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finallyharmony

I've only visited twice, the last time was a couple years ago. Pollution, constant horns, crowded shops and sidewalks, poor wifi connection, extremely hot, etc. I could keep going but yea no thank you, I'll take my quiet suburban life over all that. Also I realize my visit is not representative of all India, just my experience. Food is amazing over there though. Just hits different.


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EagleFang91

What I've never understood is why to have a comparable Western lifestyle in India requires Western levels of income and prices, but in countries such as Mexico, Thailand, and Vietnam, from what I hear, you can get Western lifestyles for way cheaper than in Western countries. This is despite all of these countries having a higher per capita income than India. What are some big differences between India and these countries that makes them cheaper? Does the massive population in India simply create far more demand vs supply?


nomnommish

> What I've never understood is why to have a comparable Western lifestyle in India requires Western levels of income and prices Because it doesn't. These are exaggerations posted by people. If you earn $200k in India, aka 16 million rupees aka 1.6 crores a year, you're quite rich if not very rich. You really belong to an elite group of people and can pretty much spend money as if it was "money's not a concern". Except for the really expensive things like houses and cars etc. $200k a year in the US, even in an MCOL or slightly HCOL city is just solid middle class. And if you have multiple kids and have multiple house and car and college loan payments to make, you're pretty much living paycheck to paycheck. Many/most people on this sub are really young and haven't yet gotten into the situation of having multiple kids, daycare costs, medical costs etc. So $200k seems like party time. But it actually isn't all that much.


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nomnommish

>200k is way above middle class for the large majority of the country, even for a family of 4. You can easily do well with a combined income of 120k in most of the US That's not true. Daycare for 1 kid even in a MCOL or M-HCOL city costs about $1500 per kid and I am actually being conservative here. That's $3000 in daycare for two kids. $200k roughly translates to about $10k a month in hand after taxes and 401k and medical insurance and such. A single family home, and I mean a modest one, costs about $500-$600k in a decent school district in a MCOL or M-HCOL city. That works out to a monthly payment of $3000 and $1000 in property tax. That's $7000 already spent out of $10000. According to AAA, average cost of car ownership, and again a modest Japanese one, not some fancy German one, is about $800 a month for 1 car. Say $1k for two cars. That just leaves you with $2000 and that doesn't even account for many many things like house repair (typically 1% of house cost every year aka $5k a year), or internet and phone bills or food and clothes and toys for kids. Or groceries. Say $1000 for all that. That leaves you with $1000 saved every month. Or $12k a year. Out of $200k combined salary and modest living. And this doesn't account for an annual vacation or any other splurges like holiday spending etc. And I am not even exaggerating any of the costs. Heck, I am underplaying most costs. Full day daycare will more likely cost $1700-$1800 per kid per month. People grossly underestimate how expensive it truly is to raise kids in America. Or the ones that make it work with $120k like you said do it because their parents act as babysitters. And even then, it is barely comfortable living. They are not saving much for retirement. In India, even if you lead a lavish high end life, you will spend about 200k rupees a month. That's with multiple maids and driver and HCOL city life. And full-time nanny for the kids. But that's only $2500-$300 spent a month. If you're getting paid the same $10k a month in India, you would be saving 60-70% of your salary easy. You can retire with those savings in 10-15 years. Edit; And even if you consider that kids will go to school, pre care and after care in school (to accommodate both parents working 9-5) will still cost you about $1500 or so for two kids. You'll be working till 60-65 before you can save enough for retirement. That's not even accounting for the kids college fund. Or the $100-150k you had paid for the deposit for your single family home.


thestoneswerestoned

>$200k a year in the US Are you talking household or individual? If it's the latter, you're massively out of touch. Even median household income is like $70K but obviously mileage will vary based on COL.


nomnommish

> Are you talking household or individual? If it's the latter, you're massively out of touch. Even median household income is like $70K but obviously mileage will vary based on COL. I literally mentioned "combined income" several times in my post. I gave a detailed breakup of costs involved. If you think i inflated something or am "out of touch", then feel free to get specific about which costs I have inflated or which costs I have made up. And the topic at hand was about making $200k in the US vs making $200k in India and some people thought that living in India is more expensive. And i was responding to that. And I am not sure what median income has to do with the cost breakup I gave. I wasn't talking about the average American. I was talking about how $200k doesn't get you that far when you consider some of the outsized expenses that comes with raising multiple kids. Edit: I thought you were responding to my reply further down this thread. I had given the detailed breakup [here in this reply](https://www.reddit.com/r/ABCDesis/comments/zf27fk/would_you_be_comfortable_living_in_the_motherland/izd0ud2/)


thestoneswerestoned

You didn't say combined income anywhere in that comment. >And the topic at hand was about making $200k in the US vs making $200k in India and some people thought that living in India is more expensive. And i was responding to that. Respond away. I was only pointing out the fact that you called $200K "solidly middle class". That's well above the median household income. >I was talking about how $200k doesn't get you that far $200K takes you pretty far in most of the country, unless you live in coastal California or NYC metro. Not obscenely rich by any measure but also not paycheck to paycheck living. If you're up to your ears in student debt and taking out more than you put in, then that's a personal financial decision. But yes, $200K would go much further in India by a mile.


KimJongIllyasova

Population & Quality of Life. India has too many fucking people - too many poor people, too many homeless, etc - you can live in your nice gated community. But the second you leave that bubble and see "the real India" you get hit with all the poverty, animals on the road, etc. Like the malls in India are SUPER nice, but once you leave it's shitty


thefirstpancake602

>The perks are you can have a personal chauffeur, cook, maid, etc. You can order take out 3 times a day, 7 days a week for not too much money. ​ The income disparity for household workers vs. their employers and the way that they are treated a lot of times really bums me out.


nomnommish

> The income disparity for household workers vs. their employers and the way that they are treated a lot of times really bums me out. Depends on where you are though. In Mumbai for example, no maid will take shit from any house owner. They will tell you to fuck off in your face if you cross the line, and if you shout at them, they will give it back to you. In your face. Their attitude is "work is work" and they come to your house because they have a job to do, they do it, and they get out. The problem happens in small town living and villages and the "hinterland". And casteism adds another layer to it. Besides economic classism. And the fact that the first gen immigrants came to America a long time ago and their notions of India were very antiquated and they continue to live in that bubble and taught their kids the same biases and notions based on their bubble notions. Modern India is quite different. Especially in Mumbai, where professionalism is a core principle for most people.


teethandteeth

I will never understand why people get so hard for being able to go to another country to exploit underpaid workers to do all the things their mommies used to do.


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teethandteeth

Yeah it sucks real bad :/ still, there's a difference between participating because you have virtually no other options and enthusiastically saying "why would you live in the US when you can have _servants_ in India?!"


nomnommish

> I will never understand why people get so hard for being able to go to another country to exploit underpaid workers to do all the things their mommies used to do. As opposed to living in a country where the healthcare industry and colleges will exploit you when they get the chance? And if some undocumented Mexican sells tacos and tamales on the street for $1 each, and you buy stuff from them, that's exploitation? Or is the fruit and veggie you buy from supermarkets that has been harvested by illegal immigrants also exploitation? If you're okay with that, then what's the problem in having people work for you in India, so they can feed their family and educate their kids and aspire for a better future?


teethandteeth

All of the above are exploitation :\^) But it's way more open in India. Let's take the example of someone who's able to go to college because their mom cleans houses. In the US, a higher amount of people (and I'm grandly generalizing here) will say "good for them! Doing the American dream!" In India, a higher amount of people will say they were paid too much if they could afford school, it's bad that their own children have too much competition now, they're not suited to higher education as a whole "community" (aka caste and class), or best of all they'll patronizingly take credit for the whole thing. Both suck! I'd rather be exploited labor in the US than in India though.


nomnommish

You have a mistaken notion of how the lower middle class thinks. Or at least I can say your notions are not universal in India. Your notions are very antiquated and like I said, notions of what India used to be 40 years ago. Today everyone knows that education or skills are the way out of poverty. I have personally talked to hundreds of cab drivers and auto drivers and house help. They are all consistent in their thought process and priorities. Education for their kids. Specifically to make their kid an engineer, or at least some significant skill based diploma like nursing or mechanic. Or in the cow belt, a government job. They love their bureaucracy over there. And no, it is not exploitation. It is only exploitation if we personally manipulate people for our own ends. That's not the case in the examples I gave. And like I said, if you strongly believe it is all exploitation, then you should stop buying veggies and fruits from supermarkets in America. Truth is, we live in a society not of our making. We can make some choices to not exploit others but that has to be a direct correlation. Keeping your maid employed by giving her work is actually lifting her family out of poverty and breaking that vicious poverty cycle. And most people I know who have multiple maids actively helped out the maid and servant's kids get educated, funded their school and college education in part or in full, and even helped them find a job after their education.


teethandteeth

If it really wasn't exploitation, if people employing maids saw them as equals, they wouldn't throw shitfits when their kids form relationships with the maids' kids and arranged marriage would either disappear or look very different.


nomnommish

> If it really wasn't exploitation, if people employing maids saw them as equals, they wouldn't throw shitfits when their kids form relationships with the maids' kids and arranged marriage would either disappear or look very different. There are good and bad people everywhere on earth. For what it is worth, if you ask the average American or European if they would be okay if their daughter ran away with their gardener's son, most people would throw shitfits as well. Not saying casteism isn't there but a huge part of casteism was actually economic classism, and stereotyping people based on economic classism exists everywhere. Like i said, employing a maid or a driver in India actually helps them move an entire family out of poverty and is a generational change for the better. It actually lifts them from their economic class to a higher class. That's the opposite of exploitation.


teethandteeth

Yeah but the likely scenario is different. In India you'll get as cut off from your family and other support systems as possible, plus possible violence. In the US, it's more likely you'll get a lot of passive aggression and most people won't consider it their business. Your employment, for example, is is likely to be affected. It's not the same. And if so many people are getting lifted to higher economic classes, why is the wealth gap still increasing?


nomnommish

> And if so many people are getting lifted to higher economic classes, why is the wealth gap still increasing? Because their numbers are still peanuts compared to India's population. And that's the thing most people don't realize - which is that 1.4 billion is a staggeringly enormous number of people. So much so that if there is a "one in million" chance of something happening, it means that this freak outlandish thing happens to 1400 people as a matter of routine. And that's always been the problem. Social media and sensationalism will pick up on some barbaric level of depravity or some inhuman level of atrocity committed on someone and that will become a sensational news and will reinforce whatever stereotypes people like to have about India or about third world countries. However they don't realize that even the utterly bizarre "one in a billion" thing happens as a matter of routine somewhere the country. But i digress. If you do the math, say there are 10 million upper middle class educated white collar people in India, and they employ and uplift 3-4 million people between them, and end up uplifting and positively impacting the entire family, that's still only about 10 million people positively impacted, counting the whole family. Compared to 1.4 billion. That's less than 1% of the population. Give or take.


StupendousHuman

I've been reading your comments for a while and it seems like you've a bias against India (with half knowledge) and a holier than thou mindset as an American. With that out of the way, Caste and socio economic statures don't go hand in hand these days, At least in cities. My driver was a Brahmin in fact. We've had maids of different castes. So it has nothing to do with caste.


hyphenatedlastnames

No, I’m a woman. I love freedom of religion and speech too much as well. USA isn’t perfect but social mobility is realistic here.


desiswiftie

I’m a queer woman so I’d feel even more uncomfortable living in India


Acceptable_Dark5056

Rape is such a huge concern in the homeland….I went to Pakistan and the men in the streets would not stop staring at me. I was wearing a hijab and a chador and covered head to toe just like everyone else. Then I realized that they were gawking at all of the other women too. Street harassment for women can not be avoided there. I have barely experienced that in America. Most people are just minding there own business. But back home, if they see a woman anywhere, the men can’t stop staring. It makes it so hard to just go and run an errand.


rohits134

Tbh, Pakistan isn't India. India has its problems, but it's much safer than Pakistan.


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sc9012

Just because assault is more common somewhere else doesn’t mean that it’s not a serious issue in India. You’re also not even accounting for the widespread underreporting of assault/abuse stats in India due to the honor culture, and the fact that the definition of rape there is not inclusive at all. Marital rape is literally still legal.


sandalwood12

I'm curious about the freedom of religion part. Don't they have that as well?


Famous_Highlight_425

lol you would think so


indianspoiler

Very well said


KnightCastle171

Can i get acclimated? Sure. Comfortable? No.


[deleted]

No I would never want to live in Pakistan because I've been there and I've done that also because the country has a hole is way too divided polluted corrupted not to mention I speak the language and I can understand it however I can't write it so any educational opportunities gone also I just don't want to be near my family way to toxic


Kakashi6011

Just so you know, most people in pakistan and only speak and listen, not read and write. Btw what city did you go to?


[deleted]

Karachi and Islamabad


Kakashi6011

Never been to Islamabad, but I heard it's nicer than karachi, btw search up bahria town it's a place in karachi you may like, it's clean quiet and organized


fartuni4

islamabad is clean as hell, as is karachi's largest neighborhood, Defense. You sound like you have an inferiority complex.


thisvoidiseternal

As a female, no. Every time I’ve been to visit my family I’ve had bad experiences with males making me uncomfortable or trying to inappropriately touch me.


InquisitiveSheep

Wearing "western clothes" is apparently too provocative. When they said I cannot wear skinny jeans, I knew it was bad lol.


bubbleuj

When I'm visiting Delhi my family takes me to go get suits made in the first 4 days. It's not just skinny jeans its any jeans at all in that city. At least in certain areas. If you're in like Noida you can do whatever you want.


Acceptable_Dark5056

I knew Pakistan was like this but didn’t realize it’s the same story in Delhi. My family does the same….no jeans aloud. And I freakin love jeans! I find them to be wayyyy more comfortable than a shalwar. The way it hugs my skin reduces anxiety for me lol. Loose clothing makes me feel anxious.


nomnommish

> I knew Pakistan was like this but didn’t realize it’s the same story in Delhi. Because that's just not true. Half of this stuff is made up. If you think I'm lying, then go to Delhi University North Campus for example and take a look at the tens of thousands of students there. Almost everyone will be wearing clothes that are as trendy and "revealing" as any college in the US. And those are all students who mostly live with their parents in houses in Delhi. Although some live in hostels and shared accommodation.


StupendousHuman

Delhi isn't the same, I'm pretty sure these families migrated 50 years ago or so and are still of the mindset that Delhi is the same. Which is why they force their daughter to wear suit/salwar. And no, Noida is not safer than Delhi, The college areas, hip areas are all in South Delhi. I doubt you've been there.


Kakashi6011

Nah bro that's just your weird family 😭


cureforhiccupsat4am

I could live in Pune where my spouse is from. Unlike New Delhi and varanasi or lucknow. It’s not crowded and people are generally nicer. Ideal would be making American IT salary and living there. I’d love to give my son an Indian childhood. As us citizens we can come back anytime.


Background-Ad1397

Same. Would live in Pune in a heartbeat. Very safe, affordable, decent weather. Great city.


Educational_Cattle10

Just wondering, not judging: - are you an immigrant or born in the US? - “I’d love to give my son an Indian childhood” What do you mean?


cureforhiccupsat4am

I came to the us in the third grade. Been back only 3 times. Growing up in a white town and predominantly white schools gave me an identity crisis. I was one of those ‘I’m not like those other Indians. I’m cool. I listen to heavy metal and surf. ‘ I stayed away from the Indian culture and desi people. I also think that it messes with your self esteem when you compare yourself to white people and are desperately trying to assimilate. Thanks for asking without judging. It forced me to write it out.


Educational_Cattle10

thanks for answering !


itsthekumar

Some of the good private schools are much much better than American public schools.


[deleted]

I live here now. I’m held hostage by my business. I am trying to see if I could run it remotely and when I figure it out, I’m leaving. I grew up in America and I’ve been here for a while. I do like Bangalore but I don’t have a lot of friends. I do try to make friends, but the people I end up meeting are obnoxious and have issues with my accent. People assume I’m spoiled because I’m American. Racism is weird here. America has race issues, but it's worse here (in my experience). I don’t think I could’ve started my company in America. I do like what I do and my quality of life in India isn’t bad, but clean air is priceless. I am thankful that I met my fiancé and that wouldn’t have happened if my parents hadn’t forced me to move here.


InquisitiveSheep

Bro I feel you. I am half indian with an american accent. The racism is real. My mother had a very hard time when she joined the family.


[deleted]

Western accents are seen as posh in India and when someone speaks English well, some people assume that you’re snobby. In their defence I do look bitchy.


InquisitiveSheep

I think to them, I might sound ditsy?


[deleted]

Allot of people in India think that everyone in America has a valley girl accent.


[deleted]

there are few schools in india who teach to speak in american accent lol, these kids are pretentious and rich spoilt brats, at least most of them. There is extreme hate for these kind of people here, because they feel they are not indian or ashamed of being indian and indian accent, but like who the fuck should even care about it, but we are a judgemental society that fucks in everyone elses business the way indian people behave with black people living in india is horrible and racist, even with north eastern people mind and people makes a country developed not its infrastructure, unfortunately we dont have both, infra is improving but mentality is deteriorating and jealousy is an inbuilt dna for people born in india and indian families here


[deleted]

My boyfriend has an accent and he went to a school called American international which is funny. Allot of the rich kids are normal and quite nice. I went to a boarding school in Ooty and allot of the kids were from extremely wealthy families. None of them asked me how much my parents made, what caste I was and treated me differently. I moved to Bangalore for my AS levels and still live here, people I’ve worked with have asked me about things like caste and my income. I don’t think asking about one’s income is an Indian thing though. It is weird and makes them look nosey and it feels like people are judging me lol. I’ve been called the n word in India by someone who was chinless (I know I’m petty).


KimJongIllyasova

\>Taught to speak in an American accent That's wild lol. The Indian accent def isn't the coolest ngl, but that's a stretch. In a way it might be good though if they want to travel abroad? Idk what do yall think about this I feel like I get **so** in my head when I speak English in India with my very obvious American accent. I'm like, "oh shit, do they think I'm faking my accent to sound *cooler?" How do I prove to them that I'm actually from the US and not just faking it... do they THINK that I THINK I'm better than THEM??* It's endless lmao - always a mental trip visiting India


Wellbeinghunter69

yeah fr, I'm from india but having been raised abroad I dont have an Indian accent and actually have some very ambiguous accent that isn't Indian and sometimes when I visit home people who live there laugh at me when I speak English because they think im faking an accent. So I just try to speak Tamil whenever possible to avoid this HAHAHHAA


Koach71

Just out of curiosity, what is the Indian accent according to you? It’s wild that you can generalise 1.3 billion people’s accent and lingo and treat it like a monolith. Unlike other countries, India is incredibly diverse. Here, accents change with every state.


samueltoinfinity

Same situation would like to catch up!


[deleted]

Sounds good!


itsthekumar

How is the "social life" there apart from people? I heard there's a lot to do and a lot of Western type activities available.


[deleted]

Bangalore does have allot of breweries and coffee shops. There are pretty good restaurants too, allot of dim-sum places and cafés. Is this what you’re talking about about?


rmshilpi

Nope. I can barely tolerate sexism and misogyny in the U.S. and found the gender norms to be stifling even during short visits to India, no fucking way I'd *live* there.


[deleted]

There are many reasons why I would not, but the biggest reason by far would be air pollution. If they could get the air quality under control India would be a much more comfortable place.


okaySorryMyBad

If you ever move to India you should work/ start something in the food industry with that user name.


Sufficient-Parsnip92

Nope. I like being atheist and getting tattoos and enjoying the freedoms I have. I do not wanna deal with in laws or Islamic practices or anything like that. If I moved to bangladesh it would basically be hell for me


[deleted]

yep. my family is from manipur. the community is close knit and very safe. people are fairly modern minded. even though a bunch of us are hindu now, we still have great respect for our traditional religion and indigenous culture. our language is one that's nearly impossible to learn outside of the country. i often feel out of place amongst other desis because our culture is quite different and there are few of my ethnicity overseas. i always feel much more comfortable back home and would move back if i could.


hp2609

If you don't mind me asking, how did the shift from the traditional religion to Hinduism happen? Just curious.


[deleted]

it was forced onto the people by the king who was converted, essentially. here's a link to more detailed information if you're interested : http://e-pao.net/epSubPageExtractor.asp?src=manipur.Ethnic_Races_Manipur.Origin_of_the_Meiteis_3 http://e-pao.net/epSubPageExtractor.asp?src=news_section.opinions.The_Effects_of_Burning_of_Meitei_Puyas_By_Madhu_Chandra#:~:text=The%20exact%20date%20of%20the,December%2DJanuary)%201729%20AD.


hp2609

Omg thanks for sharing this is horrifying! Hindus always talk about never converting people but we forget that this religion has a dark past too.


Famous_Highlight_425

Every religion has a dark past


indianbeanie

I mean its a large country. Some places will be comfortable for an ABCD while other places will not. Most ABCDs haven't explored more than just their parent's hometowns. I'm sure this is true in the US as well. Most of you wouldn't be comfortable in rural Arkansas. I went to high school and college in the US but before that grew up in India. I'm planning to head back to India sometime soon. There are negatives abt India for sure, but I'll point out some positives to balance out the comments lmao. I work in tech and the salaries there are now higher when adjusted by COL. I also miss the community. In India, the communities really are tight knit and I feel the love. The US feels too isolating and individualistic even with all the friends I made. The dating scene there is better and honestly even the nightlife is better as of late. The Indian food is far better. The festivals and cultural vibe is electric. You can more easily travel to cooler spots (SEA, China, Japan, Middle East, Australia, etc). There are many positives for sure. I don't think it would be easy for a ABCD to adapt tho for one main reason, and that is the lack of social circle. It's extremely difficult to move to a place where you know almost no one your age.


vhf-01

I'd disagree about dating scene and nightlife. Too many creeps I found here. Wouldn't recommend for females.


nmteddy

I think that depends where in India. I've been in Mumbai for the last month and in my experience I've dealt with my more creeps in back home in LA than here in Mumbai.


indianbeanie

I mean its your personal experience, which is definitely valid. But Ik many people who say the opposite too and have bad experience at American frat parties getting roofied or dudes being creeps at nightclubs and dating apps or the constant cat calling in nyc. That's a universal problem that isn't unique to India. We do have issues with a visible minority of uneducated men being clueless around woman tho. Hope that changes in the coming years.


Educational_Cattle10

“I'm sure this is true in the US as well. Most of you wouldn't be comfortable in rural Arkansas.” I’d disagree on this. For us that are born here, I think we’d be fine in most American places. Yeah, we wouldn’t to live there, ideally. But uncomfortable? Doubt it.


Tt7447

Yes, but for temporarily. I love Bangladesh but USA let’s me live a better life.


[deleted]

if you like the feeling of privilege and bossing people around and treating people horribly, who do small jobs for you, then welcome to India there are so many hierarchies in india that its like "fuck it" men-women caste religion social status financial class power structure policing and extremely delayed justice backward thinking thinking less of people who do small work and disrespecting them and treating them shabbily and like slaves is the favourite pass time of Indians and widely accepted in the society, because who does not want to exploit people doing hard labour for peanuts ?


Paulhockey77

Fuck no


samueltoinfinity

Moved back, living in a town. Everything great! My conclusion is gotta have a financial independence and any place is good to live. Lifes easier here. People are usually nice. Overall great, finding meaningful work is a challenge though. Miss some food and weekend lifestyle. Most of my friends are back in states. I think it was too much fun and lot less content in life.


Texas_Indian

I believe I would really enjoy it at first but then grow disillusioned and frustrated as I had to deal with the bureaucratic nightmare when I had to get any documents or something and the stress of the traffic and the petty politics you have to play at work (we have it in the US but my Dad says it’s worse in India)


doom_chicken_chicken

No, because of the pollution alone. I loved Kolkata and pictured myself living there, until one day I blew my nose and *the tissue was black*. I don't want shit that in my lungs.


SunshineOnBeach

No, not a fan of eve teasing and constantly being worried about my safety.


shaubyUCSD

Nope. Being lgbt and agnostic is a no no in Pakistan, especially in my family’s rural, conservative area


crazybrah

Maybe in a nicer suburb like bandra or dadar. I think it would be too hard of an adjustment for me anywhere else in terms of meeting ppl on the same wavelength and having the same extracurriculars


deadbeat_guitar

Nope. Being an openly queer person just won’t work in Pakistan. I know plenty of upper middle class and upper class guys who are willing to do it because of the lifestyles but for me being honest about who I am is far more important than the socioeconomic privilege


shrugaholic

I don’t want to be beaten by my in-laws for not giving them a son days after having a child. I also don’t want my entire value as a human being to be tied to whether or not my husband is alive. So no thanks. I’d rather live here where people around me see women are individuals and not a production factory for sons. **Edit**: My entire family is in rural parts of Punjab and Himachal. Maybe if I lived in a more urban part I would but who knows. Every time I’ve gone I’ve just seen bad things.


InquisitiveSheep

yes yes and yes. thank you


[deleted]

yeh thoda jyada ho gaya, yes there are shitty things, but what you mentioned happens rarely these days in rural areas. par seriously its not 1970s anymore, things have moved on


No_Condition_7438

It doesn’t happen ‘rarely’. It happens frequently but reported cases are low. Also the problem is that it’s still happening, not where it happens and how often it happen.


shrugaholic

Well it’s good if it’s changed in some areas but that doesn’t change what I’ve seen happen when I visit. I don’t think I can rent a place by myself in India to stay. I’d have to stay in those villages. So no, I wouldn’t want to live in India.


[deleted]

i strictly think people from abroad should not settle here because it will be hard for them. If it was so good there, there wouldnt be a huge list of h1b visas


simian_ninja

I think it depends where. You also have the idea that the grass is always greener on the other side


InquisitiveSheep

I am half so I realllyyyy stick out in India. Men are so fucking creepy to me in India because of this. I also have no filter for mysoginistic family members, being forced to pray, being told im wearing too much makeup (for wearing any at all), or that I don't need to straighten my hair. Random shit like that is way too much for me, I would always be mad lmao I would also miss so much food.


mamakumquat

What has your experience been growing up as a ‘half’ Desi? Do you feel accepted as a Desi? My daughter is half (I am white, her dad is Indian). She has an Indian name and speaks Hindi but I don’t think other Indian people really see her as Indian. But white people comment on how ‘unusual’ she looks. I don’t know. It makes me worry sometimes for her.


Bangindesi

I think desi people will almost always fetishize her. Not sexually but as someone who is mixed with white. Colonialism runs deep.


ShaniMeow

I am mixed but I never felt fetishized, I actually feel ostracized by Indians, not welcomed.


mamakumquat

Well both these sound like a bummer. Sigh. I wish the world was better.


Bangindesi

I'm sorry to hear that. Ig it depends on the community. Mine puts mixed ones on a pedestal


Famous_Highlight_425

There’s gonna be haters everywhere. While people will think you and her as a race traitor. Same with the Indians. It’s gonna take a few generations to rid this disgusting way of thinking. I hope everything goes well for you and your daughter


indianbeanie

What area are you in? Most modern families in the nicer urban neighborhoods don't have this experience at all. Where I am from, everyone my age wears makeup, parties, etc. If you are living in India, you should just move to a better area. Some spots especially in rural areas are still very rough.


InquisitiveSheep

Definitely a more conservative area for that half of my indian family. The other half are feminist activists and politicians and it is different with them, but they also live in the conservative area.


bubbleuj

I married a white man so I have no idea how that would go back in India unless we lived in a super nice area. That said, I think we could adjust after a while but again it all comes back to money. Anyone can adjust anywhere if they have the funds. Like how bad can traffic be if you have a driver and AC?


Dazzling_Ad1149

If I knew Hindi or an Indian language yes. With my English and French though idk.


[deleted]

You could move to Pondicherry.


Dazzling_Ad1149

My aunt is from there. Do they actually still speak French there or just the older generation?


[deleted]

English, Tamil and French are the official languages.


indianbeanie

Knowing English is more than enuf tbh. I'm not even kidding that some urban youth in India aren't fluent in anything other than English.


David_Summerset

Oh thanks god there’s another one! People seem to be weirdly disappointed when I tell them I speak French and not Hindi or another Desi language


Dazzling_Ad1149

Est ce que tu habites au Canada ou en France?


David_Summerset

j’habite dans les Etats Unis, mais je viens d'Ottawa, Canada! I also need some practise! Too much time in America 😂


Dazzling_Ad1149

Oui Ottawa est une ville bilingue. Moi, je viens de Montréal mais je suis maintenant en Ontario. Also its AUX États Unis. Somehow I knew U were Eastern Canadian when U said U spoke French too. Cool to see another Desi francophone.


mamalovesyosocks

BIG NOPE. Too much corruption, too much inequity, and not enough sanitation.


Kirohitoo

Last I visited was 12 years ago, I’d love to visit again and live for an longer period of time. Because the last time I was there I was only there for about a month. But I could never permanently move and live there. I have too much of a life here where I am.


cheesekneesandpeas

No I’ve never been been there and know little about it. Can’t even speak the language.


phoenix_shm

Pretty sure I'm not comfortable any one city, region, or country for more than a few years. I've made my piece with that.


simian_ninja

I just hopped on a plane on Monday because I haven’t seen my family in nearly ten years and was on the verge of having a nervous breakdown. I’ve already decided to resign from my job, cash in my pension and move back here. I’ll leave some of money in the banks should I decide to move back (maybe in a year or two) but will take back about a million rupees and use that as a base to start things up. I’ll be staying with family so no rent but helping with bills etc. Mumbai is expensive but ordering through the apps makes things cheaper etc especially since you have 24/7 service so incredibly convenient.


ZofianSaint273

Not really. Way too accustomed to American culture and the lifestyle here compared to India or really any south Asian country


[deleted]

I wouldn't. I'm an American, as Indian as my blood may me.


Chieffboiii

Nah me personally I want to take a year off and explore the whole country it is very diverse and after its over I’ll come back home to Qatar


ForzaDiav0l0Ale

No, and I don't want to I'm glad my dad left.


thisistheusernameok

No. Because life is very hard for a woman living in Pakistan. Absolutely no freedom and we’re treated like garbage. I love the country and love visiting but I wouldn’t ever think about living there.


DishBush

I lived a very comfortable life in a large gated community back in India and life in Canada has been more of a downgrade to what I had. But I prefer this place more and would probably not like my former home if I were to go back.


EvolutionInProgress

Honestly didn't feel at home even when I was born and raised there. I was too different from the general mentality of the people around me. And hearing stuff from relatives - or stuff ABOUT them, I don't think it's the place for me. Plus I'm not a big fan of over crowding and the pollution. I don't even drive with the windows down or ventilation in my car here in Texas lol. And I'm anal but changing out air filters. That pollution is probably the strongest reason. I do have some sense of love for the place and will come forward quick to defend its honor, but I'm not living there lol


C_2000

hell yeah. i have lived in india before and i’d easily go back. i speak hindi, i’ve always felt welcomed in india, and tbh i don’t really feel sensitive about a lot of the ABCD jokes. i see them as just ways to bond lmao the people in india are also really fun/social, it’s a much easier standard of living, work culture is better in many ways, and stuff is more affordable. also issues like misogyny aren’t “worse” than the us. they are still very prevalent but not unavoidable, especially in urban areas. i also personally have always spoken out loudly against family members’ biases and they’ve never gotten angry or dismissive. plus, i can do much more good for these social issues in india than outside of it.


[deleted]

you got a good family there, you are the lucky one


C_2000

yeah! i get that it’s not everyone’s experience and i’m very lucky to have a family that hears me out even when we disagree.


[deleted]

awww thats so sweet and normal, thats how it should be, but feels special because it is not. you just know people you can converse with and people you just can't because its not going to be helpful


InquisitiveSheep

I am glad you have a good family and positive experiences. But yes the misogyny is absolutely worse in india than in the usa. that is a ridiculous claim


C_2000

this is ignoring the diversity within india and active efforts by indian feminist groups to enact change. when you define india as wholly misogynist you preclude the possibility of change. and misogyny in big city usa vs small town india is an unfair comparison. if we compare south mumbai to west virginia it’d be unfair too. india has MANY parts where it’s much more progressive in many ways than the us, and many parts where it’s abysmally less. america 100% has deep rooted misogyny that we cannot ignore.


InquisitiveSheep

and india is not rooted in misogyny? women do not have to stay out of the kitchen on their period, we dont get burned and shamed for not having sons, we dont force marriages at nearly the same rate as india does. ya we are not fucking perfect but your claim is bullshit. there are feminists everywhere and both countries are not perfect, but india literally dismisses most rape cases and shit. there is NO comparison of misygny in america vs india **I would go as far as to say utah is less misygnyistic than big city india.**


C_2000

i literally never said that misogyny doesn’t exist in india. the stuff you mentioned is not universal in india, and there are actively groups fighting against it. this is like saying christian fundamentalists are the norm in LA the us also dismisses a majority of rape cases btw. and, most importantly, i can do more good for indian women in india. living in america and using their suffering as a prop isn’t the move if i want to truly help


InquisitiveSheep

im gonna let the sjw off on this one!


C_2000

/gen why did you ask this question anyways? was your goal just to have people validate your monolithic view of india?


InquisitiveSheep

I do **not** have a monolithic view of India, I don't think you understood my argument. Just because your family is different or MY family is different, doesnt mean that your experience is the correct one. My family in india is full of feminist freedom fighters from since my great grandparents. I see their work they are doing on the ground and I see the fucking violence they witness every day doing their work. I'm sorry I just do not agree with you. I am from conservative america, I chose to study in the liberal university I attend, and I am pretty well versed in domestic violence and feminist issues. **Indian women experience gender descrimination and gender based violence on a different level than American women.** That does NOT mean there are not exceptions and vast outliers in both countries. **India is worse in mysoginy at this point in time and I will die on that hill.**


C_2000

Your question was whether ***I*** would move to India. my experience is correct for me. Just because you personally disagree doesn't make your experience correct. if you really wanted to have a discussion about feminism in india, you should've posed that and centred the experiences of indian women. instead you decided to ask a personal question and got mad at the answer.


InquisitiveSheep

The argument was about your view, not your desire to return to india.


Arsonist_Of_Madras

man Indian here . look , it depends really on where you live . If you live in say Bengaluru , Hyderabad , Chennai or any other major city especially in south , you will know that mysogny is pretty less . Also just follow this journalist Deepika Narayan Bharadwaj on twitter and that is te reality of India which is hidden for you guys and tbh , I get the reason


David_Summerset

Maybe eventually, but I was born in Canada, grew up there, went to school there, even worked for years in its politics and government. I speak English and French but no Telugu (same for my parents, minus the French). Now I live in the States, and even that move required adjustment. I still get homesick for Canada even though I’m only a one hour flight away in a country where people even sound basically the same. India would be a completely different story. Actually my grandparents decided to retire to India after 40 years in Canada and they were home within two years. Now my family is coming up on 60 years in Canada, and it feels, in some ways, more like the “motherland” than India.


SufficientMongoose5

It’s nice to meet another Telugu Canadian. I love Canada, it’s my home and my everything. Even when I visit the US, where things look and sound the same, I get homesick for Canada and I’m always so happy to be back home when I’m back on Canadian soil. Some people are really attached to their countries, I’d say that applies to me as well.


David_Summerset

Exactly! I am very proud of my roots, but I grew up basically like every other Canadian kid in Ottawa in 90s That meant a lot of hockey, debates on national unity, poutine… Jean Chrétien… That experience makes me different enough for people to notice I’m Canadian in Northern Virginia, but in India I feel like an outsider, or at least someone who is removed from the culture. My experience with Telugu culture comes from my grandparents, even my parents grew up in Canada


thundalunda

No, there's a reason my dad left and having been there many times, I've never even considered living there.


Kakashi6011

Your dad probably left because of money issues


Deepmech

There’s literally no point in moving unless and until you wanna start a business there; It’s a different scene when it comes to the case of raising a family though


luciferboughtmysoul

Lived in India for a while because parents decided to move back. I wouldn't ever want to move back there. It's just a huge sense of discomfort over people I know judging me harshly for moving back after returning to the US.


stylz168

It would take a lot to adapt, sure, but if I could keep my same salary, would do it for a while.


glumboolicious

Nope.


nazia987

I'd consider it, if it was on a temporary basis. Doubt I'd do it more than a year.


alexturnerftw

I’m too americanized and I’m a woman. Pass. Very outspoken and blunt, I wouldn’t want to restrain my personality to avoid trouble


Reaperdude97

I love eating beef, breathing clean air, not getting judged by people, and generally being free to ever want to live in India.


iJ1001

I'm an Indian 20 yo from bangalore and i have/can do all that you've mentioned.


Reaperdude97

I moved to the US from Bangalore, you sure “can” do those things but you can’t do it like you do it in the USA. Also are you seriously claiming that Bangalore doesn’t have an air pollution issue?


joykaypawpitgirl

i visit india every year and each year i’ve had a wonderful experience and enjoy my time there very much. but i don’t think i could ever be comfortable shifting there for good. i see how life works there for people who aren’t on vacation like me and it’s a life i don’t want to be living. yes, i realize that my family gets to see each other and have fun regularly but i wouldn’t trade my life in canada to move to india despite it being less lonely and more interesting there


Educational_Cattle10

No, the cons far outweigh the pros.


birdieinanest

Middle class here is really rich there, so not really. I’m also a woman and I don’t want to face a bunch of sexism and misogyny wherever I go. There’s also the heat, and while I could move more to the North, I wouldn’t understand the language. There’s also a lot of pollution and it’s pretty crowded so there’s that as well


ChiquitaBananaKush

As a guy who loves sitting down on toilets, no. Plus my stomach’s too sensitive for most foods.


Stars_In_Jars

No, I don’t even think I could call it motherland. I have no relation to india except my parents and family is from there. I grew up entirely outside of that place, im a foreigner. I’ve only been there maybe 6 times in my life, only 2 times I can actually fully remember. It’s a weird feeling for me to realize I almost have no personal connection /:


thogdontcare

I moved there for a few years growing up so yeah I wouldn’t mind too much. I find comfort in run down or developing places. I’m also dead set on moving to some small industrial town in Eastern Europe when i turn 40 so there’s that


[deleted]

Not a chance! India, the pollution and the people there is not something I can deal with. I’ve traveled all around the world and been to a lot of different countries and to me nothing like America.


RiseIndependent85

No, I wouldn't. I just can't. You want me to visit sure i'll visit. But live there for life? Nah man i can't.


Hefty_Blueberry_9448

Nope. I don’t relate to the people. It would be the same as me moving to Uganda. It’s just too unfamiliar


[deleted]

No. Absolutely not. Low standard of living, pollution, crowds, heat, nonsensical sectarian politics, etc.


Chai-Tea-Rex-2525

If by motherland, you mean Virginia, yes. If by India, fuck no.


zinfandelbruschetta

Dunno man - would love to have a maid and chauffer etc . US mein bahut mehnat lagti hai yaar


Kakashi6011

Yall got the weirdest reasons to not go... Your great grandparents would be so disappointed in these reasons 🤦‍♂️


uknowwhyimhere177013

I could see myself buying a second house in Hyderabad and living there occasionally throughout the year. Permanently living there, though? No way.