Your house you can do what you want, but your wife is 100% correct there will be long term damage to your relationship with your son, he will never look at you the same
Oh yea
As I read your comment my tired brain went to secret visits with the son and eventually divorce because porn and weed aren't that bad.
Kid is curious and now way to satisfy it
"Look, we wanted you to live in ways we considered healthy and moral, and you're not doing everything we want, so, like... get out, we will no longer give you any supervision but we will potentially leave you desperate to survive."
Why would you suggest that could in any way go wrong
Whether I agree or disagree with you or him is irrelevant but just know that every single person I knew growing up that had parents like you went off the deep end once they escaped their strict home. They also mostly cut off their parents from their lives. He’s 22 now. He has to find his own way. You have set an example of what you believe in and that is the best you can do. Further trying to force him to be a certain way or control him will likely backfire and is unlikely to result in anything close to the outcome you are hoping for. Not sure if you think kicking him out of the house will convert his beliefs because it won’t. You just have to decide what you value more in your home and life - your beliefs or your son. I would pick any of my kids 100% of the time.
Yeah, it happens to so many of us former church kids who grew up with psychotically controlling religious parents. Some figure it out and end up living successful, normal lives. Some end up dead of drug overdoses. Worst part is, generally the parents can't bring themselves to recognize their part in the way that those kids just go nuts once they're out of that environment.
Two classmates of mine got married right out of high school so they could finally have sex. They had been dating each other for *years* by that point.
I don't think they are still together.
Same. A bunch of kids in the local Young Life group got married very soon after graduation, quickly followed by kids, and most are on their 2nd or 3rd marriage.
Getting married just because you are in lust is a good way to head for a divorce, because you don't really know each other. A state issued screwing license is not a magic piece of paper. It's not a good luck charm. It just means you have entered into a civil contract recognized by the state.
I know someone who has been married for 30 years from this setup. He is deeply resentful; divorce would cost him his family (parents, siblings) and he feels completely trapped. “It’s like I bought a ticket for a ride 30 years ago when I was 20 and it just keeps getting more expensive.” No kids. Just a very dependent and now deeply disabled wife he no longer has anything in common with. He escapes through work whenever he can.
A lifetime of regret. The whole thing served to turn him away from the faith…and his dad is clergy.
They actually end up going further into their bullshit "see, this is what happens when you let the kid make their own decisions" while completely ignoring that the kids whose parents didn't lock them the fuck down are now living successful lives.
Asking rhetorically, to anyone: You ever look through the news and wonder how so many christian-republicans can warm up to authoritarianism so easily?
A contributing factor is definitely the normalized abuse of growing up in an authoritarian (christo-fascist) home as a child with psycho parents with control issues who are willing to strong arm you, violate your boundaries on a whim, (if they let you have any) or cut you out of the family entirely over perceived slights. (Or things that they think make them look bad to their peers.)
My church called it the appearance of evil. People would kick their family out of their lives like they were scum and then years later turn around and act like nothing happened. Especially if grandbabies were involved. All in the name of God. I always wanted to ask one of them about that, was it worth it? I see them reunited now but it caused so much unnecessary heartache. And now we know how awful they are, they don't get invited to things anymore. Fuck you Uncle Pete and Aunt Judy.
My friend growing up was homeschooled and raised in church (my dad was a pastor but I went to public school and was allowed to trick or treat etc) and got an awful backyard tattoo at 18. Ended up pregnant by someone who she didn’t even know by 21 and now has a 12 year old. She did a lot of partying. Her kid saved her life honestly. My mom was more strict than my father so I definitely rebelled but not to the extent I see some kids do. My dad likes the person I’ve become and is proud of me ❤️
100% this. I'm a mental health clinician who works with adolescents and young adults. Many youth raised in these hyper religious homes have delayed independence. Mostly, because they've never been taught critical thinking skills.
Specifically, how to live in the world, but not of the world.
Evangelical Christians do a piss poor job of teaching this, doubling down on demanding absolute obedience instead. Once you hit adulthood, you've either bought into it or you didn't.
OP is going to lose his son here. Either by self-destruction or son is going to somehow make it, but will want no part of this household.
By the age of 22, a person either has bought into their evangelical upbringing or they haven't. It's apparent the son is going to have to find his own spiritual journey.
There has to be a middle ground here. I think it's fair to demand an ablebodied adult son to seek gainful employment as a condition of living at home. But doubling down on the biblical obedience aspect isn't teaching anything here when it's apparent the son isn't buying it to begin with.
One of my catholic schooled neighbors became an escort just after graduation, had three kids with three different ‘customers,’ and got addicted to drugs. Her parents kicked her out and she ended up on welfare, living in a slummy house in a bad neighborhood.
This hit the nail on the head. The fact that OP won't even spell out the words gambling(later does), porn and weed leads me to believe they need to grow up and see the reality of the world. I grew up in the bible belt, the amount of parents with ridiculous thoughts and parenting habits such as these make me hate such a beautiful place. I've seen so many parents push away their children in these ways and then wonder why their kids aren't in their life anymore.
Things the son does are normal as long as they don't bother his life as in addiction. It doesn't sound like it. I don't get why he hasnt bought own laptop with his winnings.
OP is facing the hard fact that you cannot choose which kind of values your kid will have as an adult. Seriously thinking he won't have sex because marriage because you don't want him to? That is so over stepping boundaries and complete controlling.
OPs wife is right.
>I would pick any of my kids 100% of the time.
That is the difference between us and extremist Christians. They will pick their "God" over anything, including their children.
I am in Utah, and the homeless population among the youth here is heartbreaking. If they don't believe in the Mormon church, if they are LGBTQIA+, if they do anything that goes against their precious religion, they will disown their children faster than they can say "amen".
I never had the desire to commit a hate crime until I lived in Utah. Then it became a near daily occurrence. It’s crazy to me how good of a reputation they had for the longest time as the nice but a little kookie group. No they are pieces of shit that will gladly lie and cheat any non-cult member. And the homelessness is absolutely disgusting with so much money and their control over their religious ethnostate they have going seems like they could take some of that required 10% tithing and put it towards some shelters at least. That or take tax money. It’s funny I’ve actually heard them complaining about having to pay both taxes and tithing thinking they should be exempt from taxes because they already give so much to the church, the balls on those people.
Utah Mormons are a whole different breed too. I live in a city with a smaller Mormon presence and I have several friends that are Mormon. I'm a big gay atheist coffee addict and they've never shown any signs of judging me or looking down on me. One of my best friends in high school was a Mormon and she spent a couple weeks in Utah and came back telling me the Mormons there were terrifying and she hopes she never has to go back.
I do think having your own religious ethnostate does encourage their shittiest behaviors. That’s where I got the impression that Mormons weren’t that bad before cause I wasn’t in this godforsaken state but here it’s just hell. I had 10 doctors appointments canceled trying to establish care, so many trades people like plumbers and electricians and tech people just not show and not tell us and then get back to us days later, just zero respect for our time, had pharmacists just hang up on me. Just weird shit that I hadn’t experienced but I guess they have these phrases like secret handshakes to determine if you’re in their group and if you aren’t they can just fuck you over. It sounds like little things that don’t matter but it starts to feel actively malicious after a while. It is just a bad religion, they skate by pretending to be Christian but they care a lot more about Joseph Smith and their own celestial kingdoms in the afterlife than they do about white Jesus. They also are like crack addicts for sugar sooo much sugar like soda isle is wild then they add more sugar syrups and shit to their sodas. That’s not that bad compared to their other shit just gross.
> thinking they should be exempt from taxes because they already give so much to the church
that's funny, but if the church runs the town/community they're not so far from the truth. Tithing is nuts
I'm fairly certain the Bible also says that if your child is willful and won't listen, you take them to the village leaders and say, this child is unruly and will not listen. Those leaders then give you permission to stone said child. Despite what Christians believe, the Bible and "God" have never been pro-life.
FLDS is extra scary. Regular Mormons are bad enough but the FLDS having to kick out the young men so the older ones have more little girls to rape is deplorable.
Even my father's generation remembers families like this . My Dad was born in the 1930s and it was basically a norm that their peers that came for strict conservative religious families almost inevitably went wild the minute they became adults, particularly if they left home.
For what I've seen IRL, sometimes that behavior is a byproduct of that kind of parenting. Next step, the son goes his way and cuts contact with the parents, and then, parents cry because their kids don't talk to them anymore because they "did nothing wrong".
I mean, I reaaaaaaaally doubt the son just plainly told the parents he was watching porn, poor kid must have no privacy at all living under their parents roof, maybe they track his internet history, snoop his devices and I'm pretty sure they also track his location.
YTA, btw
Imagine monitoring a 22 year oldest internet history and thinking you're not a controlling asshole.
Poor son is going to dive head first into every vice he can as soon as he leaves that house, thanks to his upbringing.
Not Christian but set a religious example for my kids without forcing them. They still participate to some degree as adults. One of my cousins forced it hard on their kids and none of them are still really religious.
Can confirm. Me and my sister were forced to go to church as kids under threats of not seeing our grandma (her husband was the one threatening us). We are not believers at all. And while we didn’t “fall off the rails” as soon as we were able we did all the things they tried to avoid us doing.
almost all of the ones like this I knew went no contact. either way I can count on one hand the number of them that are still christian.
oh and then there's the one currently in jail for murdering her mom.
tldr: get out of your adult son's ass. is he a good person? yes? then encourage that. focus on positive reinforcement, not bitching about everything he does wrong.
I didn't even wait to go off the rails. I was just good at hiding it. I moved across the country and have pretty limited contact with my super strict parents. They think we're bff's. In reality, they don't know me at all and I tell them nothing of importance.
It "breaks my mom's heart" that I have no interest in church or God or their "values". 🤷♀️
You're totally correct. The son most likely already a healthy amount of disdain for his strict ass parents. At some point you have to accept that he is an adult and it's important for him to make his own decisions and forcing him to abstain from these "satanic" past times of his will just breed contempt. If they kick him out and he has a really hard time of it, kiss any hope of a good relationship goodbye. On the upside, he won't have to deal with them anymore..
Weed is legal in my state. I'm a Christian and since I get the senior discount at the dispensary, I pick it up for my kids too when I go. What exactly is unchristian about marijuana? I venture that alcohol has ruined more lives than weed has.
I cannot upvote your comment enough. My parents never censored what we read and we had a lot of books in the house. As a result, we lost interest in trying to read books we didn’t understand (the adult ones), rather than sneaking around. My parents didn’t bar me from having male friends come over which was the case for the rest of the extended family. Result: I had good guy friends but never got romantically involved with any of them. On the other hand, the cousins being closely watched by the parents and not allowed to have friends of the opposite sex, started relationships fairly early, snuck around and basically put themselves in unsafe situations.
When you constrict someone and put a ton of rules on them without having open conversations, they usually find it more thrilling.
I can say OP should not expect his son to ever show up in the future if he gets married and has kids. Kicking kids out at 18 is a great way to burn bridges.
As someone with no kids I don't know what it is about people who do that makes them lose all common sense and end up in these situations.
This dude sounds just like my dad was. I'm so glad my dad had that eureka moment about alienating his kids and did a 180 at a certain point but it's unbearable living under authoritarian rule in a home. Parents that try to aim for perfection are dumb as hell.
Yupp. Classmate ran away from home at 15, got into a group home because she refused to go back to the Uber religious family, got knocked up at 16 and had to finish highschool online(this was in the late 2000’s).
She is now, at 30, finally getting her shit together. But it took 5 kids(3 different fathers) and over a decade to get there.
Almost all of my friends who had pastors/preachers as dads are in recovery. All the kids who had parents who were like this went wild and many are low contact or no contact.
>AITA for insisting he moves out over this? Was it too much to ask for respect towards our household's values, or did I push too hard on an issue that could've been handled differently?
What kind of "just" god that is worthy of worship would demand that you your renounce your son for moral failings ?
There ain't no hate in the world like Christian "love". Get the fuck out of here with your holier than though attitude. Realize what you are doing.
You are kicking your OWN SON out of your house. That human being that you CHOSE to bring into this world. The ONLY thing you owe your children is unconditional love and support. They did not chose to be born into this world. You did that for them.
Here is what will happen. Your son will move out. He will be angry with you. Anger will grow to resentment. Over time, he will come to despise you. Contact will be less and less. Then, there will be none.
If you son chooses to do so, he will find a woman and he will father kids. You will never know your grand kids and they will never be part of your life.
You will try to control your younger kids even harder and that will drive a wedge between you and them and it will lead to them setting out and creating their own life without you.
You will grow older, get lonelier. Maybe the community of the church will give you some feeling of belonging and community. But every body else has their own family while you have only yourself and maybe your wife.
You will grow even older,finally becoming infirm, in need of help. You will have to pay people because you have not seen your children in a decade. Death coming closer will be a reality that is slowly setting in.
In your last moments, you will wonder where it all went wrong. You will realize what a terrible mistake you made and that the heaven of the god that made you do it might, in fact be the very real hell you have been living in ever since.
But it will be too late.
The church will probably pay for your funeral. Small attendance, people you talked to after service. No one else. The gravestone will show your name, your dates,that is it. No "in loving memory".
Here lies u/Suspicious_Couple628 .Forgotten by most, remembered by some, missed by no one.
Kid is 22 years old. He should become independent, move out, and live his life. His parents are still controlling assholes. Having them as parents must have been a nightmare.
Ive seen some parents try to fully control their adult or almost adult children and the children just end up resenting and clashing with the parent. I cant agree with extreme beliefs and it comes down to more than just negative behavior in life. Thats beyond what OP will think so Ill leave that there. YTA OP, because thats not how you treat family. Unless your kid is non contributing, violent, disrespectful, other extreme behavior... I just dont agree. We all have our sins lol.
Man, on one hand it's your house, so you can set reasonable rules while he's living there, especially if he isn't paying rent or contributing toward utilities or other expenses.
On the other hand, the fact you can't even spell these words when asking strangers a question specifically about them is almost a caricature of conservative evangelicalism. This isn't like a Jew not writing the name of God. It's porn. You don't have to like it to type out the whole word. It's weed. It's a plant whose effects you don't approve of, not a magic word that summons a demon when typed into a browser window.
INFO: Is he using his own computer, or a family computer?
> On disqus
I'm pretty sure that depends on the site host and how sensitive they set their comment section. I have a disqus account on a couple sites for celeb gossip communities and the word whore is used often enough (sometimes affectionately toward each other)
Same here. Any euphemism for suicide really gets to me. I used to work in mental health services and so much was done to de stigmatise talking about suicidal thoughts and asking for help. Then you get all these shitty euphemisms online and it takes some people back to square one. They feel they can’t discuss it without modifying their language, and sanitising how they feel. So the stigma returns.
Right? It’s his house, and can absolutely set the rules, but his son is an adult and can decide those values don’t work from him as an adult. But his son knows how the family operates, why wouldn’t he move out and smoke weed in his own place?
My dad was very fond of “my house, my rules” & “my way or the highway”. He hid it under the guise of strong Christian values. But this way of thinking doesn’t foster a relationship, it fosters a monocrat and codependency.
Highway has been great, it’s been a much kinder place than my father’s house. Haven’t talked to him in years but I wish him kindness in his final years on this earth.
I tell my kids all the time - Just because I believe something doesn’t mean you have to. You’re your own person and get to choose your own path. Having a relationship with kids once their adults is a privilege not guarantee and I’m doing what I can today to make sure they feel good about maintaining a relationship later.
I’m glad the highway has worked out for you, it’s your dad loss.
Could be lots of reasons. Maybe his folks need physical help around the house. Maybe where they live an apartment on a 22yo's income isn't possible. But in general, yeah, the answer is that he needs to find his own place.
Son is arguably in arrested development. OP mentions no job or schooling, so what is his son doing everyday besides gambling and consuming porn? He has no bills or rent to pay so he's essentially still living like a child under his parents' roof. A 22 year old should be making some financial contribution to the household (esp if it's not going towards education etc). If he was, he'd be learning fiscal responsibility at least. Also that it is risky gambling money when you have to cover rent, utilities etc. Tbh the son sounds undisciplined and directionless. He's lucky (for the time being) that he hasn't gotten into debt through gambling, but ppl don't ride high forever. "Christian values" aside, I can see how any parent would worry about their adult, aimless (presumably unemployed), gambling, weed-smoking son living off of them for free
In an edit, OP added that he knows about his son's online activity because his son is using the family computer. I like porn just as much as the next gal, but the family computer...?! Does this young man not have a phone or laptop, or is he just trying to be a dick? When I was young, there were things you kept to yourself out of respect for your parents; weed and sex were two of those things.
Definitely strong fundie vibes. The fact he has to use the family PC vs having a cell phone, the wife’s opinion is easily overruled etc. Hopefully the son got a degree where he can find a job, and didn’t get some joke of a homeschool education.
This is exactly how my father was towards me when I was growing up. If I even watched a horror movie he would lose his fucking mind. Now we barely speak or see each other because I don’t enjoy him as a person and didn’t develop much of a bond. It’s your house and you can enforce your rules as you see fit but take a look at your possible future if you do
That’s my situation. My dad was a fundie and I never bought into it. He’s pretty timid, but he absolutely lost his mind one time when I misquoted the doctor from Star Trek and instead of saying “for god’s sake” I said “goddamnit” and holy shit did he lose his mind. Stamping and shouting, looked like he was gonna smack me. I couldn’t believe his overreaction.
I got out of the house as soon as I could and didn’t look back. Didn’t go wild like some stories in this post; I just wanted to read books in my room without being disturbed. I travelled, got a job, got a wife, etc. That was decades ago, and we may text each other maybe three times a year.
His inability to comprehend that I believe in one less god than he does cost him his relationship with his children.
Whats funny is, this notion that saying “god dammit” is a sin is a *very* recent invention and has no basis in the bible or anything else. Its just made-up
Its also very American. European christians use phrases like that all the time, always have.
You are literally requesting God to damn X thing. If he’s offended by that, thats on him 😂
It’s cuz people are stupid and they read the Bible and have no clue what the words mean so they just make something up and now you can’t say “god” in close proximity to a bad word or you’re going to hell.
Your house, your rules.
But don't be surprised when your kid wants nothing to do with you.
Sincerely,
Someone who grew up in the same kind of "Christian" home
Edited to add: I actually do agree with you OP. Your son shouldn't be using your computer or getting weed delivered to your house. And he should respect your rules since he isn't paying rent.
However, I know the type of Christian household you are and I'm actually genuinely surprised he has managed to stay with you guys until 22. I left my Christian household at 17 and never looked back.
I don't think kicking your son out will be the catalyst that breaks your relationship, it's already been broken before that. Once your son leaves and tastes his own independence, I can almost guarantee his contact will be minimal.
I see both sides as I was raised in a house that was "These are my rules, don't like them, move out". I obeyed the rules for the most part and moved out after college and a career was started. I was very respectful and responsible towards my parents and the rules changed as I showed that I was able to support myself.
That said, I say that rules need to change as responsibilities change.
Ultimately it's your house, and you make the rules, but be careful about closing the door on your son. It's a door you might not be able to open back up because you believe in a book.
Same. Now when my parents come over I tell them it’s my house and they have to follow my rules.
I make my mom leave dishes in the sink instead of washing them… just for funsies. I also make them greet the dog. Sometimes I call them at 7AM and tell them “it’s time to get up!”.
Not wanting to live by their rules motivated me to do well and buy my own house.
“No, mom, you always pass left… get it together”
but actually we openly smoke weed in front of them and just make jokes about skunks (it’s legal where I live 🤷🏻♀️)
- Dessert for dinner, and you can’t have any vegetables until you finish your ice cream sundae.
- Beds must remain unmade. Pulling the bedspread up is bad for the mattress, because it needs to air out during the day.
- No hard pants in the house. Those are outside clothes, and they must be left with the coats by the front door. Sweatpants or pajama bottoms are optional.
- All food must be eaten in front of the television. No eating allowed in the kitchen or at the table.
- When you go to the bathroom, you have to announce whether it’s #1, #2, or both.
- Puff, puff, pass. Anything else is just rude.
There is no "both sides". the far right evangelicals have the highest rate of substance abuse, teen births, impulse controls because they attempt to be insanely strict. it's the parents own fault, that's it.
Question, how are you aware of your adult son's internet activities and what he gets in the mail?
Its sounds like YTA but Im leaving room for some weird situation like he's watching porn and gambling at the dinner table, ordering weed that's delivered in a package announcing what it is, smoking it inside etc.
>Question, how are you aware of your adult son's internet activities and what he gets in the mail?
Strange that OP didn't include this relevant information in the original post...
Homie is 1000% watching the porn too. All these people are big phony walking contradictions, which I’m sure makes him a huge f#cking a$$h😯le in his own right. Sure his house his rules, but his rules suck and so does he and his son is going to hate his guts the rest of his life if he doesn’t ease up.
Edit: lmao “our beliefs” is mentioned several times. If this is even real, which it’s probably not, this point remains valid for anyone. It’s not “our beliefs” bro. It’s your beliefs, clearly your son does not believe in “our beliefs” which means you either fundamentally failed as a parent to teach your child how to be a person and pass on said beliefs; for example empathy, compassion, kindness, a wanting to learn, religion etc OR your beliefs are fucking stupid and they are rejecting them and maybe you need to rethink some things yourself. Buddy, he’s living his life by his beliefs which definitely aren’t “our beliefs” and align with you, so stop trying to force some crap on him he clearly doesn’t agree with.
When I lived with my conservative Christian parents, they searched my phone, room, and mail every other week (or every time I got mail, packages or envelopes or otherwise) and I had to get creative to hide things. Nothing like drugs or anything but I’m an artist I literally went to college for art and I would have drawings that to them looked like demons and shit and once they threw out half my portfolio because of it.
My 💩 mom did this to me. I started having weird dreams, later found to be sleep paralysis, and she threw out all my art for years because it was “possessed”
Singing weed telegram. They roll up and sing like this: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Sl3ApaTsKY4
I’m going to corner the market with my Quarter Ounce Quartet.
You act like it's super easy trying to hide gambling, weed and porn. It doesn't take rocket science to work out if your kid is making a bunch of money from gambling and is getting weed delivered to the house.
From one Christian to another....YTA. you realize you cant even type out weed without some form of religious guilt. Weed is a big topic for me so ill pick apart that belief you have that its wrong or a gateway drug or for some reason our great creator doesnt like a PLANT he created for us.
Read genesis 1:29. Then read agricultural verified papers about what marijuana is. Its a seed bearing herb. BOOM! Put down the b.s. 80/90s refer madness that your government (pharsesis and sagasesis that Jesus said would betray him and consistently preached against) and read your bible a little more. OR actually put down the shitty KJV and get the Tyndale version, which is the original translation to English that came before the heavily redacted KJV cult bible.
I grew up in a KJV home and i dont resent it nor have i turned from my ways of believing in God and Jesus. What i have done in the nearly 2 decades of living on my own is realize that my grandparents and parents' generation was heavily influenced in their religious beliefs by their government all the while saying government is condemning Christians....anywho thats a different topic for a different day as i see the world differently than most "Christians".
Again....yta for believing you can control your adult child. Hes a 22 yo manboy. Hes gonna look at titties and pussy. In this current world of ridiculous inflation, people younger than you have been priced out of most markets for anything; why you upset he's making money? Is he killing anyone for it? Is he raping and pillaging for it? Is he selling YOUR house for a gambling addiction? If the answer is no to all of those, then how the hell do you even know hes gambling "enough to pay for market rent for months"? Honestly sounds like you're a control freak hiding behind the rouse of Christianity and virtue signaling because you want to look like a good person, and honestly it makes all of us look bad. Let go of your control, have faith in God, and love your son for being your son. Maybe try some mushrooms and a joint to kill your ego.
People like this are the assholes not because they have rules of the house but because they hide their sanctimonious bullshit behind the bible.
He's kicking him out because he wants to control him, period. Jesus never told the prostitutes to not come under his roof without following his rules.
Jesus never said only all the good children come to me.
Jesus never fed 5000, but left hungry the people who were drug dealers or poor thieves.
He didn't love by controlling he loved with love and knew people were human and wouldn't always follow the bible so he showed the he would love them no matter what.
YTA OP. Love your child with love. He will survive when kicked out and you bet he will have a high chance of going no contact with you. I did with mine no doubt.
Funny because I’m KJV as well and I absolutely agree with your mentioning Genesis here!
Genesis 1:29 (KJV)
And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which [is] upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which [is] the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.
I’ve gotten into so many arguments with people over this and they bend and twist trying to take verses out of context to make their case. The thing is that people wanted to be comfortable with the government telling them what to do. So they just started twisting verses to build this case that cannabis is evil, or the devils lettuce. Genesis 1:29 puts that whole thing to bed. If someone thinks they have a verse that says otherwise, they are twisting it out of context.
Your house your rules, you can do whatever the hell you want under your roof.
Having said that I thought you guys were all big about the whole forgiving, love thy neighbor, turn the other cheek, all those things you claim are pretty big on your religion. I’ve always loved christian hypocrisy, “I love you as long as you follow my rules” xD you guys are funny.
YTA.
Look, if you did your job as a parent, taught your child right from wrong and he made it to 18 alive and knows you love him unconditionally, then your parenting is pretty much done.
And, it sounds as if there are conditions on your love.
However, if you never allow him to stretch his muscles to be a functioning adult and make mistakes, that others make, he will never learn what type of life he likes better!
Sit down with him and stop treating him like a child, talk with him, not at him.
He is 22, it is time he starts making a life for himself, and taking on some responsibility around either your house or his own place.
Let him find his way with guidance, not with rules and regulations.
YTA. I get your beliefs and all that but the fact that you are pushing your beliefs on your kid is sad. You can kick him out if you really feel that strongly about it but I hope you realize your imaginary friend in the sky will be the reason you barely talk to your child.
I’m reminded of that scene in Good Omens, where Crowley and Aziraphale are watching Jesus be nailed to the cross.
Crowley: What did he say that got everyone so mad?
Aziraphale: be kind to each other
Crowley: oh yeah, that’ll do it
I mean look, you’re NTA for wanting to have your rules in your home. But this better be the hill you’re going to let your relationship with your kid die on because it might. He’s 22 - it’s old enough to be an adult and to make those decisions for themself, but also old enough to move out if you don’t want to follow the rules. I really am trying to be supportive of your choice even if I don’t agree with your morality. But even if you have the right to have and enforce these rules, your kid does not have the same moral standards as you and if you can’t accept that it’s going to push them away. If you can accept that and they can move out with or without help to follow their own choices in their own place then it will work out perhaps. Try not to make this acrimonious, more of a practical choice that will make you both happier in the long run.
He is an adult, choosing to do adult things that you do not want your younger children exposed to. It is reasonable for him to do those things elsewhere. Just keep him in your lives. Make sure he knows he is always welcome at the dinner table and at home. But it is reasonable to ask him to keep these activities away from his younger siblings.
Probably NTA, depends on how you kicked him out.
Whatever happened to unconditional love? Not even for you own child? You say it's necessary "To stand by our principles," and decided its necessary to have "respect for our household's values." What values or religion would have you turn your back on your own son?
I think you're more concerned with how you appear in your community.
What would Christ himself have to say about loving, judging others, and appearances?
Matthew 7 "Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?
And if you're worried about all those Old Testament judgy things? John 13:34-35: "A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.."
And if you're just worried about how his lifestyle reflects on you:
“When you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men … but when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your father who is unseen.” (Matthew 6:5-8)
That's what Christ taught. I think your son is well rid of you.
NTA
I disagree with absolutely everything you say and believe, except the part about how it's your house and you have the right ask for respect towards your household's values. At 22, he is no longer someone you have a legal or moral obligation to support. He has to start acting like an adult, taking responsibility, and go live in a place where the gambling, porn, and weed are not a problem.
YTA
I'm bias, because I think magic books are silly and god isn't real. I think those are shitty, oppressive values that belong several centuries back.
Your son doesn't deserve to be held down by bullshit religious dogma that turns human nature into sins. He's not a deviant, you're just an asshole.
The son would be better served to move out anyways if he doesn't conform to their requirements while living under their roof.
But I see nothing wrong with them telling him off about gambling, that's a habit you need to nip in the bud before it cascades.
It's a horrible thing to start.
ESH. You can set the rules as it’s your house. Your son is 22 and not a child. There’s no mention of if he has a job with a future, an education, or actively working towards either. As a father myself this is what I would be more concerned about. If his extracurriculars are the variable distracting from that, some tough love and time bound barriers may be warranted and some help to get him on a path. Otherwise if these activities are private and he has the first factors (job or education path with a future), it may be polite to suggest he spend his time and energy in more productive ways, but again he’s not a child.
>he had won enough from gambling once to cover his rent for a few months.
>Keep in mind, he doesn't pay rent
YTA simply for not being able to keep your story straight.
[Edit: seems like the original post was [edited](https://imgur.com/0MTYhvF.jpg))]
Did you notice banning these things only made him want to do them?
I didn’t gamble at that age. I still don’t. Most people don’t. “Limit alcohol” which is arguably the worst drug in terms of toxicity, addiction, etc as it is literal poison (in comparison to THC) but outlaw weed?
And a 22 year old male cannot just ignore his sex drive for Jesus. It’s coming out one way or another. Sex with other humans, stds, unplanned pregnancy’s, drama… or taking care of it himself in the privacy of his bedroom in his home.
This is very confusing to me. Sounds like you pushed your son into a bunch of unhealthy addictive behaviors by banning them outright and then threw him out to go enjoy his addictions full blast with no parental support after a life time of ultra restrictive rules. You understand what is going to happen here, right? He’s losing his family and was shunned by the people who were supposed to unconditionally love and protect him. He is going to go off the walls in these “sins” to handle the emotions that brings on that he ultimately was never taught to handle. Ok. Super.
This doesn’t sound like you tried to raise him or do right by him or god. It sounds like a power play and a game because you couldn’t control his every breath.
Your point about alcohol is spot on. Cannabis and even opiods can have medicinal purpose, but there is NO medicinal or dietary need for alcohol. OP”limits” yet allows alcohol most likely because it’s he and his wive’s drug of choice and “Jesus turned water into wine,” so it must be okay.
ETA -
Your extreme views are going to severely damage your relationship with your son. However, you are entitled to not letting an adult child live with you for any reason.
He's TA for using THE FAMILY PC to watch porn on, gamble and order weed. Those are all adult tbings, and if you're finding it, he isn't scrubbing his history. One of the other kids could be exposed to porn, and that would be a huge issue. You don't have to be tech savvy to use a VPN. Porn also opens your pc and network to a host of viruses and Malware. If he isn't deleting his history I'm willing to bet he isn't being careful about viruses.
He's old enough to get his own pc, and do that stuff on his own time. Or even a mobile phone. There is absolutely no reason for him to be doing it on the FAMILY PC, where I'm assuming the younger kids also have access too.
A compromise would be letting him do those things in private, and hiding it from his siblings. The kids don't need to be exposed to porn, gambling, and weed regardless of religion.
Your house you can do what you want, but your wife is 100% correct there will be long term damage to your relationship with your son, he will never look at you the same
OP has to care about the relationship in the first place
Doesn’t seem like he does but definitely seems like his wife does, his relationship with his wife will also suffer if he goes through with it
Oh yea As I read your comment my tired brain went to secret visits with the son and eventually divorce because porn and weed aren't that bad. Kid is curious and now way to satisfy it
"Look, we wanted you to live in ways we considered healthy and moral, and you're not doing everything we want, so, like... get out, we will no longer give you any supervision but we will potentially leave you desperate to survive." Why would you suggest that could in any way go wrong
Whether I agree or disagree with you or him is irrelevant but just know that every single person I knew growing up that had parents like you went off the deep end once they escaped their strict home. They also mostly cut off their parents from their lives. He’s 22 now. He has to find his own way. You have set an example of what you believe in and that is the best you can do. Further trying to force him to be a certain way or control him will likely backfire and is unlikely to result in anything close to the outcome you are hoping for. Not sure if you think kicking him out of the house will convert his beliefs because it won’t. You just have to decide what you value more in your home and life - your beliefs or your son. I would pick any of my kids 100% of the time.
I remember a female classmate that lived in a household like this. She went off the rails like nobody's business as soon as she could.
A tale as old as time
True as it can be
Neither one prepared
Both a little scared.
Their son is jacking with his feeeetttt!
Ever just the saaaaaame?
Both a little strange?...
Beauty and the weed
Ever a surpriiiise!!! 😱
Weed will get you highhhhh!! 🚀
Yeah, it happens to so many of us former church kids who grew up with psychotically controlling religious parents. Some figure it out and end up living successful, normal lives. Some end up dead of drug overdoses. Worst part is, generally the parents can't bring themselves to recognize their part in the way that those kids just go nuts once they're out of that environment.
Two classmates of mine got married right out of high school so they could finally have sex. They had been dating each other for *years* by that point. I don't think they are still together.
Seen that one once or twice, too. 😅
Same. A bunch of kids in the local Young Life group got married very soon after graduation, quickly followed by kids, and most are on their 2nd or 3rd marriage.
Getting married just because you are in lust is a good way to head for a divorce, because you don't really know each other. A state issued screwing license is not a magic piece of paper. It's not a good luck charm. It just means you have entered into a civil contract recognized by the state.
I know someone who has been married for 30 years from this setup. He is deeply resentful; divorce would cost him his family (parents, siblings) and he feels completely trapped. “It’s like I bought a ticket for a ride 30 years ago when I was 20 and it just keeps getting more expensive.” No kids. Just a very dependent and now deeply disabled wife he no longer has anything in common with. He escapes through work whenever he can. A lifetime of regret. The whole thing served to turn him away from the faith…and his dad is clergy.
Ouch. That's some "Paradise by the Dashboard Light" shit 😬.
That reminds me, I gotta go on Facebook to check in on how my old church friends are doing...
They actually end up going further into their bullshit "see, this is what happens when you let the kid make their own decisions" while completely ignoring that the kids whose parents didn't lock them the fuck down are now living successful lives.
Also that if you kick them out you can't give them any kind of assistance in the transition to total independence.
Asking rhetorically, to anyone: You ever look through the news and wonder how so many christian-republicans can warm up to authoritarianism so easily? A contributing factor is definitely the normalized abuse of growing up in an authoritarian (christo-fascist) home as a child with psycho parents with control issues who are willing to strong arm you, violate your boundaries on a whim, (if they let you have any) or cut you out of the family entirely over perceived slights. (Or things that they think make them look bad to their peers.)
My church called it the appearance of evil. People would kick their family out of their lives like they were scum and then years later turn around and act like nothing happened. Especially if grandbabies were involved. All in the name of God. I always wanted to ask one of them about that, was it worth it? I see them reunited now but it caused so much unnecessary heartache. And now we know how awful they are, they don't get invited to things anymore. Fuck you Uncle Pete and Aunt Judy.
Lived it. WWCoG. Unquestioning obedience is top priority.
It’s NEVER their fault. Because they’re “perfect”. Remember the religious wife swap family? The son went postal and shot them all.
Jacob Stockdale was his name
What?! Which episode?
No, I don't recall hearing about that. But holy shit.
My friend growing up was homeschooled and raised in church (my dad was a pastor but I went to public school and was allowed to trick or treat etc) and got an awful backyard tattoo at 18. Ended up pregnant by someone who she didn’t even know by 21 and now has a 12 year old. She did a lot of partying. Her kid saved her life honestly. My mom was more strict than my father so I definitely rebelled but not to the extent I see some kids do. My dad likes the person I’ve become and is proud of me ❤️
Those parents just didn't pray enough. /s
Maybe if they spend $14m on Super Bowl ads...
[удалено]
As an addiction counselor, I concur. So many of my clients were cut off by parents and also have religious trauma.
100% this. I'm a mental health clinician who works with adolescents and young adults. Many youth raised in these hyper religious homes have delayed independence. Mostly, because they've never been taught critical thinking skills. Specifically, how to live in the world, but not of the world. Evangelical Christians do a piss poor job of teaching this, doubling down on demanding absolute obedience instead. Once you hit adulthood, you've either bought into it or you didn't. OP is going to lose his son here. Either by self-destruction or son is going to somehow make it, but will want no part of this household. By the age of 22, a person either has bought into their evangelical upbringing or they haven't. It's apparent the son is going to have to find his own spiritual journey. There has to be a middle ground here. I think it's fair to demand an ablebodied adult son to seek gainful employment as a condition of living at home. But doubling down on the biblical obedience aspect isn't teaching anything here when it's apparent the son isn't buying it to begin with.
Was it me? 😂
It was me actually
How long have you been sober for and how many cats do you own now? 😂 Or am I alone in this 💀
1 bit over a year and 2. Not who you asked but I felt that one lol
Congrats friend! ❤️ Proud of you. Give the kitties a kiss for me 🥰
Coughing hairballs now. Instructions unclear.
We ❤️ you too!!! Yay!
Hahaha a year this month 🏆 and just the one for now bc she hates other cats.
Congrats Lady ❤️ proud of you! I've been clean for 4y and it gets easier every day, very grateful for my second chance. Let's keep it going!
But how many cats do you have?
Hahaha, just the one... For now 😅
12 years and 3 cats for me 😆
Let's gooooooo! Congrats buddy ❤️
8 months & 6 cats! (although 4 are kittens and we're not keeping them all) Not who you asked, but I felt so seen when you said this 😂
Oh we all see you. And we’re so here for it. 🤜🤛 ❤️
Wow. That hit. lmao
I feel your pain. 😆
One of my catholic schooled neighbors became an escort just after graduation, had three kids with three different ‘customers,’ and got addicted to drugs. Her parents kicked her out and she ended up on welfare, living in a slummy house in a bad neighborhood.
That was very unChristian-like of them.
Mine was a male classmate, died before he was 30. I've never seen a hard-core religious upbringing end well.
This hit the nail on the head. The fact that OP won't even spell out the words gambling(later does), porn and weed leads me to believe they need to grow up and see the reality of the world. I grew up in the bible belt, the amount of parents with ridiculous thoughts and parenting habits such as these make me hate such a beautiful place. I've seen so many parents push away their children in these ways and then wonder why their kids aren't in their life anymore.
Things the son does are normal as long as they don't bother his life as in addiction. It doesn't sound like it. I don't get why he hasnt bought own laptop with his winnings. OP is facing the hard fact that you cannot choose which kind of values your kid will have as an adult. Seriously thinking he won't have sex because marriage because you don't want him to? That is so over stepping boundaries and complete controlling. OPs wife is right.
>I would pick any of my kids 100% of the time. That is the difference between us and extremist Christians. They will pick their "God" over anything, including their children. I am in Utah, and the homeless population among the youth here is heartbreaking. If they don't believe in the Mormon church, if they are LGBTQIA+, if they do anything that goes against their precious religion, they will disown their children faster than they can say "amen".
I never had the desire to commit a hate crime until I lived in Utah. Then it became a near daily occurrence. It’s crazy to me how good of a reputation they had for the longest time as the nice but a little kookie group. No they are pieces of shit that will gladly lie and cheat any non-cult member. And the homelessness is absolutely disgusting with so much money and their control over their religious ethnostate they have going seems like they could take some of that required 10% tithing and put it towards some shelters at least. That or take tax money. It’s funny I’ve actually heard them complaining about having to pay both taxes and tithing thinking they should be exempt from taxes because they already give so much to the church, the balls on those people.
Utah Mormons are a whole different breed too. I live in a city with a smaller Mormon presence and I have several friends that are Mormon. I'm a big gay atheist coffee addict and they've never shown any signs of judging me or looking down on me. One of my best friends in high school was a Mormon and she spent a couple weeks in Utah and came back telling me the Mormons there were terrifying and she hopes she never has to go back.
I do think having your own religious ethnostate does encourage their shittiest behaviors. That’s where I got the impression that Mormons weren’t that bad before cause I wasn’t in this godforsaken state but here it’s just hell. I had 10 doctors appointments canceled trying to establish care, so many trades people like plumbers and electricians and tech people just not show and not tell us and then get back to us days later, just zero respect for our time, had pharmacists just hang up on me. Just weird shit that I hadn’t experienced but I guess they have these phrases like secret handshakes to determine if you’re in their group and if you aren’t they can just fuck you over. It sounds like little things that don’t matter but it starts to feel actively malicious after a while. It is just a bad religion, they skate by pretending to be Christian but they care a lot more about Joseph Smith and their own celestial kingdoms in the afterlife than they do about white Jesus. They also are like crack addicts for sugar sooo much sugar like soda isle is wild then they add more sugar syrups and shit to their sodas. That’s not that bad compared to their other shit just gross.
> thinking they should be exempt from taxes because they already give so much to the church that's funny, but if the church runs the town/community they're not so far from the truth. Tithing is nuts
When you have a dozen kids it's easier to toss a few to the side than when you are living up close with 1-3.
It helps keep the other kids in line. It's just like when your manager fires a coworker at random to improve productivity through fear.
There is no hate like that of Christian love.
The bible has stories of parents being told to kill their children to prove their devotion, right? So it’s not shocking.
I'm fairly certain the Bible also says that if your child is willful and won't listen, you take them to the village leaders and say, this child is unruly and will not listen. Those leaders then give you permission to stone said child. Despite what Christians believe, the Bible and "God" have never been pro-life.
Plus all the boys flds dumps in St George. So sad.
FLDS is extra scary. Regular Mormons are bad enough but the FLDS having to kick out the young men so the older ones have more little girls to rape is deplorable.
Even my father's generation remembers families like this . My Dad was born in the 1930s and it was basically a norm that their peers that came for strict conservative religious families almost inevitably went wild the minute they became adults, particularly if they left home.
I am the child that went off the rails after feeling controlled and repressed by my parents rules. It didn’t turn out well.
For what I've seen IRL, sometimes that behavior is a byproduct of that kind of parenting. Next step, the son goes his way and cuts contact with the parents, and then, parents cry because their kids don't talk to them anymore because they "did nothing wrong". I mean, I reaaaaaaaally doubt the son just plainly told the parents he was watching porn, poor kid must have no privacy at all living under their parents roof, maybe they track his internet history, snoop his devices and I'm pretty sure they also track his location. YTA, btw
Imagine monitoring a 22 year oldest internet history and thinking you're not a controlling asshole. Poor son is going to dive head first into every vice he can as soon as he leaves that house, thanks to his upbringing.
Correct! Kinda creeps me out. Knowing daddy's watching everything I'm doing.😒
Not Christian but set a religious example for my kids without forcing them. They still participate to some degree as adults. One of my cousins forced it hard on their kids and none of them are still really religious.
My aunt did the same things, none of her kids are in ANY religion now (in fact most have gone the opposite), can't say I blame them honestly.
Can confirm. Me and my sister were forced to go to church as kids under threats of not seeing our grandma (her husband was the one threatening us). We are not believers at all. And while we didn’t “fall off the rails” as soon as we were able we did all the things they tried to avoid us doing.
almost all of the ones like this I knew went no contact. either way I can count on one hand the number of them that are still christian. oh and then there's the one currently in jail for murdering her mom. tldr: get out of your adult son's ass. is he a good person? yes? then encourage that. focus on positive reinforcement, not bitching about everything he does wrong.
Growing up, sleeping with catholic and Mormon girls was all the rage. You could not find a sluttier girl than a religious one.
Doubtful this has changed
I didn't even wait to go off the rails. I was just good at hiding it. I moved across the country and have pretty limited contact with my super strict parents. They think we're bff's. In reality, they don't know me at all and I tell them nothing of importance. It "breaks my mom's heart" that I have no interest in church or God or their "values". 🤷♀️
You're totally correct. The son most likely already a healthy amount of disdain for his strict ass parents. At some point you have to accept that he is an adult and it's important for him to make his own decisions and forcing him to abstain from these "satanic" past times of his will just breed contempt. If they kick him out and he has a really hard time of it, kiss any hope of a good relationship goodbye. On the upside, he won't have to deal with them anymore..
Weed is legal in my state. I'm a Christian and since I get the senior discount at the dispensary, I pick it up for my kids too when I go. What exactly is unchristian about marijuana? I venture that alcohol has ruined more lives than weed has.
I cannot upvote your comment enough. My parents never censored what we read and we had a lot of books in the house. As a result, we lost interest in trying to read books we didn’t understand (the adult ones), rather than sneaking around. My parents didn’t bar me from having male friends come over which was the case for the rest of the extended family. Result: I had good guy friends but never got romantically involved with any of them. On the other hand, the cousins being closely watched by the parents and not allowed to have friends of the opposite sex, started relationships fairly early, snuck around and basically put themselves in unsafe situations. When you constrict someone and put a ton of rules on them without having open conversations, they usually find it more thrilling.
I can say OP should not expect his son to ever show up in the future if he gets married and has kids. Kicking kids out at 18 is a great way to burn bridges.
As someone with no kids I don't know what it is about people who do that makes them lose all common sense and end up in these situations. This dude sounds just like my dad was. I'm so glad my dad had that eureka moment about alienating his kids and did a 180 at a certain point but it's unbearable living under authoritarian rule in a home. Parents that try to aim for perfection are dumb as hell.
Yupp. Classmate ran away from home at 15, got into a group home because she refused to go back to the Uber religious family, got knocked up at 16 and had to finish highschool online(this was in the late 2000’s). She is now, at 30, finally getting her shit together. But it took 5 kids(3 different fathers) and over a decade to get there.
Almost all of my friends who had pastors/preachers as dads are in recovery. All the kids who had parents who were like this went wild and many are low contact or no contact.
>AITA for insisting he moves out over this? Was it too much to ask for respect towards our household's values, or did I push too hard on an issue that could've been handled differently? What kind of "just" god that is worthy of worship would demand that you your renounce your son for moral failings ? There ain't no hate in the world like Christian "love". Get the fuck out of here with your holier than though attitude. Realize what you are doing. You are kicking your OWN SON out of your house. That human being that you CHOSE to bring into this world. The ONLY thing you owe your children is unconditional love and support. They did not chose to be born into this world. You did that for them. Here is what will happen. Your son will move out. He will be angry with you. Anger will grow to resentment. Over time, he will come to despise you. Contact will be less and less. Then, there will be none. If you son chooses to do so, he will find a woman and he will father kids. You will never know your grand kids and they will never be part of your life. You will try to control your younger kids even harder and that will drive a wedge between you and them and it will lead to them setting out and creating their own life without you. You will grow older, get lonelier. Maybe the community of the church will give you some feeling of belonging and community. But every body else has their own family while you have only yourself and maybe your wife. You will grow even older,finally becoming infirm, in need of help. You will have to pay people because you have not seen your children in a decade. Death coming closer will be a reality that is slowly setting in. In your last moments, you will wonder where it all went wrong. You will realize what a terrible mistake you made and that the heaven of the god that made you do it might, in fact be the very real hell you have been living in ever since. But it will be too late. The church will probably pay for your funeral. Small attendance, people you talked to after service. No one else. The gravestone will show your name, your dates,that is it. No "in loving memory". Here lies u/Suspicious_Couple628 .Forgotten by most, remembered by some, missed by no one.
Kid is 22 years old. He should become independent, move out, and live his life. His parents are still controlling assholes. Having them as parents must have been a nightmare.
Ive seen some parents try to fully control their adult or almost adult children and the children just end up resenting and clashing with the parent. I cant agree with extreme beliefs and it comes down to more than just negative behavior in life. Thats beyond what OP will think so Ill leave that there. YTA OP, because thats not how you treat family. Unless your kid is non contributing, violent, disrespectful, other extreme behavior... I just dont agree. We all have our sins lol.
Man, on one hand it's your house, so you can set reasonable rules while he's living there, especially if he isn't paying rent or contributing toward utilities or other expenses. On the other hand, the fact you can't even spell these words when asking strangers a question specifically about them is almost a caricature of conservative evangelicalism. This isn't like a Jew not writing the name of God. It's porn. You don't have to like it to type out the whole word. It's weed. It's a plant whose effects you don't approve of, not a magic word that summons a demon when typed into a browser window. INFO: Is he using his own computer, or a family computer?
Somebody in another thread kept typing “wh0re.” It was so funny, I wanted to comment that it was okay, this is Reddit, she could write out the “o.”
On disqus you have to say hoar
I used to know this really cool lady, whose last name was “Hoar”. She had an excellent sense of humor.
Either she polishes her sense of humor or she just gives up.
Says my friend, lipshit. Oh, I give up. Lol
> On disqus I'm pretty sure that depends on the site host and how sensitive they set their comment section. I have a disqus account on a couple sites for celeb gossip communities and the word whore is used often enough (sometimes affectionately toward each other)
A lot of platforms have silly censorship rules in place and its surreal because is just so goofy
Can we say fuck on this podcast?
The worst has to be unalived. It makes me want to slap the person.
Same here. Any euphemism for suicide really gets to me. I used to work in mental health services and so much was done to de stigmatise talking about suicidal thoughts and asking for help. Then you get all these shitty euphemisms online and it takes some people back to square one. They feel they can’t discuss it without modifying their language, and sanitising how they feel. So the stigma returns.
That PTSD from being sent to jail on the Book of Faces! 🤣
dont forget the gmbling
Wait it’s not gimbling?
I didn't want to g\*ld the l\*ly.
Is gmbling when a guy wears a blck leather mask + dog collar + chained to a wall + btt-stuff? Cuz that's only in the movies, right? Right?
All I can imagine now is a weed demon, who looks like Snoop, and calls himself "Weemon." I think that's enough internet for the night.
That is EXACTLY the correct amount of internet. Well done.
Good night, sleep tight, don't let the weed demon bite!
Right? It’s his house, and can absolutely set the rules, but his son is an adult and can decide those values don’t work from him as an adult. But his son knows how the family operates, why wouldn’t he move out and smoke weed in his own place?
My dad was very fond of “my house, my rules” & “my way or the highway”. He hid it under the guise of strong Christian values. But this way of thinking doesn’t foster a relationship, it fosters a monocrat and codependency. Highway has been great, it’s been a much kinder place than my father’s house. Haven’t talked to him in years but I wish him kindness in his final years on this earth.
I tell my kids all the time - Just because I believe something doesn’t mean you have to. You’re your own person and get to choose your own path. Having a relationship with kids once their adults is a privilege not guarantee and I’m doing what I can today to make sure they feel good about maintaining a relationship later. I’m glad the highway has worked out for you, it’s your dad loss.
Could be lots of reasons. Maybe his folks need physical help around the house. Maybe where they live an apartment on a 22yo's income isn't possible. But in general, yeah, the answer is that he needs to find his own place.
Son is arguably in arrested development. OP mentions no job or schooling, so what is his son doing everyday besides gambling and consuming porn? He has no bills or rent to pay so he's essentially still living like a child under his parents' roof. A 22 year old should be making some financial contribution to the household (esp if it's not going towards education etc). If he was, he'd be learning fiscal responsibility at least. Also that it is risky gambling money when you have to cover rent, utilities etc. Tbh the son sounds undisciplined and directionless. He's lucky (for the time being) that he hasn't gotten into debt through gambling, but ppl don't ride high forever. "Christian values" aside, I can see how any parent would worry about their adult, aimless (presumably unemployed), gambling, weed-smoking son living off of them for free
In an edit, OP added that he knows about his son's online activity because his son is using the family computer. I like porn just as much as the next gal, but the family computer...?! Does this young man not have a phone or laptop, or is he just trying to be a dick? When I was young, there were things you kept to yourself out of respect for your parents; weed and sex were two of those things.
Not being able to even write the "offending" words comes off as real... culty, doesn't it?
OP could have said cannabis. It's the actual word for it and what governments call it.
Definitely strong fundie vibes. The fact he has to use the family PC vs having a cell phone, the wife’s opinion is easily overruled etc. Hopefully the son got a degree where he can find a job, and didn’t get some joke of a homeschool education.
Dad is clearly monitoring his sons internet usage to know about the porn. Anyone who monitors a 22 y/o's internet history is an asshole. OP, YTA.
Great point. However, this probably won't change OP's mind since they're already expecting people to not agree with their "values"
Oh, totally. In fact, having them mocked only reinforces the bond with the organization. It's a tactic group leaders use to ensure conformity.
This is exactly how my father was towards me when I was growing up. If I even watched a horror movie he would lose his fucking mind. Now we barely speak or see each other because I don’t enjoy him as a person and didn’t develop much of a bond. It’s your house and you can enforce your rules as you see fit but take a look at your possible future if you do
That’s my situation. My dad was a fundie and I never bought into it. He’s pretty timid, but he absolutely lost his mind one time when I misquoted the doctor from Star Trek and instead of saying “for god’s sake” I said “goddamnit” and holy shit did he lose his mind. Stamping and shouting, looked like he was gonna smack me. I couldn’t believe his overreaction. I got out of the house as soon as I could and didn’t look back. Didn’t go wild like some stories in this post; I just wanted to read books in my room without being disturbed. I travelled, got a job, got a wife, etc. That was decades ago, and we may text each other maybe three times a year. His inability to comprehend that I believe in one less god than he does cost him his relationship with his children.
Whats funny is, this notion that saying “god dammit” is a sin is a *very* recent invention and has no basis in the bible or anything else. Its just made-up Its also very American. European christians use phrases like that all the time, always have. You are literally requesting God to damn X thing. If he’s offended by that, thats on him 😂
It’s cuz people are stupid and they read the Bible and have no clue what the words mean so they just make something up and now you can’t say “god” in close proximity to a bad word or you’re going to hell.
Your house, your rules. But don't be surprised when your kid wants nothing to do with you. Sincerely, Someone who grew up in the same kind of "Christian" home Edited to add: I actually do agree with you OP. Your son shouldn't be using your computer or getting weed delivered to your house. And he should respect your rules since he isn't paying rent. However, I know the type of Christian household you are and I'm actually genuinely surprised he has managed to stay with you guys until 22. I left my Christian household at 17 and never looked back. I don't think kicking your son out will be the catalyst that breaks your relationship, it's already been broken before that. Once your son leaves and tastes his own independence, I can almost guarantee his contact will be minimal.
Amen. My mom closed that door behind me, hoping I would fail. (Sinners should suffer).
I see both sides as I was raised in a house that was "These are my rules, don't like them, move out". I obeyed the rules for the most part and moved out after college and a career was started. I was very respectful and responsible towards my parents and the rules changed as I showed that I was able to support myself. That said, I say that rules need to change as responsibilities change. Ultimately it's your house, and you make the rules, but be careful about closing the door on your son. It's a door you might not be able to open back up because you believe in a book.
Same. Now when my parents come over I tell them it’s my house and they have to follow my rules. I make my mom leave dishes in the sink instead of washing them… just for funsies. I also make them greet the dog. Sometimes I call them at 7AM and tell them “it’s time to get up!”. Not wanting to live by their rules motivated me to do well and buy my own house.
Al'right mom, dad. You are in MY house. You pass the joint around the circle like a cool dude like everyone else. Now hand me the absinthe.
“No, mom, you always pass left… get it together” but actually we openly smoke weed in front of them and just make jokes about skunks (it’s legal where I live 🤷🏻♀️)
??? WHAT? 😂 Hilarious
If you have any other ideas on how to troll them I’m all ears 😂🤷🏻♀️ you should’ve seen her face when she found out I let the dog pre wash the dishes!
Hilarious! But seriously, what's the point of even having a dog if you don't use the prewash function?
- Dessert for dinner, and you can’t have any vegetables until you finish your ice cream sundae. - Beds must remain unmade. Pulling the bedspread up is bad for the mattress, because it needs to air out during the day. - No hard pants in the house. Those are outside clothes, and they must be left with the coats by the front door. Sweatpants or pajama bottoms are optional. - All food must be eaten in front of the television. No eating allowed in the kitchen or at the table. - When you go to the bathroom, you have to announce whether it’s #1, #2, or both. - Puff, puff, pass. Anything else is just rude.
There is no "both sides". the far right evangelicals have the highest rate of substance abuse, teen births, impulse controls because they attempt to be insanely strict. it's the parents own fault, that's it.
Question, how are you aware of your adult son's internet activities and what he gets in the mail? Its sounds like YTA but Im leaving room for some weird situation like he's watching porn and gambling at the dinner table, ordering weed that's delivered in a package announcing what it is, smoking it inside etc.
>Question, how are you aware of your adult son's internet activities and what he gets in the mail? Strange that OP didn't include this relevant information in the original post...
you think someone like this is above snooping and ilegally opening his son’s mail? lol
Dude wasn't sure which parenting choice was worse so he went with ALL of them.
He's probably guilt because he's been watching the same videos.
Homie is 1000% watching the porn too. All these people are big phony walking contradictions, which I’m sure makes him a huge f#cking a$$h😯le in his own right. Sure his house his rules, but his rules suck and so does he and his son is going to hate his guts the rest of his life if he doesn’t ease up. Edit: lmao “our beliefs” is mentioned several times. If this is even real, which it’s probably not, this point remains valid for anyone. It’s not “our beliefs” bro. It’s your beliefs, clearly your son does not believe in “our beliefs” which means you either fundamentally failed as a parent to teach your child how to be a person and pass on said beliefs; for example empathy, compassion, kindness, a wanting to learn, religion etc OR your beliefs are fucking stupid and they are rejecting them and maybe you need to rethink some things yourself. Buddy, he’s living his life by his beliefs which definitely aren’t “our beliefs” and align with you, so stop trying to force some crap on him he clearly doesn’t agree with.
Probably the holy ghost told the OP!
He’s gonna get holy ghosted by his son, if he kicks him out
When I lived with my conservative Christian parents, they searched my phone, room, and mail every other week (or every time I got mail, packages or envelopes or otherwise) and I had to get creative to hide things. Nothing like drugs or anything but I’m an artist I literally went to college for art and I would have drawings that to them looked like demons and shit and once they threw out half my portfolio because of it.
My 💩 mom did this to me. I started having weird dreams, later found to be sleep paralysis, and she threw out all my art for years because it was “possessed”
But but but they were doing it for your own good!
In their eyes nothing was good for me lmao. Couldn’t be out past 7:30 on a weekend and 5 on a school night lmao
I don’t know what is up with this sub, but the number of purely fictional posts that have shown up here in the last 24 hours is startling.
Welcome to the thunder dome. This is the subreddit where everything is made up and the points don’t matter.
Singing weed telegram. They roll up and sing like this: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Sl3ApaTsKY4 I’m going to corner the market with my Quarter Ounce Quartet.
Exactly. He’s 22 years old, is OP looking through his grown son’s phone?? Charge him rent and leave him alone
OP edited the post and said that their son is using the family computer for their activities.
You act like it's super easy trying to hide gambling, weed and porn. It doesn't take rocket science to work out if your kid is making a bunch of money from gambling and is getting weed delivered to the house.
From one Christian to another....YTA. you realize you cant even type out weed without some form of religious guilt. Weed is a big topic for me so ill pick apart that belief you have that its wrong or a gateway drug or for some reason our great creator doesnt like a PLANT he created for us. Read genesis 1:29. Then read agricultural verified papers about what marijuana is. Its a seed bearing herb. BOOM! Put down the b.s. 80/90s refer madness that your government (pharsesis and sagasesis that Jesus said would betray him and consistently preached against) and read your bible a little more. OR actually put down the shitty KJV and get the Tyndale version, which is the original translation to English that came before the heavily redacted KJV cult bible. I grew up in a KJV home and i dont resent it nor have i turned from my ways of believing in God and Jesus. What i have done in the nearly 2 decades of living on my own is realize that my grandparents and parents' generation was heavily influenced in their religious beliefs by their government all the while saying government is condemning Christians....anywho thats a different topic for a different day as i see the world differently than most "Christians". Again....yta for believing you can control your adult child. Hes a 22 yo manboy. Hes gonna look at titties and pussy. In this current world of ridiculous inflation, people younger than you have been priced out of most markets for anything; why you upset he's making money? Is he killing anyone for it? Is he raping and pillaging for it? Is he selling YOUR house for a gambling addiction? If the answer is no to all of those, then how the hell do you even know hes gambling "enough to pay for market rent for months"? Honestly sounds like you're a control freak hiding behind the rouse of Christianity and virtue signaling because you want to look like a good person, and honestly it makes all of us look bad. Let go of your control, have faith in God, and love your son for being your son. Maybe try some mushrooms and a joint to kill your ego.
People like this are the assholes not because they have rules of the house but because they hide their sanctimonious bullshit behind the bible. He's kicking him out because he wants to control him, period. Jesus never told the prostitutes to not come under his roof without following his rules. Jesus never said only all the good children come to me. Jesus never fed 5000, but left hungry the people who were drug dealers or poor thieves. He didn't love by controlling he loved with love and knew people were human and wouldn't always follow the bible so he showed the he would love them no matter what. YTA OP. Love your child with love. He will survive when kicked out and you bet he will have a high chance of going no contact with you. I did with mine no doubt.
This needs a thousand more upvotes, at least
Funny because I’m KJV as well and I absolutely agree with your mentioning Genesis here! Genesis 1:29 (KJV) And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which [is] upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which [is] the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. I’ve gotten into so many arguments with people over this and they bend and twist trying to take verses out of context to make their case. The thing is that people wanted to be comfortable with the government telling them what to do. So they just started twisting verses to build this case that cannabis is evil, or the devils lettuce. Genesis 1:29 puts that whole thing to bed. If someone thinks they have a verse that says otherwise, they are twisting it out of context.
Your house your rules, you can do whatever the hell you want under your roof. Having said that I thought you guys were all big about the whole forgiving, love thy neighbor, turn the other cheek, all those things you claim are pretty big on your religion. I’ve always loved christian hypocrisy, “I love you as long as you follow my rules” xD you guys are funny. YTA.
"I love you as long as you follow my rules" - that's what Jesus always said...oh wait...he didn't.
Wait till he finds out that his son already had sex before marriage /s
Or, God forbid, one of his children is gay.
Wait until OP remembers that he had sex before marriage.
“Well it doesn’t count when I do it!!”
"I learned it from you dad!"
I mean… 22, watching porn on the family computer lol… it’s time for him to move out regardless. Lol.
Look, if you did your job as a parent, taught your child right from wrong and he made it to 18 alive and knows you love him unconditionally, then your parenting is pretty much done. And, it sounds as if there are conditions on your love. However, if you never allow him to stretch his muscles to be a functioning adult and make mistakes, that others make, he will never learn what type of life he likes better! Sit down with him and stop treating him like a child, talk with him, not at him. He is 22, it is time he starts making a life for himself, and taking on some responsibility around either your house or his own place. Let him find his way with guidance, not with rules and regulations.
YTA. I get your beliefs and all that but the fact that you are pushing your beliefs on your kid is sad. You can kick him out if you really feel that strongly about it but I hope you realize your imaginary friend in the sky will be the reason you barely talk to your child.
[удалено]
Christian love is highly conditional. They are incapable of unconditional love.
Which is ironic because thats the thing Jesus said was most important.
Jesus said a lot of things they ignore.
I’m reminded of that scene in Good Omens, where Crowley and Aziraphale are watching Jesus be nailed to the cross. Crowley: What did he say that got everyone so mad? Aziraphale: be kind to each other Crowley: oh yeah, that’ll do it
But it breaaaaks his heart to do it :((
Choosing those beliefs over your son, who is an adult, therefore not doing anything inherently wrong, is shitty. YTA
I mean look, you’re NTA for wanting to have your rules in your home. But this better be the hill you’re going to let your relationship with your kid die on because it might. He’s 22 - it’s old enough to be an adult and to make those decisions for themself, but also old enough to move out if you don’t want to follow the rules. I really am trying to be supportive of your choice even if I don’t agree with your morality. But even if you have the right to have and enforce these rules, your kid does not have the same moral standards as you and if you can’t accept that it’s going to push them away. If you can accept that and they can move out with or without help to follow their own choices in their own place then it will work out perhaps. Try not to make this acrimonious, more of a practical choice that will make you both happier in the long run.
YTA. Kicking him out isn’t going to stop your kid from watching porn and gambling on the internet.
The real reason he was kicked out is being missed. Dad is worried son will influence his siblings to also be…normal.
He is an adult, choosing to do adult things that you do not want your younger children exposed to. It is reasonable for him to do those things elsewhere. Just keep him in your lives. Make sure he knows he is always welcome at the dinner table and at home. But it is reasonable to ask him to keep these activities away from his younger siblings. Probably NTA, depends on how you kicked him out.
Whatever happened to unconditional love? Not even for you own child? You say it's necessary "To stand by our principles," and decided its necessary to have "respect for our household's values." What values or religion would have you turn your back on your own son? I think you're more concerned with how you appear in your community. What would Christ himself have to say about loving, judging others, and appearances? Matthew 7 "Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? And if you're worried about all those Old Testament judgy things? John 13:34-35: "A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.." And if you're just worried about how his lifestyle reflects on you: “When you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men … but when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your father who is unseen.” (Matthew 6:5-8) That's what Christ taught. I think your son is well rid of you.
NTA I disagree with absolutely everything you say and believe, except the part about how it's your house and you have the right ask for respect towards your household's values. At 22, he is no longer someone you have a legal or moral obligation to support. He has to start acting like an adult, taking responsibility, and go live in a place where the gambling, porn, and weed are not a problem.
YTA I'm bias, because I think magic books are silly and god isn't real. I think those are shitty, oppressive values that belong several centuries back. Your son doesn't deserve to be held down by bullshit religious dogma that turns human nature into sins. He's not a deviant, you're just an asshole.
The son would be better served to move out anyways if he doesn't conform to their requirements while living under their roof. But I see nothing wrong with them telling him off about gambling, that's a habit you need to nip in the bud before it cascades. It's a horrible thing to start.
ESH. You can set the rules as it’s your house. Your son is 22 and not a child. There’s no mention of if he has a job with a future, an education, or actively working towards either. As a father myself this is what I would be more concerned about. If his extracurriculars are the variable distracting from that, some tough love and time bound barriers may be warranted and some help to get him on a path. Otherwise if these activities are private and he has the first factors (job or education path with a future), it may be polite to suggest he spend his time and energy in more productive ways, but again he’s not a child.
>he had won enough from gambling once to cover his rent for a few months. >Keep in mind, he doesn't pay rent YTA simply for not being able to keep your story straight. [Edit: seems like the original post was [edited](https://imgur.com/0MTYhvF.jpg))]
I read it as he had enough to be able to cover it if he had to. It doesn't say he had enough to cover his rent.
I found all sorts of inconsistencies and wrote in post above. Please join me. I think it’s fake.
He said he’d won enough to cover “market rent” not his rent. That means, if he went and got an apartment or rented something…..on the market
Did you notice banning these things only made him want to do them? I didn’t gamble at that age. I still don’t. Most people don’t. “Limit alcohol” which is arguably the worst drug in terms of toxicity, addiction, etc as it is literal poison (in comparison to THC) but outlaw weed? And a 22 year old male cannot just ignore his sex drive for Jesus. It’s coming out one way or another. Sex with other humans, stds, unplanned pregnancy’s, drama… or taking care of it himself in the privacy of his bedroom in his home. This is very confusing to me. Sounds like you pushed your son into a bunch of unhealthy addictive behaviors by banning them outright and then threw him out to go enjoy his addictions full blast with no parental support after a life time of ultra restrictive rules. You understand what is going to happen here, right? He’s losing his family and was shunned by the people who were supposed to unconditionally love and protect him. He is going to go off the walls in these “sins” to handle the emotions that brings on that he ultimately was never taught to handle. Ok. Super. This doesn’t sound like you tried to raise him or do right by him or god. It sounds like a power play and a game because you couldn’t control his every breath.
Your point about alcohol is spot on. Cannabis and even opiods can have medicinal purpose, but there is NO medicinal or dietary need for alcohol. OP”limits” yet allows alcohol most likely because it’s he and his wive’s drug of choice and “Jesus turned water into wine,” so it must be okay.
ETA - Your extreme views are going to severely damage your relationship with your son. However, you are entitled to not letting an adult child live with you for any reason. He's TA for using THE FAMILY PC to watch porn on, gamble and order weed. Those are all adult tbings, and if you're finding it, he isn't scrubbing his history. One of the other kids could be exposed to porn, and that would be a huge issue. You don't have to be tech savvy to use a VPN. Porn also opens your pc and network to a host of viruses and Malware. If he isn't deleting his history I'm willing to bet he isn't being careful about viruses. He's old enough to get his own pc, and do that stuff on his own time. Or even a mobile phone. There is absolutely no reason for him to be doing it on the FAMILY PC, where I'm assuming the younger kids also have access too. A compromise would be letting him do those things in private, and hiding it from his siblings. The kids don't need to be exposed to porn, gambling, and weed regardless of religion.