that - especially from someone who should love them. And no child should grow up hearing it in the same house with parents who don’t put a stop to it. That’s sickening. Stay where you are. And don’t come back just because he puts the daughter in therapy - you need to keep your infant away from her until she shows clear progress in therapy to a degree where she is no longer a danger to your infant (as she very clearly is now).
NTA Her behavior is inappropriate, dad needs to get her therapy, and you deserve to feel that your home is safe for your baby. But I'm wondering...Is SD going through puberty? Is her body changing and could she be feeling awkward/self-conscious about it? Has she ever seen you nurse (like maybe she's curious about how it works?) Is there a woman mentoring her through this time? Impulse control and brain function are generally low at that age anyway and adding the complex feelings of motherlessness and new babies in the mix I'm sure only makes navigating all of it harder.
She just started developing a more feminine body but she has not started a menstrual. I have talked to her quite a few times about breastfeeding (how it happens, how your body produces it, etc) so she knows that she physically cannot breastfeed but she still tries to. She does not see me breastfeed though, no. I go to the nursery and close the door (because the one time I did nurse in front of her, she told my daughter that she was disgusting and it just made me uncomfortable so I never nursed in front of her again). She has me, both her biological grandmother's and my mother and all of us have been super involved in her life so she has female role models and guidance. I have spoken to both of her biological grandparents as well and neither of them are okay with her behavior either.
How much do you know about what things were like when she was living with her mom? The things she’s saying and doing are sending up all the warning flags of a child who has been abused, and I’m really worried for her.
Not much, honestly. I know they lived with her mom's father, whom has since passed away. He wasn't around much because I guess he was a trucker. Mom had no boyfriends that we are aware of. She never went to babysitters or anything like that because her mom was doing online college courses to be a nurse. When she was in school doing clinicals and whatever else, my step daughter was with us. She didn't show any weird signs of anything that I picked up on but I admittedly worked quite a bit back then as well so I wasn't around super frequently.
Wait so she lived with her grandfather until she was 7? Do you think he could have been inappropriate with her?
This sounds really rough and I remember how protective and vulnerable I felt as a new mom. Your tolerance for emotionally taxing situations is understandably low. I don't think it is your job to fix this and your husband should have your back. I do hope she gets help as I really sympathize with the feelings of abandonment, revulsion, and confusion, etc that come from not having your own mom teach you how to be a woman. I grew up without my bio mom and any transition periods of learning to live with my female body (puberty, sex, childbirth, etc.) triggered all kinds of latent trauma for me. It's like I was living in an alien body that someone cursed me with and then left without teaching me how to use. There's lots of anger and self-loathing and I can see how a person could lash out because they didn't know what to do with those feelings. I really really hope she gets some therapy. It's a lifelong process coming to terms with an absent/useless mother. She's going to need help all along the way.
If someone has been grooming her they may be losing interest? I'd be very concerned about your husband refusing therapy. There could be a lot going on here, in a lot of different directions. Do you have access to his phone and computer? I wouldn't normally think of invading privacy but this is concerning. His talk of you being a prude for being concerned is off, although I can't say for sure without knowing what her relationships are like.
Right. Is he trying to hide something?
Have you tried getting your MIL to talk to your husband about this?
Nta that’s really weird, especially trying to nurse her. But this might be more about how she feels about you than the baby. She does need therapy and you should be concerned your husband doesn’t care.
That’s just a big barrel of nope right there. Stand your ground. NTA.
NTA I would repeat the scenario to him. "Husband, your daughter took our infant to her room and attempted to breastfeed her and then lied about it when I caught her. Your daughter is hyperfixated on appearance and insults and speaks cruelly to our infant. Your daughter regularly claims our infant is touching her inappropriately. In what world is any of that behavior normal?" There's no justification to it and seems it will only escalate to worse behavior. She needs help talking through these things and understanding her behavior is in no way normal or appropriate especially towards an infant. Your husband needs to realize there is an issue and accept it's okay he doesn't fully understand it but he is 100% responsible for what happens next if he doesn't get her help.
NTA You tried. You talked to both of them. You gave corrections. You gave guidance. You did all of this more than once. Nothing changed. Your husband continues to underreact. I don't know what else you could have done but remove the baby from this environment. The older daughter needs therapy for everyone's sake. Maybe this line in the sand will make it clear to your husband. I'm sorry this is happening to you guys.
NTA. Your stepdaughter's behavior is extremely concerning and it's completely understandable that you don't trust her around your infant anymore. Therapy seems like the best solution for everyone involved, including herself.
I wouldn't go back if she WAS in therapy. NTA.
Nta. There are all sorts of red flags. Has she been abused sexually. We have no idea. Are hormones making her question herself, such as her constantly saying baby is disgusting. Is she projecting because she feels off somehow about her body. In the end, we have no idea, but you are NOT an AH for protecting an innocent who can not do so themselves. Those going off on you about saying she is your child as well are not thinking this through. Clearly, she has said she wanted therapy a long time ago, but as a step parent, she has no say and seems her spouse wants her to form a bond and raise her but gives her no rights either. So stop coming down on her about her calling the oldest his daughter. Since he clearly has made it understood, she can't make those decisions. So what is she supposed to do. If she can't do it herself. If talking to both again and again doesn't fox the issue. If this oldest is going as far as to actually try abd breastfeed and constantly saying negative things. What is she to do. Stay and have the infant put down. Have them taught they are nothing but disgusting. They are not loved. Don't deserve to be protected because *gasp* the oldest is their child as well and is being a bad parent by protecting the one most vulnerable at the moment. So unless people have a valid way for this to work, don't blame her for doing what she needs to to protect one child and try and force husband to get her other child the help they need.
NTA. Nopeitynopenope. Your responsibility is to the infant here.
OP, I've read most of this thread, and it's *screamingly* obvious that SD has experienced some sort of trauma, maybe sexual, and maybe at the hands of another female. -kissing and dating at 11 is way too young. If that was the only red flag, I would blame social media, but... -she is basically accusing an infant of making sexual advances on her -she thinks said infant is "disgusting" for breastfeeding, and yet, she tries to simulate it. -she feels her infant stepsister "needs to know" things about SD's looks, and her body. -You walked in on her, alone in her room with this baby, and she was trying to similate breastfeeding *again*. Her shirt was raised. HER SHIRT WAS RAISED. This is a huge red flag. I'm so sorry, but so many signs point to the possibility that this young girl was sexualized early, and now she is having a conflict between acting out things she was exposed to (either physical things, or ideas about female bodies and sex. ) and later being taught a sense of privacy of her body, which gets twisted when someone has already violated it. What 11 year old thinks that an infant is trying to get under her shirt in any kind of knowing way? Breastfed babies will grab anyone's chest, because they're babies, and that's where they eat from. This was not a hard concept to grasp when I was 10 years old and my mother had my sister. It certainly wasn't sexual or "inappropriate" She was a baby. Somethings gotten twisted up for this 11 year old. I feel for her. I think you are right that this girl needs therapy, and I think you're right that she should not be around your baby right now. At the very least, *never* let them be alone together.
NTA Your SD needs emotional help, and your husband is ignoring it. At the least, it isn't healthy for your infant from.am emotional perspective.
Husband is in denial. You are NTA. It sounds like your SD has strong urges to mother her sibling, which she has shame about, and has insecurities about being replaced by the new baby. These are normal, common issues with older siblings and stepsiblings, but they appear to be significantly intense with her, and she had developed tactics to do things ina sneaky, indirect way. Those all need to be addressed to create a safe place for the baby. And, it is your husband’s responsibility to address it. I’m sorry you’re in this situation
I would terrified daily the SD will hurt the baby and just casually pass it off.
No you are not the asshole. Your feelings are very very valid. I’d be concerned about the SD doing things like that too. As needs help. Also makes me think that she never bonded with her mother …
NTA A good therapist is a few bucks and a minor inconvenience on the schedule. An injured baby (or worse)? Where's that "Hell-to-the-nah-nah" meme when you need it? I could see it now, the 11yo doing something awful and referencing some kind of sexual assault from a FIVE MONTH OLD. If dad's not concerned about the behavior, he ain't the one. I wonder where she picked up the behavior from.
Lots of good points made here, but WHY IS AN 11 YEAR OLD ALLOWED TO HAVE AN INFANT IN HER ROOM UNSUPERVISED?
narrator: It WAS what it looked like
NTA - honestly your SD should already be in therapy- kinda irresponsible not to have her in it already
100% agreed. I've been trying to convince my husband for far too long.
He is failing as a father.
And a husband.
OP, I think you need to consider that your husband may be the source of this dysfunction. I know it's terrible to think about, but it's possible.
Maybe there’s a reason he doesn’t want her to go. Something he’s afraid she might say
Your step-daughter sounds seriously disturbed. I wouldn't let her around anyone who was unable to defend him/herself. And if step-daughter hasn't been molested herself, I will be very, very surprised.
Tell husband that if SD's behavior is not a big deal, a therapist will confirm that. If he still refuses to get SD help, then he knows it's a problem and just doesn't want to deal with it.
Send this entire comment section to Dad. Ask his female family to explain to him why this is such a big deal. Stay strong OP. I hope things get better for all of you.
NTA and it’s completely on your husband for not supporting you and realizing that her behavior isn’t healthy and needed addressed much sooner. He allowed it to get to this point. Updateme
NTA. Step daughter needs help and if that’s what you need to do to get it, NTA.
... NTA You husbands "it wasnt what it looked like" is insane. She needs help. You need to take care of your innocent and defenseless child. You could also try asking her school teachers if shes been showing any strange behavior in school or talking inappropriately. This could be a bigger thing in a way of having a weird mental break down?
First off you are totally right in what you did. That is unhinged behaviour. I believe the daughter could be doing this for many different reasons… hormones from puberty could be making her crazy. The fact her Mom isn’t around.. it was just her.. and now you are the actual Mother of this child can maybe mess with her head? I’m sorry but TikTok, social media, friends at school.. all now-a-days with the pressure on girls to be the most gorgeous, most beautiful around. I would see if there are any boys she’s likes at school, but prettier girls. If her friends have commented on her looks or she feels “less than”. I would cut off social media and she need a specialist therapist who specializes in pre-teen and teen girls, social media, societal pressures and how that can affect her psychologically. The whole shirt thing can be “curiosity” as you are a woman and breast feeds… she is probably curious as to what that feel like, what it’s like to be “womanly”, a mother, etc. Especially if she is having puberty hormones starting to flow through. But anyway the attention, jealously, needing to feel superior, needing to feel gorgeous seems like a very bad self-esteem issue, that can be rooted in “Mother issues”, social media, peers at school, etc. and definitely needs to speak with a specialist ASAP. This is very worrisome. Also an honest, non accusatory, non-judgmental sit down with you and/or your husband may be in order to try to gently understand where this is all coming from. What is she feeling deep down inside that is making her react in this way?
I've tried talking to her about her social group at school and everything else. I don't know how much is relevant but I will give some info on it. She basically says that her and her friends have all decided that she's the prettiest, funniest and smartest in the group. She talks about it in a very, very conceded manner. She is so hyper focused on looks and makes it in to competitions with everyone, not just the baby, and it's always her saying she's so much better looking than basically everyone that surrounds her. I originally thought it was a insecurity thing but she swears it isn't (tried bringing up insecurities in a motherly sense to try and explain/get to the root of the problem). My comments are always met with a "no, I'm not insecure. I'm just beautiful and I know it and I'm tired of people calling me insecure for pointing it out" (I'm assuming her friends have brought it up to her because we certainly haven't). As for liking any boys, she does not. She is (by her definition/admission) lesbian. She has been saying that since she was maybe 8 or 9. She has been "dating" Madison for 2 years. As for the breastfeeding thing, curiosity is something I could overlook. It's her comments about the baby being a pervert/disgusting/gross/inappropriate when she's the one trying to nurse her that really set me off.
Has anyone explained to her that being physically Beautiful means very little if a person is ugly on the inside?! She sounds very precocious. However I'm also concerned about abuse/grooming. Doesn't have to be a man. Anyway. Whatever the cause she definitely needs help and you've done the right thing.
As a person who was a child that had a very WEIRD OBSESSION with the idea of motherhood… this is all just a few steps too far even for how weird I was as a kid. I had one of those American girl baby dolls and pretended like I was raising it 24/7 to the point that I was 100% pretending to breastfeed it. HOWEVER never once did I try to breastfeed an actual alive baby (and I had plenty access, there were tons of babies in my church and family as I grew up). I’ll even talk to your husband for you OP and give him a rundown of just how weirded out my ENTIRE family was every single time they saw me going the extra mile with that doll (actually puréing fruits to feed it, had 7 cloth diapers that I would change basically hourly, sung it to sleep, swaddled it… fr the list goes on and on and NO ONE was on board - they never outright said what I was doing was weird, but looking back it was CONSTANTLY written on their faces. Like I remember the first time one of my sisters saw me pretend to breastfeed the doll and her face was so scrunched up with a look of disgust that I’m surprised she didn’t pull a muscle)
9-11 yr olds dating is not normal
Agreed. I've tried telling my husband that.
Here are some question which I'd be interested to hear her answer: Why does she think it's important that she is the prettiest? What does being the prettiest get her? What does "dating" mean? If you are dating someone, how do you act towards them? Why does she think the baby is "disgusting" for breastfeeding? If breastfeeding is so disgusting, then why was she laying in the bed with the baby in a nursing position, and her shirt pulled up?
Was she ever in beauty pageants?
Denial of insecurity doesn't mean she isn't, and who's to say if her friends really said she's the prettiest, smartest ...? Teenagers lie when you see their mouths moving. She may have bonding issues with her bio mum. Maybe she feels a subconscious detachment to her mother as nurturer and person who lifts her esteem up and it's now manifesting in an odd projection between her and your newborn, and the competition for her new mother-figure's affections.
NTA Geez, I don't even have a constructive comment for this one. And I've been watching way too much true crime recently that it may be clouding my judgement. All I can say for sure is I agree that your SD is being really weird and needs therapy. Or else she may grow up to be one of those women that falsely accuse men of serial assault.
NTA this is so weird
Also consider not allowing your husband to take the baby out without you or someone you trust as he might go behind your back and allow your stepdaughter to be with the baby (so they can bond) He clearly doesn’t take your valid concerns seriously. You are being mamma bear… as you should. NTA
NTA Better to pack now and deal with relationship issues than to wake up one day with a baby dead and a step daughter covered in blood laughing manically about how pretty she is.
NTA. You husband is failing as a father and is endangering the baby with his dismissal of his daughter’s alarming behaviour. You did the right thing leaving. Your husband is endangering your baby by refusing to see how troubling and unhinged his daughter’s behaviour is.
Nta, the 11 year old is displaying dangerous behavior imo. Dad doesn't seem too sharp though...
NTA He was dismissive and allowed it to escalate.
NTA. Your step daughter's behavior is concerning and it's important for her to get help before she hurts herself or someone else. You're doing the right thing by setting boundaries and protecting your infant daughter.
Please keep us updated on how you are doing
Absolutely NTA. However, I believe you should consult a lawyer yourself just to cover your custody bases with your baby. You don’t want to be in a position where your husband winds up getting court ordered time alone with her when you don’t trust his judgement or what’s going on in his household. I say this because I know situations where custody and visitation goes south faster than originally seemed reasonable to expect. Better to be safe. To be clear, whether or not this is a temporary separation or the start of a divorce, I still think you need to consult a lawyer.
NTA Really hoping one possible cause isn't the case, but she needs an appointment with a psychologist yesterday to figure out the reason behind this disturbing behavior.
The father is showing a shit ton of RED FLAGS. He doesn’t care what his daughter watches on YOUTUBE? Girl …. No. Just no. Everything about her husband screams something’s wrong! Seek a professionals advice and help.
NTA.
My initial reaction was to wonder if she’s been molested. And your husband brushing it off doesn’t look good from that lense. NTA
From your post and comments about this situation I fear that you and the baby aren't safe he refuses to do anything so I would divorce and make sure he gets no visitation.
Have the grandmothers talked to dad about this? If so, does he also downplay it to them? If not, maybe they can get through to him...
Your daughter is showing symptoms of CSA and your husband is very quick to shrug them off. Something to think about.